Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:17 AM - Re: A New Person (Phillips, Jack)
2. 04:18 AM - Re: 3' Center Section ()
3. 04:21 AM - Re: 3' Center Section (Phillips, Jack)
4. 05:21 AM - Re: 3' Center Section (Owen Davies)
5. 05:46 AM - Re: 3' Center Section (Ed G.)
6. 05:50 AM - Re: how to flare......Jack shows us how (Gary Boothe)
7. 06:38 AM - Re: 3' Center Section (Phillips, Jack)
8. 07:39 AM - Newbie gusset question (chase143)
9. 08:05 AM - Re: Windshield thickness (Jim Sury)
10. 08:51 AM - Re: Newbie gusset question (HelsperSew@aol.com)
11. 09:16 AM - Tail wire metal fittings (Michael Groah)
12. 09:25 AM - Re: Newbie gusset question (Phillips, Jack)
13. 09:35 AM - Re: Tail wire metal fittings (Phillips, Jack)
14. 10:37 AM - Re: Tail wire metal fittings ()
15. 10:45 AM - solid wire vs cables (Bill Church)
16. 11:25 AM - Re: Tail wire metal fittings (Michael Groah)
17. 11:36 AM - solid wire vs cables (Oscar Zuniga)
18. 12:12 PM - solid wire vs cables (santiago morete)
19. 12:33 PM - Re: Newbie gusset question (chase143)
20. 12:53 PM - flaperons (jeremy bramall)
21. 01:13 PM - Re: flaperons (Steve Eldredge)
22. 01:44 PM - Re: flaperons (DJ Vegh)
23. 01:53 PM - Re: solid wire vs cables (Bill Church)
24. 02:03 PM - Re: flaperons (Phillips, Jack)
25. 02:06 PM - Re: Tail wire metal fittings (Gene Rambo)
26. 02:14 PM - Re: solid wire vs cables (Gene Rambo)
27. 02:30 PM - landing a Piet with a strong headwind (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC])
28. 03:07 PM - Re: flaperons (Brian Kraut)
29. 03:11 PM - Re: landing a Piet with a strong headwind (Rick Holland)
30. 04:02 PM - Re: solid wire vs cables (Isablcorky@aol.com)
31. 05:08 PM - Re: Newbie gusset question (Glenn Thomas)
32. 11:47 PM - Re: solid wire vs cables (Clif Dawson)
Message 1
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Hi Jim,
I'm in Raleigh, NC. I keep the planes (Pietenpol and RV-4) at Cox Field
in Apex, NC - about 8 miles south of RDU Int'l airport. I'm currently
building an RV-10.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lagowski
Morrow
Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 8:25 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: A New Person
<jimdeb@charter.net>
Jack, many thanks for the speed info. I especially enjoued the gliding
discussion!
Where are you located?
You can call me Jim. My wife is Debbie Morrow
Jim Lagowski, NX221PT
----- Original Message -----
From: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips@cardinalhealth.com>
Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 10:40 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: A New Person
> <Jack.Phillips@cardinalhealth.com>
>
> I'm not sure what to call you. Is your name Morrow? Or Lagowski? Or
> J.M.?
>
> Anyway, welcome to the list!
>
> As for flying speeds, my Pietenpol is powered by a 65 hp Continental
> with a Sensenich prop and I used the following speeds:
>
> Takeoff 45 mph indicted
> Best Rte of Climb 55 mph indicated
> Best Angle of Climb 50 mph indicated
> Best Glide Anything above stall speed - just
> doesn't matter
> Approach 55 mph indicated
> Stall Speed 35 mph indicated
>
> As for the glide, as long as it is not stalled you can glide anywhere
> from 45 to 65 mph and the glide path doesn't change much. A
Pietenpol's
> glide characteristics are somewhere between those of a brick and a
> bowling ball. When you chop the throttle, toss out a brick and see
> where it is headed. That's where you will land. Once you are on the
> ground, duck to avoid getting hit by the brick.
>
> One caution I can give you - carry a little power in the approach, and
> hold it until just before touchdown. If you don't, when you begin to
> flair it will bleed off speed very rapidly and unless you time the
flair
> perfectly, you'll find yourself a couple of feet off the ground with
> near zero airspeed. Then you will wish you had more shock absorbing
> than the fat tires of a Fly Baby landing gear.
>
> Jack Phillips
> NX899JP
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Lagowski
> Morrow
> Sent: Sunday, March 23, 2008 3:41 PM
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: A New Person
>
> <jimdeb@charter.net>
>
> Let me introduce myself, a new person on the list-Jim Lagowski. a
> Pietenpol
> builder in N.W. Michigan near Traverse City. I have been working on
mine
> for
> almost 4 years and am now within 2-3 months of hearing engine noise.
> This is
> my 2nd plane, the first being an all-composite, 150mph, 2-place KIS
> which I
> sold in '06.
>
> My Piet. will use a 65hp Continental, hydraulic brakes, gas tank
behind
> the
> firewall, 3 piece wing and at least initally a metal prop that came
with
> the
> engine. This will help I think with weight and balance compared to a
> wood
> prop and Model A engine. We'll see. The color scheme is ivory with
green
>
> trim, including scollops on the wings and vertical and horizontal
> stabilizers. landing gear is like the Fly Baby, with no springs or
> bungees.
> Just fat soft tires. My cabanes and landing gear Vees are laminated
ash.
> I
> still have to cover the fuselage and then paint, and then reinstall
the
> engine and make the engine cowlings. The tail pieces are done and
> painted
> and the wings will be finish painted this coming week
>
> My goal is to make Broadhead and Oshkosh this year.
