Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:35 AM - Photo set for RC Model? (Oscar Zuniga)
2. 07:48 AM - Re: Re: Where to look-- Corvair (Michael Perez)
3. 08:23 AM - Riblett wood size (Michael Perez)
4. 09:21 AM - Re: Aluminum in place of metal fittings (Bill Church)
5. 10:03 AM - Re: Aluminum in place of metal fittings (Michael Perez)
6. 10:45 AM - Re: Aluminum in place of metal fittings (Bill Church)
7. 11:17 AM - Re: Aluminum in place of metal fittings (Owen Davies)
8. 01:49 PM - Re: Re: Where to look-- Corvair (walt)
9. 01:50 PM - Re: Aluminum in place of metal fittings (Michael Silvius)
10. 01:51 PM - Re: Re: Where to look-- Corvair (KMHeide, BA, CPO, FAAOP)
11. 02:03 PM - Re: Aluminum in place of metal fittings (Michael Silvius)
12. 03:01 PM - Re: Re: Where to look-- Corvair (Lazlo Almasi)
13. 03:42 PM - Re: Re: Where to look-- Corvair (Lazlo Almasi)
14. 04:57 PM - Re: Re: Where to look-- Corvair (Clif Dawson)
15. 06:04 PM - Where to look-- Corvair (Oscar Zuniga)
16. 06:06 PM - Re: Re: Where to look-- Corvair (KMHeide, BA, CPO, FAAOP)
Message 1
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Photo set for RC Model? |
Antoni;
There is a very good archive of photographs of many Pietenpols at Chris Tracy's website, http://westcoastpiet.com/pictures.htm
Also another good resource for you is DJ Vegh in Arizona, who built a very nice RC model of the GN-1. You can see some of his work at http://www.imagedv.com/aircamper/log/gallery.htm
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 2
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Where to look-- Corvair |
Copy that Jim. I plan on getting the books and doing the research prior to buying.
--- On Thu, 7/24/08, Jim Ash <ashcan@earthlink.net> wrote:
From: Jim Ash <ashcan@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Where to look-- Corvair
Make sure when you find one it's the engine you want, which is a late
('65 - '69) 110hp. Chevy made a number of different engines for Corvairs
and some of them you really don't want. Do your homework before you buy.
Jim
-----Original Message-----
>From: Rick Holland <at7000ft@gmail.com>
>Sent: Jul 23, 2008 3:42 PM
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Where to look-- Corvair
>
>I just called a few local junkyards and got lucky. Pulling the engine
>yourself can be fun (just bring a floor jack), you meet some real
>interesting (strange) people at a junkyard.
>
>Rick
>
>On Wed, Jul 23, 2008 at 12:37 PM, PatrickW <pwhoyt@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
<pwhoyt@yahoo.com>
>>
>> I found mine by asking around at an EAA meeting. One of the guys
>> remembered a junkyard a couple hours away that had some Corvairs, and
I was
>> able to find my core there.
>>
>> I also joined a local Corsa Chapter that provided some leads. Other
ideas
>> would be to ask local auto mechanics if they have any ideas on where
to find
>> one. Maybe put a "wanted" ad in a local paper.
There's craigslist.orgtoo.
>>
>> Don't give up searching - the hunt is kinda fun! Take your camera
so you
>> can take pictures if it's still in a car someplace.
>>
>> Once I started looking I had a couple leads, and ended up grabbing a
1967
>> core.
>>
>> Patrick
>> http://picasaweb.google.com/Patrick.Hoyt/PatsCorvairEngine
>>
>> --------
>> Patrick
>> 601XL/Corvair
>> N63PZ (reserved)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=194573#194573
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>--
>Rick Holland
>Castle Rock, Colorado
Message 3
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Riblett wood size |
I have the plans for the Riblett design on its way. I have the wood which I
will cut to size in hand. Is the capstrip size for the Riblett the standar
d 1/4" X 1/2" ? Any one see issues with me cutting up 6 foot long strips th
is size for the Riblett rib design? It may be another week before I see the
plans.
-
Message 4
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Aluminum in place of metal fittings |
Mike,
In general, if you plan to substitute materials from those shown in the
plans, you had better know what you are doing.
For instance, with regards to substituting aluminum plate for the control
horns, you should be aware (maybe you are already) that if you weld
aluminum, many alloys are severely weakened at the weld location (for 6061
the reduction is about 40% within one inch of the weld).
