Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:32 AM - Re: rain rain go away (Rcaprd@aol.com)
2. 03:58 AM - Re: Copyrite ()
3. 03:58 AM - Re: 3rd flight report ()
4. 03:58 AM - Re: Tailwheel and steering ()
5. 05:05 AM - Re: Copyrite (Kip and Beth Gardner)
6. 05:05 AM - TW steering (Michael D Cuy)
7. 05:32 AM - Re: Copyrite (Bill Church)
8. 05:45 AM - Brussels, and the British (Bill Church)
9. 05:48 AM - here is an idea (Michael D Cuy)
10. 05:53 AM - done (Michael D Cuy)
11. 05:54 AM - Newsletter (Jeff Boatright)
12. 06:01 AM - Re: here is an idea (Rick Holland)
13. 06:27 AM - newsletter (Douwe Blumberg)
14. 06:27 AM - Marvel Mystery Oil (Oscar Zuniga)
15. 06:56 AM - Re: Marvel Mystery Oil (Lee Schiek)
16. 06:57 AM - Re: Marvel Mystery Oil (Steve Ruse)
17. 07:31 AM - Re: Brussels, and the British (Scott Knowlton)
18. 08:20 AM - Re: Brussels, and the British and balsa (Skip-Cinda Gadd)
19. 08:36 AM - Re: Marvel Mystery Oil (Jim Ash)
20. 08:47 AM - Re: Marvel Mystery Oil (Mark Blackwell)
21. 08:52 AM - Re: done (Steve Eldredge)
22. 08:54 AM - Re: BPA newsletter (Jeff Boatright)
23. 09:27 AM - Re: done ()
24. 10:51 AM - Brussels, and the British (Oscar Zuniga)
25. 11:03 AM - New on the List (Scott Knowlton)
26. 01:43 PM - Re: Marvel Mystery Oil (Mark Blackwell)
27. 02:02 PM - Re: Brussels, and the British (Bill Church)
28. 03:37 PM - Remember the vids from Richard DeCosta? (walt evans)
29. 04:10 PM - My Piet and aileron gap sealing (Jeff Boatright)
30. 04:20 PM - Re: Remember the vids from Richard DeCosta? (AMsafetyC@aol.com)
31. 04:39 PM - Re: Remember the vids from Richard DeCosta? (Jim Markle)
32. 04:50 PM - Re: here is an idea (mosnei2@aol.com)
33. 05:06 PM - Re: Re: Copyright Law (mosnei2@aol.com)
34. 05:06 PM - more basic planning questions. (AMsafetyC@aol.com)
35. 05:17 PM - Re: Re: Copyright Law (mosnei2@aol.com)
36. 05:57 PM - My Piet and aileron gap sealing (Jeff Boatright)
37. 06:38 PM - Re: My Piet and aileron gap sealing (Dave and Connie)
38. 10:02 PM - Re: Marvel Mystery Oil (Rcaprd@aol.com)
39. 10:39 PM - Re: Brussels, and the British (Clif Dawson)
40. 10:51 PM - Re: more basic planning questions. (Gordon Bowen)
41. 11:39 PM - Re: Brussels, and the British (Clif Dawson)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: rain rain go away |
In a message dated 6/26/2006 5:56:09 PM Central Standard Time,
at7000ft@gmail.com writes:
Probably the same for Chuck out there in Kansas.
Yep, it's beautiful blue skies here, with just enough white puffy clouds to
give the sky some texture. I saw on the news, where Walt is, that the east
coast is getting drenched.
Chuck G.
Message 2
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: <harvey.rule@bell.ca>
AMEN To That!
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Plncrzy3@netscape.net
Sent: June 26, 2006 9:12 PM
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Plncrzy3@netscape.net
As I sit here reading all the Bull-s--t about who or who does not hold a
copyright on idea's for building and flying a Pietenpol, that I would
think everyone should and would want to pass this information on to all
builder's both old and new. And to hear that the old idea's and
information should stay buried and not be shared with the new builder's
because someone cannot come up with new material and is just pirating
someone else's idea's is a bunch of CRAP! I thought that this is what
this was all about. If this is the way and attitude of most of the
Builder's and Flyer's of this network then I will quietly Build and Fly
my Pietenpol knowing that I did not infringe on anyone's Damn Copyright
or use there idea's or techniques to get my Plane finished. And all this
time I thought this was supposed to be a Fun thing to do between a group
of people with the same GOAL, To Build and Fly a Pietenpol. Bryan
__________________________________________________________________
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Message 3
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| Subject: | 3rd flight report |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: <harvey.rule@bell.ca>
I have a tail wheel that is controlled by springs and chain from the
rudder but there are no brakes.I use a butterfly bracket on the rudder.I
do have brakes on the front wheels though and I am still fiddling with
them ,trying to get the right setting.I don't see the need for one and
neither does my AME.If it comes down to weight then I can always change
to a skid but the handling would be a treat to watch with me at the
controls.
-----Original Message-----
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
gcardinal
Sent: June 27, 2006 12:18 AM
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "gcardinal" <gcardinal@mn.rr.com>
Builder's choice.
To install a tailwheel on a Pietenpol with Jenny style gear would
require
brakes and a means to steer the tailwheel. Brakes and steering add
weight,
complexity and additional trouble opportunities of their own.
I am perfectly satisfied to be limited to grass airstrips and mild
weather.
Cheers,
Greg Cardinal
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: <harvey.rule@bell.ca>
>
> I have to ask;why a tail skid when we have wheels that can be so much
> more manageable?Why look for trouble?
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Tailwheel and steering |
For some strange reason it turns left better than right but I have yet
to try take off and landings.I'll let you know in the future.
________________________________
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard
Schreiber
Sent: June 27, 2006 12:16 AM
I have a question for those who just used a non steerable tailwheel as
opposed to a steerable one with cables. How well has it worked on
landing and takeoff? Roughly what is your turning radius? I really want
to keep the weight down on that long moment arm if I can. I am used to
flying a Tripacer and my turning radius is probably over 40 feet at
best. So if the turning radius on a rigid tailwheel is not any worse
than that I can live with it.
Thanks,
Rick S.
Richard Schreiber
lmforge@earthlink.net
Why Wait? Move to EarthLink.
