Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:37 AM - Re: another "Johnson Airspeed Indicator" (Gene & Tammy)
2. 06:59 AM - watch out Fisherman (walt evans)
3. 09:39 AM - Cabane fitting question (Jack T. Textor)
4. 09:40 AM - Engine question...... (KMHeide, BA, CPO, FAAOP)
5. 10:52 AM - Re: Engine question...... (Rick Holland)
6. 01:54 PM - Re: Re: Welding Headache (Jim Ash)
7. 03:22 PM - tail gear collapse (Jeff Boatright)
8. 04:29 PM - Re: Engine question...... (Tim Willis)
9. 05:23 PM - Re: tail gear collapse (Dick Navratil)
10. 07:18 PM - Re: tail gear collapse (Jeff Boatright)
11. 07:29 PM - Re: tail gear collapse (Peter W Johnson)
12. 07:33 PM - Re: Engine question...... (Rcaprd@aol.com)
13. 07:53 PM - Re: tail gear collapse (Rcaprd@aol.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: another "Johnson Airspeed Indicator" |
Oscar you did it again. What a great find!
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 01, 2007 8:04 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: another "Johnson Airspeed Indicator"
> <taildrags@hotmail.com>
>
> Just saw another nifty construction detail and drawing for a "Johnson
> Airspeed Indicator", as used by the Dawn Patrol guys:
>
> http://www.kcdawnpatrol.org/airspeed-indicator.htm
>
> It's got dimensions and it's the right airspeed range for our airplanes...
> 30 to 90 MPH.
>
> Oscar Zuniga
> San Antonio, TX
> mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
> website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Get the device you want, with the Hotmail you love.
> http://www.windowsmobile.com/hotmailmobile?ocid=MobileHMTagline_1
>
>
> --
> 269.13.2/984 - Release Date: 9/2/2007 12:59 PM
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | watch out Fisherman |
Felix was packing winds of up to 165 mph as it headed west, according to
the U.S. National Hurricane Center. It was projected to skirt Honduras'
coastline on Tuesday before slamming into Belize on Wednesday.
Hurricane watches have been issued for the Caribbean coast of Guatemala
and the entire coast of Belize as Felix churns west through the
Caribbean.
Walt Evans
NX140DL
"No one ever learned anything by talking"
Message 3
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| Subject: | Cabane fitting question |
Happy Labor Day all! I'm fabricating my rear cabane fittings and had a
question. I'm doing the three piece wing. The plans show a width of
=BE inch for the piece that wraps under the spar center section. I'm
thing about making that piece 1 inch. Have other done this or should I
stick with =BE?
Thanks,
Jack
Jack Textor
Vice President
3737 Woodland Avenue
Suite #300
West Des Moines, IA 50266
515-225-7000
www.thepalmergroup.com <http://www.thepalmergroup.com/>
This e-mail, including attachments, is covered by the Electronic
Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. 2510-2521, is confidential, and
may be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, you
are hereby notified that any retention, dissemination, distribution, or
copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. Please reply to
the sender that you have received the message in error, and then please
delete it. Thank you.
Message 4
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| Subject: | Engine question...... |
Fellow Pieter's:
Forgive me for sticking my neck out.....just curious how many other applications
of engines have been tried in the pietenpol? With Continental and Lycoming
prices on the rise, just wondering if other applications have been used (outside
of the Model A also)?
Sincerely,
Village idiot
---------------------------------
Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story.
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Engine question...... |
If you don't mine building the engine yourself you can do a Corvair for
around $3000 - $6000 depending on how much you can fabricate yourself.
Rick
On 9/3/07, KMHeide, BA, CPO, FAAOP <kmheidecpo@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> Fellow Pieter's:
>
> Forgive me for sticking my neck out.....just curious how many other
> applications of engines have been tried in the pietenpol? With Continental
> and Lycoming prices on the rise, just wondering if other applications have
> been used (outside of the Model A also)?
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Village idiot
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
--
Rick Holland
ObjectAge Ltd.
Castle Rock, Colorado
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Welding Headache |
That would be Richard Smoot.
Jim Ash
-----Original Message-----
>From: Ben Charvet <bcharvet@bellsouth.net>
>Sent: Sep 2, 2007 7:54 PM
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Welding Headache
>
>
>I don't remember his name, but he had a big beard. I didn't see him
>there last year.
>
>Ben
>Jim Ash wrote:
>
>>
>>Do you remember the instructor at Sun 'n Fun or what he looked like?
>>
>>Jim Ash
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>
>>
>>>From: Ben Charvet <bcharvet@bellsouth.net>
>>>Sent: Sep 2, 2007 12:08 PM
>>>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>>>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Welding Headache
>>>
>>>
>>>I'm not an expert welder, even though my life will some day depend on
>>>it, but my experience matches Walt's. I've seen most of my popping
>>>using the torch with the gas turned down too low. How much oxygen you
>>>use should be a relatively fixed ratio to give the proper flame shape.