>
> I would be interested in hearing from you flyers what your experience
> has
> been with speeds for planning purposes, such as cruise, stall, in the
> pattern, on final etc. It is time to start outlining my test program.
> Since
> I have a certified engine and prop I will only have to fly 25 hours
> before
> taking passengers and leaving the local area. Thanks for your help!
>
>
> _________________________________________________
>
> or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error,
please
> notify the sender
>
> Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese -
Nederlands -
> Norsk - Portuguese
>
>
>
_________________________________________________
or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please notify
the sender
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - Norsk
- Portuguese
Message 2
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| Subject: | 3' Center Section |
I have a picture on my home computer of a Jenny covered in mylar.Neat
looking.I also seen a picture once of a plane that was covered in some
kind of covering but painted to make it look like the covering was
peeling back and you could see the inside of the wings and fuzy It
looked pretty weird at first.It looked as if it was peeling from either
speed or wear.The painting was air brushed on.I think it was a
P51.Really great stuff.
Do not archive
________________________________
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
jimboyer@hughes.net
Sent: March 24, 2008 5:45 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: 3' Center Section
Hi Jack,
The woodwork on your Piet is beautiful. I really like the fine way you
did the scallops on the turtle deck and also at the tail surface rib
attachment point.
Great looking; too bad you can't just fly it with transparent mylar
covering.
Thanks for the photo,
Jim
Do not archive
Message 3
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| Subject: | 3' Center Section |
The extra 6" of span my centersection added just about cancelled the area I lost
by adding a circular cutout to the centersection. But I don't think a little
more wing area could possibly hurt, and it certainly would help the climb rate.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Recine
Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 11:12 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 3' Center Section
Just curious as to how that may impact the wing loading especially since it increases
overall square footage of wing surface
Has anyone done the calculations?
Or is it an even tradeoff?
John
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: "Dick Navratil" <horzpool@goldengate.net>
To:<pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 3' Center Section
Me too. I have a 37" center section and I copied Jack's cut out for radios. I made
my wings to plan.
Dick N.
----- Original Message -----
From: Gary
Boothe <mailto:gboothe5@comcast.net>
Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 10:58 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: 3' Center Section
So far I have come up with Bill Rewey, Jack Phillips and Roman Bukolt. There may
be more, but that's all I know of for now. The pro's seem to all be about increasing
the center section tank size, primarily. Size range from 30", 36" and
48".
Does anyone care to express any concerns or cautions?
Gary Boothe
Cool, CA
WW Conversion 90% done,
Working on Tail Group
----------------
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Holland
Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 8:45 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 3' Center Section
Bill Rewey's Piet has that setup and has been flying for at least a decade.
Rick
On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 7:17 PM, Gary Boothe <gboothe5@comcast.net <mailto:gboothe5@comcast.net> > wrote:
Those who are increasing the center section to 3', are you diminishing the wings
by a like amount? Does anyone have a flying example of a 3 piece wing with a
3' center section?
Gary Boothe
Cool, CA
WW Conversion 90% done,
Working on Tail Group (and ribs)
----------------
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com <mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com <mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com> ] On Behalf Of Clif Dawson
Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2008 11:10 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 1st rib
That's just about where I am, started and finished the tailfeathers in 2000.
Now here it is, 2008 and 740 hours later. I'm working on my 3 ft center
section now. It's mounted but will be off again for tank fitting and installation,
ply covering, etc.
This thing sure does look different with it sitting up there!.I keep promising
myself I'll take pictures but I seem to spend that time making engine noises. :-)
Clif
"So many worlds, so much to do, so little done, such things to be." ~ Lord Alfred
Tennyson
----- Original Message -----
From: HelsperSew@aol.com <mailto:HelsperSew@aol.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2008 4:59 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 1st rib
Congratulations Gary!! Now you are on your way to a wonderful experience. I am
8 years and counting. Hopefully you will finish sooner.
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
----------------
Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
Home <http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?ncid=aolhom00030000000001> .href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List> ">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List> href="http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com> ">http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution <http://www.matronics.com/contribution> ">http://www.matronics.com/c <http://www.matronics.com/c>
----------------
3/22/2008 4:43 PMhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
--
Rick Holland
_________________________________________________
or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please notify
the sender
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - Norsk
- Portuguese
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: 3' Center Section |
harvey.rule@bell.ca wrote:
>
> I have a picture on my home computer of a Jenny covered in mylar.Neat
> looking.I also seen a picture once of a plane that was covered in some
> kind of covering but painted to make it look like the covering was
> peeling back and you could see the inside of the wings and fuzy It
> looked pretty weird at first.It looked as if it was peeling from
> either speed or wear.The painting was air brushed on.I think it was a
> P51.Really great stuff.
>
Did anyone here ever see Acme Duck & Airshow? It was a variation on the
flying farmer routine. The pilot's character was an airshow wannabe from
the stix. He flew a J-3 done up to look like it was covered in remnants
from someone's sewing basket.
Part-way through the act, in which the pilot kept interrupting in hope
of being allowed to perform, the announcer had everyone in the crowd
shout out what you need to make it in aerobatics: "Big bucks! Big
bucks!" A few minutes later, evidence suggested that the pilot might
have misunderstood. His wife, dressed as a magician's assistant, showed
up with a delivery from the Acme Duck Company.
Wonderful fun.
Owen
Message 5
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| Subject: | 3' Center Section |
Hi Jack...I had thought about putting my radio in the centersection of my
Piet a long time ago but decided that reaching up into the wind stream would
make it difficult if not impossible to change stations etc. My Piet is not
flying yet and I am still toying with the idea so I thought I would ask
someone with first hand experience if it is a problem or not. Sooo...Is the
wind a problem when adjusting your radio??? Will you be at Sun N Fun this
year???...Ed Grentzer West coast Fl.
