---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 01/31/10: 12 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 02:53 AM - Re: cockpit metalwork (auscar) 2. 04:49 AM - Re: Rear Seat belts (Gene & Tammy) 3. 06:44 AM - Re: My new 613.5 airfoil jig! (Gary Boothe) 4. 07:11 AM - Rear turtle deck-stab question (Jack) 5. 07:34 AM - Re: Rear turtle deck-stab question (Gary Boothe) 6. 08:05 AM - Re: Rear turtle deck-stab question (Jack Phillips) 7. 09:24 AM - Re: My new 613.5 airfoil jig! (Chet Hartley) 8. 09:54 AM - Re: My new 613.5 airfoil jig! (Mark Roberts) 9. 11:50 AM - cold weather flying (Oscar Zuniga) 10. 04:38 PM - Re: Re: My new 613.5 airfoil jig! (Mark Roberts) 11. 07:25 PM - Re: cold weather flying (coxwelljon) 12. 08:22 PM - Re: Re: cold weather flying (David Paule) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 02:53:00 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: cockpit metalwork From: "auscar" Thinking about it. Although a PPL would need to be sorted. Took a few lessons years ago but then the cost of the cars got in the way. My wife is keen on the RV 10 so we can put the mtb's in the back and go moutain biking in other parts of NZ but a Piet is more in my price range. Have to be a steel fuselage. -------- Just Lurking Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=284134#284134 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 04:49:33 AM PST US From: "Gene & Tammy" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Rear Seat belts Jack, from everything I have read you never want to anchor your shoulder belts below your shoulders. In a crash it will compress your spine. There is some thought that you would be better off without shoulder belts, rather that using ones anchored at the bottom. Gene in snowy beautiful Tennessee N502R ----- Original Message ----- From: Jack To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 4:56 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Rear Seat belts For the rear cockpit, from pictures I've seen, some have their shoulder belts exit from the top of the bulkhead and some from the bottom. Is there a preference for comfort and or safety? Thanks, Jack DSM ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 01/30/10 19:35:00 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:44:35 AM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: My new 613.5 airfoil jig! Mark, Welcome back!!! ..and good luck to you! Gary Boothe Cool, Ca. Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion, mounted Tail done, Fuselage on gear (16 ribs down.) Do not archive _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mark Roberts Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 9:45 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: My new 613.5 airfoil jig! OK, after sitting on the side lines from a job loss in September, I have made a stab at resuming my Piet build. Since I am getting no calls from the recruiters and job boards, I decided to team up with a friend and start a wooden sign business here in Clovis out of his Dad's specialty wood shop. I'll spare ya the story about how all of this came about, but it is a good match, and get this: I work in a shop that owns a professional CNC router. In fact, the Dad (Al) told Jason and I that we had full reign over the router, and he wanted us to run it full time to make money. See Jason was laid off too, so we both were 'available' to start a new business.... BUT, I thought what a great way to make professional wing jigs and wing kits for various planes. I am not sure of the legalities involved, but I knew I needed a good Riblett 613.5 wing jig, so I took my previous CAD drawings and brought them into the software we use (EnRoute 4) and presto! A new peg jig perfectly following the coordinates... Then I thought about cutting all of the little sticks to size with the CNC to make the rib gussets and such. I drew them into the program and ran it today at the shop and got press-to-fit perfect parts! It is something to see a part fit into place with almost a snap! And it just takes a few minutes to cut the parts for one rib! Building still out of poplar, and I did already have the top and bottom cap strips done, and I still need to cut the new pre-bending jig yet, but when I finished snapping the parts in (not too tight, and not too loose... J'est right for some epoxy :o) place I was very excited. I know there are a few of you guys looking at the 613.5 airfoil and I am looking into the legalities of making a few kits for those that might want a jig, a pre-bending jig, and the cap strip and cut pieces that will save ya from having to cut all of those little parts (sticks and 1/16" ply gussets) for this wing. What was a real trip about this wood shop was when I first went in there and found out he had specialty wood (stuff I'd never heard of before) and asked if he carried Sitka Spruce, he pointed to a bin and said "There sits some certified Sitka Spar stock".... and what about some aircraft ply for my gussets? "Right there in that stack..." So, instead of looking for another job, I created one for myself. Unfortunately, there's no pay check (yet) but I'm having fun! :o) Here's some pics of the finished rib ready to glue and trim the Leading Edge... If anyone has an interest in a potential kit or two, I can work up some numbers once I find out what legal stuff I must do... Just an update. Hope to begin posting again as I make progress! Mark ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:11:40 AM PST US From: "Jack" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Rear turtle deck-stab question The plans for the long fuselage show a measurement of 18 7/8 inches for the distance between the rear of the turtle deck and back of the tail post. The short plans show as 18 inches. Am I missing something here? The horizontal stabilizer cord is 18 inches. Shall we go with this? Thanks, Jack DSM ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:34:07 AM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Rear turtle deck-stab question Jack, I did not catch that before building, but definitely realized it after I started fitting the stabilizer. You can see the piece of 'filler' here. One good thing, is that it gave me something to round off nicely for the transition. Gary Boothe Cool, Ca. Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion, mounted Tail done, Fuselage on gear (16 ribs down.) _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jack Sent: Sunday, January 31, 2010 7:07 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Rear turtle deck-stab question The plans for the long fuselage show a measurement of 18 7/8 inches for the distance between the rear of the turtle deck and back of the tail post. The short plans show as 18 inches. Am I missing something here? The horizontal stabilizer cord is 18 inches. Shall we go with this? Thanks, Jack DSM ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:05:06 AM PST US From: "Jack Phillips" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Rear turtle deck-stab question Just make it fit. Be sure to give yourself allowance for fabric and paint. I think you would want a gap of 1/8" or so between the end of the turtledeck and the stab. I never noticed the discrepancy because I had my stab mounted when I built the turtledeck and just made everything fit. Jack Phillips NX899JP Raleigh, NC _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jack Sent: Sunday, January 31, 2010 10:07 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Rear turtle deck-stab question The plans for the long fuselage show a measurement of 18 7/8 inches for the distance between the rear of the turtle deck and back of the tail post. The short plans show as 18 inches. Am I missing something here? The horizontal stabilizer cord is 18 inches. Shall we go with this? Thanks, Jack DSM ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:24:01 AM PST US From: "Chet Hartley" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: My new 613.5 airfoil jig! Mark, I would be interested in the 613.5 wing jig. Do you have plans for a Cub jig as well? Chet Hartley ----- Original Message ----- From: Mark Roberts To: pietenpol-list Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 11:45 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: My new 613.5 airfoil jig! OK, after sitting on the side lines from a job loss in September, I have made a stab at resuming my Piet build. Since I am getting no calls from the recruiters and job boards, I decided to team up with a friend and start a wooden sign business here in Clovis out of his Dad's specialty wood shop. I'll spare ya the story about how all of this came about, but it is a good match, and get this: I work in a shop that owns a professional CNC router. In fact, the Dad (Al) told Jason and I that we had full reign over the router, and he wanted us to run it full time to make money. See Jason was laid off too, so we both were 'available' to start a new business.... BUT, I thought what a great way to make professional wing jigs and wing kits for various planes. I am not sure of the legalities involved, but I knew I needed a good Riblett 613.5 wing jig, so I took my previous CAD drawings and brought them into the software we use (EnRoute 4) and presto! A new peg jig perfectly following the coordinates... Then I thought about cutting all of the little sticks to size with the CNC to make the rib gussets and such. I drew them into the program and ran it today at the shop and got press-to-fit perfect parts! It is something to see a part fit into place with almost a snap! And it just takes a few minutes to cut the parts for one rib! Building still out of poplar, and I did already have the top and bottom cap strips done, and I still need to cut the new pre-bending jig yet, but when I finished snapping the parts in (not too tight, and not too loose... J'est right for some epoxy :o) place I was very excited. I know there are a few of you guys looking at the 613.5 airfoil and I am looking into the legalities of making a few kits for those that might want a jig, a pre-bending jig, and the cap strip and cut pieces that will save ya from having to cut all of those little parts (sticks and 1/16" ply gussets) for this wing. What was a real trip about this wood shop was when I first went in there and found out he had specialty wood (stuff I'd never heard of before) and asked if he carried Sitka Spruce, he pointed to a bin and said "There sits some certified Sitka Spar stock".... and what about some aircraft ply for my gussets? "Right there in that stack..." So, instead of looking for another job, I created one for myself. Unfortunately, there's no pay check (yet) but I'm having fun! :o) Here's some pics of the finished rib ready to glue and trim the Leading Edge... If anyone has an interest in a potential kit or two, I can work up some numbers once I find out what legal stuff I must do... Just an update. Hope to begin posting again as I make progress! Mark ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:54:50 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: My new 613.5 airfoil jig! From: Mark Roberts Thanks Gary! Glad to know I was missed :o) Hey Chet! I don't yet have a Cub jig, but I plan to make a few airfoils and I need folks like you to suggest and help me find the right airfoils, etc. You can call me and we can chat off line if you'd like: 559-917-5904. Thanks! Mark On Sun, Jan 31, 2010 at 9:15 AM, Chet Hartley wrote: > Mark, > > I would be interested in the 613.5 wing jig. > > Do you have plans for a Cub jig as well? > > Chet Hartley > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Mark Roberts > *To:* pietenpol-list > *Sent:* Saturday, January 30, 2010 11:45 PM > *Subject:* Pietenpol-List: My new 613.5 airfoil jig! > > OK, after sitting on the side lines from a job loss in September, I have > made a stab at resuming my Piet build. Since I am getting no calls from the > recruiters and job boards, I decided to team up with a friend and start a > wooden sign business here in Clovis out of his Dad's specialty wood shop. > I'll spare ya the story about how all of this came about, but it is a good > match, and get this: I work in a shop that owns a professional CNC router. > In fact, the Dad (Al) told Jason and I that we had full reign over the > router, and he wanted us to run it full time to make money. See Jason was > laid off too, so we both were 'available' to start a new business.... > > BUT, I thought what a great way to make professional wing jigs and wing > kits for various planes. I am not sure of the legalities involved, but I > knew I needed a good Riblett 613.5 wing jig, so I took my previous CAD > drawings and brought them into the software we use (EnRoute 4) and presto! A > new peg jig perfectly following the coordinates... > > Then I thought about cutting all of the little sticks to size with the CNC > to make the rib gussets and such. I drew them into the program and ran it > today at the shop and got press-to-fit perfect parts! It is something to see > a part fit into place with almost a snap! And it just takes a few minutes to > cut the parts for one rib! > > Building still out of poplar, and I did already have the top and bottom cap > strips done, and I still need to cut the new pre-bending jig yet, but when I > finished snapping the parts in (not too tight, and not too loose... J'est > right for some epoxy :o) place I was very excited. > > I know there are a few of you guys looking at the 613.5 airfoil and I am > looking into the legalities of making a few kits for those that might want a > jig, a pre-bending jig, and the cap strip and cut pieces that will save ya > from having to cut all of those little parts (sticks and 1/16" ply gussets) > for this wing. > > What was a real trip about this wood shop was when I first went in there > and found out he had specialty wood (stuff I'd never heard of before) and > asked if he carried Sitka Spruce, he pointed to a bin and said "There sits > some certified Sitka Spar stock".... and what about some aircraft ply for my > gussets? "Right there in that stack..." > > So, instead of looking for another job, I created one for myself. > Unfortunately, there's no pay check (yet) but I'm having fun! :o) > > Here's some pics of the finished rib ready to glue and trim the Leading > Edge... If anyone has an interest in a potential kit or two, I can work up > some numbers once I find out what legal stuff I must do... > > Just an update. Hope to begin posting again as I make progress! > > Mark > > > * > > * > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 11:50:00 AM PST US From: Oscar Zuniga Subject: Pietenpol-List: cold weather flying Temperature is sitting in the low 30s here at the moment, so I was thinking about cold weather garb. When we lived in Oregon and used to downhill ski, I had several different pairs of ski gloves and found that the chopper-style mitts kept my hands warmer than gloves with individual fingers. Makes sense because all four fingers are together in the mitt, keeping them warmer. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 04:38:33 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: My new 613.5 airfoil jig! From: Mark Roberts Thanks Jim... I will work on that this week. I don't think there is anything holding me back from offering a rib jig, so that won't be a problem. I am concerned about the actual selling of the wood and such which may not be problematic at all to offer wing kits of this and other airfoils, but I haven't checked with any lawyers yet. I just decided that I could wait for a job to come to me, or I could get out and do something more productive than sitting at home and worrying! If you'd like to chat off line my phone is 559-917-5904. Thanks! Mark On Sat, Jan 30, 2010 at 10:52 PM, flea wrote: > > Well first off congratulations on putting yourself back to work. > I must say that I would be very interested in getting a price at the very > least for a wing kit. The big thing I would be interested in would be the > Jig. I've been messin around some with building ribs, and have come to the > conclusion that my rib jig needs a jig. I'm really not ready to build the > wing yet, but Uncle Obama screwed up and is giving me some money back, so > this is the right time for me to make just such an investment. If you can > get the legalities worked out and get something packaged up for a reasonable > price I'd sure like to know about it. > > Jim. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=284131#284131 > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 07:25:28 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: cold weather flying From: "coxwelljon" Hi Oscar, It has been in the teens here in upstate NY for some time now. Below zero at night. Only flying I have been doing is in the shop. I agree with your choice of hand wear. My hands get cold easy so when it gets really cold I wear down mitts with knit wool gloves as liners. This allows me to take my hand out of the mitt and have use of my fingers for a couple of minutes without them loosing their heat. I use this method when x-country skiing. I have been wondering lately what it would be like flying in the winter in an open cockpit airplane? Jon Coxwell -------- Jon Coxwell GN-1 Builder Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=284292#284292 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 08:22:38 PM PST US From: "David Paule" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: cold weather flying I learned aerobatics out in Southern California in an open-cockpit airplane when I was a lot younger. Even in the summer, over Malibu, we needed to wear gloves. I foolishly made a molded control stick grip then that still fits my hand like a glove. That was the problem: I wasn't wearing gloves when I made it, and it didn't fit when I put my flying gloves on. So if you're making cockpit controls, see if you can use them while wearing gloves. Another man built a nice Fly-Baby. He had a clever cover. It snapped around the cockpit rim at the level of the longerons and just below the instrument panel. The cover had a jacket collar and zipper. He'd get in and zip it up and from the neck down, he was in a closed-cockpit airplane. He said it was very comfortable, flying with that. David Paule > > Hi Oscar, > > It has been in the teens here in upstate NY for some time now. Below zero > at night. Only flying I have been doing is in the shop. > > I agree with your choice of hand wear. My hands get cold easy so when it > gets really cold I wear down mitts with knit wool gloves as liners. This > allows me to take my hand out of the mitt and have use of my fingers for a > couple of minutes without them loosing their heat. I use this method when > x-country skiing. > > I have been wondering lately what it would be like flying in the winter in > an open cockpit airplane? > > Jon Coxwell > > -------- > Jon Coxwell > GN-1 Builder > Recycle and preserve the planet > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=284292#284292 > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.