Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:54 AM - Ron and Patricis Hollmer's Piet (Jim Markle)
2. 04:15 AM - Re: Engine question...... ()
3. 06:09 AM - Engine question (lshutks@webtv.net (Leon Stefan))
4. 06:44 AM - Re: Engine question (AMsafetyC@aol.com)
5. 07:18 AM - Re: Engine question (James Dallas)
6. 07:28 AM - Re: Engine question (Max Hegler)
7. 11:38 AM - Re: Engine question (Patrick Panzera)
8. 12:08 PM - Re: Engine question (Gordon Bowen)
9. 04:37 PM - Re: Engine question (MICHAEL SILVIUS)
10. 05:08 PM - Re: Engine question (skellytownflyer)
11. 05:33 PM - Re: Engine question (BFD)
12. 06:57 PM - Re: Engine question (Gordon Bowen)
13. 07:32 PM - Re: Re: Engine question (baileys)
Message 1
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Ron and Patricis Hollmer's Piet |
I think the rims are making it look like there are brakes. The spokes are
still straight (as in Howard's original build) so unless someone added them,
there probably aren't any brakes.
I want mine to look like Howard's when it grows up!!!! That thing is
beautiful.
jm
----- Original Message -----
From: "Catdesigns" <catdesigns@comcast.net>
Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 2:46 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: RE: Ron and Patricis Hollmer's Piet
> <catdesigns@comcast.net>
>
> Oscar and All,
>
> The picture can be found at
> http://westcoastpiet.com/howard_henderson_444hh.htm it's the one on the
> very bottom.
> Oscar, I see brakes. They look to be small, perhaps 4-inch, drum brakes.
> If you look closely I think he has pins on the axel like Mike Cuy.
>
> Grant MacLaren has a great write-up on this plane at
> http://users.aol.com/bpabpabpa/n444mh1.html
>
> Chris Tracy
> Sacramento, Ca
> Website at http://www.Westcoastpiet.com
>
>
>
Message 2
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Engine question...... |
My 80 hp Franklin just hums,no screaming and yes up here in cold Canada
it is an ultralight and when it starts that's when it putts.
________________________________
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ryan
Michals
Sent: September 4, 2007 7:39 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Engine question......
One of the attractive features of the Piet for me was the fact that it
uses a low revving engine. The sound of an old Ford or Continental
puttin' along adds to the whole experiance, rather than somthin' on the
nose screeming like it may blow apart at any moment (no offense
ultralight guys).
Ryan
________________________________
Choose the right car based on your needs.
Message 3
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Several years a guy in Alabama was flying a Piet with a Chevy 4 cyl.
from an S-10. It later crashed for reasons not the fault of the engine.
I'm still waiting for him to come foreward with all the details. (good
thing I'm not holding my breath) If you missed the Model A forum at
Brodhead, we learned about an automotive engineer who has re designed
the model A engine to modern standards and is planning to have it
produced in China for about 3K if he can get enough interest. for a
production run. E-mail him and tell him you'll take a dozen!
modelaengine.com Leon S. in Ks. who hasn't touched the Piet yet this
year.
Message 4
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Engine question |
What changes would one have to make to an engine to get the majority of hp
out at a lower rpm, rather than making it a 6500 rpm screamer? I would much
rather improve the low rpm output if possible than go full rpm and redrive.
Any suggestions on building a low rpm high output engine suggesting a max
rpm in the 2500 to 3500 range?
I would really like to use the ford 2.0 L OHC metric engine (Pinto) I
already have in stock if at all possible! Any info on building that is greatly
appreciated!
John
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
Message 5
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Engine question |
John, The big change would be in the cam profile. You need to find an
automotive machinist that knows cams and can grind a profile for the
torque/RPM range that you want. The bad thing is more than likely the
horsepower will be considerably lower than the stock engine trying to get
the peak torque at say 2600 RPM.
