Pietenpol-List Digest Archive

Thu 02/21/08


Total Messages Posted: 26



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 03:14 AM - Re: Re: Spruce Purchase (T White)
     2. 05:18 AM - Re: Re: Spruce Purchase (Gary Boothe)
     3. 05:31 AM - Re: Re: Tapered Spar Scare (AMsafetyC@aol.com)
     4. 05:43 AM - Re: Re: Spruce Purchase (AMsafetyC@aol.com)
     5. 06:07 AM - Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 54 Msgs - 02/20/08 (tbyh@aol.com)
     6. 07:31 AM - off topic - Mosquito (Bill Church)
     7. 07:35 AM - Re: Re: Tapered Spar Scare (John Hofmann)
     8. 07:50 AM - Re: Re: Spruce Purchase (MaxHegler)
     9. 08:40 AM - Re: Re: Spruce Purchase (Rick Holland)
    10. 11:20 AM - Re: Piet - GN! differences (jimd)
    11. 12:20 PM - Re: Piet building (KMHeide, BA, CPO, FAAOP)
    12. 12:26 PM - Re: Piet building (AMsafetyC@aol.com)
    13. 12:40 PM - Re: Piet building (KMHeide, BA, CPO, FAAOP)
    14. 01:35 PM - Question (KMHeide, BA, CPO, FAAOP)
    15. 01:36 PM - Re: Spruce Purchase (Perry Rhoads)
    16. 01:45 PM - Re: Question (AMsafetyC@aol.com)
    17. 01:53 PM - Re: Piet building (Brian Kraut)
    18. 02:04 PM - Re: Piet building (AMsafetyC@aol.com)
    19. 03:14 PM - Re: Tapered Spar Scare (walt evans)
    20. 03:40 PM - Re: Piet building (carson)
    21. 03:57 PM - Re: Tapered Spar Scare (James)
    22. 05:17 PM - Spruce Alternatives (Gary Boothe)
    23. 05:27 PM - Re: Tapered Spar Scare (Don Emch)
    24. 05:50 PM - Re: Tapered Spar Scare (Glenn Thomas)
    25. 07:30 PM - Re: Spruce Alternatives (Owen Davies)
    26. 08:08 PM - Re: Spruce Alternatives (Clif Dawson)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 03:14:27 AM PST US
    From: "T White" <aa5flyer@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: Spruce Purchase
    Received my wood kit from ACS last month, same experience as Rick. ----- Original Message ----- From: Rick Holland To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 9:08 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase I bought the Pietenpol wood kit from ACS. The wood quality was excellent and provided all the wood I needed except for all ply, rib material, leading and trailing edges. My Piet is the long fuselage version. Rick On Wed, Feb 20, 2008 at 2:18 PM, Catdesigns <Catdesigns@comcast.net> wrote: <Catdesigns@comcast.net> Steve, I just ordered wood for my wings from Aircraft Spruce. From my review of the Pietenpol Air Camper spruce kit, it does not include material for the wing tip, leading edge or trailing edge of the wing. It also does not include the wing rib material. I'm not sure how well the kit matches up with the fuselage needs as I did not buy my fuselage wood from them. =BE-inch x 4 =BD-inch spars are used by BHP on the last plane he built and are use by many people. I was going to go with the 1-inch but decided to go with =BE-inch (for cost) and shims at the ribs. Per the plans, the wing ribs are made form 1/4-inch x 1/2-inch. You will need to order this separately. ACS has a note that says the ribs are built based on the HP of your engine. This is not true for the Pietenpol. This must be from the Grega plans. They also sell a Grega kit so make sure your looking at the right one. If you order from then have them send you a copy of the material in the kit and compare it to your own list of stuff. It is rather simple to sit down with the plans and get a ruff estimate of what you need. By the way don't forget about plywood. You will need some for both the wings and fuselage. Chris -------- Chris Tracy WestCoastPiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165261#165261 ========== br> -List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List ========== MS - k">http://forums.matronics.com ========== e - -Matt Dralle, List Admin. t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ========== -- Rick Holland ObjectAge Ltd. Castle Rock, Colorado


    Message 2


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    Time: 05:18:19 AM PST US
    From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe@calply.com>
    Subject: Re: Spruce Purchase
    Clif, I think I assumed that laminating was 'required' for structural reasons. If not, I probably would not go down that road. But it seems to me that I would have much better luck finding smaller pieces without flaws, and laminating for that reason. I'll have to think about your question of laminating for 'looks.' That may be something I would like... Gary -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Clif Dawson Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 9:22 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase Two questions. Are you laminating for looks,as in dark/light woods or for structural reasons? Or possibly you have some material that is too small you want to use up? Oops, that's three. :-) Clif ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe@calply.com> Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 7:36 PM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase > > Cliff, > > You're reading my mind. I am also interested in wood struts. Do you know > of > any guidelines for laminating the struts? > > Gary Boothe > Cool, CA > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Clif > Dawson > Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 7:22 PM > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase > > > Hemlock for everything done so far, fuse, tail feathers, > ribs and cabane struts. Close grain Fir for LG legs as > Hemlock isn't available in the proper size. I'm leaning > towards laminated fir for the spars. > > It's not generaly known that many Dehaviland Mosquito's > were built with both Doug Fir and Western Hemlock as > even then Spruce was in short supply. > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOhZEsIq85E&mode=related&search > > http://clifdawson.ca/Pientenpol.html > > Go to Tools+Tips-bottom of page-for charts on wood > strength. > > Clif > >> >> Has anyone utilized an alternate to Spruce. I know that Doug Fir is >> considered acceptable - heavier but stronger. AC43-13 allows that fir can >> be >> used at a lesser dimension, provided it is AC grade. Just curious.... >> >> Gary Boothe >> Cool, CA > > > -- > 8:45 PM > >


