Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:12 AM - Re: Another dumb question ()
2. 04:21 AM - Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 19 Msgs - 01/15/07 (Graham and Robyn)
3. 07:00 AM - tail brace fittings (Oscar Zuniga)
4. 08:21 AM - Re: wet wood? (Bill Church)
5. 10:36 AM - No Space to Build. (Dave Case)
6. 01:19 PM - More Measuring Epoxy... (Dave Case)
7. 01:53 PM - Re: More Measuring Epoxy... (Bill Church)
8. 02:04 PM - Ask Markle about the mustard (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC])
9. 02:58 PM - Re: No Space to Build. (walt evans)
10. 04:15 PM - Re: wet wood? (Dick Navratil)
11. 04:38 PM - Syringes and measuring epoxy (Greg Bacon)
12. 06:35 PM - Re: Congratulations Gene Hubbard (Steve Singleton)
13. 08:02 PM - Jenny landing gear & ash cross member (santiago morete)
14. 09:16 PM - Re: down in 230' (Steve Eldredge)
Message 1
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Another dumb question |
No such thing as a dumb question.The only real dumb question is the one
unasked!
Do not archive
________________________________
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve
Singleton
Sent: January 15, 2007 6:00 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Another dumb question
---Hi everyone- I've found a source locally that has 1/8in
Baltic Birch in 5x5 sheets and am wanting to use it for Gusset material.
Would this be aceptable to use? Thanks. Steve Singleton
Message 2
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | RE: Pietenpol-List Digest: 19 Msgs - 01/15/07 |
Re Metal tail fittings , my two bobs worth
I asked the same question my self and was advised to build up the beams
with ply then to mount the fittings on top of the fabric.
Two reasons were considered, one, these fittings may corrode and the
second reason they are very much primary structure & should be
accessable.
If externally mounted it is simple to remove them if required.
They certainly look neater if buried below the fabric but moisture could
access this area & corrosion remain undetected. Then removal means
damaging the fabric.
If weight is a consideration especially down the back, consider
replacing the metal trunnion type bearings for the bell crank tube, with
two Acetal blocks with a hole bored to take the bell crank tube (use a
spade type wood bit from Irwins , leave an 1/8 inch wall at the ends.
Vans use these Acetal blocks for mounting the rudder pedals in the RV6
they never wear & are half the weight of the original metal fittings.
Am very envious of the age of you guys, I started my Piet 5 months ago
at age 78, in 5 months have the fuse 75% finished & tail plane
rudder,fin & elevators are ready for covering, why am I building again?
My RV6 is too fast for my brain.
Happy building for 2007 & thanks for the Digest
Graham Hewitt Perth West Australia
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Pietenpol-List Digest Server
Sent: Tuesday, 16 January 2007 4:57 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List Digest: 19 Msgs - 01/15/07
*
=================================================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
=================================================
Today's complete Pietenpol-List Digest can also be found in either of
the
two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest
formatted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
of the Pietenpol-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text
editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Cha
pter 07-01-15&Archive=Pietenpol
Text Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chap
ter 07-01-15&Archive=Pietenpol
===============================================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
===============================================
----------------------------------------------------------
Pietenpol-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Mon 01/15/07: 19
----------------------------------------------------------
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:55 AM - For Sale - Piet Ribs (Jack T. Textor)
2. 07:59 AM - tail brace fittings (Arden Adamson)
3. 08:08 AM - Re: For Sale - Piet Ribs (amsafetyc@aol.com)
4. 08:43 AM - Re: tail brace fittings (Lynn Knoll)
5. 08:54 AM - Congradulations Oscar (shad bell)
6. 09:17 AM - Re: tail brace fittings (Hans Vander Voort)
7. 09:40 AM - Re: wet wood? (John Egan)
8. 09:56 AM - Re: wet wood? (Michael Groah)
9. 10:08 AM - Apology (DONALD COOLEY)
10. 03:00 PM - Re: Another dumb question (Steve Singleton)
11. 03:36 PM - Re: Another dumb question (Kip and Beth Gardner)
12. 04:00 PM - Re: wet wood? (MICHAEL SILVIUS)
13. 04:06 PM - Re: Another dumb question (MICHAEL SILVIUS)
14. 04:59 PM - Re: Another dumb question (Steve Singleton)
15. 05:02 PM - down in 230' (DJ Vegh)
16. 07:25 PM - Re: wet wood? (Clif Dawson)
17. 07:46 PM - Re: wet wood? (Isablcorky@aol.com)
18. 07:52 PM - Re: tail brace fittings (Rcaprd@aol.com)
19. 09:08 PM - Re: tail brace fittings (Graham Hansen)
________________________________ Message 1
_____________________________________
Time: 06:55:12 AM PST US
Subject: Pietenpol-List: For Sale - Piet Ribs
From: "Jack T. Textor" <jtextor@thepalmergroup.com>
God morning all. Recently, I purchased a partially completed project
from David Paulsen in Missouri. I don't need the ribs, so plan to sell
them. There are 33 ribs, built for a 1" spar, glued with T88. The
spruce was from Wicks. David did a good job, but they will require a
couple of hours cleaning them up a bit. You can see some pictures on my
site www.textors.com <http://www.textors.com/> , under Piet Project,
towards the bottom. I'm asking $300.00, plus packaging and shipping.
If you have questions or wish to purchase, drop me an email at
jtextor@thepalmergroup.com.
Thanks,
Jack Textor
Des Moines, IA
________________________________ Message 2
_____________________________________
Time: 07:59:09 AM PST US
Subject: Pietenpol-List: tail brace fittings
From: "Arden Adamson" <aadamson@wnmdag.org>
Gentlemen,
I have a simple question I'd like your opinion on. Do you mount the
wire brace fittings for the rudder and horizontal stabilizer under the
covering and protruding through or on top of the covering? Does it even
matter? What did you do and/or what do you recommend? Any thoughts
would be appreciated.
Arden
________________________________ Message 3
_____________________________________
Time: 08:08:23 AM PST US
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: For Sale - Piet Ribs
From: amsafetyc@aol.com
Jack,
Let me know shipping and prep cost, to Lititz, Pennsylvania 17543. I
think w
e have a deal, will confirm but just about certain I want the ribs,
unless y
ou have already sold them.
Please advise as soon as possible, my project make take off on an
accerlerat
ed rate of build.
Thanks
John Recine
office number and answering machine 717-627-4901
-----Original Message-----
From: jtextor@thepalmergroup.com
Sent: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 9:54 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: For Sale - Piet Ribs
God morning all. Recently, I purchased a partially completed project
from D
avid Paulsen in Missouri. I don=99t need the ribs, so plan to sell th
em. There are 33 ribs, built for a 1=9D spar, glued with T88. The sp
ruce was from Wicks. David did a good job, but they will require a
couple o
f hours cleaning them up a bit. You can see some pictures on my site
www.te
xtors.com, under Piet Project, towards the bottom. I=99m asking $300.
00, plus packaging and shipping. If you have questions or wish to
purchase,
drop me an email at jtextor@thepalmergroup.com.
Thanks,
Jack Textor
Des Moines, IA
________________________________________________________________________
ee AOL Mail and more.
________________________________ Message 4
_____________________________________
Time: 08:43:38 AM PST US
From: "Lynn Knoll" <dknoll@cox.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: tail brace fittings
Arden,
I've never seen them under the fabric but that's not to say it hasn't
been done. A picture is worth a thousand words. Go to
www.westcoastpiet.com and I'm sure your question will be answered. No
Piet builder should be without this source of information. I'm thankful
this site is loaded in my favorites because I go to it constantly.
Lynn Knoll, Wichita
Piet/Vair in the works
DO NOT ARCHIVE
----- Original Message -----
From: Arden Adamson
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 9:57 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: tail brace fittings
Gentlemen,
I have a simple question I'd like your opinion on. Do you mount the
wire brace fittings for the rudder and horizontal stabilizer under the
covering and protruding through or on top of the covering? Does it even
matter? What did you do and/or what do you recommend? Any thoughts
would be appreciated.
Arden
________________________________ Message 5
_____________________________________
Time: 08:54:50 AM PST US
From: shad bell <aviatorbell@yahoo.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Congradulations Oscar
Oscar, Its a great feeling isn't it! NX92GB is pretty well behaved on
the ground
(except the old goose the throtle smash the rudder and aim the stick at
the
ground to turn routine), and I imagine your piet is also. There is
definatly
plenty of rudder athority with slow speeds. I have no experiance with a
steerable
tailwheel (on a piet) but don't think it would be any harder to control
than a Cub or Champ. Just fly it by feel and carry a little extra speed
on final
untill you get the feel of the landings. I was a little too hot on my
1st
landing and used up a lot of runway but touched down smoothly. It wont
float
as much as a cub or champ with one person aboard. It will flare loose
speed
rapidly and just bump down and stay down. Start at 55-60 mph over the
fence
and work down to what you feel it should be. I flew a cub for the 1st
time this
past November and with me and the owner aboard (probably a little over
gross)
it was heavy but acted very similar to the piet
on landing when I came in at 50mph. Take your time, do things in your
own time,
and enjoy the hell out of it!! CONGRATS
Shad
---------------------------------
We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love
(and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list.
________________________________ Message 6
_____________________________________
Time: 09:17:50 AM PST US
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: tail brace fittings
From: Hans Vander Voort <hans.vander.voort@alfalaval.com>
Arden,
It is up to your personal preference how you do it, I do not think there
is
right or wrong way here
I did mine under the fabric, just like BHP's last original.
Hans
"Arden Adamson"
<aadamson@wnmdag.
org>
To
Sent by: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
owner-pietenpol-l
cc
ist-server@matron
ics.com
Subject
Pietenpol-List: tail brace
fittings
01/15/2007 09:57
AM
Please respond to
pietenpol-list@ma
tronics.com
Gentlemen,
I have a simple question Id like your opinion on. Do you mount the wire
brace fittings for the rudder and horizontal stabilizer under the
covering
and protruding through or on top of the covering? Does it even matter?
