Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:52 AM - gluing/stitching sequence bottom of the wing undercamber (Michael D Cuy)
2. 06:22 AM - Re: you seen one wing, you seen em' both (Ed G.)
3. 06:56 AM - Re: you seen one wing, you seen em' both (Rick Holland)
4. 07:06 AM - Re: you seen one wing, you seen em' both (Ed G.)
5. 07:07 AM - Re: you seen one wing, you seen em' both (Ed G.)
6. 07:08 AM - Re: you seen one wing, you seen em' both (Phillips, Jack)
7. 07:34 AM - Applying Varnish (Egan, John)
8. 10:18 AM - Re: you seen one wing, you seen em' both (Jim Ash)
9. 10:23 AM - Fabric shrinkage math / was you seen one wing, you seen em' both (Jim Ash)
10. 11:49 AM - Re: weight and balance ()
11. 01:32 PM - Re: Fabric shrinkage math / was you seen one wing, you seen em' both (walt evans)
12. 01:32 PM - Re: Applying Varnish (Barry Davis)
13. 01:39 PM - Re: Applying Varnish (Phillips, Jack)
14. 01:48 PM - Re: Applying Varnish (Don Emch)
15. 02:58 PM - Re: Re: Applying Varnish (Jack T. Textor)
16. 03:10 PM - spray on varnish/bug sprayer (Michael D Cuy)
17. 03:19 PM - Re: 36" center section design (Steve Eldredge)
18. 03:34 PM - Fuel line size (santiago morete)
19. 05:23 PM - Re: you seen one wing, you seen em' both (Rick Holland)
20. 08:14 PM - Re: Fuel line size (gcardinal)
Message 1
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| Subject: | gluing/stitching sequence bottom of the wing undercamber |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
Chuck is correct--- you don't glue the fabric to either the top or the
bottom of the wings. I just did the blanket method where I unrolled
a length of fabric, glued it on all edges, did the same for the top,
overlapping the other side, then partially (like Chuck said, 75-80% according
to your iron temp. that you calibrated ahead of time w/ hobby thermometer,
stitch, then go 100% iron temp. and then apply finishing tapes, finish.
Mike C.
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: you seen one wing, you seen em' both |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Ed G." <flyboy_120@hotmail.com>
For anyone doing covering work for the first time, Polyfiber has an
excellent step by step covering manual and even a video available that are
excelent. I attended the two day covering class put on by EAA and found that
the class is simply a hands on application of exactly what is covered in the
manual. All the answers are in that book includeing step by step on how to
do the undercamber and rib stitching..Happy building/flying...Ed G..
>From: "Rick Holland" <at7000ft@gmail.com>
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: you seen one wing, you seen em' both
>Date: Mon, 29 May 2006 12:24:26 -0700
>
>Thank you Chuck, real windy all weekend here South of Denver also.
>
>Rick
>
>do not archive
>
>On 5/29/06, Rcaprd@aol.com <Rcaprd@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>> In a message dated 5/28/2006 8:09:10 PM Central Standard Time,
>>at7000ft@gmail.com writes:
>>
>>Did you glue (poly-tak) the fabric to the bottom of each rib, or is it
>>best to wait till you rib stitch to pull the bottom fabric up to the
>>undercambered ribs?
>>
>>Rick,
>> Allow me to jump in here. You should NOT glue the fabric to the
>>bottom (or top) of the wing ribs, or when you shrink the fabric it could
>>warp the ribs. The Stits method says the fabric will shrink by 10%.
>> The way I did it, was to glue the fabric on the bottom first, then
>>the top, then the wing tips, keeping the wrinkles out. I clamped the
>>fabric
>>in place with spring clamps and cloths pins. Then did the leading and
>>trailing edge tapes, then do a fabric shrink with 75% to 80%of the
>>suggested
>>heat setting, then rib stitch - pulling the fabric up in the undercambered
>>portion, then the final 100% of the full max suggested heat setting -
>>keeping a close eye on the temp of the iron, then tape over the the
>>stitches. You can hear the fabric moving all over the place when you
>>shrink
>>it. The stitches are closer together in the prop was area, plus one rib
>>each side. I used just over 500 stitches !!
>>
>>Chuck G.