Message 5
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Kip and Beth Gardner <kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
At 9:11 PM -0400 6/26/06, Plncrzy3@netscape.net wrote:
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Plncrzy3@netscape.net
>
>As I sit here reading all the Bull-s--t about who or who does not
>hold a copyright on idea's for building and flying a Pietenpol, that
>I would think everyone should and would want to pass this
>information on to all builder's both old and new. And to hear that
>the old idea's and information should stay buried and not be shared
>with the new builder's because someone cannot come up with new
>material and is just pirating someone else's idea's is a bunch of
>CRAP! I thought that this is what this was all about. If this is the
>way and attitude of most of the Builder's and Flyer's of this
>network then I will quietly Build and Fly my Pietenpol knowing that
>I did not infringe on anyone's Damn Copyright or use there idea's or
>techniques to get my Plane finished. And all this time I thought
>this was supposed to be a Fun thing to do between a group of people
>with the same GOAL, To Build and Fly a Pietenpol. Bryan
Ok,
So Grant M. 'owns' a copyright on the old BPA newsletters, fine, end
of that particular subject.
However, I think it's still strange that everyone says what a great
thing Grant did for the community, etc., etc. when the graet thing
that he did was edit a newsletter that he now says no one can have
access to.
I came into this project about the time Grant stopped editing the
newsletter & the only thing he ever did for me personally was take my
money & deliver no newsletters. If he was going to stop writiing,
why didn't he let everyone know in advance so that people would not
continue sending him money? It would have been easy to post
something to that effect on his web site.
I don't know what soured Grant, but I think it's a shame that he
feels the way he does - his legacy would be so much greater if he let
this information be freely shared.
I'll say no more on this subject, I guess at this point it's been
beaten to death.
Kip G.
--
North Canton, OH
Message 6
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
Richard-- I have a fully steerable (not a free-swiveling tailwheel) setup
and I can easily turn around 180 degrees on our
35 foot wide runway where I am based. Perhaps the guys flying with fixed
tailwheels can respond about turning radius.
Mike C.
Message 7
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Bill Church" <eng@canadianrogers.com>
Bryan,
I think you might be missing the key point of this discussion (and if I
have misinterpreted what you wrote, then I apologise). What is
copyrighted is not the ideas, but rather, the publication (the
newsletters themselves). Ideas cannot be copyrighted. There is no reason
why a new newsletter could not present "old ideas" to a new audience. I
have seen a couple dozen Pietenpols up close, and I have yet to find two
alike, unless they were built together, at one time. Anyone is free to
look at any airplane and "borrow" whatever detail they like. And if
anyone wishes to submit an "idea" to a newsletter, they are free to do
so. It wouldn't have to be a new "idea", or even their own "idea".
As for the attitude of the builders and flyers of this network, I have
never been involved with a group that was as friendly, welcoming and
willing to help and share as this group. I have not met anyone yet that
was secretive about the details of their plane. In fact, most will go
that extra mile to help, or share their knowledge.
And you're right, this is supposed to be a FUN thing, so let's not get
hung up on publishing copyrights. Let's focus on building, flying and
camaraderie.
Bill C.
-----Original Message-----
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Plncrzy3@netscape.net
Sent: June 26, 2006 9:16 PM
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Plncrzy3@netscape.net
As I sit here reading all the Bull-s--t about who or who does not hold a
copyright on idea's for building and flying a Pietenpol, that I would
think everyone should and would want to pass this information on to all
builder's both old and new. And to hear that the old idea's and
information should stay buried and not be shared with the new builder's
because someone cannot come up with new material and is just pirating
someone else's idea's is a bunch of CRAP! I thought that this is what
this was all about. If this is the way and attitude of most of the
Builder's and Flyer's of this network then I will quietly Build and Fly
my Pietenpol knowing that I did not infringe on anyone's Damn Copyright
or use there idea's or techniques to get my Plane finished. And all this
time I thought this was supposed to be a Fun thing to do between a group
of people with the same GOAL, To Build and Fly a Pietenpol. Bryan
Message 8
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| Subject: | Brussels, and the British |
Okay, I finally got those photos from the Brussels, Ontario Pietenpol
fly-in downloaded. As I had a few requests, I have posted them at
Mykitplane.com - here's a link:
http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/photoGalleryList2.cfm?AlbumID=290
And while I've got your attention, check out the nice work they're doing
across the ocean. The UK Pietenpol Club has posted some new photos, as
another Piet hits the skies in the U.K. I think G-ECVB is one of the
nicest Air Campers around. Here's a link to the photos:
http://www.pietenpolclub.co.uk/gallery/
Bill C.
Message 9
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
How do we actually know that Grant won't allow us to recompile and
redistribute the old newsletters that he so labored over
(with tons of thankless ungrateful, don't let the door hit you in the ass
type mentalities out there once he quit after 10 years)
if nobody contacts him and explains our desires with him ? There is an
assumption that due to his response a year or so ago when we
went thru this that he might not be willing to negotiate, but how do we
know that for sure unless someone (and there is the big if) would
diplomatically approach him on the subject ? Perhaps this common sense,
down to earth guy can actually talk about this with us and
possibly reach some kind of agreement that would benefit all ? Then
again he might just say, nope---I'll take you to court if you do so, but
what hurts in trying ?
Grant is in the middle of building a new home and has travel plans for
quite a bit of his free time otherwise for the next month or two but I think
that unless someone doesn't want to step up here and contact him that I
would be willing to do that after the fly-in's at Brodhead and Oshkosh.
Funny how many people will cry about something but not lift a finger to
find the answers.
Mike
Message 10
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
For all the guys wringing their hands out there, I just DID something. I
forwarded my post to Grant.......will let you know what
he thinks when he has time to reply to me.
Mike
Message 11
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Jeff Boatright <jboatri@emory.edu>
As far as I know, the newsletter out of Brodhead is still available.
It comes out quarterly. The most recent one I have is from April
2006. I assume the next one will be slightly delayed so that a
Brodhead report can be published in it, but that's just a guess. I
don't have it in front of me, but if anyone is interested, I'll post
the contact information tonight when I get home. It's full color and
this current issue is eight pages.
Having edited an EAA chapter newsletter for years, I can assure you
that any content you send along to them will be greatly appreciated.
Also, having edited as an avocation and professionally, I can assure
you that even if the editor never writes a single word of original
content, the workload is enormous regardless of the size of the
newsletter or magazine. It's fun, but a lot of work.
