---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 12/21/08: 27 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:44 AM - Re: Wing tip bow (Ed G.) 2. 07:23 AM - Re: Wing tip bow (amsafetyc@aol.com) 3. 07:32 AM - Squaring up (amsafetyc@aol.com) 4. 08:27 AM - Re: Squaring up (Michael Perez) 5. 08:42 AM - Re: Squaring up (amsafetyc@aol.com) 6. 08:50 AM - Ford fuel insemination (Pieti Lowell) 7. 12:13 PM - Re: Ford fuel insemination (Michael Perez) 8. 12:44 PM - Re: Squaring up (Michael Perez) 9. 12:50 PM - Re: Squaring up (Michael Perez) 10. 01:06 PM - Re: Squaring up (Michael Perez) 11. 01:18 PM - Re: Squaring up (Michael Perez) 12. 01:42 PM - Santa checkride joke... (Rob Stapleton, Jr.) 13. 02:18 PM - Re: Santa checkride joke... (Gary Boothe) 14. 02:22 PM - Re: Squaring up (Ray Krause) 15. 02:37 PM - Re: Squaring up (Ray Krause) 16. 03:08 PM - Re: Santa checkride joke... (ALAN LYSCARS) 17. 03:37 PM - Ford fuel insemination (Oscar Zuniga) 18. 04:03 PM - Re: Ford fuel insemination (Michael Perez) 19. 04:19 PM - Fuel tank near electrical (Rick Holland) 20. 04:23 PM - Fuel tank and electonics (Rick Holland) 21. 04:32 PM - Re: Ford fuel insemination (Michael Silvius) 22. 04:43 PM - Re: Ford fuel insemination (Pieti Lowell) 23. 05:17 PM - Re: Ford fuel insemination (Pieti Lowell) 24. 06:01 PM - Re: Squaring up (Dick N.) 25. 06:03 PM - Re: Re: Ford fuel insemination (Jeff Boatright) 26. 06:04 PM - Ford fuel insemination (Oscar Zuniga) 27. 11:25 PM - Re: Squaring up (Clif Dawson) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:44:36 AM PST US From: "Ed G." Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Wing tip bow Hi John If you'll send me your snail mail address I'll put together some d rawings=2C photos and directions like I was going to do for Michael. If I p ut it on the list you'll get so many opinions and variations that you wont know where to start. I'll keep a copy and maybe others can use them in the future. Unfortunately I lost the photos that I took while doing it when my hard drive crashed last summer. I still have my jig so I can take some pict ures of it. I learned to laminate while making curvy teak and holly sailboa t tillers years ago. It's not something everyone has done so it can be a li ttle intimidating the first time you do it but it's not hard to do. Ed Gr entzer om: amsafetyc@aol.comDate: Sat=2C 20 Dec 2008 18:07:49 +0000 Don't know about Michael but I would love a set. I am always willing to lea rn from others. Saves me from reinventing the wheelJohnJohn Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry From: "Ed G." Date: Sat=2C 20 Dec 2008 07:55:51 -0500To: piet-list piet-lis tSubject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Wing tip bow Hi Michael Please don't take this the wrong way=2C I'm only trying to be of help. I don't know anything about you or your level of woodworking skill s. But "IF" your reason for wanting to use a straight piece of wood for you r wing tip bows is that you are intimidated by the process of laminating th e curved ones I will be glad to snail mail you detailed drawings and direct ions on how it's done. You're welcome to e-mail me off list if you want. Th ey are easy=2C almost fun to make and very rewarding. A straight line betw een the nose and tip of a rib is way down near the bottom edge. The spars w ould need to be cut to match them. As a compression strut they would be way off center causing the spars to twist under load unless you added an upper strut and the drag wires' geometry would have an upward component unless t hey were moved to the center of the spar somehow. If that is not your re ason then please make them however you want. Ed Grentzer Fl. t: Re: Pietenpol-List: Wing tip bowTo: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sorry Walt=2C I will build my plane the way I want to. Sorry you interpret my questions as a negative. For the others=2C thanks or the posts and the link to those great pictures. I was not thinking of a flat boeard as the pictures