>>NX770CG
>>http://nx770cg.com/Wing.html
>>Too windy to fly in the Land of Oz...I wonder if anyone ever did a takeoff
>>- going in reverse !!
>>
>
>
>--
>Rick Holland
>
>"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: you seen one wing, you seen em' both |
Yes I have the Polyfiber manual and it says glue the fabric to the bottom
ribs.
In appendix C it says put 2 coats of polytak on the lower ribs and allow it
to dry then cover the top and bottom the usual way. But then its instructs
you to brush polytak over the fabric on the bottom ribs to cement the fabric
to the ribs, then 250 degree heatshrink and rib lace.
The polyfiber people are the experts but from my experiences covering RC
models back in the old days I remember the bad results I got if I glued
fabric to the ribs so I am with you guys.
Thanks
Rick H.
On 5/30/06, Ed G. <flyboy_120@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Ed G." <flyboy_120@hotmail.com>
>
>
> For anyone doing covering work for the first time, Polyfiber has an
> excellent step by step covering manual and even a video available that are
> excelent. I attended the two day covering class put on by EAA and found
> that
> the class is simply a hands on application of exactly what is covered in
> the
> manual. All the answers are in that book includeing step by step on how to
> do the undercamber and rib stitching..Happy building/flying...Ed G..
>
>
> >From: "Rick Holland" <at7000ft@gmail.com>
> >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: you seen one wing, you seen em' both
> >Date: Mon, 29 May 2006 12:24:26 -0700
> >
> >Thank you Chuck, real windy all weekend here South of Denver also.
> >
> >Rick
> >
> >do not archive
> >
> >On 5/29/06, Rcaprd@aol.com <Rcaprd@aol.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> In a message dated 5/28/2006 8:09:10 PM Central Standard Time,
> >>at7000ft@gmail.com writes:
> >>
> >>Did you glue (poly-tak) the fabric to the bottom of each rib, or is it
> >>best to wait till you rib stitch to pull the bottom fabric up to the
> >>undercambered ribs?
> >>
> >>Rick,
> >> Allow me to jump in here. You should NOT glue the fabric to the
> >>bottom (or top) of the wing ribs, or when you shrink the fabric it could
> >>warp the ribs. The Stits method says the fabric will shrink by 10%.
> >> The way I did it, was to glue the fabric on the bottom first, then
> >>the top, then the wing tips, keeping the wrinkles out. I clamped the
> >>fabric
> >>in place with spring clamps and cloths pins. Then did the leading and
> >>trailing edge tapes, then do a fabric shrink with 75% to 80%of the
> >>suggested
> >>heat setting, then rib stitch - pulling the fabric up in the
> undercambered
> >>portion, then the final 100% of the full max suggested heat setting -
> >>keeping a close eye on the temp of the iron, then tape over the the
> >>stitches. You can hear the fabric moving all over the place when you
> >>shrink
> >>it. The stitches are closer together in the prop was area, plus one rib
> >>each side. I used just over 500 stitches !!
> >>
> >>Chuck G.
> >>NX770CG
> >>http://nx770cg.com/Wing.html
> >>Too windy to fly in the Land of Oz...I wonder if anyone ever did a
> takeoff
> >>- going in reverse !!
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >--
> >Rick Holland
> >
> >"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
>
>
--
Rick Holland
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: you seen one wing, you seen em' both |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Ed G." <flyboy_120@hotmail.com>
Thanks Rick...I probably would have followed their instructions...Ed
>From: "Rick Holland" <at7000ft@gmail.com>
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: you seen one wing, you seen em' both
>Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 06:54:49 -0700
>
>Yes I have the Polyfiber manual and it says glue the fabric to the bottom
>ribs.
>
>In appendix C it says put 2 coats of polytak on the lower ribs and allow it
>to dry then cover the top and bottom the usual way. But then its instructs
>you to brush polytak over the fabric on the bottom ribs to cement the
>fabric
>to the ribs, then 250 degree heatshrink and rib lace.
>
>The polyfiber people are the experts but from my experiences covering RC
>models back in the old days I remember the bad results I got if I glued
>fabric to the ribs so I am with you guys.
>
>Thanks
>
>Rick H.