What did you do and/or what do you recommend? Any thoughts would be
appreciated.
Arden
________________________________ Message 7
_____________________________________
Time: 09:40:13 AM PST US
From: John Egan <johnegan99@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: wet wood?
Hi Don,
The times I have had to move my still incomplete fuselage, I found
that wrapping
it with saran wrap or similar tacky-stretchy plastic works well. If
there
is a bussiness in your area that supplies the big rolls of saran wrap
(about
6 inches in diameter) to moving companies, you can buy a roll of it.
Look in
the phone book under "movers" and look for a company that sells "packing
supplies"
and they should have it. I wrapped it round and round, at least two
layers,
then ran lengths of duct tape down the sides, top and bottom lengthwise.
Be
sure to that the final layer of wrap is layered so the wind doesn't want
to
catch it and open up the wrapping. I have moved my fuselage many times
so far.
Fortunately it never got rained on.
DONALD COOLEY <adonjr@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Hello, Group!
Don Cooley, age 61...retiring from teaching in June...95 days left,
but who's
counting?
My situation: I have purchased Richard daCosta's Piet project,
and plan
to drive to Maine in June, pick it up and drive home to California with
it. I
have a contractor's rack on my compact pick-up truck. The question I'd
like
to put to the group is: Will exposure to some water (rain) hurt the
unvarnished
wood? I plan to wrap everything carefully with plastic drop cloths, but
it
seems likely that some water could find its way to the project.
Thoughts?
I am currently remodeling my garage into a Piet hatchery so I'll be
ready
to really dig in as a full-time Piet builder. I've had the plans since
1972,
so I guess it's about time!
Keep the sawdust flying! Don Cooley, Fairfield, California
Pietenpol-List Digest Server <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> wrote:
*
================================================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
================================================
Today's complete Pietenpol-List Digest can also be found in either of
the
two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
of the Pietenpol-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text
editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Cha
pter 07-01-07&Archive=Pietenpol
Text Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chap
ter 07-01-07&Archive=Pietenpol
==============================================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
==============================================
----------------------------------------------------------
Pietenpol-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Sun 01/07/07: 34
----------------------------------------------------------
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:04 AM - Get Started! Do Something! (Clif Dawson)
2. 04:45 AM - Kerosene Heater (Larry Rice)
3. 05:49 AM - Re: Get Started! Do Something! (walt evans)
4. 06:33 AM - Re: CAD versus cardboard (Robert Gow)
5. 06:43 AM - Re: Get Started! Do Something![Scanned] (Rob Hart)
6. 06:54 AM - Re: thinking ahead when flying with skis (Ralph)
7. 07:27 AM - Re: Securing plane and J3 eyebrows (HVandervoo@aol.com)
8. 07:38 AM - Re: CAD versus cardboard (TJ)
9. 07:57 AM - builders ages (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC])
10. 08:41 AM - Re: builders ages (dwilson)
11. 08:53 AM - Re: CAD versus cardboard (Catdesigns)
12. 09:12 AM - Re: builders ages (Jack T. Textor)
13. 09:48 AM - List: Builder's Ages (Alan Lyscars)
14. 09:49 AM - Re: builders ages (walt evans)
15. 02:30 PM - average age (glich7@juno.com)
16. 02:56 PM - Re: average age (walt evans)
17. 03:19 PM - age (TGSTONE236@aol.com)
18. 03:41 PM - Re: average age (Jeff Boatright)
19. 03:44 PM - Re: age (Pietsrneat@aol.com)
20. 04:16 PM - Re: builders ages (Jack T. Textor)
21. 04:35 PM - Re: builders ages (Gene & Tammy)
22. 05:47 PM - Another dumb question (Gene & Tammy)
23. 06:08 PM - Duane Woolsey? (Jeff Boatright)
24. 06:43 PM - Re: Duane Woolsey? (Pietsrneat@aol.com)
25. 07:13 PM - Re: builders ages (walt evans)
26. 07:21 PM - Re: List: Builder's Ages (Roman Bukolt)
27. 07:32 PM - Re: builders ages (Don Emch)
28. 07:38 PM - Re: Another dumb question (Don Emch)
29. 08:03 PM - Re: Duane Woolsey? (Catdesigns)
30. 08:49 PM - prop (Dick Navratil)
31. 08:52 PM - Re: builders ages (Rcaprd@aol.com)
32. 09:01 PM - Re: prop (Rcaprd@aol.com)
33. 10:09 PM - Re: Get Started! Do Something! (Clif Dawson)
34. 10:46 PM - Re: -CAD (Clif Dawson)
________________________________ Message 1
_____________________________________
Time: 01:04:50 AM PST US
From: Clif Dawson
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something!
I've been building for seven years. I'll be 64 in Feb. I
estimate that my outlay has been the equivalent of a
dinner out for two every month. That includes the
three Corvair engines as core parts and a few new
parts for them. The fuselage and tail are complete
with controls. The first thing I did was make the tail
surfaces. Then I made the ribs. This year I should
get most of the wing completed. You do what you
can with the time, space and financial resources life
affords you.
Many years ago there was a series of 3 articles by a
young Piet builder, mostly centered around his trials
and tribulations with dope and fabric. He and his wife
built the thing in a small, second story apartment. The
fuselage went from the left front corner of the living
room across to the fridge in the kitchen. There is a pic
of them hoisting the finished fuselage out the window
and down to the ground. Granted, many of us don't, or
didn't, have such enthusiastic significant others but I'm
sure you can see the moral to this story. Do something!
Drill a hole even.
An idea I've seen is a heavy table 4' square to which are
mounted all the power tools and a vise or two. This table
sits on four heavy castors with brakes on them. You can
move and rotate this sucker all around the shop to access
each tool as it's needed, even outside if you need the space.
If you're worried that it will move while you're running
something through the band or table saw, I'll tell you that
my 28" by 96" rolling radial arm saw table doesn't budge
an inch! It's on three inch, locking castors.
________________________________ Message 2
_____________________________________
Time: 04:45:59 AM PST US
From: Larry Rice
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Kerosene Heater
You may already know this, but when you get to fabric, no kerosene heat,
and if you have to cover it for dust no plastic. An old friend of mine
did that and the paint wouldn't stick. Hmmmm - any effect on glue or
varnish? I ended up with a small catalytic heater on a propane bottle in
my shop.
Larry the micro mong guy
--
________________________________ Message 3
_____________________________________
Time: 05:49:04 AM PST US
From: "walt evans"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something!
Cliff,
That person was Jim Malley of this group. I still have the Kitplanes
issue that featured his Pietenpol on the front cover.
It was because of that, that I decided to build a Piet.
For all who needs/wants a little inspiration, want to again share this
picture, taken from the front seat, comming in over Stickle's Pond
headed toward runway 24 on a beautiful summer morning At Newton (Jump)
airport.
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: Clif Dawson
Sent: Sunday, January 07, 2007 4:03 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something!
I've been building for seven years. I'll be 64 in Feb. I
estimate that my outlay has been the equivalent of a
dinner out for two every month. That includes the
three Corvair engines as core parts and a few new
parts for them. The fuselage and tail are complete
with controls. The first thing I did was make the tail
surfaces. Then I made the ribs. This year I should
get most of the wing completed. You do what you
can with the time, space and financial resources life
affords you.
Many years ago there was a series of 3 articles by a
young Piet builder, mostly centered around his trials
and tribulations with dope and fabric. He and his wife
built the thing in a small, second story apartment. The
fuselage went from the left front corner of the living
room across to the fridge in the kitchen. There is a pic
of them hoisting the finished fuselage out the window
and down to the ground. Granted, many of us don't, or
didn't, have such enthusiastic significant others but I'm
sure you can see the moral to this story. Do something!
Drill a hole even.
An idea I've seen is a heavy table 4' square to which are
mounted all the power tools and a vise or two. This table
sits on four heavy castors with brakes on them. You can
move and rotate this sucker all around the shop to access
each tool as it's needed, even outside if you need the space.
If you're worried that it will move while you're running
something through the band or table saw, I'll tell you that
my 28" by 96" rolling radial arm saw table doesn't budge
an inch! It's on three inch, locking castors.
________________________________ Message 4
_____________________________________
Time: 06:33:35 AM PST US
From: "Robert Gow"
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: CAD versus cardboard
I hear you. If you are building one plane it's no too productive. But in
the past I've found a lot of dimensional errors and fixed them by
converting
from paper to CAD because you draw to scale. You can also resolve many
ambiguities as well because you have a fully detailed "model". But it
would
only be worth doing if the plans were shared with new builders.
Bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
HelsperSew@aol.com
Sent: January 6, 2007 8:53 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: CAD versus cardboard
John,
You guys talking about these CAD drawings are making my eyes glaze over.
Stop with the nonsence and just start making some ribs. At this rate you
will never get going! You need to start with what you CAN do. Nobody
needs
any "place to build" to make a rib jig and start producing ribs. A few
sticks of spruce and a hand saw and glue are all you need. There has
been a
lot of talk about tough love and kicks-in-the-butt's on this site as of
late. Here's some more---GET STARTED!
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
________________________________ Message 5
_____________________________________
Time: 06:43:26 AM PST US
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something![Scanned]
From: "Rob Hart"
Hi Walt
I also have that issue of Kitplanes. It was also the article that
inspired me to follow the Piet dream. Thanks for the pic, and for the
reminder of the start of the journey.
To esteemed listers,
For those still figuring out when to start cutting or drilling; my
advice is to take your time. Measure twice and cut once is a well known
adage. Knowing when to start measuring, given the myriad demands on
most homebuilders, is perhaps less when understood. Thinking, planning
and contemplating is as much doing something as cutting spruce. Pick
your own time, not someone else's.
Regards
Rob
VH-PTN; in preparation.
Do not archive.
