Today's Message Index:
----------------------
0. 01:03 AM - Please Make a Contribution to Support Your Lists... (Matt Dralle)
1. 04:00 AM - Re: The correct spelling is advice..... ()
2. 04:32 AM - Weight & Balance (Peter W Johnson)
3. 05:14 AM - Re: Weight & Balance (gcardinal)
4. 06:52 AM - High at. performance (lshutks@webtv.net (Leon Stefan))
5. 07:53 AM - Fuselage taper point (Dan Loegering)
6. 09:16 AM - Re: Re: High density altitude airport (shad bell)
7. 09:41 AM - Re: Re: Ohio area pietenpol gathering (shad bell)
8. 10:17 AM - Re: Re: High density altitude airport (Tom Bernie)
9. 10:49 AM - Re: Weight & Balance (walt evans)
10. 10:54 AM - Re: Weight & Balance ()
11. 01:35 PM - Re: Weight & Balance (Peter W Johnson)
12. 02:22 PM - Re: Weight & Balance (walt evans)
13. 02:46 PM - Re: Weight & Balance (Peter W Johnson)
14. 03:09 PM - Re: Weight & Balance (Rcaprd@aol.com)
15. 03:33 PM - Re: Fuselage taper point (Rcaprd@aol.com)
16. 03:41 PM - Re: Weight & Balance (walt evans)
17. 06:58 PM - Re: Fuselage taper point (Dick Navratil)
18. 08:24 PM - Re: Re: High density altitude airport (Rick Holland)
19. 09:40 PM - Re: The correct spelling is advice..... (Clif Dawson)
20. 11:19 PM - Re: Weight & Balance (Rcaprd@aol.com)
Message 0
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| Subject: | Please Make a Contribution to Support Your Lists... |
Dear Listers,
Just a reminder that November is the Annual List Fund Raiser. Please make a Contribution
today to support the continued operation and upgrade of these great
List services!! Pick up a really nice free gift with your qualifying Contribution
too!
The Contribution Site is fast and easy:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Thank you!
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
Message 1
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| Subject: | The correct spelling is advice..... |
You'll learn nothing from me but lots from those who pick up on my
mistakes and I like to jump right in there with both feet and I make a
lot of em.Glad to be of service in an inverse way.Keep em flizing.
________________________________
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary
Gower
Sent: November 22, 2006 12:48 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: The correct spelling is advice.....
GEEEE... We international members are learning a lot of good english,
Aviation knowledge is only an extra free bonus... :-)
Thanks a lot to all of you.
Saludos
Gary Gower.
Do not archive, por favor.
Bill Church <eng@canadianrogers.com> wrote:
Sorry Harvey, but flys just isn't proper English (in the U.S.,
nor in Canada). (here's a link to a quick explanation)
http://wsu.edu/~brians/errors/flys.html
Honestly, I didn't get the joke. I just didn't see what was
funny about what was written. I wasn't trying to be a nit-picker. For
example, I wouldn't point out that you typed "ment" instead of "meant"
in your posting. (sorry, couldn't resist)
What IS funny is that now we are finding humour (humor) in
things that are actually grammatically correct, and trying to "correct"
them.
I know my fingers don't always land on the keyboard where they
were intended to land, but I always give my message a quick read before
I spit it out into cyberspace. Maybe we should all make a habit of using
the spell-checker before we hit "send".
By the way, I'm pretty sure those pesky little bugs that drive
ME nuts in the summer are called mosquitoes.
Bill
do not archive
Mortgage rates near historic lows: $150,000 loan as low as $579/mo.
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Message 2
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| Subject: | Weight & Balance |
Hi Guys,
This may be a dumb question but which way does the C of G move if you move
the wing BACK! Does it follow the wing movement, i.e. move the wing back CG
moves aft, move the wing forward CG moves forward?
Cheers
Peter
Wonthaggi, Australia
http://www.cpc-world.com
--
10:36 PM
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Weight & Balance |
The reason for moving the wing is to change the location of the airfoil's
center of lift in relation to the aircraft's center of gravity.