>
>On 5/30/06, Ed G. <flyboy_120@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Ed G." <flyboy_120@hotmail.com>
>>
>>
>>For anyone doing covering work for the first time, Polyfiber has an
>>excellent step by step covering manual and even a video available that are
>>excelent. I attended the two day covering class put on by EAA and found
>>that
>>the class is simply a hands on application of exactly what is covered in
>>the
>>manual. All the answers are in that book includeing step by step on how to
>>do the undercamber and rib stitching..Happy building/flying...Ed G..
>>
>>
>> >From: "Rick Holland" <at7000ft@gmail.com>
>> >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>> >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: you seen one wing, you seen em' both
>> >Date: Mon, 29 May 2006 12:24:26 -0700
>> >
>> >Thank you Chuck, real windy all weekend here South of Denver also.
>> >
>> >Rick
>> >
>> >do not archive
>> >
>> >On 5/29/06, Rcaprd@aol.com <Rcaprd@aol.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> In a message dated 5/28/2006 8:09:10 PM Central Standard Time,
>> >>at7000ft@gmail.com writes:
>> >>
>> >>Did you glue (poly-tak) the fabric to the bottom of each rib, or is it
>> >>best to wait till you rib stitch to pull the bottom fabric up to the
>> >>undercambered ribs?
>> >>
>> >>Rick,
>> >> Allow me to jump in here. You should NOT glue the fabric to the
>> >>bottom (or top) of the wing ribs, or when you shrink the fabric it
>>could
>> >>warp the ribs. The Stits method says the fabric will shrink by 10%.
>> >> The way I did it, was to glue the fabric on the bottom first, then
>> >>the top, then the wing tips, keeping the wrinkles out. I clamped the
>> >>fabric
>> >>in place with spring clamps and cloths pins. Then did the leading and
>> >>trailing edge tapes, then do a fabric shrink with 75% to 80%of the
>> >>suggested
>> >>heat setting, then rib stitch - pulling the fabric up in the
>>undercambered
>> >>portion, then the final 100% of the full max suggested heat setting -
>> >>keeping a close eye on the temp of the iron, then tape over the the
>> >>stitches. You can hear the fabric moving all over the place when you
>> >>shrink
>> >>it. The stitches are closer together in the prop was area, plus one
>>rib
>> >>each side. I used just over 500 stitches !!
>> >>
>> >>Chuck G.
>> >>NX770CG
>> >>http://nx770cg.com/Wing.html
>> >>Too windy to fly in the Land of Oz...I wonder if anyone ever did a
>>takeoff
>> >>- going in reverse !!
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >--
>> >Rick Holland
>> >
>> >"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>--
>Rick Holland
>
>"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: you seen one wing, you seen em' both |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Ed G." <flyboy_120@hotmail.com>
Thanks Rick...I probably would have followed their instructions...Ed
>From: "Rick Holland" <at7000ft@gmail.com>
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: you seen one wing, you seen em' both
>Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 06:54:49 -0700
>
>Yes I have the Polyfiber manual and it says glue the fabric to the bottom
>ribs.
>
>In appendix C it says put 2 coats of polytak on the lower ribs and allow it
>to dry then cover the top and bottom the usual way. But then its instructs
>you to brush polytak over the fabric on the bottom ribs to cement the
>fabric
>to the ribs, then 250 degree heatshrink and rib lace.
>
>The polyfiber people are the experts but from my experiences covering RC
>models back in the old days I remember the bad results I got if I glued
>fabric to the ribs so I am with you guys.
>
>Thanks
>
>Rick H.
>
>On 5/30/06, Ed G. <flyboy_120@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Ed G." <flyboy_120@hotmail.com>
>>
>>
>>For anyone doing covering work for the first time, Polyfiber has an
>>excellent step by step covering manual and even a video available that are
>>excelent. I attended the two day covering class put on by EAA and found
>>that
>>the class is simply a hands on application of exactly what is covered in
>>the
>>manual. All the answers are in that book includeing step by step on how to
>>do the undercamber and rib stitching..Happy building/flying...Ed G..
>>
>>
>> >From: "Rick Holland" <at7000ft@gmail.com>
>> >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>> >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: you seen one wing, you seen em' both
>> >Date: Mon, 29 May 2006 12:24:26 -0700
>> >
>> >Thank you Chuck, real windy all weekend here South of Denver also.