Hope this helps,
Jeff
--
_____________________________________________________________
Jeffrey H. Boatright, PhD
Associate Professor, Emory Eye Center, Atlanta, GA, USA
Senior Editor, Molecular Vision, http://www.molvis.org/molvis
mailto:jboatri@emory.edu
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: here is an idea |
Good point Mike. I would like to have a set of the old newsletters and would
be willing to contribute money to a one time 'buy out' fund to encougrage
Grant to release the newsletters to the public domain for everyone's use.
Of course if he wants ten of thousands of dollars to do that then thats a
different matter.
Rick H.
On 6/27/06, Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov> wrote:
>
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <
> Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
>
>
> How do we actually know that Grant won't allow us to recompile and
> redistribute the old newsletters that he so labored over
>
> (with tons of thankless ungrateful, don't let the door hit you in the ass
> type mentalities out there once he quit after 10 years)
>
> if nobody contacts him and explains our desires with him ? There is an
> assumption that due to his response a year or so ago when we
>
> went thru this that he might not be willing to negotiate, but how do we
> know that for sure unless someone (and there is the big if) would
>
> diplomatically approach him on the subject ? Perhaps this common sense,
> down to earth guy can actually talk about this with us and
>
> possibly reach some kind of agreement that would benefit all ? Then
> again he might just say, nope---I'll take you to court if you do so, but
>
> what hurts in trying ?
>
> Grant is in the middle of building a new home and has travel plans for
> quite a bit of his free time otherwise for the next month or two but I
> think
>
> that unless someone doesn't want to step up here and contact him that I
> would be willing to do that after the fly-in's at Brodhead and Oshkosh.
>
> Funny how many people will cry about something but not lift a finger to
> find the answers.
>
> Mike
>
>
--
Rick Holland
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 13
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Okay guys,
After reading everyone's thoughts and talking to some guys individually,
here is what seems clear.
1. There is a need and desire for a good, informative newsletter to
support the Piet community.
1.5 the brodhead piet newsletter has petered out.
2. For lack of conclusive evidence, it should be assumed Grant owns all
the old articles
3. Grant did a great job
4. We should approach Grant, and the brodhead newsletter people in a
respectful and appreciative way, for advice and any possible offers of
help in allowing us to occasionally use some of the old material.
5. we have enough skills and experience in this group to put one
together.
6. we should stop talking and try it.
7. As I envision it, the purpose of a new Piet newsletter should be to
disseminate accurate information about the Piet, and how it is built.
It should address the common questions first time builders have. It
should provide encouragement to builders by sharing flying stories,
adventures etc. It should provide historical tidbits to help us all
keep in touch with the roots of this plane. It should encourage safety.
I think it would be fascinating to try tracking down every registered
Piet owner and dropping them a line asking for their story, performance
stats, etc. It should provide a list of Piet building resources. It
should finally have many pictures and should be fairly meaty.
So, here are my thoughts. For things like this, we need a "core" group
of people who have the passion, the time and the desire to help by
actually putting it together, writing articles, editing, soliciting
articles and stories and photos from other piet owners and builders,
etc.
John Hofmann who does the Travelair newsletter is willing to put it
together and get it mailed. I am willing to write, edit, solicit etc. I
hope everyone would be willing to make submissions of any kind, but how
about anyone interested in helping consistently contact me on my email.
John suggested, and I agree, that we should just try putting one
together and see how it goes. We have nothing to lose but a little time
and some money.
Douwe
douweblumberg@earthlink.net
Message 14
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| Subject: | Marvel Mystery Oil |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
G'day, low 'n' slow fliers;
I've been told by more than one aircraft owner that Marvel Mystery Oil is
good for anything that ails a small Continental; in the oil and in the fuel.
Anybody have any good or bad things to say about it?
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 15
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| Subject: | Marvel Mystery Oil |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Lee Schiek" <leeschiek@hotmail.com>
I've been using MMO in every engine I've owned for decades...C-65's,
O-360's, I0-540's, Chevy 454's, Subaru boxer engines, Onan generator, Briggs
& Strattons, etc. A little in the fuel every other fill-up...a little in
the crankcase at oil change, a little down the carb to winterize, etc.
Does it work? Don't know.....kinda like religion - ya need a little faith.
I do know that pulled heads have always been clean, the 454ci motorhome
greatly reduced oil consumption, and aircraft engines designed for leaded
fuel seemed to last longer......
My Model A car had a MMO Inverse Oiler installed....a jar & valving that
sent a few drops into the manifold in response to vacuum...couple
drops/minute at high vacuum (no load), 8-10 drops a minute a low vacuum
(under load).......
For 'bout a hundred bucks/year outlay, I consider it chicken soup for my
engines.....May not help, but it certainly can't hurt........
>From: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Marvel Mystery Oil
>Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2006 08:08:54 -0500
>
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga"
><taildrags@hotmail.com>
>
>G'day, low 'n' slow fliers;
>
>I've been told by more than one aircraft owner that Marvel Mystery Oil is
>good for anything that ails a small Continental; in the oil and in the
>fuel. Anybody have any good or bad things to say about it?
>
>Oscar Zuniga
>San Antonio, TX
>mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
>website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
>
>
>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
>http://wiki.matronics.com
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Marvel Mystery Oil |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Steve Ruse <steve@wotelectronics.com>
Oscar,
I use it in fuel only, I'm a little hesitant to put anything in my
oil, and I haven't heard any good reasons to do so in a Continental.
I've heard several stories of MMO "unsticking" sticky valves when
added to the fuel, and I figured that if it can unstick a stuck valve,
it should also keep them from sticking. That, along with
recommendations from a lot of people I respect, was enough to get me
to use it. It does leave a slight residue on my plane after 20+
hours, but it does wash away.
Steve Ruse
Norman, OK
Quoting Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com>:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
>
> G'day, low 'n' slow fliers;
>
> I've been told by more than one aircraft owner that Marvel Mystery Oil
> is good for anything that ails a small Continental; in the oil and in
> the fuel. Anybody have any good or bad things to say about it?
