Today's Message Index:
----------------------
0. 12:06 AM - List Fund Raiser (Matt Dralle)
1. 05:07 AM - Re: Upper Flying Strut Fitting, Possibe Plans Error (ivan.todorovic)
2. 05:24 AM - Re: Got a new camera (Gene & Tammy)
3. 07:55 AM - Re: Got a new camera (Jack Phillips)
4. 08:59 AM - Re: Upper Flying Strut Fitting, Possibe Plans Error (K5YAC)
5. 09:04 AM - Re Have a new camera (G & R Hewitt)
6. 11:53 AM - bungee wrapping (Douwe Blumberg)
7. 12:16 PM - Re: Re: Got a new camera (Wayne Bressler)
8. 12:54 PM - splash page for Piets at Fly-Ins (Jeff Boatright)
9. 01:18 PM - Re: splash page for Piets at Fly-Ins (Jim Markle)
10. 01:21 PM - Re: splash page for Piets at Fly-Ins (Barry Davis)
11. 04:05 PM - Re: Got a new camera (Graham Hansen)
12. 04:10 PM - Re: bungee wrapping (gcardinal)
13. 04:55 PM - Re: splash page for Piets at Fly-Ins (airlion)
14. 07:30 PM - Re: Upper Flying Strut Fitting, Possibe Plans Error (dwilson)
15. 08:40 PM - Re: Upper Flying Strut Fitting, Possibe Plans Error (K5YAC)
Message 0
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| Subject: | List Fund Raiser |
Dear Listers,
Just a reminder that November is the Matronics Email List Fund Raiser month. There
are some very nice incentive gifts to choose from as well!
Please make your Contribution today:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Thank you!
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Upper Flying Strut Fitting, Possibe Plans Error |
Dan,
Can we get some more photos of that spar?
Thanks,
Ivan
dwilson wrote:
> We re-covered the Aircamper at Pioneer Airport a few years ago during Oshkosh.
This plane was built by Bernard in 1966. I have a few photo's of the construction
of the wing. Here is how the designer put it together. Note the laminated
spar. Plywood was glued on both sides of the spar ( under the fitting ).
The spar was signed Bernard Pietenpol - 1966.
>
> Dan Wilson
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272294#272294
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| Subject: | Re: Got a new camera |
Sorry we missed you. Let us know when your back in the area. Glad your
getting the rain instead of us.
Gene
Do Not Archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Jack Phillips
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 8:00 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Got a new camera
Gene, I thought of you yesterday as I crossed over the Tennessee
River, ferrying the RV-4 back to North Carolina. I never had time to
get up with you and Randy. I got into Jackson late Sunday night and
left fairly early yesterday morning, trying to beat all the weather from
Ida here. Good thing I left when I did - we won't see the sun here now
until Sunday, and are forecast to get 6" of rain by then.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Raleigh, NC
Message 3
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| Subject: | Got a new camera |
Got 2-1/2" last night and it hasn't stopped yet. Makes it a good day to
work on the RV-10 in the basement.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Raleigh, NC
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene & Tammy
Sent: Wednesday, November 11, 2009 8:24 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Got a new camera
Sorry we missed you. Let us know when your back in the area. Glad your
getting the rain instead of us.
Gene
Do Not Archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Jack <mailto:pietflyr@bellsouth.net> Phillips
Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 8:00 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Got a new camera
Gene, I thought of you yesterday as I crossed over the Tennessee River,
ferrying the RV-4 back to North Carolina. I never had time to get up with
you and Randy. I got into Jackson late Sunday night and left fairly early
yesterday morning, trying to beat all the weather from Ida here. Good thing
I left when I did - we won't see the sun here now until Sunday, and are
forecast to get 6" of rain by then.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Raleigh, NC
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Upper Flying Strut Fitting, Possibe Plans Error |
Yeah, how about a close up of that lift strut attachment area if you have it.
That is installed totally unlike any other I have seen.
--------
Mark - working on wings
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272323#272323
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| Subject: | Re Have a new camera |
Hi Guys,
My two bob's worth re comments on Jeffs video.
I have found from bitter experience that it is quite difficult to assess a
climb or approach gradient by watching a video, particularly when filmed
from behind or in front of the flight path.
