Pietenpol-List Digest Archive

Mon 05/25/09


Total Messages Posted: 25



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 12:20 AM - Re: Re: california (Clif Dawson)
     2. 03:53 AM - Re: How do you wrap bungee cord? (helspersew@aol.com)
     3. 04:50 AM - Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 9 Msgs - 05/23/09 (amsafetyc@aol.com)
     4. 05:13 AM - Re: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 9 Msgs - 05/23/09 (amsafetyc@aol.com)
     5. 05:24 AM - Re: How do you wrap bungee cord? (Jack Phillips)
     6. 06:22 AM - engine mount angle (Oscar Zuniga)
     7. 06:54 AM - Re: engine mount angle (hvandervoo@aol.com)
     8. 08:07 AM - Re: Parts List (walt)
     9. 09:12 AM - Re: Parts List (K5YAC)
    10. 10:00 AM - parts list #112 pic (walt)
    11. 10:16 AM - Re: Parts List (TriScout)
    12. 10:20 AM - Re: parts list #112 pic (K5YAC)
    13. 11:14 AM - Re: Re: Parts List (Bill Church)
    14. 11:14 AM - Re: Re: Parts List (Jack Phillips)
    15. 11:19 AM - Re: Re: parts list #112 pic (Bill Church)
    16. 11:56 AM - Re: Re: Parts List (Michael Silvius)
    17. 12:03 PM - Re: parts list #112 pic (K5YAC)
    18. 12:30 PM - Re: Re: parts list #112 pic (Bill Church)
    19. 03:14 PM - fuel line thread sealant (skellytown flyer)
    20. 04:17 PM - Re: fuel line thread sealant (Pieti Lowell)
    21. 05:11 PM - Re: fuel line thread sealant (Jack Phillips)
    22. 05:42 PM - Re: fuel line thread sealant (Gene & Tammy)
    23. 06:09 PM - Re: fuel line thread sealant (Jeff Boatright)
    24. 06:22 PM - fuel line thread sealant (Oscar Zuniga)
    25. 06:40 PM - Re: fuel line thread sealant (skellytown flyer)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 12:20:54 AM PST US
    From: "Clif Dawson" <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca>
    Subject: Re: california
    The true horsepower of all Lycomings and Continentals is 20% less than rated right from the factory and it gets less as the engine wears. The A weighs 244 lb dry. Add water, radiator and hoses. Now it weighs 260 or more, about the same as the O-290 I've got. The larger engine isn't there to give you more speed, that's dictated by the airframe. It's there to get you off the ground sooner. There will be times that's a good thing. Remember the list of useless things in aviation. Add to that the horsepower you don't have. :-) Just make sure you understand the tradeoffs. Clif, workin on firewall and engine mount. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Dotson" <jdotson@erec.net> Sent: Sunday, May 24, 2009 5:50 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: california > > I don't think the O-200 will be too much power. They put the Corvair on it > and they say the Corvair is more powerful than the O-200 is. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245121#245121 > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 07:09:00


    Message 2


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    Time: 03:53:20 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: How do you wrap bungee cord?
    From: helspersew@aol.com
    Straight axle guys, Is there a secret to the method of wrapping that bungee cord? I have mine on (loosely) but trying to do it with one person is next to impossible without four hands. How did you secure the ends together? Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL


    Message 3


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    Time: 04:50:05 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 9 Msgs - 05/23/09
    From: amsafetyc@aol.com
    Well gang I just started the tear down and inspection of my intended power plant. So far the crank is looking good run out looks really good. Zero at the number 3 main and .0015 at the front plate at the very most. I don't know what it was at brand new but those numbers are encouraging. The lycoming 0235C came out of a wreck that I believed nosed over following a prop strike at idle. I hope the magnaflux confirms no cracks or metal damage. News like that I just had to share John Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: Pietenpol-List Digest Server <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List Digest: 9 Msgs - 05/23/09 * ================================================= Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive ================================================= Today's complete Pietenpol-List Digest can also be found in either of the two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version of the Pietenpol-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor such as Notepad or with a web browser. HTML Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 09-05-23&Archive=Pietenpol Text Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter 09-05-23&Archive=Pietenpol =============================================== EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive =============================================== ---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 05/23/09: 9 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:55 AM - intersection takeoff (Oscar Zuniga) 2. 10:23 AM - Model A (Ameet Savant) 3. 10:51 AM - Re: ANY BUILDERS NEAR PENSACOLA? (jimcarriere) 4. 11:42 AM - Re: Model A (Chet's Mail) 5. 06:12 PM - three tenths flight time (Oscar Zuniga) 6. 08:20 PM - Re: three tenths flight time (Pieti Lowell) 7. 08:35 PM - Re: Model A (ALAN LYSCARS) 8. 09:52 PM - Re: Model A (jorge lizarraga) 9. 10:03 PM - california (jorge lizarraga) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 07:55:48 AM PST US From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: intersection takeoff My instructor/mentor has taken 41CC off at Zapata County airport by applyin g full throttle where the parking apron meets the intersection taxiway and has gotten airborne before getting to the runway. He's the airport manager there so I guess he can do that =3Bo) I would try it at San Geronimo=2C my home base=2C except there is a fence a nd a windsock on a pole straight ahead of me as I taxi out from my hangar t o the runway. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio=2C TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 10:23:14 AM PST US From: Ameet Savant <ameetsavant@yahoo.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model A Hello everyone, I was on vacation for a month or so and finally am caught up with the 600 or so posts on the Pietenpol list. It is truly amazing how active this group is. For flying low and slow we do seem to post like the fast and furious! Anyway, like every builder, I am contemplating engine choices for my yet to be started Pietenpol. I never thought I would consider the Ford Model A mainly because I am not that much of a purist. However, when opportunity knocks, who am I to ignore? I ran into the local Model A club member (while getting my car windshield replaced- whole other story) and he has a 1928 Model A engine block that he is willing to part for free. Given my gross ignorance about all things engines (we all have to start somewhere), I have no recourse but to ask the good folks of this list-- Is this something I should acquire and decide later if I am going to use it or not? Is there a particular model year that is better suited for flight? The condition of the engine is unknown, but hey the price is just right! Your help is much appreciated! Ameet Savant ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 10:51:59 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: ANY BUILDERS NEAR PENSACOLA? From: "jimcarriere" <jimcarriere@yahoo.com> [quote="Jerry Dotson"]I am wanting to start a Pietenpol soon. Any builders or owners near Pensacola, FL?? I would buy a project if near me and all spruce and MIL-SPEC plywood. I am going with Continental power. Probably an O-200. What about 3 piece wing versus 1 piece? I have room to build either way. Jerry Dotson[/quote] Jerry, I live in Navarre. I'm a Piet fan but not a Piet builder; I'm halfway done building a Kitfox (and 90% to go... life got in the way for the last couple years). I go to the EAA chapter in Crestview (108) and while there are no Piets in that chapter there are a handful of fabric covered airplanes and lots of smart and friendly people. I don't know much about the EAA chapter in Pensacola (485) other than they have lots of good people too. Something good to know in this area, if you order something from Aircraft Spruce in Atlanta then UPS Ground shipping usually shows up the next day. That's just dumb good luck. Good luck! -Jim -------- Jim in NW FL Kitfox Series 7 in progress Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245071#245071 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 11:42:16 AM PST US From: "Chet's Mail" <Chethartley1@mchsi.com> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A Ameet, The Ford engine is a good engine for the piet, the only thing I would do different is to install a counter balanced crank shaft. You can buy one or have yours balanced. Chet Hartley 920Y ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ameet Savant" <ameetsavant@yahoo.com> Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2009 12:19 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model A > > > Hello everyone, > > I was on vacation for a month or so and finally am caught up with the 600 > or so posts on the Pietenpol list. It is truly amazing how active this > group is. For flying low and slow we do seem to post like the fast and > furious! > > Anyway, like every builder, I am contemplating engine choices for my yet > to be started Pietenpol. I never thought I would consider the Ford Model A > mainly because I am not that much of a purist. However, when opportunity > knocks, who am I to ignore? > > I ran into the local Model A club member (while getting my car windshield > replaced- whole other story) and he has a 1928 Model A engine block that > he is willing to part for free. Given my gross ignorance about all things > engines (we all have to start somewhere), I have no recourse but to ask > the good folks of this list-- Is this something I should acquire and > decide later if I am going to use it or not? Is there a particular model > year that is better suited for flight? The condition of the engine is > unknown, but hey the price is just right! > > Your help is much appreciated! > > Ameet Savant > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:12:25 PM PST US From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: three tenths flight time Doesn't sound like much=2C but it sure was a great flight. We had a heavy passing thunderstorm today so I was inside the hangar most of the afternoon but when it got done raining=2C there wasn't much wind and I knew I'd have to go fly. It is so nice to fly in an open cockpit in conditions like the se: cool=2C clean air=2C everything fresh from a rain=2C and the airplane f lies strong and smooth. The smells are richer and the colors of everything seem brighter and more true. So I didn't fly for long but I didn't have t o- it was enough. My three landings were all nearly perfect=2C a little st anding water splashing the tires=2C then we were home. This is what Mr. Pietenpol must have had in his mind when he first set out to design the Air Camper more than 80 years ago=2C and why he kept after it when the first few versions didn't quite match the picture he had in his m ind. Minimal preflight=2C minimal fuss and planning=2C and you're out flyi ng. No charts=2C no radios=2C no gadgets=2C nothing. I used my canvas fly ing helmet and goggles=2C didn't even bother with the other helmet with hea ring protectors because when I use the plain canvas=2C I can hear the wind in the wires when I pull off the power for landing. This is Piet flying. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio=2C TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:20:24 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: three tenths flight time From: "Pieti Lowell" <Lowellcfrank@yahoo.com> Aman-Oscar. I have been flying Pietenpols for well over 40 some odd years You have said it all. I have never ever missed flying a Piet to the annual Brodhead fly-in. This is also my 80Th also . I have known the greats, most have signed my logs and you guys are carrying the torch, and with all the great comments I read, keep It up, see you at Brodhead. Pieti Lowell Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245099#245099 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:35:22 PM PST US From: "ALAN LYSCARS" <alyscars@myfairpoint.net> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A Ameet.. Possession is always 100% of a resource's value. Take it and use it later, trade or sell it later, or scrap it later. Just plain Yankee attitude! Al in New Hampshire ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ameet Savant" <ameetsavant@yahoo.com> Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2009 1:19 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model A > I ran into the local Model A club member (while getting my car windshield > replaced- whole other story) and he has a 1928 Model A engine block that > he is willing to part for free. ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:52:20 PM PST US From: jorge lizarraga <flightwood@yahoo.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A hello there I think we have the same dilema and allso you trate to have cor vier engines is aluminium blok and aircooler you foun those in yunk yard fo r less 100 each i trate to heve one or ford modelA too , but people flu in ford model powered piet and fly in other engine realised is beter A65 or co rvier I personaly fly in piet whit A65- my whit is 186 my frien is 178lbs so we have past the limit and fly exelent i hope these help you- cincere ly jorge lizarraga --- On Sat, 5/23/09, Ameet Savant <ameetsavant@yahoo.com> wrote: From: Ameet Savant <ameetsavant@yahoo.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model A Hello everyone, I was on vacation for a month or so and finally am caught up with the 600 o r so posts on the Pietenpol list. It is truly amazing how active this group is. For flying low and slow we do seem to post like the fast and furious! Anyway, like every builder, I am contemplating engine choices for my yet to be started Pietenpol. I never thought I would consider the Ford Model A ma inly because I am not that much of a purist. However, when opportunity knoc ks, who am I to ignore? I ran into the local Model A club member (while getting my car windshield r eplaced- whole other story) and he has a 1928 Model A engine block that he is willing to part for free. Given my gross ignorance about all things engi nes (we all have to start somewhere), I have no recourse but to ask the goo d folks of this list-- Is this something I should acquire and decide later if I am going to use it or not? Is there a particular model year that is be tter suited for flight? The condition of the engine is unknown, but hey the price is just right! Your help is much appreciated! Ameet Savant - - - le, List Admin. =0A=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 10:03:09 PM PST US From: jorge lizarraga <flightwood@yahoo.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: california hello to florida Im build a piet here and is my fuselaje almost done and tr ate to build 3 pises wing like old timer is best because you can disamble f or transport to another location, and is the 0-200 engine is tomouch powere d and stres for the fuselaje is disagned for no more that 120mph. so more p ower?? well you welcome to piet builders you found these proyect enyoable a nd funn to have .seyou jorge --- On Sat, 5/23/09, jimcarriere <jimcarriere@yahoo.com> wrote: From: jimcarriere <jimcarriere@yahoo.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: ANY BUILDERS NEAR PENSACOLA? [quote="Jerry Dotson"]I am wanting to start a Pietenpol soon. Any builder s or owners near Pensacola, FL?? I would buy a project if near me and all s pruce and MIL-SPEC plywood. I am going with Continental power. Probably an O-200. What about 3 piece wing versus 1 piece? I have room to build either way. Jerry Dotson[/quote] Jerry, I live in Navarre.- I'm a Piet fan but not a Piet builder; I'm hal fway done building a Kitfox (and 90% to go... life got in the way for the l ast couple years).- I go to the EAA chapter in Crestview (108) and while there are no Piets in that chapter there are a handful of fabric covered ai rplanes and lots of smart and friendly people.- I don't know much about t he EAA chapter in Pensacola (485) other than they have lots of good people too. Something good to know in this area, if you order something from Aircraft S pruce in Atlanta then UPS Ground shipping usually shows up the next day.- That's just dumb good luck. Good luck! -Jim -------- Jim in NW FL Kitfox Series 7 in progress Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245071#245071 le, List Admin. =0A=0A=0A