>> >
>> >Rick
>> >
>> >do not archive
>> >
>> >On 5/29/06, Rcaprd@aol.com <Rcaprd@aol.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> In a message dated 5/28/2006 8:09:10 PM Central Standard Time,
>> >>at7000ft@gmail.com writes:
>> >>
>> >>Did you glue (poly-tak) the fabric to the bottom of each rib, or is it
>> >>best to wait till you rib stitch to pull the bottom fabric up to the
>> >>undercambered ribs?
>> >>
>> >>Rick,
>> >> Allow me to jump in here. You should NOT glue the fabric to the
>> >>bottom (or top) of the wing ribs, or when you shrink the fabric it
>>could
>> >>warp the ribs. The Stits method says the fabric will shrink by 10%.
>> >> The way I did it, was to glue the fabric on the bottom first, then
>> >>the top, then the wing tips, keeping the wrinkles out. I clamped the
>> >>fabric
>> >>in place with spring clamps and cloths pins. Then did the leading and
>> >>trailing edge tapes, then do a fabric shrink with 75% to 80%of the
>> >>suggested
>> >>heat setting, then rib stitch - pulling the fabric up in the
>>undercambered
>> >>portion, then the final 100% of the full max suggested heat setting -
>> >>keeping a close eye on the temp of the iron, then tape over the the
>> >>stitches. You can hear the fabric moving all over the place when you
>> >>shrink
>> >>it. The stitches are closer together in the prop was area, plus one
>>rib
>> >>each side. I used just over 500 stitches !!
>> >>
>> >>Chuck G.
>> >>NX770CG
>> >>http://nx770cg.com/Wing.html
>> >>Too windy to fly in the Land of Oz...I wonder if anyone ever did a
>>takeoff
>> >>- going in reverse !!
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >--
>> >Rick Holland
>> >
>> >"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>--
>Rick Holland
>
>"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 6
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| Subject: | you seen one wing, you seen em' both |
Rick, I covered my wing exactly to the procedure in Appendix C of the
PolyFiber manual. It worked just fine. I would do it that way again,
whenever I recover it.
Jack Phillips
Raleigh NC
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick
Holland
Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2006 9:55 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: you seen one wing, you seen em' both
Yes I have the Polyfiber manual and it says glue the fabric to the
bottom ribs.
In appendix C it says put 2 coats of polytak on the lower ribs and allow
it to dry then cover the top and bottom the usual way. But then its
instructs you to brush polytak over the fabric on the bottom ribs to
cement the fabric to the ribs, then 250 degree heatshrink and rib lace.
The polyfiber people are the experts but from my experiences covering RC
models back in the old days I remember the bad results I got if I glued
fabric to the ribs so I am with you guys.
Thanks
Rick H.
On 5/30/06, Ed G. <flyboy_120@hotmail.com> wrote:
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Ed G." <flyboy_120@hotmail.com>
For anyone doing covering work for the first time, Polyfiber has an
excellent step by step covering manual and even a video available that
are
excelent. I attended the two day covering class put on by EAA and found
that
the class is simply a hands on application of exactly what is covered in
the
manual. All the answers are in that book includeing step by step on how
to
do the undercamber and rib stitching..Happy building/flying...Ed G..
>From: "Rick Holland" <at7000ft@gmail.com>
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: you seen one wing, you seen em' both
>Date: Mon, 29 May 2006 12:24:26 -0700
>
>Thank you Chuck, real windy all weekend here South of Denver also.
>
>Rick
>
>do not archive
>
>On 5/29/06, Rcaprd@aol.com < Rcaprd@aol.com <mailto:Rcaprd@aol.com> >
wrote:
>>
>> In a message dated 5/28/2006 8:09:10 PM Central Standard Time,
>>at7000ft@gmail.com writes:
>>
>>Did you glue (poly-tak) the fabric to the bottom of each rib, or is it
>>best to wait till you rib stitch to pull the bottom fabric up to the
>>undercambered ribs?
>>
>>Rick,
>> Allow me to jump in here. You should NOT glue the fabric to the
>>bottom (or top) of the wing ribs, or when you shrink the fabric it
could
>>warp the ribs. The Stits method says the fabric will shrink by 10%.