show=2C I was going to use a tip=2C just not curved. We'll see=2C not quite there yet. --- On Fri =2C 12/19/08=2C walt wrote: From: walt Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Wing tip bowTo : pietenpol-list@matronics.comDate: Friday=2C December 19=2C 2008=2C 6:34 P M Good for you Ed G.! Build to the plans. PS This isn't a "what can I change on the plans"=2C site. PPS To me =2C It's belittleing Bernard Pietenpol's talents=2C to try to ch ange his plans. walt evansNX140DL ----- Original Message ----- From: Ed G. Sent: Friday=2C December 19=2C 2008 10:59 AM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Wing tip bow One of the many things I have learned while building my Piet over the last eight years is that the master has already figuered out most of the "what ifs" for us. That's why we bought his plans. Yes=2C somethings need to be c hanged to work in todays airport environment=2C BUT. Everything that I have changed has added extra planning and changeing at least one something else to work with the change which requires more planning and experimenting whi ch adds exponentially to the build time. So=2C I have learned that at least with my limited time to devote to my Piet=2C If I ever plan to fly the thi ng=2C I had better quit "Changeing" and "Planning" and keep building. It's amazing how much progress can be made when just building to the plans. Ed G. Do Not archive href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http: //www.matronics.com/chref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-L ist">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List href="http://forum s.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D 3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D ===================== ky=B7=E8 =9E=DB"=CD=ED=9C=A2Z+=D3M4=D3G=DAq=E7(=BA=B8=9E=AEw=B0r=8B=AB=89=EA=CF- =E6=ACy+=A9=8A=EDb=8B=AB.+-=B18b=B0=CA'=B6=10'tg=ADJ=89=9E=01a=128=C1=05 DA=06=89=FBl6=8B=DE=99=B7=AB=8A=CBax 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iUuKy2G22g0K/yAwmatronicscom/NavigatorPietenpolLissNCmjAE0TjSCAlhARTkVDEkmpn IK3mrXKJ7Xp7WpbKGr2opWm5Xr4mrYXlnmxaK7prGoa3n4bbaf/36K7prJmra6J4nLHKJobbaf/3 6K7prJmra6J4nLHKJv2v2/36J7f6a3v26Hcv4bZpPQ0KDQo ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:27:34 AM PST US From: Michael Perez Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Squaring up John, I am building my first wing right now as well. If your spars are not bent and twisted to bad, you have nothing to worry about. When it comes tim e to make use of the drag wires in the wing as well as rigging the wings to the fuselage, that is when you can get it all in alignment.- Keep in min d that wood will continue to move, swell, twist, bend, etc. over time. Even after the wing is built, I am told they are quite easy to twist and shift. They don't get stiff until rigged and covered. So, a perfect wing "on the jig" will more then likely move around a bit once it is removed and put out of the way for later covering. - I have my first wing on my mobile table I made. I used some scrap 5" wood a s a fence on one end to keep the spar ends even. I have a second fence 90 d egrees to the first about 3 feel long as a guide for the length of the spar . The rib locations are marked on the spars from top to bottom using a squa re to make sure they are perpendicular to the spars. I epoxy in place 3 rib s at a time and clamp them just enough to draw the spar up to the vertical rib support. (minimal epoxy squeeze out.)- This process in effect will "w alk" out any minor twist in the spars. I let these three ribs sit overnight and then do 3 more, working from one end of the spars to the other. I only have my spars clamped at the ends up against the fence and the forward spa r along the 3 foot fence. The rest of the front spar and rear-spar are le ft to "float". You will find that if you keep the spar ends equal and the r ibs perpendicular to the spars, the wing is somewhat self aligning. By clamping the spars to the vertical rib supports, the spars will kinda self adjust assuming those vertical supports are square and not twisted. As lon g as-your ribs are made the same and the cap strips are square to each ot her, (the rib is true in every plane) as you work from one end to the other , the wing will be just fine. - I have pictures of my current setup right now if interested. I will be epox ying ribs 10,11,and 12 today. ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:42:26 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Squaring up From: amsafetyc@aol.com TWlrZQ0KDQpUaGFua3MgZm9yIHRoZSBpbmZvIGFuZCB5ZXMgSSB3b3VsZCBsb3ZlIHRvIHNlZSB0 aGUgcGljcy4gUGxlYXNlIHNlbmQgdGhlbSBhbG9uZyB3aGVuIHlvdSBnZXQgYSBjaGFuY2UuIA0K DQpKb2huDQpCdWlsZGFwYWxvb3phIDA4IGlzIHVuZGVyd2F5IQ0KU2VudCBmcm9tIG15IFZlcml6 b24gV2lyZWxlc3MgQmxhY2tCZXJyeQ0KDQotLS0tLU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KRnJv bTogTWljaGFlbCBQZXJleiA8c3BlZWRicmFrZUBzYmNnbG9iYWwubmV0Pg0KDQpEYXRlOiBTdW4s IDIxIERlYyAyMDA4IDA4OjI2OjIzIA0KVG86IDxwaWV0ZW5wb2wtbGlzdEBtYXRyb25pY3MuY29t Pg0KU3ViamVjdDogUmU6IFBpZXRlbnBvbC1MaXN0OiBTcXVhcmluZyB1cA0KDQoNCg0KSm9obiwg SSBhbSBidWlsZGluZyBteSBmaXJzdCB3aW5nIHJpZ2h0IG5vdyBhcyB3ZWxsLiBJZiB5b3VyIHNw YXJzIGFyZSBub3QgYmVudCBhbmQgdHdpc3RlZCB0byBiYWQsIHlvdSBoYXZlIG5vdGhpbmcgdG8g d29ycnkgYWJvdXQuIFdoZW4gaXQgY29tZXMgdGltZSB0byBtYWtlIHVzZSBvZiB0aGUgZHJhZyB3 aXJlcyBpbiB0aGUgd2luZyBhcyB3ZWxsIGFzIHJpZ2dpbmcgdGhlIHdpbmdzIHRvIHRoZSBmdXNl bGFnZSwgdGhhdCBpcyB3aGVuIHlvdSBjYW4gZ2V0IGl0IGFsbCBpbiBhbGlnbm1lbnQuoCBLZWVw IGluIG1pbmQgdGhhdCB3b29kIHdpbGwgY29udGludWUgdG8gbW92ZSwgc3dlbGwsIHR3aXN0LCBi ZW5kLCBldGMuIG92ZXIgdGltZS4gRXZlbiBhZnRlciB0aGUgd2luZyBpcyBidWlsdCwgSSBhbSB0 b2xkIHRoZXkgYXJlIHF1aXRlIGVhc3kgdG8gdHdpc3QgYW5kIHNoaWZ0LiBUaGV5IGRvbid0IGdl dCBzdGlmZiB1bnRpbCByaWdnZWQgYW5kIGNvdmVyZWQuIFNvLCBhIHBlcmZlY3Qgd2luZyAib24g dGhlIGppZyIgd2lsbCBtb3JlIHRoZW4gbGlrZWx5IG1vdmUgYXJvdW5kIGEgYml0IG9uY2UgaXQg aXMgcmVtb3ZlZCBhbmQgcHV0IG91dCBvZiB0aGUgd2F5IGZvciBsYXRlciBjb3ZlcmluZy4gDQqg DQpJIGhhdmUgbXkgZmlyc3Qgd2luZyBvbiBteSBtb2JpbGUgdGFibGUgSSBtYWRlLiBJIHVzZWQg c29tZSBzY3JhcCA1IiB3b29kIGFzIGEgZmVuY2Ugb24gb25lIGVuZCB0byBrZWVwIHRoZSBzcGFy IGVuZHMgZXZlbi4gSSBoYXZlIGEgc2Vjb25kIGZlbmNlIDkwIGRlZ3JlZXMgdG8gdGhlIGZpcnN0 IGFib3V0IDMgZmVlbCBsb25nIGFzIGEgZ3VpZGUgZm9yIHRoZSBsZW5ndGggb2YgdGhlIHNwYXIu IFRoZSByaWIgbG9jYXRpb25zIGFyZSBtYXJrZWQgb24gdGhlIHNwYXJzIGZyb20gdG9wIHRvIGJv dHRvbSB1c2luZyBhIHNxdWFyZSB0byBtYWtlIHN1cmUgdGhleSBhcmUgcGVycGVuZGljdWxhciB0 byB0aGUgc3BhcnMuIEkgZXBveHkgaW4gcGxhY2UgMyByaWJzIGF0IGEgdGltZSBhbmQgY2xhbXAg dGhlbSBqdXN0IGVub3VnaCB0byBkcmF3IHRoZSBzcGFyIHVwIHRvIHRoZSB2ZXJ0aWNhbCByaWIg c3VwcG9ydC4gKG1pbmltYWwgZXBveHkgc3F1ZWV6ZSBvdXQuKaAgVGhpcyBwcm9jZXNzIGluIGVm ZmVjdCB3aWxsICJ3YWxrIiBvdXQgYW55IG1pbm9yIHR3aXN0IGluIHRoZSBzcGFycy4gSSBsZXQg dGhlc2UgdGhyZWUgcmlicyBzaXQgb3Zlcm5pZ2h0IGFuZCB0aGVuIGRvIDMgbW9yZSwgd29ya2lu ZyBmcm9tIG9uZSBlbmQgb2YgdGhlIHNwYXJzIHRvIHRoZSBvdGhlci4gSSBvbmx5IGhhdmUgbXkg c3BhcnMgY2xhbXBlZCBhdCB0aGUgZW5kcyB1cCBhZ2FpbnN0IHRoZSBmZW5jZSBhbmQgdGhlIGZv cndhcmQgc3BhciBhbG9uZyB0aGUgMyBmb290IGZlbmNlLiBUaGUgcmVzdCBvZiB0aGUgZnJvbnQg c3BhciBhbmQgcmVhcqBzcGFyIGFyZSBsZWZ0IHRvICJmbG9hdCIuIFlvdSB3aWxsIGZpbmQgdGhh dCBpZiB5b3Uga2VlcCB0aGUgc3BhciBlbmRzIGVxdWFsIGFuZCB0aGUgcmlicyBwZXJwZW5kaWN1 bGFyIHRvIHRoZSBzcGFycywgdGhlIHdpbmcgaXMgc29tZXdoYXQgc2VsZiBhbGlnbmluZy4gQnkN CiBjbGFtcGluZyB0aGUgc3BhcnMgdG8gdGhlIHZlcnRpY2FsIHJpYiBzdXBwb3J0cywgdGhlIHNw YXJzIHdpbGwga2luZGEgc2VsZiBhZGp1c3QgYXNzdW1pbmcgdGhvc2UgdmVydGljYWwgc3VwcG9y dHMgYXJlIHNxdWFyZSBhbmQgbm90IHR3aXN0ZWQuIEFzIGxvbmcgYXOgeW91ciByaWJzIGFyZSBt YWRlIHRoZSBzYW1lIGFuZCB0aGUgY2FwIHN0cmlwcyBhcmUgc3F1YXJlIHRvIGVhY2ggb3RoZXIs ICh0aGUgcmliIGlzIHRydWUgaW4gZXZlcnkgcGxhbmUpIGFzIHlvdSB3b3JrIGZyb20gb25lIGVu ZCB0byB0aGUgb3RoZXIsIHRoZSB3aW5nIHdpbGwgYmUganVzdCBmaW5lLiANCqANCkkgaGF2ZSBw aWN0dXJlcyBvZiBteSBjdXJyZW50IHNldHVwIHJpZ2h0IG5vdyBpZiBpbnRlcmVzdGVkLiBJIHdp bGwgYmUgZXBveHlpbmcgcmlicyAxMCwxMSxhbmQgMTIgdG9kYXkuIA0KDQo ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:50:51 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Ford fuel insemination From: "Pieti Lowell" Has anyone tried or thought of injecting the Ford A or B ? Pieti Lowell Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=220401#220401 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/injection_assy_744.jpg ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 12:13:18 PM PST US From: Michael Perez Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Ford fuel insemination I have not, but that would be great!