Pietenpol-List Digest Archive

Sat 11/01/08


Total Messages Posted: 9



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 12:23 AM - Matronics Email List Fund Raiser During November! (dralle@matronics.com)
     2. 06:50 AM - Re:Adequate rod ends (Lawrence Williams)
     3. 07:09 AM - Re: Re:Adequate rod ends (Jeff Boatright)
     4. 07:35 AM - Re: Progress Report (Gene Rambo)
     5. 08:07 AM - Re: Re:Adequate rod ends (Ryan Mueller)
     6. 12:50 PM - see web page below last try failed to go through (H RULE)
     7. 01:09 PM - Re: see web page below last try failed to go through (Ryan Mueller)
     8. 01:52 PM - Re: aileron stuff (Lagowski Morrow)
     9. 03:37 PM - Re: Re: Progress Report, keep going (shad bell)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 12:23:53 AM PST US
    From: dralle@matronics.com
    Subject: Matronics Email List Fund Raiser During November!
    Dear Listers, Each November I hold a PBS-like fund raiser to support the continued operation and upgrade of the List services at Matronics. It's through soley through the Contributions of List members that these Matronics Lists are possible. You have probably noticed that there are no banner ads or pop-up windows on any of the Matronics Lists or related web sites such as the Forums site ( http://forums.matronics.com ), Wiki site ( http://wiki.matronics.com ), or other related pages such as the List Search Engine ( http://www.matronics.com/search ), List Browse ( http://www.matronics.com/listbrowse ), etc. This is because I believe in a List experience that is completely about the sport we all enjoy - namely Airplanes and not about annoying advertisments. During the month of November I will be sending out List messages every few days reminding everyone that the Fund Raiser is underway. I ask for your patience and understanding during the Fund Raiser and throughout these regular messages. The Fund Raiser is only financial support mechanism I have to pay all of the bills associated with running these lists. Your personal Contribution counts. Once again, this year I've got a terrific line up of free gifts to go along with the various Contribution levels. Most all of these gifts have been provided by some of the vary members and vendors that you'll find on Matronics Lists and have been either donated or provided at substantially discounted rates. This year, these generous people include Bob Nuckolls of the AeroElectric Connection (http://www.aeroelectric.com/), Andy Gold of the Builder's Bookstore (http://www.buildersbooks.com/), and Jon Croke of HomebuiltHELP (http://www.homebuilthelp.com/). These are extremely generous guys and I encourage you to visit their respective web sites. Each one offers a unique and very useful aviation-related product line. I would like publicly to thank Bob, Andy, and Jon for their generous support of the Lists again this year!! You can make your List Contribution using any one of three secure methods this year including using a credit card, PayPal, or by personal check. All three methods afford you the opportunity to select one of this year's free gifts with a qualifying Contribution amount!! To make your Contribution, please visit the secure site below: http://www.matronics.com/contribution I would like to thank everyone in advance for their generous financial AND moral support over the years. I know it sounds a little cliche, but you guys really do feel like family. Thank you for your support! Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator


    Message 2


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    Time: 06:50:06 AM PST US
    From: Lawrence Williams <lnawms@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re:Adequate rod ends
    I know that this topic has been beat to death but after all the exotic expl anations and stress analysis, it might be wise to consider what else could be impacted by "merely" unscrewing the rod-ends? - The Piet in question is already built and for some reason the owner (builde r?) wants to add some dihedral, so: - Assuming a one-piece wing, what kind of a load will this cause on the caban e strut fittings? - Assuming a three piece wing, what loads will be imposed on the butt-ends of the spars that will translate directly to the wing-attach fittings? - Jacking up the struts really does have consequences other than putting a li ttle dihedral into the tips. I suspect that the loads to the center section fittings would be a much bigger factor to consider than any cosmetic enhan cement dihedral might add. - Just musing........ - Larry Williams- XCG,XCMR,EPP=0A=0A=0A


