---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 06/30/07: 14 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:30 AM - Re: Re: Wide body. (Max Hegler) 2. 06:45 AM - Re: Re: Engines (Max Hegler) 3. 07:57 AM - Re: Brodhead - who's going this year? (Skip Gadd) 4. 08:55 AM - Re: Re: Wide body. (walt evans) 5. 10:32 AM - Re: Wide body. (kb2qqm) 6. 10:39 AM - Re: Re: Wide body. (Gordon Bowen) 7. 10:59 AM - Re: Who's going to Brodhead? (Tim Verthein) 8. 03:52 PM - Continental Motor Mount Jigs Photos? (Ben Charvet) 9. 03:52 PM - weight of NX41CC (Oscar Zuniga) 10. 04:42 PM - Re: Continental Motor Mount Jigs Photos? (Gordon Bowen) 11. 07:05 PM - Re: Shad Bell: Tractor Pull Competition (shad bell) 12. 08:56 PM - Re: weight of NX41CC (Dick Navratil) 13. 09:02 PM - Re: Piet Builder Identity (Roman Bukolt) 14. 09:38 PM - Re: Saw Blades (del magsam) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:30:32 AM PST US From: "Max Hegler" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wide body. I understand that...Pietpenpol about 80% done with 80% to go and RV-7 about 20% done with 80% to go... Take Care, Max Hegler ----- Original Message ----- From: "kb2qqm" Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 9:47 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wide body. > A part of me just loves the look, and the wood, and the vintage feel of > the airplane. Another part of me likes the quicknes of the sonex, with > the > CNC drilled parts that just fit together. Especially for a first time > kit. > > Is there anywhere (anybody) that has an order parts list for the Empenage? > How much spruce and Ply? > > Thanks.. > Greg > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:45:56 AM PST US From: "Max Hegler" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Engines Why are you laughing? It sounds pretty good to me...am I missing something? Max ----- Original Message ----- From: "kb2qqm" Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 11:29 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Engines > > Engine Sound > > http://www.stampe.org/USA%20pages/First%20run.wav > > [Laughing] > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=121309#121309 > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:57:42 AM PST US From: "Skip Gadd" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Brodhead - who's going this year? Shad, We will probably leave Brodhead for West Virginia on Sunday. We could head back together. Felix likes to cruz about 67 or 68 mph. Skip ----- Original Message ----- From: shad bell Sent: 6/28/2007 7:26:40 PM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Brodhead - who's going this year? Skip, What day are you flying back home after you get to Brodhead? If we get there we could fly part of the way home togeather down through Indianna. I was thinking about going up to Oshkosh after Brodhead but not sure I want to spend 2 million dollars to eat, sleep and tie an airplane down. Shad ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:55:40 AM PST US From: "walt evans" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wide body. Greg, Yes, I have a mat'l list from a previous builder, and a mat'l list quoted by AS&S back in about 1998. I ordered from that and it worked out nicely. If you like I'll send directly to you. Walt Evans NX140DL "No one ever learned anything by talking" ----- Original Message ----- From: "kb2qqm" Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 10:47 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wide body. > > I started studying the plans last night for a couple of hours, trying not > to get psyched out. I thought about making the whole thing just a little > wider. > > Then I got to reading the building guide and the rest of the posts here, > and decided this morning to build a rear cockpit mockup. So I could see > if there were any fit problems. > I fit. But I see how it would be tight squeeze. Maybe I can butter up > the cockpit :-) > Then I started seeing how making the airplane wider affects so many other > things. At first I just started to imagine the fuselage and the extra > wood required (weight), then I would have to redesign the center wing > section, then the wing struts, the landing gear. With all the extra > weight and design changes, maybe a bigger engine. My mind just started to > snowball at the changes. So should I re-invent the wheel, and re-doo the > whole airplane to a wider dimension, and take the weight penalty or should > I build it to plans? I think if I redesign it, then I become a test > pilot. The other dilema I am facing is the performance hit. What's the > airplane going to fly like once it's done? > > A part of me just loves the look, and the wood, and the vintage feel of > the airplane. Another part of me likes the quicknes of the sonex, with > the > CNC drilled parts that just fit together. Especially for a first time > kit. > > Is there anywhere (anybody) that