---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 10/13/09: 34 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:54 AM - Re: Fall flying (H RULE) 2. 05:18 AM - Re: website to journal Piet build (H RULE) 3. 05:58 AM - Re: Quiet (TulsaFlyer) 4. 09:07 AM - Fall flying (Oscar Zuniga) 5. 09:53 AM - Re: Quiet (K5YAC) 6. 10:21 AM - Re: Vi Kapler's Piets (dwilson) 7. 10:23 AM - Re: Fall flying (mike) 8. 11:23 AM - Fall flying (Oscar Zuniga) 9. 11:23 AM - Vi Kapler's Piets (Oscar Zuniga) 10. 11:23 AM - Re: Fall flying (Jeff Boatright) 11. 12:27 PM - Fall flying (Oscar Zuniga) 12. 12:53 PM - Re: Fall flying (Jeff Boatright) 13. 01:25 PM - Re: Forward Visibility (Wayne Bressler) 14. 02:36 PM - New to the list. (coxwelljon) 15. 02:52 PM - Re: New to the list. (Gary Boothe) 16. 03:50 PM - Re: New to the list. (Dick N.) 17. 03:57 PM - Re: New to the list. (Tim Willis) 18. 05:09 PM - Re: New to the list. (coxwelljon) 19. 05:34 PM - Re: New to the list. (coxwelljon) 20. 06:06 PM - Re: website to journal Piet build (swamppilot) 21. 06:07 PM - Re: website to journal Piet build (swamppilot) 22. 06:31 PM - any GN-1 builders (bryan green) 23. 06:32 PM - Re: Re: New to the list. (Gary Boothe) 24. 06:32 PM - Re: New to the list. (bryan green) 25. 06:38 PM - Re: website to journal Piet build (coxwelljon) 26. 06:43 PM - Re: any GN-1 builders (coxwelljon) 27. 06:52 PM - Re: New to the list. (coxwelljon) 28. 07:29 PM - Re: any GN-1 builders (ALAN LYSCARS) 29. 07:50 PM - New to the list (Oscar Zuniga) 30. 07:58 PM - Re: Fall flying (Clif Dawson) 31. 08:26 PM - Re: any GN-1 builders (coxwelljon) 32. 08:33 PM - Re: New to the list (coxwelljon) 33. 09:39 PM - Re: Re: Re: Western Piets availabele next week? (Jim) 34. 09:53 PM - Re: Forward Visibility (Clif Dawson) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:54:13 AM PST US From: H RULE Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fall flying Great stuff;I wish I could do the same but even if I did have mine in runni ng order it would be so cold that like Wap May, when I pulled my scarf off my lips would come with it.LOL!=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A____________ ____________________=0AFrom: shad bell =0ATo: pieten pol-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Mon, October 12, 2009 8:57:17 PM=0ASubject: Pietenpol-List: Fall flying=0A=0A=0AHello Fellers, =0AI was glad to- get in an hour of flying on sunday evening after work, but it was chilly.- It was about 50-55 degrees or so, and not much wind so I had to go.- I flew over to say hi to a friend of mine, and my low pass brought him and his wi fe and the kids out from the dinner table-to wave and wait for a second p ass.- He lives out in farm country away from pretty much any thing but co rn and bean fields, so there is not to much to run into except the occasion al stray cell tower.- After the 20 mile flight over my face was cold and numb, so I figured I would go home and shoot a few landings.- On the way home I saw a bunch of farmers cutting off their beans, and a couple of hot air balloons off in the distance.-I was-flying along at 500 ft, watchin g the shadows grow longer and seeing the trees change color in the sinking sun, I completly forgot about my face being cold.- After my 1st wheel lan ding touch and go, I flew out made a 180 and landed long the oppisite direction to cut down on my taxi back to my hanger.- I had planned on making that the last landing, but the sky was so calm and clear that I had to turn around and go around once more, before the daylight was completly gone.- I don't get to fly as much as I did last year, before I was a father, but I can't wait untill he is old enough to fly around with m e and see the beauty of a cool fall afternoon,-on the loud, windy magic c arpet that is the Pietenpol.=0A=0AShad =0A_________________________________ ===================== ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:18:41 AM PST US From: H RULE Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: website to journal Piet build The son of the builder of my plane got hold of me.Just for the hell of it, he googled his fathers name and it came up in an RAA magazine here in Canad a.He had never seen the completed aircraft and wanted to see it flying.He l ooked at the aircraft and after peeking inside the fusalage he said all the smell brought back memories of when he was a boy crawling through the fusy running the cables and installing the pullies.After he seen it fly and too k all the pictures he wanted, he said it completed a life long dream to see her completed and flying.She was started way back in 77 and completed in 2 005 and she flys like a dream.SNOOP DOG GN-1 Aircamper C-IOVC started by Ge orge Uranick of Perth Ontario Canada,sold to Robert Greyham of Manotick Ont ario and then sold to me.Snoop dog with Snoopy painted on the tail- looki ng like Sherlock Homes with that hat and magnifying glass because George wa s an Ontario Provincial Policeman attached to the Snoop division- before he passed away.The work those men did and the ones that helped me c omplete it are all mentioned in the RAA magazine.Guys like George Uranick,R obert Greyham,Tom Bennate and Bob Moorhead. Crafts men, that if they had no t been there for me, I doubt if Snoop would be flying today.These guys real ly know their stuff.I'm just a flyboy myself.My wife told me after seeing a bird house I'd made, said they won't go in that, and they didn't.That's ho w good I am at building anything.--=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A_____________________ ___________=0AFrom: "amsafetyc@aol.com" =0ATo: Pietenpol builders Board =0ASent: Mon, October 12, 200 9 7:26:48 PM=0ASubject: Re: Pietenpol-List: website to journal Piet build =0A=0AHaving a build buddy that happens to be your son brings with it good times, great memories and a deeper and richer relationship for both to shar e for years to come. =0A=0AJohn=0A=0A=0A=0Ahref="http://www.matronics.com /Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-Lis t=0Ahref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com=0Ahref ="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c=0A=0A -======================== ================== ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:58:44 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Quiet From: "TulsaFlyer" Hey Mark, Your logo was kinda' messed up so I fixed it for you. :D Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267723#267723 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/untitled_193.jpg ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 09:07:55 AM PST US From: Oscar Zuniga Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fall flying Here's a shot of our oldest grandson Brandon sitting in 41CC. Tell me he's not enjoying himself: http://www.flysquirrel.net/piets/brandon_003.jpg The only problem was, he thought it was a jet, or at least that's what it sounded like when he "flew" the airplane. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 09:53:23 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Quiet From: "K5YAC" Haaaa ha ha! Well see about that. -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267755#267755 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 10:21:32 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vi Kapler's Piets From: "dwilson" Vi says the dihedral is one inch. The Pietenpol Aircamper located at the Pioneer Museum in Oshkosh has two inches of dihedral. Vi stated that Bernard thought that was too much. It also has only 1/4 inch washout instead of 3/8 that Vi used to rig his wing. DW Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267763#267763 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:23:01 AM PST US From: "mike" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fall flying Doggone it Oscar, I'm already motivated. Stop throwing kerosene on the fire. (My oldest grandson can't see over the cockpit coaming yet so I have a little breathing space.) Mike Hardaway -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Oscar Zuniga Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 2009 9:04 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fall flying --> Here's a shot of our oldest grandson Brandon sitting in 41CC. Tell me he's not enjoying himself: http://www.flysquirrel.net/piets/brandon_003.jpg The only problem was, he thought it was a jet, or at least that's what it sounded like when he "flew" the airplane. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 11:23:00 AM PST US From: Oscar Zuniga Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fall flying Mike wrote: >My oldest grandson can't see over the cockpit coaming yet >so I have a little breathing space. All taildragger pilots can tell you that you don't need to be able to see over the cockpit coaming, and the Ford Piet guys don't get to see straight ahead any of the time due to the radiator anyway. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 11:23:26 AM PST US From: Oscar Zuniga Subject: Pietenpol-List: Vi Kapler's Piets dwilson wrote- >It also has only 1/4 inch washout instead of 3/8 that >Vi used to rig his wing. Shoot... my Piet building ruler doesn't even have fractions that small, my eyes can't see 'em even if they were there, and I'll bet the plane doesn't know the difference ;o) Beautiful, classic Air Campers. And I do like the look with minimal dihedral even though 41CC has about 3" of it. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 11:23:31 AM PST US From: Jeff Boatright Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fall flying It's all them fancy gauges that fooled him, Oscar. Whut are they fer? > > >Here's a shot of our oldest grandson Brandon sitting >in 41CC. Tell me he's not enjoying himself: > >http://www.flysquirrel.net/piets/brandon_003.jpg > >The only problem was, he thought it was a jet, or at >least that's what it sounded like when he "flew" the >airplane. > >Oscar Zuniga ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 12:27:58 PM PST US From: Oscar Zuniga Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fall flying Jeff asked- >It's all them fancy gauges that fooled him, Oscar. >Whut are they fer? Well, I got me a mock-meter on the far left. It tells me how close I'm flyin' to the speed of sound. Then next to it I got me an exhaust gas analyzer to tell me if the water injection system needs to be backed off or if it's set just right. Above that is the visual approach slope indicator, which I don't need to explain to such a sharp gent as yourself. To the right of it is the tomfoolerimeter, which goes from green to yellow as my credibility level drops, and it's set to sound a 'harumph' if the needle keeps climbing from yellow into the red. Last, but not least, on the far right of the panel is the gauge that tells me when it's Miller time. It has an adjustable bug that allows me to set it to any value that I want, but I have the threshold set pretty low at the moment because my Dad always cautioned me, "never pass a waterhole, because the next one might be dry." do not archive Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 12:53:07 PM PST US From: Jeff Boatright Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fall flying Heh - water injection system. Sounds like something the passenger does on any number of my landings... <:-| > > >Jeff asked- > >>It's all them fancy gauges that fooled him, Oscar. >>Whut are they fer? > >Well, I got me a mock-meter on the far left. It >tells me how close I'm flyin' to the speed of sound. >Then next to it I got me an exhaust gas analyzer to >tell me if the water injection system needs to be >backed off or if it's set just right. -- Jeff Boatright "Now let's think about this..." ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 01:25:05 PM PST US From: Wayne Bressler Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Forward Visibility "Forward visibility is a luxury, not a right.". -me I'm sure you've all seen examples of this on the past, but a few examples come immediately to mind: Laird Super Solution Spirit of St Louis Corben Super Ace Most Taildraggers in the 3-point attitude. Not that I'm suggesting it's a good idea (which it isn't), or even that I like the idea (which I don't), but has anyone ever put a nosewheel on a Piet? I know they've done if on the Champ, the folks who sell the Baby Ace have disfigured their airframe in this manner, and even aviation legend Steve Wittman put a nose gear on a Tailwind, but I don't personally know of anyone who has done this to an Aircamper. Gross... Wayne Bressler Jr. Taildraggers, Inc. taildraggersinc.com Sent from the phone that made the Blackberry obsolete. On Oct 13, 2009, at 2:15 PM, Oscar Zuniga wrote: > > > > > Mike wrote: > >> My oldest grandson can't see over the cockpit coaming yet >> so I have a little breathing space. > > All taildragger pilots can tell you that you don't need to > be able to see over the cockpit coaming, and the Ford Piet > guys don't get to see straight ahead any of the time due to > the radiator anyway. > > Oscar Zuniga > Air Camper NX41CC > San Antonio, TX > mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com > website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 02:36:25 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: New to the list. From: "coxwelljon" Hello, I am new to this list but looking over the archives I found lots of interesting stuff and I hope this will be a place to get questions answered or at least experienced opinions. Just a little about myself as a means of introduction. I am an architect by trade and still working as a partial retirement. I have held a private license since 1967 and along the way got my instrument and a commercial ticket (which I never used). I currently have about 1700 hours in lots of different airplanes, all single engine and including about 100 hrs in tail wheel . And in the last 20 years have flown just enough to be able to pass my BFR. I am located in upstate NY in the Adirondack Park. I am building or finishing someone else's project, a GN-1 Aircamper. Project is 75% done with 75% to go. The project started in Canada and then ended up in Iowa. I have no documentation from the original builders who did all the wood work. As I understand it the plane was part of an estate sale and then passed to someone else in payment of a debt. I bought it from a person that had done the conversion of a corvair engine and some covering and that documentation wasn't too bad. Good enough to let me know that I need to do some things over. It has been interesting taking someone else's work and trying to decide if it is OK. When I first started it was overwhelming. I am making headway now, but with each thing I do I find something else that was done before but does not quit work right based on the way I want things to end up. The GN-1 was heavy and this one is not exception. Wings are done and one is covered. Tail surfaces are done and covered but I have had to do some remodeling to make new attachment fittings work. I am working toward covering the fuselage but to do that I have needed to do preliminary rigging and found some guide blocks mis-located. Because these birds tend to be tail heavy I am going to build a Piet style skid but with a tail wheel and try to reduce weight at the tail. A friend gave me a used Scott tail wheel but it is way too heavy in my opinion especially hanging back another 12 " beyond the end of the Fues. Building the tail wheel assembly will put the fuselage covering on hold for a while as I want the mounting hardware in place before covering. Well you get the picture. Apparently Grega is no longer supporting his plans (or his father's plans) so information on the GN-1 is scarce. I hope there are some GN-1 builders that frequent this list that will be willing to share there building experiences. Sorry for being so wordy here, but I thought I would give a little background. -------- Jon Coxwell Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267805#267805 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:52:09 PM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: New to the list. Welcome, Jon!! You're at the right place. Are you sure you're 75%, and not 51%? Don't forget to consider moving the engine forward, maybe 2"? should help with that heavy tail. Gary Boothe Cool, Ca. Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion, mounted Tail done, Fuselage on gear (15 ribs down.) -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of coxwelljon Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 2009 2:36 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: New to the list. Hello, I am new to this list but looking over the archives I found lots of interesting stuff and I hope this will be a place to get questions answered or at least experienced opinions. Just a little about myself as a means of introduction. I am an architect by trade and still working as a partial retirement. I have held a private license since 1967 and along the way got my instrument and a commercial ticket (which I never used). I currently have about 1700 hours in lots of different airplanes, all single engine and including about 100 hrs in tail wheel . And in the last 20 years have flown just enough to be able to pass my BFR. I am located in upstate NY in the Adirondack Park. I am building or finishing someone else's project, a GN-1 Aircamper. Project is 75% done with 75% to go. The project started in Canada and then ended up in Iowa. I have no documentation from the original builders who did all the wood work. As I understand it the plane was part of an estate sale and then passed to someone else in payment of a debt. I bought it from a person that had done the conversion of a corvair engine and some covering and that documentation wasn't too bad. Good enough to let me know that I need to do some things over. It has been interesting taking someone else's work and trying to decide if it is OK. When I first started it was overwhelming. I am making headway now, but with each thing I do I find something else that was done before but does not quit work right based on the way I want things to end up. The GN-1 was heavy and this one is not exception. Wings are done and one is covered. Tail surfaces are done and covered but I have had to do some remodeling to make new attachment fittings work. I am working toward covering the fuselage but to do that I have needed to do preliminary rigging and found some guide blocks mis-located. Because these birds tend to be tail heavy I am going to build a Piet style skid but with a tail wheel and try to reduce weight at the tail. A friend gave me a used Scott tail wheel but it is way too heavy in my opinion especially hanging back another 12 " beyond the end of the Fues. Building the tail wheel assembly will put the fuselage covering on hold for a while as I want the mounting hardware in place before covering. Well you get the picture. Apparently Grega is no longer supporting his plans (or his father's plans) so information on the GN-1 is scarce. I hope there are some GN-1 builders that frequent this list that will be willing to share there building experiences. Sorry for being so wordy here, but I thought I would give a little background. -------- Jon Coxwell Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267805#267805 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 03:50:36 PM PST US From: "Dick N." Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New to the list. I REALLY agree with Gary. If you are taking over a project, you will have to review everything that has been done. In looking at work YOU WILL complete more than 51% of the construction. Dick N. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Boothe" Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 2009 4:46 PM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: New to the list. > > Welcome, Jon!! You're at the right place. Are you sure you're 75%, and not > 51%? > > Don't forget to consider moving the engine forward, maybe 2"? should help > with that heavy tail. > > Gary Boothe > Cool, Ca. > Pietenpol > WW Corvair Conversion, mounted > Tail done, Fuselage on gear > (15 ribs down.) > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of coxwelljon > Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 2009 2:36 PM > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Pietenpol-List: New to the list. > > > > Hello, > > I am new to this list but looking over the archives I found lots of > interesting stuff and I hope this will be a place to get questions > answered > or at least experienced opinions. Just a little about myself as a means > of > introduction. I am an architect by trade and still working as a partial > retirement. I have held a private license since 1967 and along the way > got > my instrument and a commercial ticket (which I never used). I currently > have about 1700 hours in lots of different airplanes, all single engine > and > including about 100 hrs in tail wheel . And in the last 20 years have > flown > just enough to be able to pass my BFR. > > I am located in upstate NY in the Adirondack Park. I am building or > finishing someone else's project, a GN-1 Aircamper. Project is 75% done > with 75% to go. The project started in Canada and then ended up in Iowa. > I > have no documentation from the original builders who did all the wood > work. > As I understand it the plane was part of an estate sale and then passed to > someone else in payment of a debt. I bought it from a person that had > done > the conversion of a corvair engine and some covering and that > documentation > wasn't too bad. Good enough to let me know that I need to do some things > over. > > It has been interesting taking someone else's work and trying to decide if > it is OK. When I first started it was overwhelming. I am making headway > now, but with each thing I do I find something else that was done before > but > does not quit work right based on the way I want things to end up. The > GN-1 > was heavy and this one is not exception. > > Wings are done and one is covered. Tail surfaces are done and covered but > I > have had to do some remodeling to make new attachment fittings work. I am > working toward covering the fuselage but to do that I have needed to do > preliminary rigging and found some guide blocks mis-located. > > Because these birds tend to be tail heavy I am going to build a Piet style > skid but with a tail wheel and try to reduce weight at the tail. A friend > gave me a used Scott tail wheel but it is way too heavy