>
> Oscar Zuniga
> San Antonio, TX
> mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
> website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
> http://wiki.matronics.com
Message 17
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| Subject: | Brussels, and the British |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Scott Knowlton" <flyingscott_k@hotmail.com>
Thanks Bill. Eric and I just brought home three large RC airplanes that his
grandfather secured for him in an estate sale. Talk about a garage filled
with airplanes. I'm moving back into the building mode with Eric home but i
seem to be bouncing between RC and the real thing. Hope no balsa ends up in
the Piet!!
Nice pics.
Scott
>From: "Bill Church" <eng@canadianrogers.com>
>To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Brussels, and the British
>Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2006 08:48:34 -0400
>
>Okay, I finally got those photos from the Brussels, Ontario Pietenpol
>fly-in downloaded. As I had a few requests, I have posted them at
>Mykitplane.com - here's a link:
>
>http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/photoGalleryList2.cfm?AlbumID=290
>
>And while I've got your attention, check out the nice work they're doing
>across the ocean. The UK Pietenpol Club has posted some new photos, as
>another Piet hits the skies in the U.K. I think G-ECVB is one of the
>nicest Air Campers around. Here's a link to the photos:
>
>http://www.pietenpolclub.co.uk/gallery/
>
>Bill C.
_________________________________________________________________
Movies, Music & More! Visit Sympatico / MSN Entertainment
http://entertainment.sympatico.msn.ca/
Message 18
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| Subject: | Brussels, and the British and balsa |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Skip-Cinda Gadd" <csfog@earthlink.net>
Actually I plan to use balsa for the filler strips between gussets on the
top and bottom longerons and tail feathers. The filler strips are there
only to give the fabric a nice straight line to bend around.
Skip
> [Original Message]
> Hope no balsa ends up in
> the Piet!!
> Scott
Message 19
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| Subject: | Marvel Mystery Oil |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Jim Ash <ashcan@earthlink.net>
When I first bought my Cub, this subject came up. Apparently MMO is not officially
approved for aircraft use, but everybody looks the other way. I suspect if
there were a verifiable incident of failure traceable to MMO, the word would
get out and shut the practice down. I don't know if any of this applies to experimental
type, except in the case where you're maintaining a certificated engine
as standard type in your experimental airplane. I use a 1/4 cup of MMO in
a full tank of fuel in the Cub. I don't put it in my oil.
Jim Ash
-----Original Message-----
>From: Lee Schiek <leeschiek@hotmail.com>
>Sent: Jun 27, 2006 9:55 AM
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Marvel Mystery Oil
>
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Lee Schiek" <leeschiek@hotmail.com>
>
>I've been using MMO in every engine I've owned for decades...C-65's,
>O-360's, I0-540's, Chevy 454's, Subaru boxer engines, Onan generator, Briggs
>& Strattons, etc. A little in the fuel every other fill-up...a little in
>the crankcase at oil change, a little down the carb to winterize, etc.
>
>Does it work? Don't know.....kinda like religion - ya need a little faith.
>I do know that pulled heads have always been clean, the 454ci motorhome
>greatly reduced oil consumption, and aircraft engines designed for leaded
>fuel seemed to last longer......
>
>My Model A car had a MMO Inverse Oiler installed....a jar & valving that
>sent a few drops into the manifold in response to vacuum...couple
>drops/minute at high vacuum (no load), 8-10 drops a minute a low vacuum
>(under load).......
>
>For 'bout a hundred bucks/year outlay, I consider it chicken soup for my
>engines.....May not help, but it certainly can't hurt........
>
>
>>From: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
>>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Marvel Mystery Oil
>>Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2006 08:08:54 -0500
>>
>>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga"
>><taildrags@hotmail.com>
>>
>>G'day, low 'n' slow fliers;
>>
>>I've been told by more than one aircraft owner that Marvel Mystery Oil is
>>good for anything that ails a small Continental; in the oil and in the
>>fuel. Anybody have any good or bad things to say about it?
>>
>>Oscar Zuniga
>>San Antonio, TX
>>mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
>>website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
>>http://wiki.matronics.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Marvel Mystery Oil |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Mark Blackwell" <markb1958@verizon.net>
If you send an engine oil sample off for examination, the report will come
back as a non aviation substanse in the oil. IE oil comtaminated. Well
that really wouldn't be a big deal until something else liquid got in an
contaminated the oil.
Personally I have never seen anything that said it would do any harm, but
not really seen anything for sure that said it would do any good either. I
used it in a RX 7 for years. It had a turbo charged rotary in it and I used
MMO every fill up for years. The engine had 230,000 miles on it when a
cooling seal finally went bad.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 9:08 AM
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga"
> <taildrags@hotmail.com>
>
> G'day, low 'n' slow fliers;
>
> I've been told by more than one aircraft owner that Marvel Mystery Oil is
> good for anything that ails a small Continental; in the oil and in the
> fuel. Anybody have any good or bad things to say about it?
>
> Oscar Zuniga
> San Antonio, TX
> mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
> website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
> http://wiki.matronics.com
>
>
>
Message 21
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Steve Eldredge" <steve@byu.edu>
Mike C and I (Steve E) were building during the same period (10 years
ago!) that Grant was publishing. Grant is a great guy who decided to
turn his interests to other things after shepherding the piet flock for
years with the best looking news letter in the 'business'. He did give
a years warning and no-one picked up the baton. (including myself)
I'll be interested to see if his reply to Mike C. is the same that he
gave me years ago when we talked about copyright.
Personally I think the BPA newsletters are fascinating and helpful, but
the archives of this group have as much or more valuable information
when it comes to building. History is interesting however....
Steve E (the youngish, old timer. "I'm only 37... no make that 38.)
-----Original Message-----
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael
D Cuy
Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 6:53 AM
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy
<Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
For all the guys wringing their hands out there, I just DID something.
I
forwarded my post to Grant.......will let you know what
he thinks when he has time to reply to me.
Mike
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: BPA newsletter |
I had to come home over lunch, so I thought I'd dig out the most
recent BPA Newletter to send the list information about it. It is the
Second Quarter issue and came out on time (April), AFAIK. I agree
with Douwe that some recent issues are thin (though this one is 8
pages), but given that they are full color, that the
publisher/editors have the means to edit, typeset, and distribute,
and that someone has the interest, seems to me that all it's missing
is content.
