Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:42 AM - Re: Wood Sources (Phillips, Jack)
2. 04:53 AM - Re: Re: Wood Sources (Lou Wither)
3. 04:57 AM - Aircraft wood (TBYH@aol.com)
4. 05:35 AM - Re: Wood Sources (Glenn Thomas)
5. 05:49 AM - Re: Wood Sources (Glenn Thomas)
6. 06:07 AM - Re: Turk's Head knot (at7000ft)
7. 06:18 AM - axle shims (Oscar Zuniga)
8. 06:27 AM - Re: Re: Building logs??? (Ben Charvet)
9. 07:16 AM - Re: Re: Building logs??? (Rick Holland)
10. 08:04 AM - looking for... (Egan, John)
11. 12:21 PM - Re: Re: Building logs??? (Ken)
12. 07:09 PM - Re: looking for... (Dick Navratil)
13. 07:19 PM - Re: Re: Wood Sources (Dick Navratil)
14. 11:12 PM - Flying in the Kansas Wind (Rcaprd@aol.com)
Message 1
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips@cardinal.com>
I concur with Dick. Wicks has great quality wood, cut accurately to
your dimenison, and much faster than Aircraft Spruce (why do they call
the company that name?). Typically Aicraft Spruce quotes 4 to 6 weeks
delivery. Wicks can usually do it in 2 weeks or less.
Jack Phillips
Glad to finally have good Pietenpol weather, and be exercising Icarus
Plummet again
-----Original Message-----
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Dick Navratil"
<horzpool@goldengate.net>
For my first project I bought from Aircraft Spruce. Wood was great
quality,
but took a long time to get delivered. Second project, I tried cutting
my
own, that didn't work too well, so I ordered from Wicks. Great quality,
quick delivery and about the same price as ACS.
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Glenn Thomas" <glennthomas@flyingwood.com>
Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2006 6:24 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wood Sources
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Glenn Thomas"
> <glennthomas@flyingwood.com>
>
> Question: If you were buying wood to build ribs with, where would you
go
> to get it? I didn't want to buy Sitka Spruce boards and cut them with
my
> tablesaw. I'm interested in finding out if I bought the wrong type of
> wood.
>
> I didn't buy a lot but in talking with the establishment I bought it
from,
> I was VERY surprised to hear their last statement on dealing with this
> problem. (In the end, if I do have to eat the wood I bought I'm only
out
> $300 and much better educated, perhaps worth the $300)
>
> --------
> Glenn Thomas
> N?????
> http://www.flyingwood.com
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Message 2
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Subject: | Re: Wood Sources |
Glen,
There is a place in New London that sells Sitka spruce. You can pick out your
own boards and look over their selection. I purchased "Aircraft Quality" spruce
spars from a friend that restores Waco's. Frankly, I couldn't see the differenct
between that and what I got in New London.
I cut mine on a table saw and finished them to size with a jointer. I used a
micrometer to make sure they were all exactly the same, it is pretty easy to
hold them to +/- .005".
You get a lot of loss, but you can hand pick what you want for the cap strips
and use the other pieces for the structural pieces with larger sections.
Lou Wither
N799LJ
Message 3
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I bought my spruce from McCormack's in Madison, WI -- very reasonable and I
live only two hours away. What I like is that you can pick out your own wood
and so, obviously, you know exactly what you're hauling home. Had to cut it
myself into strips for the longerons and uprights for fuselage, but with a good
sharp table saw blade and two of my boys (16 and 19)to help feed it through the
saw (one at each end of the 14-foot lengths and me at the saw-- I didn't want
them losing a finger if something slipped) it was relatively easy to cut the
longerons out.
As for capstrips, I bought a complete set of ribs from the late Charlie
Rubeck -- that's "cheating" a little, but once my Piet flies, we'll be literally
and figuratively flying on Charlie's "wings" -- and I can't think of a better
way to honor his memory!
Today I plan to finish up the vertical stab and then glue up the rudder. With
the rudder finished all the tailpieces will be finished -- then I can
assemble the landing gear and she'll be on wheels! Last weekend was spent, mostly,
finishing up the painting and installing chair rail in the kitchen. That
compound, laser-guided miter saw that my wife bought me for Christmas a couple
years
ago-- and which I claimed was for household jobs, heh-heh-heh - sure came in
handy for that chair rail! All the corners came out so nice -- my wife thinks
I'm a stinking genius! And you know, some of that fancy chair rail would look
great around the perimeter of my Piet's cockpit...hmmmm.... Just kidding!