>From: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips@cardinalhealth.com>
>To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: 3' Center Section
>Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 07:19:10 -0400
>
><Jack.Phillips@cardinalhealth.com>
>
>The extra 6" of span my centersection added just about cancelled the area I
>lost by adding a circular cutout to the centersection. But I don't think a
>little more wing area could possibly hurt, and it certainly would help the
>climb rate.
>
>Jack Phillips
>NX899JP
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Recine
>Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 11:12 PM
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 3' Center Section
>
><AmsafetyC@aol.com>
>
>Just curious as to how that may impact the wing loading especially since it
>increases overall square footage of wing surface
>
>Has anyone done the calculations?
>
>Or is it an even tradeoff?
>
>John
>Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: "Dick Navratil" <horzpool@goldengate.net>
>
>Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2008 21:52:02
>To:<pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 3' Center Section
>
>
>Me too. I have a 37" center section and I copied Jack's cut out for
>radios. I made my wings to plan.
>Dick N.
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Gary
> Boothe <mailto:gboothe5@comcast.net>
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com <mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 10:58 AM
>Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: 3' Center Section
>
>
>So far I have come up with Bill Rewey, Jack Phillips and Roman Bukolt.
>There may be more, but that's all I know of for now. The pro's seem to all
>be about increasing the center section tank size, primarily. Size range
>from 30", 36" and 48".
>
>Does anyone care to express any concerns or cautions?
>
>Gary Boothe
>Cool, CA
>WW Conversion 90% done,
>Working on Tail Group
>
>
>----------------
>
>From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick
>Holland
>Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 8:45 AM
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 3' Center Section
>
>Bill Rewey's Piet has that setup and has been flying for at least a decade.
>
>Rick
>
>On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 7:17 PM, Gary Boothe <gboothe5@comcast.net
><mailto:gboothe5@comcast.net> > wrote:
>
>
>Those who are increasing the center section to 3', are you diminishing the
>wings by a like amount? Does anyone have a flying example of a 3 piece wing
>with a 3' center section?
>
>Gary Boothe
>Cool, CA
>WW Conversion 90% done,
>Working on Tail Group (and ribs)
>
>
>----------------
>
>From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
><mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com>
>[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
><mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com> ] On Behalf Of Clif
>Dawson
>Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2008 11:10 PM
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com <mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 1st rib
>
>
>That's just about where I am, started and finished the tailfeathers in
>2000.
>
>Now here it is, 2008 and 740 hours later. I'm working on my 3 ft center
>
>section now. It's mounted but will be off again for tank fitting and
>installation,
>
>ply covering, etc.
>
>
>This thing sure does look different with it sitting up there!.I keep
>promising
>
>myself I'll take pictures but I seem to spend that time making engine
>noises. :-)
>
>
>Clif
>
>
>"So many worlds, so much to do, so little done, such things to be." ~ Lord
>Alfred Tennyson
>
>----- Original Message -----
>
>From: HelsperSew@aol.com <mailto:HelsperSew@aol.com>
>
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com <mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>
>Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2008 4:59 AM
>
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 1st rib
>
>
>Congratulations Gary!! Now you are on your way to a wonderful experience.
>I am 8 years and counting. Hopefully you will finish sooner.
>
>
>Dan Helsper
>Poplar Grove, IL.
>
>
>----------------
>
>Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
> Home
><http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?ncid=aolhom00030000000001>
>.href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
><http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>
>">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
><http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>
>href="http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>
>">http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>
>href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution
><http://www.matronics.com/contribution> ">http://www.matronics.com/c
><http://www.matronics.com/c>
>
>----------------
>
>3/22/2008 4:43 PMhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
><http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
>
>
>--
>Rick Holland
>
>
>_________________________________________________
>
>or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please
>notify the sender
>
>Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands -
>Norsk - Portuguese
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | how to flare......Jack shows us how |
The good news is, Mike probably not need a high speed lens.
Gary Boothe
Cool, CA
WW Conversion 90% done,
Working on Tail Group
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Phillips,
Jack
Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 12:06 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: how to flare......Jack shows us how
<Jack.Phillips@cardinalhealth.com>
Even a blind pig finds an acorn every now and then...
I've never seen that picture, Mike. Didn't know you shot that one.
Thanks,
Jack Phillips
NX899JP.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Cuy,
Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC]
Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 2:53 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: how to flare......Jack shows us how
Jack touching down enroute to Brodhead and Oshkosh, 2005 at Columbia
Station, Ohio.
Squeak, squeak.....rolllllllllllllto a stop, turn around..... Nice.
Very nice.
_________________________________________________
or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please
notify the sender
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands -
Norsk - Portuguese
Message 7
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| Subject: | 3' Center Section |
Hi Ed,
The wind is not really a problem when changing frequencies on the radio. The intercom
($20 on ebay) does not work well in the slipstream, though. I need to
replace it with an intercom made for a helicopter or an open cockpit airplane.
I won't be at SNF this year, but will fly the Pietenpol to Brodhead again. Maybe
next year for Lakeland.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ed G.
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 8:32 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: 3' Center Section
Hi Jack...I had thought about putting my radio in the centersection of my
Piet a long time ago but decided that reaching up into the wind stream would
make it difficult if not impossible to change stations etc. My Piet is not
flying yet and I am still toying with the idea so I thought I would ask
someone with first hand experience if it is a problem or not. Sooo...Is the
wind a problem when adjusting your radio??? Will you be at Sun N Fun this
year???...Ed Grentzer West coast Fl.
