Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:06 AM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller (H RULE)
2. 05:09 AM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller (H RULE)
3. 06:21 AM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller (Max Hegler)
4. 07:01 AM - Han van der voort-gear springs (Jack T. Textor)
5. 07:04 AM - a Piet is a Piet (Lawrence Williams)
6. 07:14 AM - Re: a Piet is a Piet (TOM STINEMETZE)
7. 07:43 AM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller (Michael Perez)
8. 07:58 AM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller (H RULE)
9. 08:00 AM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller (Gene & Tammy)
10. 08:04 AM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller (Mike)
11. 09:00 AM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller (Jim Ash)
12. 09:04 AM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller-- NOW "Orbital Acceleration" (Tim Willis)
13. 09:13 AM - Re: a Piet is a Piet (Dan Yocum)
14. 09:49 AM - Re: a Piet is a Piet (Jeff Boatright)
15. 11:07 AM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller (H RULE)
16. 11:54 AM - a piet is a piet (Lawrence Williams)
17. 12:07 PM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller-- NOW "Orbital Acceleration" (H RULE)
18. 01:09 PM - A Piet is a Piet or a Snowflake........... (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation])
19. 01:10 PM - Coveralls and Flitzer group-nice one Larry ! (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation])
20. 01:12 PM - Re: a Piet is a Piet (Gene & Tammy)
21. 02:22 PM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller (Jeff Boatright)
22. 02:54 PM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller (Rodrigo Liberato de Oliveira)
23. 03:00 PM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller (Max Hegler)
24. 03:00 PM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller (Max Hegler)
25. 03:25 PM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller (Gene & Tammy)
26. 03:25 PM - Re: logos, coveralls etc. (Mike King)
27. 04:54 PM - Re: logos, coveralls etc. (Rick Holland)
28. 05:58 PM - Re: logos, coveralls etc. (Jeff Boatright)
29. 05:59 PM - Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller (gliderx5@comcast.net)
30. 06:12 PM - Eastern and United issues (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation])
31. 06:12 PM - Re: logos, coveralls etc. (bryan green)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller |
The SR71 had a nasty habit of blowback which would make the engine cut out.
Those nose cones had to be moved at just the right time in just the right c
onditions or this would happen.In effect the engines would stall not the wi
ng.But I'm sure if you brought the wing to the proper=C2-angle of attack
=C2-it would stall as all others do.=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A______________________
__________=0AFrom: Max Hegler <maxhegler@msn.com>=0ATo: pietenpol-list@matr
onics.com=0ASent: Tue, March 2, 2010 10:56:33 PM=0ASubject: RE: Pietenpol-L
ist: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A=0AI think it must be th
e U2, as the SR71 is supersonic and technically a plane flying supersonic c
annot stall. At least that is my experience. =0A=0AMax=0A=0A> Date: Tue, 2
Mar 2010 19:40:47 -0600=0A> From: jim_markle@mindspring.com=0A> To: pietenp
ol-list@matronics.com=0A> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Di
Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>=0A> =0A> Am I sure he was not talking ab
out the U-2???? Nope, I'm not sure at all! As good as MY memory is, maybe h
e was talking about the Jenny! :-)=0A> =0A> I think it was the SR71....but
who knows..... :-)=0A> =0A> do not archive=0A> =0A> =0A> -----Original Mess
age-----=0A> >From: Tim Willis <timothywillis@earthlink.net>=0A> >Sent: Mar
2, 2010 1:10 PM=0A> >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0A> >Subject: Re: Pi
etenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A> >=0A> >--> Pi
etenpol-List message posted by: Tim Willis <timothywillis@earthlink.net>=0A