________________________________
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of walt
evans
Sent: Sunday, 7 January 2007 10:50 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something![Scanned]
Cliff,
That person was Jim Malley of this group. I still have the Kitplanes
issue that featured his Pietenpol on the front cover.
It was because of that, that I decided to build a Piet.
For all who needs/wants a little inspiration, want to again share this
picture, taken from the front seat, comming in over Stickle's Pond
headed toward runway 24 on a beautiful summer morning At Newton (Jump)
airport.
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: Clif Dawson
Sent: Sunday, January 07, 2007 4:03 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something!
I've been building for seven years. I'll be 64 in Feb. I
estimate that my outlay has been the equivalent of a
dinner out for two every month. That includes the
three Corvair engines as core parts and a few new
parts for them. The fuselage and tail are complete
with controls. The first thing I did was make the tail
surfaces. Then I made the ribs. This year I should
get most of the wing completed. You do what you
can with the time, space and financial resources life
affords you.
Many years ago there was a series of 3 articles by a
young Piet builder, mostly centered around his trials
and tribulations with dope and fabric. He and his wife
built the thing in a small, second story apartment. The
fuselage went from the left front corner of the living
room across to the fridge in the kitchen. There is a pic
of them hoisting the finished fuselage out the window
and down to the ground. Granted, many of us don't, or
didn't, have such enthusiastic significant others but I'm
sure you can see the moral to this story. Do something!
Drill a hole even.
An idea I've seen is a heavy table 4' square to which are
mounted all the power tools and a vise or two. This table
sits on four heavy castors with brakes on them. You can
move and rotate this sucker all around the shop to access
each tool as it's needed, even outside if you need the space.
If you're worried that it will move while you're running
something through the band or table saw, I'll tell you that
my 28" by 96" rolling radial arm saw table doesn't budge
an inch! It's on three inch, locking castors.
This message, including any attachments, may contain confidential
information and is transmitted for the sole use of the intended
recipient. If you are not the intended recipient, you may not use,
disseminate, copy or retain this e-mail or the information contained in
it. If you have received this e-mail in error, please immediately notify
the sender by telephone or reply e-mail, and permanently delete this
e-mail from your computer system. E-mail transmission cannot be
guaranteed to be secure or error-free as information could be
intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or
contain viruses. The sender therefore does not accept liability for any
errors or omissions in the contents of this message. Finally, the
recipient should check this email and any attachments for the presence
of viruses. The company accepts no liability for any damage caused by
any virus transmitted by this email. AION Diagnostics, Level 2, 40-48
Subiaco Square Road, Subiaco 6008, Australia, Phone: +61 (8) 6461 9400,
Fax: +61 (8) 6461 9499
This message, including any attachments, may contain confidential
information and is transmitted for the sole use of the intended
recipient.
If you are not the intended recipient, you may not use, disseminate,
copy or retain this e-mail or the information contained in it. If you
have received this e-mail in error, please immediately notify the sender
by telephone or reply e-mail, and permanently delete this e-mail from
your computer system.
E-mail transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free as
information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive
late or incomplete, or contain viruses. The sender therefore does not
accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of this
message. Finally, the recipient should check this email and any
attachments for the presence of viruses. The company accepts no
liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this email.
AION Diagnostics, Level 2, 40-48 Subiaco Square Road, Subiaco 6008,
Australia, Phone: +61 (8) 6461 9400, Fax: +61 (8) 6461 9499
________________________________ Message 6
_____________________________________
Time: 06:54:16 AM PST US
From: "Ralph"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: thinking ahead when flying with skis
I am also flying a Chief on skis in the snowy weather. I have a pair of
wood Call-Air skis. You set the wheel into a metal tube frame on top of
the
ski and clamp it down.. It takes about ten minutes to change with the
help
of the wife. I hope to incorporate something similar for the Piet.
(thirteen years down, about ready to cover the wings). If you land in
snow
in a field, always circle around and park in you own tracks. It really
helps to not have to break trail when first starting to move. I always
grab
the ski tip and lift up before starting up the engine. That breaks loose
any freeze down that might occur.
Carol and Ralph
Raymond
________________________________ Message 7
_____________________________________
Time: 07:27:16 AM PST US
From: HVandervoo@aol.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Securing plane and J3 eyebrows
Rick,
Program I use is Visio 2000, it is a simple draft program.
By no means as good and versatile as AutoCAD but cheap and simple to
use.
Hans
________________________________ Message 8
_____________________________________
Time: 07:38:55 AM PST US
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: CAD versus cardboard
From: "TJ"
Hi Guys
I can tell you from a newbies point of view that I wish someone would
redraw everything
in CAD. I know when my plans first came I looked them over every which
way and couldnt make much outta them. After I met a few guys like Jim
Markle
and Larry Williams and looked over what they have, then I started to
understand
them better. I lucked out and bumped into a guy named Frank Hiles that
lives
45 minutes from me that has built 4 Piets and is on his 5th one now and
hes
showing how to build now. Razorbacks Rule!!! (Well maybe not this year
but somtimes, maybe once in a while, I think I remember when they did,
OK maybe
not, but then whos cares anyway, thats why I like flying and not
football)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=86044#86044
________________________________ Message 9
_____________________________________
Time: 07:57:00 AM PST US
Subject: Pietenpol-List: builders ages
From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]"
Mike C. 47 and still keeping to my goal of keeping my waistline
measurement under my age:)
________________________________ Message 10
____________________________________
Time: 08:41:37 AM PST US
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: builders ages
From: "dwilson"
Dan Wilson, age 50. Would like to finish my Piet while I can still pass
the vision
test. Just got my first pair of glasses!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=86063#86063
________________________________ Message 11
____________________________________
Time: 08:53:33 AM PST US
From: "Catdesigns"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: CAD versus cardboard
Early on I drew up all the fittings in CAD and would advise against
doing
this. The fittings I have tried to make based on the CAD drawings are
not
always correct. Accurate to the plans yes but not correct for the job
they
are intended to do. Sometimes the holes are a bit off and sometimes the
size of the fitting is a bit small. Plus you will want to lengthen the
fittings in a few places to access the bolt heads. For instance, take a
look at the front tailwheel mounting fitting, the one with the 3 fingers
on
it. Notice how the bolt holes for mounting it to the fuselage interfere
with each other? If you were to blindly follow the plans you would be
making these fittings again, hopefully before you drilled your holes in
the
lower longeron. Sorry, don't ask for the files because I think releasing
them into the world would give a false sense of accuracy that I don't
want
to promote.
One thing you will find as you build is the plans turn out to be better
then
you thought. They may look poor at first glance but after a while you
start
to get in the groove and they turn out to be just fine. You soon realize
that you worry about some dimensions but others are whatever length is
required to fit YOUR particular assembly. The best approach is to get
the
idea from the plans then fine tune the location and dimensions to make
the
part fit your assembly correctly and serve the intended purpose. The
important thing is to make a strong well built plane. Don't waste your
time
trying to build to the exact 1/64th because that's what the plans said
it
had to be.
By the way I'm now 39. Was 33 when I started. Probably be 45 when done
:-(
Chris Tracy
Sacramento, Ca
Website at http://www.Westcoastpiet.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Glass"
Sent: Saturday, January 06, 2007 4:47 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: CAD versus cardboard
>
>
> Hi
>
> I have been on the list for about a year gathering info but not yet
> started building.
>
> It would be intersting to know the average age of the people on the
list.
=== message truncated =
---------------------------------
No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go
with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started.
________________________________ Message 8
_____________________________________
Time: 09:56:26 AM PST US
From: Michael Groah <dskogrover@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: wet wood?
Congrats on your upcoming retirement from a fellow California teacher.
I have
a little more than 95 days left as I'm only 30 and this is my third year
teaching.
What do you teach? I teach CAD/Drafting and Automotive at Tulare Union
High School. Im sure that having a large project will help in the
transition
to retirement. It helped my father who retired a few years back from
teaching
(from the same school I teach at). He didn't do an airplane, he built a
street
rod, but having a project was good for him.
As for the moisture with the wood I would think if you wrapped it up
tightly
to keep the direct water off of it you would be fine. But like was said
already
you will want to unwrap it and get it into your garage (hatchery) as
soon
as you get back home.
Mike Groah
(collecting pieces for my piet and getting other projects wrapped up so
I can put
all my play time into the Piet (I must finish my cushman project which
is almost
done and my Firebird project which is coming along first)
http://www.groverfabs.com/MISCpersonal.htm
DONALD COOLEY <adonjr@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Hello, Group!
Don Cooley, age 61...retiring from teaching in June...95 days left,
but who's
counting?
My situation: I have purchased Richard daCosta's Piet project,
and plan
to drive to Maine in June, pick it up and drive home to California with
it. I
have a contractor's rack on my compact pick-up truck. The question I'd
like
to put to the group is: Will exposure to some water (rain) hurt the
unvarnished
wood? I plan to wrap everything carefully with plastic drop cloths, but
it
seems likely that some water could find its way to the project.
Thoughts?
I am currently remodeling my garage into a Piet hatchery so I'll be
ready
to really dig in as a full-time Piet builder. I've had the plans since
1972,
so I guess it's about time!