Only 90-some days to Brodhead!
Happy building/flying everyone!
Fred B.
La Crosse, WI
Message 4
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Subject: | Re: Wood Sources |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Glenn Thomas" <glennthomas@flyingwood.com>
A Pober Jr. Ace (wood wing) builder in my area ordered his wood from Wicks and
has been happy what everything he's received. I'm still working this out with
AS&S. I'm not the type that goes out to smear people but thought that other
new builders sizing up their sources for lumber might want to know what they're
getting into.
--------
Glenn Thomas
N?????
http://www.flyingwood.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=28338#28338
Message 5
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Subject: | Re: Wood Sources |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Glenn Thomas" <glennthomas@flyingwood.com>
Hi Lou,
I thought about it. You've told me about that place before. I just don't have
the tablesaw for that right now. My saw is about 50 years old and I need to
pull the tilt assembly out and figure out why the blade won't quite make it to
90 degrees. Otherwise it's a great saw. Then I would need a planer (which I
don't have) to get the precise dimensions. I figured while I focused on building
the ribs with store-bought capstrip, I could put away my pennies for the
planer. I almost went out and bought the Rigid one from Home Depot ($350.00)
2 weeks ago.
When I bought the wood there was (and still is) a notice on the website that says...
NOTICE
We supply only certified aircraft grade spruce. Do not accept lower grades of spruce
for lower prices in your project. It is no bargain. Demand top quality.
No Packaging Charges on Spruce
I've reminded them of the notice and asked what they use as a measure for certified
"aircraft grade" and asked who certifies it. I'm going by FAA Advisory Circular
43.13. Although the Customer Service folks try to be nice I get the sense
that they are getting bounced back and forth like ping pong balls, trying
to help me and then told to do otherwise by their management. Getting the order
placed was an ordeal too. They wanted to ship from California but they also
have a storefront in Georgia which cuts freight in half. It took 5 days for
them to figure out how to ship it.
--------
Glenn Thomas
N?????
http://www.flyingwood.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=28345#28345
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: Turk's Head knot |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "at7000ft" <at7000ft@gmail.com>
Thanks Clif, I am at at7000ft@gmail.com.
--------
Rick Holland
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=28349#28349
Message 7
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
What is it about axle shims that makes them so expensive? I need to correct
a little camber on one side and got to looking at prices of shims. Anybody
have any shortcuts or tips on axle shims?
Thanks.
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: Building logs??? |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ben Charvet <bcharvet@bellsouth.net>
At a forum at Sun-N-Fun it was also mentioned that if you keep track of
how much time you spend on your project it can count as experience hours
if you ever decide you want to get an AP certification. I think I
forgot to mention this in my first reply. Living in Mims is great, and
I have my shop right here on my property. Always love to have people
come look at the project, just give my a few minutes warning so I can
clean the shop up a little. :-[
Ben
Launchpad wrote:
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Launchpad" <launchpad@chartermi.net>
>
>Thanks so much Ben for the info. That is exactly what I was looking for.
> Say, hows life in Mims? Former Cocoa Beach area guy here. Miss the south.
Would enjoy meeting and checking out your plane on my next trip down..
>Brian
>
>
>
Message 9
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Subject: | Re: Building logs??? |
Now we just need to convince a couple schools to provide college credit for
time building an airplane.
do not archive
On 4/14/06, Ben Charvet <bcharvet@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ben Charvet <bcharvet@bellsouth.net>
>
> At a forum at Sun-N-Fun it was also mentioned that if you keep track of
> how much time you spend on your project it can count as experience hours
> if you ever decide you want to get an AP certification. I think I
> forgot to mention this in my first reply. Living in Mims is great, and
> I have my shop right here on my property. Always love to have people
> come look at the project, just give my a few minutes warning so I can
> clean the shop up a little. :-[
>
> Ben
> Launchpad wrote:
>
> >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Launchpad" <
> launchpad@chartermi.net>
> >
> >Thanks so much Ben for the info. That is exactly what I was looking for.