> >=0A> >Jim,=0A> >Are you sure he was not talking about the U-2? Such a di
fference between cruising and stalling on a U-2. =0A> >Tim in central TX=0A
> >do not archive=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >-----Original Message-----=0A> >>From: J
im Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>=0A> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 11:28 AM=0A>
>>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0A> >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: C
orvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A> >>=0A> >>--> Pietenpol-List mess
age posted by: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>=0A> >>=0A> >>Once liv
ed next door to an Ex-SR71 pilot...he told me the difference between stall
and Vne at altitude was something like 4 knots...not related to anything in
this conversation but I thought that was VERY interesting.=0A> >>=0A> >>do
not archive=0A> >>=0A> >>-----Original Message-----=0A> >>=0A> >>From: Dav
id Paule =0A> >>=0A> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 8:51 AM=0A> >>=0A> >>To: pietenpol
-list@matronics.com=0A> >>=0A> >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircr
aft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=C3=AF=C2=BB=C2
=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>This was primarily for
thermal expansion and =0A> >>secondarily for stiffness. It had nothing to d
o with the transition to turbulent =0A> >>flow, as the SR-71 operated at a
very high Reynolds Number, even at =0A> >>"low" speeds.=0A> >> =0A> >>David
Paule=0A> >> =0A> >> =0A> >> =0A> >> >> If you look at the underside of an
SR-71, it is =0A> >>corrugated. =0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>
=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A
==================0A> =0A> =0A> =0A=C2
=C2=B7=BA~=B0=C3=AD=C2=B2,=C3=9Eg(=93=C5-=C3=93M4=C3=93
G=C3=9Aq=C3=BC=C2=A2=C3=C3=A2z=C2=B9=C3=9E=C3=81=C3=8A.=C2=AE'=C2=AB8^>'
=C2=ADzzh=9D=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B4I=C5=A1=C5-Qh=C2=AE=C3=A9R=C3=87=C2
=AD=C3=A3=C2=B6=C2=BA'=B0=C3=8B=C5-=C3=8BEy=C2=ABn=C2=AD
=C3=AB j=C3=B8=C2-j=C3=9A+=C2=B6-=C3=AB=C2=A3=C3=98^=84=A2=C2
=A9=C3=B2.+-=C2=BA=C3=98=C2=A5=C5-=C3=98=C5=BE=C2=B2=C3=8B=C5=93
=C2=AB=C5-=C3=8BT=C5=B8=C3=B4=C2=AEn=C3=87+=C5-=BAb=C2=A2p=C2=AD
=C3=88b=C2=BD=C3=A4=C5=BEj=C2=B7!=C5=92'=93-=EF=BD=C3=AC6
=C2=B2=C2=BA0=C2=B1=C3-=C2=A1j=C3=91@C=C3=A1=C2=A2=C3=9A,=C2
=C3=9Ejwf=C2=B9=C3=88f=C2=B9=C3=88f=C2=A2=C2=B7=EF=BD=C2=A8ky=C3=B1=C2
=B6=C3=9A=C30=84=A2=C2=ABk=C2=A2x=C5=93=C2=B1=C3=8A&=C3=BC=C3'=C2
=AF=C5-=C2=AD=C2=A2=C2=B3=C3=A2z=C3=97=C2=A7=C2=B0K=C5-=C3=8Ba
=C2=B6=C3=9A=C30=84=A2=C2=ABk=C2=A2x=C5=93=C2=B1=C3=8A&=C3=BC=C3'
=C2=AF=C5-=C2=AD=C2=A2=C2=B3=C3=A2z=C3=97=C2=A7=C2=B0K=C5-=C3
=8Bl4N4=82=AC=99X@E9L=C5=A1=84=A2=C3=A8+y=C2=AB\=C2=A2{^=C5=BE
=C3'=C2=A5=C2=B2-=C2=AFj)ZnW=C2=AF=B0=C2=ABayg=BA=C5
-=C3=AE=C5=A1j=C3=9E|m=C2=B6=C5=B8=C3~=C5-=C3=AE=C5=A1=C3=89=C5=A1
=C2=B6=C2=BA'=B0=C3=8B=C2=A2hm=C2=B6=C5=B8=C3~=C5-=C3=AE=C5=A1
=C3=89=C5=A1=C2=B6=C2=BA'=B0=C3=8B=C2=A2o=C3=9A=C3=A2=C2=B2=C3=90=C2
=A8=C5=BE=C3=9A=C3=A2n=C3=ABb=C2=A2u=C5=BEm(=C2=AD|=C3=A1jy2=C2=A2=C3=A7=C3
=A8=C2=AF*.=C2=AE=C2=A7z=C2=BA.=C2=B2=C3=8B=C2=A9=C2=C5-=C3=AD
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller |
When they took off with that aircraft they could not have the fuel tanks fu
ll because she would leak fuel until the plates expanded.Once heated and th
e plates closed the gaps then they fueled her in mid flight.=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
________________________________=0AFrom: David Paule <dpaule@frii.com>=0ATo
: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Tue, March 2, 2010 10:35:26 PM=0ASub
ject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A=0A
=EF=BB =0AMany years ago I had a chance to read through the SR-71 pilot'
s manual. The one thing that I remembered was that it got its best MPG at t
he highest and fastest it could go. I think it was way above Mach 3, and it
was something like 80,000 feet. Just mind-boggling numbers.=0A=C2-=0ADav