To answer your question, the aircraft cg will move aft when you move the
wing aft but the airfoil center of lift will move aft much more than the cg.
Greg C.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka@bigpond.net.au>
Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 6:32 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
> <vk3eka@bigpond.net.au>
>
> Hi Guys,
>
> This may be a dumb question but which way does the C of G move if you move
> the wing BACK! Does it follow the wing movement, i.e. move the wing back
> CG
> moves aft, move the wing forward CG moves forward?
>
> Cheers
>
> Peter
> Wonthaggi, Australia
> http://www.cpc-world.com
>
>
> --
> 10:36 PM
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | High at. performance |
.......do you seasoned Model A fliers......? I think the question
didn't elicit much response is because there are very few (if any )
Model A fliers on the list. I think there are a lot of Model A builders
here, but few (if any ) fliers . The one thing that gets repeated often
is that the reliability of the A is in direct proportion to the amount
of hop up you do. Some of A guys have good success with this engine.
Others don't and throw in the towel and go with a Cont. or something.
Ken Perkins does well with his hopped up A, but has his share of forced
landings. I don't know what to tell you since I haven't flown yet,
except keep it LIGHT. Remember the stock A is only about 40 hp. It
seams to fly a lot of Piets ok, but with little margin. My field alt. is
1500 ft and I am getting religion praying that my A will work good, Leon
S. in Ks. with a Cont. 65 in the corner gathering dust..just in case.
Message 5
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| Subject: | Fuselage taper point |
Ken Heide and I were discussing the "wide fuselage" options last night while gluing
up the last of four fuse sides. Has anyone ever moved the taper start point
to the back of the rear seat instead of at the station ahead of it? What
would the issue be of keeping the 24" dimension all the way back to that point?
We are building the long fuselage version and tested one side last night to
be sure that it would pull in with the shorter distance. This change would be
a very minimal structural change but would effectively widen the rear cockpit
by 2" at the pilot's shoulders.
Let the discussion begin! We are looking for pro's and con's about this possible
solution.
Dan Loegering
Fargo, ND
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: High density altitude airport |
Rick, Dad's corvair was putting out somewhere in the 90-100hp range with a marvel
scebler ma3spa carb and no blower fan. We are located at about 1000msl in
central Ohio and even on a hot day (90 +) with full fuel and me (180lbs, empty
wt 732lbs with batt and starter), I can get an initial climb of 600 -700ft/min.
That would put the gross wt at about....990lbs. On a 90 deg day during the
test phase I climbed to 8000msl and had no problems and was still getting 200
ft/min est. as alt increased. It may have got better if we had a mixture control
but that is too high out here in Ohio for practical flights,I was up there
just to see if It would do it, and to cool off. Besides airliners coming in
to Port Columbus Airport (20 miles south) get a little to big in the windscreen
for my taste. I would guess with a single person and 10 gal of "go juice"
It will climb like a heavy 150. The other good thing is at 50-55mph your not
covering as much ground as you would in a 150
climbing at 75-80mph, so that runway is still below you for just a little longer
if you need it.
My 2 cents worth,
Shad
Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca> wrote:
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: High density altitude airport
My airport is at 6840, over 10,000 density altitude on a hot day. Am going with
a Corvair (100 HP), will let you know if it's enough. I have flown 150s (also
100 HP and 1000lbs empty weight) many times with a passenger from similiar altitude
airports and did ok so it should be enough.
Rick
---------------------------------
Rates near 39yr lows. $510,000 Loan for $1698/mo - Calculate new house payment
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Ohio area pietenpol gathering |
Don, That sounds good. I usually fly over to Wyncoop (12miles away) to get fuel,as
I live on a private strip/ community in Centerburg (Chpman Memorial), and
we dont have fuel here. If Barber doesn't work out I can ask Wyncoop about having
it co-inside with the Waco fllys'ziz-in (ha ha). I even thought about asking
the airport owner here at Chapman if we could have it here. I have about
1 acre behind my hanger to park piets. But I am guessing Bill See the airport
owner won't like the idea (insurance reasons I suppose). But if any of you
would like to fly into chapman I AM allowed to invite you, and piets are always
welcome, and there is plenty of grass, 3100ft 28/10 runways and it is pretty
smooth. By the way if Barber doesn't host it or we all want to meet at the waco
fly-in also, bring a check or cash for the fuel at Wyncoop, as they don't
accept plastic. However they have the best price on 100LL I saw all last summer.