has an order parts list for the Empenage? > How much spruce and Ply? > > Thanks.. > Greg > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=121292#121292 > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 10:32:41 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wide body. From: "kb2qqm" that would be great.. Greg kb2qqm(at)mac.com Do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=121377#121377 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 10:39:17 AM PST US From: "Gordon Bowen" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wide body. Couple of points re mods on plans: 1) no matter what, you are a test pilot, even if you build it to exact plans. You built it, you get to test it. Keep that in mind each and every time you do a pre-flight on any airplane. 2) Everyone does some sort of mod to their plans and planes, it's just the nature of homebuilding. Some of the best plans for homebuilts were put out by Rutan, and they were still highly modified by the individual builders. 3) Making the body a little wider apparently does not have much negative impact on performance, the Questar-Venture looks like an egg at the mid section. It's still one of the fastest homebuilts around. I've often lamented I didn't make the fuselage about 4" wider at the pilot's seat and a tad "egg-shaped" the entire fuselage, had the darn thing completely apart for rewelding the 4130 after the wreck. Shoulda done it. Lot easier than losing 40 lbs. Gordon ----- Original Message ----- From: "kb2qqm" Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 6:47 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wide body. > > I started studying the plans last night for a couple of hours, trying not > to get psyched out. I thought about making the whole thing just a little > wider. > > Then I got to reading the building guide and the rest of the posts here, > and decided this morning to build a rear cockpit mockup. So I could see > if there were any fit problems. > I fit. But I see how it would be tight squeeze. Maybe I can butter up > the cockpit :-) > Then I started seeing how making the airplane wider affects so many other > things. At first I just started to imagine the fuselage and the extra > wood required (weight), then I would have to redesign the center wing > section, then the wing struts, the landing gear. With all the extra > weight and design changes, maybe a bigger engine. My mind just started to > snowball at the changes. So should I re-invent the wheel, and re-doo the > whole airplane to a wider dimension, and take the weight penalty or should > I build it to plans? I think if I redesign it, then I become a test > pilot. The other dilema I am facing is the performance hit. What's the > airplane going to fly like once it's done? > > A part of me just loves the look, and the wood, and the vintage feel of > the airplane. Another part of me likes the quicknes of the sonex, with > the > CNC drilled parts that just fit together. Especially for a first time > kit. > > Is there anywhere (anybody) that has an order parts list for the Empenage? > How much spruce and Ply? > > Thanks.. > Greg > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=121292#121292 > > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:59:36 AM PST US From: Tim Verthein Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Who's going to Brodhead? We are! Me 'n' th' wife. Driving from Bovey, MN down to Minneapolis to see my folks thursday, then off to Brodhead Friday morning. We're staying at the Gasthaus Motel in Monroe, where I understand their county fair is going on that weekend too. We're rolling out for Oshkosh Sunday morning. Alledgedly we're staying at the Settle Inn in Kaukauna for two nights for Oshkosh, but I am skeptical as my wife made reservations on line, we have them confirmed with a printed confirmation, but it's at a "normal" rate, not the usual double or triple special Oshkosh rate everyone seems to have so I wouldn't be surprised to find out they're screwed up. Interesting motel things I've learned this year. Legally, reservations mean nothing. They don't really HAVE to have a room, or one that meets the specifications that you reserved, not to mention the rate. AND online confirmations may not be real. We made reservations in Marshalltown Iowa for a day of Corvair racing over labor day. Confirmed. Were e-mailed a confirmation. We called to see about changing to a different room as it turns out my Son will be able to attend with us, and when we called they said they didn't have ANY reservation for us! Grrrrr. Kindlike how an airline dosen't really HAVE to have a plane. Or a seat. Or a flight..that you have a ticket for. Cripes. Tim in Bovey == You *can* repair a flip-flop with a capacitor! == Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us. http://surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 03:52:27 PM PST US From: Ben Charvet Subject: Pietenpol-List: Continental Motor Mount Jigs Photos? Hi All, I'm getting ready to fabricate the motor mount for an A-65. I remember seeing some pictures of jigs others have used for this, but they don't show up when browsing the archives. Anyone out there have a picture of the jig they used they could send me off list? I'm sure I could come up with something on my own, but like most of my Piet building I combine my creativity with that of others.. Ben Charvet Mims, Fl NX866BC ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 03:52:55 PM PST US From: "Oscar Zuniga" Subject: Pietenpol-List: weight of NX41CC Per digital race car scales, with 3 qts. oil and any unusable fuel, 41CC weighs 633 lbs. I don't believe in weighing without unusable fuel and minimum operating oil, and consider it to be part of the basic empty weight. I weigh 151 lbs. according to the same scales, before I drank a beer and after I drained my internal tank. Prior to doing the W&B I flew 0.6 hrs. to burn off some fuel in the airplane's tank, drained the rest, and did the W&B. Also checked the mechanical tach against a digital "True Tach" and found the following: RPM- mechanical tach/digital tach 1000/900 1500/1330 2000/1840 2200/2000 This explains why I can set power in level cruise and exceed redline (2250 RPM) on this engine so easily... it's reading about 200 RPM high when in that range. Now I know I can safely cruise it at 2450 indicated, which is where it likes to cruise anyway. With this prop I really need an A75 to take full advantage ;o) Another delightful day of playing with the Pietenpol! Oscar Zuniga San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net _________________________________________________________________ Picture this share your photos and you could win big! http://www.GETREALPhotoContest.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 04:42:27 PM PST US From: "Gordon Bowen" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Continental Motor Mount Jigs Photos? Ben, I think we still have the A-75 motor mount laying around the hanger in Palatka. Think my builder buddies may have taken it to S&fun and sold same but you're welcome to use it as a jig if it's still there. Contact me off group at gbowen@ptialaska.net and I'll give you the guy's telephone number in Satsuma that you'd need to contact. Gordon ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ben Charvet" Sent: Saturday, June 30, 2007 2:50 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Continental Motor Mount Jigs Photos? > > Hi All, > I'm getting ready to fabricate the motor mount for an A-65. I remember > seeing some pictures of jigs others have used for this, but they don't > show up when browsing the archives. Anyone out there have a picture of > the jig they used they could send me off list? I'm sure I could come up > with something on my own, but like most of my Piet building I combine my > creativity with that of others.. > > Ben Charvet > Mims, Fl > NX866BC > > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 07:05:02 PM PST US From: shad bell Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Shad Bell: Tractor Pull Competition Hello guys, BAD NEWS, while testing the engine for detonation friday afternoon all was going well with the test run untill I made one more full power check and everything went rough. I pulled the power back and it almost quit so I quickly shut her down. Went to pull the prop through and I'll be damned, I burnt up the #4 piston. I then quickly switched from Iced Tea to cold Miller Light and started pulling everything apart. I got the cylinder off and am waiting on parts now. #4 is the same one we had to replace during the rebuild, Might have a messed up head (cracked) or might have a leaking helicoil for the plug. I am too stupid to give up trying to have it ready for Brodhead in 3 weeks but I will try up to the bitter end. If I drive up with Dad we'll talk about it over some cold ones, and mabey I can bum a piet ride from one of the guys who actually make it there. Not throwing in the towel yet Shad Okay Shad....my money is on you buddy at the Ohio State Fair tractor pull. Bring it on ! Mike C. in Ohio --------------------------------- Take the Internet to Go: Yahoo!Go puts the Internet in your pocket: mail, news, photos & more. ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 08:56:58 PM PST US From: "Dick Navratil" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: weight of NX41CC Hey Oscar I want to order 3 of you beautiful data plates, but I can't remember the important info. What is your address and how much? Dick N. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Oscar Zuniga" Sent: Saturday, June 30, 2007 5:51 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: weight of NX41CC > > > Per digital race car scales, with 3 qts. oil and any unusable fuel, 41CC > weighs 633 lbs. > > I don't believe in weighing without unusable fuel and minimum operating > oil, and consider it to be part of the basic empty weight. > > I weigh 151 lbs. according to the same scales, before I drank a beer and > after I drained my internal tank. Prior to doing the W&B I flew 0.6 hrs. > to burn off some fuel in the airplane's tank, drained the rest, and did > the W&B. Also checked the mechanical tach against a digital "True Tach" > and found the following: > > RPM- mechanical tach/digital tach > 1000/900 > 1500/1330 > 2000/1840 > 2200/2000 > > This explains why I can set power in level cruise and exceed redline (2250 > RPM) on this engine so easily... it's reading about 200 RPM high when in > that range. Now I know I can safely cruise it at 2450 indicated, which is > where it likes to cruise anyway. With this prop I really need an A75 to > take full advantage ;o) > > Another delightful day of playing with the Pietenpol! > > Oscar Zuniga > San Antonio, TX > mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com > website at http://www.flysquirrel.net > > _________________________________________________________________ > Picture this - share your photos and you could win big! > http://www.GETREALPhotoContest.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us > > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 09:02:07 PM PST US From: "Roman Bukolt" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet Builder Identity OK, all you creative geniuses who plan on making it to Brodhead, see if you can come up with some type of Identity device so that we can spot each other without having to stare down at your breast to see if you have a name to go with these emails. Bill Rewey suggested something that could be spotted 30 ft. away, front or back, like a certain common color wrist band or something on your hat or cap if you're wearing one, or a common color bandana or whatever. Unless you guys like to stare down at other guys breasts ????? Roman Bukolt ----- Original Message ----- From: Rick Holland To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 9:26 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Engines If you are getting a new table saw (or miter saw) blade I would recommend a DIablo (96 tooth for a 10 inch). Expensive but makes a big difference with the softer woods especially when you need to rip long leading/trailing edge or capstip. Diablos are about half the thickness of normal blades too. Rick On 6/26/07, Tom Winter wrote: Hello all, I just got on board. After about 10 years of dithering what to build, I've settled on a Pietenpol. So far: I have acquired 4 Model A Ford engines, and the Hoopman plans. Two engines are soaking in kerosene, one is disassembled, and the likeliest boat anchor is still untouched. I'm hoping that cherry-picking from the 4, I can get most of a good engine. I have laid out the rib, and next step is to put a new blade in my table saw. Tom Winter (past pres EAA 569, owner Cessna 150G) ObjectAge Ltd. Castle Rock, Colorado ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 09:38:12 PM PST US From: del magsam Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Saw Blades I use to sell commercial blades to wood shops, and my brother took over the business and is still selling commercial carbide products. So I know for a fact that a 96 teeth is way too many for ripping...40 is for ripping and a 60 tooth will work for ripping and crosscutting. the only time you need more than that is for mitering prefinished house trim or picture frames. or your saw is not running true, and only a few teeth are doing the work. Thin kerf is fine, but it has a harder time running true in thicker woods. The bottom line is this...cheap blades are stamped out of soft steel, and the carbide teeth are welded in without being sharpened too well. They will work better after they have been sharpened once. Higher dollar blades are ground plates, tensioned to run true at high rpms, teeth welded in and ground so that each tooth is following each other within .002. And good blades only produce good results if your arbor is running true on your saw. If you have a good saw and a good blade you can actually cut and leave no saw marks on your wood, making jointers obsolete, I throw my finger eating jointer out years ago. The secret to cutting capstrips and other thin pieces is a new wood insert in your saw and then crank the running blade up through it so that there is no spaces between it and the blade. Del If you are getting a new table saw (or miter saw) blade I would recommend a DIablo (96 tooth for a 10 inch). Expensive but makes a big difference with the softer woods especially when you need to rip long leading/trailing edge or capstip. Diablos are about half the thickness of normal blades too. Rick Del-New Richmond, Wi "farmerdel@rocketmail.com" --------------------------------- Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search that gives answers, not web links. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.