    Message 4


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    Time: 05:13:22 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 9 Msgs - 05/23/09
    From: amsafetyc@aol.com
    Does anyone have a prop size and pitch recommendation. I am looking for climb performance over cruise. The 0235 develops 108 hp. Thanks John Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: amsafetyc@aol.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 9 Msgs - 05/23/09 Well gang I just started the tear down and inspection of my intended power plant. So far the crank is looking good run out looks really good. Zero at the number 3 main and .0015 at the front plate at the very most. I don't know what it was at brand new but those numbers are encouraging. The lycoming 0235C came out of a wreck that I believed nosed over following a prop strike at idle. I hope the magnaflux confirms no cracks or metal damage. News like that I just had to share John Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: Pietenpol-List Digest Server <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List Digest: 9 Msgs - 05/23/09 * ================================================= Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive ================================================= Today's complete Pietenpol-List Digest can also be found in either of the two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version of the Pietenpol-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor such as Notepad or with a web browser. HTML Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 09-05-23&Archive=Pietenpol Text Version: http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter 09-05-23&Archive=Pietenpol =============================================== EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive =============================================== ---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 05/23/09: 9 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:55 AM - intersection takeoff (Oscar Zuniga) 2. 10:23 AM - Model A (Ameet Savant) 3. 10:51 AM - Re: ANY BUILDERS NEAR PENSACOLA? (jimcarriere) 4. 11:42 AM - Re: Model A (Chet's Mail) 5. 06:12 PM - three tenths flight time (Oscar Zuniga) 6. 08:20 PM - Re: three tenths flight time (Pieti Lowell) 7. 08:35 PM - Re: Model A (ALAN LYSCARS) 8. 09:52 PM - Re: Model A (jorge lizarraga) 9. 10:03 PM - california (jorge lizarraga) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 07:55:48 AM PST US From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: intersection takeoff My instructor/mentor has taken 41CC off at Zapata County airport by applyin g full throttle where the parking apron meets the intersection taxiway and has gotten airborne before getting to the runway. He's the airport manager there so I guess he can do that =3Bo) I would try it at San Geronimo=2C my home base=2C except there is a fence a nd a windsock on a pole straight ahead of me as I taxi out from my hangar t o the runway. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio=2C TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 10:23:14 AM PST US From: Ameet Savant <ameetsavant@yahoo.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model A Hello everyone, I was on vacation for a month or so and finally am caught up with the 600 or so posts on the Pietenpol list. It is truly amazing how active this group is. For flying low and slow we do seem to post like the fast and furious! Anyway, like every builder, I am contemplating engine choices for my yet to be started Pietenpol. I never thought I would consider the Ford Model A mainly because I am not that much of a purist. However, when opportunity knocks, who am I to ignore? I ran into the local Model A club member (while getting my car windshield replaced- whole other story) and he has a 1928 Model A engine block that he is willing to part for free. Given my gross ignorance about all things engines (we all have to start somewhere), I have no recourse but to ask the good folks of this list-- Is this something I should acquire and decide later if I am going to use it or not? Is there a particular model year that is better suited for flight? The condition of the engine is unknown, but hey the price is just right! Your help is much appreciated! Ameet Savant ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 10:51:59 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: ANY BUILDERS NEAR PENSACOLA? From: "jimcarriere" <jimcarriere@yahoo.com> [quote="Jerry Dotson"]I am wanting to start a Pietenpol soon. Any builders or owners near Pensacola, FL?? I would buy a project if near me and all spruce and MIL-SPEC plywood. I am going with Continental power. Probably an O-200. What about 3 piece wing versus 1 piece? I have room to build either way. Jerry Dotson[/quote] Jerry, I live in Navarre. I'm a Piet fan but not a Piet builder; I'm halfway done building a Kitfox (and 90% to go... life got in the way for the last couple years). I go to the EAA chapter in Crestview (108) and while there are no Piets in that chapter there are a handful of fabric covered airplanes and lots of smart and friendly people. I don't know much about the EAA chapter in Pensacola (485) other than they have lots of good people too. Something good to know in this area, if you order something from Aircraft Spruce in Atlanta then UPS Ground shipping usually shows up the next day. That's just dumb good luck. Good luck! -Jim -------- Jim in NW FL Kitfox Series 7 in progress Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245071#245071 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 11:42:16 AM PST US From: "Chet's Mail" <Chethartley1@mchsi.com> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A Ameet, The Ford engine is a good engine for the piet, the only thing I would do different is to install a counter balanced crank shaft. You can buy one or have yours balanced. Chet Hartley 920Y ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ameet Savant" <ameetsavant@yahoo.com> Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2009 12:19 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model A > > > Hello everyone, > > I was on vacation for a month or so and finally am caught up with the 600 > or so posts on the Pietenpol list. It is truly amazing how active this > group is. For flying low and slow we do seem to post like the fast and > furious! > > Anyway, like every builder, I am contemplating engine choices for my yet > to be started Pietenpol. I never thought I would consider the Ford Model A > mainly because I am not that much of a purist. However, when opportunity > knocks, who am I to ignore? > > I ran into the local Model A club member (while getting my car windshield > replaced- whole other story) and he has a 1928 Model A engine block that > he is willing to part for free. Given my gross ignorance about all things > engines (we all have to start somewhere), I have no recourse