in my opinion > especially hanging back another 12 " beyond the end of the Fues. Building > the tail wheel assembly will put the fuselage covering on hold for a while > as I want the mounting hardware in place before covering. Well you get > the > picture. > > Apparently Grega is no longer supporting his plans (or his father's > plans) > so information on the GN-1 is scarce. I hope there are some GN-1 builders > that frequent this list that will be willing to share there building > experiences. > > Sorry for being so wordy here, but I thought I would give a little > background. > > -------- > Jon Coxwell > Recycle and preserve the planet > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267805#267805 > > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 03:57:39 PM PST US From: Tim Willis Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New to the list. Jon, You have your work cut out. Your piloting and architecture skills will serve you well. It sounds like you have been going it alone, which raises some immediate questions: Do you have at least some Piet and GN-1 prints? Do you have other Piets and builders nearby as resources? You say "heavy"-- how so, have you weighed what you have, and/or estimated the rest? Have you made an estimate of the CG, using a spreadsheet? Have you read the Piet archives on weight and balance, weight, and CG? Is your own weight a negative factor (like mine), or are you OK there (e.g., <200#)? Have you looked at some of the Piet coil spring tailwheel designs? Answers to these questions will let some of us here help you solve your problems. Tim in central TX -----Original Message----- >From: coxwelljon >Sent: Oct 13, 2009 5:35 PM >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Pietenpol-List: New to the list. > > >Hello, > >I am new to this list but looking over the archives I found lots of interesting stuff and I hope this will be a place to get questions answered or at least experienced opinions. Just a little about myself as a means of introduction. I am an architect by trade and still working as a partial retirement. I have held a private license since 1967 and along the way got my instrument and a commercial ticket (which I never used). I currently have about 1700 hours in lots of different airplanes, all single engine and including about 100 hrs in tail wheel . And in the last 20 years have flown just enough to be able to pass my BFR. > >I am located in upstate NY in the Adirondack Park. I am building or finishing someone else's project, a GN-1 Aircamper. Project is 75% done with 75% to go. The project started in Canada and then ended up in Iowa. I have no documentation from the original builders who did all the wood work. As I understand it the plane was part of an estate sale and then passed to someone else in payment of a debt. I bought it from a person that had done the conversion of a corvair engine and some covering and that documentation wasn't too bad. Good enough to let me know that I need to do some things over. > >It has been interesting taking someone else's work and trying to decide if it is OK. When I first started it was overwhelming. I am making headway now, but with each thing I do I find something else that was done before but does not quit work right based on the way I want things to end up. The GN-1 was heavy and this one is not exception. > >Wings are done and one is covered. Tail surfaces are done and covered but I have had to do some remodeling to make new attachment fittings work. I am working toward covering the fuselage but to do that I have needed to do preliminary rigging and found some guide blocks mis-located. > >Because these birds tend to be tail heavy I am going to build a Piet style skid but with a tail wheel and try to reduce weight at the tail. A friend gave me a used Scott tail wheel but it is way too heavy in my opinion especially hanging back another 12 " beyond the end of the Fues. Building the tail wheel assembly will put the fuselage covering on hold for a while as I want the mounting hardware in place before covering. Well you get the picture. > >Apparently Grega is no longer supporting his plans (or his father's plans) so information on the GN-1 is scarce. I hope there are some GN-1 builders that frequent this list that will be willing to share there building experiences. > >Sorry for being so wordy here, but I thought I would give a little background. > >-------- >Jon Coxwell >Recycle and preserve the planet > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267805#267805 > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 05:09:22 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: New to the list. From: "coxwelljon" Welcome, Jon!! You're at the right place. Are you sure you're 75%, and not 51%? I REALLY agree with Gary. If you are taking over a project, you will have to review everything that has been done. In looking at work YOU WILL complete more than 51% of the construction. Gary & Dick, I have discussed this quite a bit with my local EAA and with our local DAR. All have encouraged me to really document what I am doing. I believe that with all I am having to redo I will have no problem being designated as the builder. In fact I have gone through the process with FAA and I am now listed on the registration as the builder. This airplane already had an N-number even though it had never flown or been fully assembled. It took some doing to get the previous builder removed but I got that acomplished. As for the 51% rule, a fellow EAA sent me an exerpt from some FAA documentation and you can use the previous builder as well as your own work for compliance with the 