I believe it was only $2.20/ Gal, compared to
an average of 3.00-3.50/ gal. Well group I am glad you all share the interest
of a more local piet gathering. We might just have to meet up and do high speed
(80mph)fly -by's in tandem at the local fly-in's one after the other like
the RV guys. ( "Aircamper Overcast"). BOY, they would get mad! It would steal
all there thunder to see a "Rag Bag" mock them there fast aeroplanes.
Sorry to get so excited, haven't flown the Piet for a few months,
Shad
Don Emch <EmchAir@aol.com> wrote:
It sounds like Barber could work. Making it a Pietenpol/Corvair Fly-in might be
a good idea. I'll bet we could get a showing of Ford, Corvair, and Continental
powered ships without too much arm twisting. If we advertise we might get more
than just Buckeyes there too. With the nice weather forecast this week I may
try to fly over and see Forrest and see what he thinks and if others like the
idea, maybe you could bring it up at a chapter meeting Kip. What do you think
Shad?
Don E.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=76246#76246
---------------------------------
Mortgage rates near historic lows: $150,000 loan as low as $579/mo. Intro-*Terms
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: High density altitude airport |
Guys,
The Koch chart gives a pretty good idea of how performance is
affected at higher altitude airports. A quick look at the chart show an
aircraft that climbs at 500 fpm from a 50 degree sea level airport will
climb at about 200 fpm from a 50 degree 6000' airport. (At 100 degrees
it will drop to around 100 fpm.)
Tom Bernie
On Wed, 2006-11-22 at 09:15 -0800, shad bell wrote:
> Rick, Dad's corvair was putting out somewhere in the 90-100hp range
> with a marvel scebler ma3spa carb and no blower fan. We are located
> at about 1000msl in central Ohio and even on a hot day (90 +) with
> full fuel and me (180lbs, empty wt 732lbs with batt and starter), I
> can get an initial climb of 600 -700ft/min. That would put the gross
> wt at about....990lbs. On a 90 deg day during the test phase I
> climbed to 8000msl and had no problems and was still getting 200
> ft/min est. as alt increased. It may have got better if we had a
> mixture control but that is too high out here in Ohio for practical
> flights,I was up there just to see if It would do it, and to cool off.
> Besides airliners coming in to Port Columbus Airport (20 miles south)
> get a little to big in the windscreen for my taste. I would guess
> with a single person and 10 gal of "go juice" It will climb like a
> heavy 150. The other good thing is at 50-55mph your not covering as
> much ground as you would in a 150 climbing at 75-80mph, so that runway
> is still below you for just a little longer if you need it.
> My 2 cents worth,
> Shad
>
> Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca> wrote:
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: High density altitude
> airport
>
>
> My airport is at 6840, over 10,000 density altitude on
> a hot day. Am going with a Corvair (100 HP), will let
> you know if it's enough. I have flown 150s (also 100
> HP and 1000lbs empty weight) many times with a
> passenger from similiar altitude airports and did ok
> so it should be enough.
>
> Rick
>
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Weight & Balance |
Greg,
Nah, forward.
Peter,
Don't think of it as moving the wing back, but rather moving the fuselage
forward.
So the imaginary point , on the wing, that the whole plane would teeter
on, before moving, would be in an exact spot.
After you moved the fuselage forward, now you'd have to pick a spot further
forward to balance everything.
hope this makes sense.