id Paule=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0A=C2-=0A=0A=C2-=0A----- Original M
essage ----- =0AFrom: "Jim Markle" <jim_markle@mindspring.com>=0ATo: <piete
npol-list@matronics.com>=0ASent: Tuesday, March 02, 2010 6:40 PM=0ASubject:
Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A--> Piet
enpol-List message posted by: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>=0A=0AA
m I sure he was not talking about the U-2????=C2- Nope, I'm not sure at a
ll!=C2- As good as MY memory is, maybe he was talking about the Jenny!=C2
- :-)=0A=0AI think it was the SR71....but who knows.....=C2- :-)=0A=0Ad
o not archive=0A=0A=0A-----Original Message-----=0A>From: Tim Willis <timot
hywillis@earthlink.net>=0A>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 1:10 PM=0A>To: pietenpol-list@
matronics.com=0A>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape
othywillis@earthlink.net>=0A>=0A>Jim,=0A>Are you sure he was not talking ab
out the U-2?=C2- Such a difference between cruising and stalling on a U-2
.=C2- =0A>Tim in central TX=0A>do not archive=0A>=0A>=0A>-----Original Me
ssage-----=0A>>From: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>=0A>>Sent: Mar 2
, 2010 11:28 AM=0A>>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0A>>Subject: Re: Piete
npol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A>>=0A>>--> Pietenp
ol-List message posted by: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>=0A>>=0A>>
Once lived next door to an Ex-SR71 pilot...he told me the difference betwee
n stall and Vne at altitude was something like 4 knots...not related to any
thing in this conversation but I thought that was VERY interesting.=0A>>=0A
>>do not archive=0A>>=0A>>-----Original Message-----=0A>>=0A>>From: David P
aule =0A>>=0A>>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 8:51 AM=0A>>=0A>>To: pietenpol-list@matron
ics.com=0A>>=0A>>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape
on a propeller=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=EF=BB=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>
=0A>>This was primarily for thermal expansion and =0A>>secondarily for stif
fness. It had nothing to do with the transition to turbulent =0A>>flow, as
the SR-71 operated at a very high Reynolds Number, even at =0A>>"low" speed
s.=0A>> =0A>>David Paule=0A>> =0A>> =0A>> =0A>> >> If you look at the under
side of an SR-71, it is =0A>>corrugated.=C2- =0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A
>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenp
ol-List=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com=0Ahttp://www.matronics.com/contributi
======
Message 3
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| Subject: | Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller |
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Message 4
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| Subject: | Han van der voort-gear springs |
Morning all,
Tried to send the following to Hans, must have a bad email. If anyone
has his email please send it to me. Or, any comments on the note
welcome.
Thanks,
Jack
DSM
Hans,
I hope all is well with you. I'm building a Piet and currently trying
to decide on the size of coil spring to use for the gear. If I'm
correct, from your drawing you utilized a 3224-36 which from what I can
tell can handle a max load of 2593 pounds. Some other plans I've seen
utilize a spring with outside diameter of 1.5 and inside of .75 inches,
with a max load of 1672 pounds. Have you been happy with yours? Do you
think the second example would be too light?
Hans thanks so much!
Jack
Message 5
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| Subject: | a Piet is a Piet |
Ok, Ok. Go get your "grain of salt" pills and re read my epic adventure. Al
so keep the pills handy whenever you see one of my infrequent posts.
-
As for Vne vs. stall speed, it ain't uncommon at all. One of our Canadair R
J's was leveling out at about =0A=0A=0A
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: a Piet is a Piet |
Ah comeon Larry. Give us the rest of the story!