Content and paying dues would be our contribution, whether that
contribution be made to the current Newsletter or to a new
newsletter. I'm not clear on why we wouldn't just contribute to the
current newsletter and not reinvent the wheel. BUT, don't let me get
in the way of someone's dream. As I wrote this morning, I used to
edit a newsletter. It was a lot of fun (but a lot of work, too).
In case you want to contribute to the current newsletter, the contact
information is:
The Brodhead Pietenpol Association Newsletter
c/o The Independent-Register
PO Box 255
Brodhead, WI 53520-0255
Email: bpa@indreg.com
A year's subscription is $16 (four issues). They have a standing
request for stories and photos of Piet-related items.
If another Piet newsletter pops up, I'll probably subscribe to that one, too!
Hope this helps,
Jeff
>Roman,
>
>I subscribe to the BPA newsletter too, and have enjoyed it... to a
>point. As I mentioned in my emails, the substance and regularity
>seemed to trail off a couple years ago to the point where I was
>occassionally getting a two or four page newsletter with very little
>of interest.
>
>I respect anyone who has the gumption to get up and freely "do"
>something like this and my hat is off to them. It does seem
>however, that they need help or to pass the baton.
>
>I'll try to contact them for a status update and pick their brains.
>
>Douwe
--
Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D.
Associate Professor
Department of Ophthalmology
Emory University School of Medicine
Atlanta, GA 30322
Editor-in-Chief
Molecular Vision
http://www.molvis.org/
Message 23
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: <harvey.rule@bell.ca>
SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO he's hearding sheep now you say!
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve
Eldredge
Sent: June 27, 2006 11:52 AM
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Steve Eldredge" <steve@byu.edu>
Mike C and I (Steve E) were building during the same period (10 years
ago!) that Grant was publishing. Grant is a great guy who decided to
turn his interests to other things after shepherding the piet flock for
years with the best looking news letter in the 'business'. He did give
a years warning and no-one picked up the baton. (including myself)
I'll be interested to see if his reply to Mike C. is the same that he
gave me years ago when we talked about copyright.
Personally I think the BPA newsletters are fascinating and helpful, but
the archives of this group have as much or more valuable information
when it comes to building. History is interesting however....
Steve E (the youngish, old timer. "I'm only 37... no make that 38.)
-----Original Message-----
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael
D Cuy
Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 6:53 AM
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy
<Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
For all the guys wringing their hands out there, I just DID something.
I
forwarded my post to Grant.......will let you know what
he thinks when he has time to reply to me.
Mike
Message 24
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| Subject: | Brussels, and the British |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
It is always so interesting and educational to review photographs of
different airplanes (especially Piets). I noticed several things in the
photos... such as, most Piets are set up with zero dihedral. One of the
ones in the photos has no strut bracing (the X-brace cables between the lift
struts), but then again it doesn't seem to have a registration number
either, so maybe it isn't finished yet. One seems to have a bottom (belly)
that is plumb flat (most have a stringer down the belly to give it some
roundness). And the fattened wing center section idea is one of those that
is so simple as to be one of those 'duh' things when additional fuel
capacity is desired for a center section fuel tank.
Good source for ideas. And yes, G-ECVB sure is a nice airplane. A cockpit
shot or two would be nice, but I didn't see any...
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 25
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--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Scott Knowlton" <flyingscott_k@hotmail.com>
Hello everyone. I thought I would introduce myself as a new member on the
list. Been watching and learning on the sidelines for quite some time but
didn't feel I had much to offer in the way of "how too" as I am a new
builder. I have been to Broadhead with my 11 year old building partner in
2004 and 2005 (spent an amazing 20 minutes aloft in a Pietenpol in 2005).
We are at the plans/initial building stage of our Pietenpol with 14 ribs
built and a bunch of spruce and AN hardware (mostly from the aeromart at the
"other fly-in"). I have to tell you that any time I have had a question I
have been able to answer it by doing a search on this amazing forum you
have. We are hoping to attend Broadhead again this year (only a 16 hour
drive from Toronto) but having started a new job I am unsure that I'll be
able to get the time off... If so I look forward to meeting more of the
"faces behind the names". Keep up the great posts and the excellent
technical information. For everyone who asks an open question on the forum
there are probably another ten of us who benefit from your answers.
Scott Knowlton
Burlington Ontario
_________________________________________________________________
Auto news & advice check out Sympatico / MSN Autos
http://en.autos.sympatico.msn.ca/Default.aspx
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: Marvel Mystery Oil |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Mark Blackwell" <markb1958@verizon.net>
MMO is definately illegal to use in any airplane with a standard
airworthiness certificate. But for those that are interested there is a
product called Av Blend which is legal that goes in the engine oil. I used
it in an old Isuzo Rodeo that had a bad knock and yes it stopped it when MMO
wouldn't. Id use it first, IF I were using a certified airplane engine.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 11:34 AM
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Jim Ash <ashcan@earthlink.net>
>
> When I first bought my Cub, this subject came up. Apparently MMO is not
> officially approved for aircraft use, but everybody looks the other way.
> I suspect if there were a verifiable incident of failure traceable to MMO,
> the word would get out and shut the practice down. I don't know if any of
> this applies to experimental type, except in the case where you're
> maintaining a certificated engine as standard type in your experimental
> airplane. I use a 1/4 cup of MMO in a full tank of fuel in the Cub. I
> don't put it in my oil.
>
> Jim Ash
Message 27
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| Subject: | Brussels, and the British |
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Bill Church" <eng@canadianrogers.com>
Oscar,
The plane with no X-brace cables between the lift struts does have
registration numbers on the rudder (C-FRCO) but the photographer seemed
to cut that off. The X-brace cables just weren't installed yet. It
hasn't flown since the restoration. I'm not sure, but I think that plane
is a highly modified Grega.
As for a cockpit shot of G-ECVB, try this:
http://www.airliners.net/open.file/0678122/L/
Bill C.
Message 28
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| Subject: | Remember the vids from Richard DeCosta? |
All those old vids of Piets flying, I had on my old computer. When I
tried to play the CD's on my new XP, it doesn't recogonize the files.
Does anyone have the vids? The newer guys would like them.
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
Message 29
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| Subject: | My Piet and aileron gap sealing |
Douwe,
Sorry you can't make it this year. My dad, a friend, and I bought our
Piet last August and we along with my wife will be at Brodhead.
Thanks for asking about it.