If you have Windows Excel I can send you a small program, given to me,
where you can just plug in all the numbers and see the final result to any
plane
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: "gcardinal" <gcardinal@comcast.net>
Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 8:15 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
>
> The reason for moving the wing is to change the location of the airfoil's
> center of lift in relation to the aircraft's center of gravity.
> To answer your question, the aircraft cg will move aft when you move the
> wing aft but the airfoil center of lift will move aft much more than the
> cg.
>
> Greg C.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka@bigpond.net.au>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 6:32 AM
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
>
>
>> <vk3eka@bigpond.net.au>
>>
>> Hi Guys,
>>
>> This may be a dumb question but which way does the C of G move if you
>> move
>> the wing BACK! Does it follow the wing movement, i.e. move the wing back
>> CG
>> moves aft, move the wing forward CG moves forward?
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Peter
>> Wonthaggi, Australia
>> http://www.cpc-world.com
>>
>>
>> --
>> 10:36 PM
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Weight & Balance |
We used the hub on the prop as our datum point.AME said mathematically
that's the best because then it's just a matter of adding .(if my memory
serves me right)
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of walt
evans
Sent: November 22, 2006 1:48 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
Greg,
Nah, forward.
Peter,
Don't think of it as moving the wing back, but rather moving the
fuselage
forward.
So the imaginary point , on the wing, that the whole plane would
teeter
on, before moving, would be in an exact spot.
After you moved the fuselage forward, now you'd have to pick a spot
further
forward to balance everything.
hope this makes sense.
If you have Windows Excel I can send you a small program, given to me,
where you can just plug in all the numbers and see the final result to
any
plane
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: "gcardinal" <gcardinal@comcast.net>
Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 8:15 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
<gcardinal@comcast.net>
>
> The reason for moving the wing is to change the location of the
airfoil's
> center of lift in relation to the aircraft's center of gravity.
> To answer your question, the aircraft cg will move aft when you move
the
> wing aft but the airfoil center of lift will move aft much more than
the
> cg.
>
> Greg C.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka@bigpond.net.au>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 6:32 AM
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
>
>
>> <vk3eka@bigpond.net.au>
>>
>> Hi Guys,
>>
>> This may be a dumb question but which way does the C of G move if you
>> move
>> the wing BACK! Does it follow the wing movement, i.e. move the wing
back
>> CG
>> moves aft, move the wing forward CG moves forward?
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Peter
>> Wonthaggi, Australia
>> http://www.cpc-world.com
>>
>>
>> --
>> 10:36 PM
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Weight & Balance |
Walt,
Thats what I am hoping. I would appreciate a copy of your spreadsheet. I
have made one myself but would be good to see how you have done it.
Thanks
Peter.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of walt evans
Sent: Thursday, 23 November 2006 5:48 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
Greg,
Nah, forward.
Peter,
Don't think of it as moving the wing back, but rather moving the fuselage
forward.
So the imaginary point , on the wing, that the whole plane would teeter
on, before moving, would be in an exact spot.
After you moved the fuselage forward, now you'd have to pick a spot further
forward to balance everything.
hope this makes sense.
If you have Windows Excel I can send you a small program, given to me,
where you can just plug in all the numbers and see the final result to any
plane
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: "gcardinal" <gcardinal@comcast.net>
Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 8:15 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
>
> The reason for moving the wing is to change the location of the airfoil's
> center of lift in relation to the aircraft's center of gravity.
> To answer your question, the aircraft cg will move aft when you move the
> wing aft but the airfoil center of lift will move aft much more than the
> cg.
>
> Greg C.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka@bigpond.net.au>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 6:32 AM
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
>
>
>> <vk3eka@bigpond.net.au>
>>
>> Hi Guys,
>>
>> This may be a dumb question but which way does the C of G move if you
>> move
>> the wing BACK! Does it follow the wing movement, i.e. move the wing back
>> CG
>> moves aft, move the wing forward CG moves forward?
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Peter
>> Wonthaggi, Australia
>> http://www.cpc-world.com
>>
>>
>> --
>> 10:36 PM
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
--
10:36 PM
--
10:36 PM
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Weight & Balance |
Peter,
Sure, I guess I can put on this reply.