Keep the sawdust flying! Don Cooley, Fairfield, California
Pietenpol-List Digest Server <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> wrote:
*
================================================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
================================================
Today's complete Pietenpol-List Digest can also be found in either of
the
two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
of the Pietenpol-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text
editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Cha
pter 07-01-07&Archive=Pietenpol
Text Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chap
ter 07-01-07&Archive=Pietenpol
==============================================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
==============================================
----------------------------------------------------------
Pietenpol-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Sun 01/07/07: 34
----------------------------------------------------------
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:04 AM - Get Started! Do Something! (Clif Dawson)
2. 04:45 AM - Kerosene Heater (Larry Rice)
3. 05:49 AM - Re: Get Started! Do Something! (walt evans)
4. 06:33 AM - Re: CAD versus cardboard (Robert Gow)
5. 06:43 AM - Re: Get Started! Do Something![Scanned] (Rob Hart)
6. 06:54 AM - Re: thinking ahead when flying with skis (Ralph)
7. 07:27 AM - Re: Securing plane and J3 eyebrows (HVandervoo@aol.com)
8. 07:38 AM - Re: CAD versus cardboard (TJ)
9. 07:57 AM - builders ages (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC])
10. 08:41 AM - Re: builders ages (dwilson)
11. 08:53 AM - Re: CAD versus cardboard (Catdesigns)
12. 09:12 AM - Re: builders ages (Jack T. Textor)
13. 09:48 AM - List: Builder's Ages (Alan Lyscars)
14. 09:49 AM - Re: builders ages (walt evans)
15. 02:30 PM - average age (glich7@juno.com)
16. 02:56 PM - Re: average age (walt evans)
17. 03:19 PM - age (TGSTONE236@aol.com)
18. 03:41 PM - Re: average age (Jeff Boatright)
19. 03:44 PM - Re: age (Pietsrneat@aol.com)
20. 04:16 PM - Re: builders ages (Jack T. Textor)
21. 04:35 PM - Re: builders ages (Gene & Tammy)
22. 05:47 PM - Another dumb question (Gene & Tammy)
23. 06:08 PM - Duane Woolsey? (Jeff Boatright)
24. 06:43 PM - Re: Duane Woolsey? (Pietsrneat@aol.com)
25. 07:13 PM - Re: builders ages (walt evans)
26. 07:21 PM - Re: List: Builder's Ages (Roman Bukolt)
27. 07:32 PM - Re: builders ages (Don Emch)
28. 07:38 PM - Re: Another dumb question (Don Emch)
29. 08:03 PM - Re: Duane Woolsey? (Catdesigns)
30. 08:49 PM - prop (Dick Navratil)
31. 08:52 PM - Re: builders ages (Rcaprd@aol.com)
32. 09:01 PM - Re: prop (Rcaprd@aol.com)
33. 10:09 PM - Re: Get Started! Do Something! (Clif Dawson)
34. 10:46 PM - Re: -CAD (Clif Dawson)
________________________________ Message 1
_____________________________________
Time: 01:04:50 AM PST US
From: Clif Dawson
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something!
I've been building for seven years. I'll be 64 in Feb. I
estimate that my outlay has been the equivalent of a
dinner out for two every month. That includes the
three Corvair engines as core parts and a few new
parts for them. The fuselage and tail are complete
with controls. The first thing I did was make the tail
surfaces. Then I made the ribs. This year I should
get most of the wing completed. You do what you
can with the time, space and financial resources life
affords you.
Many years ago there was a series of 3 articles by a
young Piet builder, mostly centered around his trials
and tribulations with dope and fabric. He and his wife
built the thing in a small, second story apartment. The
fuselage went from the left front corner of the living
room across to the fridge in the kitchen. There is a pic
of them hoisting the finished fuselage out the window
and down to the ground. Granted, many of us don't, or
didn't, have such enthusiastic significant others but I'm
sure you can see the moral to this story. Do something!
Drill a hole even.
An idea I've seen is a heavy table 4' square to which are
mounted all the power tools and a vise or two. This table
sits on four heavy castors with brakes on them. You can
move and rotate this sucker all around the shop to access
each tool as it's needed, even outside if you need the space.
If you're worried that it will move while you're running
something through the band or table saw, I'll tell you that
my 28" by 96" rolling radial arm saw table doesn't budge
an inch! It's on three inch, locking castors.
________________________________ Message 2
_____________________________________
Time: 04:45:59 AM PST US
From: Larry Rice
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Kerosene Heater
You may already know this, but when you get to fabric, no kerosene heat,
and if you have to cover it for dust no plastic. An old friend of mine
did that and the paint wouldn't stick. Hmmmm - any effect on glue or
varnish? I ended up with a small catalytic heater on a propane bottle in
my shop.
Larry the micro mong guy
--
________________________________ Message 3
_____________________________________
Time: 05:49:04 AM PST US
From: "walt evans"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something!
Cliff,
That person was Jim Malley of this group. I still have the Kitplanes
issue that featured his Pietenpol on the front cover.
It was because of that, that I decided to build a Piet.
For all who needs/wants a little inspiration, want to again share this
picture, taken from the front seat, comming in over Stickle's Pond
headed toward runway 24 on a beautiful summer morning At Newton (Jump)
airport.
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: Clif Dawson
Sent: Sunday, January 07, 2007 4:03 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something!
I've been building for seven years. I'll be 64 in Feb. I
estimate that my outlay has been the equivalent of a
dinner out for two every month. That includes the
three Corvair engines as core parts and a few new
parts for them. The fuselage and tail are complete
with controls. The first thing I did was make the tail
surfaces. Then I made the ribs. This year I should
get most of the wing completed. You do what you
can with the time, space and financial resources life
affords you.
Many years ago there was a series of 3 articles by a
young Piet builder, mostly centered around his trials
and tribulations with dope and fabric. He and his wife
built the thing in a small, second story apartment. The
fuselage went from the left front corner of the living
room across to the fridge in the kitchen. There is a pic
of them hoisting the finished fuselage out the window
and down to the ground. Granted, many of us don't, or
didn't, have such enthusiastic significant others but I'm
sure you can see the moral to this story. Do something!
Drill a hole even.
An idea I've seen is a heavy table 4' square to which are
mounted all the power tools and a vise or two. This table
sits on four heavy castors with brakes on them. You can
move and rotate this sucker all around the shop to access
each tool as it's needed, even outside if you need the space.
If you're worried that it will move while you're running
something through the band or table saw, I'll tell you that
my 28" by 96" rolling radial arm saw table doesn't budge
an inch! It's on three inch, locking castors.
________________________________ Message 4
_____________________________________
Time: 06:33:35 AM PST US
From: "Robert Gow"
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: CAD versus cardboard
I hear you. If you are building one plane it's no too productive. But in
the past I've found a lot of dimensional errors and fixed them by
converting
from paper to CAD because you draw to scale. You can also resolve many
ambiguities as well because you have a fully detailed "model". But it
would
only be worth doing if the plans were shared with new builders.
Bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
HelsperSew@aol.com
Sent: January 6, 2007 8:53 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: CAD versus cardboard
John,
You guys talking about these CAD drawings are making my eyes glaze over.
Stop with the nonsence and just start making some ribs. At this rate you
will never get going! You need to start with what you CAN do. Nobody
needs
any "place to build" to make a rib jig and start producing ribs. A few
sticks of spruce and a hand saw and glue are all you need. There has
been a
lot of talk about tough love and kicks-in-the-butt's on this site as of
late. Here's some more---GET STARTED!
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
________________________________ Message 5
_____________________________________
Time: 06:43:26 AM PST US
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something![Scanned]
From: "Rob Hart"
Hi Walt
I also have that issue of Kitplanes. It was also the article that
inspired me to follow the Piet dream. Thanks for the pic, and for the
reminder of the start of the journey.
To esteemed listers,
For those still figuring out when to start cutting or drilling; my
advice is to take your time. Measure twice and cut once is a well known
adage. Knowing when to start measuring, given the myriad demands on
most homebuilders, is perhaps less when understood. Thinking, planning
and contemplating is as much doing something as cutting spruce. Pick
your own time, not someone else's.
Regards
Rob
VH-PTN; in preparation.
Do not archive.
________________________________
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of walt
evans
Sent: Sunday, 7 January 2007 10:50 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something![Scanned]
Cliff,
That person was Jim Malley of this group. I still have the Kitplanes
issue that featured his Pietenpol on the front cover.
It was because of that, that I decided to build a Piet.
For all who needs/wants a little inspiration, want to again share this
picture, taken from the front seat, comming in over Stickle's Pond
headed toward runway 24 on a beautiful summer morning At Newton (Jump)
airport.
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: Clif Dawson
Sent: Sunday, January 07, 2007 4:03 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something!
I've been building for seven years. I'll be 64 in Feb. I
estimate that my outlay has been the equivalent of a
dinner out for two every month. That includes the
three Corvair engines as core parts and a few new
parts for them. The fuselage and tail are complete
with controls. The first thing I did was make the tail
surfaces. Then I made the ribs. This year I should
get most of the wing completed. You do what you
can with the time, space and financial resources life
affords you.
Many years ago there was a series of 3 articles by a
young Piet builder, mostly centered around his trials
and tribulations with dope and fabric. He and his wife
built the thing in a small, second story apartment. The
fuselage went from the left front corner of the living
room across to the fridge in the kitchen. There is a pic
of them hoisting the finished fuselage out the window
and down to the ground. Granted, many of us don't, or
didn't, have such enthusiastic significant others but I'm
sure you can see the moral to this story. Do something!
Drill a hole even.
An idea I've seen is a heavy table 4' square to which are
mounted all the power tools and a vise or two. This table
sits on four heavy castors with brakes on them. You can
move and rotate this sucker all around the shop to access
each tool as it's needed, even outside if you need the space.
If you're worried that it will move while you're running
something through the band or table saw, I'll tell you that
my 28" by 96" rolling radial arm saw table doesn't budge
an inch! It's on three inch, locking castors.
This message, including any attachments, may contain confidential
information and is transmitted for the sole use of the intended
recipient. If you are not the intended recipient, you may not use,
disseminate, copy or retain this e-mail or the information contained in
it. If you have received this e-mail in error, please immediately notify
the sender by telephone or reply e-mail, and permanently delete this
e-mail from your computer system. E-mail transmission cannot be
guaranteed to be secure or error-free as information could be
intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or
contain viruses. The sender therefore does not accept liability for any
errors or omissions in the contents of this message. Finally, the
recipient should check this email and any attachments for the presence
of viruses. The company accepts no liability for any damage caused by
any virus transmitted by this email. AION Diagnostics, Level 2, 40-48
Subiaco Square Road, Subiaco 6008, Australia, Phone: +61 (8) 6461 9400,
Fax: +61 (8) 6461 9499
This message, including any attachments, may contain confidential
information and is transmitted for the sole use of the intended
recipient.