>> The way I did it, was to glue the fabric on the bottom first,
then
>>the top, then the wing tips, keeping the wrinkles out. I clamped the
>>fabric
>>in place with spring clamps and cloths pins. Then did the leading and
>>trailing edge tapes, then do a fabric shrink with 75% to 80%of the
>>suggested
>>heat setting, then rib stitch - pulling the fabric up in the
undercambered
>>portion, then the final 100% of the full max suggested heat setting -
>>keeping a close eye on the temp of the iron, then tape over the the
>>stitches. You can hear the fabric moving all over the place when you
>>shrink
>>it. The stitches are closer together in the prop was area, plus one
rib
>>each side. I used just over 500 stitches !!
>>
>>Chuck G.
>>NX770CG
>>http://nx770cg.com/Wing.html
>>Too windy to fly in the Land of Oz...I wonder if anyone ever did a
takeoff
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Message 7
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| Subject: | Applying Varnish |
Is a paint brush the best method to apply varnish, or can that stuff be
sprayed to get it in the many difficult to brush areas=3F Hope you all
had a safe and enjoyable Memorial weekend.
Thank you,
John
This e-mail is intended for the use of the addressee(s) only and may contai=
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inform us promptly by reply e-mail, then delete the e-mail and destroy any
printed copy. Thank you.
Message 8
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| Subject: | you seen one wing, you seen em' both |
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Message 9
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| Subject: | Fabric shrinkage math / was you seen one wing, you seen |
em' both
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Message 10
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| Subject: | tenpol-List:weight and balance |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: <harvey.rule@bell.ca>
Thanks very much Gordon.I didn't need the level point for side to side.I
must have misunderstood the AME(not the first time and probably won't be
the last).All I really needed was the longeron level point which you
gave me.14.6 is my c of g probably due to the fact I have a starter
motor in mine.The battery sits in the front seat.I won't be carrying a
passenger.I'm classified basic ultralight (so I don't have the
authority).I figure I'm good for full up gas,including wing tank and a
light sleeping bag with very small light tent.No beer I'm afraid unless
I loose some weight and beer won't help me there anyway ,will it!I weigh
in at about 215lb so I don't see a problem here.The AME sez it will be
tight for load so don't over do it.Anybody out there looking for 50lbs I
'm giving it away for nothing.God it's hard to loose weight!Not hard to
put on though!Getting closer to take off!
Harv Rule
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gordon
Bowen
Sent: May 29, 2006 11:05 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List:weight and balance
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Gordon Bowen"
<gbowen@ptialaska.net>
Harvey,
A traditional rectangluar wing, flat bottomed, so called NACA wing, has
a
standard loaded CG range. The CG range is calculated to provide the CG
range slightly forward of the center of lift. This forward shift of
loaded
CG is due to the nature of the weight of the tail feathers and whether
they
provide additional lift in flight. This standard NACA wing loaded CG
range
is 25% to 33% of chord. So, assuming a 60" chord line, then this means
the
loaded operational CG range is 12" to 20" from the leading edge of the
wing.
The center of lift would be slightly behind the 20" back limit, to
assure a
nose over stall instead of a tail heavy flat non-recoverable stall.
Each
moveable item loaded in the plane would have a calculated ARM or
distance
forward of or behind this datum point (in the case above, meaning the
leading edge of the wing). The empty (setting longerons level in
hanger) is
less important, other than the fact the plane may fall over on it's prop
if
the empty CG is too far forward of the landing gear. So, here's how you
do
it, assuming the Pietenpol undercamber wing qualifies as a NACA type.