I didn't make it up. Someone in this group or the Fisher Flying Products
group shared it with me.
See if it downloads all four.
I did four different setups, for all possible modes. Everything from max
plane, to light pilot with heavy fuel, to heavy pilot with low fuel.
It's a great little program, just highlite the square and change the value.
Hit enter and the bottom line changes.
I used the prop hub tip as the datum. So the distance from there to the
leading edge plus the "window" on the wing , gave the final result.
Say you want to add an instrument,,,,you can "add" it on paper and see the
result, before you put it on.
If you're designing a new plane, you put the people in the seats measuring
at where the navel is in the seat. (actually they call out something else,
but this is a family group) :^)
Have fun
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka@bigpond.net.au>
Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 4:34 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
> <vk3eka@bigpond.net.au>
>
> Walt,
>
> Thats what I am hoping. I would appreciate a copy of your spreadsheet. I
> have made one myself but would be good to see how you have done it.
>
> Thanks
>
> Peter.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of walt evans
> Sent: Thursday, 23 November 2006 5:48 AM
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
>
>
> Greg,
> Nah, forward.
>
> Peter,
> Don't think of it as moving the wing back, but rather moving the fuselage
> forward.
> So the imaginary point , on the wing, that the whole plane would teeter
> on, before moving, would be in an exact spot.
> After you moved the fuselage forward, now you'd have to pick a spot
> further
>
> forward to balance everything.
> hope this makes sense.
> If you have Windows Excel I can send you a small program, given to me,
> where you can just plug in all the numbers and see the final result to any
> plane
> walt evans
> NX140DL
>
> "Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
> Ben Franklin
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "gcardinal" <gcardinal@comcast.net>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 8:15 AM
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
>
>
>>
>> The reason for moving the wing is to change the location of the airfoil's
>> center of lift in relation to the aircraft's center of gravity.
>> To answer your question, the aircraft cg will move aft when you move the
>> wing aft but the airfoil center of lift will move aft much more than the
>> cg.
>>
>> Greg C.
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka@bigpond.net.au>
>> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 6:32 AM
>> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
>>
>>
>>> <vk3eka@bigpond.net.au>
>>>
>>> Hi Guys,
>>>
>>> This may be a dumb question but which way does the C of G move if you
>>> move
>>> the wing BACK! Does it follow the wing movement, i.e. move the wing back
>>> CG
>>> moves aft, move the wing forward CG moves forward?
>>>
>>> Cheers
>>>
>>> Peter
>>> Wonthaggi, Australia
>>> http://www.cpc-world.com
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> 10:36 PM
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> 10:36 PM
>
>
> --
> 10:36 PM
>
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Weight & Balance |
Walt,
Thanks very much, I'll give them a try.
Cheers
Peter.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of walt evans
Sent: Thursday, 23 November 2006 9:22 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
Peter,
Sure, I guess I can put on this reply.
I didn't make it up. Someone in this group or the Fisher Flying Products
group shared it with me.
See if it downloads all four.
I did four different setups, for all possible modes. Everything from max
plane, to light pilot with heavy fuel, to heavy pilot with low fuel.
It's a great little program, just highlite the square and change the value.
Hit enter and the bottom line changes.
I used the prop hub tip as the datum. So the distance from there to the
leading edge plus the "window" on the wing , gave the final result.
Say you want to add an instrument,,,,you can "add" it on paper and see the
result, before you put it on.
If you're designing a new plane, you put the people in the seats measuring
at where the navel is in the seat. (actually they call out something else,
but this is a family group) :^)
Have fun
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka@bigpond.net.au>
Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 4:34 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
> <vk3eka@bigpond.net.au>
>
> Walt,
>
> Thats what I am hoping. I would appreciate a copy of your spreadsheet. I
> have made one myself but would be good to see how you have done it.
>
> Thanks
>
> Peter.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of walt evans
> Sent: Thursday, 23 November 2006 5:48 AM
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
>
>
> Greg,
> Nah, forward.