Many years ago I was involved in an initial test flight of an RV6A fitted
with a dreaded nose wheel.
The flight was uneventful & after carrying out several stalls to establish a
safe approach speed I made my approach in the accustomed manner, after a
normal touch down, without any warning the machine started a violent
porpoise over which I had no control, then the nose leg failed I only
traveled about 50 yards on a sealed runway.
Later inspection showed a clean break exactly where the leg changed in
thickness with very little radius where it exited the outer tube.
The owner showed me a video sequence taken from almost in front of the
event.
this video & the broken leg were sent to the manufacturer in the USA who
sent out an email world wide criticizing the test pilot & alleging that he
had made a very steep approach with little flare and had subjected the
machine to some brutal pitch changes after landing.
This was a bit hard to take as at the time I had a total of 22000 flying
hours on over 100 types & had also done over 20 initial test flights of home
builts including 6 RV's.
It was very interesting to note that shortly after this another two nose
legs failed, then the nose leg design was very quickly modified to have a
safe radius where it exited the tube.
This whole affair was based on a video evidence,shot from dead ahead of the
approach path.
So what I am saying here is that perhaps caution should be taken before
criticism is made after watching a video taken from behind or in front.
>From the shots taken from the side I thought that Jeff was exemplary with
his technique, he was careful not to pull off too early, had a good margin
above the stall & showed excellent directional control, nothing squirrelly
about it.
The other factor is that with trees ahead it is not a bad idea to go for max
climb gradient initially. These trees could not be seen on the video
Back to my shed, my own Piet only needs fuel tank, top decking on fuse &
covering after 3 years hard work,
I have to keep at it as I'm now 81, I look forward to sending you all a
video of my own first flight (taken from the side)
Best regards Graham Hewitt in West Australia
Message 6
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I asked this a while ago but wasn't really ready to start, and have lost the info.
I am sorry for asking again, but would really appreciate your input. Talking
Jenny gear here.
seems the two thicknesses used are 1/2 and 5/8, most using 1/2.
How many feet did you use on each side, and how many wraps.
Also, by "wrap" I guess I mean one complete time around. Or... how many pieces
of bungee can you see on each side of the "V"
Also, can anyone think of a reason I couldn't use cable clamps to hold them together
at the ends?
Douwe
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Got a new camera |
Jim,
Post that video on YouTube!
Jeff - I was impressed with your climb angle. It looked like good fun!
Wayne Bressler Jr.
Taildraggers, Inc.
taildraggersinc.com
Sent from the phone that made the Blackberry obsolete.
On Nov 11, 2009, at 12:58 AM, Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
wrote:
> >
>
> I have a video of you and that Werner taking off at Brodhead in (I
> think) 2002...it WAS incredible!
>
> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Pieti Lowell <Lowellcfrank@yahoo.com>
>> Sent: Nov 10, 2009 10:55 PM
>> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Got a new camera
>>
>> >
>>
>> Hi Jeff:,
>> Looks perfect to me, I'm glad that I never have shown the rate of
>> climb when I had the Werner 145, 500 cu in. on my Piet, It was very
>> capable of a loop on take-off and still have 200 feet under me at
>> the bottom of the loop. God help me if the engine sneezed once. I
>> tested that item at 2000Ft.
>> Jeff, fly as you feel comfortable with, And you sure look good to me.
>> Pieti Lowell
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272204#272204
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | splash page for Piets at Fly-Ins |
Pieters,
We were invited to bring the Piet to a local fly-in. The organizer
asks that we set out a sign or something that has information on the
Pietenpol Aircamper. As this is last minute (just got off the phone
with the guy and the fly-in is this Saturday morning), I don't really
have time to put something together. Come to think of it, if I had
time for THAT, I'd use it flying the Piet! Anyway, do any of you have
a digital version of Piet info that you set out beside your airplane
when you attend fly-ins? Any place you can point me to on the web?
Thanks in advance,
Jeff
--
---
Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D.
Associate Professor of Ophthalmology
Emory University School of Medicine
Editor-in-Chief
Molecular Vision
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: splash page for Piets at Fly-Ins |
Here's a copy of what I think is just about the neatest thing I've ever seen for
that type of info.
Larry Prange did this and I thought it was really cool.