Stinemetze
>>> Lawrence Williams <lnawms@yahoo.com> 3/3/2010 8:37 AM >>>
Ok, Ok. Go get your "grain of salt" pills and re read my epic adventure.
Also keep the pills handy whenever you see one of my infrequent posts.
As for Vne vs. stall speed, it ain't uncommon at all. One of our Canadair
RJ's was leveling out at about
Message 7
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| Subject: | Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller |
Those cones move in relation to speed as well.=C2- The nose of the Peregr
ine Falcon has cones as well so it can breath in a dive.
=C2-
=C2-
Do not archive.
--- On Wed, 3/3/10, Max Hegler <maxhegler@msn.com> wrote:
From: Max Hegler <maxhegler@msn.com>
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
The purpose of the nose cone (or spike) was to keep the supersonic bow wave
attached to the inlet of the engine. Jet (turbine) engines will not operat
e with supersonic airflow going through the engines. If the spike was not i
n the proper place the engine would compressor stall and flameout. At cruis
e (mach 3+) this would cause a yawing into the dead engine resulting in los
s of control and breakup of the aircraft. This was the cause of all but one
of the SR-71 crashes. To fix this, they added automatic shutdown of the go
od engine if thrust on one side suddenly dropped. The reason you can't stal
l supersonically is the controls are not as effective and would not bring t
he wing into a stall angle of attack...or something like that.
From: harvey.rule@rogers.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
#yiv1995312934 .ExternalClass DIV
{}
The SR71 had a nasty habit of blowback which would make the engine cut out.
Those nose cones had to be moved at just the right time in just the right c
onditions or this would happen.In effect the engines would stall not the wi
ng.But I'm sure if you brought the wing to the proper=C2-angle of attack
=C2-it would stall as all others do.
From: Max Hegler <maxhegler@msn.com>
Sent: Tue, March 2, 2010 10:56:33 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
#yiv1995312934 .ExternalClass .ecxhmmessage P
{padding:0px;}
#yiv1995312934 .ExternalClass body.ecxhmmessage
{font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana;}
I think it must be the U2, as the SR71 is supersonic and technically a plan
e flying supersonic cannot stall. At least that is my experience.
Max
> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 19:40:47 -0600
> From: jim_markle@mindspring.com
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
>
om>
>
> Am I sure he was not talking about the U-2???? Nope, I'm not sure at all!
As good as MY memory is, maybe he was talking about the Jenny! :-)
>
> I think it was the SR71....but who knows..... :-)
>
> do not archive
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: Tim Willis <timothywillis@earthlink.net>
> >Sent: Mar 2, 2010 1:10 PM
> >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
> >
k.net>
> >
> >Jim,
> >Are you sure he was not talking about the U-2? Such a difference between
cruising and stalling on a U-2.
> >Tim in central TX
> >do not archive
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >>From: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 11:28 AM
> >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propelle
r
> >>
.com>
> >>
> >>Once lived next door to an Ex-SR71 pilot...he told me the difference be
tween stall and Vne at altitude was something like 4 knots...not related to
anything in this conversation but I thought that was VERY interesting.
> >>
> >>do not archive
> >>
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>
> >>From: David Paule
> >>
> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 8:51 AM
> >>
> >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >>
> >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propelle
r
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>=C3=83=C2=AF=C3=82=C2=BB=C3=82=C2
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>This was primarily for thermal expansion and
> >>secondarily for stiffness. It had nothing to do with the transition to
turbulent
> >>flow, as the SR-71 operated at a very high Reynolds Number, even at
> >>"low" speeds.