- I can't think of any reason off the top of my head why it could not be done. - ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 12:44:36 PM PST US From: Michael Perez Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Squaring up O.K., Not sure how many pictures I can put on a single post, so I may have to send multiple replies. - This- first picture shows the small oak fences screwed to my table at exa ctly 90 degrees. At the end of the table is the larger fence that is screwe d to the smaller oak. The very ends of the spars are butted here and clampe d to the fence. I put my front spar 6" away from the front small oak fence. (Just a made up measurement. I wanted to make sure the ribs did not hit th e front fence.) The dark wood block further down the spar is also 6" clampe d to the fence and the spar to maintain parrallel. The spar ends are now ev en and the front spar is locked square to the ends. The ribs themselves pro perly space the rear spar. The spars are up on spaces that I will show you in my next picture. Note the wood wedges between the rib tops and the front spar top. These are added after the ribs have dried overnight. ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 12:50:52 PM PST US From: Michael Perez Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Squaring up This attached picture shows the two small oak fences as well as the larger end fence. The spar ends are clamped on top of the small end fence to keep the spars from resting on top of the inside of the ribs and to give me working room. ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 01:06:19 PM PST US From: Michael Perez Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Squaring up All right, here you will see toward the end of the table another piece of oak used to maintain the same height as the front small fence under the spars. Notice nothing is clamped to the table or tool box. I allow the spars to float and let the ribs do the alignment. The green weights strapped to the spar with rags is just there to keep some down force on the wing so that it won't sway if bumped. The three bar clamps clamp the spars snugly to the rib verticals and remove any twist out of the spar. Just enough to lay the spar upagainst the verticles...you don't want to pre-stress the ribs or squeeze out the epoxy here. As I said, I do three ribs at a time working from the end fence allowing each set to dry overnight. I will do the end rib and tip rib tomorrow. The end rib is not in place in the first photo because I could not rest the spars on the small oak fence nor butt the spars against the large fence had Itbeen there. ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 01:18:07 PM PST US From: Michael Perez Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Squaring up Lastly, this shows-a rib location mark on the spars. These are drawn squa re to the spars and as long as the ribs at each spar are on these lines, an d the ends of the spars are even, (against the end fence) all is square. We ll, I believe good enough to get you to the rigging and covering stage. The small arrow near the line is to remind me on which side of the line the ri b goes. Not needed for the end rib, but helpful for all the other ribs. Rem ember to plot your rib locations on both spars and put the ribs in place. R un string to simulate the drag cables and adjust the ribs to clear. Mark th ese new locations, disassemble the wing and square up these new location ma rks to the spar. (perpendicular) Patience here, and be mindful that you hav e the right ends of the spars at the end fence and that you don't have one upside down, etc. - Sorry for the multiple posts and I hope some of what I have said is helpful . If I can assists any further, let me know. I can take more/better picture s if needed as well. Good Luck! ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 01:42:53 PM PST US From: "Rob Stapleton, Jr." Subject: Pietenpol-List: Santa checkride joke... I was wondering who sent that story about Santa getting an FAA checkride, and wondered if I could use it in the EAA Chap 42 newsletter? It seems to have dropped off the list, at least I can't find it.. Thanks, Rob Anchorage AK Do not archive ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 02:18:07 PM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Santa checkride joke... Rob, I can't answer your question, but I think the check ride has been cancelled. Gary Boothe Cool, Ca. Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion Tail done, working on fuselage (endless metal parts!) (12 ribs down.) _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rob Stapleton, Jr. Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2008 1:39 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Santa checkride joke... I was wondering who sent that story about Santa getting an FAA checkride, and wondered if I could use it in the EAA Chap 42 newsletter? It seems to have dropped off the list, at least I can't find it.. Thanks, Rob Anchorage AK Do not archive ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 02:22:44 PM PST US From: "Ray Krause" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Squaring up Michael, This is Ray Krause, a newbie to this site. I am just starting on my Pietenpol and would appreciate seeing your pictures, also. My e-mail is RayKrause@frontiernet.net. I recently completed a Sonex Waiex plane. Beautiful and fast. The Pietenpol will replace my J-3 for slow and low flying. I just need to be building something! Thanks, Ray Krause N51YX, Waiex, TD, Jab 3300 (1197), AeroCarb, Sensinich 54X62 wood prop, Dynon D-180, Garmin SL-30, 327, 296, 65 hrs. ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael Perez To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2008 8:26 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Squaring up John, I am building my first wing right now as well. If your spars are not bent and twisted to bad, you have nothing to worry about. When it comes time to make use of the drag wires in the wing as well as rigging the wings to the fuselage, that is when you can get it all in alignment. Keep in mind that wood will continue to move, swell, twist, bend, etc. over time. Even after the wing is built, I am told they are quite easy to twist and shift. They don't get stiff until rigged and covered. So, a perfect wing "on the jig" will more then likely move around a bit once it is removed and put out of the way for later covering. I have my first wing on my mobile table I made. I used some scrap 5" wood as a fence on one end to keep the spar ends even. I have a second fence 90 degrees to the first about 3 feel long as a guide for the length of the spar. The rib locations are marked on the spars from top to bottom using a square to make sure they are perpendicular to the spars. I epoxy in place 3 ribs at a time and clamp them just enough to draw the spar up to the vertical rib support. (minimal epoxy squeeze out.) This process in effect will "walk" out any minor twist in the spars. I let these three ribs sit overnight and then do 3 more, working from one end of the spars to the other. I only have my spars clamped at the ends up against the fence and the forward spar along the 3 foot fence. The rest of the front spar and rear spar are left to "float". You will find that if you keep the spar ends equal and the ribs perpendicular to the spars, the wing is somewhat self aligning. By clamping the spars to the vertical rib supports, the spars will kinda self adjust assuming those vertical supports are square and not twisted. As long as your ribs are made the same and the cap strips are square to each other, (the rib is true in every plane) as you work from one end to the other, the wing will be just fine. I have pictures of my current setup right now if interested. I will be epoxying ribs 10,11,and 12 today. 