If you are not the intended recipient, you may not use, disseminate,
copy or retain this e-mail or the information contained in it. If you
have received this e-mail in error, please immediately notify the sender
by telephone or reply e-mail, and permanently delete this e-mail from
your computer system.
E-mail transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free as
information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive
late or incomplete, or contain viruses. The sender therefore does not
accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of this
message. Finally, the recipient should check this email and any
attachments for the presence of viruses. The company accepts no
liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this email.
AION Diagnostics, Level 2, 40-48 Subiaco Square Road, Subiaco 6008,
Australia, Phone: +61 (8) 6461 9400, Fax: +61 (8) 6461 9499
________________________________ Message 6
_____________________________________
Time: 06:54:16 AM PST US
From: "Ralph"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: thinking ahead when flying with skis
I am also flying a Chief on skis in the snowy weather. I have a pair of
wood Call-Air skis. You set the wheel into a metal tube frame on top of
the
ski and clamp it down.. It takes about ten minutes to change with the
help
of the wife. I hope to incorporate something similar for the Piet.
(thirteen years down, about ready to cover the wings). If you land in
snow
in a field, always circle around and park in you own tracks. It really
helps to not have to break trail when first starting to move. I always
grab
the ski tip and lift up before starting up the engine. That breaks loose
any freeze down that might occur.
Carol and Ralph
Raymond
________________________________ Message 7
_____________________________________
Time: 07:27:16 AM PST US
From: HVandervoo@aol.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Securing plane and J3 eyebrows
Rick,
Program I use is Visio 2000, it is a simple draft program.
By no means as good and versatile as AutoCAD but cheap and simple to
use.
Hans
________________________________ Message 8
_____________________________________
Time: 07:38:55 AM PST US
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: CAD versus cardboard
From: "TJ"
Hi Guys
I can tell you from a newbies point of view that I wish someone would
redraw everything
in CAD. I know when my plans first came I looked them over every which
way and couldnt make much outta them. After I met a few guys like Jim
Markle
and Larry Williams and looked over what they have, then I started to
understand
them better. I lucked out and bumped into a guy named Frank Hiles that
lives
45 minutes from me that has built 4 Piets and is on his 5th one now and
hes
showing how to build now. Razorbacks Rule!!! (Well maybe not this year
but somtimes, maybe once in a while, I think I remember when they did,
OK maybe
not, but then whos cares anyway, thats why I like flying and not
football)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=86044#86044
________________________________ Message 9
_____________________________________
Time: 07:57:00 AM PST US
Subject: Pietenpol-List: builders ages
From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]"
Mike C. 47 and still keeping to my goal of keeping my waistline
measurement under my age:)
________________________________ Message 10
____________________________________
Time: 08:41:37 AM PST US
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: builders ages
From: "dwilson"
Dan Wilson, age 50. Would like to finish my Piet while I can still pass
the vision
test. Just got my first pair of glasses!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=86063#86063
________________________________ Message 11
____________________________________
Time: 08:53:33 AM PST US
From: "Catdesigns"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: CAD versus cardboard
Early on I drew up all the fittings in CAD and would advise against
doing
this. The fittings I have tried to make based on the CAD drawings are
not
always correct. Accurate to the plans yes but not correct for the job
they
are intended to do. Sometimes the holes are a bit off and sometimes the
size of the fitting is a bit small. Plus you will want to lengthen the
fittings in a few places to access the bolt heads. For instance, take a
look at the front tailwheel mounting fitting, the one with the 3 fingers
on
it. Notice how the bolt holes for mounting it to the fuselage interfere
with each other? If you were to blindly follow the plans you would be
making these fittings again, hopefully before you drilled your holes in
the
lower longeron. Sorry, don't ask for the files because I think releasing
them into the world would give a false sense of accuracy that I don't
want
to promote.
One thing you will find as you build is the plans turn out to be better
then
you thought. They may look poor at first glance but after a while you
start
to get in the groove and they turn out to be just fine. You soon realize
that you worry about some dimensions but others are whatever length is
required to fit YOUR particular assembly. The best approach is to get
the
idea from the plans then fine tune the location and dimensions to make
the
part fit your assembly correctly and serve the intended purpose. The
important thing is to make a strong well built plane. Don't waste your
time
trying to build to the exact 1/64th because that's what the plans said
it
had to be.
By the way I'm now 39. Was 33 when I started. Probably be 45 when done
:-(
Chris Tracy
Sacramento, Ca
Website at http://www.Westcoastpiet.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Glass"
Sent: Saturday, January 06, 2007 4:47 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: CAD versus cardboard
>
>
> Hi
>
> I have been on the list for about a year gathering info but not yet
> started building.
>
> It would be intersting to know the average age of the people on the
list.
=== message truncated =
---------------------------------
Looking for earth-friendly autos?
Browse Top Cars by "Green Rating" at Yahoo! Autos' Green Center.
________________________________ Message 9
_____________________________________
Time: 10:08:16 AM PST US
From: DONALD COOLEY <adonjr@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Apology
Hello, group,
I apologize for forgetting to snip before I replied to yesterday's
digest.
I'll be more careful in the future. Keep the sawdust flying! Don
Cooley
Pietenpol-List Digest Server <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> wrote:
*
================================================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
================================================
________________________________ Message 10
____________________________________
Time: 03:00:39 PM PST US
From: "Steve Singleton" <slsingleton@cvalley.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Another dumb question
---Hi everyone- I've found a source locally that has 1/8in Baltic
Birch in 5x5 sheets and am wanting to use it for Gusset material. Would
this be aceptable to use? Thanks. Steve Singleton
________________________________ Message 11
____________________________________
Time: 03:36:31 PM PST US
From: Kip and Beth Gardner <kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Another dumb question
Steve,
Baltic Birch is an interior grade plywood (the glue is not
waterproof), and is NOT recommended for aircraft. The other
consideration is that is mainly intended for finish applications -
the interior plys may not be up to aircraft spec structurally.
What you can use that is cheaper than aircraft grade is Marine Grade
plywood that meets a spec (don't remember the #) for waterproofness,
quality of interior plys, etc. It is generally sold in metric
thicknesses (made in Israel), so you'll need to convert (~25mm/inch).
If I remember correctly, the best source for this is a marine
building supply company that's called Noah's (?). They have locations
in Buffalo and Toronto.
Kip Gardner
At 4:59 PM -0600 1/15/07, Steve Singleton wrote:
>
>
>---Hi everyone- I've found a source locally that has 1/8in Baltic
>Birch in 5x5 sheets and am wanting to use it for Gusset material.
>Would this be aceptable to use? Thanks. Steve Singleton
>
>
><http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>http://www.matronics
.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
--
North Canton, OH
________________________________ Message 12
____________________________________
Time: 04:00:55 PM PST US
From: "MICHAEL SILVIUS" <M.Silvius@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: wet wood?
Donald:
I live less than a half mile form Richard Decosta. I thought he had sold
that about 2 years ago but my UPS man just told me it was still in his
garage last week. I have seen the plane it is a nice short fuselage Piet
built to the original construction manual if I recall correctly. I
passed on buying it as I could not fit in the short fuse with my big
clodhoppers.
As for wrapping the thing with shipping grade saran wrap you'd likely be
fine. Just be sure to wrap in the right direction so the wind don't blow
it off. U-Haul sells the stuff in 18 inch wide rolls. Transport should
be easy as it is the 3 piece wing. If you are really concerned we are
right on the coast an thus we have a lot of boating around here. And we
also have a lot of folks that do shrink wrapping of boats for winter
storage. I am certain that if you were up for it you could get it shrink
wrapped for the trip by one of the fellows that do that around here.
Richard or myself could come up with some phone numbers for you. It may
give you the extra peace of mind for the long journey. I hauled a
project home from western Vermont just a week before Christmas and was
having a kinipshen fit when I went through a couple of rain brief and
ever so slight showers. They passed quick enough.
http://rides.webshots.com/album/147451245dhnmgI
the piet parts are in the basement for now
michael silvius
scarborough, maine
________________________________ Message 13
____________________________________
Time: 04:06:18 PM PST US
From: "MICHAEL SILVIUS" <M.Silvius@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Another dumb question
Re: Pietenpol-List: Another dumb
questionhttp://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/wppages/finnishbirch.php
http://www.wicksaircraft.com/catalog/product_cat.php/subid=9/index.html
http://www.wicksaircraft.com/catalog/product_cat.php/subid=8/index.html
________________________________ Message 14
____________________________________
Time: 04:59:53 PM PST US
From: "Steve Singleton" <slsingleton@cvalley.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Another dumb question
Re: Pietenpol-List: Another dumb questionThanks Kip-The price was really
cheap. I guess thats why. Just a tibit of info-I'm 48 and yes a waist
line that should be somewhat smaller. I built the ribs last winter
(glued them up in the living room) If i have the Piet done by the time
I'm 50 I'll be doing great. I only fell twice today on the ice comeing
and going between the shop and house. Steve Singleton
----- Original Message -----
From: Kip and Beth Gardner
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 5:36 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Another dumb question
Steve,
Baltic Birch is an interior grade plywood (the glue is not
waterproof), and is NOT recommended for aircraft. The other
consideration is that is mainly intended for finish applications - the
interior plys may not be up to aircraft spec structurally.
What
________________________________ Message 15
____________________________________
Time: 05:02:43 PM PST US
From: "DJ Vegh" <dj@veghdesign.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: down in 230'
wow! what fun today. Been practicing short field landings in our
Taylorcraft. Today I managed down and stopped in 230' (see attached)
Winds
were ahead at 9kts. I wonder... a Piet/GN-1 should be able to do the
same
right?? For those flying, what's your shortest landing in your Piet and
what were the winds?
DJ
________________________________ Message 16
____________________________________
Time: 07:25:59 PM PST US
From: Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: wet wood?
