Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 09:14 AM - Re: Re: Looking for the Riblett letter.. (Mark Roberts)
2. 09:57 AM - Re: handheld radios (Gene & Tammy)
3. 12:50 PM - Cable Tensiometer and G Note (K5YAC)
4. 12:58 PM - to avoid the winter blues----watch this. (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation])
5. 01:08 PM - Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note (Jerry Dotson)
6. 02:15 PM - Re: Sportsman Pilot Article featuring Jack Phillips (Jack)
7. 02:41 PM - Re: Sportsman Pilot Article featuring Jack Phillips (Wayne Bressler)
8. 02:51 PM - Completion Photo (Ben Charvet)
9. 03:10 PM - Re: Completion Photo (K5YAC)
10. 03:16 PM - Re: Completion Photo (airlion)
11. 03:42 PM - Re: Completion Photo (Ben Charvet)
12. 05:11 PM - venturi mounting location (Oscar Zuniga)
13. 05:21 PM - Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note (Richard Schreiber)
14. 05:39 PM - Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note (K5YAC)
15. 06:02 PM - Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note (Gary Boothe)
16. 06:11 PM - Re: Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note (Michael McGowan)
17. 06:15 PM - Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note (K5YAC)
18. 06:22 PM - Re: venturi mounting location (Gene Rambo)
19. 06:29 PM - Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note (Gene Rambo)
20. 06:52 PM - Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note (K5YAC)
21. 06:54 PM - Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note (Clif Dawson)
22. 07:01 PM - Re: Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note (Ryan Mueller)
23. 07:10 PM - Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note (K5YAC)
24. 07:29 PM - Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note (K5YAC)
25. 07:45 PM - Re: Completion Photo (airlion)
26. 07:46 PM - Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note (Dave and Connie)
27. 08:15 PM - Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note (Ozarkflyer)
28. 08:51 PM - Re: Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note (Clif Dawson)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Looking for the Riblett letter.. |
Hey Ryan:
Thanks for your thoughts on the Riblett, and I agree with the 'Poor Saps"
that live in CA... I am looking for a way OUT of this state after being born
and raised here. I'm sick of the Tom Foolery in Sacramento... it is beyond
the point of no return.
My main problem is I don't have a plane yet that I can fly outta state!
Thanks again on the=airfoil feedback. My main issue is trying to get more
lift efficiently for my larger than BHP body...
Mark
On Sun, Feb 7, 2010 at 8:44 PM, Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com> wrote:
> Mark,
>
> I would agreed with Don and Greg about Mr. Riblett's thoughts on the Piet
> airfoil....while certainly interesting, they should be viewed with the
> understanding that they are purely theoretical. Riblett never built or flew
> a Pietenpol with his airfoil to prove his claims. The empirical knowledge
> provided by 80 years of Pietenpol airfoils flying around would tend to
> indicate that the negative characteristics he outlines are exaggerated to
> non-existent. As far as how much of a benefit you will actually see from the
> Riblett...I would say you have to look to Lowell for that, as he is the only
> one (despite all the talk about the Riblett) to have actually flown a Piet
> with the airfoil (that I have heard of, at least).
>
> Don't worry about those of us that have to deal with good ole' winter. We
> get to sit here and be glad we're not one of "those poor saps" that live in
> California! (Sorry Mark, Gary, Chris, Jim, et al.....couldn't resist)
>
> Have a good night,
>
> Ryan
>
> On Sun, Feb 7, 2010 at 9:51 PM, Mark Roberts <mark.rbrts1@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Oh Man! 26" of snow! It's one thing to read about the news and think
>> "those poor saps!" It's another to know one of "those poor saps!" I hope
>> you dig out soon!
>>
>> I appreciate your comments about the original Piet airfoil. I know this
>> topic has seen quite a bit of discussion over the years (the earliest posts
>> I saw were from '98 or '99), and I wasn't trying to kick over the safety
>> issue again, although I do appreciate the comments.