I've attached a small version but if you want a larger, more detailed copy of the
file, let me know offlist.
-----Original Message-----
>From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri@emory.edu>
>Sent: Nov 11, 2009 2:51 PM
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: splash page for Piets at Fly-Ins
>
>
>Pieters,
>
>We were invited to bring the Piet to a local fly-in. The organizer
>asks that we set out a sign or something that has information on the
>Pietenpol Aircamper. As this is last minute (just got off the phone
>with the guy and the fly-in is this Saturday morning), I don't really
>have time to put something together. Come to think of it, if I had
>time for THAT, I'd use it flying the Piet! Anyway, do any of you have
>a digital version of Piet info that you set out beside your airplane
>when you attend fly-ins? Any place you can point me to on the web?
>
>Thanks in advance,
>
>Jeff
>--
>---
>
>Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D.
>Associate Professor of Ophthalmology
>Emory University School of Medicine
>Editor-in-Chief
>Molecular Vision
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | splash page for Piets at Fly-Ins |
Jeff
I did several for the Big Piets for airshow displays. If you can do the
artwork, I can print you some tomorrow say 18"x24" or 24"x36"I enclosed a
pic of some I did for the Epps Bi-Plane display. Let me know.
Barry Davis
770-834-8900
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff
Boatright
Sent: Wednesday, November 11, 2009 3:52 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: splash page for Piets at Fly-Ins
Pieters,
We were invited to bring the Piet to a local fly-in. The organizer asks that
we set out a sign or something that has information on the Pietenpol
Aircamper. As this is last minute (just got off the phone with the guy and
the fly-in is this Saturday morning), I don't really have time to put
something together. Come to think of it, if I had time for THAT, I'd use it
flying the Piet! Anyway, do any of you have a digital version of Piet info
that you set out beside your airplane when you attend fly-ins? Any place you
can point me to on the web?
Thanks in advance,
Jeff
--
---
Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D.
Associate Professor of Ophthalmology
Emory University School of Medicine
Editor-in-Chief
Molecular Vision
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Got a new camera |
Hello Jeff,
Frankly, your take-offs and climb-outs looked fine to me because you
didn't haul it off the ground at low speed and seemed to have lots of
speed during the climb-out. As Graham Hewett observed, a camera (even a
new one!) can create an illusion depending on the camera's location
relative to the action. From your posting, it is evident that you are
keenly aware of the draggy nature of the Pietenpol and are handling it
accordingly.
Your Piet seems to accelerate in a spritely manner, as does mine with a
C85 Continental up front. When I first flew it (39 years ago on November
15th), it was powered by a Continental A65. At our elevation of about
2400 feet, its performance with an adult passenger on a hot day was
marginal, and it needed to be flown very carefully. The C85 is a vast
improvement, but I continually remind myself that whatever you had up
front doesn't make any difference when the engine quits. Zero is zero
and it is "deadstick" time. Therefore, I tend to be very conservative by
climbing out at about 70 mph, unless I have to clear obstacles. With the
A65 I had to climb at about 60 mph because the cruise speed was only in
the low seventies. With the C85, the climb is still good even at 70+ and
I would have adequate speed for control and extra time to lower the nose
should the engine decide to take the rest of the day off. (Of course, in
this area there are lots of grain fields and our airstrip has clear
approaches so I don't really have to claw for altitude right after
taking off.)
During the early 1950s I worked in the north as an aircraft mechanic for
4 1/2 years and had the good fortune to do a lot of flying with three
veteran bush pilots who, all of them, had flown Spitfires in combat. I
had a private pilot licence then and learned a lot about flying
technique and weather from them--which was invaluable later on when I
became a commercial pilot. I learned from them and others that if you
stall, you lose control---and when you lose control, you die. During the
initial climb-out you will not have sufficient altitude to do much and
if you are also low on airspeed/kinetic energy, you may stall if the
engine suddenly fails. Having extra airspeed means a lower angle of
attack and is "money in the bank", so to speak.
It is far better to be able to fly the airplane into the treetops under
control and lose the airplane, than to stall and lose everything.
I remember examining the wreckage of a Cessna 180 that had an engine
failure at low altitude over solid bush. The cabin section was the
largest part remaining and all four (there may have been five!)occupants
walked away because the pilot maintained airspeed and control. And I
remember the Taylorcraft pilot who was killed because he tried to turn
back to the airstrip after his engine failed, stalled and spun in. Even
then, he probably would have survived had he been wearing shoulder
harness because the airplane wasn't all that badly damaged. Ironically,
he had plenty of room in the field ahead and didn't need to try to turn
back! A DH Beaver floatplane pilot I knew died when he tried to save the
airplane after the engine failed (from fuel contamination) shortly after
taking off from a lake, and stalled. Had he put it down on the rocks
under control, they would have survived and the airplane (not the
floats) may have been salvageable.
Anyway, this old guy (I'll be 81 next month) will continue to abide by
the ancient aeronautical dictum:
"Always maintain thine airspeed lest the ground arise and smite thee."
My $0.02---but that isn't worth much anymore!
Cheers,
Graham Hansen (Pietenpol CF-AUN in Alberta, Canada)
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: bungee wrapping |
7' of 5/8" cord. 3 wraps will do it. Hose clamps are perfectly acceptable.
Use heat shrink tubing on the ends of the cord to keep them from fraying.
Greg C.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg@earthlink.net>
Sent: Wednesday, November 11, 2009 11:55 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: bungee wrapping
> <douweblumberg@earthlink.net>
>
> I asked this a while ago but wasn't really ready to start, and have lost
> the info. I am sorry for asking again, but would really appreciate your
> input. Talking Jenny gear here.
>
> seems the two thicknesses used are 1/2 and 5/8, most using 1/2.
>
> How many feet did you use on each side, and how many wraps.
>
> Also, by "wrap" I guess I mean one complete time around. Or... how many
> pieces of bungee can you see on each side of the "V"
>
> Also, can anyone think of a reason I couldn't use cable clamps to hold
> them together at the ends?
>
> Douwe
>
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: splash page for Piets at Fly-Ins |
Jeff, P.F. Beck in Barnwell S. C has info on the pietenpol already printed out.
I'm sure he would be glad to send it to you. His phone number is 803 259 6381.
Cheers, Gardiner Mason
----- Original Message ----
From: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
Sent: Wed, November 11, 2009 4:17:48 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: splash page for Piets at Fly-Ins
Here's a copy of what I think is just about the neatest thing I've ever seen for
that type of info.
Larry Prange did this and I thought it was really cool.
I've attached a small version but if you want a larger, more detailed copy of the
file, let me know offlist.
-----Original Message-----
>From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri@emory.edu>
>Sent: Nov 11, 2009 2:51 PM
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: splash page for Piets at Fly-Ins
>
>
>Pieters,
>
>We were invited to bring the Piet to a local fly-in. The organizer
>asks that we set out a sign or something that has information on the
>Pietenpol Aircamper. As this is last minute (just got off the phone
>with the guy and the fly-in is this Saturday morning), I don't really
>have time to put something together. Come to think of it, if I had
>time for THAT, I'd use it flying the Piet! Anyway, do any of you have
>a digital version of Piet info that you set out beside your airplane
>when you attend fly-ins? Any place you can point me to on the web?
>
>Thanks in advance,
>
>Jeff
>--
>---
>
>Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D.
>Associate Professor of Ophthalmology
>Emory University School of Medicine
>Editor-in-Chief
>Molecular Vision
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Upper Flying Strut Fitting, Possibe Plans Error |
You may have to rotate this photo's for proper orientation, then use your software
to zoom in for a better view... These photo's are of the construction of
the one piece wing. 1966 Bernard Pietenpol. Note the small block located on the
top of the spar next to the end rib, Bernard located an eye hook at the end
of each spar so that he could connect the one piece wing to a pulley system that
he used to lower or raise the wing in order to attach it to the fuselage.
He could accomplish this without any assistance. The pulley system can be seen
at the Pietenpol Hanger at the Pioneer Airport in Oshkosh. He really was a
genius... Hope you enjoy the pictures.
Dan Wilson
Austin, Minnesota
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272394#272394
Attachments:
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http://forums.matronics.com//files/dan10_476.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dan9_119.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dan6_135.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dan4_503.jpg
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Upper Flying Strut Fitting, Possibe Plans Error |
Cool photos! Thanks for sharing.
--------
Mark - working on wings
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272399#272399
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