Today's Message Index:
----------------------
0. 12:08 AM - Just A Few More Days... (Matt Dralle)
1. 05:43 AM - latex house paint (Oscar Zuniga)
2. 06:12 AM - Re: latex house paint (AMsafetyC@aol.com)
3. 06:38 AM - Re: latex house paint (Gary Boothe)
4. 10:04 AM - Re: latex house paint (AMsafetyC@aol.com)
5. 10:22 AM - Re: latex house paint (Bill Church)
6. 10:33 AM - Re: latex house paint (AMsafetyC@aol.com)
7. 12:34 PM - Re: latex house paint (Ryan Mueller)
8. 01:31 PM - Re: latex house paint (H RULE)
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Subject: | Just A Few More Days... |
Dear Listers,
There are just a few more days left in this year's List Fund Raiser. There are
some great gifts available when you make a qualifying Contribution and there's
plenty still available. Don't forget that its *your* Contribution that keeps
the computers running, the electricity turned on, and the computer room AC cooling!
If you look forward to reading your List email each day, won't you please take
a minute right now to make your personal Contribution?
Credit Card or Paypal:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Personal Check:
Matronics / Matt Dralle
PO Box 347
Livermore, CA 94550
Thank you for your support!
Matt Dralle
Message 1
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Subject: | latex house paint |
Bill Church wrote-
>
> This is the first time that I have read that John Dilatush's (now Greg
> bacon's) Piet was painted with Latex.
> Is this a recent discovery?
Well, I went back and re-read the info from John (down near the bottom, at http://www.westcoastpiet.com/steve_eldridge.htm ) and it actually says that he used the Fisher method, which involves black latex house paint as the primer, weave filler, and UV protection, and then applied automotive enamel over that. So I was only partially correct in what I said.
On a completely different subject, I just noticed that Mike Cuy's Piet has brass
leading edges on the prop. Hmmm... I don't remember seeing that in the construction
videos. I sure like that look on a prop for these airplanes.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 2
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Subject: | Re: latex house paint |
I realize there is much I do not know about many things so it surprises me
to learn that an automotive paint which I suspect would have been a solvent
based enamel could adhere to a latex paint. It stands to reason the two
materials are vastly different in chemistry and properties.
The typical enamel automotive style coating would be a brittle material more
rigid and with little flexibility other than its own expansion properties
where as the underlying a latex material is a more flexible rubber type material
with greater flex capability. When the skin needed to flex under load, the
top coat automotive coating would be resistant to that mechanical stretching
and begin to lose adhesion to its latex bonding base and chip off perhaps
causing the cloth to follow.
Although the use of automotive paint sounds attractive and would permit a
nice smooth and highly more aerodynamic surface it doesn't sound practical over
the latex base. I suspect one would have to uses an automotive primer, base
coat and clear coat system to do it all properly.
These are my own though's of how materials work and behave. I call once
again on the collective wisdom and science of the experts and the coating Gods
to
show me the errors of my ways and point me the direction of truth.
I would love to use a latex base and get the ease of application and cost
benefit and the automotive finish topcoat if it is possible, practical and does
not compromise safety of flight. It seems that like the airplane the coating
systems are a series of compromises and there is just something about a wing
loosing its covering in flight is just a bit more adventure than I care to
experience.
John
In a message dated 11/26/2008 8:44:46 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
taildrags@hotmail.com writes:
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com>
Bill Church wrote-
>
> This is the first time that I have read that John Dilatush's (now Greg
> bacon's) Piet was painted with Latex.
> Is this a recent discovery?
Well, I went back and re-read the info from John (down near the bottom, at
http://www.westcoastpiet.com/steve_eldridge.htm ) and it actually says that he
used the Fisher method, which involves black latex house paint as the
primer, weave filler, and UV protection, and then applied automotive enamel over
that. So I was only partially correct in what I said.
On a completely different subject, I just noticed that Mike Cuy's Piet has
brass leading edges on the prop. Hmmm... I don't remember seeing that in the
construction videos. I sure like that look on a prop for these airplanes.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
**************Life should be easier. So should your homepage. Try the NEW
AOL.com.
Message 3
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Subject: | latex house paint |
John,
Flex agents are available for automotive paints.works well, highly caustic,
though, and you would definitely want your own air supply. I learned this
the hard way, and, for that reason, am very interested in the Stewart
System.
Gary Boothe
Cool, Ca.
Pietenpol
WW Corvair Conversion
Tail done, working on fuselage (endless metal parts!)
(12 ribs down.)
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
AMsafetyC@aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2008 6:10 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: latex house paint
I realize there is much I do not know about many things so it surprises me
to learn that an automotive paint which I suspect would have been a solvent
based enamel could adhere to a latex paint. It stands to reason the two
materials are vastly different in chemistry and properties.
The typical enamel automotive style coating would be a brittle material more
rigid and with little flexibility other than its own expansion properties
where as the underlying a latex material is a more flexible rubber type
material with greater flex capability. When the skin needed to flex under
load, the top coat automotive coating would be resistant to that mechanical
stretching and begin to lose adhesion to its latex bonding base and chip off
perhaps causing the cloth to follow.