>>
>> My thought was what Riblett said about the contrast of the 2 airfoils. I
>> did not remember some of the issues involved. I know for me, at 6'4" and
>> "two-hundred-and-none-your-business" fat pounds (Ok, 245 lbs with no clothes
>> to cover the natural good looks of my fat), I am building the 613.5 because
>> I remember seeing something that said it would have better lifting power in
>> hot weather, something we get nothing BUT in the summers in Central
>> California.
>>
>> As I see it, a design that has stood the test of over 80 years is not
>> something you make great changes to unless there is a specific need (as in
>> making the cockpit fit yer body, and making the wing better for your
>> weight). Some would even argue that if that is the issue, find a plane that
>> fits better. But after some 20 years of looking, this one meets almost all
>> the criteria I need most: build at your own pay-comfort level, reliable,
>> LSA, 2 seats and cool looking (well, cool enuf!)
>>
>> Thanks for the feedback!
>>
>> Mark
>>
>> On Sun, Feb 7, 2010 at 6:00 PM, Don Emch <EmchAir@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Mark,
>>>
>>> This is the first time I've seen this letter. I'm very certain Mr.
>>> Riblett is very knowledgeable on his designs, but I have to disagree with
>>> him on his comments about Mr. Pietenpol's airfoil. My Piet by no means has
>>> a sharp stall. It is very benign and very predictable. It is also very
>>> very slow, especially with a touch of power. The most surprising part of
>>> the letter is "Indeed, due to safety considerations, we strongly recommend
>>> this substitution." I could see if the Pietenpol had been plagued with
>>> stall accidents over the past 80 years, but it really hasn't. If there had
>>> been any complaints about a bad stall characteristic, which I've never
>>> heard, it was probably due to a rearward cg, which some Piets have. Please
>>> don't let anyone fool you. A properly built Pietenpol is a safe, docile,
>>> honest, and FUN airplane!
>>>
>>> I was all set to fly this weekend with the skis, but that 6" to 8" of
>>> snow we were forcasted to get turned into 26"!! Little too deep!
>>>
>>> Don Emch
>>> NX899DE
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=285280#285280
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ==========
>>> st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
>>> ==========
>>> http://forums.matronics.com
>>> ==========
>>> le, List Admin.
>>> ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>>> ==========
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> *
>>
>>
>> " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
>> tp://forums.matronics.com
>>
>> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>> *
>>
>>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: handheld radios |
Sorry Clif, my memory didn't serve me very well (old age). I do
remember seeing somewhere the use of a Delcom end mount, but guess it
wasn't the flybaby site.
Gene in miserable, rainy Tennessee
N502R
----- Original Message -----
From: Clif Dawson
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, February 11, 2010 10:00 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: handheld radios
Where? I checked various photo pages, especialy the "instrument panel"
one and
there's nothing like a delcom in there at all. There is one small
modern style that's
been sunk into the surface.
Also, back in the good ol days, Delcom had a panel mount kit that fit
in a 3 1/4"
instrument hole. Dean Sevold, in Naniamo, has one in his Piet.
Clif
----- Original Message -----
From: Gene & Tammy
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, February 11, 2010 12:54 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: handheld radios
Clif, take a look on the Fly Baby Yahoo site. I believe someone
mounted the same radio and posted a photo of it.
Gene
N502R
----- Original Message -----
From: Clif Dawson
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, February 09, 2010 10:11 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: handheld radios
Since I'm building an old time plane and have to have
a radio ( and mode C transponder ) I would really
prefer that this stuff is as unobtrusive as possible.
So I purposely bought an old Delcom with all the
controls on the end.
I spent hours trying to figure out where to put that
*&#% transponder so that I could see the numbers
and work the dials. I think it's going down on the side
by my right leg lying against the diagonal.
Clif
----- Original Message -----
From: RAMPEYBOY@aol.com
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, February 09, 2010 2:31 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: handheld radios
I have been thinking about radios also. I am building a
different plane (mustang II) but am hoping to draw some info from your
discussion here. I'm not aware of any Mustang owners with a handheld as
the primary radio. I was trying to weigh the pros and cons of using a
handheld versus a panel mount. Maybe they are best for open cockpit?