>>>This a very important part of welding. I attended a welding workshop
>>>at Sun-N-Fun a few years ago, and the instructor spent 15 minutes
>>>showing me how to adjust the flame. Too much oxygen gives you a sharp
>>>pointed inner cone that puts too much oxygen in the weld and could cause
>>>your brittleness. If you haven't already, get a copy of the Finch
>>>(Robert or Richard) book on welding, and he gives a lot of good
>>>advice.I use the "0" tip for nearly everything on the Piet, unless the
>>>metal is close to 1/8 inch thick, like landing gear legs. I use a chart
>>>I picked up at a welding store that recommends tip sizes.
>>>
>>>Ben Charvet
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | tail gear collapse |
Gang,
I broke the Piet's tail gear this afternoon - broke at the welds of
the "V", just ahead of the vertical spring. The 30 year old welds
couldn't take the pounding that occurs with one of my multi-hop
landings.
Does anyone know of a gear that can be bought? The current gear uses
the two steel tubes in a V as per the later plans (I think) with a
spring running vertically at the point of the "V". What we have now
is probably not repairable. I've attached photos prior to the
collapse. They're not very good; I'll try to upload better ones later.
We have four fly-ins starting 10 days from now that I'd really like
to make if at all possible. One of them my Dad is coming into town
specifically to ride in the Piet to. I'm open to any suggestions
about how to beg, borrow, or buy a complete "V". Note that the
tailwheel and hardware is fine; it's just the "V" that is knackered.
In the mean time, I'm ordering tubing from AS&S to make a new one.
Thanks,
Jeff
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Engine question...... |
Ken,
There is a list somewhere of all the engines someone had compiled that had bveen
used on a the Piet. I can't find it now.
As you likely know the big three for Piets has been-- the Ford Model A and B, the
Continental (most often A65), and the Corvair. The older Continentals and
the Corvairs seems most practical to me, and their numbers would seem to confirm
that.
Other aircraft engines include some Lycoming, Franklin, and more recently Rotax,
as well as a great many radials (those spread across not too many actual flying
planes-- many "one-offs").
Other auto engines include several Subarus and a few more modern small Fords (an
English or Euro engine, I think). A Toyota, Nissan or Mazda should work as
well as a small Ford engine, but it's most often better to follow a trail of adaptation
than blaze a new one. No doubt someone has put a Mazda rotary in a
Piet, too. These other auto engines are water-cooled. The Subarus have the advantage
of pancake design and some good documentation.
No one should try a VW,--" the other air-cooled auto engine"-- in a Piet, I believe,
for the combo of the Piet's weight, drag and 2-place capacity is at the
edge of the best VWs; e.g., Great Plains, IMO.
The Corvairs are almost an aircraft engine at the outset. Other than the Model
A or Corvair, the other auto engines almost always require a speed (rpm) reducer.
If you are going that way, something to consider would be a modern motorcycle
engine with fuel injection and all that. For motorcycle engines, the Honda
Gold Wing has higher torque and lower rpm than most other motorcylces, and
would be my choice on paper. I think you might get a used one for $1200 or so,
but then might have to figure out how to adapt computer and fuel injection
issues. Direct drive might actually work on this particular engine.
However, as I've said, I favor the Continentals or the Corvair. What are you considering?
Tim in central TX
AM
>To: Pietenpol <Pietenpol-List@matronics.com>
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Engine question......
>
>Fellow Pieter's:
>
> Forgive me for sticking my neck out.....just curious how many other applications
of engines have been tried in the pietenpol? With Continental and Lycoming
prices on the rise, just wondering if other applications have been used (outside
of the Model A also)?
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Village idiot
>
>
>---------------------------------
>Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story.
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: tail gear collapse |
Jeff
Seems to me, you have the new tube coming, you can make a new one in a
afternoon. Slap on a couple coats of paint and do the fly ins.
Can you do your own welding? If not, someone here might do it for you.
Dick
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Boatright" <jboatri@emory.edu>
Sent: Monday, September 03, 2007 5:19 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: tail gear collapse
> Gang,
>
> I broke the Piet's tail gear this afternoon - broke at the welds of
> the "V", just ahead of the vertical spring. The 30 year old welds
> couldn't take the pounding that occurs with one of my multi-hop
> landings.
>
> Does anyone know of a gear that can be bought? The current gear uses
> the two steel tubes in a V as per the later plans (I think) with a
> spring running vertically at the point of the "V". What we have now
> is probably not repairable. I've attached photos prior to the
> collapse. They're not very good; I'll try to upload better ones later.
>
> We have four fly-ins starting 10 days from now that I'd really like
> to make if at all possible. One of them my Dad is coming into town
> specifically to ride in the Piet to. I'm open to any suggestions
> about how to beg, borrow, or buy a complete "V". Note that the
> tailwheel and hardware is fine; it's just the "V" that is knackered.