    Message 3


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    Time: 07:09:21 AM PST US
    From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri@emory.edu>
    Subject: Re:Adequate rod ends
    Larry, Thanks for the note. Sorry that some information went missing. It's a 3-piece wing; I'm not the builder; not looking for cosmetic enhancement, but possibly more stability. Why would dihedral add load to the center section attach pointsor the wing-attach fittings? Thanks, Jeff At 6:46 AM -0700 11/1/08, Lawrence Williams wrote: >I know that this topic has been beat to death but after all the >exotic explanations and stress analysis, it might be wise to >consider what else could be impacted by "merely" unscrewing the >rod-ends? > >The Piet in question is already built and for some reason the owner >(builder?) wants to add some dihedral, so: > >Assuming a one-piece wing, what kind of a load will this cause on >the cabane strut fittings? > >Assuming a three piece wing, what loads will be imposed on the >butt-ends of the spars that will translate directly to the >wing-attach fittings? > >Jacking up the struts really does have consequences other than >putting a little dihedral into the tips. I suspect that the loads to >the center section fittings would be a much bigger factor to >consider than any cosmetic enhancement dihedral might add. > >Just musing........ > >Larry Williams XCG,XCMR,EPP >


    Message 4


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    Time: 07:35:11 AM PST US
    From: "Gene Rambo" <generambo@msn.com>
    Subject: Re: Progress Report
    Guys: Just finished this week splicing and routing my spars (for one piece wing). It was much easier than I expected, but I filled a large shop-vac twice with the sawdust. Now it is getting too cold to be glueing, so I may have to slide the ribs on and make all of the pieces to have ready for when it warms up, or maybe a few warm days left this year? Gene trying my best to make Brodhead/Oshkosh next year


    Message 5


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    Time: 08:07:59 AM PST US
    From: "Ryan Mueller" <rmueller23@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re:Adequate rod ends
    A question I asked Bill Rewey led to answer related to that. Until Larry brought it up I had forgotten about it. On the drawing for his three piece wing, he shows a roughly 1" gap between the center section and wing panels. There are offsets bent in the wing attach fittings, to allow them to mate with the opposite fittings. I believe he also did not extend the spars at all beyond the butt ribs. Anyhow, he pointed out that having the one inch gap between the wing panels and center section (and thusly the ends of the spars of each) prevents the tops of the spars from contacting each other if you add dihedral. With the three piece wing drawing that comes with the Piet plans, I believe there is zero clearance between the ends of the spars of the panel and center section (I'm not at home, so I'm going from memory). According to what the drawing shows it would appear that if you add dihedral the tops of the spar would already be touching, and thusly it would attempt to pull the bottom of the spars apart. This would put additional stress on the wing attach fittings and wing attach bolts. At least that's how it appears. Maybe those who have built the three-piece and added dihedral can add their experience. But if your Piet has the three-piece wings built to the plans with zero clearance between the wing and center section spars, the stress on the fittings and bolts might be something to take into account. Ryan On Sat, Nov 1, 2008 at 9:08 AM, Jeff Boatright <jboatri@emory.edu> wrote: > > > Why would dihedral add load to the center section attach pointsor the > wing-attach fittings? > > Thanks, > > Jeff


    Message 6


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    Time: 12:50:04 PM PST US
    From: H RULE <harvey.rule@rogers.com>
    Subject: see web page below last try failed to go through
    http://www.kontraband.com/videos/14339/The-Best-Air-Race-Pilot-EVER/ I know this has nothing to do with Piets but this is some flying you just have to see.


    Message 7


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    Time: 01:09:16 PM PST US
    From: "Ryan Mueller" <rmueller23@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: see web page below last try failed to go through
    http://www.avweb.com/blogs/insider/AVwebInsiderBlog_ViralVideo_KillaThrill_LostWingLanding_199096-1.html It also has nothing to do with actual flying...well, real airplane flying at least. :P On Sat, Nov 1, 2008 at 2:49 PM, H RULE <harvey.rule@rogers.com> wrote: > http://www.kontraband.com/videos/14339/The-Best-Air-Race-Pilot-EVER/ > > > I know this has nothing to do with Piets but this is some flying you just > have to see. >