Boyce
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
------------------------------------------------------------------------
- Release Date: 02/09/10 11:35:00
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
- Release Date: 02/09/10 19:35:00
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.mat
ronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
- Release Date: 02/10/10 11:38:00
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
02/11/10 16:09:00
Message 3
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| Subject: | Cable Tensiometer and G Note |
If you are easily offended, turn back now!
I recently installed and applied tension to my drag/anti drag cables. A few weeks
ago, there was some discussion on the matter and several people said to tighten
them to a note of G. I thought they were joking at first, but as more people
concurred, I realized they were serious. So, I recorded a G note from my
PC on to my phone and took it to the hangar. Once I tightened a cable to this
tone, I stopped and used a tensiometer to check the tension. It registered
~185 pounds. Having never done this, I wasn't sure if that was reasonable or
not... again, just using the G note approach.
To confirm, I called my friendly A&P and asked him about the G note method as well
as the 185 pound reading. He said that the G note is a good rule of thumb
and that 180 - 190 pounds isn't unreasonable either. He said that the cables
on his Fokker's landing gear are in that range.
So, having said all this, what do you guys think? I've got all 4 cables in the
left wing panel adjusted, but not safety wired. Before I proceed, would anyone
have any concerns with my readings? Too tight? Not tight enough?
I will say this... the tensiometer is very repeatable, but a fellow can chase his
tail all day trying to get each cable exactly the same. Mine are all within
a few pounds of each other, which I believe is good enough.
Speaking of chasing tail... I think I will use this method the next time I need
to check cables (see photo). Not overly scientific, but certainly a lot easier
on the senses.
--------
Mark - working on wings
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286425#286425
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/rig_tensiometer_165.jpg
Message 4
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| Subject: | to avoid the winter blues----watch this. |
Stearman C3B first engine start since major restoration.......this is a Wright
J-5, the same sounds and smoke and vintage that Charles A. Lindbergh flew behind
in his historic 1927 New York to Paris nonstop flight in his Ryan Spirit of St.
Louis. Alive today, history making smoke and noise.
Mike C.
do not archive
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1X3IL9taEa4
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note |
That is for sure the most accurate tensiometer I have ever seen.
mmmw
--------
Jerry Dotson
59 Daniel Johnson Rd
Baker, FL 32531
Started building NX510JD July, 2009
Ribs and tailfeathers done
using Lycoming O-235
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286431#286431
Message 6
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| Subject: | Sportsman Pilot Article featuring Jack Phillips |
Barry,
Is this article online or available somewhere else?
Thanks,
Jack
DSM
Jack Textor
29 SW 58th Drive
Des Moines, IA 50312
www.textors.com
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Davis
Sent: Saturday, February 13, 2010 10:06 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Sportsman Pilot Article featuring Jack Phillips
Jack
Got my new issue of Sportsman Pilot yesterday and as always, sat down to
read it from cover to cover. It started out with a good article about fellow
EAA Director Susan Dusenbury and her Stinson project. As I made my way
through the magazine, I was pleased to see your smiling face and a great
multi-page article on you and your Pietenpol. Jack and Golda do a great job
with this pub;ication and your article was no exception. I had heard the
story of your off airport landing, but never did know the cause until now.
We are all glad you took the time to fix it back and lead the Pietenpol
charge.
Got about 4" of snow last night (the most we have had in 8 or 9 years) and I
love it. Almost hate to leave tomorrow for an EAA Fun Cruise to the Bahamas
with our local chapter, but hey..........somebody's gotta do it!
Sun n Fun Bound
Barry Davis
BIG PIET NX973BP
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Sportsman Pilot Article featuring Jack Phillips |
Jack,
For twelve dollars, you get a whole year of this excellent
publication. It's only four issues, but in my opinion, it is the best
grassroots aviation magazine available.
www.sportsmanpilot.com
Wayne Bressler Jr.
Taildraggers, Inc.
taildraggersinc.com
On Feb 14, 2010, at 5:14 PM, "Jack" <jack@textors.com> wrote:
> Barry,
> Is this article online or available somewhere else?
> Thanks,
> Jack
> DSM
>
> Jack Textor
> 29 SW 58th Drive
> Des Moines, IA 50312
> www.textors.com
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-
> pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry Davis
> Sent: Saturday, February 13, 2010 10:06 AM
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Sportsman Pilot Article featuring Jack
> Phillips
>
> Jack
> Got my new issue of Sportsman Pilot yesterday and as always, sat
> down to read it from cover to cover. It started out with a good
> article about fellow EAA Director Susan Dusenbury and her Stinson
> project. As I made my way through the magazine, I was pleased to see
> your smiling face and a great multi-page article on you and your
> Pietenpol. Jack and Golda do a great job with this pub;ication and
> your article was no exception. I had heard the story of your off
> airport landing, but never did know the cause until now. We are all
> glad you took the time to fix it back and lead the Pietenpol charge.
>
> Got about 4" of snow last night (the most we have had in 8 or 9
> years) and I love it. Almost hate to leave tomorrow for an EAA Fun
> Cruise to the Bahamas with our local chapter, but
> hey..........somebody's gotta do it!
>
> Sun n Fun Bound
> Barry Davis
> BIG PIET NX973BP
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
> http://forums.matronics.com
> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Completion Photo |
We finally had some decent flying weather today. I flew the Baby Ace
for a little over an hour and did 8 landings. I was tempted to take the
Pietenpol up, but the right people weren't present. I'm going to shoot
for Wed, Thur, or Fri AM. More photos to follow!
Ben Charvet
NX866BC
Your message is ready to be sent with the following file or link
attachments:
Feb flight 015
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Completion Photo |
You lucky dog. She's a beauty!!
--------
Mark - working on wings
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286444#286444
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Completion Photo |
Great looking plane Ben. Where are you located? I am in Lagrange, Ga. and during
my taxi test today I did break the ground a couple of feet. My plane is ready
ro fly but i'm not. Too Cold untill I cover the front Pit. Cheers, Gardiner
Mason
----- Original Message ----
From: Ben Charvet <bcharvet@bellsouth.net>
Sent: Sun, February 14, 2010 5:50:28 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Completion Photo
We finally had some decent flying weather today. I flew the Baby Ace for a little
over an hour and did 8 landings. I was tempted to take the Pietenpol up,
but the right people weren't present. I'm going to shoot for Wed, Thur, or Fri
AM. More photos to follow!
Ben Charvet
NX866BC
Your message is ready to be sent with the following file or link attachments:
Feb flight 015
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Completion Photo |
I'm in Titusville, Fl, which is right next to the Space Center. It was
cold here too. Sounds like you are being as cautious about your first
flight as I am. You still have the Cessna taildragger?
Ben
Do Not Archive
On 2/14/2010 6:15 PM, airlion wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: airlion<airlion@bellsouth.net>
>
> Great looking plane Ben. Where are you located? I am in Lagrange, Ga. and during
my taxi test today I did break the ground a couple of feet. My plane is ready
ro fly but i'm not. Too Cold untill I cover the front Pit. Cheers, Gardiner
Mason
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | venturi mounting location |
Ken; check the 2nd picture down the page, here:
http://www.flysquirrel.net/piets/CorkyPiet.html
However, I don't have a vacuum gauge so I have
no idea how much it pulls. It does seem to do
fine though, driving the vertical speed indicator
and the turn-and-bank.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 13
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| Subject: | Cable Tensiometer and G Note |
Mark:
I think 185# is way too high. My EAA tech counselor told me not to go above
40# with the 3/32" cable that I used. I have read that the Bowers Fly Baby
plans say to tighten as tight as you can by using your fingers, then go one
more turn. In my case that worked about to about 35-40#. Sound wise, the
cables don't ping and are not tight enough to really produce a note. They
are just tight enough too feel secure.
Regards,
Rick Schreiber
Valparaiso, IN
> [Original Message]
> From: K5YAC <hangar10@cox.net>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Date: 2/14/2010 2:52:41 PM
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Cable Tensiometer and G Note
>
>
> If you are easily offended, turn back now!
>
> I recently installed and applied tension to my drag/anti drag cables. A
few weeks ago, there was some discussion on the matter and several people
said to tighten them to a note of G. I thought they were joking at first,
but as more people concurred, I realized they were serious. So, I recorded
a G note from my PC on to my phone and took it to the hangar. Once I
tightened a cable to this tone, I stopped and used a tensiometer to check
the tension. It registered ~185 pounds. Having never done this, I wasn't
sure if that was reasonable or not... again, just using the G note
approach.
>
> To confirm, I called my friendly A&P and asked him about the G note
method as well as the 185 pound reading. He said that the G note is a good
rule of thumb and that 180 - 190 pounds isn't unreasonable either. He said
that the cables on his Fokker's landing gear are in that range.
>
> So, having said all this, what do you guys think? I've got all 4 cables
in the left wing panel adjusted, but not safety wired. Before I proceed,
would anyone have any concerns with my readings? Too tight? Not tight
enough?
>
> I will say this... the tensiometer is very repeatable, but a fellow can
chase his tail all day trying to get each cable exactly the same. Mine are
all within a few pounds of each other, which I believe is good enough.
>
> Speaking of chasing tail... I think I will use this method the next time
I need to check cables (see photo). Not overly scientific, but certainly a
lot easier on the senses.
>
> --------
> Mark - working on wings
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286425#286425
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/rig_tensiometer_165.jpg
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note |
I'll be darn... really? I am using 1/8" 7x19 cable... anyone else think I'm over
tightening? If so, can anyone else offer their techniques or suggestions?
I know I just read about this stuff not too long ago.
--------
Mark - working on wings
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286464#286464
Message 15
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| Subject: | Cable Tensiometer and G Note |
Mark,
Where do I get one of those? ;-)
Gary Boothe
Cool, Ca.
Pietenpol
WW Corvair Conversion, mounted
Tail done, Fuselage on gear
(18 ribs down.)
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of K5YAC
Sent: Sunday, February 14, 2010 12:50 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Cable Tensiometer and G Note
If you are easily offended, turn back now!
I recently installed and applied tension to my drag/anti drag cables. A few
weeks ago, there was some discussion on the matter and several people said
to tighten them to a note of G. I thought they were joking at first, but as
more people concurred, I realized they were serious. So, I recorded a G
note from my PC on to my phone and took it to the hangar. Once I tightened
a cable to this tone, I stopped and used a tensiometer to check the tension.
It registered ~185 pounds. Having never done this, I wasn't sure if that
was reasonable or not... again, just using the G note approach.
To confirm, I called my friendly A&P and asked him about the G note method
as well as the 185 pound reading. He said that the G note is a good rule of
thumb and that 180 - 190 pounds isn't unreasonable either. He said that the
cables on his Fokker's landing gear are in that range.
So, having said all this, what do you guys think? I've got all 4 cables in
the left wing panel adjusted, but not safety wired. Before I proceed, would
anyone have any concerns with my readings? Too tight? Not tight enough?
I will say this... the tensiometer is very repeatable, but a fellow can
chase his tail all day trying to get each cable exactly the same. Mine are
all within a few pounds of each other, which I believe is good enough.
Speaking of chasing tail... I think I will use this method the next time I
need to check cables (see photo). Not overly scientific, but certainly a
lot easier on the senses.
--------
Mark - working on wings
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286425#286425
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/rig_tensiometer_165.jpg
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note |
According to AC43-13 3/32 cable has a minimum breaking strength of 920
pounds. 1/8 inch 7 X 19 has a strength of either 1760 lbs or 2000 lbs. I was
taught in A+P school to use the twanging method. If the cables are too
slack they will deform and not provide the structural stability they
installed for. Mike McGowan
----- Original Message -----
From: "K5YAC" <hangar10@cox.net>
Sent: Sunday, February 14, 2010 7:38 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note
>
> I'll be darn... really? I am using 1/8" 7x19 cable... anyone else think
> I'm over tightening? If so, can anyone else offer their techniques or
> suggestions? I know I just read about this stuff not too long ago.
>
> --------
> Mark - working on wings
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286464#286464
>
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note |
I'm not sure where to get one. I'm pretty sure AS&S doesn't carry that particular
model, and I hear that they are VERY expensive.
gboothe5(at)comcast.net wrote:
> Mark,
>
> Where do I get one of those? ;-)
>
> Gary Boothe
> Cool, Ca.
> Pietenpol
> WW Corvair Conversion, mounted
> Tail done, Fuselage on gear
> (18 ribs down.)
> Do not archive
>
> --
--------
Mark - working on wings
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286475#286475
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| Subject: | Re: venturi mounting location |
vertical speed run off of a venturi??????????
Gene
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Oscar Zuniga<mailto:taildrags@hotmail.com>
To: Pietenpol List<mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Sunday, February 14, 2010 8:10 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: venturi mounting location
<taildrags@hotmail.com<mailto:taildrags@hotmail.com>>
Ken; check the 2nd picture down the page, here:
http://www.flysquirrel.net/piets/CorkyPiet.html<http://www.flysquirrel.ne
t/piets/CorkyPiet.html>
However, I don't have a vacuum gauge so I have
no idea how much it pulls. It does seem to do
fine though, driving the vertical speed indicator
and the turn-and-bank.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com<mailto:taildrags@hotmail.com>
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net<http://www.flysquirrel.net/>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List<http://www.matronics.co
m/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>
http://www.matronics.com/contribution<http://www.matronics.com/contributi
on>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note |
185 lbs is way, way too high. Most aircraft flight control cables are
in the 25-35 lb range. You are going to deform something for certain,
and break something possibly. for a cable that is a stay, hand tight is
more than enough. There is certainly no reason to go to any particular
tension.
Gene
----- Original Message -----
From: K5YAC<mailto:hangar10@cox.net>
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com<mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Sunday, February 14, 2010 3:50 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Cable Tensiometer and G Note
<hangar10@cox.net<mailto:hangar10@cox.net>>
If you are easily offended, turn back now!
I recently installed and applied tension to my drag/anti drag cables.
A few weeks ago, there was some discussion on the matter and several
people said to tighten them to a note of G. I thought they were joking
at first, but as more people concurred, I realized they were serious.
So, I recorded a G note from my PC on to my phone and took it to the
hangar. Once I tightened a cable to this tone, I stopped and used a
tensiometer to check the tension. It registered ~185 pounds. Having
never done this, I wasn't sure if that was reasonable or not... again,
just using the G note approach.
To confirm, I called my friendly A&P and asked him about the G note
method as well as the 185 pound reading. He said that the G note is a
good rule of thumb and that 180 - 190 pounds isn't unreasonable either.
He said that the cables on his Fokker's landing gear are in that range.
So, having said all this, what do you guys think? I've got all 4
cables in the left wing panel adjusted, but not safety wired. Before I
proceed, would anyone have any concerns with my readings? Too tight?
Not tight enough?
I will say this... the tensiometer is very repeatable, but a fellow
can chase his tail all day trying to get each cable exactly the same.
Mine are all within a few pounds of each other, which I believe is good
enough.
Speaking of chasing tail... I think I will use this method the next
time I need to check cables (see photo). Not overly scientific, but
certainly a lot easier on the senses.
--------
Mark - working on wings
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286425#286425<http://forums
.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286425#286425>
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/rig_tensiometer_165.jpg<http://forums.
matronics.com//files/rig_tensiometer_165.jpg>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List<http://www.matronics.co
m/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>
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on>
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note |
You guys must have hands like the son of Jor-El (Superman). I am a fairly large
and reasonably strong young whipper snapper, but hand tightening leaves my 1/8"
cables sagging slightly. I certainly wouldn't think this is correct.
I would think they should be taut, but I have yet to read anything that indicates
proper tension other than the twang method. When I tension enough to resonate
at an audible level (more particularly, a G note), the tensiometer reads 180-190.
I checked the tension after each adjustment. Hand tight read near to
zero pounds (still a bit slack). Even when I got around 40 pounds, I would consider
them a bit loose. I think I would prefer that my drag/anti-drag cables
be at least taught.
--------
Mark - working on wings
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286485#286485
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| Subject: | Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note |
If everything was made of steel 185 might be reasonable
but I certainly don't want to subject my wood stab and
rudder to that kind of force.
If I could just find a few G notes somewhere, I'd be a
happy man.
So that tensionometers mother doesn't happen to be
free tonight does she?
By the way, which G are we talking about? Every
octave has a G you know.
Clif
"There are many tunes still to be written in the Key of C."
Arnold Schoenberg
> Mark:
> I think 185# is way too high. My EAA tech counselor told me not to go
> above
> 40# with the 3/32" cable that I used. I have read that the Bowers Fly Baby
> plans say to tighten as tight as you can by using your fingers, then go
> one
> more turn. In my case that worked about to about 35-40#. Sound wise, the
> cables don't ping and are not tight enough to really produce a note. They
> are just tight enough too feel secure.
>
> Regards,
> Rick Schreiber
> Valparaiso, IN
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note |
A selection of posts from the archives by those who have been there, done
that...in no particular order:
--------------
"Tension by ear is much more accurate than any gauge. Tighten slowly and
evenly until you hear a "FWANG" Don't keep tightening till you start hearing
any kind of tone like a PING. It's really pretty easy."
Dick N.
--------------
"A nice "Thummmm..." is what you want. The main thing is to have each of
the wires produce pretty close to the same note, with the wing trammelled
and true. You can measure the tension in the wires by using some kind of a
force gage to indicate the amount of force required top deflect the center
of each wire a certain distance, but that is probably overkill, and not
likely to be much better than just plunking them and listening for the
note."
Jack Phillips
--------------
"I tensioned mine using the same method of twanging as prescribed by my
local A&P and IA guys who work on old airplanes all the time. They merely
advised me to tension them approximately the same key of G minor, just below
middle C. Actually they said make them tight and make them sound about the
same when you twang them. No real rocket science needed here."
Mike C.
--------------
Good luck!
Ryan
On Sun, Feb 14, 2010 at 8:52 PM, K5YAC <hangar10@cox.net> wrote:
>
> You guys must have hands like the son of Jor-El (Superman). I am a fairly
> large and reasonably strong young whipper snapper, but hand tightening
> leaves my 1/8" cables sagging slightly. I certainly wouldn't think this is
> correct.
>
> I would think they should be taut, but I have yet to read anything that
> indicates proper tension other than the twang method. When I tension enough
> to resonate at an audible level (more particularly, a G note), the
> tensiometer reads 180-190. I checked the tension after each adjustment.
> Hand tight read near to zero pounds (still a bit slack). Even when I got
> around 40 pounds, I would consider them a bit loose. I think I would prefer
> that my drag/anti-drag cables be at least taught.
>
> --------
> Mark - working on wings
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286485#286485
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note |
Right Clif... I am listening for the first audible G, so the lowest one.
I wish I knew more about the other tensiometer... sorry I can't help ya out.
[quote="CDAWSON5854(at)shaw.ca"]
If everything was made of steel 185 might be reasonable
but I certainly don't want to subject my wood stab and
rudder to that kind of force.
If I could just find a few G notes somewhere, I'd be a
happy man.
So that tensionometers mother doesn't happen to be
free tonight does she?
By the way, which G are we talking about? Every
octave has a G you know.
Clif
--------
Mark - working on wings
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286489#286489
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| Subject: | Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note |
Thanks Ryan, that is some of the stuff I read a few weeks ago, but I'm pretty sure
there was other stuff about a G note. Perhaps I made that part up in my head.
Ha ha!
I guess I could go back and adjust my turnbuckles down a bit. I guess I'll just
listen for an equal resonating tone all around. Sure wish I knew what a reasonable
"pounds" indication would be.
--------
Mark - working on wings
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286493#286493
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| Subject: | Re: Completion Photo |
Thanks Ben, yes I still have the Cessna 14 0 but I have not flown it much what
with the work on the Piet. Gardiner
----- Original Message ----
From: Ben Charvet <bcharvet@bellsouth.net>
Sent: Sun, February 14, 2010 6:41:38 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Completion Photo
I'm in Titusville, Fl, which is right next to the Space Center. It was
cold here too. Sounds like you are being as cautious about your first
flight as I am. You still have the Cessna taildragger?
Ben
Do Not Archive
On 2/14/2010 6:15 PM, airlion wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: airlion<airlion@bellsouth.net>
>
> Great looking plane Ben. Where are you located? I am in Lagrange, Ga. and during
my taxi test today I did break the ground a couple of feet. My plane is ready
ro fly but i'm not. Too Cold untill I cover the front Pit. Cheers, Gardiner
Mason
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
>
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| Subject: | Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note |
Gene,
I think that you are talking about control cables and while Mark is
talking about Drag/Anti-Drag cables in the wings. Very different tensions.
Dave
Gene Rambo wrote:
> 185 lbs is way, way too high. Most aircraft flight control cables are
> in the 25-35 lb range. You are going to deform something for certain,
> and break something possibly. for a cable that is a stay, hand tight
> is more than enough. There is certainly no reason to go to any
> particular tension.
>
> Gene
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* K5YAC <mailto:hangar10@cox.net>
> *To:* pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> <mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> *Sent:* Sunday, February 14, 2010 3:50 PM
> *Subject:* Pietenpol-List: Cable Tensiometer and G Note
>
> <mailto:hangar10@cox.net>>
>
> If you are easily offended, turn back now!
>
> I recently installed and applied tension to my drag/anti drag
> cables. A few weeks ago, there was some discussion on the matter
> and several people said to tighten them to a note of G. I thought
> they were joking at first, but as more people concurred, I
> realized they were serious. So, I recorded a G note from my PC on
> to my phone and took it to the hangar. Once I tightened a cable
> to this tone, I stopped and used a tensiometer to check the
> tension. It registered ~185 pounds. Having never done this, I
> wasn't sure if that was reasonable or not... again, just using the
> G note approach.
>
> To confirm, I called my friendly A&P and asked him about the G
> note method as well as the 185 pound reading. He said that the G
> note is a good rule of thumb and that 180 - 190 pounds isn't
> unreasonable either. He said that the cables on his Fokker's
> landing gear are in that range.
>
> So, having said all this, what do you guys think? I've got all 4
> cables in the left wing panel adjusted, but not safety wired.
> Before I proceed, would anyone have any concerns with my
> readings? Too tight? Not tight enough?
>
> I will say this... the tensiometer is very repeatable, but a
> fellow can chase his tail all day trying to get each cable exactly
> the same. Mine are all within a few pounds of each other, which I
> believe is good enough.
>
> Speaking of chasing tail... I think I will use this method the
> next time I need to check cables (see photo). Not overly
> scientific, but certainly a lot easier on the senses.
>
> --------
> Mark - working on wings
>
>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note |
I think you guys may be thinking more along the lines of G-string as opposed to
G note.
By the way, in the long run that pictured tensiometer will cost you a lot more
than your airplane ever will. [Rolling Eyes]
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=286502#286502
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| Subject: | Re: Cable Tensiometer and G Note |
Hahaha! Now what could possibly bring you to that
conclusion. :-)
Tensionometer? How about this one?
Clif
>
> I think you guys may be thinking more along the lines of G-string as
> opposed to G note.
>
> By the way, in the long run that pictured tensiometer will cost you a lot
> more than your airplane ever will. [Rolling Eyes]
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