Jim Dallas
>From: AMsafetyC@aol.com
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Engine question
>Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2007 09:44:22 EDT
>
>What changes would one have to make to an engine to get the majority of hp
>out at a lower rpm, rather than making it a 6500 rpm screamer? I would much
>rather improve the low rpm output if possible than go full rpm and
>redrive.
>
>Any suggestions on building a low rpm high output engine suggesting a max
>rpm in the 2500 to 3500 range?
>
>I would really like to use the ford 2.0 L OHC metric engine (Pinto) I
>already have in stock if at all possible! Any info on building that is
>greatly
>appreciated!
>
>John
>
>
>http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
Message 6
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Engine question |
Has anyone checked this one out?
http://www.donovanengineering.com/Blocks/ModelDBlock.html
In my "wild about car" days, Donovan engines were about the best.
I have asked for information but it hasn't arrived yet.
Max
----- Original Message -----
From: AMsafetyC@aol.com
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 8:44 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Engine question
What changes would one have to make to an engine to get the majority
of hp out at a lower rpm, rather than making it a 6500 rpm screamer? I
would much rather improve the low rpm output if possible than go full
rpm and redrive.
Any suggestions on building a low rpm high output engine suggesting a
max rpm in the 2500 to 3500 range?
I would really like to use the ford 2.0 L OHC metric engine (Pinto) I
already have in stock if at all possible! Any info on building that is
greatly appreciated!
John
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Message 7
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
A good rule of thumb is RPM x displacement (in cubic inches) =F7 5,250
will
get you close to what you can expect from HP.
So as an example, your 2000cc (122 cubes) @ 3,250 RPM could net upwards
of
75 ponies. If you need to turn it slower, say 2,750 RPM then HP drops to
59.
So if you increase the cubes by bore and stroke (if that=92s possible)
you
could gain a few ponies back. You can also pick a little more power by
increasing the compression ratio and by playing with the timing.
Cam grind can help too if you can find such a cam. Most cams made for
little
motors are to help the engine spin faster. Do you know of a stock torque
curve graph that=92s out there for this engine?
The good thing about trying to find extra power with an auto conversion
is
the lack of a need for =93drivability=94. You pretty much have three
throttle
positions, wide open, cruise, and pattern and not any start-and-stop
driving
like with a car.
But with direct drive you have to concern yourself with the crank. A
PSRU
can isolate the crank from all the gyroscopic concerns imposed by the
prop
(in addition to thrust), and in many cases, offer some sort of torsional
vibration damping.
Pat
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
AMsafetyC@aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 6:44 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Engine question
What changes would one have to make to an engine to get the majority of
hp
out at a lower rpm, rather than making it a 6500 rpm screamer? I would
much
rather improve the low rpm output if possible than go full rpm and
redrive.
Any suggestions on building a low rpm high output engine suggesting a
max
rpm in the 2500 to 3500 range?
I would really like to use the ford 2.0 L OHC metric engine (Pinto) I
already have in stock if at all possible! Any info on building that is
greatly appreciated!
John
_____
<http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour/?ncid=AOLAOF00020000000982>
.
Message 8
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Engine question |
Find an engine with the shortest stroke and largest diameter pistons.
Torque turns the prop, not max. hp. Low rpm torque comes from short
stroke and large diameter piston engines, ie. diesel engines and
storebought aircraft engines. You can look until the next ice age, but
you ain't gonna find too many cheap engines made for cars that meet the
above torque requirements at low rpm. OR Option 1--- bite the bullet
and buy engine designed for the job, like a Lycosaurus. Option 2--bite
the bullet again and get a firewall forward system like the Subaru's
modified, somewhat proven and for aircraft. Subarus still need a PRU,
do to rpm needed to get torque. Benefit of Subarus is the fact the
pistons are oppossed like VW or Corvair, thus they don't vibrate
themselves to death at high rpms. Biggest problem with looking a
alternate sources of power is waste of your time and money. I know it's
called experimental, but the engine alternative experiment has been
beaten to death by every type and sort of homebuilder and some spam cans
with ie. 4.3L Chevy engines, or alumimum block ole Buick V-8's. There's
tonnes of research and experiment documentation out there in
internet-land for your consideration. The power systems that have
worked and are working are well documented.
Gordon
----- Original Message -----
From: AMsafetyC@aol.com
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 5:44 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Engine question
What changes would one have to make to an engine to get the majority
of hp out at a lower rpm, rather than making it a 6500 rpm screamer? I
would much rather improve the low rpm output if possible than go full
rpm and redrive.
Any suggestions on building a low rpm high output engine suggesting a
max rpm in the 2500 to 3500 range?
I would really like to use the ford 2.0 L OHC metric engine (Pinto) I
already have in stock if at all possible! Any info on building that is
greatly appreciated!
John
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Message 9
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
You could even do a direct drive Subaru as Ed Barros is doing on his highly
modified KR in Agentina.
Cant get much simpler and afordable than that.
http://www.kr2-egb.com.ar/
Message 10
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Engine question |
Well I wonder how the re-drive bug engine is holding up that gene what's his name
in Missourri builds and also sells the drive unit for? I have a friend that
wants to buy one of his backyard flyer's with one of them on it pretty bad.but
unless he sells his Tailwind for a pretty good price-I doubt he will.another
buddy is thinking along the same lines if he sells his Glassair.that's the fastest
plane I ever got to fly for sure.but they are geting into the Light Sport
mentality now instead of just wanting to go fast.I guess the grass is surely
allways greener on the other side of the runway.Don't know why one of those engines
would'nt power a Piet pretty well too and surely be lighter than a model
A or a Corvair.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=132979#132979
Message 11
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Engine question |
Thats a good one! lol
Low rpm torque comes from short stroke and large diameter piston
engines, ie. diesel engines and storebought aircraft engines.
Message 12
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Engine question |
BFD seems to have a tad of doubt, soooo. Here's an example for doubting
BFD's. GM and Ford both made a 3.8l V-6 engine. Equal displacement but
Ford engine has larger bore and shorter stroke to get same cubic inches
as GM. Get a copy of the torque curve and ck it out yourself who has
the highest torque at lowest RPM's. Ford and Chrysler (Cummings) both
making approx same displacement diesel engine, the Cummings engine has
larger bore and shorter stroke, look up the torque curve and see who has
highest torque at lowest RPM.
Gordon
----- Original Message -----
From: BFD
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 4:29 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Engine question
Thats a good one! lol
Low rpm torque comes from short stroke and large diameter piston
engines, ie. diesel engines and storebought aircraft engines.
Message 13
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Engine question |
IMHO the bug engine at it's current level of development would be a good
candidate as long as one didn't try and push it too hard. I belive the
redrive you mention is one from Valley Engineering aka Culver Props.
Father and Son team Gene and Larry Smith are the ones running the show
http://www.culverprops.com/index.php
Even if you aren't interested in a bug engine it is an interesting site
to browse. Also I belive they won an award for their Briggs & Stratton
conversion at EAA.
----- Original Message -----
From: skellytownflyer
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 7:07 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Engine question
<hanover@centramedia.net>
Well I wonder how the re-drive bug engine is holding up that gene
what's his name in Missourri builds and also sells the drive unit for? I
have a friend that wants to buy one of his backyard flyer's with one of
them on it pretty bad.but unless he sells his Tailwind for a pretty good
price-I doubt he will.another buddy is thinking along the same lines if
he sells his Glassair.that's the fastest plane I ever got to fly for
sure.but they are geting into the Light Sport mentality now instead of
just wanting to go fast.I guess the grass is surely allways greener on
the other side of the runway.Don't know why one of those engines
would'nt power a Piet pretty well too and surely be lighter than a model
A or a Corvair.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=132979#132979
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|