My choice for moving large object this way is 10 mil poly.
It's 10 ft wide and you buy it in any length you want. Wrap
the part in it with the seam on the "bottom" surface away
from the rain. You'll have to plan that of course. :-)
Tape up seams with lots of duct tape. The problem I see
with the saran wrap idea is that there are multitudes of
seams, each a potential leak. It doesn't always stick to
itself as well as you would need. Now how would I know
that? :-)
The shrink wrap is a good one too. I like that. I think it just
boils down to which you one guys think would be easier.
Clif
----- Original Message -----
From: MICHAEL SILVIUS
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 3:58 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: wet wood?
Donald:
As for wrapping the thing with shipping grade saran wrap you'd likely
be fine. Just be sure to wrap in the right direction so the wind don't
blow it off. And we also have a lot of folks that do shrink wrapping of
boats for winter storage. I am certain that if you were up for it you
could get it shrink wrapped for the trip by one of the fellows that do
that around here.
________________________________ Message 17
____________________________________
Time: 07:46:10 PM PST US
From: Isablcorky@aol.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: wet wood?
Here I go again after saying I never would again.
May I suggest that you get up to Maine a few days earlier than planned
put
on a couple of coats of good spar varnish, 1st coat thinned then 2d coat
full
strength out of the can. I like Ace hardware gloss. Then you wouldn't
have to
wrap anything or worry about plastic flying. I'm thinking like a
completed
fuse of course.
Just a thought but I bet that's the way I'd do it.
Corky
________________________________ Message 18
____________________________________
Time: 07:52:48 PM PST US
From: Rcaprd@aol.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: tail brace fittings
In a message dated 1/15/2007 10:01:45 AM Central Standard Time,
aadamson@wnmdag.org writes:
Gentlemen,
I have a simple question I=99d like your opinion on. Do you mount the
wire
brace fittings for the rudder and horizontal stabilizer under the
covering a
nd
protruding through or on top of the covering? Does it even matter?
What di
d
you do and/or what do you recommend? Any thoughts would be appreciated.
Arden
Arden,
The tail wire brace fittings for the vertical and horizontal stabilizer,
are
Under the fabric. I used 3/16" iron rivets, called out in the plans, so
it
was a permanent install, before fabric. You need to have them installed
whe
n
you pre-fit the empenage. Then you the parts, and cover the vert &
horiz st
abs,
with just a slit for the fittings to protrude, then install a
re-enforcing
small round patch (about 3" diameter), slit for the protruding fitting,
with
the
fibers running at about a 45=C2=BA to the covering, on top of the
fabric. A
llow
the fabric to creep up on the fitting, and it makes for a nice clean
looking
,
and waterproof install.
You can see the fittings here, as well as how I set up the heel brakes,
sealed hinge gaps, and means to jack the plane up
http://nx770cg.com/Unique.html
Chuck G.
NX770CG
________________________________ Message 19
____________________________________
Time: 09:08:06 PM PST US
From: "Graham Hansen" <ghans@cable-lynx.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: tail brace fittings
Arden,
In general, early designs having a wooden structure (and the Pietenpol
fits this category) have fittings placed outside the fabric covering.
The DeHavilland Moths, among others, did it this way because:
1. Inspection of fittings is made easy.
2. Fabric covering is easier to accomplish.
3. It is easy to seal between the fabric and the fittings.*
4. Removal/replacement of fittings or bolts is facilitated.
5. You get a nice "antique" appearance.
* Use a high quality marine sealant here.
Covering the fittings with fabric is OK, but make sure no water can
enter where the fitting emerges from the fabric. This can be difficult
to accomplish for long term protection.
I opted to place my fittings outside the fabric and tolerate the extra
drag they produce. After all, what's a bit more drag to a Pietenpol?
Graham Hansen (Pietenpol CF-AUN)
Message 3
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | tail brace fittings |
Just to chime in here, the tail brace fittings on NX41CC are mounted outside
the fabric and I've been glad of it a time or two already. I had to remove
the vertical stabilizer for repairs and it was my first time doing fabric
covering. It was tricky learning to fit the fabric around protruding
fittings (the Vi Kapler style rudder hinges in this case), and the fewer
fittings I need to work fabric around, the better for me. I'm sure it
presents a smoother finish to cover over them though.
And after looking at Chuck Gantzer's link to his page, I remembered how
slick his heel brake setup is. 41CC has toe brakes and they work fine, but
that heel brake setup of Chuck's is nifty too. Higher parts count and more
detail than the toe brake setup, I'll admit. Someone else sent me pictures
of their heel brake setup (along with their trim wheel setup, using part of
a bicycle chain with a nicely done wooden trim wheel) and that one, too, is
really nice; it uses Matco masters in the laydown position along with short
sections of tubing below the rudder bar to activate the brakes.
Oscar Zuniga
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
_________________________________________________________________
>From photos to predictions, The MSN Entertainment Guide to Golden Globes has
it all. http://tv.msn.com/tv/globes2007/?icid=nctagline1
Message 4
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
I agree with Clif. I would wrap with polyethylene (vapour barrier), and
seal ALL the seams. Water has a way of working through almost any
opening, and if you have the misfortune of driving through a rainstorm,
or even if the roads are wet, the water will get to places you don't
want it to be. Since you're going to be driving across the continent,
there's likely going to be some rain along the way. To seal the seams, I
would use this stuff:
http://www.can-save.ca/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=19
5&Ite
mid=93
It really sticks, and is waterproof - much better than duct tape. Up
here in Canada, we can buy it at building supply stores (Home Depot
carries it) - not sure how available it is on your side of the border.
Bill C
Message 5
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | No Space to Build. |
Just to back up what's being said -- I'm making ribs in my dinette -- no
problem at all. My wife always balks at the talk of "Oh, I'll hang the
wings up from the ceiling; think of it as decoration!". Maybe I can get a
shop built by then. :) Plus, it has it's advantages, I don't have to worry
about temperature, but I do have to worry about drifts of sawdust in my
kitchen.
I just bought an electronic scale accurate to within 1/10th of a gram --
makes measuring T-88 braindead simple, and I can also measure dry
ingredients (flower, sugar etc...) like the Europeans do. It's a MyWeigh
i500, and cost me about $60. I always had a nagging fear in the back of my
head that measuring T-88 by eye was a bad idea.
Plus, how can you call it a real aircraft project if you don't make it on to
some sort of Drug Enforcement Agency watch list?
--
David Case
Dav3xor@gmail.com
www.builddiary.net
Message 6
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | More Measuring Epoxy... |
Forgot to mention... it takes about 5 grams of resin per rib, and remember
to multiply your weight of resin by .83 to get the amount of hardener to
use. Results may vary. Do not attempt to operate a motor vehicle while
mixing epoxy. Warning -- glue may attach objects together beyond your
ability to break them apart again. It is advisable to take your gloves off
before opening any doors. No matter how good it smells, please don't eat
the hardener.
--
David Case
Dav3xor@gmail.com
www.builddiary.net
Message 7
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | More Measuring Epoxy... |
I wonder what advantage, if any, one might gain by weighing epoxy
components, rather than measuring the volume. I just used small
disposable plastic graduated measuring cups. For each rib I measured 1/4
oz resin and added hardener, to make 1/2 oz of epoxy, which seems to be
a good amount to do one rib - leaves a little (maybe 1/8 oz) in the
bottom of the cup to save as a glue batch sample. I wrote the date on
each cup and set them aside for safekeeping. I also numbered each rib
assembly, so that if I found a glue sample to be not quite right, I
could identify the rib built with that batch of glue.
Bill C
Message 8
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Ask Markle about the mustard |
I hate to bust a good builder from Texas but Jim Markle had a funny
story about what not to eat one day.......
and for what it's worth, I mixed all of my epoxy by eye. Two very
similar diameter blobs of part A and part B and did glue joint tests
with many batches
along the way and nary at time when the joint didn't break where it
should--in the wood.
A good use for all of those cap strip pieces that you might normally
throw away is to use them to test your glue batches from time to time.
A sharp FAA or
DAR inspector might even ask you to produce to a few (dated is best,
with a pencil or marker) I used to dab two offset overlapping joints,
let them cure then
clamp one end in a vise and hit the other end/piece with a hammer and
see where the joint would break.
Mike C.
(PS-- white vinegar on a paper towel works good for removing T-88 from
tools, hands, hair, and makes you smell like a cucumber salad somewhat)
Message 9
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: No Space to Build. |
I built my Pietenpol in a 10x20ft basement. Where there's a
wil,,,,blah, blah.
PS did have to take a piece of the foundation out to get the wings out
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: Dave Case
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 1:36 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: No Space to Build.
Just to back up what's being said -- I'm making ribs in my dinette --
no problem at all. My wife always balks at the talk of "Oh, I'll hang
the wings up from the ceiling; think of it as decoration!". Maybe I can
get a shop built by then. :) Plus, it has it's advantages, I don't
have to worry about temperature, but I do have to worry about drifts of
sawdust in my kitchen.
I just bought an electronic scale accurate to within 1/10th of a gram
-- makes measuring T-88 braindead simple, and I can also measure dry
ingredients (flower, sugar etc...) like the Europeans do. It's a
MyWeigh i500, and cost me about $60. I always had a nagging fear in the
back of my head that measuring T-88 by eye was a bad idea.
Plus, how can you call it a real aircraft project if you don't make it
on to some sort of Drug Enforcement Agency watch list?
--
David Case
Dav3xor@gmail.com
www.builddiary.net
Message 10
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
I am going to disagree with some of the comments offered on sealing up
your project. Trapping moisture between poly and wood can do more
damage that letting it get rained on. I moved my fuse and then wings
from Sun n Fun to Minnesota (1600 mi.) after building them at the show.
It was a 2 day trip, twice. As long as the project is covered and
vented, it will be fine.
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: DONALD COOLEY
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 12:51 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: wet wood?
Hello, Group!
Don Cooley, age 61...retiring from teaching in June...95 days left,
but who's counting?