but to ask > the good folks of this list-- Is this something I should acquire and > decide later if I am going to use it or not? Is there a particular model > year that is better suited for flight? The condition of the engine is > unknown, but hey the price is just right! > > Your help is much appreciated! > > Ameet Savant > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:12:25 PM PST US From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: three tenths flight time Doesn't sound like much=2C but it sure was a great flight. We had a heavy passing thunderstorm today so I was inside the hangar most of the afternoon but when it got done raining=2C there wasn't much wind and I knew I'd have to go fly. It is so nice to fly in an open cockpit in conditions like the se: cool=2C clean air=2C everything fresh from a rain=2C and the airplane f lies strong and smooth. The smells are richer and the colors of everything seem brighter and more true. So I didn't fly for long but I didn't have t o- it was enough. My three landings were all nearly perfect=2C a little st anding water splashing the tires=2C then we were home. This is what Mr. Pietenpol must have had in his mind when he first set out to design the Air Camper more than 80 years ago=2C and why he kept after it when the first few versions didn't quite match the picture he had in his m ind. Minimal preflight=2C minimal fuss and planning=2C and you're out flyi ng. No charts=2C no radios=2C no gadgets=2C nothing. I used my canvas fly ing helmet and goggles=2C didn't even bother with the other helmet with hea ring protectors because when I use the plain canvas=2C I can hear the wind in the wires when I pull off the power for landing. This is Piet flying. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio=2C TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:20:24 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: three tenths flight time From: "Pieti Lowell" <Lowellcfrank@yahoo.com> Aman-Oscar. I have been flying Pietenpols for well over 40 some odd years You have said it all. I have never ever missed flying a Piet to the annual Brodhead fly-in. This is also my 80Th also . I have known the greats, most have signed my logs and you guys are carrying the torch, and with all the great comments I read, keep It up, see you at Brodhead. Pieti Lowell Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245099#245099 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:35:22 PM PST US From: "ALAN LYSCARS" <alyscars@myfairpoint.net> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Model A Ameet.. Possession is always 100% of a resource's value. Take it and use it later, trade or sell it later, or scrap it later. Just plain Yankee attitude! Al in New Hampshire ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ameet Savant" <ameetsavant@yahoo.com> Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2009 1:19 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model A > I ran into the local Model A club member (while getting my car windshield > replaced- whole other story) and he has a 1928 Model A engine block that > he is willing to part for free. ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:52:20 PM PST US From: jorge lizarraga <flightwood@yahoo.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Model A hello there I think we have the same dilema and allso you trate to have cor vier engines is aluminium blok and aircooler you foun those in yunk yard fo r less 100 each i trate to heve one or ford modelA too , but people flu in ford model powered piet and fly in other engine realised is beter A65 or co rvier I personaly fly in piet whit A65- my whit is 186 my frien is 178lbs so we have past the limit and fly exelent i hope these help you- cincere ly jorge lizarraga --- On Sat, 5/23/09, Ameet Savant <ameetsavant@yahoo.com> wrote: From: Ameet Savant <ameetsavant@yahoo.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Model A Hello everyone, I was on vacation for a month or so and finally am caught up with the 600 o r so posts on the Pietenpol list. It is truly amazing how active this group is. For flying low and slow we do seem to post like the fast and furious! Anyway, like every builder, I am contemplating engine choices for my yet to be started Pietenpol. I never thought I would consider the Ford Model A ma inly because I am not that much of a purist. However, when opportunity knoc ks, who am I to ignore? I ran into the local Model A club member (while getting my car windshield r eplaced- whole other story) and he has a 1928 Model A engine block that he is willing to part for free. Given my gross ignorance about all things engi nes (we all have to start somewhere), I have no recourse but to ask the goo d folks of this list-- Is this something I should acquire and decide later if I am going to use it or not? Is there a particular model year that is be tter suited for flight? The condition of the engine is unknown, but hey the price is just right! Your help is much appreciated! Ameet Savant - - - le, List Admin. =0A=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 10:03:09 PM PST US From: jorge lizarraga <flightwood@yahoo.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: california hello to florida Im build a piet here and is my fuselaje almost done and tr ate to build 3 pises wing like old timer is best because you can disamble f or transport to another location, and is the 0-200 engine is tomouch powere d and stres for the fuselaje is disagned for no more that 120mph. so more p ower?? well you welcome to piet builders you found these proyect enyoable a nd funn to have .seyou jorge --- On Sat, 5/23/09, jimcarriere <jimcarriere@yahoo.com> wrote: From: jimcarriere <jimcarriere@yahoo.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: ANY BUILDERS NEAR PENSACOLA? [quote="Jerry Dotson"]I am wanting to start a Pietenpol soon. Any builder s or owners near Pensacola, FL?? I would buy a project if near me and all s pruce and MIL-SPEC plywood. I am going with Continental power. Probably an O-200. What about 3 piece wing versus 1 piece? I have room to build either way. Jerry Dotson[/quote] Jerry, I live in Navarre.- I'm a Piet fan but not a Piet builder; I'm hal fway done building a Kitfox (and 90% to go... life got in the way for the l ast couple years).- I go to the EAA chapter in Crestview (108) and while there are no Piets in that chapter there are a handful of fabric covered ai rplanes and lots of smart and friendly people.- I don't know much about t he EAA chapter in Pensacola (485) other than they have lots of good people too. Something good to know in this area, if you order something from Aircraft S pruce in Atlanta then UPS Ground shipping usually shows up the next day.- That's just dumb good luck. Good luck! -Jim -------- Jim in NW FL Kitfox Series 7 in progress Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245071#245071 le, List Admin. =0A=0A=0A