Level up the top longerons, north/south and east/west. You may have to
add
weight to the tail wheel to keep the nose from tipping over. Now weigh
the
plane at all three wheels. Drop plumb from the leading edge of the wing
and
mark it on the floor. Now measure the distance each wheel behind this
zero
datum line. Multiply the weights at each point the plane touches the
ground
x distance from datum and you'll get moment. Example- the tail wheel
could
weigh 10 lbs and be 170" behind the leading edge of wing therefore it's
moment is 1700"/lbs. Main gear axles could weigh each 300lbs and be 3"
behind the leading edge therefore 1800"/lbs. Divide total moment by
total
weight and you'll get the empty CG of the plane. Example above
continued--
total weight= 610lbs. total moment= 3500"/lbs, therefore empty CG is
5.7"
behind the leading edge of the wing. Each plane is different. The
empty
CG in inches will probably be within a couple inches of the actual main
gears axles'. Now sit in the pilot's seat and repeat the process, back
calulating the actual movement aft of the loaded CG vs the empty CG,
therefore you'll get the actual ARM of the pilot's seat. Do the same
for
the passenger seat and back calculate the ARM of the passenger. Do the
same
for fuel added and back calculate. Etc. Do back calculation technique
for
each moveable thing to be added to the empty plane, to get the safe
range
for flying loaded CG. Make a chart for your plane and stay within the
safe
loaded CG range for flying. You'll need help so get someone from the
local
EAA chapter to help and maybe they have nice accurate scales you can use
for
these needed weighings. The only variable in the above procedure is the
fact that the Piete traditional wing may have less than the 25-33% of
chord
tolerances for safe loaded flying.
Good luck
Gordon Bowen
----- Original Message -----
From: <harvey.rule@bell.ca>
Sent: Monday, May 29, 2006 4:03 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List:weight and balance
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: <harvey.rule@bell.ca>
>
> I have searched through the drawings and have come up empty as to the
> balance locations on the aircraft for a weight and balance.The AME has
> asked me to get in touch with the web to find out what these
> are.Thankyou in advance for any info you can provide.
>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Fabric shrinkage math / was you seen one wing, you |
seen em' both
Jim,
Think you thinking way tooooo much into this. :^).
It's to explain to people like one of my friends, no matter how you told
him to glue it on relaxed. he would struggle and struggle to pull it
tight like a drum, and have it slip back off and on and on.
Means that on a 60" chord wing you could leave up to 6" extra fabric on
it. ( Get up on a morning after you tossed and turned all night. turn
and look at the sheets on your bed. ) you can glue it on like that and
have it tighten up beautifully. :^)
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: Jim Ash
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2006 1:23 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fabric shrinkage math / was you seen one
wing, you seen em' both
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Jim Ash
One thing mentioned here, and we never really got a straight answer in
the class: Polyfiber claims 10 percent shrinkage. I don't fully
understand what this 10 percent means exactly, and one of my classmates
didn't either, although he and I were the only ones apparently
interested in the answer. If I glue my fabric on mildly tight before I
shrink, then have at it, is my wing going to be 10 percent smaller? I'm
thinking not. It's all about pressures, but that's not how they write it
up in the manual. The manual tries to keep it simple, but we were
interested in a bit more detail.
Jim Ash
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
http://wiki.matronics.com
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Applying Varnish |
With a brush, 2 guys can paint a wing panel in about 15 minutes. After
it dries, flip it over and hit the missed spots. Remember, the areas
that touch fabric, needs to be painted with epoxy.
Barry
----- Original Message -----
From: Egan, John
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2006 10:33 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Applying Varnish
Is a paint brush the best method to apply varnish, or can that stuff
be sprayed to get it in the many difficult to brush areas? Hope you all
had a safe and enjoyable Memorial weekend.
Thank you,
John
-----
This e-mail is intended for the use of the addressee(s) only and may
contain privileged, confidential, or proprietary information that is
exempt from disclosure under law. If you have received this message in
error, please inform us promptly by reply e-mail, then delete the e-mail
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Message 13
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| Subject: | Applying Varnish |
The first coat of varnish should be thinned about 50/50 with reducer, to
help it soak in and really seal the wood. Then the second coat should
be full strength. I used the polyfiber epoxy varnish - expensive but
excellent quality. It is pricey, but cheap compared to dry-rot. It
withstands virtually all chemical attack once cured, and is about as
bulletproof a coating for wood as you can find.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry
Davis
Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2006 4:32 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Applying Varnish
With a brush, 2 guys can paint a wing panel in about 15 minutes. After
it dries, flip it over and hit the missed spots. Remember, the areas
that touch fabric, needs to be painted with epoxy.
