Pietenpol-List Digest Archive

Mon 01/21/08


Total Messages Posted: 12



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 05:36 AM - Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 01/20/08 (tbyh@aol.com)
     2. 07:30 AM - Re: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 01/20/08 (Scott Schreiber)
     3. 08:23 AM - Keep the crap off here guys (Eric Williams)
     4. 08:49 AM - Usage of the list (Ryan Mueller)
     5. 10:27 AM - Roman Bukolt's Riblett Airfoil (ALAN LYSCARS)
     6. 10:49 AM - Re: Roman Bukolt's Riblett Airfoil (Phillips, Jack)
     7. 11:16 AM - Roman Bukolt's Riblett Airfoil (Oscar Zuniga)
     8. 11:40 AM - Re: Roman Bukolt's Riblett Airfoil (Bill Church)
     9. 12:07 PM - determining Vne (Oscar Zuniga)
    10. 12:19 PM - Re: Roman Bukolt's Riblett Airfoil (Don Emch)
    11. 12:22 PM - Re: determining Vne (Phillips, Jack)
    12. 01:42 PM - GN-1 Spar Thickness (ALAN LYSCARS)
 
 
 


Message 1


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 05:36:04 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 01/20/08
    From: tbyh@aol.com
    This is why off-topic items need to be kept off of here -- because then we get comments like "dumb savages in New Orleans and their rhyming reverends."? Mr. Schreiber ought to apologize for that comment and refrain from making similar bigoted, ignorant remarks. Comments like this are unacceptable, period! I never would have thought that somebody associated with the American space program, or the?Pietenpol airplane,?could utter such truly astounding remarks. F. Beseler La Crosse, WI -----Original Message----- From: Pietenpol-List Digest Server <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> Sent: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 1:56 am Subject: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 01/20/08 * ================================================= Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive ================================================= Today's complete Pietenpol-List Digest can also be found in either of the two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version of the Pietenpol-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor such as Notepad or with a web browser. HTML Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 08-01-20&Archive=Pietenpol Text Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter 08-01-20&Archive=Pietenpol =============================================== EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive =============================================== ---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 01/20/08: 2 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:56 AM - Re: Re: CONTACT! Magazine, Pietenpol Issue/Don Emch (Chet's Mail) 2. 09:16 AM - Re: disturbing video (Scott Schreiber) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 07:56:18 AM PST US From: "Chet's Mail" <Chethartley1@mchsi.com> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: CONTACT! Magazine, Pietenpol Issue/Don Emch Brent, Thanks for the replay I live in Holts Summit, and keep NX920Y at the Jeff airport. Things are a little busy right now but I will be in touch soon. Chet Hartley 896-5405 or cell 573 - 645 - 0534. ----- Original Message ----- From: BScott116@aol.com To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 9:15 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: CONTACT! Magazine, Pietenpol Issue/Don Emch Jefferson City area. 12 miles north Brent Scott-573 999 4120 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape in the new year. ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 09:16:35 AM PST US From: "Scott Schreiber" <got22b@subarubrat.com> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: disturbing video It is distrubing to think that anyone might actually buy into that nonsense, as a scientist in the space program I can assure you we did in fact go to the moon. The dumb savages in New Orleans and their rhyming reverends might not understand that water always flows to the lowest point. Scott Do not Archive ----- Original Message ----- From: AMsafetyC@aol.com To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2008 2:20 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: disturbing video Don't forget Katrina and the allegations that center around of the Army corps of engineers were responsible because the corps dynamited the levy in the ward along with other low lying low income areas of New Orleans along with all the other communities. The there is always the Kennedy assignations as a fall back position I am sure if you looked you could find plenty of conspiracy theories that dispel the popular beliefs about national events. Sorry Gang! Some of the conspiracy theory really gets my shorts twisted Do not Archive John Recine ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape in the new year. ________________________________________________________________________