51% rule. -------- Jon Coxwell Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267822#267822 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 05:34:09 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: New to the list. From: "coxwelljon" Tim thanks for your interest, You guys are asking the right questions. Do you have at least some Piet and GN-1 prints? Yes, both Do you have other Piets and builders nearby as resources? A former Piet builder, but he is a purist and is not enamored by by the GN-1. He is some help though if I ask the right questions. I did go to Brodhead this summer and joined the Brodhead Assoc. and get their newsletter. You say "heavy"-- how so, have you weighed what you have, and/or estimated the rest? I have done this and it looks like i will be within gross but close. Have you made an estimate of the CG, using a spreadsheet? No, I am going to do a careful weighing when I get the fuselage covered and then do some calculations. The airplane came with a motor mount for the corvair. The diagonal tube is going the wrong way for the way the engine turns so I will have to redo that. That will be the time to change the engine location if I need to. Is your own weight a negative factor (like mine), or are you OK there (e.g., -------- Jon Coxwell Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267825#267825 ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 06:06:50 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: website to journal Piet build From: "swamppilot" Many thanks to all for the nice comments. We will keep our website up to date and hope to meet all of you at Broadhead. Thanks in advance for the many answers to questions we will have along the way. Thanks, Don & Peyton Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267827#267827 ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 06:07:38 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: website to journal Piet build From: "swamppilot" Many thanks to all for the nice comments. We will keep our website up to date and hope to meet all of you at Broadhead. Thanks in advance for the many answers to questions we will have along the way. Thanks, Don & Peyton Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267828#267828 ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 06:31:46 PM PST US From: "bryan green" Subject: Pietenpol-List: any GN-1 builders Hi I know this is a piet list but are there any GN-1 (wood) builders or owners here. I just purchased a GN-1 that was attacked by a tree and am starting rebuild. When finished I'll be flying it to Piet flyins. Bryan Green Elgin SC ----- Original Message ----- From: "TulsaFlyer" Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 2009 8:58 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Quiet > > Hey Mark, > > Your logo was kinda' messed up so I fixed it for you. :D > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267723#267723 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/untitled_193.jpg > > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 06:32:05 PM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: New to the list. Tim, I see that Jon skillfully avoided the last question!! You are amongst 'friends', Jon! ;-) Gary Boothe Cool, Ca. Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion, mounted Tail done, Fuselage on gear (15 ribs down.) Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of coxwelljon Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 2009 5:32 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: New to the list. Tim thanks for your interest, You guys are asking the right questions. Do you have at least some Piet and GN-1 prints? Yes, both Do you have other Piets and builders nearby as resources? A former Piet builder, but he is a purist and is not enamored by by the GN-1. He is some help though if I ask the right questions. I did go to Brodhead this summer and joined the Brodhead Assoc. and get their newsletter. You say "heavy"-- how so, have you weighed what you have, and/or estimated the rest? I have done this and it looks like i will be within gross but close. Have you made an estimate of the CG, using a spreadsheet? No, I am going to do a careful weighing when I get the fuselage covered and then do some calculations. The airplane came with a motor mount for the corvair. The diagonal tube is going the wrong way for the way the engine turns so I will have to redo that. That will be the time to change the engine location if I need to. Is your own weight a negative factor (like mine), or are you OK there (e.g., -------- Jon Coxwell Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267825#267825 ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 06:32:55 PM PST US From: "bryan green" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New to the list. Hi Jon saw your post. I'm rebuilding a GN-1 and putting a corvair on it. Maybe we can share info. E-mail me off list and I'll give you a call this weekend. Bryan Green Elgin SC ----- Original Message ----- From: "coxwelljon" Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 2009 5:35 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: New to the list. > > > Hello, > > I am new to this list but looking over the archives I found lots of > interesting stuff and I hope this will be a place to get questions > answered or at least experienced opinions. Just a little about myself as > a means of introduction. I am an architect by trade and still working as > a partial retirement. I have held a private license since 1967 and along > the way got my instrument and a commercial ticket (which I never used). I > currently have about 1700 hours in lots of different airplanes, all single > engine and including about 100 hrs in tail wheel . And in the last 20 > years have flown just enough to be able to pass my BFR. > > I am located in upstate NY in the Adirondack Park. I am building or > finishing someone else's project, a GN-1 Aircamper. Project is 75% done > with 75% to go. The project started in Canada and then ended up in Iowa. > I have no documentation from the original builders who did all the wood > work. As I understand it the plane was part of an estate sale and then > passed to someone else in payment of a debt. I bought it from a person > that had done the conversion of a corvair engine and some covering and > that documentation wasn't too bad. Good enough to let me know that I need > to do some things over. > > It has been interesting taking someone else's work and trying to decide if > it is OK. When I first started it was overwhelming. I am making headway > now, but with each thing I do I find something else that was done before > but does not quit work right based on the way I want things to end up. > The GN-1 was heavy and this one is not exception. > > Wings are done and one is covered. Tail surfaces are done and covered but > I have had to do some remodeling to make new attachment fittings work. I > am working toward covering the fuselage but to do that I have needed to do > preliminary rigging and found some guide blocks mis-located. > > Because these birds tend to be tail heavy I am going to build a Piet style > skid but with a tail wheel and try to reduce weight at the tail. A friend > gave me a used Scott tail wheel but it is way too heavy in my opinion > especially hanging back another 12 " beyond the end of the Fues. Building > the tail wheel assembly will put the fuselage covering on hold for a while > as I want the mounting hardware in place before covering. Well you get > the picture. > > Apparently Grega is no longer supporting his plans (or his father's > plans) so information on the GN-1 is scarce. I hope there are some GN-1 > builders that frequent this list that will be willing to share there > building experiences. > > Sorry for being so wordy here, but I thought I would give a little > background. > > -------- > Jon Coxwell > Recycle and preserve the planet > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267805#267805 > > > ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 06:38:21 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: website to journal Piet build From: "coxwelljon" [quote="swamppilot"]All, As some of you know my 14 year old son and I are building a Piet (his project). We created a website for the project. The site includes a blog that he will use as a journal to post each step of the build. If you would like to check it out the URL is: www.firstwings.net (http://www.firstwings.net) We will expand the site to included a photo album as time goes on. Don 12 ribs complete > [b] Don & Peyton, Nice website. Good luck, I look forward to following your progress. -------- Jon Coxwell Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267839#267839 ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 06:43:55 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: any GN-1 builders From: "coxwelljon" Hi Bryan, See my post "new to the list" I am about 1 year into finishing someone else's project. My GN-1 has never flown. I purchased it several years ago and I am now working on it in earnest. -------- Jon Coxwell Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267840#267840 ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 06:52:15 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: New to the list. From: "coxwelljon" gboothe5(at)comcast.net wrote: > Tim, > > I see that Jon skillfully avoided the last question!! You are amongst > 'friends', Jon! ;-) > > Gary Boothe > Cool, Ca. > Pietenpol > WW Corvair Conversion, mounted > Tail done, Fuselage on gear > (15 ribs down.) > Do not archive > > -- You must mean the one about the archives, No I haven't looked there yet. -------- Jon Coxwell Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267841#267841 ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 07:29:13 PM PST US From: "ALAN LYSCARS" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: any GN-1 builders Bryan.. I'm starting a GN-1 from plans here in New Hampshire. Al Lyscars ----- Original Message ----- From: "bryan green" Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 2009 9:14 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: any GN-1 builders > > Hi I know this is a piet list but are there any GN-1 (wood) builders or > owners here. I just purchased a GN-1 that was attacked by a tree and am > starting rebuild. When finished I'll be flying it to Piet flyins. > Bryan Green > Elgin SC > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "TulsaFlyer" > To: > Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 2009 8:58 AM > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Quiet > > >> >> Hey Mark, >> >> Your logo was kinda' messed up so I fixed it for you. :D >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267723#267723 >> >> >> >> >> Attachments: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com//files/untitled_193.jpg >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 07:50:44 PM PST US From: Oscar Zuniga Subject: Pietenpol-List: New to the list Jon; what the jokers were baiting you into was the question about your own personal "gross weight". Some pilots tip the scales at a bit more than the FAA "standard weight" of 170 lbs. and they tend to pick on the ones who don't quite come