> > Say, hows life in Mims? Former Cocoa Beach area guy here. Miss the
> south. Would enjoy meeting and checking out your plane on my next trip
> down..
> >Brian
> >
> >
> >
>
>
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
>
>
--
Rick Holland
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 10
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Hello all,
I would like to get in touch with Piet builder P.F. Beck from Barnwell,
S.C. whose name I found on the Piet Frapper site. I would like local
information regarding the area. If you (P.F. B.) are out there, would
you please contact me off-line=3F
Do not archive
Thanks,
John
This e-mail is intended for the use of the addressee(s) only and may contain privileged,
confidential, or proprietary information that is exempt from disclosure
under law. If you have received this message in error, please inform us promptly
by reply e-mail, then delete the e-mail and destroy any printed copy.
Thank you.
Message 11
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Subject: | Re: Building logs??? |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ken <av8orken@adelphia.net>
Thomas Edison State College in NJ will give college credit for you A&P
certificate. They also give college credit for pilot certificates.
Check them out at http://www.tesc.edu/. I guess give is not really a
good term because there is a fee involved.
Ken
Rick Holland wrote:
> Now we just need to convince a couple schools to provide college credit
> for time building an airplane.
>
> do not archive
>
> On 4/14/06, *Ben Charvet* < bcharvet@bellsouth.net
> <mailto:bcharvet@bellsouth.net>> wrote:
>
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Ben Charvet <
> bcharvet@bellsouth.net <mailto:bcharvet@bellsouth.net>>
>
> At a forum at Sun-N-Fun it was also mentioned that if you keep track of
> how much time you spend on your project it can count as experience
> hours
> if you ever decide you want to get an AP certification. I think I
> forgot to mention this in my first reply. Living in Mims is great, and
> I have my shop right here on my property. Always love to have people
> come look at the project, just give my a few minutes warning so I can
> clean the shop up a little. :-[
>
> Ben
> Launchpad wrote:
>
> >--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Launchpad" <
> launchpad@chartermi.net <mailto:launchpad@chartermi.net>>
> >
> >Thanks so much Ben for the info. That is exactly what I was
> looking for.
> > Say, hows life in Mims? Former Cocoa Beach area guy here. Miss
> the south. Would enjoy meeting and checking out your plane on my
> next trip down..
> ==================================================ist Features
> Navigator to browse ics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">
> ================================================== out the All New
> Matronics Email List Wiki! ========================= -
> List Contrib &nb->
> http://www.matronic=============================================
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Rick Holland
>
> "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
> <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
Message 12
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Subject: | Re: looking for... |
John
P.F. Beck probably lurks here, if not, pfbeck@barnwellsc.com
Dick
----- Original Message -----
From: Egan, John
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, April 14, 2006 10:03 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: looking for...
Hello all,
I would like to get in touch with Piet builder P.F. Beck from Barnwell, S.C.
whose name I found on the Piet Frapper site. I would like local information regarding
the area. If you (P.F. B.) are out there, would you please contact me
off-line?
Do not archive
Thanks,
John
This e-mail is intended for the use of the addressee(s) only and may contain privileged,
confidential, or proprietary information that is exempt from disclosure
under law. If you have received this message in error, please inform us promptly
by reply e-mail, then delete the e-mail and destroy any printed copy. Thank
you.
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: Wood Sources |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Dick Navratil" <horzpool@goldengate.net>
Glenn
I have a very good quality table saw, and I still found it very difficult to
cut those small dimension pieces accurately. For as nice of a job that
Wicks does, I don't think it's worth the savings.
A couple of other comments. Aircraft Spruce got it's name because thats
what they started out doing years ago and expanded from there.
Certified Aircraft Grade of course is just the basic 8 grains per inch and
the grain to run in accordance with FAA specs. They spell out the specs on
page 53 of their cataloug. I'm sure I'm not saying anything new here.