Aluminum also does not have a fatigue limit, unlike steel. What this
basically means is that steel will not be affected by fatigue (repeated
cycles of tension and compression) unless it is stressed above a certain
level, whereas aluminum will feel the effects of fatigue at any level of
stress. Eventually, the aluminum could develop cracks due to fatigue.
Also, the solid aluminum control horns will definitely end up heavier than
the hollow, formed sheet metal horns shown in the drawings. As an example,
the aileron control horn has a surface area of approximately 19 square
inches on one side. Two thicknesses of 22ga (.03") mild steel (or 4130) will
weigh about 0.33 lb. One thickness of 3/8" aluminum will weigh approximately
0.7 lb - or twice as much. Of course, you could machine the aluminum into a
bit of an airfoil shape, which would save a few ounces. But then you will
still need to add bracing angles and nuts and bolts to mount this solid
aluminum horn. Attached is a photo of such an aluminum aileron horn (by
someone else), which was cut from 1/4" aluminum plate. I would estimate that
this whole arrangement weighs approximately 2 to 3 times as much as a
plans-built control horn.
So, in conclusion, just make sure you do your homework before you start
changing from the plans.
Bill C.
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael
Perez
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 6:56 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum in place of metal fittings
I just got my plans today from the Pietenpol family. As I glanced over them
quickly, I see the fittings involved with the 3 piece wing, wing struts,
control bell cranks, etc. I wonder if it would be safe to make some, if not
all of these, from aluminum. I am thinking of machining some of these from
.125", T-6061. The fittings to move the rudder, ailerons, etc., I wonder if,
say 3/8" T-6061 would work...machined from a single slab and maybe even
fitted with ball bearings where the control wires connect. Just some
thoughts. I have the machines and material readily available. Any ideas?
Anyone do this before?
Message 5
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Aluminum in place of metal fittings |
Thanks Bill. This is exactly why I ask. There is always someone whom knows
more then you do. After looking further into the prints, I undestand the lo
gic behind the design. I want to save weight at every turn, but not comprom
ize the integrity of the AC. Bending, and welding these different pieces wi
ll just learn me a new skill...I'm down with that. Thanks for the response.
--- On Thu, 7/24/08, Bill Church <eng@canadianrogers.com> wrote:
From: Bill Church <eng@canadianrogers.com>
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum in place of metal fittings
Mike,
In general, if-you plan to substitute materials from those shown in the p
lans, you had better know what you are doing.
For instance, with regards to substituting aluminum plate for the control h
orns, you should be aware (maybe you are already) that if you weld aluminum
, many alloys are severely weakened at the weld location (for 6061 the redu
ction is about 40% within one inch of the weld).
Aluminum also does not have a fatigue limit, unlike steel. What this basica
lly means is that steel will not be affected by fatigue (repeated cycles of
tension and compression)-unless it is stressed above a certain level, wh
ereas aluminum will feel the effects of fatigue at any level of stress. Eve
ntually, the aluminum could develop cracks due to fatigue.
Also, the solid aluminum control horns will definitely end up heavier than
the hollow, formed sheet metal horns shown in the drawings. As an example,
the aileron control horn has a surface area of approximately 19 square inch
es on one side. Two thicknesses of 22ga (.03") mild steel (or 4130) will we
igh about 0.33 lb. One thickness of 3/8" aluminum will weigh approximately
0.7 lb - or twice as much. Of course, you could machine the-aluminum into
a bit of an airfoil shape, which-would save a few ounces. But then you w
ill still need to add bracing angles and nuts and bolts-to mount this sol
id aluminum horn. Attached is a photo of such an aluminum aileron horn (by
someone else), which was cut from 1/4" aluminum plate. I would estimate tha
t this whole arrangement weighs approximately 2 to 3 times as much as a pla
ns-built control horn.
-
So, in conclusion, just make sure you do your homework before you start cha
nging from the plans.
-
Bill C.
-
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis
t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael Perez
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 6:56 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum in place of metal fittings
I just got my plans today from the Pietenpol family. As I glanced over them
quickly, I see the fittings involved with the 3 piece wing, wing struts, c
ontrol bell cranks, etc. I wonder if it would be safe to make some, if not
all of these, from aluminum. I am thinking of machining some of these from
.125", T-6061. The fittings to move the rudder, ailerons, etc., I wonder if
, say 3/8" T-6061 would work...machined from a single slab and maybe even f
itted with ball bearings where the control wires connect. Just some thought
s. I have the machines and material readily available. Any ideas? Anyone do
this before?
