Pietenpol-List Digest Archive

Mon 05/26/08


Total Messages Posted: 8



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 08:21 AM - Inspection holes (wing) (Jack T. Textor)
     2. 08:57 AM - Re: Inspection holes (wing) (CozyGirrrl@aol.com)
     3. 09:09 AM - Re: Inspection holes (wing) (Lagowski Morrow)
     4. 04:15 PM - Re: Recent Flying (Lagowski Morrow)
     5. 04:35 PM - Fuel Flow Rates (Steve Ruse)
     6. 05:00 PM - Re: Fuel Flow Rates (Gene & Tammy)
     7. 05:30 PM - Re: Inspection holes (wing) (Dick Navratil)
     8. 05:30 PM - Re: Fuel Flow Rates (Steve Ruse)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 08:21:35 AM PST US
    Subject: Inspection holes (wing)
    From: "Jack T. Textor" <jtextor@thepalmergroup.com>
    Finally getting my first wing finished. The plans show a =BC plywood plate with 4 =BD hole beneath the aileron pulley for inspection. For the other inspection holes what does everybody suggest? Should I use plywood plates or inspection rings cut into the fabric? Thanks! Jack www.textors.com


    Message 2


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    Time: 08:57:11 AM PST US
    From: CozyGirrrl@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Inspection holes (wing)
    Dear Jack, Thanks for your very helpful web site, the pictures help to quickly answer a lot of questions. One thing that may become clearer to us when you get further toward covering your wings and tail feathers is the attachment of the control horns. The plans show an opening of approximately one inch in the horns as well as the available material for the attachment tabs and screw holes support geometry for fastening to a one inch thick beam, yet the spruce beam material indicated in the plans is 5/8" thick at that point, is it intended that the beam is filled in with a ply shim on each side before attaching the horns? Does anyone have pictures on their web site showing these installed? Also how is the covering material dealt with around these interruptions? And by the way, nice job on the metalwork Jack. Please excuse our ignorance, this old-fangled construction is new to us =) Regards, Chrissi & Randi CG Products, Custom Aircraft Hardware www.CozyGirrrl.com Cozy Mk-IV RG 13B-turbo Plans #957 Chapter? big pieces done, details, details ============================== In a message dated 5/26/2008 10:22:30 A.M. Central Daylight Time, jtextor@thepalmergroup.com writes: Finally getting my first wing finished. The plans show a plywood plate with 4 hole beneath the aileron pulley for inspection. For the other inspection holes what does everybody suggest? Should I use plywood plates or inspection rings cut into the fabric? Thanks! Jack www.textors.com **************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with Tyler Florence" on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4&?NCID=aolfod00030000000002)


    Message 3


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    Time: 09:09:16 AM PST US
    From: "Lagowski Morrow" <jimdeb@charter.net>
    Subject: Re: Inspection holes (wing)
    I have finished all my surfaces using the plastic rings and aluminum cover plates They are easy to install and the cover plates go on and off easily. I used the Poly-Fiber fabric covering system. The plastic rings are glued on and preshrunk doilies applied on top. After painting just cut out the hole Jim lagowski--Trying hard to finish in time for Brodhead--NX221PT Do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Jack T. Textor To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, May 26, 2008 11:18 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Inspection holes (wing) Finally getting my first wing finished. The plans show a =BC plywood plate with 4 =BD hole beneath the aileron pulley for inspection. For the other inspection holes what does everybody suggest? Should I use plywood plates or inspection rings cut into the fabric? Thanks! Jack www.textors.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Checked by AVG. 5/25/2008 6:49 PM


    Message 4


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    Time: 04:15:05 PM PST US
    From: "Lagowski Morrow" <jimdeb@charter.net>
    Subject: Re: Recent Flying
    Peter, Keep up the good work!!--JIm Lagowski in N.W. Michigan do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter W Johnson To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com ; corvaircraft-bounces@mylist.net Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2008 7:54 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Recent Flying Hi Guys, I have at last made my first out landing flight in the Pietenpol. I made a trip to another airport about an hour away from my home field. The Piet and Corvair performed very well although the weather was very cold (by Aussie standards, about 10C). It was a beautiful sunny day, the Piet flies hands off (short distances) with just a little nose up trim requiring a little more as the fuel in the top tank is burned off. The engine ran very well with the temps just about reaching the greens. Even my landings weren=92t too bad! Cruise speed was around 70kts at 2800 rpm with fuel consumption 18litres per hour (around 4 imp galls). One thing I am going to have to learn for the future is how to read a map in an open cockpit airplane. Just as well I knew were I was going because I couldn=92t get at my map. I had another flight a couple of days ago with one of my hangar mates doing some in-flight videoing. He is a pro photographer so the results look good. I=92ll post some to YouTube when I get a copy. I am hoping that all the days of high oil temps, bent wheels and ugly landings are getting behind me and I can start having some fun in the Piet. Role on the warm weather!! Cheers Peter Wonthaggi Australia http://www.cpc-world.com Checked by AVG. 24/05/2008 8:56 AM ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Checked by AVG. 5/24/2008 8:56 AM