    Message 2


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:30:35 AM PST US
    From: "Scott Schreiber" <got22b@subarubrat.com>
    Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 01/20/08
    Shooting at rescue workers, looting big screens, and then blaming the CIA for blowing up the dam are truly astounding and really did happen. The rhyming reverends really did go on TV and play up the wild fantasies that only a moron would believe while hard working people risked life and limb. Just like claiming that we never went to the moon, great men did great things and morons pick it apart. And don't even get me started on the scumbags that have turned 9-11 into a circus. Being disgusted by such behavior is not bigoted, ignorant, unnaceptable, or astounding. -Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: tbyh@aol.com To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 8:27 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 01/20/08 This is why off-topic items need to be kept off of here -- because then we get comments like "dumb savages in New Orleans and their rhyming reverends." Mr. Schreiber ought to apologize for that comment and refrain from making similar bigoted, ignorant remarks. Comments like this are unacceptable, period! I never would have thought that somebody associated with the American space program, or the Pietenpol airplane, could utter such truly astounding remarks. F. Beseler La Crosse, WI -----Original Message----- From: Pietenpol-List Digest Server <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> To: Pietenpol-List Digest List <pietenpol-list-digest@matronics.com> Sent: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 1:56 am Subject: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 01/20/08 * Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive Today's complete Pietenpol-List Digest can also be found in either of the two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version of the Pietenpol-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor such as Notepad or with a web browser. HTML Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html& Chapter 08-01-20&Archive=Pietenpol Text Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&C hapter 08-01-20&Archive=Pietenpol ====================== EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive ====================== ---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 01/20/08: 2 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:56 AM - Re: Re: CONTACT! Magazine, Pietenpol Issue/Don Emch (Chet's Mail) 2. 09:16 AM - Re: disturbing video (Scott Schreiber) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 07:56:18 AM PST US From: "Chet's Mail" <Chethartley1@mchsi.com> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: CONTACT! Magazine, Pietenpol Issue/Don Emch Brent, Thanks for the replay I live in Holts Summit, and keep NX920Y at the Jeff airport. Things are a little busy right now but I will be in touch soon. Chet Hartley 896-5405 or cell 573 - 645 - 0534. ----- Original Message ----- From: BScott116@aol.com To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 9:15 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: CONTACT! Magazine, Pietenpol Issue/Don Emch Jefferson City area. 12 miles north Brent Scott-573 999 4120 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape in the new year. ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 09:16:35 AM PST US From: "Scott Schreiber" <got22b@subarubrat.com> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: disturbing video It is distrubing to think that anyone might actually buy into that nonsense, as a scientist in the space program I can assure you we did in fact go to the moon. The dumb savages in New Orleans and their rhyming reverends might not understand that water always flows to the lowest point. Scott Do not Archive ----- Original Message ----- From: AMsafetyC@aol.com To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2008 2:20 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: disturbing video Don't forget Katrina and the allegations that center around of the Army corps of engineers were responsible because the corps dynamited the levy in the ward along with other low lying low income areas of New Orleans along with all the other communities. The there is always the Kennedy assignations as a fall back position I am sure if you looked you could find plenty of conspiracy theories that dispel the popular beliefs about national events. Sorry Gang! Some of the conspiracy theory really gets my shorts twisted Do not Archive John Recine ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape in the new year. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- -----