> In the mean time, I'm ordering tubing from AS&S to make a new one.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jeff
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: tail gear collapse |
Does anyone know the tubing specs for this application? The diameter
of the tubes use previously is 5/8", but I can't tell what the
thickness is.
Thanks,
Jeff
At 7:19 PM -0500 9/3/07, Dick Navratil wrote:
><horzpool@goldengate.net>
>
>Jeff
>Seems to me, you have the new tube coming, you can make a new one in
>a afternoon. Slap on a couple coats of paint and do the fly ins.
>Can you do your own welding? If not, someone here might do it for you.
>Dick
>----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Boatright" <jboatri@emory.edu>
>To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Sent: Monday, September 03, 2007 5:19 PM
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: tail gear collapse
>
>>Gang,
>>
>>I broke the Piet's tail gear this afternoon - broke at the welds of
>>the "V", just ahead of the vertical spring. The 30 year old welds
>>couldn't take the pounding that occurs with one of my multi-hop
>>landings.
>>
>>Does anyone know of a gear that can be bought? The current gear uses
>>the two steel tubes in a V as per the later plans (I think) with a
>>spring running vertically at the point of the "V". What we have now
>>is probably not repairable. I've attached photos prior to the
>>collapse. They're not very good; I'll try to upload better ones later.
>>
>>We have four fly-ins starting 10 days from now that I'd really like
>>to make if at all possible. One of them my Dad is coming into town
>>specifically to ride in the Piet to. I'm open to any suggestions
>>about how to beg, borrow, or buy a complete "V". Note that the
>>tailwheel and hardware is fine; it's just the "V" that is knackered.
>>In the mean time, I'm ordering tubing from AS&S to make a new one.
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Jeff
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | tail gear collapse |
Jeff,
5/8 inch 20 gauge (0.035")??. You will need about 34 inches.
Cheers
Peter
Wonthaggi Australia
http://www.cpc-world.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff
Boatright
Sent: Tuesday, 4 September 2007 12:18 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: tail gear collapse
Does anyone know the tubing specs for this application? The diameter
of the tubes use previously is 5/8", but I can't tell what the
thickness is.
Thanks,
Jeff
At 7:19 PM -0500 9/3/07, Dick Navratil wrote:
><horzpool@goldengate.net>
>
>Jeff
>Seems to me, you have the new tube coming, you can make a new one in
>a afternoon. Slap on a couple coats of paint and do the fly ins.
>Can you do your own welding? If not, someone here might do it for you.
>Dick
>----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Boatright" <jboatri@emory.edu>
>To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Sent: Monday, September 03, 2007 5:19 PM
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: tail gear collapse
>
>>Gang,
>>
>>I broke the Piet's tail gear this afternoon - broke at the welds of
>>the "V", just ahead of the vertical spring. The 30 year old welds
>>couldn't take the pounding that occurs with one of my multi-hop
>>landings.
>>
>>Does anyone know of a gear that can be bought? The current gear uses
>>the two steel tubes in a V as per the later plans (I think) with a
>>spring running vertically at the point of the "V". What we have now
>>is probably not repairable. I've attached photos prior to the
>>collapse. They're not very good; I'll try to upload better ones later.
>>
>>We have four fly-ins starting 10 days from now that I'd really like
>>to make if at all possible. One of them my Dad is coming into town
>>specifically to ride in the Piet to. I'm open to any suggestions
>>about how to beg, borrow, or buy a complete "V". Note that the
>>tailwheel and hardware is fine; it's just the "V" that is knackered.
>>In the mean time, I'm ordering tubing from AS&S to make a new one.
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Jeff
>
>
4:32 PM
4:32 PM
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Engine question...... |
In a message dated 9/3/2007 11:41:21 AM Central Daylight Time,
kmheidecpo@yahoo.com writes:
Forgive me for sticking my neck out.....just curious how many other
applications of engines have been tried in the pietenpol? With Continental and
Lycoming
prices on the rise, just wondering if other applications have been used
(outside of the Model A also)?
The 'Pietenpol Aircamper' has had a wider variety of engines installed in
this airframe, than any other aircraft in history. Direct drive, long stroke
engines that swing a big prop work best.
Chuck G.
NX770CG
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: tail gear collapse |
Jeff,
The plans tail skid call for 5/8" 20ga (.035") wall thickness. One thing to
keep in mind is how much higher the tail sits, after you put that wheel under
the 'Vee'. On my plane, I tried to keep the tail as low as I could, by
installing the wheel behind the aft edge of the 'Vee', in order to keep the tail
as
low as possible. This helps with doing full stall landings, and keeps a lot
of the twisting loads from breaking the assembly. On the ground, I spin the
tail around and around with the smoke on, and haven't had any problems twisting
the tail assembly.
Chuck G.
NX770CG
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
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