Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:46 AM - Re: Super strong, super simple leading edge (Phillips, Jack)
2. 06:01 AM - Re: More leading edge questions/ideas (Michael Perez)
3. 07:18 AM - gas tank filler neck options (John Egan)
4. 07:51 AM - Re: gas tank filler neck options (Gene & Tammy)
5. 07:54 AM - Re: gas tank filler neck options (Gene & Tammy)
6. 08:09 AM - Re: gas tank filler neck options (Jeff Boatright)
7. 08:47 AM - gas tank filler neck options (Oscar Zuniga)
8. 09:33 AM - Leaing ege follow up (Michael Perez)
9. 09:48 AM - Old PopSci's available from 1930s via Google (Mike Whaley)
10. 10:25 AM - Re: gas tank construction (AMsafetyC@aol.com)
11. 11:16 AM - Re: Old PopSci's available from 1930s via Google (Bill Church)
12. 01:08 PM - Re: gas tank construction (walt)
13. 01:36 PM - Re: gas tank filler neck options (Mike Tunnicliffe)
14. 02:07 PM - Re: Super strong, super simple leading edge (Don Emch)
15. 02:21 PM - soapboxes (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC])
16. 03:49 PM - quite a ways off topic (walt)
17. 06:17 PM - soapboxes (Oscar Zuniga)
18. 07:01 PM - Re: Leaing ege follow up (Gene Rambo)
19. 07:31 PM - Re: Leaing ege follow up (Peter W Johnson)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Super strong, super simple leading edge |
I agree with you completely, Don. It took me less time to make the leading
edge per the plans (including the plywood) than this thread has occupied o
n the list.
When I had a forced landing in my Pietenpol and ended up in a ditch four ye
ars ago, the right wingtip, including about 2 feet of the leading edge, imp
acted a ditch. Net result of the impact to the leading edge was a small de
nt in the spruce and a tear in the fabric. I repaired that easily with a b
it of Superfil epoxy filler to fill the dent and a simple patch on the fabr
ic. Had I made the leading edge a hollow box of plywood, I would have had
to scarf in a rounded patch, and the repair of just that area would have ta
ken weeks of work (ask Matt Paxton what it took to repair the leading edge
of his Bellanca when he hit a buzzard on the way to Oshkosh a few years ago
).
Over the years I have observed a number of people on this list try to impro
ve the basic design of the Pietenpol. Almost always, the results are infer
ior to the original design. Bernard Pietenpol was a true genius in design.
With no formal education, he came up with a design that many have tried t
o improve and few have actually improved upon.
If those who insist on "improving" the design would spend more time buildin
g to the plans and less time re-designing, there would be a lot more Pieten
pols in the air.
Just my 2=A2 worth.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Raleigh, NC
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis
t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Don Emch
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 6:13 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Super strong, super simple leading edge
I don't mean to continue to stir the pot, but... it would be tough to come
up with a much simpler, stronger leading edge than what is on the plans. I
t is such a simple concept to take a piece of spruce, run it through the ta
ble saw then glue and bolt it to the leading edge of the ribs and plane it
down to shape. Then what could be stronger than simply gluing a piece of 1
/16" plywood to it and the ribs, no steaming or forming necessary. It crea
tes an incredibly strong and lightweight leading edge with no complex steam
ing, forming or bending required.
I have a really great airplane friend who suffers from a condition known as
"Over-Analysis Paralysis". It gets in the way of his airplane building.
I know everyone's idea of building an airplane is different, and some peopl
e may enjoy having this type of condition, but look at those plans, digest
it, then enjoy building it, then you can really enjoy FLYING IT! Off the s
oapbox now....... :D
Don Emch
NX899DE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=218548#218548
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Dansk - Deutsch - Espanol - Francais - Italiano - Japanese - Nederlands - N
orsk - Portuguese
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| Subject: | More leading edge questions/ideas |
I appriciate you input Bill. These ideas are just that at the moment. When I get
there, I'll figure it out.