    Message 5


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    Time: 05:24:01 AM PST US
    From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: How do you wrap bungee cord?
    Hi Dan, Congratulations! You figured it out! It takes two people ' at least, I=92ve never been able to get it done satisfactorily by myself. As for securing the ends together, I use nylon tie wraps as a temporary method while I=92m wrestling with the bungee cords. Use a Panduit cable-Tie gun to make the job easier (I bought mine on ebay for $10) ' you just squeeze the trigger and the cable tie is tensioned correctly and then cut off automatically. By the way, I use 5/8=94 bungees on my Piet. I know Mike Cuy uses =BD=94, but his plane weighs 100 lbs less than mine and I find that I get too much sag with =BD=94. Mike also uses only the cable ties (I believe) to secure his bungees. I find the cable ties will eventually work loose, so once I have the bungees in place, I go back and secure them with .041=94 stainless steel safety wire. I find on mine that the 5/8=94 cords are just about right when there is about a =BD=94 gap between the axle and the =93V-Blocks=94. Taxiing over rough ground that gap will open and close about =BD=94 either way. Changing bungee cords is probably my second least favorite task on this airplane ' right behind bleeding the brakes. Hope to see yours at Brodhead and Oshkosh this summer. Jack Phillips NX899JP Raleigh, NC _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of helspersew@aol.com Sent: Monday, May 25, 2009 6:52 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: How do you wrap bungee cord? Straight axle guys, Is there a secret to the method of wrapping that bungee cord? I have mine on (loosely) but trying to do it with one person is next to impossible without four hands. How did you secure the ends together? Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL _____ Wanna slim down for summer? Go to America <http://www.aolhealth.com/diet/weight-loss-program/?ncid=emlcntusheal00 00000 1> Takes it Off to learn how.