Message 6
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Aluminum in place of metal fittings |
No problem, Mike.
Actually, I think a lot of people are intimidated by the control horns as
shown in the plans. But I don't think they are really that tricky. And when
they are well made, they are a really nice looking feature. I'm looking
forward to building those little jobbies. I'll be making mine soon (I hope)
so we'll see if I have to eat my words on that one. But, 20 or 22ga steel is
fairly easy to manipulate, and once it gets those curves bent into it (for
the airfoil shape) it will become quite rigid. The most challenging part
will be welding the light gauge metal, which, in my case, I will likely get
done for me by someone who knows what they are doing.
It has been said that Bernard Pietenpol designed the Air Camper so that it
could be built by a person with average skills and equipment, using
materials that were readily available. When you consider that that was
almost 80 years ago, and the advancements in technology and equipment that
have occurred since then, there really is no reason why anyone today
wouldn't be able to build one of these planes. If it means that some of us
get to learn a few new skills along the way, then, as you say, "I'm down
with that" too.
Enjoy the journey you're embarking on. It may not be a fast trip, but
there's lots to see and do along the way. And when you are finished
building, you can take your creation on another journey - also not a fast
trip, but with lots to see and do along the way.
Bill C.
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael
Perez
Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2008 1:01 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Aluminum in place of metal fittings
Thanks Bill. This is exactly why I ask. There is always someone whom knows
more then you do. After looking further into the prints, I undestand the
logic behind the design. I want to save weight at every turn, but not
compromize the integrity of the AC. Bending, and welding these different
pieces will just learn me a new skill...I'm down with that. Thanks for the
response.
Message 7
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Aluminum in place of metal fittings |
Among other useful comments, Bill Church wrote:
> Actually, I think a lot of people are intimidated by the control horns
> as shown in the plans. But I don't think they are really that tricky.
FWIW, a friend of ours built a Piet some years back. His total welding
experience was an afternoon at the local EAA chapter. The control horns
were the first steel pieces he made--with an overgrown Craftsman
handyman's torch. The results were just beautiful the first time out. He
does have talent, but based on his experience there is no reason anyone
should have trouble building usable horns.
Owen
Message 8
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Where to look-- Corvair |
test
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Ash" <ashcan@earthlink.net>
Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2008 12:26 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Where to look-- Corvair
>
> Make sure when you find one it's the engine you want, which is a late
> ('65 - '69) 110hp. Chevy made a number of different engines for Corvairs
> and some of them you really don't want. Do your homework before you buy.
>
> Jim
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>>From: Rick Holland <at7000ft@gmail.com>
>>Sent: Jul 23, 2008 3:42 PM
>>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Where to look-- Corvair
>>
>>I just called a few local junkyards and got lucky. Pulling the engine
>>yourself can be fun (just bring a floor jack), you meet some real
>>interesting (strange) people at a junkyard.
>>
>>Rick
>>
>>On Wed, Jul 23, 2008 at 12:37 PM, PatrickW <pwhoyt@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> I found mine by asking around at an EAA meeting. One of the guys
>>> remembered a junkyard a couple hours away that had some Corvairs, and I
>>> was
>>> able to find my core there.
>>>
>>> I also joined a local Corsa Chapter that provided some leads. Other
>>> ideas
>>> would be to ask local auto mechanics if they have any ideas on where to
>>> find
>>> one. Maybe put a "wanted" ad in a local paper. There's
>>> craigslist.orgtoo.
>>>
>>> Don't give up searching - the hunt is kinda fun! Take your camera so
>>> you
>>> can take pictures if it's still in a car someplace.
>>>
>>> Once I started looking I had a couple leads, and ended up grabbing a
>>> 1967
>>> core.
>>>
>>> Patrick
>>> http://picasaweb.google.com/Patrick.Hoyt/PatsCorvairEngine
>>>
>>> --------
>>> Patrick
>>> 601XL/Corvair
>>> N63PZ (reserved)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=194573#194573
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>--
>>Rick Holland
>>Castle Rock, Colorado
>
>
>
Message 9
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Aluminum in place of metal fittings |
From:
http://members.aol.com/bpanews/www.html
You can change Mr. Pietenpol's plans
and build a good airplane.
