---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 03/30/09: 22 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 02:30 AM - Re: elongating holes (carson) 2. 04:05 AM - Re: elongating holes (helspersew@aol.com) 3. 04:59 AM - Re: Jim Lagowski Pietenpol completion in April Sport Pilot (Glenn Thomas) 4. 07:37 AM - Re: Re: elongating holes (shad bell) 5. 08:10 AM - Re: Riblett Airfoil (Michael Perez) 6. 11:34 AM - some gorgeous photos of a Ford Pietenpol flying in California (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation]) 7. 12:24 PM - Re: some gorgeous photos of a Ford Pietenpol flying in California (Gary Boothe) 8. 12:26 PM - Re: some gorgeous photos of a Ford Pietenpol flying in California (walt) 9. 12:51 PM - Photo resizing tool (jimbir) 10. 01:04 PM - Wingtip attachment (jimbir) 11. 01:26 PM - Re: Photo resizing tool (H RULE) 12. 01:41 PM - Re: Wingtip attachment (Jack T. Textor) 13. 01:52 PM - Re: some gorgeous photos of a Ford Pietenpol flying in Californi (K5YAC) 14. 02:10 PM - Re: Wingtip attachment (jimbir) 15. 02:29 PM - Re: Re: Wingtip attachment (Jack T. Textor) 16. 04:00 PM - Re: Hand propping a 65 (Lagowski Morrow) 17. 04:33 PM - Re: Hand propping a 65 (H RULE) 18. 04:35 PM - Re: Hand propping a 65 (Gary Boothe) 19. 04:44 PM - Re: Hand propping a 65 (Scott Knowlton) 20. 06:40 PM - Re: Riblett Airfoil (ALAN LYSCARS) 21. 07:08 PM - Re: Riblett Airfoil (Ryan Mueller) 22. 09:56 PM - Re: elongating holes (Clif Dawson) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 02:30:59 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: elongating holes From: "carson" I stuffed up a couple of holes and filled them with T88 and re drilled. I think it will be ok the rest of the Piet is held together with it. Carson Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=236822#236822 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 04:05:42 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: elongating holes From: helspersew@aol.com Tom, I also had trouble with those plans-built hinges to line up. I had to do a lot of fudging like you propose. Somebody has to have figured out a way to line-up all those things. Maybe you could put a rod all the way through all three hinges before marking for the holes in the wood? That sounds easy but in reality? A slight bit of elongation will not hurt in my opinion. This is what I did. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL NX929DH ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 04:59:55 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Jim Lagowski Pietenpol completion in April Sport Pilot From: "Glenn Thomas" Yes, that's a pretty paint scheme and the wood color looks fantastic with the paint colors. Cowling is nice too. Is that a Fly Baby landing gear setup? Looks like it would be a bit lighter than Jenny gear. -------- Glenn Thomas N????? http://www.flyingwood.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=236829#236829 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/jimlagowskipiet_919.jpg ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:37:05 AM PST US From: shad bell Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: elongating holes Mixing sawdust or fiberglass flox with t-88 would probably work well, I have to fill one on my project as well. Shad ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:10:01 AM PST US From: Michael Perez Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Riblett Airfoil Al, I am using the 3 piece wing plan for the Pietenpol with the Riblett 612 ribs. What you must do is build the ribs per the Riblett full scale drawin g and modify/include what you need to do match the print of the wing. (rega rdless of the type of plane/wing)- Our Pietenpol wings use compression st ruts at the drag cable attach points on the spars. These are separate from the ribs. Our ribs do not include any kind of built in compression struts. (if I am reading you question correctly.) There are extra braces that are b uilt into a few ribs for the ends of the wings and those are also shown on the Riblett plan.- My 3 piece Pietenpol wing will use a total of 31 ribs. ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 11:34:34 AM PST US From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation]" Subject: Pietenpol-List: some gorgeous photos of a Ford Pietenpol flying in California go here: http://forum.planetalk.net/viewtopic.php?t=7708 Serial Number 1 Type Registration Individual Manufacturer Name BOWE WALTER Certificate Issue Date 10/12/2004 Model PIETENPOL AIR CAMPER Status Valid T ype Aircraft Fixed Wing Single-Engine Type Engine Reciprocating Pending Num ber Change None Dealer No Date Change Authorized None Mode S Code 50074262 MFR Year 2005 Fractional Owner NO To search FAA registrations go here: http://registry.faa.gov/aircraftinqu iry/ ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 12:24:12 PM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: some gorgeous photos of a Ford Pietenpol flying in California Mike, I recognize my old stompin' grounds.Thanks! .interesting routing of the aileron cables.. Gary Boothe Cool, Ca. Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion Tail done, Fuselage ready for gear (13 ribs down.) Do not archive _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation] Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 11:31 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: some gorgeous photos of a Ford Pietenpol flying in California go here: http://forum.planetalk.net/viewtopic.php?t=7708 Serial Number 1 Type Registration Individual Manufacturer Name BOWE WALTER Certificate Issue Date 10/12/2004 Model PIETENPOL AIR CAMPER Status Valid Type Aircraft Fixed Wing Single-Engine Type Engine Reciprocating Pending Number Change None Dealer No Date Change Authorized None Mode S Code 50074262 MFR Year 2005 Fractional Owner NO To search FAA registrations go here: http://registry.faa.gov/aircraftinquiry/ ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 12:26:00 PM PST US From: "walt" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: some gorgeous photos of a Ford Pietenpol flying in California That IS a beautiful plane! Thanks Mike walt evans NX140DL ----- Original Message ----- From: Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation] To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 2:30 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: some gorgeous photos of a Ford Pietenpol flying in California go here: http://forum.planetalk.net/viewtopic.php?t=7708 Serial Number 1 Type Registration Individual Manufacturer Name BOWE WALTER Certificate Issue Date 10/12/2004 Model PIETENPOL AIR CAMPER Status Valid Type Aircraft Fixed Wing Single-Engine Type Engine Reciprocating Pending Number Change None Dealer No Date Change Authorized None Mode S Code 50074262 MFR Year 2005 Fractional Owner NO To search FAA registrations go here: http://registry.faa.gov/aircraftinquiry/ ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 12:51:10 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Photo resizing tool From: "jimbir" I buried this in a reply to a previous thread and you might have missed it. Here it is again. It's a very handy picture resizing tool as an add-on from Microsoft This link will tell you all about it. It allows you to select one or more photos and make them smaller and better suited as attachments to lists such as this. http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/digitalphotography/learnmore/tips/eschelman2.mspx It says it's for XP but, I don't know why it wouldn't work with Vista. -------- Jim Birke Ira G. Ross Aerospace Museum Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=236906#236906 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 01:04:11 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wingtip attachment From: "jimbir" Would you be so kind as to tell me the best way to attach the wingtips to the spars? I can see the blocks at the leading and trailing edges but, the plans are a little vague about the spars. Looks like some kind of an angle. -------- Thanks, Jim Birke Ira G. Ross Aerospace Museum Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=236908#236908 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 01:26:32 PM PST US From: H RULE Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Photo resizing tool Thanks very much to all those who replied to this thread.Your help was grea tly appreciated.=0A=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________ ________=0AFrom: jimbir =0ATo: pietenpol-list@matronics.c om=0ASent: Monday, March 30, 2009 3:49:01 PM=0ASubject: Pietenpol-List: Pho r@yahoo.com>=0A=0AI buried this in a reply to a previous thread and you mig ht have missed it. Here it is again. It's a very handy- picture resizing tool as an add-on from Microsoft This link will tell you all about it. It a llows you to select one or more photos and make them smaller and better sui ted as attachments to lists such as this. =0A=0Ahttp://www.microsoft.com/wi ndowsxp/using/digitalphotography/learnmore/tips/eschelman2.mspx=0A=0AIt say s it's for XP but, I don't know why it wouldn't work with Vista.=0A=0A----- ---=0AJim Birke=0AIra G. Ross Aerospace Museum=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ARead this topi c online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=236906#23 ======================= ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 01:41:32 PM PST US Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Wingtip attachment From: "Jack T. Textor" Here you go Jim, more pictures on my site. Jack www.textors.com ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 01:52:07 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: some gorgeous photos of a Ford Pietenpol flying in Californi From: "K5YAC" Very cool pics. I hope mine turns out that nice. -------- Mark Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=236918#236918 ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 02:10:56 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wingtip attachment From: "jimbir" Thanks for the info. A couple of questions. 1. bolt size thru the spars. 2. is the screw thru the tip the same size as the screws thru the leading edge and are they counter-bored the same way? -------- Thanks, Jim Birke Ira G. Ross Aerospace Museum Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=236920#236920 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:29:39 PM PST US Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wingtip attachment From: "Jack T. Textor" Jim, AN3 through the spars, the tip was a bit smaller (it was an MS?)and bored in to hide the head. Jack Textor Vice President 3737 Woodland Avenue Suite #300 West Des Moines, IA 50266 515-225-7000 www.thepalmergroup.com This e-mail, including attachments, is covered by the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. 2510-2521, is confidential, and may be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any retention, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. Please reply to the sender that you have received the message in error, and then please delete it. Thank you. -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jimbir Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 4:09 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wingtip attachment Thanks for the info. A couple of questions. 1. bolt size thru the spars. 2. is the screw thru the tip the same size as the screws thru the leading edge and are they counter-bored the same way? -------- Thanks, Jim Birke Ira G. Ross Aerospace Museum Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=236920#236920 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 04:00:40 PM PST US From: "Lagowski Morrow" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Hand propping a 65 Oscar, Thanks or the hand prop comments. Appreciated. I'm new to hand propping with my 65 Continental and no electrical system.I built in a primer, use one or two squirts and then 4-5 props before turning the mags on. This works most of the time on a cool engine. I don't have as much success with a hot engine and am not sure why. I use chocks and lock my hydraulic brakes with blocks on a cord. I also have a removable metal tab on the throttle cable that limits the rpm to ~idle on startup. My objective here is to avoid a prop "haircut". On idle the plane doesn't creep, even on asphalt. Any thoughts here that might help me do a more reliable/safe job in starting? Like you I like the simplicity of hand propping, no electrical system, battery etc Thanks for any experience you can share.--Jim Lagowski Do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Oscar Zuniga To: Pietenpol List Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 10:48 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Hand propping a 65 Propping the engine is something I have mixed feelings about. On one hand, I like the utter simplicity of having no electrics, no starter, no gadgets and no messing about. On the other hand, I worry about the engine stopping sometime with only moments to spare for a retry in flight, and not being able to give it another try at starting by just punching a button or pulling a handle. It's not really something I should worry about... they always say the main thing to do when the engine quits is to fly the airplane and not worry with gadgets that might distract. I have found my airplane to be extremely simple and fuss-free, easy and quick to start now that I know the drill, and not at all difficult to prop. I also think it adds an aura of "old time-ness" to the whole flight when it begins with a hand-prop. It's how I learned to fly and it always works. On the other hand, there is a lot to be said for being in the cockpit, strapped in, brakes set, and in control of everything when the engine is lit. There is no doubt that electric (or other automatic) starters have something to be said for them. For now, though, I'm starter-free and happy with that. I sure wouldn't pay $1800 for a starter unless I lost the physical ability to prop my airplane, and then I might be out of luck flying entirely. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 03/29/09 16:56:00 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 04:33:50 PM PST US From: H RULE Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Hand propping a 65 I believe it is not necessary to prime a hot engine.Chock it,tie it from th e tail and give her some throttle and it should start.Find a nice place on the throttle before you shut her down where it is a good idle point.Not so much toward the shut off point,somewhat faster but not so fast that it want s to take off on you.It never hurts to have someone in the know on the thro ttle to cut her back once started.=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A__________________________ ______=0AFrom: Lagowski Morrow =0ATo: pietenpol-list@ma tronics.com=0ASent: Monday, March 30, 2009 6:57:51 PM=0ASubject: Re: Pieten pol-List: Hand propping a 65=0A=0A=0AOscar, Thanks or the hand prop comment s. Appreciated.-I'm new to hand propping with my 65 Continental and no el ectrical system.I built in a primer, use one or two squirts and then 4-5 pr ops before turning the mags on. This works most of the time on a cool engin e. I don't have as much success with a hot engine and am not sure why. I us e chocks and lock my hydraulic brakes with blocks on a cord. I also have a removable metal tab on the throttle cable-that limits the rpm to ~idle on startup. My objective here is to avoid a prop "haircut". On idle the plane doesn't creep, even on asphalt.=0A-=0AAny thoughts here that might help me do a more reliable/safe job in starting?=0A-=0ALike you I like the sim plicity of hand propping, no electrical system, battery etc=0A-=0AThanks for any experience you can share.--Jim Lagowski=0A-=0ADo not archive=0A-- --- Original Message ----- =0AFrom: Oscar Zuniga =0ATo: Pietenpol List =0AS ent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 10:48 PM=0ASubject: Pietenpol-List: Hand proppi ng a 65=0APropping the engine is something I have mixed feelings about.- On one hand, I like the utter simplicity of having no electrics, no starter , no gadgets and no messing about.- On the other hand, I worry about the engine stopping sometime with only moments to spare for a retry in flight, and not being able to give it another try at starting by just punching a bu tton or pulling a handle.=0A=0AIt's not really something I should worry abo ut... they always say the main thing to do when the engine quits is to fly the airplane and not worry with gadgets that might distract.- I have foun d my airplane to be extremely simple and fuss-free, easy and quick to start now that I know the drill, and not at all difficult to prop.- I also thi nk it adds an aura of "old time-ness" to the whole flight when it begins wi th a hand-prop.- It's how I learned to fly and it always works.=0A=0AOn t he other hand, there is a lot to be said for being in the cockpit, strapped in, brakes set, and in control of everything when the engine is lit.- Th ere is no doubt that electric (or other automatic) starters have something to be said for them.- For now, though, I'm starter-free and happy with th at.- I sure wouldn't pay $1800 for a starter unless I lost the physical a bility to prop my airplane, and then I might be out of luck flying entirely .=0A=0AOscar Zuniga=0AAir Camper NX41CC=0ASan Antonio, TX=0Amailto: taildra gs@hotmail.com=0Awebsite at http://www.flysquirrel.net=0A=0A=0A=0A=0Ahref ="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics .com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List=0Ahref="http://forums.matronics.com">http:/ /forums.matronics.com=0Ahref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http ://www.matronics.com/c=0A=0A________________________________=0A- Release Da == ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 04:35:51 PM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Hand propping a 65 Jim, For what it's worth, my Dad & I had a T-craft back in the '70's (A-65), and we fought warm starts until we installed an impulse mag.proplem (pun intended) solved! Gary Boothe Cool, Ca. Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion Tail done, Fuselage ready for gear (13 ribs down.) _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lagowski Morrow Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 3:58 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Hand propping a 65 Oscar, Thanks or the hand prop comments. Appreciated. I'm new to hand propping with my 65 Continental and no electrical system.I built in a primer, use one or two squirts and then 4-5 props before turning the mags on. This works most of the time on a cool engine. I don't have as much success with a hot engine and am not sure why. I use chocks and lock my hydraulic brakes with blocks on a cord. I also have a removable metal tab on the throttle cable that limits the rpm to ~idle on startup. My objective here is to avoid a prop "haircut". On idle the plane doesn't creep, even on asphalt. Any thoughts here that might help me do a more reliable/safe job in starting? Like you I like the simplicity of hand propping, no electrical system, battery etc Thanks for any experience you can share.--Jim Lagowski Do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Oscar Zuniga Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 10:48 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Hand propping a 65 Propping the engine is something I have mixed feelings about. On one hand, I like the utter simplicity of having no electrics, no starter, no gadgets and no messing about. On the other hand, I worry about the engine stopping sometime with only moments to spare for a retry in flight, and not being able to give it another try at starting by just punching a button or pulling a handle. It's not really something I should worry about... they always say the main thing to do when the engine quits is to fly the airplane and not worry with gadgets that might distract. I have found my airplane to be extremely simple and fuss-free, easy and quick to start now that I know the drill, and not at all difficult to prop. I also think it adds an aura of "old time-ness" to the whole flight when it begins with a hand-prop. It's how I learned to fly and it always works. On the other hand, there is a lot to be said for being in the cockpit, strapped in, brakes set, and in control of everything when the engine is lit. There is no doubt that electric (or other automatic) starters have something to be said for them. For now, though, I'm starter-free and happy with that. I sure wouldn't pay $1800 for a starter unless I lost the physical ability to prop my airplane, and then I might be out of luck flying entirely. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronic s.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c _____ - Release Date: 03/29/09 16:56:00 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 04:44:29 PM PST US From: "Scott Knowlton " Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Hand propping a 65 I was taught on a 65 horsepower champ a couple techniques that helped. Brakes and throttle limiting are important but also during every start turn your fuel valve on and then leave in the off position for starting. This only gives you a gascolator full of fuel for the start so on that fateful day when you have a throttle linkage malfunction along with brakes that aren't as strong as you thought there is only enough gas for the airplane to make a short taxi. You'll still have lots of time after a successful start to make your way to the cockpit to turn the fuel back on. For a hot start we would leave mags off throttle full and then ten blades backwards. Then do a normal start. Worked every time! On a hot day where vapour lock may be an issue if the above doesn't work, try turning the prop horizontal and lifting the tail off the ground momentarily as high as you can. The extra gravity of the fuel seems to get rid of the lock. Maybe all old wives tails but they've worked for me. If nothing else it feels good to do something while you are resting your arms from all that propping! Scott Knowlton -----Original Message----- From: Lagowski Morrow Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Hand propping a 65 Oscar, Thanks or the hand prop comments. Appreciated.I'm new to hand propping with my 65 Continental and no electrical system.I built in a primer, use one or two squirts and then 4-5 props before turning the mags on. This works most of the time on a cool engine. I don't have as much success with a hot engine and am not sure why. I use chocks and lock my hydraulic brakes with blocks on a cord. I also have a removable metal tab on the throttle cablethat limits the rpm to ~idle on startup. My objective here is to avoid a prop "haircut". On idle the plane doesn't creep, even on asphalt. Any thoughts here that might help me do a more reliable/safe job in starting? Like you I like the simplicity of hand propping, no electrical system, battery etc Thanks for any experience you can share.--Jim Lagowski Do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: Oscar Zuniga Sent: Sunday, March 29, 2009 10:48 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Hand propping a 65 Propping the engine is something I have mixed feelings about. On one hand, I like the utter simplicity of having no electrics, no starter, no gadgets and no messing about. On the other hand, I worry about the engine stopping sometime with only moments to spare for a retry in flight, and not being able to give it another try at starting by just punching a button or pulling a handle. It's not really something I should worry about... they always say the main thing to do when the engine quits is to fly the airplane and not worry with gadgets that might distract. I have found my airplane to be extremely simple and fuss-free, easy and quick to start now that I know the drill, and not at all difficult to prop. I also think it adds an aura of "old time-ness" to the whole flight when it begins with a hand-prop. It's how I learned to fly and it always works. On the other hand, there is a lot to be said for being in the cockpit, strapped in, brakes set, and in control of everything when the engine is lit. There is no doubt that electric (or other automatic) starters have something to be said for them. For now, though, I'm starter-free and happy with that. I sure wouldn't pay $1800 for a starter unless I lost the physical ability to prop my airplane, and then I might be out of luck flying entirely. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ---------------- - Release Date: 03/29/09 16:56:00 ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 06:40:25 PM PST US From: "ALAN LYSCARS" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Riblett Airfoil Thanks, Michael. I'm now aware that I'll blend the Riblett airfoil construction into the specific detail called out in my plans. On a technical construction note (the egg or chicken story), how does one transition from full-size ribs to ailerons during the jig work? Make a bunch of full-size then cut them to order, or make required number of full-size, then modify the jig? And is it advisable to use 1/2" Sitka in the aileron spars or are you all using something else? With great thanks, Al ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael Perez To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, March 30, 2009 11:07 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Riblett Airfoil Al, I am using the 3 piece wing plan for the Pietenpol with the Riblett 612 ribs. What you must do is build the ribs per the Riblett full scale drawing and modify/include what you need to do match the print of the wing. (regardless of the type of plane/wing) Our Pietenpol wings use compression struts at the drag cable attach points on the spars. These are separate from the ribs. Our ribs do not include any kind of built in compression struts. (if I am reading you question correctly.) There are extra braces that are built into a few ribs for the ends of the wings and those are also shown on the Riblett plan. My 3 piece Pietenpol wing will use a total of 31 ribs. ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 07:08:20 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Riblett Airfoil From: Ryan Mueller Al, At least for the Pietenpol, you build full size ribs for the aileron portion of the wing. After you have assembled the wing and finished installing the various components for the ailerons (braces, beams/spars, etc) you cut the ailerons free of the wing. Then you finish the aileron and bay off by enclosing the open ends and adding 1/4x1/4 filler strips as shown in the plans. What one might term the aileron false spar and aileron spar are referred to as the "aileron beams" in the Piet plans, and are shown to be 1/2". Ryan On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 8:38 PM, ALAN LYSCARS wrote: > Thanks, Michael. > > I'm now aware that I'll blend the Riblett airfoil construction into the > specific detail called out in my plans. > > On a technical construction note (the egg or chicken story), how does one > transition from full-size ribs to ailerons during the jig work? Make a > bunch of full-size then cut them to order, or make required number > of full-size, then modify the jig? > > And is it advisable to use 1/2" Sitka in the aileron spars or are you all > using something else? > > With great thanks, > > Al > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Michael Perez > *To:* pietenpol-list@matronics.com > *Sent:* Monday, March 30, 2009 11:07 AM > *Subject:* Re: Pietenpol-List: Riblett Airfoil > > Al, I am using the 3 piece wing plan for the Pietenpol with the Riblett > 612 ribs. What you must do is build the ribs per the Riblett full scale > drawing and modify/include what you need to do match the print of the wing. > (regardless of the type of plane/wing) Our Pietenpol wings use compression > struts at the drag cable attach points on the spars. These are separate from > the ribs. Our ribs do not include any kind of built in compression struts. > (if I am reading you question correctly.) There are extra braces that are > built into a few ribs for the ends of the wings and those are also shown on > the Riblett plan. My 3 piece Pietenpol wing will use a total of 31 ribs. > > * > > href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c* > > * > > * > > ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 09:56:46 PM PST US From: "Clif Dawson" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: elongating holes That's exactly what I did. I used 3/16" hard piano wire from the hobby shop and a straight piece of 1 1/2" L iron clamped 1"above the hinge rod. Clamp one hinge to the stab then the other at the other end. Measure the center rod as 1" down, clamp and start drilling. Once I'd established the hinges and drilled them I marked around the bases with a knife and routed out the wood with a little hand router. Also, wood cabane struts, go to my message #40283 from Jan 6 for strength and load calculations. Ash or any other hardwood is overkill. Especialy considering the weight penalty. Wing struts require a few more strategicaly placed bolts. Clif Tom, I also had trouble with those plans-built hinges to line up. I had to do a lot of fudging like you propose. Somebody has to have figured out a way to line-up all those things. Maybe you could put a rod all the way through all three hinges before marking for the holes in the wood? Dan Helsper ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 03/30/09 17:56:00 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.