    Message 8


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    Time: 01:52:38 PM PST US
    From: "Lagowski Morrow" <jimdeb@charter.net>
    Subject: Re: aileron stuff
    Rick, I'll follow up--Jim Do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Richard Schreiber To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 10:48 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: aileron stuff Thanks Jim, that would be great! Do you have any dimensions and photos that you could share? Walt and Greg I thought you were the ones that had problems with the riveted and soldered tanks, which is why I did not want to go that route. When I checked if there was anyone locally that could weld up an aluminum that I fabricated, I was given the name of the guy that wants $500. Rick Schreiber ----- Original Message ----- From: Lagowski Morrow To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: 10/30/2008 8:05:03 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: aileron stuff Rick, My tank is a Cub tank built by a guy in Cheboygan, Mich. He charged me $140. He has the patterns to make more. If you want I'll ask him if he wants to make anymore. My tank is mounted behind the firewall and holds ~12.6 gallons. Jim Lagowski, in N.W. Mich ----- Original Message ----- From: Richard Schreiber To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 4:03 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: aileron stuff Thanks John. I'd like to work on my tank next but I'm trying to decide what to make it out of. I was going to go with aluminium.We have a local welder who does racing tanks. His prices were reasonable, but the last Piet tank he did was around $500 just for labor! I would like to go with glass, but since I will also burn auto fuel I am concerned about solvent resistance. When I get time I'll go through all of the posts to the web site and make a decision, unless someone would like to chime in now. Rick ----- Original Message ----- From: To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: 10/30/2008 2:28:16 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: aileron stuff Rick, The wings look a bit different from when I saw them, really nice. John In a message dated 10/30/2008 2:54:22 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, lmforge@earthlink.net writes: Well guys here is a status report on my project. Per Dan Helsper's request I attached some photos of my wing with the aileron attached. I have also included a photo of drilling the aileron horn attachment. I used the hardwood block and tube method to insure the holes were aligned properly and perpendicular. This idea came from Chris Tracy on his web site. It worked well. This is the same method I used to drill all of the holes for the aileron hinge attachment screws. On the wings I still need to put in the nut plates for the aileron hinges, mount the aileron pulley supports and then run the cable. The fuselage is pretty well done, including all of the controls and cables I have mounted the main instruments in the IP, but still need to do some more like the engine gages, throttle, carb heat etc.. I am going to put the fuel tank in the front and that still needs to be made. The wing center section is complete. My empennage is complete and has been fitted to the fuselage with the guy wires for a test fit. Next on the agenda is the tail wheel and the straight axle main gear. I'd like to have my Piet done for the 80th in Oshkosh, but realistically that might be a stretch, depending on how much I get done this winter. I am also going to use a corvair engine. I have the core, but I still need to rebuild it. Around Valparaiso (VPZ) we have 4 Piet's in various stages on construction. All of them will be using Corvair power. The plan is to rebuild all of the engines at the same time in the same location with the assistance of our local EAA tech counselor. The great thing is the tech counselor is rebuilding a Piet and also doing a corvair conversion. He is also the person who did the restoration of the Allison engines for the Glacier Girl P-38 a few years ago. Rick Schreiber lmforge@earthlink.net ------------------------------------------------------------------------ href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.mat ronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ------------------------------------------------------------------------ AVG - 270.8.5/1756 - Release Date: 10/30/2008 7:59 AM ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com 10/30/2008 2:35 PM


    Message 9


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    Time: 03:37:19 PM PST US
    From: shad bell <aviatorbell@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: Progress Report, keep going
    Gene, what kind of glue??- If it's T-88 keep on building.- Dad built hi s in the winter in an unheated garage.- Just as long as you have a little electric heater with a fan on it.- Put a piece of 2 mil dropcloth plasti c over the wing as to cover it with 2ft or so extra around the edges.- Ta pe or lay a board pipe etc. to hold the sides down, and leave the ends open .- Put the heater with the fan on it at one end and inflate the plastic l ike a greenhouse, it will stay at least 70 degrees all night long.- Keep the glue inside and mix it, then go out glue the pieces on and put up the t ent.- I used the same process last winter building wings for my Jungster, worked like a charm, I left the heat tent on for 48 hrs to make sure the g lue cured, and the temp outside was well below 20 degrees. - Shad=0A=0A=0A




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