Although the use of automotive paint sounds attractive and would permit a
nice smooth and highly more aerodynamic surface it doesn't sound practical
over the latex base. I suspect one would have to uses an automotive primer,
base coat and clear coat system to do it all properly.
These are my own though's of how materials work and behave. I call once
again on the collective wisdom and science of the experts and the coating
Gods to show me the errors of my ways and point me the direction of truth.
I would love to use a latex base and get the ease of application and cost
benefit and the automotive finish topcoat if it is possible, practical and
does not compromise safety of flight. It seems that like the airplane the
coating systems are a series of compromises and there is just something
about a wing loosing its covering in flight is just a bit more adventure
than I care to experience.
John
In a message dated 11/26/2008 8:44:46 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
taildrags@hotmail.com writes:
Bill Church wrote-
>
> This is the first time that I have read that John Dilatush's (now Greg
> bacon's) Piet was painted with Latex.
> Is this a recent discovery?
Well, I went back and re-read the info from John (down near the bottom, at
http://www.westcoastpiet.com/steve_eldridge.htm ) and it actually says that
he used the Fisher method, which involves black latex house paint as the
primer, weave filler, and UV protection, and then applied automotive enamel
over that. So I was only partially correct in what I said.
On a completely different subject, I just noticed that Mike Cuy's Piet has
brass leading edges on the prop. Hmmm... I don't remember seeing that in
the construction videos. I sure like that look on a prop for these
airplanes.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at sp; (And Get Some AWESOME FREE find you for
-Matt Dralle, List e the es y - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS
========================
_____
Lifoptin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002">Try the NEW
AOL.com.
Message 4
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Subject: | Re: latex house paint |
Gary,
Where would I get information on the Stewart System is there a web site I
can review to become familiar with their system?
Please advise
Thanks
John
In a message dated 11/26/2008 9:40:33 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
gboothe@calply.com writes:
John,
Flex agents are available for automotive paintsworks well, highly
caustic,
though, and you would definitely want your own air supply. I learned this t
he
hard way, and, for that reason, am very interested in the Stewart System.
Gary Boothe
Cool, Ca.
Pietenpol
WW Corvair Conversion
Tail done, working on fuselage (endless metal parts!)
(12 ribs down)
____________________________________
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of AMsafetyC@a
ol.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2008 6:10 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: latex house paint
I realize there is much I do not know about many things so it surprises me
to learn that an automotive paint which I suspect would have been a solvent
based enamel could adhere to a latex paint. It stands to reason the two
materials are vastly different in chemistry and properties.
The typical enamel automotive style coating would be a brittle material mor
e
rigid and with little flexibility other than its own expansion properties
where as the underlying a latex material is a more flexible rubber type
material with greater flex capability. When the skin needed to flex under l
oad, the
top coat automotive coating would be resistant to that mechanical stretchin
g
and begin to lose adhesion to its latex bonding base and chip off perhaps
causing the cloth to follow.
Although the use of automotive paint sounds attractive and would permit a
nice smooth and highly more aerodynamic surface it doesn't sound practical
over
the latex base. I suspect one would have to uses an automotive primer, base
coat and clear coat system to do it all properly.
These are my own though's of how materials work and behave. I call once
again on the collective wisdom and science of the experts and the coating G
ods to
show me the errors of my ways and point me the direction of truth.
I would love to use a latex base and get the ease of application and cost
benefit and the automotive finish topcoat if it is possible, practical and
does
not compromise safety of flight. It seems that like the airplane the coatin
g
systems are a series of compromises and there is just something about a win
g
loosing its covering in flight is just a bit more adventure than I care to
experience.
John
In a message dated 11/26/2008 8:44:46 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
taildrags@hotmail.com writes:
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com>
Bill Church wrote-
>
> This is the first time that I have read that John Dilatush's (now Greg
> bacon's) Piet was painted with Latex.
> Is this a recent discovery?
Well, I went back and re-read the info from John (down near the bottom, at
http://www.westcoastpiet.com/steve_eldridge.htm ) and it actually says that
he
used the Fisher method, which involves black latex house paint as the
primer, weave filler, and UV protection, and then applied automotive enamel
over
that. So I was only partially correct in what I said.
On a completely different subject, I just noticed that Mike Cuy's Piet has
brass leading edges on the prop. Hmmm... I don't remember seeing that in t
he
construction videos. I sure like that look on a prop for these airplanes.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at sp; (And Get Some AWESOME FREE find you for
-Matt Dralle, List e the es y - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS
____________________________________
Lifoptin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002">Try th
e NEW
AOL.com.
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
_http://www.matronics.com/contribution_
(http://www.matronics.com/contribution)
(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List)
**************Life should be easier. So should your homepage. Try the NEW
AOL.com.
m00000002)
Message 5
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Subject: | latex house paint |
John,
You didn't try very hard.
I just googled "stewart system" and the company website came up as the
number 1 site.
Or just click here:
http://www.stewartsystems.aero/
Bill C.