Our Piet was built in 1976 by a fellow in upstate NY. It's only got
about 300 hrs on it. Trucked in down in a UHaul. That was a long
drive that ended safely but in a downpour at the home airport. The
workmanship is excellent, it's always been hangared and the fabric is
in great shape. The original engine was an A65. Though it was
low-time, it had issues and has since been replaced with a C-75. With
two on board (180 lbs and 160 lbs) and full fuel (14 gal), we climb
out at about 450 fpm on a fairly standard day.
The engine swap helps on take-off and climb. However, the biggest
gain we've seen, certainly the biggest compared to the effort, was
sealing the aileron gaps with translucent duct tape. Before this, I
always felt that the plane was balanced on a knife edge on both axes.
It was jittery and just downright un-fun to fly in any circumstance
other than dead still air. Even in dead still air, initiating a
control input was like being slammed in turbulence - I'd move the
stick, nothing would happen, then (as Emeril would say) BAM! the
plane would lurch over into a turn. Even in light chop it was real
work to fly the thing.
Now, it is rock solid. The response is fairly quick, but s-m-o-o-t-h
and predictable. I highly suggest it to anyone who is flying with
open gaps. It really adds joy to the whole experience.
Another thing we've found is that the plane is happiest at about 70
mph. It'll do 90, but even at 80 it is just not as fun an experience.
Maybe bigger windscreens or better rigging would help. But, it sure
is fun at 70, so why bother?
A picture of the Piet and me is at the Pietenpol frappr site:
http://www.frappr.com/?a=viewphoto&id=1251828&pid=1983898
Jeff
At 2:34 PM -0400 6/27/06, Douwe Blumberg wrote:
>I can't believe it, but I won't be able to make this year. My best
>friend is getting married on Sat and simply refused to postpone it
>for me (rather selfish I thought!)
>
>Tell me about your Piet. Did you buy it, build it, is it finished,
>what engine???
>
--
_____________________________________________________________
Jeffrey H. Boatright, PhD
Associate Professor, Emory Eye Center, Atlanta, GA, USA
Senior Editor, Molecular Vision, http://www.molvis.org/molvis
mailto:jboatri@emory.edu
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Remember the vids from Richard DeCosta? |
I would love to see any vids on the peit
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Remember the vids from Richard DeCosta? |
I have them....plus a few more....
Send me an sase and I'll copy a few CDs of Piet videos for you....
Jim Markle
4247 W 420 Road
Pryor, OK 64361
214.505.6101
----- Original Message -----
From: AMsafetyC@aol.com
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 6:20 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Remember the vids from Richard DeCosta?
I would love to see any vids on the peit
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: here is an idea |
Just a thought .... If that doesnt work, then why not start a NEW Pietenpol Newsletter?
L.D. Sewell
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Tue, 27 Jun 2006 08:47:43 -0400
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Michael D Cuy <Michael.D.Cuy@grc.nasa.gov>
How do we actually know that Grant won't allow us to recompile and redistribute
the old newsletters that he so labored over
(with tons of thankless ungrateful, don't let the door hit you in the ass type
mentalities out there once he quit after 10 years)
if nobody contacts him and explains our desires with him ? There is an assumption
that due to his response a year or so ago when we
went thru this that he might not be willing to negotiate, but how do we know that
for sure unless someone (and there is the big if) would
diplomatically approach him on the subject ? Perhaps this common sense, down to
earth guy can actually talk about this with us and
possibly reach some kind of agreement that would benefit all ? Then again he might
just say, nope---I'll take you to court if you do so, but
what hurts in trying ?
Grant is in the middle of building a new home and has travel plans for quite a
bit of his free time otherwise for the next month or two but I think
that unless someone doesn't want to step up here and contact him that I would be
willing to do that after the fly-in's at Brodhead and Oshkosh.
Funny how many people will cry about something but not lift a finger to find the
answers.
Mike
________________________________________________________________________
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: Copyright Law |
As far as I know a copyright is automatically created at the time a work is written
by its author. In other words it belongs to he who WROTE IT. It can be sold
or otherwise transferred to another party by an agreement, however, failing
that -- the material would normally still belong to the original AUTHOR. That's
just my understanding and it certainly doesn't mean its right.... I'm sure
at least one of you on the list has to be a lawyer, care to render an authoritative
legal opinion?
Just another thought ... Before I would argue with anybody over old newsletters
I would simply start a NEW NEWSLETTER and with all the active interest in this
wonderful little airplane called a Pietenpol ... there would be no shortage
of material.
L. D. Sewell
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Sun, 25 Jun 2006 10:26:57 -0400
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Kip and Beth Gardner <kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
Dick,
Thanks for the clarification, I thought this was the case, having some friends
who publish in the music business, but my personal experience is not there, so
I could not authoratatively reply to Mike.
So, my original question stands, does Grant McClaren hold a copyright for the old
issues of the BPA newsletter that he edited or not? Where's the proof?
I have heard that he has been quite belligerent towards anyone who has wanted to
reprint material, but to my knowledge, he has not presented any proof to anyone
that he holds such a copyright. As I said before, all of my old copies have
absolutely no mention anywhere in them that the material is copyrighted or that
a copyright has been applied for. In fact, I think that the fact that he put
in a statement that the material is intended for BPA members leads me to believe
that the material IS NOT copyrighted & that he put that statement there
to try to cover his ass without going to the trouble of getting one, and perhaps
as a C-H-A for liability as well.
The reason that I'm making an issue of this is that there is a true wealth of information
in those old issues & it should be available to the community, not
hoarded by Grant as if he were some kind of troll guarding a treasure.
Kip Gardner
At 1:07 PM +0000 6/25/06, flywrite@hughes.net wrote:
>--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "flywrite@hughes.net" ><flywrite@hughes.net>
>
>As a magazine publisher with some experience with copyrights, I believe
>someone has misinformed Mike Volckermann about copyright law. The U.S.
>Patent and Copyright Office (www.uspto.gov) does not automatically
>issue a copyright, nor does any other agency do so. Indeed, a copyright
>can be issued only after the applicant has filed an application, paid
>the requisite fee, and the application referred to an examiner. If the
>examiner finds the application acceptable in its own right, and does
>not infringe upon any other copyright, a certificate of copyright can
>be issued. No one can claim that anything is, or has been, copyrighted
>unless a certificate has been issued to cover the specific material for
>which the copyright is claimed. However, if an applicaton has been
>filed, the claimant can use the term "Copyright applied for" to alert
>would-be users of the material to the danger of copyright
>violation/prosecution.