>
> Peter,
> Don't think of it as moving the wing back, but rather moving the fuselage
> forward.
> So the imaginary point , on the wing, that the whole plane would teeter
> on, before moving, would be in an exact spot.
> After you moved the fuselage forward, now you'd have to pick a spot
> further
>
> forward to balance everything.
> hope this makes sense.
> If you have Windows Excel I can send you a small program, given to me,
> where you can just plug in all the numbers and see the final result to any
> plane
> walt evans
> NX140DL
>
> "Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
> Ben Franklin
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "gcardinal" <gcardinal@comcast.net>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 8:15 AM
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
>
>
>>
>> The reason for moving the wing is to change the location of the airfoil's
>> center of lift in relation to the aircraft's center of gravity.
>> To answer your question, the aircraft cg will move aft when you move the
>> wing aft but the airfoil center of lift will move aft much more than the
>> cg.
>>
>> Greg C.
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Peter W Johnson" <vk3eka@bigpond.net.au>
>> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>> Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 6:32 AM
>> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
>>
>>
>>> <vk3eka@bigpond.net.au>
>>>
>>> Hi Guys,
>>>
>>> This may be a dumb question but which way does the C of G move if you
>>> move
>>> the wing BACK! Does it follow the wing movement, i.e. move the wing back
>>> CG
>>> moves aft, move the wing forward CG moves forward?
>>>
>>> Cheers
>>>
>>> Peter
>>> Wonthaggi, Australia
>>> http://www.cpc-world.com
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> 10:36 PM
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> 10:36 PM
>
>
> --
> 10:36 PM
>
>
>
--
10:36 PM
--
10:36 PM
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Weight & Balance |
Peter,
Before all this fancy computer stuff (but still using a calculator), I
did the weight & balance like I show on this web page:
http://nx770cg.com/OperationsManual.html
Scroll down to the bottom of the page, and see all possible loading
configurations. I use the firewall as the datum (per plans), so there will be
some
negative numbers when doing the calculations. The reason, by today's standards,
they put the datum ahead of the prop, is that there will be no negative
numbers.
Walt always has the good explanation of what happens when you move the
wing: You're not actually moving the wing aft...what you are really doing is
moving the fuselage forward.
Chuck G.
NX770CG
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Fuselage taper point |
In a message dated 11/22/2006 9:55:44 AM Central Standard Time,
danl@odayequipment.com writes:
Ken Heide and I were discussing the "wide fuselage" options last night while
gluing up the last of four fuse sides. Has anyone ever moved the taper start
point to the back of the rear seat instead of at the station ahead of it?
What would the issue be of keeping the 24" dimension all the way back to that
point? We are building the long fuselage version and tested one side last night
to be sure that it would pull in with the shorter distance. This change would
be a very minimal structural change but would effectively widen the rear
cockpit by 2" at the pilot's shoulders.
Let the discussion begin! We are looking for pro's and con's about this
possible solution.
Dan Loegering
Fargo, ND
Dan,
I don't know why anybody would even want to widen the fuselage. That
shouldn't even be an option. The plans dimensions get the job done, and keeps
it as
light as possible. I have the short fuse, plans width, and I am 6' tall, and
go about 215 lbs. Once I'm snuggled down in the cockpit, it's plenty roomy
enough. I even have enough room to keep a fire extinguisher, fuel sump tool,
and E.L.T. by my left hip, and four rolls of T.P. and a bottle of water by my
right hip.
If you move the taper starting point to the back of the rear seat, the
radius of the sides curving in will be much more dramatic, look odd, and not to
mention how it Will Affect the aerodynamics...most likely by blanking out some
of the inboard horizontal tail with turbulence. Also, it doesn't seem the
longerons could handle that radius, unless you steamed them. Moist Heat is
what is required to make curved wood. If you go that route, you better be mighty
careful...or you're gonna hear a loud 'CRACK' !!
All right...I'll say it again - "Build it to the plans !!"