>From: "Phillips, Jack" <Jack.Phillips@cardinalhealth.com>
>To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: 3' Center Section
>Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 07:19:10 -0400
>
><Jack.Phillips@cardinalhealth.com>
>
>The extra 6" of span my centersection added just about cancelled the area I
>lost by adding a circular cutout to the centersection. But I don't think a
>little more wing area could possibly hurt, and it certainly would help the
>climb rate.
>
>Jack Phillips
>NX899JP
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Recine
>Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 11:12 PM
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 3' Center Section
>
><AmsafetyC@aol.com>
>
>Just curious as to how that may impact the wing loading especially since it
>increases overall square footage of wing surface
>
>Has anyone done the calculations?
>
>Or is it an even tradeoff?
>
>John
>Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: "Dick Navratil" <horzpool@goldengate.net>
>
>Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2008 21:52:02
>To:<pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 3' Center Section
>
>
>Me too. I have a 37" center section and I copied Jack's cut out for
>radios. I made my wings to plan.
>Dick N.
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Gary
> Boothe <mailto:gboothe5@comcast.net>
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com <mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 10:58 AM
>Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: 3' Center Section
>
>
>So far I have come up with Bill Rewey, Jack Phillips and Roman Bukolt.
>There may be more, but that's all I know of for now. The pro's seem to all
>be about increasing the center section tank size, primarily. Size range
>from 30", 36" and 48".
>
>Does anyone care to express any concerns or cautions?
>
>Gary Boothe
>Cool, CA
>WW Conversion 90% done,
>Working on Tail Group
>
>
>----------------
>
>From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick
>Holland
>Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 8:45 AM
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 3' Center Section
>
>Bill Rewey's Piet has that setup and has been flying for at least a decade.
>
>Rick
>
>On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 7:17 PM, Gary Boothe <gboothe5@comcast.net
><mailto:gboothe5@comcast.net> > wrote:
>
>
>Those who are increasing the center section to 3', are you diminishing the
>wings by a like amount? Does anyone have a flying example of a 3 piece wing
>with a 3' center section?
>
>Gary Boothe
>Cool, CA
>WW Conversion 90% done,
>Working on Tail Group (and ribs)
>
>
>----------------
>
>From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
><mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com>
>[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
><mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com> ] On Behalf Of Clif
>Dawson
>Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2008 11:10 PM
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com <mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 1st rib
>
>
>That's just about where I am, started and finished the tailfeathers in
>2000.
>
>Now here it is, 2008 and 740 hours later. I'm working on my 3 ft center
>
>section now. It's mounted but will be off again for tank fitting and
>installation,
>
>ply covering, etc.
>
>
>This thing sure does look different with it sitting up there!.I keep
>promising
>
>myself I'll take pictures but I seem to spend that time making engine
>noises. :-)
>
>
>Clif
>
>
>"So many worlds, so much to do, so little done, such things to be." ~ Lord
>Alfred Tennyson
>
>----- Original Message -----
>
>From: HelsperSew@aol.com <mailto:HelsperSew@aol.com>
>
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com <mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>
>Sent: Saturday, March 22, 2008 4:59 AM
>
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 1st rib
>
>
>Congratulations Gary!! Now you are on your way to a wonderful experience.
>I am 8 years and counting. Hopefully you will finish sooner.
>
>
>Dan Helsper
>Poplar Grove, IL.
>
>
>----------------
>
>Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
> Home
><http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?ncid=aolhom00030000000001>
>.href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
><http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>
>">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
><http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>
>href="http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>
>">http://forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>
>href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution
><http://www.matronics.com/contribution> ">http://www.matronics.com/c
><http://www.matronics.com/c>
>
>----------------
>
>3/22/2008 4:43 PMhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
><http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
>
>
>--
>Rick Holland
>
>
>_________________________________________________
>
>or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please
>notify the sender
>
>Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands -
>Norsk - Portuguese
>
>
_________________________________________________
or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please notify
the sender
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - Norsk
- Portuguese
Message 8
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| Subject: | Newbie gusset question |
I must have misinterpreted the grain orientation for the wing rib gussets. Only
after cutting out more than half of mine with horizontal outside grain, did I
realize Bingelis recommends vertical orientation for rib gussets. I don't mind
doing the right thing if it means ordering more 1/16 ply and redoing these,
but wanted to see if others felt this was necessary. Any recommendations? Thanks.
Steve C.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=172513#172513
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| Subject: | Re: Windshield thickness |
John go down to the local motorcycle shop and pick up a cracked motorcycle
windshield. Cost is reasonable and it will work just fine. Cut it down to
size and make the attach fittings. You can even get one that is tinted.
Just watch where the crack is.
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Franklin" <jbfjr@peoplepc.com>
Sent: Friday, March 21, 2008 6:36 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Windshield thickness
>
> I have "access" to a large sheet of either Plexiglass or Lexan, I don't
> know which, but it is only 0.078" thick...I think most of the builders are
> using 1/8", so is this stuff too thin to use for a windshield?
>
> John F.
> GN-1 / Corvair
> Richmond, TX
>
>
> ________________________________________
>
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Newbie gusset question |
Steve,
I never considered the grain orientation on the rib gussets either, so I
guess about 50% of mine are "wrong". I doubt very much if this is going to make
a hill of beans difference in the long run, but then again I haven't flown
behind it yet. I think I'll "chance" it.
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
**************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
Home.
(http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?ncid=aolhom00030000000001)
Message 11
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| Subject: | Tail wire metal fittings |
The plans show the tail wire fittings riveted to the tail with 3/16" rivets and
thus end up under the fabric with the tabs sticking through. I see that most
people seem to bolt them on top of the tail after fabric covering. Is there
anything wrong with, or any problems that could occur if i use 3/16" AD rivets
to rivet these fittings to the tail as in the plans? Why does everyone just
bolt them on? Is it just easier or is there a safety issue?