    Message 3


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    Time: 05:31:09 AM PST US
    From: AMsafetyC@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Tapered Spar Scare
    Truly words to live by, I am going to post this in my office for reference in dealing with the business world, I may even add a few: Words of reassurance and appearence: We don't want to disconcert the masses now do we son , Consoling a co worker following the meeting : you're a good looser and I like good looser's. I bet you've had a lot of practice. Exercising creativity and improvising solutions: The lake Axle, the Lake Humility: No I cant say that I'm the best pilot in the world Scooter, I would have to say Earnst Kessler the German flying Ace is the best, I'm the second best pilot in the world Exploring options: Will it do an outside loop? John In a message dated 2/20/2008 11:00:35 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, jhofmann@reesgroupinc.com writes: --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: John Hofmann <jhofmann@reesgroupinc.com> John R, Now you've got the spirit! All of life's problems can be solved through "The Great Waldo Pepper." Greet Strangers: "Hello Good People!" Protect Wimminfolk: "He's a Four-Flusher Mary Beth." Learn about culture: "Duke, into the opera singer costume" Become a new entrepreneur: "You take this to the gas station every time I need it and at the end of the day I'll give you a free ride." Lessons in advertising: "I knew she wasn't worth top billing." Learn about sharing: "Nebraska is mine!" Return from a business trip: "Look who's home." Advanced aircraft design: "It's gonna be a monoplane." ALL of life's questions and problems solved. -john- John Hofmann Vice-President, Information Technology The Rees Group, Inc. 2810 Crossroads Drive, Ste 3800 Madison, WI 53718 Phone: 608.443.2468 ext 150 Fax: 608.443.2474 Email: jhofmann@reesgroupinc.com On Feb 20, 2008, at 9:00 PM, AmsafetyC@aol.com wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: AmsafetyC@aol.com > > Ezra. Its not a biplane! > > John > Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry > > -----Original Message----- > From: John Hofmann <jhofmann@reesgroupinc.com> > > Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 10:22:29 > To:pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Tapered Spar Scare > > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: John Hofmann <jhofmann@reesgroupinc.com > > > > A one inch spar failing in compression from a bevel? > Brown Gravy? > "The IT Girl of the Sky?" > > It must be time to level this discussion with a quote: > > "I Haven't had an unlimited budget you know. It's not going to look > look like something out of a museum, all clean and dusted. I'm a > designer and I don't give a d@nm about clean. That's what's so unique > about this plane, the design. Concentrate on that. The Design. Well, > there it is, the Stiles Skystreak." > > -Ezra Stiles- > > You may now return to serious Pietenpol discussion. > > -john (the idiot)- > > Do Not Archive > > **************Ideas to please picky eaters. Watch video on AOL Living. (http://living.aol.com/video/how-to-please-your-picky-eater/rachel-campos-duffy/ 2050827?NCID=aolcmp00300000002598)


    Message 4


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    Time: 05:43:36 AM PST US
    From: AMsafetyC@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Spruce Purchase
    Gary, I have not had any problems meeting the specs, the only problem so far is trying to find the best of the stack for my Piet, The only thing I have encountered so far is that straight board once ripped, the rips can change shape and twist, but that only happened in one piece of stock the rest has had a nice straight consistent grain with few knots and nice growth ring pattern. I an still working with my initial stock purchase of poplar which I spent $89.00 and have all my structural pieces complete in addition to the turtle deck and still have some left. I just really love working with it. the coloration differences are perplexing in that it changes along a board or inside of rip can take on a green color. I have not noticed any weakness or changes in strength, ply ability or bonding capability. I think its a great alternative to the more expensive woods, sitka spruce and with a minimal penalty in weight it matches up really good in the wood charts as an alternative. John In a message dated 2/20/2008 10:43:01 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, gboothe@calply.com writes: --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe@calply.com> John, Just wondering, are you finding it difficult to find poplar that fits the grain description in 43.13? Gary Boothe Cool, CA -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of AmsafetyC@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 6:39 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase I am using poplar in my build and rather pleased with it from all aspects. Except of course my newly acquired allergic reaction to it. Just my luck it takes a few days of misery to get past the love of the build All in all poplar is amazing stuff to work with strong, stable, readily available fro the local wood guy and a lot less expensive. Has all the makings of perfect. John Recine Lititz pa Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe@calply.com> To:<pietenpol-list@matronics.com> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase Has anyone utilized an alternate to Spruce. I know that Doug Fir is considered acceptable - heavier but stronger. AC43-13 allows that fir can be used at a lesser dimension, provided it is AC grade. Just curious.... Gary Boothe Cool, CA -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Catdesigns Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 1:30 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase Just noticed I made a mistake in my previous email. My spars are are 3/4-inch by 4 3/4-inch. Also, shipping from Corona to Sacramento, $110 (estimated by them). I cant drive down there for less then $110. Frequently I get hit with $15 to $20 shipping on small boxes so this sounded good to me. Chris -------- Chris Tracy WestCoastPiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165264#165264 **************Ideas to please picky eaters. Watch video on AOL Living. (http://living.aol.com/video/how-to-please-your-picky-eater/rachel-campos-duffy/ 2050827?NCID=aolcmp00300000002598)