> >>
> >>David Paule
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> >> If you look at the underside of an SR-71, it is
> >>corrugated.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
&===
>
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Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller |
Ya ,what he said!=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A__________________________
______=0AFrom: Max Hegler <maxhegler@msn.com>=0ATo: pietenpol-list@matronic
s.com=0ASent: Wed, March 3, 2010 9:14:58 AM=0ASubject: RE: Pietenpol-List:
Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A=0AThe purpose of the nose co
ne (or spike) was to keep the supersonic bow wave attached to the inlet of
the engine. Jet (turbine) engines will not operate with supersonic airflow
going through the engines. If the spike was not in the proper place the eng
ine would compressor stall and flameout. At cruise (mach 3+) this would cau
se a yawing into the dead engine resulting in loss of control and breakup o
f the aircraft. This was the cause of all but one of the SR-71 crashes. To
fix this, they added automatic shutdown of the good engine if thrust on one
side suddenly dropped. The reason you can't stall supersonically is the co
ntrols are not as effective and would not bring the wing into a stall angle
of attack...or something like that. =0A=0A________________________________
=0ADate: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 05:05:18 -0800=0AFrom: harvey.rule@rogers.com=0ASu
bject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0ATo
: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0A=0A=0AThe SR71 had a nasty habit of blowba
ck which would make the engine cut out.Those nose cones had to be moved at
just the right time in just the right conditions or this would happen.In ef
fect the engines would stall not the wing.But I'm sure if you brought the w
ing to the proper=C2-angle of attack=C2-it would stall as all others do
.=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFrom: Max Hegler <maxheg
ler@msn.com>=0ATo: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Tue, March 2, 2010
10:56:33 PM=0ASubject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on
a propeller=0A=0AI think it must be the U2, as the SR71 is supersonic and t
echnically a plane flying supersonic cannot stall. At least that is my expe
rience. =0A=0AMax=0A=0A> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 19:40:47 -0600=0A> From: jim
_markle@mindspring.com=0A> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0A> Subject: Re
: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A> =0A> -->
Pietenpol-List message posted by: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>=0A
> =0A> Am I sure he was not talking about the U-2???? Nope, I'm not sure at
all! As good as MY memory is, maybe he was talking about the Jenny! :-)=0A
> =0A> I think it was the SR71....but who knows..... :-)=0A> =0A> do not ar
chive=0A> =0A> =0A> -----Original Message-----=0A> >From: Tim Willis <timot
hywillis@earthlink.net>=0A> >Sent: Mar 2, 2010 1:10 PM=0A> >To: pietenpol-l
ist@matronics.com=0A> >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpl
illis <timothywillis@earthlink.net>=0A> >=0A> >Jim,=0A> >Are you sure he wa
s not talking about the U-2? Such a difference between cruising and stallin
g on a U-2. =0A> >Tim in central TX=0A> >do not archive=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >--
---Original Message-----=0A> >>From: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
=0A> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 11:28 AM=0A> >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0A
> >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propelle
@mindspring.com>=0A> >>=0A> >>Once lived next door to an Ex-SR71 pilot...he
told me the difference between stall and Vne at altitude was something lik
e 4 knots...not related to anything in this conversation but I thought that
was VERY interesting.=0A> >>=0A> >>do not archive=0A> >>=0A> >>-----Origin
al Message-----=0A> >>=0A> >>From: David Paule =0A> >>=0A> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2
010 8:51 AM=0A> >>=0A> >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0A> >>=0A> >>Subj
ect: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A> >>
=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=C3=83=C2=AF=C3=82=C2=BB=C3=82=C2=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A>
>>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>This was primarily for thermal expansion and
=0A> >>secondarily for stiffness. It had nothing to do with the transition
to turbulent =0A> >>flow, as the SR-71 operated at a very high Reynolds Nu
mber, even at =0A> >>"low" speeds.=0A> >> =0A> >>David Paule=0A> >> =0A> >>
=0A> >> =0A> >> >> If you look at the underside of an SR-71, it is =0A> >>
corrugated. =0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>
=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A
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=C3=82=C2=B2=C3=83=B9=C3=82=C2=A9=C3=82=C2=C3=85=C2-=C3=83=C2=AD
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=A8=C2=AF*.=C2=AE=C2=A7z=C2=BA.=C2=B2=C3=8B=C2=A9=C2=C5-=C3=AD
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller |
Max, when are you coming over to the Center of the World (also known as
Camden)?
Gene
N502R
=EF=BD=EF=BD=EF=BD~=EF=BD=EF=BD=EF=BD,=EF=BD=03g(=EF
=BD=EF=BD=EF=BDM=EF=BDGq=EF=BDz=EF=BD=EF=BD
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
03/03/10 07:34:00
Message 10
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| Subject: | Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller |
The limit on the U-2 was the "Dead Man's notch," the high-altitude
corner right below stall true airspeed and critical Mach number. This
same notch killed several Lear 24/25 pilots when those aircraft became
cheap enough to filter down to companies who couldn't' afford in-depth
pilot training. In subsonic planes like the U-2 and the Lear, exceeding
critical Mach can cause an uncontrollable pitch down which only results
in going faster, with no ability to pull the nose up.