    Message 6


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    Time: 06:22:01 AM PST US
    From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com>
    Subject: engine mount angle
    Raymond wrote- >I was considering whether to do anything with the thrust on my mount >of course if yours is for a real Piet it would no doubt be different >in fit than a GN-1 anyway. Shouldn't be. Same basic dimensions and geometry, similar weight & balance, and certainly the same V-speeds and attitude in climb. If any differences, they would be minor. Some GN-1s are built using complete wing and landing gear assemblies from certified aircraft, but DJ built his from scratch and used the undercamber airfoil profile so there shouldn't be much difference between your GN-1 and an Air Camper. Now it is true that the engine mount attach points are different in that DJ used standard spool-type mounts with bolts through the firewall, but the engine/airframe geometry should be the same. With the fuselage level (top longerons level), your engine mount tray should be a little lower in front than in back. I can calculate the angle if you want, but I'll bet DJ built it with a good offset in it. >D.J. said he added some angle of attack to the wing if I remember right >so maybe that will allow it to fly more level Actually, here's what he says about the incidence on his website: "The first thing I needed to do was confirm that my angle of incidence was going to be correct. It turns out that the GN-1 plans are not correct and give you only about .5 degrees of incidence. This is probably why most GN-1s fly "tail low". I did the math and figured I needed to raise the front cabane another .5". I did that by inserting a longer aluminum bar into the extruded strut. This gave me 1.5 degrees of incidence." You worry too much, Raymond ;o) Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net


    Message 7


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    Time: 06:54:24 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: engine mount angle
    From: hvandervoo@aol.com
    Raymond / Oscar, My Pietenpol requires a little Left rudder, thus I do not have enough left thrust off set in the engine mount. Rudder and fin are mounted without offset. The left rudder pressure needed is almost nothing as it hardly deflects the rudder. I build the Motor mount as per Pietenpol plans but added William Wynne's suggested vibration mounts. These vibration?mounts do raise the engine by about an 1" These vibration mounts?need internal bushings which can help to create more or less offset, something I need to play with on the next annual. Regards Hans -----Original Message----- From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com> Sent: Sun, 24 May 2009 8:52 pm Subject: Pietenpol-List: engine mount angle Raymond; Let's see if I change my message formatting to "plain text" if the extra "alphabet" doesn't show up in my posts whenever I add a comma or other punctuation. The Corvair engine mount design that you can get from the Pietenpol family incorporates the offset that Mr. Pietenpol used on his airplanes. The plans for that mount show the propeller end of the main cradle tubes 1" lower than the firewall end of the tubes but no left/right offset. I have not heard whether any of the PietVair pilots have needed to add rudder trim or other offset. Perhaps Hans will comment on how his PietVair flies, and if he built his mount according to the Pietenpol drawing dated 3-15-67. I have one of these engine mounts, built per this drawing, and can dig it out of the hangar and make measurements if you'd like. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net


    Message 8


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    Time: 08:07:54 AM PST US
    From: "walt" <waltdak@verizon.net>
    Subject: Re: Parts List
    Mark, Hope I caught you in time, just saw your post today. Here's a copy of the itemized quote from AS&S ( at 1998 prices.) They said they based it on the last sheet from a private builder. The list was right on for me. I built long fuselage three piece wing The one list from the builder has hand written notes by me to figure out what everything was when I inventoried it all. walt evans NX140DL ----- Original Message ----- From: "K5YAC" <hangar10@cox.net> Sent: Sunday, May 24, 2009 11:33 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Parts List > > I'm getting ready to place an order for my wood kit, and since I have to > pay freight, I'd like to get as much stuff as I can on this order... > especially all the larger stuff that will require a freight truck. > > I know I've seen some discussion of parts lists on the boards, but I've > searched for those threads and haven't come up with anything. As for the > wood, I've already got all the capstrip for my wing ribs (only a few left > to build), and I understand that in addition to the wood kit, I will need > ply for gussets, floor and sides, as well as fuselage standoff material. > I've identified several things that I'll need to order by studying the > prints, but I'd hate to leave something out that I've overlooked, or order > a part that should be substituted with something else. > > Does anyone have a parts list I can refer to prior to completing my order? > > Thanks! > > -------- > Mark > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245222#245222 > > >


    Message 9


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    Time: 09:12:05 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Parts List
    From: "K5YAC" <hangar10@cox.net>
    Thanks for the info guys. Walt, the last image (walt_112) didn't come though. Was there any additional info on that page? -------- Mark Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245272#245272


    Message 10


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    Time: 10:00:10 AM PST US
    From: "walt" <waltdak@verizon.net>
    Subject: parts list #112 pic
    That's the list that AS&S based the quote on. It was right on for me. Anything in pencil , were my notes walt evans NX140DL