My situation: I have purchased Richard daCosta's Piet project,
and plan to drive to Maine in June, pick it up and drive home to
California with it. I have a contractor's rack on my compact pick-up
truck. The question I'd like to put to the group is: Will exposure to
some water (rain) hurt the unvarnished wood? I plan to wrap everything
carefully with plastic drop cloths, but it seems likely that some water
could find its way to the project. Thoughts?
I am currently remodeling my garage into a Piet hatchery so I'll be
ready to really dig in as a full-time Piet builder. I've had the plans
since 1972, so I guess it's about time!
Keep the sawdust flying! Don Cooley, Fairfield, California
Pietenpol-List Digest Server <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> wrote:
*
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
Today's complete Pietenpol-List Digest can also be found in either
of the
two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest
formatted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked
Indexes
and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII
version
of the Pietenpol-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text
editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&
Chapter 07-01-07&Archive=Pietenpol
Text Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&C
hapter 07-01-07&Archive=Pietenpol
======================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
======================
----------------------------------------------------------
Pietenpol-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Sun 01/07/07: 34
----------------------------------------------------------
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:04 AM - Get Started! Do Something! (Clif Dawson)
2. 04:45 AM - Kerosene Heater (Larry Rice)
3. 05:49 AM - Re: Get Started! Do Something! (walt evans)
4. 06:33 AM - Re: CAD versus cardboard (Robert Gow)
5. 06:43 AM - Re: Get Started! Do Something![Scanned] (Rob Hart)
6. 06:54 AM - Re: thinking ahead when flying with skis (Ralph)
7. 07:27 AM - Re: Securing plane and J3 eyebrows
(HVandervoo@aol.com)
8. 07:38 AM - Re: CAD versus cardboard (TJ)
9. 07:57 AM - builders ages (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC])
10. 08:41 AM - Re: builders ages (dwilson)
11. 08:53 AM - Re: CAD versus cardboard (Catdesigns)
12. 09:12 AM - Re: builders ages (Jack T. Textor)
13. 09:48 AM - List: Builder's Ages (Alan Lyscars)
14. 09:49 AM - Re: builders ages (walt evans)
15. 02:30 PM - average age (glich7@juno.com)
16. 02:56 PM - Re: average age (walt evans)
17. 03:19 PM - age (TGSTONE236@aol.com)
18. 03:41 PM - Re: average age (Jeff Boatright)
19. 03:44 PM - Re: age (Pietsrneat@aol.com)
20. 04:16 PM - Re: builders ages (Jack T. Textor)
21. 04:35 PM - Re: builders ages (Gene & Tammy)
22. 05:47 PM - Another dumb question (Gene & Tammy)
23. 06:08 PM - Duane Woolsey? (Jeff Boatright)
24. 06:43 PM - Re: Duane Woolsey? (Pietsrneat@aol.com)
25. 07:13 PM - Re: builders ages (walt evans)
26. 07:21 PM - Re: List: Builder's Ages (Roman Bukolt)
27. 07:32 PM - Re: builders ages (Don Emch)
28. 07:38 PM - Re: Another dumb question (Don Emch)
29. 08:03 PM - Re: Duane Woolsey? (Catdesigns)
30. 08:49 PM - prop (Dick Navratil)
31. 08:52 PM - Re: builders ages (Rcaprd@aol.com)
32. 09:01 PM - Re: prop (Rcaprd@aol.com)
33. 10:09 PM - Re: Get Started! Do Something! (Clif Dawson)
34. 10:46 PM - Re: -CAD (Clif Dawson)
________________________________ Message 1
_____________________________________
Time: 01:04:50 AM PST US
From: Clif Dawson
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something!
I've been building for seven years. I'll be 64 in Feb. I
estimate that my outlay has been the equivalent of a
dinner out for two every month. That includes the
three Corvair engines as core parts and a few new
parts for them. The fuselage and tail are complete
with controls. The first thing I did was make the tail
surfaces. Then I made the ribs. This year I should
get most of the wing completed. You do what you
can with the time, space and financial resources life
affords you.
Many years ago there was a series of 3 articles by a
young Piet builder, mostly centered around his trials
and tribulations with dope and fabric. He and his wife
built the thing in a small, second story apartment. The
fuselage went from the left front corner of the living
room across to the fridge in the kitchen. There is a pic
of them hoisting the finished fuselage out the window
and down to the ground. Granted, many of us don't, or
didn't, have such enthusiastic significant others but I'm
sure you can see the moral to this story. Do something!
Drill a hole even.
An idea I've seen is a heavy table 4' square to which are
mounted all the power tools and a vise or two. This table
sits on four heavy castors with brakes on them. You can
move and rotate this sucker all around the shop to access
each tool as it's needed, even outside if you need the space.
If you're worried that it will move while you're running
something through the band or table saw, I'll tell you that
my 28" by 96" rolling radial arm saw table doesn't budge
an inch! It's on three inch, locking castors.
________________________________ Message 2
_____________________________________
Time: 04:45:59 AM PST US
From: Larry Rice
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Kerosene Heater
You may already know this, but when you get to fabric, no kerosene
heat,
and if you have to cover it for dust no plastic. An old friend of
mine
did that and the paint wouldn't stick. Hmmmm - any effect on glue or
varnish? I ended up with a small catalytic heater on a propane
bottle in
my shop.
Larry the micro mong guy
--
________________________________ Message 3
_____________________________________
Time: 05:49:04 AM PST US
From: "walt evans"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something!
Cliff,
That person was Jim Malley of this group. I still have the Kitplanes
issue that featured his Pietenpol on the front cover.
It was because of that, that I decided to build a Piet.
For all who needs/wants a little inspiration, want to again share
this
picture, taken from the front seat, comming in over Stickle's Pond
headed toward runway 24 on a beautiful summer morning At Newton
(Jump)
airport.
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: Clif Dawson
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, January 07, 2007 4:03 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something!
I've been building for seven years. I'll be 64 in Feb. I
estimate that my outlay has been the equivalent of a
dinner out for two every month. That includes the
three Corvair engines as core parts and a few new
parts for them. The fuselage and tail are complete
with controls. The first thing I did was make the tail
surfaces. Then I made the ribs. This year I should
get most of the wing completed. You do what you
can with the time, space and financial resources life
affords you.
Many years ago there was a series of 3 articles by a
young Piet builder, mostly centered around his trials
and tribulations with dope and fabric. He and his wife
built the thing in a small, second story apartment. The
fuselage went from the left front corner of the living
room across to the fridge in the kitchen. There is a pic
of them hoisting the finished fuselage out the window
and down to the ground. Granted, many of us don't, or
didn't, have such enthusiastic significant others but I'm
sure you can see the moral to this story. Do something!
Drill a hole even.
An idea I've seen is a heavy table 4' square to which are
mounted all the power tools and a vise or two. This table
sits on four heavy castors with brakes on them. You can
move and rotate this sucker all around the shop to access
each tool as it's needed, even outside if you need the space.
If you're worried that it will move while you're running
something through the band or table saw, I'll tell you that
my 28" by 96" rolling radial arm saw table doesn't budge
an inch! It's on three inch, locking castors.
________________________________ Message 4
_____________________________________
Time: 06:33:35 AM PST US
From: "Robert Gow"
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: CAD versus cardboard
I hear you. If you are building one plane it's no too productive.
But in
the past I've found a lot of dimensional errors and fixed them by
converting
from paper to CAD because you draw to scale. You can also resolve
many
ambiguities as well because you have a fully detailed "model". But
it would
only be worth doing if the plans were shared with new builders.
Bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of
HelsperSew@aol.com
Sent: January 6, 2007 8:53 PM
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: CAD versus cardboard
John,
You guys talking about these CAD drawings are making my eyes glaze
over.
Stop with the nonsence and just start making some ribs. At this rate
you
will never get going! You need to start with what you CAN do. Nobody
needs
any "place to build" to make a rib jig and start producing ribs. A
few
sticks of spruce and a hand saw and glue are all you need. There has
been a
lot of talk about tough love and kicks-in-the-butt's on this site as
of
late. Here's some more---GET STARTED!
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
________________________________ Message 5
_____________________________________
Time: 06:43:26 AM PST US
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something![Scanned]
From: "Rob Hart"
Hi Walt
I also have that issue of Kitplanes. It was also the article that
inspired me to follow the Piet dream. Thanks for the pic, and for
the
reminder of the start of the journey.
To esteemed listers,
For those still figuring out when to start cutting or drilling; my
advice is to take your time. Measure twice and cut once is a well
known
adage. Knowing when to start measuring, given the myriad demands on
most homebuilders, is perhaps less when understood. Thinking,
planning
and contemplating is as much doing something as cutting spruce. Pick
your own time, not someone else's.
Regards
Rob
VH-PTN; in preparation.
Do not archive.
________________________________
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of walt
evans
Sent: Sunday, 7 January 2007 10:50 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something![Scanned]
Cliff,
That person was Jim Malley of this group. I still have the Kitplanes
issue that featured his Pietenpol on the front cover.
It was because of that, that I decided to build a Piet.
For all who needs/wants a little inspiration, want to again share
this
picture, taken from the front seat, comming in over Stickle's Pond
headed toward runway 24 on a beautiful summer morning At Newton
(Jump)
airport.
walt evans
NX140DL
"Put your wealth in knowledge, and no one can ever take it from you"
Ben Franklin
----- Original Message -----
From: Clif Dawson
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, January 07, 2007 4:03 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Get Started! Do Something!
I've been building for seven years. I'll be 64 in Feb. I
estimate that my outlay has been the equivalent of a
dinner out for two every month. That includes the
three Corvair engines as core parts and a few new
parts for them. The fuselage and tail are complete
with controls. The first thing I did was make the tail
surfaces. Then I made the ribs. This year I should
get most of the wing completed. You do what you
can with the time, space and financial resources life
affords you.