---------------------------------
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
Message 12
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| Subject: | Newbie gusset question |
I wouldn't worry about it. Grain runs different directions in each
layer of the plywood. Of far more importance is to lightly sand birch
plywood before gluing to remove the satin sheen on the surface. That
smooth surface is not a good surface for glue to bond with. Scuff it up
slightly before gluing.
Jack Phillips
Who couldn't tell you what direction the grain runs in my gussets.
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of chase143
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 10:36 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Newbie gusset question
I must have misinterpreted the grain orientation for the wing rib
gussets. Only after cutting out more than half of mine with horizontal
outside grain, did I realize Bingelis recommends vertical orientation
for rib gussets. I don't mind doing the right thing if it means ordering
more 1/16 ply and redoing these, but wanted to see if others felt this
was necessary. Any recommendations? Thanks.
Steve C.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=172513#172513
_________________________________________________
or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please notify
the sender
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - Norsk
- Portuguese
Message 13
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| Subject: | Tail wire metal fittings |
I don't think riveting them on is a good idea. I must confess, I don't
remember the plans showing them riveted but I wouldn't even consider
doing it that way. Rivets don't work well under tension and they swell
when driven. This swelling would tend to split the wood underneath,
where you can't see it. I think bolts are definitely the way to go.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael
Groah
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 12:13 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Tail wire metal fittings
The plans show the tail wire fittings riveted to the tail with 3/16"
rivets and thus end up under the fabric with the tabs sticking through.
I see that most people seem to bolt them on top of the tail after fabric
covering. Is there anything wrong with, or any problems that could
occur if i use 3/16" AD rivets to rivet these fittings to the tail as in
the plans? Why does everyone just bolt them on? Is it just easier or
is there a safety issue?
_________________________________________________
This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privilege
d, proprietary
or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please
notify the sender
immediately and delete the original. Any other use of the email by you is p
rohibited.
Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - N
orsk - Portuguese
Message 14
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| Subject: | Tail wire metal fittings |
Also as a foot note to that.Rivets tend to come loose with vibration.Now
this area may not take too much vibration but over time it could still
become a factor.I had a lot of rivets in my Lazair ultralight and they
would come loose in the weirdest plases.Places you wouldn't expect that
to happen.Just my two cents worth.
________________________________
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Phillips, Jack
Sent: March 25, 2008 12:27 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Tail wire metal fittings
I don't think riveting them on is a good idea. I must confess, I don't
remember the plans showing them riveted but I wouldn't even consider
doing it that way. Rivets don't work well under tension and they swell
when driven. This swelling would tend to split the wood underneath,
where you can't see it. I think bolts are definitely the way to go.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
________________________________
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael
Groah
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 12:13 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Tail wire metal fittings
The plans show the tail wire fittings riveted to the tail with 3/16"
rivets and thus end up under the fabric with the tabs sticking through.
I see that most people seem to bolt them on top of the tail after fabric
covering. Is there anything wrong with, or any problems that could
occur if i use 3/16" AD rivets to rivet these fittings to the tail as in
the plans? Why does everyone just bolt them on? Is it just easier or
is there a safety issue?
Message 15
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| Subject: | solid wire vs cables |
In the plans, the bracing wires for the empennage and for the drag and
anti-drag wires are shown as solid wire, or as described in the plans,
"hard wire". I realize that this was a common method in the old days,
and now almost everyone uses aircraft cable with nicopress fittings. But
using the hard wire results in a nice clean look, as seen on Ken
Perkins' award winner N34KP. Plus, it's authentic Pietenpol. I ran
across a photo and description on Mykitplane.com (Terry Bowden's photos)
that said the wires were formed using a jig that was described in an old
copy of the BPA newsletter. I'm curious as to what such a jig might look
like. So, here's my question:
Anyone out there have a copy of the old newsletter that described the
jig? Or sketches or photos of such a jig?
Bill C.
<http://www.ultraflightradio.com/byname/wynne-william.html>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Tail wire metal fittings |
Sounds good. I'll bolt them on. With them on top of the fabric it's also easier
to inspect them. I was leaning towards bolting but I thought I'd throw it out
since it's how the plans say to do it.
harvey.rule@bell.ca wrote: v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) }
Also as a foot note to that.Rivets tend to come loose with vibration.Now
this area may not take too much vibration but over time it could still become
a factor.I had a lot of rivets in my Lazair ultralight and they would come loose
in the weirdest plases.Places you wouldnt expect that to happen.Just my two
cents worth.
---------------------------------
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Phillips, Jack
Sent: March 25, 2008 12:27 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Tail wire metal fittings
I dont think riveting them on is a good idea. I must confess, I dont remember
the plans showing them riveted but I wouldnt even consider doing it that way.
Rivets dont work well under tension and they swell when driven. This swelling
would tend to split the wood underneath, where you cant see it. I think bolts
are definitely the way to go.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
---------------------------------
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael Groah
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 12:13 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Tail wire metal fittings
The plans show the tail wire fittings riveted to the tail with 3/16" rivets and
thus end up under the fabric with the tabs sticking through. I see that most
people seem to bolt them on top of the tail after fabric covering. Is there
anything wrong with, or any problems that could occur if i use 3/16" AD rivets
to rivet these fittings to the tail as in the plans? Why does everyone just
bolt them on? Is it just easier or is there a safety issue?