>
>This has nothing to do per se with the Broadhead newsletter. However,
>if the claim is being made that any or all of the newsletters are
>covered by a copyright, then an unexpired (or renewed) USPTO copyright
>document to that effect would settle the matter once and for all.
>In the absence of such a document, I believe a patent attorney would
>advise that the material is in the public domain.
>
>Dick Carden
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
North Canton, OH
________________________________________________________________________
Message 34
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| Subject: | more basic planning questions. |
I would like to achieve a wider range of useable load and climb performance
without too many sacrifices.
With the exception of the prop. What are the other variables to increasing
useable load? Is this a horsepower only issue and what are the other
variables?
I realize there are a series of design compromises that accompany design
changes so I was curious as where the useable comes from and how is that
determined?
Naturally the collective experience and insight and topic knowledge is
greatly appreciated in answering one of many basic questions I have.
Thanks
John
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: Copyright Law |
Here is a link to some very interesting information on the subject of copyrights
http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ1.html#wci
L.D.Sewell
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Mon, 26 Jun 2006 01:26:08 -0700
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca>
As a painter and sculptor, when I sell a painting
or sculpture, the only thing I sell is the physical
object itself. I retain the right of copy unless
specifically agreed upon to do otherwise. There
have been cases of the purchaser making
prints of a painting and making copies of a
sculpture where the artist has discovered it
and taken the "owner" to court. In every case
I know of the artist has recovered damages
and the perpetuator penalized.
A few years ago a local artist saw a painting
by another artist that incorporated a small
part of one of his paintings. He successfully
sued. The notoriety was beneficial to BOTH
artists!
A publication such as the BPA or a magazine
may print things submitted by outside parties,
such as you and I, or by their own employed
writers. The first is like my painting, the second
belongs to the publication.There is more to it,
however. If the publication solicits your
services to write something for them then you
have been employed and the work is theirs. If
you submit an unsolicited article on a subject
of your choice with the idea that it may be of
interest to their readers and they buy it from
you then you retain the rights unless you
explicitly sign them away in some fashion, as
Mark has said.
In the case of the BPA we have no idea what
the original contractual agreement was for any
given article. It's no use speculating or assuming
anything either. If you copy the entire newsletter
then that, regardless of what it's comprised of, is
an entity unto itself and owned by the publisher
or, more likely, the company or individual that
owns the publishing company.
The answer is to write your own. Suppose you
want to pass on some important information about
a topic such as standard spin recovery techniques
that you think would be beneficial to the rest of us
Peiters.
In this case the facts are the facts, do this, do that, do
the other thing and you come out the bottom straight.
Copy the original and you break the law. Take those
facts, write about them in your own words and phrases,
and THAT document is yours even though the reader
comes away with exactly the same knowledge from
either article.
Notes from the Convoluted Universe, Clif
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Mark Blackwell" > <markb1958@verizon.net>
>
> There is one thing though that might come up. Publishing an article in a > mag
doesn't necessarily give the copyright to the editor or publisher. It > would
depend on how the agreement was written. A publication may be given > "one time
use rights" which only allows the publication in that months > issue. A magazine
can claim a copyright for that issue, but may or may > not hold the copyright
for the work itself. The newsletter claiming > copyright, in reality might
not have it, but that wouldn't necessarily > meant if fell into public domain
either.
> ----- Original Message ----- > Sent: Sunday, June 25, 2006 3:24 PM
________________________________________________________________________
Message 36
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| Subject: | My Piet and aileron gap sealing |
Douwe,
Sorry you can't make it this year. My dad, a friend, and I bought our
Piet last August and we along with my wife will be at Brodhead.
Thanks for asking about it.
Our Piet was built in 1976 by a fellow in upstate NY. It's only got
about 300 hrs on it. Trucked in down in a UHaul. That was a long
drive that ended safely but in a downpour at the home airport. The
workmanship is excellent, it's always been hangared and the fabric is
in great shape. The original engine was an A65. Though it was
low-time, it had issues and has since been replaced with a C-75. With
two on board (180 lbs and 160 lbs) and full fuel (14 gal), we climb
out at about 450 fpm on a fairly standard day.
The engine swap helps on take-off and climb. However, the biggest
gain we've seen, certainly the biggest compared to the effort, was
sealing the aileron gaps with translucent duct tape. Before this, I
always felt that the plane was balanced on a knife edge on both axes.
It was jittery and just downright un-fun to fly in any circumstance
other than dead still air. Even in dead still air, initiating a
control input was like being slammed in turbulence - I'd move the
stick, nothing would happen, then (as Emeril would say) BAM! the
plane would lurch over into a turn. Even in light chop it was real
work to fly the thing.
Now, it is rock solid. The response is fairly quick, but s-m-o-o-t-h
and predictable. I highly suggest it to anyone who is flying with
open gaps. It really adds joy to the whole experience.
Another thing we've found is that the plane is happiest at about 70
mph. It'll do 90, but even at 80 it is just not as fun an experience.
Maybe bigger windscreens or better rigging would help. But, it sure
is fun at 70, so why bother?
A picture of the Piet and me is at the Pietenpol frappr site:
http://www.frappr.com/?a=viewphoto&id=1251828&pid=1983898
Jeff
At 2:34 PM -0400 6/27/06, Douwe Blumberg wrote:
>I can't believe it, but I won't be able to make this year. My best
>friend is getting married on Sat and simply refused to postpone it
>for me (rather selfish I thought!)
>
>Tell me about your Piet. Did you buy it, build it, is it finished,
>what engine???
>
--
Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D.
Associate Professor
Department of Ophthalmology
Emory University School of Medicine
Atlanta, GA 30322
Editor-in-Chief
Molecular Vision
http://www.molvis.org/
Message 37
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| Subject: | Re: My Piet and aileron gap sealing |
That looks like Watson Hartway's old plane. I was probably his last
student for tailwheel transition and now rent his old hangar at 01G. We
had a lot of fun flying off 15 hours of dual when I bought the Taylorcraft.
I also had a BFR from the guy that bought the plane outof the
estate. During the BFR I found out that that was his first hour of
Taylorcraft time.