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: latex house paint |
I suppose not, I goggled it and came up with a dozen Stewart's one of which
was Martha and I know she's not coking up coatings in her kitchen so I figured
I would ask rather than waste time on whats Martha up to today!
Thanks for the link
John
In a message dated 11/26/2008 1:23:38 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
eng@canadianrogers.com writes:
John,
You didn't try very hard.
I just googled "stewart system" and the company website came up as the
number 1 site.
Or just click here:
_http://www.stewartsystems.aero/_ (http://www.stewartsystems.aero/)
Bill C.
(http://www.matronics.com/contribution)
(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List)
**************Life should be easier. So should your homepage. Try the NEW
AOL.com.
Message 7
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Subject: | Re: latex house paint |
Aha! I ran across this site the other day, thought it was amusing, but
didn't think I would use it. Until now...
http://letmegooglethatforyou.com/?q=stewart+systems
;)
Happy Thanksgiving everyone!
Ryan
do not archive
On Wed, Nov 26, 2008 at 12:21 PM, Bill Church <eng@canadianrogers.com>wrote:
> John,
>
> You didn't try very hard.
> I just googled "stewart system" and the company website came up as the
> number 1 site.
>
> Or just click here:
> http://www.stewartsystems.aero/
>
> Bill C.
>
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: latex house paint |
Auto paint was used on my wing.=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A_____________________________
___=0AFrom: Gary Boothe <gboothe@calply.com>=0ATo: pietenpol-list@matronics
.com=0ASent: Wednesday, November 26, 2008 9:36:27 AM=0ASubject: RE: Pietenp
ol-List: latex house paint=0A=0A=0AJohn,=0A-=0AFlex agents are available
for automotive paints=85works well, highly caustic, though, and you would d
efinitely want your own air supply. I learned this the hard way, and, for t
hat reason, am very interested in the Stewart System.=0A-=0AGary Boothe
=0ACool, Ca.=0APietenpol=0AWW Corvair Conversion=0ATail done, working on fu
selage (endless metal parts!)=0A(12 ribs down=85)=0A=0A____________________
____________=0A=0AFrom:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:ow
ner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of AMsafetyC@aol.com=0AS
ent: Wednesday, November 26, 2008 6:10 AM=0ATo: pietenpol-list@matronics.co
m=0ASubject: Re: Pietenpol-List: latex house paint=0A-=0AI realize there
is much I do not know about many things so it surprises me to learn that an
automotive paint which I suspect would have been a solvent based enamel co
uld adhere to a latex paint. It stands to reason the two materials are vast
ly different in chemistry-and properties. =0A-=0AThe typical enamel aut
omotive style coating would be a brittle material more rigid and with littl
e flexibility other than its own expansion properties where as the underlyi
ng a latex material is a more flexible rubber type material with greater fl
ex capability. When the skin needed to flex under load, the top coat automo
tive coating would be resistant to that mechanical stretching and begin to
lose adhesion to its latex bonding base and chip off perhaps causing the cl
oth to follow.=0A-=0AAlthough the use of automotive paint sounds attracti
ve and would permit a nice smooth and highly more aerodynamic surface it do
esn't sound practical over the latex base. I suspect one would have to uses
an automotive primer, base coat and clear coat system-to do it all prope
rly.=0A-=0AThese are my own though's of how materials work and behave. I
call once again on the collective wisdom and science-of the experts and t
he coating Gods to show me the errors of my ways and point me the direction
of truth. =0A-=0AI would love to use a latex base and get the ease-of
application and cost benefit and-the automotive finish topcoat if it is p
ossible, practical and does not compromise safety of flight. It seems that
like the airplane the coating systems are a series of compromises and there
is just something about a wing loosing its covering-in flight is just a
bit more adventure than I care to experience.=0A-=0AJohn=0A-=0A-=0AIn
a message dated 11/26/2008 8:44:46 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, taildrags@h
ildrags@hotmail.com>=0A=0A=0ABill Church wrote-=0A> =0A> This is the first
time that I have read that John Dilatush's (now Greg=0A> bacon's) Piet was
painted with Latex.=0A> Is this a recent discovery?=0A=0AWell, I went back
and re-read the info from John (down near the bottom, at http://www.westcoa
stpiet.com/steve_eldridge.htm ) and it actually says that he used the Fishe
r method, which involves black latex house paint as the primer, weave fille
r, and UV protection, and then applied automotive enamel over that.- So I
was only partially correct in what I said.=0A=0AOn a completely different
subject, I just noticed that Mike Cuy's Piet has brass leading edges on the
prop.- Hmmm... I don't remember seeing that in the construction videos.
- I sure like that look on a prop for these airplanes.=0A=0AOscar Zuniga
=0AAir Camper NX41CC=0ASan Antonio , TX=0Amailto: taildrags@hotmail.com=0Aw
ebsite at sp; - - - -- (And Get Some AWESOME FREE find you for
- - - - - - - - - - -Matt Dralle, List e the es y -
- - - - -- - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS =0A=0A=0A-=0A=0A___________
_____________________=0A=0ALifoptin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=e
mlcntaolcom00000002">Try the NEW AOL.com.=0A -=0A -=0Ahttp://www.matron
=0A
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