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
---------------------------------
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| Subject: | solid wire vs cables |
Bill, I think I printed out the details on how to make a jig for forming th
e hard wire loops and ferrules for the Piet tail feathers and could probabl
y locate them in my stuff, given time. If memory serves, Keri-Ann Price au
thored that article for BPA, including photos and details.
Be prepared for flak though... the idea of using hard wire braces with wrap
ped ferrules got shot at pretty hard last time it came up here. Recognizin
g that braided aircraft cable, Nicopress, and turnbuckles are all available
and commonly used, the nifty and nostalgic idea of stiff wires seems to ha
ve been swept away in the sea of modernity.Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CCSan Antonio, TXmailto: taildrags@hotmail.comwebsite at htt
p://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 18
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| Subject: | solid wire vs cables |
This can be useful www.flitzerbiplane.com/PianoWire.shtml and www.flitzerbiplane.com/DragWires.shtml
Santiago
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Encuentros
Ahora encontrar pareja es mucho ms fcil, prob el nuevo Yahoo! Encuentros.
Visit http://yahoo.cupidovirtual.com/servlet/NewRegistration
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Newbie gusset question |
Thanks for the sanity check! Then I'm going to press and continue with rib building!
Cheers,
Steve C.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=172602#172602
Message 20
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Hey guys, this is my first post. Complete newbee so we'll see if I can make this
thing work. I've never been part of a group/forum like this but I've been
reading your posts for a couple of months, and its been fun.
My Dad did some horse trading to get a Sky Scout with all of the woodwork done,
fuselage and wings assembled, brackets made, control surfaces prefit and many
of the cable and pulley parts installed. The tailwheel is on and we are about
to fab the gear and get it off the floor. We've been argueing about what
wheels and brakes to use and what motor we're going to use. Dad is set on electric
start but complains about cost of a motor that we can easily put electric
start on. Anyways, thats where were at.
My question to you guys is, has anyone toyed with the idea of using flaperons
on their Piet? My dad has a 600ft grass strip at his home that he uses for his
Rans Coyote II. I have room for about an 800ft strip at my place, but it is
in the bottom of a pretty deep valley. The Piet will likely end up spending
most of it's time at my place just because Dad doesn't have the hangar space.
If the wings weren't already built, we would just add flaps. We've never flown
a plane with flaperons and were wondering if it would be an advantage for
the Piet.
Thanks for the input, Jeremy Bramall
DFW, TX
Message 21
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Welcome Jeremy!
Just learn to slip the Piet. It will come down from 1000' in less than a m
ile, a lot less. I bet I could land it in the bottom of a 5 gallon bucket.
Getting out would be another story...
Flaps, (or flaperons) would add complexity and weight with no advantage.
The airframe is very draggy as is. Put the wind to its side and it will dr
op out of the sky. (besides it is great fun!)
Steve E.
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis
t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jeremy bramall
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 1:45 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: flaperons
Hey guys, this is my first post. Complete newbee so we'll see if I can mak
e this thing work. I've never been part of a group/forum like this but I'v
e been reading your posts for a couple of months, and its been fun.
My Dad did some horse trading to get a Sky Scout with all of the woodwork d
one, fuselage and wings assembled, brackets made, control surfaces prefit a
nd many of the cable and pulley parts installed. The tailwheel is on and w
e are about to fab the gear and get it off the floor. We've been argueing
about what wheels and brakes to use and what motor we're going to use. Dad
is set on electric start but complains about cost of a motor that we can e
asily put electric start on. Anyways, thats where were at.
My question to you guys is, has anyone toyed with the idea of using flapero
ns on their Piet? My dad has a 600ft grass strip at his home that he uses
for his Rans Coyote II. I have room for about an 800ft strip at my place,
but it is in the bottom of a pretty deep valley. The Piet will likely end
up spending most of it's time at my place just because Dad doesn't have the
hangar space. If the wings weren't already built, we would just add flaps
. We've never flown a plane with flaperons and were wondering if it would
be an advantage for the Piet.
Thanks for the input, Jeremy Bramall
DFW, TX
Message 22
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a Piet with flaperons is a tip stall waiting to happen.
Spoilerons would be preferred over flaperons in a Piet. On my RC model
Piet I have implemented spoilerons. At full spoiler defflection the
ailerons are angled up about 30=B0 Makes for very steep approaches with
good aileron authority.
Seems like the weight involved in a real Piet would make them
undeseirable. Besides a slipping Piet can drop down into a small strip
easily.
DJ Vegh
www.azchoppercam.com
----- Original Message -----
From: jeremy bramall
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 12:44 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: flaperons
Hey guys, this is my first post. Complete newbee so we'll see if I
can make this thing work. I've never been part of a group/forum like
this but I've been reading your posts for a couple of months, and its
been fun.
My Dad did some horse trading to get a Sky Scout with all of the
woodwork done, fuselage and wings assembled, brackets made, control
surfaces prefit and many of the cable and pulley parts installed. The
tailwheel is on and we are about to fab the gear and get it off the
floor. We've been argueing about what wheels and brakes to use and what
motor we're going to use. Dad is set on electric start but complains
about cost of a motor that we can easily put electric start on. Anyways,
thats where were at.
My question to you guys is, has anyone toyed with the idea of using
flaperons on their Piet? My dad has a 600ft grass strip at his home
that he uses for his Rans Coyote II. I have room for about an 800ft
strip at my place, but it is in the bottom of a pretty deep valley. The
Piet will likely end up spending most of it's time at my place just
because Dad doesn't have the hangar space. If the wings weren't already
built, we would just add flaps. We've never flown a plane with
flaperons and were wondering if it would be an advantage for the Piet.
Thanks for the input, Jeremy Bramall
DFW, TX
Message 23
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| Subject: | solid wire vs cables |
Santiago,
Those were two very interesting links that I had never seen before. Lots of
good information.