    Message 5


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    Time: 04:35:41 PM PST US
    From: "Steve Ruse" <steve@wotelectronics.com>
    Subject: Fuel Flow Rates
    I just installed a new fuel valve, gascolator screen and fuel hoses on my plane, and decided I needed to test the fuel flow rate when I was done. I have an 18.3 gallon nose tank, and I expected the flow rate to be far more than adequate. It appears to be adequate, but is not as high as I hoped, so I'd like to get the opinion of more experienced people to determine what I need to do, if anything. I have an A-75. The chart indicates a maximum full throttle demand of about 6.3 gallons per hour. Of course, my burn rates in cruise are higher than what they should be according to the same table, so I think the actual max rate is probably also higher. For that reason, I'd be happy with a rate of at least 9-10 GPH, just for a safety margin. It took about 38 minutes to drain 5 gallons of fuel, a flow rate of about 7.9GPH. I started with 5 gallons of fuel, then when it got to four gallons, I noticed the flow rate had decreased substantially. I added another 5 gallons, and this increased the flow rate and it appeared to remain near constant as it drained from 9 gallons to 5 gallons. Obviously what I am trying to simulate is a full throttle climb with minimum useable fuel. A few questions: 1. - What is the MINIMUM acceptable flow rate for an A-75? 2. - Does the carburetor/needle assembly affect the flow rate? I tested the rate by simply disconnecting the hose from the carb, and keeping the hose at the same height as the carb inlet. Would the needle lower the fuel rate? 3. - Is ~7GPH adequate for an A-75 in your opinion? Something to consider for builders...because my tank is so low relative to the carb, I don't get adequate fuel pressure when the fuel level is low. As a result, I have about 4 gallons of fuel that is unusable, not because it won't reach the sump, but because of pressure. So I am always carrying around 25lbs of fuel for no reason other than to make the fire bigger after a crash. Somewhere before I have seen a specification for a minimum height of the tank outlet above the carburetor. Mine does not meet that spec, hence the reason for a large amount of unuseable fuel. The bottom of my tank is about 2"-3" above the carb when sitting on the ground. Of course before I fly it, I intend to do an extended ground run at full throttle to verify that flow is adequate. Any thoughts or shared experience on the subject would be appreciated. Thanks, Steve Ruse Norman, Ok


    Message 6


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    Time: 05:00:32 PM PST US
    From: "Gene & Tammy" <zharvey@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: Re: Fuel Flow Rates
    Steve, the two questions I have is what size hose and do you have a vented cap? I have also seen problems with fuel valves not opening all the way even though the handle indicates it is full open. Gene ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Ruse" <steve@wotelectronics.com> Sent: Monday, May 26, 2008 6:33 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuel Flow Rates > <steve@wotelectronics.com> > > I just installed a new fuel valve, gascolator screen and fuel hoses on my > plane, and decided I needed to test the fuel flow rate when I was done. I > have an 18.3 gallon nose tank, and I expected the flow rate to be far more > than adequate. It appears to be adequate, but is not as high as I hoped, > so I'd like to get the opinion of more experienced people to determine > what I need to do, if anything. > > I have an A-75. The chart indicates a maximum full throttle demand of > about 6.3 gallons per hour. Of course, my burn rates in cruise are higher > than what they should be according to the same table, so I think the > actual max rate is probably also higher. For that reason, I'd be happy > with a rate of at least 9-10 GPH, just for a safety margin. It took about > 38 minutes to drain 5 gallons of fuel, a flow rate of about 7.9GPH. I > started with 5 gallons of fuel, then when it got to four gallons, I > noticed the flow rate had decreased substantially. I added another 5 > gallons, and this increased the flow rate and it appeared to remain near > constant as it drained from 9 gallons to 5 gallons. Obviously what I am > trying to simulate is a full throttle climb with minimum useable fuel. > > A few questions: > > 1. - What is the MINIMUM acceptable flow rate for an A-75? > > 2. - Does the carburetor/needle assembly affect the flow rate? I tested > the rate by simply disconnecting the hose from the carb, and keeping the > hose at the same height as the carb inlet. Would the needle lower the > fuel rate? > > 3. - Is ~7GPH adequate for an A-75 in your opinion? > > Something to consider for builders...because my tank is so low relative to > the carb, I don't get adequate fuel pressure when the fuel level is low. > As a result, I have about 4 gallons of fuel that is unusable, not because > it won't reach the sump, but because of pressure. So I am always carrying > around 25lbs of fuel for no reason other than to make the fire bigger > after a crash. Somewhere before I have seen a specification for a minimum > height of the tank outlet above the carburetor. Mine does not meet that > spec, hence the reason for a large amount of unuseable fuel. The bottom > of my tank is about 2"-3" above the carb when sitting on the ground. > > Of course before I fly it, I intend to do an extended ground run at full > throttle to verify that flow is adequate. Any thoughts or shared > experience on the subject would be appreciated. > > Thanks, > > Steve Ruse > Norman, Ok > > > -- > Date: 5/22/2008 7:06 AM > >