Dave
N36078 '41 BC-12-65
At 07:08 PM 6/27/2006, you wrote:
>Douwe,
>
>Sorry you can't make it this year. My dad, a friend, and I bought our Piet
>last August and we along with my wife will be at Brodhead. Thanks for
>asking about it.
>
>Our Piet was built in 1976 by a fellow in upstate NY. It's only got about
>300 hrs on it. Trucked in down in a UHaul. That was a long drive that
>ended safely but in a downpour at the home airport. The workmanship is
>excellent, it's always been hangared and the fabric is in great shape. The
>original engine was an A65. Though it was low-time, it had issues and has
>since been replaced with a C-75. With two on board (180 lbs and 160 lbs)
>and full fuel (14 gal), we climb out at about 450 fpm on a fairly standard day.
>
>The engine swap helps on take-off and climb. However, the biggest gain
>we've seen, certainly the biggest compared to the effort, was sealing the
>aileron gaps with translucent duct tape. Before this, I always felt that
>the plane was balanced on a knife edge on both axes. It was jittery and
>just downright un-fun to fly in any circumstance other than dead still
>air. Even in dead still air, initiating a control input was like being
>slammed in turbulence - I'd move the stick, nothing would happen, then (as
>Emeril would say) BAM! the plane would lurch over into a turn. Even in
>light chop it was real work to fly the thing.
>
>Now, it is rock solid. The response is fairly quick, but s-m-o-o-t-h and
>predictable. I highly suggest it to anyone who is flying with open gaps.
>It really adds joy to the whole experience.
>
>Another thing we've found is that the plane is happiest at about 70 mph.
>It'll do 90, but even at 80 it is just not as fun an experience. Maybe
>bigger windscreens or better rigging would help. But, it sure is fun at
>70, so why bother?
>
>A picture of the Piet and me is at the Pietenpol frappr site:
>
>http://www.frappr.com/?a=viewphoto&id=1251828&pid=1983898
>
>Jeff
>
Message 38
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| Subject: | Re: Marvel Mystery Oil |
In a message dated 6/27/2006 8:29:07 AM Central Standard Time,
taildrags@hotmail.com writes:
I've been told by more than one aircraft owner that Marvel Mystery Oil is
good for anything that ails a small Continental; in the oil and in the fuel.
Anybody have any good or bad things to say about it?
I use it in my fuel, and oil, but can't really say yay or nay about it...just
going on the words of others about it.
Chuck G.
NX770CG
Message 39
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| Subject: | Re: Brussels, and the British |
Mine already does. In nonstructural places
balsa is light and strong enough to be effective.
I used it to give shape and solidity to the ply
cover at the front of the turtledeck. The ply
itself is 1/64" which gives a hard surface to
that area. If I used ply strong enough to put
any weight on it would be a lot heavier than
what I've done. Also I covered the entire
inside of the first bay of the turtle deck with
1/32" ply, glueing it to the inside of the
stringers. Nothing to glue the edges to so
1/2" square balsa was used.
The pic shows the balsa and the ply with
contact cement ready to be mated.
Clif
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Scott Knowlton"
> <flyingscott_k@hotmail.com>
>
Hope no balsa ends up in
> the Piet!!
>
> Scott
Message 40
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| Subject: | Re: more basic planning questions. |
John,
Useful load is almost entirely a function of wing design, shape and
size. The increased climb rate, some increase in top speed, etc. can be
influenced by prop or engine HP, these are variables you can control.
But the wing has a max. loading, it can carry the plane's weight (which
you can control by building lighter), and other "useful" stuff like fuel
and you (which you can vary), up to the max allowable for wing loading-
lbs/sq.ft. Max wing loading allows for pulling G's in turns up to the
limits of the category normally 3.8g's. You want more useful load, you
gotta change the wing, ie. increased length, more chord width, diff
shape, etc. Goggle it, and/or buy book on subject. The original Piete
airfoil is "birdlike", it has a comparatively high coefficient of lift
but higher drag due to it's shape results in lower landing speed but
also lower cruise speed. One option you have for the wing is to buy a
used wing set off of an Aeronca or SuperCub, etc., and attach this to
the traditional Piete design. That is one of the beautiful things about
the Piete. This will give you a diff plane design with higher loadings
possible, higher cruise but normally higher landing speeds. Everything
is a trade-off.
Gordon
----- Original Message -----
From: AMsafetyC@aol.com
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 4:05 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: more basic planning questions.
I would like to achieve a wider range of useable load and climb
performance without too many sacrifices.
With the exception of the prop. What are the other variables to
increasing useable load? Is this a horsepower only issue and what are
the other variables?
I realize there are a series of design compromises that accompany
design changes so I was curious as where the useable comes from and how
is that determined?
Naturally the collective experience and insight and topic knowledge is
greatly appreciated in answering one of many basic questions I have.
Thanks
John
Message 41
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| Subject: | Re: Brussels, and the British |
Rats! Here I thought I was being original and
I'm not! I even made a small peanut scale
model with a Tigermoth style fuel tank to see if
I liked it. And there it is already. At least I can
see that it looks perfectly fine.
Another one. Look at the pic of the inside of the
motorcycle wheel. Did you see the strap cable
under the bungee? That is what keeps the brake
assembly from turning. One end to the front leg
and the other to the lower rear of the brake face
plate. The only time the brakes are used is when
the plane is taxiing, hopefully not overrunning the
end of the runway! :-) Hopefully this means the
axle won't be bouncing up and down a whole lot.
so there won't be much fore and aft travel at the
plate connection. The drawings I did a few weeks
ago show that even with an axle travel of 3" that
point will only travel 1/4". I don't know about this
one but my baseplate will not be welded to the
axle.
This system eliminates those fancy axel locater
brackets and tubes, (eg Mike Cuy for one),
I remember a whole raft of messages concerned
with welding such things and at least one axel
breaking at that weld. There's the solution, tried
and true, quick and Pietenpol dirty. Right before
your eyes in Brussels Ontario.
Clif, now in possession of a giant lawn dart.
From: Bill Church
Okay, I finally got those photos from the Brussels, Ontario Pietenpol
fly-in downloaded. As I had a few requests, I have posted them at
Mykitplane.com - here's a link:
http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/photoGalleryList2.cfm?AlbumID=290
Bill C.
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