    Message 11


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    Time: 10:16:34 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Parts List
    From: "TriScout" <apfelcyber@yahoo.com>
    I live in dallas. When I get done w/my ribs, I'm contemplating just driving out to AS east (Atlanta) and picking up the wood myself. It's just a 12hr drive each way. Perfect for a little get away/r&r. Now, if I just knew the dimentions of all the wood and if it's possible to haul it in a pickup truck. I may have to configure a big mailtube over the top of truck for the 3-piece wing spars that I plan to haul. Just a thought. Larry Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245280#245280


    Message 12


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    Time: 10:20:17 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: parts list #112 pic
    From: "K5YAC" <hangar10@cox.net>
    Darn... the image just isn't coming through. I got the first three on the original post, but "walt_112" does not display at all on either attempt. I'm assuming that there is important info on that particular page, so I would like to see it. Any chance you can e-mail it to me directly? If so, please send it to k5yac-at-cox-dot-net. Thanks! -------- Mark Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245281#245281


    Message 13


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    Time: 11:14:04 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Parts List
    From: "Bill Church" <eng@canadianrogers.com>
    Larry, You shouldn't have a problem fitting the wood in the back of a pickup truck. The biggest pieces would be the plywood (which should fit perfectly in the box of a full-size pickup). Other than that, the only "issues" would be the long pieces (spars and fuselage longerons), which are about 15 feet long. All the rest of the wood can be 8 ft long (or less), which would fit in the truck nicely. There used to be a photo on the Pietenpol family website that showed how small the "bundle" of wood was to build a Piet, but it looks like they redesigned the website and removed all of the pics. Bill C.


    Message 14


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    Time: 11:14:19 AM PST US
    From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: Re: Parts List
    Larry, Unless you've got a really long bed pickup, I think you'll need a rack on top such as you would use to carry a canoe. The three piece wing spars are 13 feet long each, and the longerons are over 16'. You'll need at least one 4' x 8' sheet of plywood, probably more. Think about it - you'll be driving 24 hours round trip in a truck that will get maybe 15 - 20 mpg. Gas alone will cost you $160 to $200 for the round trip. Unless you've got another reason to drive a truck to Atlanta, I'd seriously look into having a trucking company ship it. See if you can shop around on rates - they are highly variable. Now, if you get a trucking company to ship it, you will have to go pick it up at their dock or pay a lot for them to deliver it to your door. It is worth if for you to pick it up at their dock, but I doubt if it's worth it to drive all the way from Dallas to Atlanta to save $150 in shipping charges. Jack Phillips NX899JP Raleigh, NC -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of TriScout Sent: Monday, May 25, 2009 1:10 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Parts List I live in dallas. When I get done w/my ribs, I'm contemplating just driving out to AS east (Atlanta) and picking up the wood myself. It's just a 12hr drive each way. Perfect for a little get away/r&r. Now, if I just knew the dimentions of all the wood and if it's possible to haul it in a pickup truck. I may have to configure a big mailtube over the top of truck for the 3-piece wing spars that I plan to haul. Just a thought. Larry Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245280#245280


    Message 15


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    Time: 11:19:32 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: parts list #112 pic
    From: "Bill Church" <eng@canadianrogers.com>
    That's weird. The image comes through fine over the real-time List, but does not come through over the Forum. Wonder what's going on there? Bill C.


    Message 16


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    Time: 11:56:57 AM PST US
    From: "Michael Silvius" <silvius@gwi.net>
    Subject: Re: Parts List
    With a pickup and a rack anything is possible. Where there is a will there is a way. Just remember any sarran wrap goes from back to front and not the other way. Admitedly my ride was only about 5 hrs with this rig. Michael in Maine ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net> > > Unless you've got a really long bed pickup, I think you'll need a rack on > top such as you would use to carry a canoe. The three piece wing spars are > 13 feet long each, and the longerons are over 16'. You'll need at least one > 4' x 8' sheet of plywood, probably more. > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of TriScout > > I live in dallas. When I get done w/my ribs, I'm contemplating just driving > out to AS east (Atlanta) and picking up the wood myself. It's just a 12hr > drive each way. Perfect for a little get away/r&r. Now, if I just knew the > dimentions of all the wood and if it's possible to haul it in a pickup > truck. I may have to configure a big mailtube over the top of truck for the > 3-piece wing spars that I plan to haul. Just a thought. > > Larry >


    Message 17


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    Time: 12:03:23 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: parts list #112 pic
    From: "K5YAC" <hangar10@cox.net>
    Hmmm, where do I find this "real-time list"? I'm only familiar with the forums. -------- Mark Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245300#245300


    Message 18


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    Time: 12:30:18 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: parts list #112 pic
    From: "Bill Church" <eng@canadianrogers.com>
    Mark, The Realtime subscription was what was available before the Forum existed. Try this to sign up: http://www.matronics.com/subscription/ The Realtime subscription sends you an email everytime anyone posts a message to the list. Attachments ARE allowed on the Realtime postings. The Digest subscription gets you one email per day, with all of the previous day's postings in one message. Attachments are NOT included in the Digest version. Still don't know why the image isn't going through on the Forum, though. Bill C.