Many years ago there was a series of 3 articles by a
young Piet builder, mostly centered around his trials
and tribulations with dope and fabric. He and his wife
built the thing in a small, second story apartment. The
fuselage went from the left front corner of the living
room across to the fridge in the kitchen. There is a pic
of them hoisting the finished fuselage out the window
and down to the ground. Granted, many of us don't, or
didn't, have such enthusiastic significant others but I'm
sure you can see the moral to this story. Do something!
Drill a hole even.
An idea I've seen is a heavy table 4' square to which are
mounted all the power tools and a vise or two. This table
sits on four heavy castors with brakes on them. You can
move and rotate this sucker all around the shop to access
each tool as it's needed, even outside if you need the space.
If you're worried that it will move while you're running
something through the band or table saw, I'll tell you that
my 28" by 96" rolling radial arm saw table doesn't budge
an inch! It's on three inch, locking castors.
This message, including any attachments, may contain confidential
information and is transmitted for the sole use of the intended
recipient. If you are not the intended recipient, you may not use,
disseminate, copy or retain this e-mail or the information contained
in
it. If you have received this e-mail in error, please immediately
notify
the sender by telephone or reply e-mail, and permanently delete this
e-mail from your computer system. E-mail transmission cannot be
guaranteed to be secure or error-free as information could be
intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete,
or
contain viruses. The sender therefore does not accept liability for
any
errors or omissions in the contents of this message. Finally, the
recipient should check this email and any attachments for the
presence
of viruses. The company accepts no liability for any damage caused
by
any virus transmitted by this email. AION Diagnostics, Level 2,
40-48
Subiaco Square Road, Subiaco 6008, Australia, Phone: +61 (8) 6461
9400,
Fax: +61 (8) 6461 9499
This message, including any attachments, may contain confidential
information and is transmitted for the sole use of the intended
recipient.
If you are not the intended recipient, you may not use, disseminate,
copy or retain this e-mail or the information contained in it. If
you
have received this e-mail in error, please immediately notify the
sender
by telephone or reply e-mail, and permanently delete this e-mail
from
your computer system.
E-mail transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free
as
information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive
late or incomplete, or contain viruses. The sender therefore does
not
accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of this
message. Finally, the recipient should check this email and any
attachments for the presence of viruses. The company accepts no
liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this
email.
AION Diagnostics, Level 2, 40-48 Subiaco Square Road, Subiaco 6008,
Australia, Phone: +61 (8) 6461 9400, Fax: +61 (8) 6461 9499
________________________________ Message 6
_____________________________________
Time: 06:54:16 AM PST US
From: "Ralph"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: thinking ahead when flying with skis
I am also flying a Chief on skis in the snowy weather. I have a pair
of
wood Call-Air skis. You set the wheel into a metal tube frame on top
of the
ski and clamp it down.. It takes about ten minutes to change with
the help
of the wife. I hope to incorporate something similar for the Piet.
(thirteen years down, about ready to cover the wings). If you land
in snow
in a field, always circle around and park in you own tracks. It
really
helps to not have to break trail when first starting to move. I
always grab
the ski tip and lift up before starting up the engine. That breaks
loose
any freeze down that might occur.
Carol and Ralph
Raymond
________________________________ Message 7
_____________________________________
Time: 07:27:16 AM PST US
From: HVandervoo@aol.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Securing plane and J3 eyebrows
Rick,
Program I use is Visio 2000, it is a simple draft program.
By no means as good and versatile as AutoCAD but cheap and simple to
use.
Hans
________________________________ Message 8
_____________________________________
Time: 07:38:55 AM PST US
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: CAD versus cardboard
From: "TJ"
Hi Guys
I can tell you from a newbies point of view that I wish someone
would redraw everything
in CAD. I know when my plans first came I looked them over every
which
way and couldnt make much outta them. After I met a few guys like
Jim Markle
and Larry Williams and looked over what they have, then I started to
understand
them better. I lucked out and bumped into a guy named Frank Hiles
that lives
45 minutes from me that has built 4 Piets and is on his 5th one now
and hes
showing how to build now. Razorbacks Rule!!! (Well maybe not this
year
but somtimes, maybe once in a while, I think I remember when they
did, OK maybe
not, but then whos cares anyway, thats why I like flying and not
football)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=86044#86044
________________________________ Message 9
_____________________________________
Time: 07:57:00 AM PST US
Subject: Pietenpol-List: builders ages
From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]"
Mike C. 47 and still keeping to my goal of keeping my waistline
measurement under my age:)
________________________________ Message 10
____________________________________
Time: 08:41:37 AM PST US
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: builders ages
From: "dwilson"
Dan Wilson, age 50. Would like to finish my Piet while I can still
pass the vision
test. Just got my first pair of glasses!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=86063#86063
________________________________ Message 11
____________________________________
Time: 08:53:33 AM PST US
From: "Catdesigns"
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: CAD versus cardboard
Early on I drew up all the fittings in CAD and would advise against
doing
this. The fittings I have tried to make based on the CAD drawings
are not
always correct. Accurate to the plans yes but not correct for the
job they
are intended to do. Sometimes the holes are a bit off and sometimes
the
size of the fitting is a bit small. Plus you will want to lengthen
the
fittings in a few places to access the bolt heads. For instance,
take a
look at the front tailwheel mounting fitting, the one with the 3
fingers on
it. Notice how the bolt holes for mounting it to the fuselage
interfere
with each other? If you were to blindly follow the plans you would
be
making these fittings again, hopefully before you drilled your holes
in the
lower longeron. Sorry, don't ask for the files because I think
releasing
them into the world would give a false sense of accuracy that I
don't want
to promote.
One thing you will find as you build is the plans turn out to be
better then
you thought. They may look poor at first glance but after a while
you start
to get in the groove and they turn out to be just fine. You soon
realize
that you worry about some dimensions but others are whatever length
is
required to fit YOUR particular assembly. The best approach is to
get the
idea from the plans then fine tune the location and dimensions to
make the
part fit your assembly correctly and serve the intended purpose. The
important thing is to make a strong well built plane. Don't waste
your time
trying to build to the exact 1/64th because that's what the plans
said it
had to be.
By the way I'm now 39. Was 33 when I started. Probably be 45 when
done :-(
Chris Tracy
Sacramento, Ca
Website at http://www.Westcoastpiet.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Glass"
Sent: Saturday, January 06, 2007 4:47 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: CAD versus cardboard
>
>
> Hi
>
> I have been on the list for about a year gathering info but not
yet
> started building.
>
> It would be intersting to know the average age of the people on
the list.
=== message truncated ==
Message 11
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Syringes and measuring epoxy |
Just a tip I thought I'd share with the list:
I fill two 10cc syringes, one with resin and one with hardener. I can
then dispense various amounts of each part. If I have a small job, I
may only dispense 2cc of each, leaving the rest in the syringes. For a
bigger job I might use 4cc of each. This ensures a very close
volumetric mix of both parts and you can quickly dispense the amount you
need.
BTW, T-88 is formulated to be mixed 1:1 by VOLUME.
My 2 cents anyway.
Greg Bacon
Prairie Home, MO
Message 12
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Congratulations Gene Hubbard |
Doug-I had some wood in my house attic for a few years and when i went
to use it it had dried out so much in the hot attic that the wood was no
good to use. I hope you the best on your Piet. I just getting started
also. Steve Singleton Hale MO
----- Original Message -----
From: DOUGLAS BLACKBURN
To: Pietenpol List
Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2007 12:45 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Congratulations Gene Hubbard
Good job Gene!!!!!
I have been down to see Gene a few times over the years. He even
loaned me his rib jig to many years ago. I have to say I have been the
proverbial bump on a log, and I'd say it is time to get off that log and
pull my head out and get to building. Even though Gene loaned me his
jig, It appears to be a better deal to build your own from what I have
been reading in the archives this evening. I have the cap-strip for the
ribs, the wood for the tail group, and all the wood for the fuse in the
attic above the garage. I suppose this list is making me accountable so
to speak for getting this project on the road. I hope my questions over
the next few years don't become too much for you guys. No more excuses
either. Tomorrow I will pick up a board to build the rib jig. Gene I
will return yours as soon as it fits into yours and mines schedule.
Email me off list and we will work that out.
My wife has had many health problems and I suppose I have been hiding
behind that in a way. He rproblems continue, but it is time for me to
move forward with this dream of mine to build a plane. I hope to learn
as much, and be able to teach as much some day to someone else, in the
way you all teach each other. I'll get off the soapbox now, I need to
find a place to build a website, and start the progress logs. Thanks,
you'll be hearing from me.
Doug Blackburn
Yucaipa California
p.s. Carl Levken, drop me a line..............
Message 13
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Jenny landing gear & ash cross member |
I am building the jenny style landing gear and since there are no ash cross members
in the F&GM for this type of gear, I am wondering if it is really necesary.
As far as I know, most of you use them anyway, but there is a reason? I
hope that my english has been sufficiently clear . Thanks to all.
Santiago
---------------------------------
Pregunt. Respond. Descubr.
Todo lo que queras saber, y lo que ni imaginabas,
est en Yahoo! Respuestas (Beta).
Message 14
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
About 20' ground roll once in the piet. It was downright scary. I didn't dare
turn off the runway for fear I would flip. Winds were about 35kts down the runway
after I diverted to the larger metro apt. with a crosswind runway. I somehow
got it to a tie down and left it there for the weekend. I haven't landed
backwards yet though. My personal record for TO/Landings is 5 without a pattern
on our 5900' strip. Take off, climb to 100' and land straight ahead full
stop, without turning as many times as you can before running out of runway.
Silly headwind piet tricks.
Steve E
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of DJ Vegh
Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 6:02 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: down in 230'
wow! what fun today. Been practicing short field landings in our
Taylorcraft. Today I managed down and stopped in 230' (see attached) Winds were
ahead at 9kts. I wonder... a Piet/GN-1 should be able to do the same right??
For those flying, what's your shortest landing in your Piet and what were the
winds?
DJ
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|