Barry
----- Original Message -----
From: Egan, John <mailto:jegan@kcc.com>
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2006 10:33 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Applying Varnish
Is a paint brush the best method to apply varnish, or can that
stuff be sprayed to get it in the many difficult to brush areas? Hope
you all had a safe and enjoyable Memorial weekend.
Thank you,
John
=09
=09
=09
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This e-mail is intended for the use of the addressee(s) only and may
contain privileged, confidential, or proprietary information that is
exempt from disclosure under law. If you have received this message in
error, please inform us promptly by reply e-mail, then delete the e-mail
and destroy any printed copy. Thank you.
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Cardinal Health -- Working together. For life. (sm)
This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privilege=
d, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have received it i=
n error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any
other use of the email by you is prohibited.
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Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Applying Varnish |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Don Emch" <EmchAir@aol.com>
With all of the little crevices all over the wings I found it easiest to thin the
varnish a little and spray it on with a pump up bug sprayer. I then went along
with a brush and touched up any runs. Did both panels outside, one coat
per evening. I'm sure there may have been a run or two that was left, but the
coverage was good and it's quick. You'll be kicking yourself when it comes time
to cover up all of that beautiful woodwork!
Don Emch
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=37491#37491
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Applying Varnish |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Jack T. Textor" <jtextor@thepalmergroup.com>
Don,
I assume you varnished the wing assembled? Not individual ribs prior to
assembly. I understand you need to keep the "glued" joints free of
varnish.
Jack Textor
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Don Emch" <EmchAir@aol.com>
With all of the little crevices all over the wings I found it easiest to
thin the varnish a little and spray it on with a pump up bug sprayer. I
then went along with a brush and touched up any runs. Did both panels
outside, one coat per evening. I'm sure there may have been a run or
two that was left, but the coverage was good and it's quick. You'll be
kicking yourself when it comes time to cover up all of that beautiful
woodwork!
Don Emch
Message 16
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| Subject: | spray on varnish/bug sprayer |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
I'm with Don Emch using the spray method then brush the drips clean.
I used the thinned stuff from Minwax---spar varnish for the wings. Did it
out in the driveway (stone) on sawhorses, flip, spray, flip.
Mike C.
Message 17
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| Subject: | 36" center section design |
I made mine 48" using the described method. I can carry a bit more gas
(14Gallons) I did it to prevent a scarf joint in the main spars, my
material was only 12'6" or so.
Steve e
________________________________
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick
Holland
Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2006 6:51 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 36" center section design
Would recommend purchasing the 36" CC plans from Bill Rewey, his address
was listed a couple days ago on this list. Basically you are correct the
only real difference is that the cabane fittings on the spars are
separate from the wing attach fittings at the ends of the spars.
Actually makes things easier I think. In my case, since I widened my
fuselage 2" the top bolt holes for the cabane fittings mated with the
top bolt holes of the wing attach fittings.
Rick H
On 5/28/06, John Egan <johnegan99@yahoo.com> wrote:
36" center section: With the direction from group members to build a
36" center section, please advise me if my thoughts are reasonable
regarding the design.
* Cut the center section spars to 36".
* Lengthen the plywood laminated plates so they span from the end
of the center spar back to the cabane strut attach points.
* The wing attachment brackets (flat stock) will be at the same
geometry as in the Vi Kaplar drawing, however they will not be welded to
the cabane strut weldment. A spacer will be needed to cleanly overlap
the brackets on the wing.
* Fabricate the cabane strut attachment welment and locate it
directly above the fuselage so the struts remain square to the fuselage
and wing.
So basically, fabricate the weldment as usual, without welding the flat
stock wing bracket to the strut weldment... A person could also use
something to the Grega plans however the traditional design calls for
easy to use flat stock.
I appreciate your thoughts and advice.
Thanks,
John
--
Rick Holland
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 18
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Hello! I need to know the size of the fuel line (Ford A engine). Plans shows 1/4"
copper tube. I.D or O.D? It seems a little small. Which is the size commonly
used?
Sorry about my very limited english. Thank you.
Santiago
__________________________________________________
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Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: you seen one wing, you seen em' both |
Interesting, so you glued the fabric to the bottom ribs before heat
shrinking? I guess it can be done either way.