    Message 3


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 08:23:05 AM PST US
    From: Eric Williams <ewilliams805@msn.com>
    Subject: Keep the crap off here guys
    Like my title says... Go elsewhere for stupid political discussions. We will never change each o ther's minds on that topic so let's stick to something we can all agree on. .. airplanes. That's the point of this list. Just don't even start these threads. Nothing good ever comes of it. Eric From: got22b@subarubrat.comTo: pietenpol-list@matronics.comSubject: Re: Pie tenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 01/20/08Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 10:27:36 -0500 Shooting at rescue workers, looting big screens, and then blaming the CIA f or blowing up the dam are truly astounding and really did happen. The rhymi ng reverends really did go on TV and play up the wild fantasies that only a moron would believe while hard working people risked life and limb. Just l ike claiming that we never went to the moon, great men did great things and morons pick it apart. And don't even get me started on the scumbags that h ave turned 9-11 into a circus. Being disgusted by such behavior is not bigo ted, ignorant, unnaceptable, or astounding. -Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: tbyh@aol.com Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 8:27 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 01/20/08 This is why off-topic items need to be kept off of here -- because then we get comments like "dumb savages in New Orleans and their rhyming reverends. " Mr. Schreiber ought to apologize for that comment and refrain from makin g similar bigoted, ignorant remarks. Comments like this are unacceptable, p eriod! I never would have thought that somebody associated with the America n space program, or the Pietenpol airplane, could utter such truly astoundi ng remarks. F. BeselerLa Crosse, WI -----Original Message-----From: Pietenp ol-List Digest Server <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>To: Pietenpol-List Dige st List <pietenpol-list-digest@matronics.com>Sent: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 1:56 am Subject: Pietenpol-List Digest: 2 Msgs - 01/20/08 * Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive Today's complete Pietenpol-List Digest can also be found in either of the two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version of the Pietenpol-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor such as Notepad or with a web browser. HTML Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=htm l&Chapter 08-01-20&Archive=Pietenpol Text Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt &Chapter 08-01-20&Archive=Pietenpol ====================== EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive ====================== ---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 01/20/08: 2 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:56 AM - Re: Re: CONTACT! Magazine, Pietenpol Issue/Don Emch (Ch et's Mail) 2. 09:16 AM - Re: disturbing video (Scott Schreiber) ________________________________ Message 1 ______________________________ _______ Time: 07:56:18 AM PST US From: "Chet's Mail" <Chethartley1@mchsi.com> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: CONTACT! Magazine, Pietenpol Issue/Don Emc h Brent, Thanks for the replay I live in Holts Summit, and keep NX920Y at the Jeff airport. Things are a little busy right now but I will be in touch soon. Chet Hartley 896-5405 or cell 573 - 645 - 0534. ----- Original Message ----- From: BScott116@aol.com To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2008 9:15 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: CONTACT! Magazine, Pietenpol Issue/Don Emch Jefferson City area. 12 miles north Brent Scott-573 999 4120 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape in the new year. ________________________________ Message 2 ______________________________ _______ Time: 09:16:35 AM PST US From: "Scott Schreiber" <got22b@subarubrat.com> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: disturbing video It is distrubing to think that anyone might actually buy into that nonsense, as a scientist in the space program I can assure you we did in fact go to the moon. The dumb savages in New Orleans and their rhyming reverends might not understand that water always flows to the lowest point. Scott Do not Archive ----- Original Message ----- From: AMsafetyC@aol.com To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2008 2:20 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: disturbing video Don't forget Katrina and the allegations that center around of the Army corps of engineers were responsible because the corps dynamited the levy in the ward along with other low lying low income areas of New Orleans along with all the other communities. The there is always the Kennedy assignations as a fall back position I am sure if you looked you could find plenty of conspiracy theories that dispel the popular beliefs about national events. Sorry Gang! Some of the conspiracy theory really gets my shorts twisted Do not Archive John Recine ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape in the new year. href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matro nics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c


    Message 4


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 08:49:12 AM PST US
    From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Usage of the list
    Some of us need to refresh our memories about the Usage Guidelines of the mailing list: http://www.matronics.com/ftp/Archives/Pietenpol-List.FAQ Scroll to the bottom and read carefully. Take this crap elsewhere and sort it out off-list. Ryan do not archive Scott Schreiber <got22b@subarubrat.com> wrote: Shooting at rescue workers, looting big screens, and then blaming the CIA for blowing up the dam are truly astounding and really did happen. The rhyming reverends really did go on TV and play up the wild fantasies that only a moron would believe while hard working people risked life and limb. Just like claiming that we never went to the moon, great men did great things and morons pick it apart. And don't even get me started on the scumbags that have turned 9-11 into a circus. Being disgusted by such behavior is not bigoted, ignorant, unnaceptable, or astounding. -Scott --------------------------------- Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.


    Message 5


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 10:27:35 AM PST US
    From: "ALAN LYSCARS" <alyscars@verizon.net>
    Subject: Roman Bukolt's Riblett Airfoil
    Gents: I am ready to build the Riblett Airfoil for my GN-1. I've purchased the full-size drawing from Roman. The Riblett rib is set up for a 3/4" spar. Pete Bowers, in his Fly Baby drawings, recommends a 1 inch spar for the Fly Baby when powering the ship with 100 hp or greater. Question: Since I'll be rigging a WW Corvair on my GN-1, should I increase the spar thickness in my Riblett/GN-1 to 1 inch? Will I die before my time by staying with a 3/4" spar? No aerobatics intended, but bumpy weather here in New England. Thanks for your input, Al in NH