But if you don't change them, you'll build
a better one. . . . . Jim VanDervort
Michael in Maine
Message 10
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Where to look-- Corvair |
If you are still in search of a corvair or in need of rebuilding and assemb
ly to include testing of your engine....contact this site: www.billclapp.co
m-- Look under Corvair services and tell him Ken Heide sent you! Let hi
m know you are from the pietenpol site. He has engines I believe in stock.
If you want to purchase an engine, I have two complete- torn down engines
ready to be rebuilt. Nothing missing. Email me with your information and a
number so we can discuss in further details.
-
Also, I have a corvair guru who can sell you an engine since he has several
in storage.
Kenneth M. Heide, BA, CPO, FAAOP
-
-=0A=0A=0A
Message 11
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Aluminum in place of metal fittings |
Michael:
Santiago Morete's project.
If you can read Spanish you will find some good advise regarding the
design, if not just enjoy the photos
http://www.aracuan.com.ar/pietenpol.htm
Michael
Message 12
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Where to look-- Corvair |
Re: Mr. Clapp:
Please read the links
http://www.maddyhome.com/corvairsrch/message?sn=0&hit=39
http://www.maddyhome.com/corvairsrch/message?sn=0&hit=4
http://www.maddyhome.com/corvairsrch/message?sn=0&hit=28
http://www.maddyhome.com/corvairsrch/message?sn=0&hit=8
Caveat emptor
Lazlo
----- Original Message -----
*From:* KMHeide, BA, CPO, FAAOP <kmheidecpo@yahoo.com>
*To:* pietenpol-list@matronics.com
*Sent:* Thursday, July 24, 2008 3:48 PM
*Subject:* Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Where to look-- Corvair
If you are still in search of a corvair or in need of rebuilding and
assembly to include testing of your engine....contact this site:
www.billclapp.com Look under Corvair services and tell him Ken Heide sent
you! Let him know you are from the pietenpol site. He has engines I believe
in stock. If you want to purchase an engine, I have two complete torn down
engines ready to be rebuilt. Nothing missing. Email me with your information
and a number so we can discuss in further details.
Also, I have a corvair guru who can sell you an engine since he has several
in storage.
*Kenn**eth M. Heide, BA, CPO, FAAOP *
**
Message 13
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Where to look-- Corvair |
<http://www.maddyhome.com/corvairsrch/message?sn=0&hit=39>go to:
http://www.maddyhome.com/corvairsrch/
search for Bill Clapp, see results under:
Jul 5, 2008 CorvAircraft> Re: KR> Who bought my stuff / Bill Clapp
flykr2s@charter.net
Jun 22, 2008 CorvAircraft> setting the record straight N56ML@hiwaay.net
Mar 7, 2008 CorvAircraft> Issues with Bill Clapp, Long Post
WilliamTCA@aol.com
Mar 9, 2008 Re: CorvAircraft> Enough on the character assassination
n56ml@hiwaay.net
<http://www.maddyhome.com/corvairsrch/message?sn=0&hit=4>
Message 14
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Where to look-- Corvair |
You know, there's a guy on the Corvair list that finds
and puts up Craigslist engines from all over the country.
You should sign up if you already haven't.
Corvair engines for homebuilt aircraft <corvaircraft@mylist.net>
Clif
----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Perez
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2008 7:42 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Where to look-- Corvair
Copy that Jim. I plan on getting the books and doing the
research prior to buying.
Message 15
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Where to look-- Corvair |
Michael; you can contact Raymond Hanover (rhano@att.net) for the name of a friend
up in Wyoming that has a Corvair he has cleaned up and stored along with a
Wynne manual.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 16
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Where to look-- Corvair |
Memebers of the list!!!
-
I had no idea he was a con artist! I take back any mention of him or is ser
vices! Geez....glad I did not use him! Thanks for the heads up on his opera
tion!
Kenneth M. Heide, BA, CPO, FAAOP
-
--- On Thu, 7/24/08, Lazlo Almasi <aqulisaq@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Lazlo Almasi <aqulisaq@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Where to look-- Corvair
go to:
http://www.maddyhome.com/corvairsrch/
search for Bill Clapp, see results under:
Jul 5, 2008 CorvAircraft> Re: KR> Who bought my stuff / Bill Clapp flykr2s@
charter.net
Jun 22, 2008 CorvAircraft> setting the record straight N56ML@hiwaay.net
Mar 7, 2008 CorvAircraft> Issues with Bill Clapp, Long Post- WilliamTCA@a
ol.com
Mar 9, 2008 Re: CorvAircraft> Enough on the character assassination n56ml@h
iwaay.net
=0A=0A=0A
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|