    Message 7


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    Time: 05:30:15 PM PST US
    From: "Dick Navratil" <horzpool@goldengate.net>
    Subject: Re: Inspection holes (wing)
    Hey Jack I used the nylon inspection rings and am very happy with them. They are very easy to install. As far as installing around control horns, I pre ironed a piece of fabric up to 350 deg. I used the pinking sissors and installed 2 additional patches over the covering. That seems to have worked well. Dick N. ----- Original Message ----- From: Jack T. Textor To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, May 26, 2008 10:18 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Inspection holes (wing) Finally getting my first wing finished. The plans show a =BC plywood plate with 4 =BD hole beneath the aileron pulley for inspection. For the other inspection holes what does everybody suggest? Should I use plywood plates or inspection rings cut into the fabric? Thanks! Jack www.textors.com


    Message 8


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    Time: 05:30:52 PM PST US
    From: "Steve Ruse" <steve@wotelectronics.com>
    Subject: Re: Fuel Flow Rates
    The fuel lines are 1/4" Aeroquip 666 (666-4), but the ID is only .188. There are two 16" lines, one from the tank to the gascolator and one from the gascolator to the carb. The ID of that hose is only .188, which initially caused me concern, but the company I ordered them from (www.aircrafthose.com) assured me that was fine for a gravity feed system, and that I should use it instead of a larger hose since those fittings were what were on my carb and gascolator. The valve does open all the way, I just installed it and checked it before installation. It is a new miniature 1/4" valve from Aircraft Spruce. http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/minifv.php The cap is a cub-style cap with a cork float. It is only vented via the small opening around the 1/8" float rod and the tube it passes through. Removing the cap did not cause a noticeable different in the flow rate, so I don't believe it is a vacuum problem. Thanks for any input, Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gene & Tammy" <zharvey@bellsouth.net> Sent: Monday, May 26, 2008 6:57 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuel Flow Rates > <zharvey@bellsouth.net> > > Steve, the two questions I have is what size hose and do you have a vented > cap? I have also seen problems with fuel valves not opening all the way > even though the handle indicates it is full open. > Gene > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Steve Ruse" <steve@wotelectronics.com> > To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> > Sent: Monday, May 26, 2008 6:33 PM > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuel Flow Rates > > >> <steve@wotelectronics.com> >> >> I just installed a new fuel valve, gascolator screen and fuel hoses on my >> plane, and decided I needed to test the fuel flow rate when I was done. >> I have an 18.3 gallon nose tank, and I expected the flow rate to be far >> more than adequate. It appears to be adequate, but is not as high as I >> hoped, so I'd like to get the opinion of more experienced people to >> determine what I need to do, if anything. >> >> I have an A-75. The chart indicates a maximum full throttle demand of >> about 6.3 gallons per hour. Of course, my burn rates in cruise are >> higher than what they should be according to the same table, so I think >> the actual max rate is probably also higher. For that reason, I'd be >> happy with a rate of at least 9-10 GPH, just for a safety margin. It >> took about 38 minutes to drain 5 gallons of fuel, a flow rate of about >> 7.9GPH. I started with 5 gallons of fuel, then when it got to four >> gallons, I noticed the flow rate had decreased substantially. I added >> another 5 gallons, and this increased the flow rate and it appeared to >> remain near constant as it drained from 9 gallons to 5 gallons. >> Obviously what I am trying to simulate is a full throttle climb with >> minimum useable fuel. >> >> A few questions: >> >> 1. - What is the MINIMUM acceptable flow rate for an A-75? >> >> 2. - Does the carburetor/needle assembly affect the flow rate? I tested >> the rate by simply disconnecting the hose from the carb, and keeping the >> hose at the same height as the carb inlet. Would the needle lower the >> fuel rate? >> >> 3. - Is ~7GPH adequate for an A-75 in your opinion? >> >> Something to consider for builders...because my tank is so low relative >> to the carb, I don't get adequate fuel pressure when the fuel level is >> low. As a result, I have about 4 gallons of fuel that is unusable, not >> because it won't reach the sump, but because of pressure. So I am always >> carrying around 25lbs of fuel for no reason other than to make the fire >> bigger after a crash. Somewhere before I have seen a specification for a >> minimum height of the tank outlet above the carburetor. Mine does not >> meet that spec, hence the reason for a large amount of unuseable fuel. >> The bottom of my tank is about 2"-3" above the carb when sitting on the >> ground. >> >> Of course before I fly it, I intend to do an extended ground run at full >> throttle to verify that flow is adequate. Any thoughts or shared >> experience on the subject would be appreciated. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Steve Ruse >> Norman, Ok >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Date: 5/22/2008 7:06 AM >> >> > > >




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