The SR-71 doesn't have a Mach number that makes it uncontrollable; its
speed is limited by compression heating on the nose and leading edges,
as well as keeping the shock wave properly captured in those
all-too-critical engine inlets.
BTW, at speed and altitude over the equator, headed east, approximately
14% of the weight of the SR and its crew is supported by orbital
acceleration. (You weigh less in the seat.)
Mike Hardaway
_____
The SR71 had a nasty habit of blowback which would make the engine cut
out.Those nose cones had to be moved at just the right time in just the
right conditions or this would happen.In effect the engines would stall
not the wing.But I'm sure if you brought the wing to the proper angle of
attack it would stall as all others do.
_____
I think it must be the U2, as the SR71 is supersonic and technically a
plane flying supersonic cannot stall. At least that is my experience.
Max
> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 19:40:47 -0600
> From: jim_markle@mindspring.com
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a
propeller
>
<jim_markle@mindspring.com>
>
> Am I sure he was not talking about the U-2???? Nope, I'm not sure at
all! As good as MY memory is, maybe he was talking about the Jenny! :-)
>
> I think it was the SR71....but who knows..... :-)
>
> do not archive
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: Tim Willis <timothywillis@earthlink.net>
> >Sent: Mar 2, 2010 1:10 PM
> >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a
propeller
> >
<timothywillis@earthlink.net>
> >
> >Jim,
> >Are you sure he was not talking about the U-2? Such a difference
between cruising and stalling on a U-2.
> >Tim in central TX
> >do not archive
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >>From: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 11:28 AM
> >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a
propeller
> >>
<jim_markle@mindspring.com>
> >>
> >>Once lived next door to an Ex-SR71 pilot...he told me the difference
between stall and Vne at altitude was something like 4 knots...not
related to anything in this conversation but I thought that was VERY
interesting.
> >>
> >>do not archive
> >>
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>
> >>From: David Paule
> >>
> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 8:51 AM
> >>
> >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >>
> >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a
propeller
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>=C3=AF=C2=BB=C2
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>This was primarily for thermal expansion and
> >>secondarily for stiffness. It had nothing to do with the transition
to turbulent
> >>flow, as the SR-71 operated at a very high Reynolds Number, even at
> >>"low" speeds.
> >>
> >>David Paule
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> >> If you look at the underside of an SR-71, it is
> >>corrugated.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
&===
>
>
>
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=C5=BEj=C2=B7!=C5=92'=93-=EF=BD=C3=AC6=C2=B2=C2=BA0=C2=B1
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'=B0=C3=8B=C2=A2o=C3=9A=C3=A2=C2=B2=C3=90=C2=A8=C5=BE=C3=9A=C3=A2n=C3
=ABb=C2=A2u=C5=BEm(=C2=AD|=C3=A1jy2=C2=A2=C3=A7=C3=A8=C2=AF*.=C2=AE=C2=A7
z=C2=BA.=C2=B2=C3=8B=C2=A9=C2=C5-=C3=AD
Message 11
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| Subject: | Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller |
An old friend's father-in-law was one of the engineers on the SR-71 engine inlet
cones. I remember that chat with him, maybe 25 years ago. Not a simple problem.
Jim Ash
-----Original Message-----
From: Mike
Sent: Mar 3, 2010 11:04 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
The limit on the U-2 was the "Dead Man's notch," the high-altitude corner right
below stall true airspeed and critical Mach number. This same notch killed several
Lear 24/25 pilots when those aircraft became cheap enough to filter down
to companies who couldn't' afford in-depth pilot training. In subsonic planes
like the U-2 and the Lear, exceeding critical Mach can cause an uncontrollable
pitch down which only results in going faster, with no ability to pull the
nose up.
The SR-71 doesn't have a Mach number that makes it uncontrollable; its speed is
limited by compression heating on the nose and leading edges, as well as keeping
the shock wave properly captured in those all-too-critical engine inlets.