Chuck G.
NX770CG
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Weight & Balance |
Chuck,
Nah, Just passing along the explanation that someone else told me , and
my simple brain could pick it up. Just kind of makes sense.
Chuck, If I didn't tell you before, let me tell you now,,,that your
video was great. Lots of great stuff on building, and a must for the
new builders.
Those TP drops were a blast.
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: Rcaprd@aol.com
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 6:08 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Weight & Balance
Peter,
Before all this fancy computer stuff (but still using a
calculator), I did the weight & balance like I show on this web page:
http://nx770cg.com/OperationsManual.html
Scroll down to the bottom of the page, and see all possible loading
configurations. I use the firewall as the datum (per plans), so there
will be some negative numbers when doing the calculations. The reason,
by today's standards, they put the datum ahead of the prop, is that
there will be no negative numbers.
Walt always has the good explanation of what happens when you move
the wing: You're not actually moving the wing aft...what you are really
doing is moving the fuselage forward.
Chuck G.
NX770CG
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Fuselage taper point |
I pretty much agree with Chuck and I remember a past comment from Mike
Cuy that "It fits me like a glove". I don't see much reason to go wider,
it just adds weight. The exception is that the long fuse with the A-65
would have been better for W/B.
Dick N.
I don't know why anybody would even want to widen the fuselage. That
shouldn't even be an option. The plans dimensions get the job done, and
keeps it as light as possible. I have the short fuse, plans width, and
I am 6' tall, and go about 215 lbs. Once I'm snuggled down in the
cockpit, it's plenty roomy enough. I even have enough room to keep a
fire extinguisher, fuel sump tool, and E.L.T. by my left hip, and four
rolls of T.P. and a bottle of water by my right hip.
If you move the taper starting point to the back of the rear seat,
the radius of the sides curving in will be much more dramatic, look odd,
and not to mention how it Will Affect the aerodynamics...most likely by
blanking out some of the inboard horizontal tail with turbulence.
Also, it doesn't seem the longerons could handle that radius, unless you
steamed them. Moist Heat is what is required to make curved wood. If
you go that route, you better be mighty careful...or you're gonna hear a
loud 'CRACK' !!
All right...I'll say it again - "Build it to the plans !!"
Chuck G.
NX770CG
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: High density altitude airport |
Don't know, what is the wing area diff?
On 11/21/06, Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
> Don't forget the difference in wing area.
>
> And don't forget, that 100 hp Lyc or Continental
> started out life at the factory door with only 80
> true horsepower.
>
> Put those two together and what do you get?
>
> Clif
>
> *Subject:* Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: High density altitude airport
>
> My airport is at 6840, over 10,000 density altitude on a hot day. Am going
> with a Corvair (100 HP), will let you know if it's enough. I have flown 150s
> (also 100 HP and 1000lbs empty weight) many times with a passenger from
> similiar altitude airports and did ok so it should be enough.
>
> Rick
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
--
Rick Holland
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: The correct spelling is advice..... |
Consider yourself a catylist. Isn't that what makes things happen?
Clif :-)
----- Original Message -----
From: harvey.rule@bell.ca
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 22, 2006 3:59 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: The correct spelling is advice.....
You'll learn nothing from me but lots from those who pick up on my
mistakes and I like to jump right in there with both feet and I make a
lot of em.Glad to be of service in an inverse way.Keep em flizing.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Weight & Balance |
In a message dated 11/22/2006 5:43:26 PM Central Standard Time,
waltdak@verizon.net writes:
Chuck, If I didn't tell you before, let me tell you now,,,that your video was
great. Lots of great stuff on building, and a must for the new builders.
Those TP drops were a blast.
Thanks, Walt.
I'm still working on a trailer for 'Flying NX770CG' to put up on YouTube or
Google video, to try to drum up some sales...which dropped off to almost
nothing. I guess just about everyone on the list has it, so now it's time to branch
out to the general population, and show them the thrills of flying a
Pietenpol - Low & Slow !!
Chuck G.
NX770CG
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