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| Subject: | gas tank filler neck options |
Hi builders,=0A=0AI have been looking for a gas tank filler neck to extend
the hieght of my gas cap.- I can not find what I want, and I wonder if yo
u guys know if this item is out there some where?=0A=0AI am using a J-3 sty
le fuel tank located in the nose.- Because the top of the tank is limited
in roundness, I can only locate the stock tank so the gas cap is not quite
-sticking out of the cowling.- I would like another inch or 1-1/2" high
er cap location.- I am therefor looking for a longer filler neck or coupl
ing to to thread on to the tank and raise the cap hieght. The J-3 style tan
k is from Wag-Aero (E-316-000).- I notice Wag-Aero sells a steel filler n
eck that looks taller in thier picture, however when I called Wag-Aero to i
nquire on the hieght of the neck-and if it has threads, they can not answ
er my questions because they do not typically stock that part.- If I can
not find an easy solution, I could modify (cut and weld)-a short piece of
steel tube to the existing neck.- I'll attach a photo of the tank. So, I
'm wondering if anyone knows if I can get a longer threaded filler neck for
this tank?=0A=0AAlso, regarding the leading edge of the wing discussion, I
bought a 14' long douglas fir 2x8 for $9.- I ripped-it down the length
at the center line at-the appropriate angle to mount to the wing, then r
an-each piece through the table saw to rough out the shape.- I then att
ached it to the wing and shaped it using a hand plane as Jack P described
-in his post.- Very fun. I'll attach a photo.=0A=0AThanks all,=0A=0AJoh
n E=0Atoo cold in the shop these days - Greenville, Wi=0A=0A=0A
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: gas tank filler neck options |
Aircraft Spruce has them. Page 170 P/N05-01060
Gene in wet Tennessee
----- Original Message -----
From: John Egan
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 9:18 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: gas tank filler neck options
Hi builders,
I have been looking for a gas tank filler neck to extend the hieght of
my gas cap. I can not find what I want, and I wonder if you guys know
if this item is out there some where?
I am using a J-3 style fuel tank located in the nose. Because the top
of the tank is limited in roundness, I can only locate the stock tank so
the gas cap is not quite sticking out of the cowling. I would like
another inch or 1-1/2" higher cap location. I am therefor looking for a
longer filler neck or coupling to to thread on to the tank and raise the
cap hieght. The J-3 style tank is from Wag-Aero (E-316-000). I notice
Wag-Aero sells a steel filler neck that looks taller in thier picture,
however when I called Wag-Aero to inquire on the hieght of the neck and
if it has threads, they can not answer my questions because they do not
typically stock that part. If I can not find an easy solution, I could
modify (cut and weld) a short piece of steel tube to the existing neck.
I'll attach a photo of the tank. So, I'm wondering if anyone knows if I
can get a longer threaded filler neck for this tank?
Also, regarding the leading edge of the wing discussion, I bought a
14' long douglas fir 2x8 for $9. I ripped it down the length at the
center line at the appropriate angle to mount to the wing, then ran each
piece through the table saw to rough out the shape. I then attached it
to the wing and shaped it using a hand plane as Jack P described in his
post. Very fun. I'll attach a photo.
Thanks all,
John E
too cold in the shop these days - Greenville, Wi
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Checked by AVG.
12/10/2008 9:30 AM
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: gas tank filler neck options |
Sorry, guess I should have read further. Not sure Aircraft Spruce can
help you.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: John Egan
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 9:18 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: gas tank filler neck options
Hi builders,
I have been looking for a gas tank filler neck to extend the hieght of
my gas cap. I can not find what I want, and I wonder if you guys know
if this item is out there some where?
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: gas tank filler neck options |
John,
Try speed shops like summit racing. They have filler necks for
various applications. Something like Summit SUM-290200 might work,
but it is not cheap.
See at: http://tinyurl.com/69rrgq
HTH,
Jeff
At 7:18 AM -0800 12/10/08, John Egan wrote:
>Hi builders,
>
>I have been looking for a gas tank filler neck to extend the hieght
>of my gas cap. I can not find what I want, and I wonder if you guys
>know if this item is out there some where?