The one for the drag wires uses nico-press sleeves in place of wire ferrules
- very interesting.
By navigating a bit around the Flitzer site, I found a link to a company
that fabricates drum brake assemblies that look like they would go great on
a Pietenpol. The design apparently incorporates an arm to prevent rotation
of the axle when brakes are applied. The only downside that I can see is the
price - about $2000 a pair! But they also sell detailed construction plans
for the brakes.
Thanks for the tips!
Bill C.
Message 24
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Might be interesting to watch, though. A normal Pietenpol has a generous a
mount of adverse yaw. Imagine what it would be like with full span aileron
s (assuming that's what he's talking about).
As others have said Jeremy, landing on an 800' strip is no problem. A 600'
strip would be a challenge, but doable (although I'd hate to have to do it
right every time, with no margin for error). Getting out of either of the
m would be very difficult without a 150 Lycoming on the nose. I keep my Pi
et on a 2,000' grass strip with tall trees at the end, and I will not carry
passengers in it out of that field. I would not even think about flying i
t out of an 800' strip unless there are VERY good, flat approaches on each
end.
A STOL airplane it is not. It flies like what it is - a 1929 airplane.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis
t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of DJ Vegh
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 4:37 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: flaperons
a Piet with flaperons is a tip stall waiting to happen.
Spoilerons would be preferred over flaperons in a Piet. On my RC model Pie
t I have implemented spoilerons. At full spoiler defflection the ailerons
are angled up about 30=B0 Makes for very steep approaches with good ailero
n authority.
Seems like the weight involved in a real Piet would make them undeseirable.
Besides a slipping Piet can drop down into a small strip easily.
DJ Vegh
www.azchoppercam.com
----- Original Message -----
From: jeremy bramall <mailto:outofthebox50@yahoo.com>
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 12:44 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: flaperons
Hey guys, this is my first post. Complete newbee so we'll see if I can ma
ke this thing work. I've never been part of a group/forum like this but I'
ve been reading your posts for a couple of months, and its been fun.
My Dad did some horse trading to get a Sky Scout with all of the woodwork
done, fuselage and wings assembled, brackets made, control surfaces prefit
and many of the cable and pulley parts installed. The tailwheel is on and
we are about to fab the gear and get it off the floor. We've been argueing
about what wheels and brakes to use and what motor we're going to use. Da
d is set on electric start but complains about cost of a motor that we can
easily put electric start on. Anyways, thats where were at.
My question to you guys is, has anyone toyed with the idea of using flaper
ons on their Piet? My dad has a 600ft grass strip at his home that he uses
for his Rans Coyote II. I have room for about an 800ft strip at my place,
but it is in the bottom of a pretty deep valley. The Piet will likely end
up spending most of it's time at my place just because Dad doesn't have th
e hangar space. If the wings weren't already built, we would just add flap
s. We've never flown a plane with flaperons and were wondering if it would
be an advantage for the Piet.
Thanks for the input, Jeremy Bramall
DFW, TX
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matr
onics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
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Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Tail wire metal fittings |
wait, wait, wait! All of you guys have talked about AD rivets!!!!!!!!
The plans show steel rivets, NOT aluminum AD rivets. Steel Rivets do
not swell in the middle when peened over, nor do they tend to work
loose. Whether you want to use them is a different question, but make
sure you have the right thing in mind when you make your decision.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Groah<mailto:dskogrover@yahoo.com>
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com<mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 2:22 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Tail wire metal fittings
Sounds good. I'll bolt them on. With them on top of the fabric it's
also easier to inspect them. I was leaning towards bolting but I
thought I'd throw it out since it's how the plans say to do it.
harvey.rule@bell.ca<mailto:harvey.rule@bell.ca> wrote:
Also as a foot note to that.Rivets tend to come loose with
vibration.Now this area may not take too much vibration but over time it
could still become a factor.I had a lot of rivets in my Lazair
ultralight and they would come loose in the weirdest plases.Places you
wouldn't expect that to happen.Just my two cents worth.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Phillips, Jack
Sent: March 25, 2008 12:27 PM
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Tail wire metal fittings
I don't think riveting them on is a good idea. I must confess, I
don't remember the plans showing them riveted but I wouldn't even
consider doing it that way. Rivets don't work well under tension and
they swell when driven. This swelling would tend to split the wood
underneath, where you can't see it. I think bolts are definitely the
way to go.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael
Groah
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 12:13 PM
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Tail wire metal fittings
The plans show the tail wire fittings riveted to the tail with 3/16"
rivets and thus end up under the fabric with the tabs sticking through.
I see that most people seem to bolt them on top of the tail after fabric
covering. Is there anything wrong with, or any problems that could
occur if i use 3/16" AD rivets to rivet these fittings to the tail as in
the plans? Why does everyone just bolt them on? Is it just easier or
is there a safety issue?
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List<http://www.matronics.co
m/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>
http://www.matronics.com/contribution<http://www.matronics.com/contributi
on>
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: solid wire vs cables |
the jig for making the loop is pretty simple and the drawings for it are
pretty common. What is not as common, or as easy, is making the wrapped
ferrule. I know a couple of people who are proficient at making these
ferrules, but it is not easy to describe or do. Don't forget, another
option to !gasp! nicropress fittings is wrapped and soldered, which is
simple and authentic as well.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Church<mailto:eng@canadianrogers.com>
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com<mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 12:56 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: solid wire vs cables
In the plans, the bracing wires for the empennage and for the drag and
anti-drag wires are shown as solid wire, or as described in the plans,
"hard wire". I realize that this was a common method in the old days,
and now almost everyone uses aircraft cable with nicopress fittings. But
using the hard wire results in a nice clean look, as seen on Ken
Perkins' award winner N34KP. Plus, it's authentic Pietenpol. I ran
across a photo and description on Mykitplane.com (Terry Bowden's photos)
that said the wires were formed using a jig that was described in an old
copy of the BPA newsletter. I'm curious as to what such a jig might look
like. So, here's my question:
Anyone out there have a copy of the old newsletter that described the
jig? Or sketches or photos of such a jig?