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:37:22 PM PST US From: "Ray Krause" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Squaring up Thanks, Michael! Thanks, Ray Krause N51YX, Waiex, TD, Jab 3300 (1197), AeroCarb, Sensinich 54X62 wood prop, Dynon D-180, Garmin SL-30, 327, 296, 65 hrs. ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael Perez To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2008 1:15 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Squaring up Lastly, this shows a rib location mark on the spars. These are drawn square to the spars and as long as the ribs at each spar are on these lines, and the ends of the spars are even, (against the end fence) all is square. Well, I believe good enough to get you to the rigging and covering stage. The small arrow near the line is to remind me on which side of the line the rib goes. Not needed for the end rib, but helpful for all the other ribs. Remember to plot your rib locations on both spars and put the ribs in place. Run string to simulate the drag cables and adjust the ribs to clear. Mark these new locations, disassemble the wing and square up these new location marks to the spar. (perpendicular) Patience here, and be mindful that you have the right ends of the spars at the end fence and that you don't have one upside down, etc. Sorry for the multiple posts and I hope some of what I have said is helpful. If I can assists any further, let me know. I can take more/better pictures if needed as well. Good Luck! ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 03:08:50 PM PST US From: "ALAN LYSCARS" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Santa checkride joke... Rob, It's been around for years, and I've been borrowing it for as long. Haven't got fined yet! Merry Christmas, Al Lyscars B19 Biddeford, Maine Santa Claus, like all pilots, gets regular visits from the Federal Aviation Administration, and the FAA examiner, Orton, arrived last week for the pre-Christmas check ride. In preparation, Santa had his elves wash the sled and bathe all the reindeer. Santa got his logbook out and made sure all his paperwork was in order. He knew they would examine all his equipment and truly put Santa's flying skills to the test. The examiner walked slowly around the sled. He checked all the reindeer harnesses, the landing gear, and even Rudolph's nose. He painstakingly reviewed Santa's weight and balance calculations for sled's enormous payload. Finally, they were ready for the check ride. Santa got in and fastened his seat belt and shoulder harness and checked the compass. Then the FAA examiner hopped in carrying, to Santa's surprise, a shotgun. "What's that for!?" asked Santa incredulously. The FAA examiner winked and said, "I'm not supposed to tell you this ahead of time," as he leaned over to whisper in Santa's ear, "but you're gonna lose an engine on takeoff." ----- Original Message ----- From: Rob Stapleton, Jr. To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2008 4:38 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Santa checkride joke... I was wondering who sent that story about Santa getting an FAA checkride, and wondered if I could use it in the EAA Chap 42 newsletter? It seems to have dropped off the list, at least I can't find it.. Thanks, Rob Anchorage AK Do not archive ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 03:37:04 PM PST US From: Oscar Zuniga Subject: Pietenpol-List: Ford fuel insemination Mike; I guess what Lowell was referring to was the image that was with his post, showing an injected inline Ford. If you can't see that, go to http://forums.matronics.com and go to the Piet forum. You'll see that image attached to the post. Pretty interesting setup and also has a magneto installed pointing forward rather than hung off the back of the Ford like most. It would seem that with so many inline injected 4-cyl. engines on the road these days, taking one off a car and installing it on an airplane wouldn't be too difficult but then again there is the "black box" that controls the darned things. Too many sensors, pickups, wires, and programming details to make them work. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 04:03:54 PM PST US From: Michael Perez Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Ford fuel insemination Copy. I just missed it, to fast to read and not look for attachments. ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 04:19:16 PM PST US From: "Rick Holland" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tank near electrical Is it a problem placing higher voltage electrical components near a fuel tank? In this case two ignition coils and a switcher unit for my Corvair placed on the shelf ahead of the forward instrument panel. Don't know where else I would put them except on the firewall. Thanks Rick -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 04:23:52 PM PST US From: "Rick Holland" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuel tank and electonics ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 04:32:02 PM PST US From: "Michael Silvius" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Ford fuel insemination ----- Original Message ----- From: "Oscar Zuniga" > It would seem that > with so many inline injected 4-cyl. engines on the road these days, taking one > off a car and installing it on an airplane wouldn't be too difficult but then > again there is the "black box" that controls the darned things. Too many > sensors, pickups, wires, and programming details to make them work. > Yes though that one in the photo looked to be a mechanical one taken of a Lycosaurus or something. Michael under 18 inches of white fluffy suff today in Maine ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 04:43:31 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Ford fuel insemination From: "Pieti Lowell" taildrags(at)hotmail.com wrote: > Mike; I guess what Lowell was referring to was the image that was with his post, > showing an injected inline Ford. If you can't see that, go to > http://forums.matronics.com and go to the Piet forum. You'll see that image > attached to the post. > > Pretty interesting setup and also has a magneto installed pointing forward > rather than hung off the back of the Ford like most. It would seem that > with so many inline injected 4-cyl. engines on the road these days, taking one > off a car and installing it on an airplane wouldn't be too difficult but then > again there is the "black box" that controls the darned things. Too many > sensors, pickups, wires, and programming details to make them work. > > Oscar Zuniga > Air Camper NX41CC > San Antonio, TX > mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com > website at http://www.flysquirrel.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=220465#220465 ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 05:17:22 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Ford fuel insemination From: "Pieti Lowell" The Injection body installed on this Ford B, was first tried on a stock Ford A in 1992 and ran for 2 years (110 Hrs ) The increase in RPM ran take-off engine speed at 1450 RPM with a 76X42 Prop. After the trial run the babbit was inspected and was perfect. This A Ford engine was at Oshkosh during that EAA Pietenpol Interview. This Ford B installation has a stock Lambert , 90 HP, prop, (76X57), and will turn 2250 RPM. And by the way there isn't any electronics involved, 4.5 GPH fuel consumption, no carb heat required, primer injects fuel at intake ports. Idles at 550 RPM. Look close at photo , you will see many bolt-on go-fasts. this B Ford has close to 300 Hrs, and no problems. Pieti Lowell Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=220468#220468 ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 06:01:44 PM PST US From: "Dick N." Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Squaring up Welcome to the group, Ray. You will find it helpful and sometimes entertaining. What area are you from? We have members all around the world. Dick N. ----- Original Message ----- From: Ray Krause To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2008 4:19 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Squaring up Michael, This is Ray Krause, a newbie to this site. I am just starting on my Pietenpol and would appreciate seeing your pictures, also. My e-mail is RayKrause@frontiernet.net. I recently completed a Sonex Waiex plane. Beautiful and fast. The Pietenpol will replace my J-3 for slow and low flying. I just need to be building something! Thanks, Ray Krause N51YX, Waiex, TD, Jab 3300 (1197), AeroCarb, Sensinich 54X62 wood prop, Dynon D-180, Garmin SL-30, 327, 296, 65 hrs. ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael Perez ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 06:03:51 PM PST US From: Jeff Boatright Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Ford fuel insemination Pietei Lowell- Impressive engine. Hope to meet you at Brodhead. Jeff ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 06:04:27 PM PST US From: Oscar Zuniga Subject: Pietenpol-List: Ford fuel insemination Mike: careful... real Piets are not fuel injected ;o) In both a light-hearted and yet a serious way, I look at that injected Ford and see not only all of Mr. Pietenpol, but also a lot of what has come after him. No, that engine is not converted according to Mr. Pietenpol's clear and complete details. The leather flex coupling for the mag isn't there, neither is the original carb, and very likely not much of the engine interior is per his details- and yet there it is, a nifty and reliable conversion. Experimental aviation at its finest, and all of it based on the tried-and-true, soon to be 80-year-old design that started life on the floor of a barn. Start with a stable and forgiving platform and tweak to your heart's content. There are not too many marginal aspects of the airplane, so we can do a lot of different things to it and still end up with a good flier. Oscar Zuniga Original, unaltered, true-blue Air Camper NX41CC ;o) San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 11:25:41 PM PST US From: "Clif Dawson" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Squaring up Have you run string through the ribs where the drag wires will go? Just to make sure they will clear all the upright parts of the ribs. If you go into the archives there's many messages over the years indicating that the ribs should be spaced to clear the drag wires and usually a few ribs will be moved a bit from even spacing. It would be a shame to have to cut out and replace rib braces to clear the wires. Apparently if you build exactly to the planes it won't be an issue but a few have moved ribs a half inch one way or the other to have clearance. It was suggested by Graham Hansen that it would be a good idea to set all ribs in place without glueing then install the cross bracing and drag/antidrag wires. If there appears to be a clearance issue then you can move ribs to clear. This could be more of an issue if your designing your own method of drag bracing as some have done. Clif ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael Perez To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2008 8:26 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Squaring up John, I am building my first wing right now as well. If your spars are not bent and twisted to bad, you have nothing to worry about. When it comes time to make use of the drag wires in the wing as well as rigging the wings to the fuselage, that is when you can get it all in alignment. I will be epoxying ribs 10,11,and 12 today. 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com 12/21/2008 3:08 PM ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.