...
--
_____________________________________________________________
Jeffrey H. Boatright, PhD
Associate Professor, Emory Eye Center, Atlanta, GA, USA
Senior Editor, Molecular Vision, http://www.molvis.org/molvis
mailto:jboatri@emory.edu
Message 7
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| Subject: | gas tank filler neck options |
Not sure if you're willing to cut off the neck that you have and weld in a new
one,
but that could definitely be done. Another way would be to cut off the top part
of your existing neck with a tubing cutter or hacksaw, then weld in an extension.
It sounds like you're looking for something that could be screwed right into your
existing neck to bring it a bit higher but you'd have to make your own.
You can get a neck from an auto junkyard by cutting the neck off an old fuel tank
but it would have to be an older vehicle
without the screw-in cap. Or browse Summit Racing or Moroso- they have all kinds
of filler necks available for building your own tanks. I got the filler neck for
my smoke oil tank from Summit but it's for a radiator cap, not a fuel filler cap.
Search their website on "filler neck" or something like that.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
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| Subject: | Leaing ege follow up |
I appreciate the responses I have received about my leading edge posts. If
I did not want to hear what others think, I would not ask. So thanks to you
all.
-
I do feel that some of you miss the point from time to time. Quite a few re
sponded with how they made their leading edge stick and commented on how ea
sy it is. That's fine, but I never asked how to make one or whether or not
it was difficult. It seemed people assumed that because I was leaning away
from a leading edge stick that-I did not know how to make one or that I d
id not want to use/invest in hand tools to do it. Not the case.
-
It also seems that quite often-many respond with artificial facts or thou
ghts that don't exist. Almost like putting words in my mouth. From what I u
nderstand, plywood sheet needs to be used with a stick leading edge. I am n
ot sure how not using one leads to more work. No one had any problems makin
g a pre bend jig for the ribs, why is making a jig for the plywood now too
involved or complex? I never mentioned making a steamer. I used a 4" piece
of PVC filled with water for my cap strips, I know my bath tub will soak my
plywood just fine. I have no intention on hurrying my build just to have i
t done when some think it should. I believe the time I spend tweaking thing
s is an education and time well spent. If I don't contribute to adding to t
he number of Pietenpols in the air anytime soon, so be it.
-
Many speak about Mr. Pietenpol not having a formal education. But yet he ma
de a plane proven to fly. Who is to say that myself, or any of us are in th
e same situation? How did we go from Model A to Continental?- Then there
are those that cut out an access in the wing for the pilot to get in and ou
t. Wow, talk about a design change! Not on the plan, but someone thought of
it and it worked. I doubt that everyone who ever made a change to the Piet
enpol has an aeronautical degree.
-
I, personally, do not want a cookie cutter Piet. I want it to be different
more then just with paint, even if the changes will never be seen. I want t
o save weight everywhere I can and I don't feel that the research, question
ing and time are a waste. I am just wired that way, I need to tweak. Buildi
ng by the book if fine, seems most of you go that way, it is just not my wa
y.
-
So, to wrap this up, I ask to be mind full of what is really being asked an
d limit the assumptions when responding.
-
Thanks again.
-
Message 9
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| Subject: | Old PopSci's available from 1930s via Google |
I figured if anyone would appreciate this, the Piet group would...
Google has just made various historic magazine archives available (for
free!!!), including Popular Science. This isn't in their "regular" google
search but in the "Books" search (on their homepage, click the "more" link
and go to "Books"). As many of you know, Pop Sci and related magazines
during the 1920s and 1930s was full of interesting, bizzarre, and some
now-classic ideas in the aviation world, everything from "How I set my
glider records" by Mr. Bowlus (with a stunning 1,500 feet above the takoff
point!) to stories about boat-car-submarine-spaceships. Here's a link to get
started...
http://books.google.com/books?id=gSkDAAAAMBAJ&source=gbs_all_issues_r&cad=2_
2
Enjoy!