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Glenn Thomas" <glennthomas@flyingwood.com>
Sent: Friday, April 14, 2006 7:48 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wood Sources
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Glenn Thomas"
> <glennthomas@flyingwood.com>
>
> Hi Lou,
> I thought about it. You've told me about that place before. I just don't
> have the tablesaw for that right now. My saw is about 50 years old and I
> need to pull the tilt assembly out and figure out why the blade won't
> quite make it to 90 degrees. Otherwise it's a great saw. Then I would
> need a planer (which I don't have) to get the precise dimensions. I
> figured while I focused on building the ribs with store-bought capstrip, I
> could put away my pennies for the planer. I almost went out and bought
> the Rigid one from Home Depot ($350.00) 2 weeks ago.
>
> When I bought the wood there was (and still is) a notice on the website
> that says...
>
> NOTICE
>
> We supply only certified aircraft grade spruce. Do not accept lower grades
> of spruce for lower prices in your project. It is no bargain. Demand top
> quality. No Packaging Charges on Spruce
>
> I've reminded them of the notice and asked what they use as a measure for
> certified "aircraft grade" and asked who certifies it. I'm going by FAA
> Advisory Circular 43.13. Although the Customer Service folks try to be
> nice I get the sense that they are getting bounced back and forth like
> ping pong balls, trying to help me and then told to do otherwise by their
> management. Getting the order placed was an ordeal too. They wanted to
> ship from California but they also have a storefront in Georgia which cuts
> freight in half. It took 5 days for them to figure out how to ship it.
>
> --------
> Glenn Thomas
> N?????
> http://www.flyingwood.com
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=28345#28345
>
>
>
Message 14
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Subject: | Flying in the Kansas Wind |
On Wednesday I went out to face a stiff, gusty, east crosswind. A couple
of buddies showed up, who I told I would give 'em a Pietenpol Ride, but I
wanted to do some solo landings before I took on a passenger. There was about
3/4 sock exposed at almost direct crosswind, which made it Pilot's discretion as
to which runway to use. Initially, the Skydivers plane was using 35, but
when I finished pre-flight, they took off on 17. I've been looking for an
opportunity to practice crosswind technique, and this one really laid it out for
me.
Taxiing in the wind was not really difficult, just remember Climb into a
quartering headwind, and dive away from a quartering tailwind. It did rock the
wings back & forth some, but was very manageable. Just before back taxi on 17,
two of the skydivers were landing behind me, and to the right...I didn't and
couldn't see them coming. I'm glad they decided not to land on top of me !!
Left crosswind takeoff was not too bad...just keep the left aileron in during
the takeoff run, and gradually bring it back to close to neutral until
rotation. Break ground, and she immediately weathervanes into the wind, and I
fly
sideways the rest of the way down the runway, and turn left soon after the end
of the runway, to take advantage of the more forgiving terrain. Stayed in the
pattern to do some landings, & back taxi. Base to final I overshot the grass
strip, and the first landing was a third of the way down the 1500' grass
strip, and a pretty good bounce, so I went full power for a go around...don't even
try to save a bad landing...just go around. The next attempt was much better,
but still a bounce. I was trying to carry too much speed on final approach,
with the upwind wing down, so the instant the mains made contact, I blipped
some forward stick to keep it on the ground, for a wheel landing. I
disappointed my friends when I told them it was too rough to risk taking a passenger
in
these conditions. I was bouncing all over the place on downwind. I did
another flight later on in the evening, after the wind died down some, went south
about 5 miles, and did some steep turns about a point...Smoke On !! Came back
and made 3 pretty good landings. Remember : If you can walk away, it was a
good landing...if you can use the plane again, it was a Great Landing !!
On Thursday, there was a Full sock of wind, right down the runway. I
had less than a half load of fuel, and was by myself today, so I thought I would
see how short the takeoff roll would be...maybe even a Vertical takeoff !! I
rolled the plane out of the hanger, and pointed 'er right into the wind, for
pre-flight. She just wouldn't stand still long enough for me to pre-flight !!
She kept tippee toeing, lifting one wheel off the ground, then the other,
then the tail would come up. I couldn't even walk away from the plane !! I had
to hold 'er from rolling backwards, too. I thought maybe I would have to
chalk the Back of the tires !! This went on for about 10 minutes, before I
decided to put 'er back in the barn (hanger). If I had a helper, I could have
flown that day, but this launch was beyond my solo capacity.
Ah, yesss...the Kansas Winds - always challenging...practice, practice,
practice !!!
Chuck G.
Wichita, KS
NX770CG
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