Rick
On 5/30/06, Phillips, Jack <Jack.Phillips@cardinal.com> wrote:
>
> Rick, I covered my wing exactly to the procedure in Appendix C of the
> PolyFiber manual. It worked just fine. I would do it that way again,
> whenever I recover it.
>
>
> Jack Phillips
>
> Raleigh NC
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> *From:* owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *Rick Holland
> *Sent:* Tuesday, May 30, 2006 9:55 AM
> *To:* pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: Pietenpol-List: you seen one wing, you seen em' both
>
>
> Yes I have the Polyfiber manual and it says glue the fabric to the bottom
> ribs.
>
> In appendix C it says put 2 coats of polytak on the lower ribs and allow
> it to dry then cover the top and bottom the usual way. But then its
> instructs you to brush polytak over the fabric on the bottom ribs to cement
> the fabric to the ribs, then 250 degree heatshrink and rib lace.
>
> The polyfiber people are the experts but from my experiences covering RC
> models back in the old days I remember the bad results I got if I glued
> fabric to the ribs so I am with you guys.
>
> Thanks
>
> Rick H.
>
> On 5/30/06, *Ed G.* <flyboy_120@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Ed G." <flyboy_120@hotmail.com>
>
>
> For anyone doing covering work for the first time, Polyfiber has an
> excellent step by step covering manual and even a video available that are
>
> excelent. I attended the two day covering class put on by EAA and found
> that
> the class is simply a hands on application of exactly what is covered in
> the
> manual. All the answers are in that book includeing step by step on how to
>
> do the undercamber and rib stitching..Happy building/flying...Ed G..
>
>
> >From: "Rick Holland" <at7000ft@gmail.com>
> >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: you seen one wing, you seen em' both
> >Date: Mon, 29 May 2006 12:24:26 -0700
> >
> >Thank you Chuck, real windy all weekend here South of Denver also.
> >
> >Rick
> >
> >do not archive
> >
> >On 5/29/06, Rcaprd@aol.com < Rcaprd@aol.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> In a message dated 5/28/2006 8:09:10 PM Central Standard Time,
> >>at7000ft@gmail.com writes:
> >>
> >>Did you glue (poly-tak) the fabric to the bottom of each rib, or is it
> >>best to wait till you rib stitch to pull the bottom fabric up to the
> >>undercambered ribs?
> >>
> >>Rick,
> >> Allow me to jump in here. You should NOT glue the fabric to the
> >>bottom (or top) of the wing ribs, or when you shrink the fabric it could
> >>warp the ribs. The Stits method says the fabric will shrink by 10%.
> >> The way I did it, was to glue the fabric on the bottom first, then
> >>the top, then the wing tips, keeping the wrinkles out. I clamped the
> >>fabric
> >>in place with spring clamps and cloths pins. Then did the leading and
> >>trailing edge tapes, then do a fabric shrink with 75% to 80%of the
> >>suggested
> >>heat setting, then rib stitch - pulling the fabric up in the
> undercambered
> >>portion, then the final 100% of the full max suggested heat setting -
> >>keeping a close eye on the temp of the iron, then tape over the the
> >>stitches. You can hear the fabric moving all over the place when you
> >>shrink
> >>it. The stitches are closer together in the prop was area, plus one rib
> >>each side. I used just over 500 stitches !!
> >>
> >>Chuck G.
> >>NX770CG
> >>http://nx770cg.com/Wing.html
> >>Too windy to fly in the Land of Oz...I wonder if anyone ever did a
> takeoff
>
> Cardinal Health -- Working together. For life. (sm)
> _________________________________________________
>
> This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privileged,
proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error,
please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any other use
of the email by you is prohibited.
>
> Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - Norsk - Portuguese - Svenska: www.cardinalhealth.com/legal/email
>
>
--
Rick Holland
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel line size |
We used 3/8" on NX18235 using an A-65.
Bigger is better; less chance of the line becoming blocked with debris.
Greg C.
----- Original Message -----
From: santiago morete
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2006 5:34 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuel line size
Hello! I need to know the size of the fuel line (Ford A engine).
Plans shows 1/4" copper tube. I.D or O.D? It seems a little small.
Which is the size commonly used?
Sorry about my very limited english. Thank you.
Santiago
__________________________________________________
Espacio para todos tus mensajes, antivirus y antispam =A1gratis!
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