-Mike
Mike Whaley
MerlinFAC@cfl.rr.com
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: gas tank construction |
I have been looking at this product for quite some time in considering
building my gas tank does anyone have experience with the Super alloy 5. Seems
a
bit pricey but it it works as well as the demo video shows I may give it a
shot.
_http://www.muggyweld.com/5clip2.html_ (http://www.muggyweld.com/5clip2.html)
Has anyone tried this stuff?
John
In a message dated 12/10/2008 11:48:21 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
taildrags@hotmail.com writes:
--> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com>
Not sure if you're willing to cut off the neck that you have and weld in a
new one,
but that could definitely be done. Another way would be to cut off the top
part
of your existing neck with a tubing cutter or hacksaw, then weld in an
extension.
It sounds like you're looking for something that could be screwed right into
your
existing neck to bring it a bit higher but you'd have to make your own.
You can get a neck from an auto junkyard by cutting the neck off an old fuel
tank
but it would have to be an older vehicle
without the screw-in cap. Or browse Summit Racing or Moroso- they have all
kinds
of filler necks available for building your own tanks. I got the filler
neck for
my smoke oil tank from Summit but it's for a radiator cap, not a fuel filler
cap.
Search their website on "filler neck" or something like that.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
**************Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and
favorite sites in one place. Try it now.
Message 11
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| Subject: | Old PopSci's available from 1930s via Google |
Too Cool.
People were apparently a lot more self-sufficient way back when.
I could spend hours looking through those old magazines.
Now, how am I going to find time to build.
Thanks for the link, Mike.
Bill C.
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: gas tank construction |
John,
Yeah, I have some.
Takes a little knack to use. But the big thing is,,,(good or bad) is
that it's somekind of lower melting temp aluminum stick with a flux
attached.
The end result is two pieces of aluminum that is kind of "soldered"
together.
The TIG process actually melts the two pieces, and the filler into one
piece.
Where this "solders" the two together.
To me,,,this falls under the thoughts of "what don't I want to fail
while at 5000ft." Probably the fuel tank would be on the top of the
list.
I ordered my alum sheet from ACS&S, along with the filler neck and drain
fittings.
Cut out the patterns for sides and ends and bottom, drilled all the
holes for all fittings.
Then "built" the tank by drilling tiny holes about every 4 inches along
the edges so I could put little wire loops to hold the tank together.
(this way the welder doesn't have to restle with pieces).
If using steel wire, they can tack all over and remove the wire. Then
final weld.
Actually I tried to TIG myself, but being a TIG novice, the leak test
proved to be a watering can effect.
Had a friend reweld both tanks with beautiful results, for $50.00.
10 gal tank in the center section. And a 14 gallon tank in the nose. As
per my mentor,,,no baffles in either.
The attached pic is of my first attempt. The design was sound but leaky
walt evans
NX140DL
----- Original Message -----
From: AMsafetyC@aol.com
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 1:25 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: gas tank construction
I have been looking at this product for quite some time in considering
building my gas tank does anyone have experience with the Super alloy 5.
Seems a bit pricey but it it works as well as the demo video shows I may
give it a shot.
http://www.muggyweld.com/5clip2.html
Has anyone tried this stuff?
John
In a message dated 12/10/2008 11:48:21 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
taildrags@hotmail.com writes:
<taildrags@hotmail.com>
Not sure if you're willing to cut off the neck that you have and
weld in a new one,
but that could definitely be done. Another way would be to cut off
the top part
of your existing neck with a tubing cutter or hacksaw, then weld in
an extension.
It sounds like you're looking for something that could be screwed
right into your
existing neck to bring it a bit higher but you'd have to make your
own.
You can get a neck from an auto junkyard by cutting the neck off an
old fuel tank
but it would have to be an older vehicle
without the screw-in cap. Or browse Summit Racing or Moroso- they
have all kinds
of filler necks available for building your own tanks. I got the
filler neck for
my smoke oil tank from Summit but it's for a radiator cap, not a
fuel filler cap.