    Message 5


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    Time: 06:07:57 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 54 Msgs - 02/20/08
    From: tbyh@aol.com
    I saw a reference to the WW2 DeHavilland Mosquito - my favorite plane of all time. (I sometimes dream of=C2-building a 2/3- scale Mosquito using a pai r of Jaguar V-12 engines...but that's another story!) Yes, the 400+ mph Mosquitos were built of a plywood/balsa/plywood sandwich - - and I am proud to say that the plywood came from the Roddis Veneer Company in Marshfield, Wisconsin. This=C2-company continues in business today as Marshfield Door Systems. During WW2 Roddis also supplied=C2-plywood for us e in the Avro Anson twin-engine training plane and for other uses including the floor in the WW2 Waco assault gliders and=C2-for building PT boats. There is currently a traveling display touring the country that is called "W isconsin's Flying Trees." It tells the story of the plywood industry's contr ibution to the WW2 war effort. Through March 19, 2008,=C2-it=C2-is at the Silent Wings Museum in Lubboc k, Texas. Here is the schedule for the rest of the year: April 1 =93 June 30, 2008 Yanks Aviation Museum =C2-Chino, California July 1 =93 September, 2008 National WWII Museum, New Orleans October =93 December, 2008 Wisconsin Veterans=99 Museum Madison, WI May, 2009 Deke Slayton Museum Sparta, WI I haven't seen the display yet, but I hear that it is terrific. If you live near Lubbock, Chino, New Orleans or in Wisconsin, be sure to=C2-check out this display. Will make you proud to be building a Pietenpol using wood! The exhibit is sponsored by the Hamilton Roddis Foundation through the Camp 5 L ogging Museum in Laona, Wis. For more information, check these sites:=C2- http://www.chipsandsawdust.com/articles/rodply_article.html http://www.ci.lubbock.tx.us/newsPage.aspx?ID=2361 Meanwhile, here on Wisconsin's "west coast" I got my=C2-Piet's motor mount s (Model A Ford) installed earlier this week! Thanks to Ken Perkins for the gorgeous welded steel=C2-parts! And the=C2-white ash proved to me that I need a bigger, more powerful table saw. Guess that's why they make baseball bats and hockey sticks out of white ash! =C2- Best regards to all, Fred Beseler La Crosse, WI=C2- -----Original Message----- ________________________________________________________________________ aol.com


    Message 6


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    Time: 07:31:59 AM PST US
    Subject: off topic - Mosquito
    From: "Bill Church" <eng@canadianrogers.com>
    For fans of the graceful, wooden DeHavilland Mosquito, recently referred to in a couple of postings to the list, here's a link that may be of interest: http://www.virtualmuseum.ca/pm.php?id=record_detail&fl=0&lg=English &ex=0 0000192 (photo 111 of 225 is ... interesting.) I've long been a fan of this aircraft, having had a model of one (built by my Dad) hung below the ceiling light in my room as a child. Bill C. do not archive


    Message 7


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    Time: 07:35:55 AM PST US
    From: John Hofmann <jhofmann@reesgroupinc.com>
    Subject: Re: Tapered Spar Scare
    Excellent my friend! Don't forget the salute to the Yankee work ethic: "That don't seem right. Shootin' down Americans, that don't make a man a hero to me. An honest days work, not that's what I call special." Now get back to building. I, for one, am off to North Carolina today to visit Jack Phillips and to check out my new addition to the family in the form of a J-3. It ain't a Piet but it will be at Brodhead. -john- John Hofmann Vice-President, Information Technology The Rees Group, Inc. 2810 Crossroads Drive, Ste 3800 Madison, WI 53718 Phone: 608.443.2468 ext 150 Fax: 608.443.2474 Email: jhofmann@reesgroupinc.com On Feb 21, 2008, at 7:27 AM, AMsafetyC@aol.com wrote: > Truly words to live by, I am going to post this in my office for > reference in dealing with the business world, I may even add a few: > > Words of reassurance and appearence: We don't want to disconcert the > masses now do we son , > > Consoling a co worker following the meeting : you're a good looser > and I like good looser's. I bet you've had a lot of practice. > > Exercising creativity and improvising solutions: The lake Axle, the > Lake > > Humility: No I cant say that I'm the best pilot in the world > Scooter, I would have to say Earnst Kessler the German flying Ace > is the best, I'm the second best pilot in the world > > Exploring options: Will it do an outside loop? > > John > > > In a message dated 2/20/2008 11:00:35 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, jhofmann@reesgroupinc.com > writes: > > > > John R, > > Now you've got the spirit! All of life's problems can be solved > through "The Great Waldo Pepper." > > Greet Strangers: "Hello Good People!" > > Protect Wimminfolk: "He's a Four-Flusher Mary Beth." > > Learn about culture: "Duke, into the opera singer costume" > > Become a new entrepreneur: "You take this to the gas station every > time I need it and at the end of the day I'll give you a free ride." > > Lessons in advertising: "I knew she wasn't worth top billing." > > Learn about sharing: "Nebraska is mine!" > > Return from a business trip: "Look who's home." > > Advanced aircraft design: "It's gonna be a monoplane." > > ALL of life's questions and problems solved. > > -john- > > John Hofmann > Vice-President, Information Technology > The Rees Group, Inc. > 2810 Crossroads Drive, Ste 3800 > Madison, WI 53718 > Phone: 608.443.2468 ext 150 > Fax: 608.443.2474 > Email: jhofmann@reesgroupinc.com > > On Feb 20, 2008, at 9:00 PM, AmsafetyC@aol.com wrote: > > > > > Ezra. Its not a biplane! > > > > John > > Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: John Hofmann <jhofmann@reesgroupinc.com> > > > > Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 10:22:29 > > To:pietenpol-list@matronics.com > > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Tapered Spar Scare > > > > > > > > > > > A one inch spar failing in compression from a bevel? > > Brown Gravy? > > "The IT Girl of the Sky?" > > > > It must be time to level this discussion with a quote: > > > > "I Haven't had an unlimited budget you know. It's not going to look > > look like something out of a museum, all clean and dusted. I'm a > > designer and I don't give a d@nm about clean. That's what's so > unique > > about this plane, the design. Concentrate on that. The Design. Well, > > there it is, the Stiles Skystreak." > > > > -Ezra Stiles- > > > > You may now return to serious Pietenpol discussion. > > > > -john (the idiot)- > > > > Do Not Archive > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Delicious ideas to please the pickiest eaters. Watch the video on > AOL Living. > >


    Message 8


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    Time: 07:50:11 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Spruce Purchase
    From: MaxHegler <MaxHegler@msn.com>
    Poplar is also rot and insect resistant like cedar and cypress. My house, built in 1875 has never had any exterior or interior boards replaced until I cut out an opening for a door. The wood still had a green tint where I cut it. Good stuff! Max On 2/21/08 7:40 AM, "AMsafetyC@aol.com" <AMsafetyC@aol.com> wrote: > Gary, > > I have not had any problems meeting the specs, the only problem so far is > trying to find the best of the stack for my Piet, The only thing I have > encountered so far is that straight board once ripped, the rips can change > shape and twist, but that only happened in one piece of stock the rest has had > a nice straight consistent grain with few knots and nice growth ring pattern. > I an still working with my initial stock purchase of poplar which I spent > $89.00 and have all my structural pieces complete in addition to the turtle > deck and still have some left. > > I just really love working with it. the coloration differences are perplexing > in that it changes along a board or inside of rip can take on a green color. I > have not noticed any weakness or changes in strength, ply ability or bonding > capability. I think its a great alternative to the more expensive woods, sitka > spruce and with a minimal penalty in weight it matches up really good in the > wood charts as an alternative. > > John > > In a message dated 2/20/2008 10:43:01 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > gboothe@calply.com writes: >> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe@calply.com> >> >> John, >> >> Just wondering, are you finding it difficult to find poplar that fits the >> grain description in 43.13? >> >> Gary Boothe >> Cool, CA >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com >> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of >> AmsafetyC@aol.com >> Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 6:39 PM >> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase >> >> >> I am using poplar in my build and rather pleased with it from all aspects. >> Except of course my newly acquired allergic reaction to it. Just my luck it >> takes a few days of misery to get past the love of the build >> >> All in all poplar is amazing stuff to work with strong, stable, readily >> available fro the local wood guy and a lot less expensive. Has all the >> makings of perfect. >> >> John Recine >> Lititz pa >> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe@calply.com> >> >> Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 17:43:03 >> To:<pietenpol-list@matronics.com> >> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase >> >> >> >> Has anyone utilized an alternate to Spruce. I know that Doug Fir is >> considered acceptable - heavier but stronger. AC43-13 allows that fir can be >> used at a lesser dimension, provided it is AC grade. Just curious.... >> >> Gary Boothe >> Cool, CA >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com >> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Catdesigns >> Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 1:30 PM >> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase >> >> >> Just noticed I made a mistake in my previous email. My spars are are >> 3/4-inch by 4 3/4-inch. >> >> Also, shipping from Corona to Sacramento, $110 (estimated by them). I >> cant drive down there for less then $110. Frequently I get hit with $15 to >> $20 shipping on small boxes so this sounded good to me. >> >> Chris >> >> -------- >> Chris Tracy >> WestCoastPiet.com >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165264#165264 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Delicious ideas to please the pickiest eaters. Watch the video on AOL Living. >> <http://living.aol.com/video/how-to-please-your-picky-eater/rachel-campos-duf >> fy/2050827?NCID=aolcmp00300000002598> >> >> >> >>


    Message 9


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    Time: 08:40:51 AM PST US
    From: "Rick Holland" <at7000ft@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: Spruce Purchase
    Talking about cedar, have seen several Piet rib sets build of cedar including a set for sale at Broadhead. Rick On Thu, Feb 21, 2008 at 8:47 AM, MaxHegler <MaxHegler@msn.com> wrote: > Poplar is also rot and insect resistant like cedar and cypress. My > house, built in 1875 has never had any exterior or interior boards replaced > until I cut out an opening for a door. The wood still had a green tint > where I cut it. Good stuff! > > Max > > > On 2/21/08 7:40 AM, "AMsafetyC@aol.com" <AMsafetyC@aol.com> wrote: > > Gary, > > I have not had any problems meeting the specs, the only problem so far is > trying to find the best of the stack for my Piet, The only thing I have > encountered so far is that straight board once ripped, the rips can change > shape and twist, but that only happened in one piece of stock the rest has > had a nice straight consistent grain with few knots and nice growth ring > pattern. I an still working with my initial stock purchase of poplar which I > spent $8900 and have all my structural pieces complete in addition to the > turtle deck and still have some left. > > > I just really love working with it. the coloration differences are > perplexing in that it changes along a board or inside of rip can take on a > green color. I have not noticed any weakness or changes in strength, ply > ability or bonding capability. I think its a great alternative to the more > expensive woods, sitka spruce and with a minimal penalty in weight it > matches up really good in the wood charts as an alternative. > > John > > In a message dated 2/20/2008 10:43:01 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > gboothe@calply.com writes: > > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe@calply.com> > > John, > > Just wondering, are you finding it difficult to find poplar that fits the > grain description in 43.13? > > Gary Boothe > Cool, CA > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]<owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com%5D> On Behalf Of > AmsafetyC@aol.com > Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 6:39 PM > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase > > > I am using poplar in my build and rather pleased with it from all > aspects. > Except of course my newly acquired allergic reaction to it. Just my luck > it > takes a few days of misery to get past the love of the build > > All in all poplar is amazing stuff to work with strong, stable, readily > available fro the local wood guy and a lot less expensive. Has all the > makings of perfect. > > John Recine > Lititz pa > Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe@calply.com> > > Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 17:43:03 > To:<pietenpol-list@matronics.com> > Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase > > > > Has anyone utilized an alternate to Spruce. I know that Doug Fir is > considered acceptable - heavier but stronger. AC43-13 allows that fir can > be > used at a lesser dimension, provided it is AC grade. Just curious.... > > Gary Boothe > Cool, CA > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]<owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com%5D> On Behalf Of Catdesigns > Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 1:30 PM > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase > > Catdesigns@comcast.net> > > Just noticed I made a mistake in my previous email. My spars are are > 3/4-inch by 4 3/4-inch. > > Also, shipping from Corona to Sacramento, $110 (estimated by them). I > cant drive down there for less then $110. Frequently I get hit with $15 > to > $20 shipping on small boxes so this sounded good to me. > > Chris > > -------- > Chris Tracy > WestCoastPiet.com > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165264#165264 > > > ------------------------------ > Delicious ideas to please the pickiest eaters. Watch the video on AOL > Living. > <http://living.aol.com/video/how-to-please-your-picky-eater/rachel-campos-duffy/2050827?NCID=aolcmp00300000002598><http://living.aol.com/video/how-to-please-your-picky-eater/rachel-campos-duffy/2050827?NCID=aolcmp00300000002598> > * > > ist Email Forum - > l-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > ; - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - > matronics.com > ;- List Contribution Web Site - > ; -Matt Dralle, List Admin. > ://www.matronics.com/contribution > > ** > * > > * > > * > > -- Rick Holland ObjectAge Ltd. Castle Rock, Colorado


    Message 10


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    Time: 11:20:23 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Piet - GN! differences
    From: "jimd" <jlducey@hotmail.com>
    There is a brief discussion of the differences on the www.westcoastpiet.com site. Also it is a great place to look around at both Grega's and Pietenpol's in various stages of construction. The Grega's have GN-1 listed by the names. (Most the really neat stuff is under photos.) Jim Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165429#165429


    Message 11


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    Time: 12:20:45 PM PST US
    From: "KMHeide, BA, CPO, FAAOP" <kmheidecpo@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: Piet building
    John, and other pieters.... I called the magazine company (EAA) and they said they would send me a copy at no charge. I say give them a call and see if they can send you a copy.. Ken AmsafetyC@aol.com wrote: Dick That must be a common builders thing I too have some piet pics hanging in my shop for inspitation. I have not seen your cover shot, I don't get the mag I am certain they would be disapointing after seeing your build in Broadhead this past year. Certainly an impressive piece of work and a great build an inspiration to us all. John Recine Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: "Dick Navratil" To: Subject: Pietenpol-List: Piet building Again, thanks to all on the comments on my new plane. I would like to remind everyone to go back to the Sport Aviation 1999 issue with the P-51 on the cover. The pics there of Mike Cuy's Piet still are posted in my hangar. Jack Phillips and Larry Williams also had nice spreads in the past. Mike Cuy and Chuck Ganzer both have nice videos on building and flying the Piet. While building watching these videos can be a great source of inspiration. For all new builders, try to set aside time to make it to Brodhead, Wi. for the Piet fly in. It happens just before OSH and you get to meet lots of the people on this list. Kenneth M. Heide, BA, CPO, FAAOP "Once you have flown, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, there you long to return, to break the surly bonds of earth and touch the face of God!" -da Vinci/John Gillespie Magee --------------------------------- Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.


    Message 12


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    Time: 12:26:19 PM PST US
    From: AMsafetyC@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Piet building
    Ken, ya got a phone number we can use? John In a message dated 2/21/2008 3:21:49 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, kmheidecpo@yahoo.com writes: John, and other pieters.... I called the magazine company (EAA) and they said they would send me a copy at no charge. I say give them a call and see if they can send you a copy.. Ken AmsafetyC@aol.com wrote: --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: AmsafetyC@aol.com Dick That must be a common builders thing I too have some piet pics hanging in my shop for inspitation. I have not seen your cover shot, I don't get the mag I am certain they would be disapointing after seeing your build in Broadhead this past year. Certainly an impressive piece of work and a great build an inspiration to us all. John Recine Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: "Dick Navratil" "Once you have flown, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, there you long to return, to break the surly bonds of earth and touch the face of God!" -da Vinci/John Gillespie Magee ____________________________________ Be a better friend, newshound, and (http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List) (http://www.matronics.com/contribution) **************Ideas to please picky eaters. Watch video on AOL Living. (http://living.aol.com/video/how-to-please-your-picky-eater/rachel-campos-duffy/ 2050827?NCID=aolcmp00300000002598)


    Message 13


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    Time: 12:40:23 PM PST US
    From: "KMHeide, BA, CPO, FAAOP" <kmheidecpo@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: Piet building
    John, Here is the number I called and she is sending me the magazine. Sport Aviation Magazine Email :: 920-426-6516 Ken AMsafetyC@aol.com wrote: Ken, ya got a phone number we can use? John In a message dated 2/21/2008 3:21:49 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, kmheidecpo@yahoo.com writes: John, and other pieters.... I called the magazine company (EAA) and they said they would send me a copy at no charge. I say give them a call and see if they can send you a copy.. Ken AmsafetyC@aol.com wrote: Dick That must be a common builders thing I too have some piet pics hanging in my shop for inspitation. I have not seen your cover shot, I don't get the mag I am certain they would be disapointing after seeing your build in Broadhead this past year. Certainly an impressive piece of work and a great build an inspiration to us all. John Recine Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: "Dick Navratil" "Once you have flown, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, there you long to return, to break the surly bonds of earth and touch the face of God!" -da Vinci/John Gillespie Magee --------------------------------- Be a better friend, newshound, and href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matron.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com ://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution --------------------------------- Delicious ideas to please the pickiest eaters. Watch the video on AOL Living. Kenneth M. Heide, BA, CPO, FAAOP "Once you have flown, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, there you long to return, to break the surly bonds of earth and touch the face of God!" -da Vinci/John Gillespie Magee --------------------------------- Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.


    Message 14


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    Time: 01:35:15 PM PST US
    From: "KMHeide, BA, CPO, FAAOP" <kmheidecpo@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Question
    Fellow Pieters: Does fiberglass deteriorate in gas after time? Specifically a fiberglass rod such as a driveway marker? Ken H --------------------------------- Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.


    Message 15


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    Time: 01:36:15 PM PST US
    From: "Perry Rhoads" <prhoads61@frontiernet.net>
    Subject: Re: Spruce Purchase
    . With all the discussion on purchasing wood and wood kits, does anyone have experience with Western Aircraft supply in Canada. They seem to be very knowledgeable on Pietenpol's and it sounds like a very complete kit. Naturally, the shipping to me here in the Midwest is an issue. Any expereriences with them? Perry Rhoads Illinois ----- Original Message ----- From: Ryan Mueller To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 3:48 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Spruce Purchase There is an Excel spreadsheet wood list for the extended fuselage which is posted on Mykitplane: http://www.mykitplane.com/Planes/filesList2.cfm?AlbumID=4 Maybe someone with a bit more experience could take a look and see if it seems correct. It is very handy for estimating cost, as you can just plug the current prices in and it will recalculate. Ryan HelsperSew@aol.com wrote: Steve, I would definitely NOT buy my spruce from the lumber list provided by ACS. You are best to develop your own lumber list. BTW , ACS has their "bargain bag of spruce" which is a very good buy. I actually bought two of these before I was finished with my wood work. You can make many parts out of the pieces that they send you, especially if you have a planer. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL.


    Message 16


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    Time: 01:45:42 PM PST US
    From: AMsafetyC@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Question
    Ken, In the old days anything would deteriorate in gasoline in time, nowadays with the alcohol component and the new gasoline formulations is shelf life is about 30 days I am told I would doubt that after 45 days its not even gasoline anymore. I would run a trial and see what you get. I suspect the worst would be the varnish and gunk which may be more of the fuel than the fiber glass. You can go to the post manufacturer and request an MSDS to see what it is not compatable. That too will give you some good info and quickly. John In a message dated 2/21/2008 4:35:59 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, kmheidecpo@yahoo.com writes: Fellow Pieters: Does fiberglass deteriorate in gas after time? Specifically a fiberglass rod such as a driveway marker? Ken H ____________________________________ Be a better friend, newshound, and (http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List) (http://www.matronics.com/contribution) **************Ideas to please picky eaters. Watch video on AOL Living. (http://living.aol.com/video/how-to-please-your-picky-eater/rachel-campos-duffy/ 2050827?NCID=aolcmp00300000002598)


    Message 17


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    Time: 01:53:28 PM PST US
    From: "Brian Kraut" <brian.kraut@engalt.com>
    Subject: Piet building
    Most magazines, and I believe SA also, will sell high quality prints of any pictures that have been in their magazine for a pretty reasonable price and in various different sizes. Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of KMHeide, BA, CPO, FAAOP Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2008 3:18 PM To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Piet building John, and other pieters.... I called the magazine company (EAA) and they said they would send me a copy at no charge. I say give them a call and see if they can send you a copy.. Ken AmsafetyC@aol.com wrote: Dick That must be a common builders thing I too have some piet pics hanging in my shop for inspitation. I have not seen your cover shot, I don't get the mag I am certain they would be disapointing after seeing your build in Broadhead this past year. Certainly an impressive piece of work and a great build an inspiration to us all. John Recine Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: "Dick Navratil" "Once you have flown, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, there you long to return, to break the surly bonds of earth and touch the face of God!" -da Vinci/John Gillespie Magee ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Be a better friend, newshound, and


    Message 18


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    Time: 02:04:22 PM PST US
    From: AMsafetyC@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Piet building
    I called and spoke with Mary Jones, my copy is in the mail, thanks to Ken. I told her about the impact, she was surprised to hear from me the second Pieter this week. She also took the time to tell me she was sending a new membership kit in case I was interested in renewing my expired membership. Naturally that's gonna happen just haven't gotten to it in the past John In a message dated 2/21/2008 4:55:09 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, brian.kraut@engalt.com writes: Most magazines, and I believe SA also, will sell high quality prints of any pictures that have been in their magazine for a pretty reasonable price and in various different sizes. Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of KMHeide, BA, CPO, FAAOP Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2008 3:18 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Piet building John, and other pieters.... I called the magazine company (EAA) and they said they would send me a copy at no charge. I say give them a call and see if they can send you a copy.. Ken AmsafetyC@aol.com wrote: --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: AmsafetyC@aol.com Dick That must be a common builders thing I too have some piet pics hanging in my shop for inspitation. I have not seen your cover shot, I don't get the mag I am certain they would be disapointing after seeing your build in Broadhead this past year. Certainly an impressive piece of work and a great build an inspiration to us all. John Recine Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: "Dick Navratil" "Once you have flown, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, there you long to return, to break the surly bonds of earth and touch the face of God!" -da Vinci/John Gillespie Magee ____________________________________ Be a better friend, newshound, and href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c (http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List) (http://www.matronics.com/contribution) **************Ideas to please picky eaters. Watch video on AOL Living. (http://living.aol.com/video/how-to-please-your-picky-eater/rachel-campos-duffy/ 2050827?NCID=aolcmp00300000002598)


    Message 19


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    Time: 03:14:02 PM PST US
    From: "walt evans" <waltdak@verizon.net>
    Subject: Re: Tapered Spar Scare
    Dear Brown, If the rib is securely glued to the spar, the taper, in the calculation, disappears, I think. In my print, the fwd spar had a gusset that fit the flat spar, and the rear needed a small wedge to fill the void. If you build to the print, it's fine. Whew, in the last few weeks everyone is trying to reinvent the wheel,,,well in this case Bernard's prints. Build to the prints and you'll be fine Build to the prints and you'll be fine Build to the prints and you'll be fine walt evans NX140DL "No one ever learned anything by talking" Ben Franklin ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brown Gravy" <mjs.browngravy@yahoo.com> Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2008 11:48 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Tapered Spar Scare > <mjs.browngravy@yahoo.com> > > Hello Everybody > > It's been a long time since I've contributed anything to the list. I've > been reading the postings quietly, but recently the question of tapering > the top of the spars to match the profile of the wing section has bothered > me. I'm concerned that tapering the spars my lead to a concentration of > compression forces at the tip of the taper and result to failure of the > spar. Has anyone done an analysis of the tapered spars? > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165034#165034 > > >