up to snuff. I presently weigh just a pound or two over 150 myself, so they would say I don't measure up to what the FAA considers to be a "standard pilot". For those building a Grega GN-1 Aircamper, don't feel a bit put off by this being formally a discussion group for the Pietenpol Air Camper. I submitted a detailed response to Doc Mosher regarding the nuanced differences between Mr. Pietenpol's original Air Camper design and Mr. Grega's follow-on GN-1 Aircamper redesign/revision/improvement, but I respect both men and their designs and believe them to be worthy compatriots in the challenge to see who can fly lowest and slowest and provide pilots with the most fun, at the lowest cost, with the simplest construction, and to give the most consternation to the tin-and-rivet crowd. I doubt that you will find any Piet pilot on this list who would not share a beer with a GN-1 pilot, but there are a few of them (mostly over 170 lbs.) who will throw down a gauntlet and challenge you to a spot landing contest or something when they find out you fly a GN-1. Like as not, they will also 'harumph' loudly when you step into the bar. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 07:58:52 PM PST US From: "Clif Dawson" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fall flying I don't want none of your lip Harv! Clif Do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: H RULE Great stuff;I wish I could do the same but even if I did have mine in running order it would be so cold that like Wap May, when I pulled my scarf off my lips would come with it.LOL! do not archive ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 08:26:37 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: any GN-1 builders From: "coxwelljon" alyscars(at)myfairpoint.n wrote: > Bryan.. > > I'm starting a GN-1 from plans here in New Hampshire. > > Al Lyscars > > --- Al, we are not too far apart. I live in Remsen, NY just N of Utica. -------- Jon Coxwell Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267855#267855 ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 08:33:45 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: New to the list From: "coxwelljon" Thanks for the kind words. 200 is a good and accurate number but I am trying for 20 under that just to extend longevity. Not only do I want to complete the GN-1, but I want to be healthy enough to fly it. At this age one has to think about these things. -------- Jon Coxwell Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=267856#267856 ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 09:39:17 PM PST US From: Jim Subject: Re: RE: RE: Pietenpol-List: Western Piets availabele next week? Gary, I don't know for sure. I think the lens is dirty and just haven'tchecked it yet. I will do that tomorrow or whenever I remember it. I knowI need a new prescription! Sorry it took so long to answer this; I have been busy and next Tuesday we will be in Arizona for a couple of weeks; holy delay Batman! Jim Do not archive Jim Boyer Santa Rosa, CA Pietenpol on wheels Tail surfaces done Wing ribs done Corvair engine Oct 9, 2009 05:52:54 PM, pietenpol-list@matronics.com wrote: Jim, It's just about time!!! You must be excited! I have to ask, though: What's wrong with your camera? I notice that your pictures are getting fuzzy, or do I need a new prescription? Gary Boothe Cool, Ca. Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion, mounted Tail done, Fuselage on gear (15 ribs down) Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Sent: Friday, October 09, 2009 5:02 PM Subject: Re: RE: Pietenpol-List: Western Piets availabele next week? Just had to send it to you; i.e. ask and you shall receive. I've got all the fuselage fittings off as I am sanding and varnishing the inside of the cockpits. Then paint all the control sticks, etc before mounting them again. Notice I still have the price tag on the tailwheel; I may leave it there ala Minnie Pearl. Jim B. Jim Boyer Santa Rosa, CA Pietenpol builder with Corvair On Oct 9, 2009, Gary Boothe wrote: Hold the phone! You have her on the gear? Let's see some pics!! Gary Boothe Cool, Ca. Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion, mounted Tail done, Fuselage on gear (15 ribs down) Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Sent: Friday, October 09, 2009 1:18 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Western Piets availabele next week? John, If you don't mind a 40 mile detour off I-80 you are welcome to come to Santa Rosa and see my Piet under construction. I have the fuselage on wheels, wing ribs done, tail surfaces done, engine mount done, and engine about ready to hang.l Santa Rosa is North of San Francisco on highway 101 and about 40 miles West of I-80 via highway 12. My address is 3504 BAnyan St and phone is 707-571-8001. It would be nice to have a visitor and get some constructive comments. Cheers, Jim B. Jim Boyer Santa Rosa, CA Pietenpol builder with Corvair On Oct 9, 2009, AMsafetyC@aol.com wrote: Going to Portland, Sacramento and Stockton next week looking for Piets, second request got 2 reply's anyone else interested? Lemme no John ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 09:53:06 PM PST US From: "Clif Dawson" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Forward Visibility There is a rumour of same. As the story goes, someone had such a light engine and extra long nose( no, not the pilot) that he couldn't overcome takeoff prop forces, His solution was to level the plane. Clif has anyone ever put a > nosewheel on a Piet? I know they've done if on the Champ, > Wayne > Bressler Jr. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.