Search their website on "filler neck" or something like that.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at sp; (And Get Some AWESOME FREE find you for
-Matt Dralle, List e the es y - MATRONICS
WEB FORUMS
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in one ncid=emlcntaolcom00000010">Try it now.
Message 13
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| Subject: | gas tank filler neck options |
Hi John, you should be able to get a piece of tube turned up that will
thread into the tank, and be threaded for the cap at the other end, to
extend the filler without welding. Alternatively you could make a recess in
the front deck to accommodate the filler, perhaps it could have a flush
cover. Regards, Mike T.
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Egan
Sent: Thursday, 11 December 2008 4:18 a.m.
Subject: Pietenpol-List: gas tank filler neck options
Hi builders,
I have been looking for a gas tank filler neck to extend the hieght of my
gas cap. I can not find what I want, and I wonder if you guys know if this
item is out there some where?
I am using a J-3 style fuel tank located in the nose. Because the top of
the tank is limited in roundness, I can only locate the stock tank so the
gas cap is not quite sticking out of the cowling. I would like another inch
or 1-1/2" higher cap location. I am therefor looking for a longer filler
neck or coupling to to thread on to the tank and raise the cap hieght. The
J-3 style tank is from Wag-Aero (E-316-000). I notice Wag-Aero sells a
steel filler neck that looks taller in thier picture, however when I called
Wag-Aero to inquire on the hieght of the neck and if it has threads, they
can not answer my questions because they do not typically stock that part.
If I can not find an easy solution, I could modify (cut and weld) a short
piece of steel tube to the existing neck. I'll attach a photo of the tank.
So, I'm wondering if anyone knows if I can get a longer threaded filler neck
for this tank?
Also, regarding the leading edge of the wing discussion, I bought a 14' long
douglas fir 2x8 for $9. I ripped it down the length at the center line at
the appropriate angle to mount to the wing, then ran each piece through the
table saw to rough out the shape. I then attached it to the wing and shaped
it using a hand plane as Jack P described in his post. Very fun. I'll
attach a photo.
Thanks all,
John E
too cold in the shop these days - Greenville, Wi
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Super strong, super simple leading edge |
It sure is nice to know I share a soapbox with a great guy like Jack Phillips!
Do Not Archive
Don Emch
NX899DE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=218751#218751
Message 15
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Okay would all of you guys get off the soap box so I can get some soap
and take
a shower ? I've been working outside all day and sweating like a pig
in 35 F
weather so I could use a hot shower and good meal.
You know the view IS better from atop the soap box too but it can lead
to a nose
bleed since normally I don't fly that high.
Back to your normally scheduled programming.
Mike C.
do not archive
Message 16
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| Subject: | quite a ways off topic |
For all who might be interested, for the others, just delete.
Iditirod,,,
My CFI, who has given me my BFR for the last MANY years has always
talked of racing the Iditarod.
She has been training for years, and now is going to do it.
She is one of the most qualified female pilots, if not the MOST
qualified Female pilot in the USA right now.
She is in Michigan right now training, and if anyone can win it, she
can.
Just spoke to her Mother tonite about a contribution that I made. And
it's a go.
This girl has every instructor rating that there is, and was flying
727's out of Newark, NJ, as an ATP at 28 years old.
She's fun to fly with, and dead on with her instruction.
It's good, cause every time I see for an hour of instruction,,,I always
get my hug.
She even invited Harrison Ford, to his face, to compete in a Helo
compitition with her.
PS The first entry ever for the Iditarod from NJ
walt evans
NX140DL
http://www.iditarod.com/
http://www.iditarod.com/race/musherprofiles/musherbio_326.html
http://www.huskyhavenraceteam.com/
do not archive
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Soapboxes... hmmm... I wonder if you could flatten them out like old
Quaker Oats cartons and use them to make the leading edges of your wings?
(Sorry, Mikee- I couldn't stand to listen to your singing in the shower
so I had to throw out something to laugh at).
I will have to say in all honesty that the leading edges of 41CC catch
their share of bumps and knocks and I'm glad there is solid wood there.