    Message 6


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 10:49:42 AM PST US
    Subject: Roman Bukolt's Riblett Airfoil
    From: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips@cardinalhealth.com>
    Pitts Specials and Citabrias both have a =BE" spar, as does my Pietenpol. As long as you don't get too enthusiastic with the Whifferdills you should be fine. I wouldn't bump the redline airspeed up much over 100 mph, though. Jack Phillips NX899JP _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of ALAN LYSCARS Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 1:24 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Roman Bukolt's Riblett Airfoil Gents: I am ready to build the Riblett Airfoil for my GN-1. I've purchased the fu ll-size drawing from Roman. The Riblett rib is set up for a 3/4" spar. Pete Bowers, in his Fly Baby dr awings, recommends a 1 inch spar for the Fly Baby when powering the ship wi th 100 hp or greater. Question: Since I'll be rigging a WW Corvair on my GN-1, should I increase the spar thickness in my Riblett/GN-1 to 1 inch? Will I die before my tim e by staying with a 3/4" spar? No aerobatics intended, but bumpy weather h ere in New England. Thanks for your input, Al in NH _________________________________________________ This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privilege d, proprietary or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any other use of the email by you is p rohibited. Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - N orsk - Portuguese


    Message 7


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 11:16:25 AM PST US
    From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com>
    Subject: Roman Bukolt's Riblett Airfoil
    Alan; The spar strength, dimensions, and materials are selected by the designer based on the wing span, chord, weight of the aircraft, and design G-loading. If you're not changing the location of the spars relative to the leading edge, not changing the wing chord, not changing any of the other factors- if a 3/4" thick spar was OK with the Pietenpol airfoil I would think it would be OK with another foil. Sure, there are other factors that play into the selection such as pitching moment (twist) and other effects that change when the airfoil is changed, but none that would affect the spar thickness OTHER THAN THE SPAR DEPTH, which is of course a very big consideration. I thought that the Riblett was a thicker airfoil than the Piet, in which case the spars are deeper... even more reason why the 3/4" should be acceptable if they were OK on the Pietenpol airfoil. Disclaimer: I'm not an aerodynamicist, a structural engineer, or an aero engineer! Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net


    Message 8


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 11:40:12 AM PST US
    Subject: Roman Bukolt's Riblett Airfoil
    From: "Bill Church" <eng@canadianrogers.com>
    Alan, >From the information I have on the Riblett airfoil, the profile will allow a taller spar (from memory, I think it's about 3/4" taller for the front spar). A basic comparison of the section modulus (used to determine the strength of beams) of various spar cross-sections shows the following: standard 3/4" x 4 3/4" spar - Section Modulus = 2.82 taller 3/4" x 5 1/2" spar - Section Modulus = 3.78 wider 1" x 4 3/4" spar - Section Modulus = 3.76 from this we can see that a 3/4" x 5 1/2" spar will have approximately the same strength (in bending) as a 1" x 4 3/4", and approximately 1/3 more strength than a standard 3/4" x 4 3/4" spar. The extra height of the taller spar will add about 16% to the weight of the spar. NOTE: this ONLY applies to vertical loading, and is presented for reference only. There are many other factors that come into play in wing loads. Bill C.


    Message 9


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 12:07:43 PM PST US
    From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com>
    Subject: determining Vne
    I believe that one of the methods of determining Vne is that it is set at 9 0% of dive speed, Vd, and that Vd is required to be 1.4 times design cruise speed for certification in the normal category. Let's take an example... my airplane. I think I redlined my airspeed indic ator at 95MPH (based on somebody else's info), which would mean it should h ave been designed for Vd of 105MPH but I have no idea if it was. It also m eans that cruise speed should be about 75MPH and that's pretty close to whe re I cruise, if a little high. But here's better information: the Pietenpo l family website shows the original Piet "high speed" as 90MPH. That would hint at a designer's approved Vd of 100MPH and a cruise of 71MPH, which so unds more like reality for this airplane. I have heard that in order to flight-test to determine Vne, you'd have to f ly at Vd for three minutes with no damage or flutter, then redline your Vne at 90% of the tested Vd. I'm not sure I'd want to hold 41CC at 105MPH for three minutes, or that it even could do that without me climbing waaayyy o n up there to get enough altitude for the dive. It would really be coming down at that speed. Oscar ZunigaSan Antonio, TXmailto: taildrags@hotmail.comwebsite at http://w ww.flysquirrel.net