    Message 19


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    Time: 03:14:38 PM PST US
    Subject: fuel line thread sealant
    From: "skellytown flyer" <rhano@att.net>
    OK I hope I get some help on this one-I'm trying to make up the fuel lines and have an aluminum tank with 3/8" thread and aluminum fittings and also a brass body valve and what appears to be a brass colored steel nipple.all threads subject to leaking and looks like at least one did when DJ made them up for test.I think I Will use Teflon tape being careful not to wrap the first thread but has anyone got a sure fire sealant that will stand up to both avgas and car gas? Raymond Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245313#245313


    Message 20


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    Time: 04:17:51 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: fuel line thread sealant
    From: "Pieti Lowell" <Lowellcfrank@yahoo.com>
    NEVER < NEVER use Teflon tape on any plumbing in the fuel system. The Fiesta Piet that came to Brodhead a few years ago, was having engine problems, guess what was found in the carb ? that Teflon tape. I have used the Teflon paste with no problems on 4 Piets. Pieti Lowell Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245325#245325


    Message 21


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    Time: 05:11:57 PM PST US
    From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: fuel line thread sealant
    DO NOT USE TEFLON TAPE. I used "Sealube" from ACS on all my fuel system fittings. No leaks after 5 years of flying. Unfortunately you have to buy a quart of the stuff, which is an infinite supply. You will need a total of about a tablespoon for your entire fuel system. Jack Phillips NX899JP Raleigh, NC -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of skellytown flyer Sent: Monday, May 25, 2009 6:14 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: fuel line thread sealant OK I hope I get some help on this one-I'm trying to make up the fuel lines and have an aluminum tank with 3/8" thread and aluminum fittings and also a brass body valve and what appears to be a brass colored steel nipple.all threads subject to leaking and looks like at least one did when DJ made them up for test.I think I Will use Teflon tape being careful not to wrap the first thread but has anyone got a sure fire sealant that will stand up to both avgas and car gas? Raymond Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245313#245313


    Message 22


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    Time: 05:42:21 PM PST US
    From: "Gene & Tammy" <zharvey@bentoncountycable.net>
    Subject: Re: fuel line thread sealant
    I used Sealube also. I took a small pill bottle over to the local A & P and he gave me a dab (about a tablespoon). Much better than buying a whole can. I make it a point to not only stop in and BS every so often but I also take him a can of very cold pop on hot days and a hot cup of coffee on cold days. He always makes me feel welcome in his shop. Gene ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net> Sent: Monday, May 25, 2009 7:08 PM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: fuel line thread sealant > <pietflyr@bellsouth.net> > > DO NOT USE TEFLON TAPE. > > I used "Sealube" from ACS on all my fuel system fittings. No leaks after > 5 > years of flying. Unfortunately you have to buy a quart of the stuff, > which > is an infinite supply. You will need a total of about a tablespoon for > your > entire fuel system. > > Jack Phillips > NX899JP > Raleigh, NC > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of skellytown > flyer > Sent: Monday, May 25, 2009 6:14 PM > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Pietenpol-List: fuel line thread sealant > > > OK I hope I get some help on this one-I'm trying to make up the fuel lines > and have an aluminum tank with 3/8" thread and aluminum fittings and also > a > brass body valve and what appears to be a brass colored steel nipple.all > threads subject to leaking and looks like at least one did when DJ made > them > up for test.I think I Will use Teflon tape being careful not to wrap the > first thread but has anyone got a sure fire sealant that will stand up to > both avgas and car gas? Raymond > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245313#245313 > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 18:14:00


    Message 23


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    Time: 06:09:55 PM PST US
    From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri@emory.edu>
    Subject: Re: fuel line thread sealant
    I use Sealube also (and also "borrowed" from a friendly A&P). I found that it was useful to have a lot o disposable gloves handy and change them often. Otherwise you end up like a cartoon character spreading the sticky stuff everywhere!


    Message 24


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    Time: 06:22:48 PM PST US
    From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com>
    Subject: fuel line thread sealant
    I'm with Jack all the way... NO teflon tape on fuel or oil fittings. I used "EZ Turn", which is the same as fuel lube, available from Aircraft Spruce or from your neighborhood aircraft supply house ;o) Aircraft Spruce shows a 5 oz. tube available along with a 1 lb. can, and like Jack says, a little goes a long way. I bought the can ($22) since the 5 oz. tube costs $11 but even the tube is probably more than a lifetime supply unless you run an A&P shop. The stuff never goes bad, never hardens, and is resistant to all the fuels and oils you're likely to find in aircraft. The one thing about it is that it is worse than honey. It will find its way onto you no matter how careful you are, and it's a bit sticky. I keep a popsicle stick on top of the can lid to use as a spreader since I don't like to spread it with my finger, but the stuff isn't toxic or anything. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net


    Message 25


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    Time: 06:40:47 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: fuel line thread sealant
    From: "skellytown flyer" <rhano@att.net>
    Thanks for the good responses.i have known how Teflon tape gets into things if used wrong for years.I use it every day at work.but I'm careful to not wrap the first thread and when fittings are removed they always shed some in the fitting.I expect 9/10's of the problems are from folks that take them back apart and then put them back together again without thoroughly cleaning out the remains.but I'll either try the Teflon paste or get some fuel lube from my friendly mechanic.i used to get it to lube the selector valve and gas cap gaskets on my tri-pacer.but didn't keep any extra.I mainly want to insure i don't gall any threads as well as seal it up.guess either one should guard against that.the heavy aluminum bung welded to the bottom of the tank is very thick so I shouldn't have to worry about splitting it.Raymond Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=245347#245347




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