The paint is a bit chafed here and there along the LE of both wings from
various things, not to mention the dust-up four years ago Veterans Day
when the airplane went over on its back, but still sound as can be and
I didn't touch the wings after the nose-over incident.
One of these days I'll pull out the yellow Poly-Tone and a brush and
touch up the wings, I guess.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Leaing ege follow up |
Guys:
This leading edge thing is getting wayyyy out of hand.
The leading edge on the Pietenpol wing, as designed, is not structural.
The ribs give it an airfoil shape, and the nose piece of wood holds the
front of the ribs together. Bernie (supposedly) used cardboard for the
covering WHICH GOES ONLY FROM THE LEADING EDGE TO THE TOP OF THE SPAR!
We could also use cardboard, aluminum, plywood, or nothing at all with
equal success and would lose no structural strength whatsoever. A
number of the old biplanes (such as the Travel Air and pretty much
everything from WWI) used nothing at all, just the fabric. You can see
this in any photo where the fabric is scalloped between the nose ribs.
This causes no loss of aerodynamics or strength, and I have never heard
of a bird strike bringing down an airplane. And yes, I have hit birds
with the Travel Air, they just bounce off.
Wrapping plywood all the way around the leading edge from spar to spar
would create, as many have pointed out, a "D box" spar for no good
purpose that I can think of. It would be strong as a bridge where it is
not necessary, it would be a b**ch to build (wrapping ply on that sharp
radius at the nose is going to be damned difficult, and it could well
shift a bunch of loads into an area where they were not meant to be.
The only airplanes I have ever seen with a wooden D box front spar are
cantilever wings (Cessna Airmaster, Fokker D VII, etc) Now, if you are
going for a cantilever Pietenpol, I'd love to see it!!
Anyway, Mike, have a beer and chill. No one is trying to put words into
your mouth. By the way, the wing cut out for the pilot to enter the
cockpit was in the original design, so when you "talk about a design
change", you might want to use another example.
Gene
working on my Model A engine
Message 19
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| Subject: | Leaing ege follow up |
Gene,
The PFA (now LAA) in the UK "require" a D section on the leading edge of the
wing. I did mine that way and have no regrets.
Peter
Wonthaggi Australia
http://www.cpc-world.com <http://www.cpc-world.com/>
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene Rambo
Sent: Thursday, 11 December 2008 1:59 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Leaing ege follow up
Guys:
This leading edge thing is getting wayyyy out of hand.
The leading edge on the Pietenpol wing, as designed, is not structural. The
ribs give it an airfoil shape, and the nose piece of wood holds the front of
the ribs together. Bernie (supposedly) used cardboard for the covering
WHICH GOES ONLY FROM THE LEADING EDGE TO THE TOP OF THE SPAR! We could also
use cardboard, aluminum, plywood, or nothing at all with equal success and
would lose no structural strength whatsoever. A number of the old biplanes
(such as the Travel Air and pretty much everything from WWI) used nothing at
all, just the fabric. You can see this in any photo where the fabric is
scalloped between the nose ribs. This causes no loss of aerodynamics or
strength, and I have never heard of a bird strike bringing down an airplane.
And yes, I have hit birds with the Travel Air, they just bounce off.
Wrapping plywood all the way around the leading edge from spar to spar would
create, as many have pointed out, a "D box" spar for no good purpose that I
can think of. It would be strong as a bridge where it is not necessary, it
would be a b**ch to build (wrapping ply on that sharp radius at the nose is
going to be damned difficult, and it could well shift a bunch of loads into
an area where they were not meant to be. The only airplanes I have ever
seen with a wooden D box front spar are cantilever wings (Cessna Airmaster,
Fokker D VII, etc) Now, if you are going for a cantilever Pietenpol, I'd
love to see it!!
Anyway, Mike, have a beer and chill. No one is trying to put words into
your mouth. By the way, the wing cut out for the pilot to enter the cockpit
was in the original design, so when you "talk about a design change", you
might want to use another example.
Gene
working on my Model A engine
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