    Message 10


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 12:19:50 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Roman Bukolt's Riblett Airfoil
    From: "Don Emch" <EmchAir@aol.com>
    Alan, I'll just add my 2 cents worth, even though we all know how little 2 cents is worth nowadays. When Pietenpol designed his wing, he designed it based on trial and error. Probably lots of error. He built it with a 1" thick spar routed to an I beam. Later on he had trouble finding suitable 1" x 4 3/4" boards. So he opted to laminate smaller pieces into a 3/4" x 4 3/4" non-routed spar. He felt, as many do, that a properly laminated spar is somewhat stronger than one of the same size but solid. As far as I can tell in researching, he did not use solid 3/4" spars. I could be wrong though. I believe the 3/4" spars we see in the 3-piece wing plans were of the built up laminated type. I know there are lots of ships out there with solid 3/4" spars and as far as I know, none have fallen out of the sky, so I guess my point might very well not mean much of anything. I just thought I'd share what I've come across in my Pietenpol experiences. As a side note Frank Pavliga is recovering Sky Gypsy and should be done with it in the Spring. He bought Lowell Frank's Lambert engine to power it. He flew Mr. Frank's airplane just before he bought the engine off of it and told me that the performance was very good. He also said he could tell the wing was different ( has a Riblett airfoil). He mentioned it felt very pitch sensitive. And that's coming from a pilot with 1400 hours in his own Piet. Just a thought to those thinking about changing the airfoil. But of course I'm very biased about the Pietenpol design! Don Emch NX899DE Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=159623#159623


    Message 11


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 12:22:58 PM PST US
    Subject: determining Vne
    From: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips@cardinalhealth.com>
    I've never had my Pietenpol faster than about 90, and it was really "not happy" at that speed, and let me know it. As usual, Bernard knew what he was doing. Jack Phillips NX899JP _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Oscar Zuniga Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 3:05 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: determining Vne I believe that one of the methods of determining Vne is that it is set at 90% of dive speed, Vd, and that Vd is required to be 1.4 times design cruise speed for certification in the normal category. Let's take an example... my airplane. I think I redlined my airspeed indicator at 95MPH (based on somebody else's info), which would mean it should have been designed for Vd of 105MPH but I have no idea if it was. It also means that cruise speed should be about 75MPH and that's pretty close to where I cruise, if a little high. But here's better information: the Pietenpol family website shows the original Piet "high speed" as 90MPH. That would hint at a designer's approved Vd of 100MPH and a cruise of 71MPH, which sounds more like reality for this airplane. I have heard that in order to flight-test to determine Vne, you'd have to fly at Vd for three minutes with no damage or flutter, then redline your Vne at 90% of the tested Vd. I'm not sure I'd want to hold 41CC at 105MPH for three minutes, or that it even could do that without me climbing waaayyy on up there to get enough altitude for the dive. It would really be coming down at that speed. Oscar Zuniga San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net _________________________________________________ This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privilege d, proprietary or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any other use of the email by you is p rohibited. Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - N orsk - Portuguese


    Message 12


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 01:42:41 PM PST US
    From: "ALAN LYSCARS" <alyscars@verizon.net>
    Subject: GN-1 Spar Thickness
    Thanks, Fellows, for all your comment, I'll be staying with 3/4" spars on the Riblett airfoil (with a 100 hp Vair strapped out front). I don't think you'll be seeing me at Reno any time soon! Warm Regards to all, Al




    Other Matronics Email List Services

  • Post A New Message
  •   pietenpol-list@matronics.com
  • UN/SUBSCRIBE
  •   http://www.matronics.com/subscription
  • List FAQ
  •   http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm
  • Web Forum Interface To Lists
  •   http://forums.matronics.com
  • Matronics List Wiki
  •   http://wiki.matronics.com
  • 7-Day List Browse
  •   http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list
  • Browse Pietenpol-List Digests
  •   http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list
  • Browse Other Lists
  •   http://www.matronics.com/browse
  • Live Online Chat!
  •   http://www.matronics.com/chat
  • Archive Downloading
  •   http://www.matronics.com/archives
  • Photo Share
  •   http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
  • Other Email Lists
  •   http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
  • Contributions
  •   http://www.matronics.com/contribution

    These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.

    -- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --