Pietenpol-List Digest Archive

Sun 02/07/10


Total Messages Posted: 30



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 04:18 AM - Re: straight axle hub info (Jack Phillips)
     2. 07:07 AM - Re: Turtle Deck (Jerry Dotson)
     3. 07:20 AM - New Pictures (Jack)
     4. 08:03 AM - Re: Re: Turtle Deck (Jack)
     5. 08:57 AM - Re: straight axle hub info (Skip Gadd)
     6. 09:59 AM - Re: straight axle hub info (Richard Schreiber)
     7. 11:17 AM - Made my leather coaming padding today (helspersew@aol.com)
     8. 11:46 AM - Leather coaming procedure, pg 3 (helspersew@aol.com)
     9. 11:50 AM - Re: Made my leather coaming padding today (Jack)
    10. 11:55 AM - Re: Made my leather coaming padding today (Gary Boothe)
    11. 11:55 AM - Leather coaming procedure, pg. 2, cont. (helspersew@aol.com)
    12. 11:56 AM - Leather coaming- last page (helspersew@aol.com)
    13. 12:11 PM - Re: Made my leather coaming padding today (Tim Willis)
    14. 12:11 PM - Re: Leather coaming- last page (H RULE)
    15. 12:50 PM - Made my leather coaming padding today (santiago morete)
    16. 12:51 PM - Re: Leather coaming- last page (jboatri@emory.edu)
    17. 01:36 PM - Re: Leather coaming procedure, pg 3 (Jack Phillips)
    18. 01:47 PM - Yey another turtle-deck question (Jack)
    19. 01:55 PM - Re: Leather coaming- last page (Jack)
    20. 02:24 PM - Re: Yey another turtle-deck question (chase143(at)aol.com)
    21. 02:32 PM - Re: Yey another turtle-deck question (Jerry Dotson)
    22. 02:47 PM - Looking for the Riblett letter.. (Mark Roberts)
    23. 02:54 PM - Re: Yes another turtle-deck question (Gary Boothe)
    24. 03:49 PM - Re: Looking for the Riblett letter.. (Ryan Mueller)
    25. 06:02 PM - Re: Looking for the Riblett letter.. (Don Emch)
    26. 06:48 PM - aileron horns (Douwe Blumberg)
    27. 07:50 PM - Re: Looking for the Riblett letter.. (Mark Roberts)
    28. 07:55 PM - Re: Re: Looking for the Riblett letter.. (Mark Roberts)
    29. 08:06 PM - Re: Re: Looking for the Riblett letter.. (gcardinal)
    30. 08:48 PM - Re: Re: Looking for the Riblett letter.. (Ryan Mueller)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 04:18:10 AM PST US
    From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: straight axle hub info
    Rick, Why not ask Buchanan's? I'm sure they could tell you what they prefer. Here is a detail from the drawings I made for my hubs. I sent these hubs to Buchanan's and they made custom spokes and laced them for me. I dod not know what the gage on the spoke wire is, but they have worked just fine. Jack Phillips NX899JP Raleigh, NC _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Schreiber Sent: Saturday, February 06, 2010 8:24 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: straight axle hub info Fellow Pieters: for those that have made the straight axle gear using the Henderson/Pavliga/Perkins style hubs, what size holes did you drill in the hubs for your spokes. I realize it is spoke size dependent, but my plans are to go with 9 ga. spokes from Buchanan's. I want to make sure that the hubs that I send to them are drilled correctly. Rick Schreiber Valparaiso, IN


    Message 2


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    Time: 07:07:44 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Turtle Deck
    From: "Jerry Dotson" <jdotson@erec.net>
    Jack you and I are near the same stage of construction on the fuselage. Looking good. I did like you and fitted the bottom side. I'm not trying to steal your thread...just didn't want to start another. -------- Jerry Dotson 59 Daniel Johnson Rd Baker, FL 32531 Started building NX510JD July, 2009 Ribs and tailfeathers done using Lycoming O-235 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=285207#285207 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/a61_182.jpg


    Message 3


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    Time: 07:20:41 AM PST US
    From: "Jack" <jack@textors.com>
    Subject: New Pictures
    Just updated my site with some new fuselage pictures. Hope it helps those at that stage. Jack DSM www.textors.com <http://www.textors.com/>


    Message 4


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    Time: 08:03:05 AM PST US
    From: "Jack" <jack@textors.com>
    Subject: Re: Turtle Deck
    Yea Jerry don't be messing with my thread. :) I still have a lot of trimming and adjusting to do but it's nice to get the deck started. If my IPod Google is correct you have a beautiful spread down there. Looks like room for a great runway. Next time we are heading down to Destin, we may have to stop by. Do you have a website? Take care, Jack DSM Do not archive Jack you and I are near the same stage of construction on the fuselage. Looking good. I did like you and fitted the bottom side. I'm not trying to steal your thread...just didn't want to start another. -------- Jerry Dotson 59 Daniel Johnson Rd Baker, FL 32531 Started building NX510JD July, 2009 Ribs and tailfeathers done using Lycoming O-235 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=285207#285207 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/a61_182.jpg


    Message 5


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    Time: 08:57:09 AM PST US
    From: "Skip Gadd" <skipgadd@earthlink.net>
    Subject: straight axle hub info
    Rick, I used Buchanan's 9-10 ga SS spokes, they are about .140 tho. I drilled 3/16 holes which is about .185 tho. With the chamfer on both edges of the hole it was easy to lace the wheels. Skip Fellow Pieters: for those that have made the straight axle gear using the Henderson/Pavliga/Perkins style hubs, what size holes did you drill in the hubs for your spokes. I realize it is spoke size dependent, but my plans are to go with 9 ga. spokes from Buchanan's. I want to make sure that the hubs that I send to them are drilled correctly. Rick Schreiber Valparaiso, IN


    Message 6


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    Time: 09:59:57 AM PST US
    From: "Richard Schreiber" <lmforge@earthlink.net>
    Subject: straight axle hub info
    Jack and Skip, Thanks for the response. I tried calling Bucanan's Saturday, but only got a voicemail. I will either try e-mail or call them again tomorrow. Rick Schreiber ----- Original Message ----- From: Jack Phillips Sent: 2/7/2010 6:21:53 AM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: straight axle hub info Rick, Why not ask Buchanans? Im sure they could tell you what they prefer. Here is a detail from the drawings I made for my hubs. I sent these hubs to Buchanans and they made custom spokes and laced them for me. I dod not know what the gage on the spoke wire is, but they have worked just fine. Jack Phillips NX899JP Raleigh, NC From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Schreiber Sent: Saturday, February 06, 2010 8:24 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: straight axle hub info Fellow Pieters: for those that have made the straight axle gear using the Henderson/Pavliga/Perkins style hubs, what size holes did you drill in the hubs for your spokes. I realize it is spoke size dependent, but my plans are to go with 9 ga. spokes from Buchanan's. I want to make sure that the hubs that I send to them are drilled correctly. Rick Schreiber Valparaiso, IN http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution


    Message 7


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    Time: 11:17:37 AM PST US
    Subject: Made my leather coaming padding today
    From: helspersew@aol.com
    Hello good people, I have completed my leather cockpit coaming, after much frustration and co nsternation. I finally came up with a very nice looking result, and I beli eve much easier method than what others have done. Basically the procedure is, to take the correct lenth pipe insulation (Home Depot)(sections glued together) and using spray adhesive (3M Foamfast 74 from Grainger), glue leather to pipe insulation, install grommets, and lace onto airplane. I will send photos of this procedure in the next few posts.-- Dan Helsper Leather is marked along edge to make a glued hem on two long edges. Spray on adhesive and then fold up hems on both long edges.


    Message 8


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    Time: 11:46:52 AM PST US
    Subject: Leather coaming procedure, pg 3
    From: helspersew@aol.com
    Let this dry for about 1/2 hour. Next, split polyethelene tubing and apply to raw edge of aluminum. I used a few pieces of safety wire to hold it on, covered by black duct tape. I did a trial fit at this point so I could get a final length and sew it into the circle I needed. Now locate and drill 3/16 holes for lacing.


    Message 9


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    Time: 11:50:48 AM PST US
    From: "Jack" <jack@textors.com>
    Subject: Made my leather coaming padding today
    Great Dan, thanks! Do not archive _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of helspersew@aol.com Sent: Sunday, February 07, 2010 1:11 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Made my leather coaming padding today Hello good people, I have completed my leather cockpit coaming, after much frustration and consternation. I finally came up with a very nice looking result, and I believe much easier method than what others have done. Basically the procedure is, to take the correct lenth pipe insulation (Home Depot)(sections glued together) and using spray adhesive (3M Foamfast 74 from Grainger), glue leather to pipe insulation, install grommets, and lace onto airplane. I will send photos of this procedure in the next few posts.-- Dan Helsper Cockpitcoamingleatherpadding038.jpg picture by dhelsper <http://i564.photobucket.com/albums/ss83/dhelsper/Cockpitcoamingleatherpaddi ng038.jpg?t=1265568805> Leather is marked along edge to make a glued hem on two long edges. Cockpitcoamingleatherpadding042.jpg picture by dhelsper <http://i564.photobucket.com/albums/ss83/dhelsper/Cockpitcoamingleatherpaddi ng042.jpg?t=1265569511> Spray on adhesive and then fold up hems on both long edges. Cockpitcoamingleatherpadding043.jpg picture by dhelsper <http://i564.photobucket.com/albums/ss83/dhelsper/Cockpitcoamingleatherpaddi ng043.jpg?t=1265569622>


    Message 10


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    Time: 11:55:04 AM PST US
    From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5@comcast.net>
    Subject: Made my leather coaming padding today
    .looking forward to that next set of pics!!! Gary Boothe Cool, Ca. Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion, mounted Tail done, Fuselage on gear (16 ribs down.) _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of helspersew@aol.com Sent: Sunday, February 07, 2010 11:11 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Made my leather coaming padding today Hello good people, I have completed my leather cockpit coaming, after much frustration and consternation. I finally came up with a very nice looking result, and I believe much easier method than what others have done. Basically the procedure is, to take the correct lenth pipe insulation (Home Depot)(sections glued together) and using spray adhesive (3M Foamfast 74 from Grainger), glue leather to pipe insulation, install grommets, and lace onto airplane. I will send photos of this procedure in the next few posts.-- Dan Helsper Cockpitcoamingleatherpadding038.jpg picture by dhelsper <http://i564.photobucket.com/albums/ss83/dhelsper/Cockpitcoamingleatherpaddi ng038.jpg?t=1265568805> Leather is marked along edge to make a glued hem on two long edges. Cockpitcoamingleatherpadding042.jpg picture by dhelsper <http://i564.photobucket.com/albums/ss83/dhelsper/Cockpitcoamingleatherpaddi ng042.jpg?t=1265569511> Spray on adhesive and then fold up hems on both long edges. Cockpitcoamingleatherpadding043.jpg picture by dhelsper <http://i564.photobucket.com/albums/ss83/dhelsper/Cockpitcoamingleatherpaddi ng043.jpg?t=1265569622>


    Message 11


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    Time: 11:55:05 AM PST US
    Subject: Leather coaming procedure, pg. 2, cont.
    From: helspersew@aol.com
    Next, punch holes and install grommets. I used size 00 (black oxide finish ) grommets. Next, mask-off grommeted edges and far ends of leather, and suspend foam with copper pipe, to facilitate spraying of glue. After spraying glue on leather and foam, wait for tack, then carefully dro p foam down on to the center of leather, rolling in each direction to get nice wrinkle-free roll.


    Message 12


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    Time: 11:56:41 AM PST US
    Subject: Leather coaming- last page
    From: helspersew@aol.com
    A slight bit of wrinkling is evident in the curves, but it is very uniform and goes good with my "distressed" leather. I used round leather lacing cord I bought on line from Leather Cord USA. Lacing, about 1/2 way done. Originally my coaming metal stopped at the pil ot back rest, but I added a piece to get more of a true "pit" look. Hope this info helps somebody. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL.


    Message 13


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    Time: 12:11:06 PM PST US
    From: Tim Willis <timothywillis@earthlink.net>
    Subject: Re: Made my leather coaming padding today
    Dan, Great series of explanations and pix. Thanks. I will do it just that way, except that I will be stopping at the backrest. Tim in central TX do not archive -----Original Message----- From: helspersew@aol.com Sent: Feb 7, 2010 2:11 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Made my leather coaming padding today Hello good people, I have completed my leather cockpit coaming, after much frustration and consternation. I finally came up with a very nice looking result, and I believe much easier method than what others have done. Basically the procedure is, to take the correct lenth pipe insulation (Home Depot)(sections glued together) and using spray adhesive (3M Foamfast 74 from Grainger), glue leather to pipe insulation, install grommets, and lace onto airplane. I will send photos of this procedure in the next few posts.-- Dan Helsper Leather is marked along edge to make a glued hem on two long edges. Spray on adhesive and then fold up hems on both long edges.


    Message 14


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    Time: 12:11:06 PM PST US
    From: H RULE <harvey.rule@rogers.com>
    Subject: Re: Leather coaming- last page
    real nice work!=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A____________________________ ____=0AFrom: "helspersew@aol.com" <helspersew@aol.com>=0ATo: pietenpol-list @matronics.com=0ASent: Sun, February 7, 2010 2:48:21 PM=0ASubject: Pietenpo l-List: Leather coaming- last page=0A=0A=0A=0AA slight bit of wrinkling is evident in the curves, but it is very uniform and goes good with my "distre ssed" leather. I used round leather lacing cord I bought on line from Leath er Cord USA.=0A=0A=0A=0ALacing, about 1/2 way done. Originally my coaming m etal stopped at the pilot back rest, but I added a piece to get more of a t rue "pit" look.=0A=0AHope this info helps somebody.=0A=0ADan Helsper=0APopl =====


    Message 15


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    Time: 12:50:37 PM PST US
    From: santiago morete <moretesantiago@yahoo.com.ar>
    Subject: Made my leather coaming padding today
    Congratulations Dan!- Beautiful work!!!!!!!!!!!!! Saludos - Santiago -=0A=0A=0A Yahoo! Cocina=0A=0AEncontra las mejores recetas con Yahoo ! Cocina.=0A=0A=0Ahttp://ar.mujer.yahoo.com/cocina/


    Message 16


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    Time: 12:51:40 PM PST US
    From: jboatri@emory.edu
    Subject: Re: Leather coaming- last page
    Unbelievably, almost painfully, beautiful workmanship.


    Message 17


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    Time: 01:36:28 PM PST US
    From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: Leather coaming procedure, pg 3
    I like it, Dan! That looks much easier than the method I used. Jack Phillips NX899JP Raleigh, NC _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of helspersew@aol.com Sent: Sunday, February 07, 2010 2:39 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Leather coaming procedure, pg 3 Let this dry for about 1/2 hour. Cockpitcoamingleatherpadding052.jpg picture by dhelsper <http://i564.photobucket.com/albums/ss83/dhelsper/Cockpitcoamingleatherpaddi ng052.jpg?t=1265571040> Cockpitcoamingleatherpadding053.jpg picture by dhelsper <http://i564.photobucket.com/albums/ss83/dhelsper/Cockpitcoamingleatherpaddi ng053.jpg?t=1265571103> Next, split polyethelene tubing and apply to raw edge of aluminum. I used a few pieces of safety wire to hold it on, covered by black duct tape. Cockpitcoamingleatherpadding024.jpg picture by dhelsper <http://i564.photobucket.com/albums/ss83/dhelsper/Cockpitcoamingleatherpaddi ng024.jpg?t=1265571171> I did a trial fit at this point so I could get a final length and sew it into the circle I needed. Now locate and drill 3/16 holes for lacing. Cockpitcoamingleatherpadding013.jpg picture by dhelsper <http://i564.photobucket.com/albums/ss83/dhelsper/Cockpitcoamingleatherpaddi ng013.jpg?t=1265571333>


    Message 18


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    Time: 01:47:00 PM PST US
    From: "Jack" <jack@textors.com>
    Subject: Yey another turtle-deck question
    >From pictures it looks like some leave their stringers square and other round out the tops. I would appreciate thoughts on the best way to go so the fabric will look pleasing. Thanks, Jack Jack Textor 29 SW 58th Drive Des Moines, IA 50312 www.textors.com


    Message 19


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    Time: 01:55:19 PM PST US
    From: "Jack" <jack@textors.com>
    Subject: Leather coaming- last page
    Dan, A piece of art, beautiful coaming and panel! That's the way I plan to do it.. Jack DSM Do not archive Jack Textor 29 SW 58th Drive Des Moines, IA 50312 www.textors.com _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of helspersew@aol.com Sent: Sunday, February 07, 2010 1:48 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Leather coaming- last page A slight bit of wrinkling is evident in the curves, but it is very uniform and goes good with my "distressed" leather. I used round leather lacing cord I bought on line from Leather Cord USA. Cockpitcoamingleatherpadding025.jpg picture by dhelsper <http://i564.photobucket.com/albums/ss83/dhelsper/Cockpitcoamingleatherpaddi ng025.jpg?t=1265571664> Cockpitcoamingleatherpadding034.jpg picture by dhelsper <http://i564.photobucket.com/albums/ss83/dhelsper/Cockpitcoamingleatherpaddi ng034.jpg?t=1265571904> Lacing, about 1/2 way done. Originally my coaming metal stopped at the pilot back rest, but I added a piece to get more of a true "pit" look. Hope this info helps somebody. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL.


    Message 20


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    Time: 02:24:32 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Yey another turtle-deck question
    From: "chase143(at)aol.com" <chase143@aol.com>
    Hello Jack, I am another "rounding person" (have not covered yet) based on several recommendations, and looking at completed versions. Also, I asked for a recommendation fro the instructor when taking the Poly-fiber covering class, and they recommended rounding, as a general rule, whenever possible. Just another opinion. Cheers, Steve www.mypiet.com -------- Steve www.mypiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=285262#285262


    Message 21


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    Time: 02:32:36 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Yey another turtle-deck question
    From: "Jerry Dotson" <jdotson@erec.net>
    Jack I rounded because I don't plan on taping them before covering. If you choose to leave them with sharp corners I would for sure tape over them. -------- Jerry Dotson 59 Daniel Johnson Rd Baker, FL 32531 Started building NX510JD July, 2009 Ribs and tailfeathers done using Lycoming O-235 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=285263#285263


    Message 22


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    Time: 02:47:33 PM PST US
    Subject: Looking for the Riblett letter..
    From: Mark Roberts <mark.rbrts1@gmail.com>
    Hey Guys: I've just spent the last hour or so perusing the archives for something i remember seeing last year but now can't find. I thought it was posted on the forum, but it could have been on someone's website and I just missed it... It was a letter frn Harry Riblett on the analysis of teh original Piet airfoil (FC-10) and it's stall characteristics. If I remember correctly, it was a posted photocopy of the letter he wrote back to Piety Lowell regarding his selection of the 613.5 and 612 as better airfoils from his analysis. I wanted to re-read this again, but couldn't find it on the archives, searching from the beginning to end for 'Riblett'. Anyone with a better memory than me? Thanks guys... Mark


    Message 23


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    Time: 02:54:45 PM PST US
    From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5@comcast.net>
    Subject: Yes another turtle-deck question
    Jack, Pretty sure the edges should be sanded slightly, at least. After that, and with all the reinforcing tapes, I doubt whether one looks better than another.and ALL look fantastic at 75mph and 500agl. JMO (Just My Opinion) Gary Boothe Cool, CA Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion Tail done, Fuselage on gear 16 ribs done From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jack Sent: Sunday, February 07, 2010 1:43 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Yey another turtle-deck question >From pictures it looks like some leave their stringers square and other round out the tops. I would appreciate thoughts on the best way to go so the fabric will look pleasing. Thanks, Jack Jack Textor 29 SW 58th Drive Des Moines, IA 50312 www.textors.com


    Message 24


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    Time: 03:49:34 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Looking for the Riblett letter..
    From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com>
    Mark, I think this is what you may be looking for: [image: ?ui=2&view=att&th=126aacb935f40d2d&attid=0.1&disp=attd&realattid=ii_126aacb935f40d2d&zw] If the image doesn't come through, here's a link to the file: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2314248/riblett%20letter.jpg Have a good evening, Ryan On Sun, Feb 7, 2010 at 4:44 PM, Mark Roberts <mark.rbrts1@gmail.com> wrote: > Hey Guys: > > I've just spent the last hour or so perusing the archives for something i > remember seeing last year but now can't find. I thought it was posted on the > forum, but it could have been on someone's website and I just missed it... > > It was a letter frn Harry Riblett on the analysis of teh original Piet > airfoil (FC-10) and it's stall characteristics. If I remember correctly, it > was a posted photocopy of the letter he wrote back to Piety Lowell regarding > his selection of the 613.5 and 612 as better airfoils from his analysis. > > I wanted to re-read this again, but couldn't find it on the archives, > searching from the beginning to end for 'Riblett'. Anyone with a better > memory than me? > > Thanks guys... > > Mark > > * > > * > >


    Message 25


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    Time: 06:02:56 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Looking for the Riblett letter..
    From: "Don Emch" <EmchAir@aol.com>
    Mark, This is the first time I've seen this letter. I'm very certain Mr. Riblett is very knowledgeable on his designs, but I have to disagree with him on his comments about Mr. Pietenpol's airfoil. My Piet by no means has a sharp stall. It is very benign and very predictable. It is also very very slow, especially with a touch of power. The most surprising part of the letter is "Indeed, due to safety considerations, we strongly recommend this substitution." I could see if the Pietenpol had been plagued with stall accidents over the past 80 years, but it really hasn't. If there had been any complaints about a bad stall characteristic, which I've never heard, it was probably due to a rearward cg, which some Piets have. Please don't let anyone fool you. A properly built Pietenpol is a safe, docile, honest, and FUN airplane! I was all set to fly this weekend with the skis, but that 6" to 8" of snow we were forcasted to get turned into 26"!! Little too deep! Don Emch NX899DE Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=285280#285280


    Message 26


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    Time: 06:48:55 PM PST US
    From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg@earthlink.net>
    Subject: aileron horns
    My horns are flat stock, angled to line up with the cable. I think if something is just bugging you, and it doesn't go away, then you should probably take the time to re-do it. With all the other things to look at on a beautiful Piet, I don't really notice control horns, but ... that might be all you notice on your baby if you don't fix it. Douwe


    Message 27


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    Time: 07:50:38 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Looking for the Riblett letter..
    From: Mark Roberts <mark.rbrts1@gmail.com>
    Hey Ryan! This is EXACTLY the one I remember seeing, and could not locate it for the life of me. THANKS brother! I also remember reading somewhere that Mr. Riblett had recommended the 613.5 over the 612, and I thought that was in this letter, but after reading it I don't see it mentioned... Anyone remember if this is the case, or is my memory beginning to play tricks on me...? Thanks again Ryan. Mark On Sun, Feb 7, 2010 at 3:38 PM, Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com> wrote: > Mark, > > I think this is what you may be looking for: > > [image: > ?ui=2&view=att&th=126aacb935f40d2d&attid=0.1&disp=attd&realattid=ii_126aacb935f40d2d&zw] > > If the image doesn't come through, here's a link to the file: > http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2314248/riblett%20letter.jpg > > Have a good evening, > > Ryan > > > On Sun, Feb 7, 2010 at 4:44 PM, Mark Roberts <mark.rbrts1@gmail.com>wrote: > >> Hey Guys: >> >> I've just spent the last hour or so perusing the archives for something i >> remember seeing last year but now can't find. I thought it was posted on the >> forum, but it could have been on someone's website and I just missed it... >> >> It was a letter frn Harry Riblett on the analysis of teh original Piet >> airfoil (FC-10) and it's stall characteristics. If I remember correctly, it >> was a posted photocopy of the letter he wrote back to Piety Lowell regarding >> his selection of the 613.5 and 612 as better airfoils from his analysis. >> >> I wanted to re-read this again, but couldn't find it on the archives, >> searching from the beginning to end for 'Riblett'. Anyone with a better >> memory than me? >> >> Thanks guys... >> >> Mark >> >> * >> >> " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >> tp://forums.matronics.com >> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> * >> >> >


    Message 28


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    Time: 07:55:19 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Looking for the Riblett letter..
    From: Mark Roberts <mark.rbrts1@gmail.com>
    Oh Man! 26" of snow! It's one thing to read about the news and think "those poor saps!" It's another to know one of "those poor saps!" I hope you dig out soon! I appreciate your comments about the original Piet airfoil. I know this topic has seen quite a bit of discussion over the years (the earliest posts I saw were from '98 or '99), and I wasn't trying to kick over the safety issue again, although I do appreciate the comments. My thought was what Riblett said about the contrast of the 2 airfoils. I did not remember some of the issues involved. I know for me, at 6'4" and "two-hundred-and-none-your-business" fat pounds (Ok, 245 lbs with no clothes to cover the natural good looks of my fat), I am building the 613.5 because I remember seeing something that said it would have better lifting power in hot weather, something we get nothing BUT in the summers in Central California. As I see it, a design that has stood the test of over 80 years is not something you make great changes to unless there is a specific need (as in making the cockpit fit yer body, and making the wing better for your weight). Some would even argue that if that is the issue, find a plane that fits better. But after some 20 years of looking, this one meets almost all the criteria I need most: build at your own pay-comfort level, reliable, LSA, 2 seats and cool looking (well, cool enuf!) Thanks for the feedback! Mark On Sun, Feb 7, 2010 at 6:00 PM, Don Emch <EmchAir@aol.com> wrote: > > Mark, > > This is the first time I've seen this letter. I'm very certain Mr. Riblett > is very knowledgeable on his designs, but I have to disagree with him on his > comments about Mr. Pietenpol's airfoil. My Piet by no means has a sharp > stall. It is very benign and very predictable. It is also very very slow, > especially with a touch of power. The most surprising part of the letter is > "Indeed, due to safety considerations, we strongly recommend this > substitution." I could see if the Pietenpol had been plagued with stall > accidents over the past 80 years, but it really hasn't. If there had been > any complaints about a bad stall characteristic, which I've never heard, it > was probably due to a rearward cg, which some Piets have. Please don't let > anyone fool you. A properly built Pietenpol is a safe, docile, honest, and > FUN airplane! > > I was all set to fly this weekend with the skis, but that 6" to 8" of snow > we were forcasted to get turned into 26"!! Little too deep! > > Don Emch > NX899DE > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=285280#285280 > >


    Message 29


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    Time: 08:06:35 PM PST US
    From: "gcardinal" <gcardinal@comcast.net>
    Subject: Re: Looking for the Riblett letter..
    I concur with everything Don Says. There is no sharp stall issue. Power off with the stick way back and it will simply mush down at about 5 - 600 fpm with the Johnson airspeed indicator wavering somwhere around 30 - 32 mph. Just keep the ball centered. Sharp stall reports might have more to do with leading edge shape than airfoil shape. Greg Cardinal Mineapolis ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Emch" <EmchAir@aol.com> Sent: Sunday, February 07, 2010 8:00 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Looking for the Riblett letter.. > > Mark, > > This is the first time I've seen this letter. I'm very certain Mr. > Riblett is very knowledgeable on his designs, but I have to disagree with > him on his comments about Mr. Pietenpol's airfoil. My Piet by no means > has a sharp stall. It is very benign and very predictable. It is also > very very slow, especially with a touch of power. The most surprising > part of the letter is "Indeed, due to safety considerations, we strongly > recommend this substitution." I could see if the Pietenpol had been > plagued with stall accidents over the past 80 years, but it really hasn't. > If there had been any complaints about a bad stall characteristic, which > I've never heard, it was probably due to a rearward cg, which some Piets > have. Please don't let anyone fool you. A properly built Pietenpol is a > safe, docile, honest, and FUN airplane! > > I was all set to fly this weekend with the skis, but that 6" to 8" of snow > we were forcasted to get turned into 26"!! Little too deep! > > Don Emch > NX899DE > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=285280#285280 > > >


    Message 30


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    Time: 08:48:27 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Looking for the Riblett letter..
    From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com>
    Mark, I would agreed with Don and Greg about Mr. Riblett's thoughts on the Piet airfoil....while certainly interesting, they should be viewed with the understanding that they are purely theoretical. Riblett never built or flew a Pietenpol with his airfoil to prove his claims. The empirical knowledge provided by 80 years of Pietenpol airfoils flying around would tend to indicate that the negative characteristics he outlines are exaggerated to non-existent. As far as how much of a benefit you will actually see from the Riblett...I would say you have to look to Lowell for that, as he is the only one (despite all the talk about the Riblett) to have actually flown a Piet with the airfoil (that I have heard of, at least). Don't worry about those of us that have to deal with good ole' winter. We get to sit here and be glad we're not one of "those poor saps" that live in California! (Sorry Mark, Gary, Chris, Jim, et al.....couldn't resist) Have a good night, Ryan On Sun, Feb 7, 2010 at 9:51 PM, Mark Roberts <mark.rbrts1@gmail.com> wrote: > Oh Man! 26" of snow! It's one thing to read about the news and think "those > poor saps!" It's another to know one of "those poor saps!" I hope you dig > out soon! > > I appreciate your comments about the original Piet airfoil. I know this > topic has seen quite a bit of discussion over the years (the earliest posts > I saw were from '98 or '99), and I wasn't trying to kick over the safety > issue again, although I do appreciate the comments. > > My thought was what Riblett said about the contrast of the 2 airfoils. I > did not remember some of the issues involved. I know for me, at 6'4" and > "two-hundred-and-none-your-business" fat pounds (Ok, 245 lbs with no clothes > to cover the natural good looks of my fat), I am building the 613.5 because > I remember seeing something that said it would have better lifting power in > hot weather, something we get nothing BUT in the summers in Central > California. > > As I see it, a design that has stood the test of over 80 years is not > something you make great changes to unless there is a specific need (as in > making the cockpit fit yer body, and making the wing better for your > weight). Some would even argue that if that is the issue, find a plane that > fits better. But after some 20 years of looking, this one meets almost all > the criteria I need most: build at your own pay-comfort level, reliable, > LSA, 2 seats and cool looking (well, cool enuf!) > > Thanks for the feedback! > > Mark > > On Sun, Feb 7, 2010 at 6:00 PM, Don Emch <EmchAir@aol.com> wrote: > >> >> Mark, >> >> This is the first time I've seen this letter. I'm very certain Mr. >> Riblett is very knowledgeable on his designs, but I have to disagree with >> him on his comments about Mr. Pietenpol's airfoil. My Piet by no means has >> a sharp stall. It is very benign and very predictable. It is also very >> very slow, especially with a touch of power. The most surprising part of >> the letter is "Indeed, due to safety considerations, we strongly recommend >> this substitution." I could see if the Pietenpol had been plagued with >> stall accidents over the past 80 years, but it really hasn't. If there had >> been any complaints about a bad stall characteristic, which I've never >> heard, it was probably due to a rearward cg, which some Piets have. Please >> don't let anyone fool you. A properly built Pietenpol is a safe, docile, >> honest, and FUN airplane! >> >> I was all set to fly this weekend with the skis, but that 6" to 8" of snow >> we were forcasted to get turned into 26"!! Little too deep! >> >> Don Emch >> NX899DE >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=285280#285280 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ========== >> st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >> ========== >> http://forums.matronics.com >> ========== >> le, List Admin. >> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> ========== >> >> >> >> > * > > * > >




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