Bill C.
Message 27
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| Subject: | landing a Piet with a strong headwind |
And many of the flying Piet pilots will relate to this observation very
closely but to experience landing
your Pietenpol into the face of a nice, strong, and steady wind becomes
what I call 'a laugher' because
you are SO slow and making SO little progress over the ground during
your flare that you can literally
land and stop your plane within just a handful (or less) of runway
centerline dash marks. My only
reaction, even to this day after flying this crate for almost 10 years,
is to simply laugh out loud at how
dreamlike the experience is. You know those dreams where your feet
feel like they have been dipped
in big gobs of cold honey and you're trying to run out of a jealous
husband's house ? That's how slow it
feels to land a Piet into a strong headwind.
Mike C. in Ohio
Message 28
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A bunch of those VGs that they use on Cubs would be an interresting
experiment.
Brian Kraut
Engineering Alternatives, Inc.
www.engalt.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Steve
Eldredge
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 4:03 PM
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: flaperons
Welcome Jeremy!
Just learn to slip the Piet. It will come down from 1000' in less than a
mile, a lot less. I bet I could land it in the bottom of a 5 gallon bucket.
Getting out would be another story.
Flaps, (or flaperons) would add complexity and weight with no advantage.
The airframe is very draggy as is. Put the wind to its side and it will
drop out of the sky. (besides it is great fun!)
Steve E.
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jeremy
bramall
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 1:45 PM
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: flaperons
Hey guys, this is my first post. Complete newbee so we'll see if I can
make this thing work. I've never been part of a group/forum like this but
I've been reading your posts for a couple of months, and its been fun.
My Dad did some horse trading to get a Sky Scout with all of the woodwork
done, fuselage and wings assembled, brackets made, control surfaces prefit
and many of the cable and pulley parts installed. The tailwheel is on and
we are about to fab the gear and get it off the floor. We've been argueing
about what wheels and brakes to use and what motor we're going to use. Dad
is set on electric start but complains about cost of a motor that we can
easily put electric start on. Anyways, thats where were at.
My question to you guys is, has anyone toyed with the idea of using
flaperons on their Piet? My dad has a 600ft grass strip at his home that he
uses for his Rans Coyote II. I have room for about an 800ft strip at my
place, but it is in the bottom of a pretty deep valley. The Piet will
likely end up spending most of it's time at my place just because Dad
doesn't have the hangar space. If the wings weren't already built, we would
just add flaps. We've never flown a plane with flaperons and were wondering
if it would be an advantage for the Piet.
Thanks for the input, Jeremy Bramall
DFW, TX
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-Listhttp://forums.matronics.c
omhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: landing a Piet with a strong headwind |
You know those dreams where your feet feel like they have been dipped
> in big gobs of cold honey and you're trying to run out of a jealous
> husband's house ? That's how slow it
> feels to land a Piet into a strong headwind.
>
> Mike C. in Ohio
>
>
How would you know about that particular feeling Mike?
Rick
do not archive
>
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
--
Rick Holland
Castle Rock, Colorado
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: solid wire vs cables |
Oscar,
It was stated that the wing drag and antis were double piano wire. No gauge
was given. Do you have any info on that?
Levi
**************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
Home.
(http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?ncid=aolhom00030000000001)
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Newbie gusset question |
Steve,
I made a small sander out of a piece of one of those free paint stirrers from Home
Depot T-88'd to a small maneuverable piece of aluminum scrap. (The scrounger
in me tells me to grab an acceptable amount of them every time I go there
since they are handy for shims and little homemade tools)
http://www.flyingwood.com/index.asp?page=14&filter=0
I wrapped a piece of coarse 60 grit over the bottom and pinched it against the
handle to hold it during use and cross-hatch scored the gussets and the capstrips
prior to gluing. I only scored it and then vacuumed up all the dust thoroughly
with a shop vac. I vacuumed all the gussets and all the capstrip areas
that were sanded prior to the T-88. We have yet to see how well this works.
But, like Jack said, the 1/16th birch ply is so smooth I wanted to make sure the
glue had something to grip. It only adds another 10 minutes to each rib but
think that it's worth the time.
Keep on keepin on!
Glenn
--------
Glenn Thomas
N?????
http://www.flyingwood.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=172668#172668
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: solid wire vs cables |
This is what you want to start with.
http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19930091028_19930910
28.pdf
----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Church
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 9:56 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: solid wire vs cables
In the plans, the bracing wires for the empennage and for the drag and
anti-drag wires are shown as solid wire, or as described in the plans,
"hard wire". I realize that this was a common method in the old days,
and now almost everyone uses aircraft cable with nicopress fittings. But
using the hard wire results in a nice clean look, as seen on Ken
Perkins' award winner N34KP. Plus, it's authentic Pietenpol. I ran
across a photo and description on Mykitplane.com (Terry Bowden's photos)
that said the wires were formed using a jig that was described in an old
copy of the BPA newsletter. I'm curious as to what such a jig might look
like. So, here's my question:
Anyone out there have a copy of the old newsletter that described the
jig? Or sketches or photos of such a jig?
Bill C.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Checked by AVG.
3/25/2008 7:17 PM
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