    Message 20


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    Time: 03:40:08 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Piet building
    From: "carson" <carsonvella@yahoo.com.au>
    Hi Could one of you kind gentleman do me a favor and call and get me a copy sent out with a membership pack as well.It would be greatly appreciated. Address is Carson Vella 38 Bell Rd Glasshouse mountains Queensland 4518 Australia Thanks in advance Carson Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165485#165485


    Message 21


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    Time: 03:57:02 PM PST US
    From: "James" <jthursby@tampabay.rr.com>
    Subject: Tapered Spar Scare
    Build to the prints and you'll not fit in it? Jim -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of walt evans Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2008 6:11 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Tapered Spar Scare Dear Brown, If the rib is securely glued to the spar, the taper, in the calculation, disappears, I think. In my print, the fwd spar had a gusset that fit the flat spar, and the rear needed a small wedge to fill the void. If you build to the print, it's fine. Whew, in the last few weeks everyone is trying to reinvent the wheel,,,well in this case Bernard's prints. Build to the prints and you'll be fine Build to the prints and you'll be fine Build to the prints and you'll be fine walt evans NX140DL "No one ever learned anything by talking" Ben Franklin ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brown Gravy" <mjs.browngravy@yahoo.com> Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2008 11:48 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Tapered Spar Scare > <mjs.browngravy@yahoo.com> > > Hello Everybody > > It's been a long time since I've contributed anything to the list. > I've > been reading the postings quietly, but recently the question of tapering > the top of the spars to match the profile of the wing section has bothered > me. I'm concerned that tapering the spars my lead to a concentration of > compression forces at the tip of the taper and result to failure of the > spar. Has anyone done an analysis of the tapered spars? > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165034#165034 > > >


    Message 22


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    Time: 05:17:09 PM PST US
    From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5@comcast.net>
    Subject: Spruce Alternatives
    That's a great testimony, Max! In the last few days, 3 alternatives have been mentioned: Pine, Fir and Poplar. Is everyone who is using a Spruce alternative using Fir for the spars? Gary Boothe Cool, CA _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of MaxHegler Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2008 7:48 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase Poplar is also rot and insect resistant like cedar and cypress. My house, built in 1875 has never had any exterior or interior boards replaced until I cut out an opening for a door. The wood still had a green tint where I cut it. Good stuff! Max On 2/21/08 7:40 AM, "AMsafetyC@aol.com" <AMsafetyC@aol.com> wrote: Gary, I have not had any problems meeting the specs, the only problem so far is trying to find the best of the stack for my Piet, The only thing I have encountered so far is that straight board once ripped, the rips can change shape and twist, but that only happened in one piece of stock the rest has had a nice straight consistent grain with few knots and nice growth ring pattern. I an still working with my initial stock purchase of poplar which I spent $8900 and have all my structural pieces complete in addition to the turtle deck and still have some left. I just really love working with it. the coloration differences are perplexing in that it changes along a board or inside of rip can take on a green color. I have not noticed any weakness or changes in strength, ply ability or bonding capability. I think its a great alternative to the more expensive woods, sitka spruce and with a minimal penalty in weight it matches up really good in the wood charts as an alternative. John In a message dated 2/20/2008 10:43:01 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, gboothe@calply.com writes: --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe@calply.com> John, Just wondering, are you finding it difficult to find poplar that fits the grain description in 43.13? Gary Boothe Cool, CA -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] <mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com%5d> On Behalf Of AmsafetyC@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 6:39 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase I am using poplar in my build and rather pleased with it from all aspects. Except of course my newly acquired allergic reaction to it. Just my luck it takes a few days of misery to get past the love of the build All in all poplar is amazing stuff to work with strong, stable, readily available fro the local wood guy and a lot less expensive. Has all the makings of perfect. John Recine Lititz pa Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe@calply.com> To:<pietenpol-list@matronics.com> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase Has anyone utilized an alternate to Spruce. I know that Doug Fir is considered acceptable - heavier but stronger. AC43-13 allows that fir can be used at a lesser dimension, provided it is AC grade. Just curious.... Gary Boothe Cool, CA -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] <mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com%5d> On Behalf Of Catdesigns Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 1:30 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase Just noticed I made a mistake in my previous email. My spars are are 3/4-inch by 4 3/4-inch. Also, shipping from Corona to Sacramento, $110 (estimated by them). I cant drive down there for less then $110. Frequently I get hit with $15 to $20 shipping on small boxes so this sounded good to me. Chris -------- Chris Tracy WestCoastPiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165264#165264 _____ Delicious ideas to please the pickiest eaters. Watch the video on AOL Living. <http://living.aol.com/video/how-to-please-your-picky-eater/rachel-campos-du ffy/2050827?NCID=aolcmp00300000002598> <http://living.aol.com/video/how-to-please-your-picky-eater/rachel-campos-du ffy/2050827?NCID=aolcmp00300000002598> ist Email Forum - l-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List ; - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - matronics.com ;- List Contribution Web Site - ; -Matt Dralle, List Admin. ://www.matronics.com/contribution


    Message 23


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    Time: 05:27:48 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Tapered Spar Scare
    From: "Don Emch" <EmchAir@aol.com>
    Dear Walt, AMEN to that! Don Emch NX899DE Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165497#165497


    Message 24


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    Time: 05:50:08 PM PST US
    From: "Glenn Thomas" <glennthomas@flyingwood.com>
    Subject: Re: Tapered Spar Scare
    Testimonial.... I met Walt in NJ 2 summers ago. After showing me his plane he was kind and generous enough to take me for a ride. I am about 210lbs which he told me is lighter than some of his other passengers. The plane climbed nicely and we (at least I) had a GREAT time. That was all made possible by Walt's sticking to the plans and building one of the lightest Piets around... 595 lbs!!!! That was my best lesson in learning to resist temptations to reengineer the plans. At 210 I still had no problem in the front seat. I think if the Piet is too tight a squeeze for you it probably makes more sense to get yourself down to the right size than bring the Piet up to the wrong size. ...and the wing didn't break on that windy, bumpy day. On 2/21/08, walt evans <waltdak@verizon.net> wrote: > > Dear Brown, > If the rib is securely glued to the spar, the taper, in the calculation, > disappears, I think. > In my print, the fwd spar had a gusset that fit the flat spar, and the > rear > needed a small wedge to fill the void. If you build to the print, it's > fine. > > Whew, in the last few weeks everyone is trying to reinvent the > wheel,,,well in this case Bernard's prints. > Build to the prints and you'll be fine > Build to the prints and you'll be fine > Build to the prints and you'll be fine > > > walt evans > NX140DL > > "No one ever learned anything by talking" > Ben Franklin > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Brown Gravy" <mjs.browngravy@yahoo.com> > To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> > Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2008 11:48 AM > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Tapered Spar Scare > > > > <mjs.browngravy@yahoo.com> > > > > Hello Everybody > > > > It's been a long time since I've contributed anything to the list. I've > > been reading the postings quietly, but recently the question of tapering > > the top of the spars to match the profile of the wing section has > bothered > > me. I'm concerned that tapering the spars my lead to a concentration of > > compression forces at the tip of the taper and result to failure of the > > spar. Has anyone done an analysis of the tapered spars? > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165034#165034 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- Glenn Thomas Storrs, CT http://www.flyingwood.com


    Message 25


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    Time: 07:30:06 PM PST US
    From: Owen Davies <owen5819@comcast.net>
    Subject: Re: Spruce Alternatives
    Gary Boothe wrote: > > Thats a great testimony, Max! > > In the last few days, 3 alternatives have been mentioned: Pine, Fir > and Poplar. Is everyone who is using a Spruce alternative using Fir > for the spars? > Let's add the fourth alternative: plywood web. I haven't decided yet which to use. Not pine, but poplar would do well. One fellow I chatted with some years ago was using hemlock, and another planned to use Port Orford cedar. Both seemed reasonable choices. Owen


    Message 26


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    Time: 08:08:03 PM PST US
    From: Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca>
    Subject: Re: Spruce Alternatives
    Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce PurchaseFour. You forgot Hemlock. As per AC43.13-1B, strength "slightly exceeds Spruce. If I could get it in the necessary size I would use it for spars. It's all made into mill-work. Clif "If I had 8 hours to cut down a tree,,,I'd spend the first 6 sharpening the axe" ABE LINCOLN That's a great testimony, Max! In the last few days, 3 alternatives have been mentioned: Pine, Fir and Poplar. Is everyone who is using a Spruce alternative using Fir for the spars? Gary Boothe Cool, CA ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of MaxHegler Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2008 7:48 AM To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase Poplar is also rot and insect resistant like cedar and cypress. My house, built in 1875 has never had any exterior or interior boards replaced until I cut out an opening for a door. The wood still had a green tint where I cut it. Good stuff! Max On 2/21/08 7:40 AM, "AMsafetyC@aol.com" <AMsafetyC@aol.com> wrote: Gary, I have not had any problems meeting the specs, the only problem so far is trying to find the best of the stack for my Piet, The only thing I have encountered so far is that straight board once ripped, the rips can change shape and twist, but that only happened in one piece of stock the rest has had a nice straight consistent grain with few knots and nice growth ring pattern. I an still working with my initial stock purchase of poplar which I spent $8900 and have all my structural pieces complete in addition to the turtle deck and still have some left. I just really love working with it. the coloration differences are perplexing in that it changes along a board or inside of rip can take on a green color. I have not noticed any weakness or changes in strength, ply ability or bonding capability. I think its a great alternative to the more expensive woods, sitka spruce and with a minimal penalty in weight it matches up really good in the wood charts as an alternative. John In a message dated 2/20/2008 10:43:01 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, gboothe@calply.com writes: --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe@calply.com> John, Just wondering, are you finding it difficult to find poplar that fits the grain description in 43.13? Gary Boothe Cool, CA -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of AmsafetyC@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 6:39 PM To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase I am using poplar in my build and rather pleased with it from all aspects. Except of course my newly acquired allergic reaction to it. Just my luck it takes a few days of misery to get past the love of the build All in all poplar is amazing stuff to work with strong, stable, readily available fro the local wood guy and a lot less expensive. Has all the makings of perfect. John Recine Lititz pa Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe@calply.com> Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2008 17:43:03 To:<pietenpol-list@matronics.com> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase <gboothe@calply.com> Has anyone utilized an alternate to Spruce. I know that Doug Fir is considered acceptable - heavier but stronger. AC43-13 allows that fir can be used at a lesser dimension, provided it is AC grade. Just curious.... Gary Boothe Cool, CA -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Catdesigns Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2008 1:30 PM To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Spruce Purchase <Catdesigns@comcast.net> Just noticed I made a mistake in my previous email. My spars are are 3/4-inch by 4 3/4-inch. Also, shipping from Corona to Sacramento, $110 (estimated by them). I cant drive down there for less then $110. Frequently I get hit with $15 to $20 shipping on small boxes so this sounded good to me. Chris -------- Chris Tracy WestCoastPiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=165264#165264 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Delicious ideas to please the pickiest eaters. Watch the video on AOL Living. <http://living.aol.com/video/how-to-please-your-picky-eater/rachel-campos -duffy/2050827?NCID=aolcmp00300000002598> ist Email Forum - l-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List ; - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - matronics.com ;- List Contribution Web Site - ; -Matt Dralle, List Admin. ://www.matronics.com/contribution http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- 2/21/2008 4:09 PM




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