BTW, at speed and altitude over the equator, headed east, approximately 14% of
the weight of the SR and its crew is supported by orbital acceleration. (You
weigh less in the seat.)
Mike Hardaway
The SR71 had a nasty habit of blowback which would make the engine cut out.Those
nose cones had to be moved at just the right time in just the right conditions
or this would happen.In effect the engines would stall not the wing.But I'm
sure if you brought the wing to the proper angle of attack it would stall as
all others do.
I think it must be the U2, as the SR71 is supersonic and technically a plane flying
supersonic cannot stall. At least that is my experience.
Max
> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 19:40:47 -0600
> From: jim_markle@mindspring.com
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
>
>
> Am I sure he was not talking about the U-2???? Nope, I'm not sure at all! As
good as MY memory is, maybe he was talking about the Jenny! :-)
>
> I think it was the SR71....but who knows..... :-)
>
> do not archive
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: Tim Willis <timothywillis@earthlink.net>
> >Sent: Mar 2, 2010 1:10 PM
> >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
> >
> >
> >Jim,
> >Are you sure he was not talking about the U-2? Such a difference between cruising
and stalling on a U-2.
> >Tim in central TX
> >do not archive
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >>From: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 11:28 AM
> >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
> >>
> >>
> >>Once lived next door to an Ex-SR71 pilot...he told me the difference between
stall and Vne at altitude was something like 4 knots...not related to anything
in this conversation but I thought that was VERY interesting.
> >>
> >>do not archive
> >>
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>
> >>From: David Paule
> >>
> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 8:51 AM
> >>
> >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >>
> >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>This was primarily for thermal expansion and
> >>secondarily for stiffness. It had nothing to do with the transition to turbulent
> >>flow, as the SR-71 operated at a very high Reynolds Number, even at
> >>"low" speeds.
> >>
> >>David Paule
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> >> If you look at the underside of an SR-71, it is
> >>corrugated.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
&===
>
>
>
~,g(M4Gqz.'8^>'­zzhIQhR­'Eyn­ j j+^.+-Tn+bp­bj!'60j@C,jwfffky0kx&­zKa0kx&­zKl4N4X@E9L+y\{^j)ZnWaygj|m~'hm~'onbum(­|jy2*.z.
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
Message 12
| Subject: | Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller-- NOW |
"Orbital Acceleration"
At altitude and speed at the equator, how much orbital acceleration would a Piet
have?
Perhaps we can ask the Fisherman to fly south from Belize and check it out.
>From now on,the "orbital acceleration issue" can replace the "milk jugs issue"
for us Pietenpolers.
Collectively, GROOOOOAAAAN!
Tim in central TX
do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: Mike
Sent: Mar 3, 2010 10:04 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
The limit on the U-2 was the "Dead Man's notch," the high-altitude corner right
below stall true airspeed and critical Mach number. This same notch killed several
Lear 24/25 pilots when those aircraft became cheap enough to filter down
to companies who couldn't' afford in-depth pilot training. In subsonic planes
like the U-2 and the Lear, exceeding critical Mach can cause an uncontrollable
pitch down which only results in going faster, with no ability to pull the
nose up.
The SR-71 doesn't have a Mach number that makes it uncontrollable; its speed is
limited by compression heating on the nose and leading edges, as well as keeping
the shock wave properly captured in those all-too-critical engine inlets.
BTW, at speed and altitude over the equator, headed east, approximately 14% of
the weight of the SR and its crew is supported by orbital acceleration. (You
weigh less in the seat.)
Mike Hardaway
The SR71 had a nasty habit of blowback which would make the engine cut out.Those
nose cones had to be moved at just the right time in just the right conditions
or this would happen.In effect the engines would stall not the wing.But I'm
sure if you brought the wing to the proper angle of attack it would stall as
all others do.
I think it must be the U2, as the SR71 is supersonic and technically a plane flying
supersonic cannot stall. At least that is my experience.
Max
> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 19:40:47 -0600
> From: jim_markle@mindspring.com
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
>
>
> Am I sure he was not talking about the U-2???? Nope, I'm not sure at all! As
good as MY memory is, maybe he was talking about the Jenny! :-)
>
> I think it was the SR71....but who knows..... :-)
>
> do not archive
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: Tim Willis <timothywillis@earthlink.net>
> >Sent: Mar 2, 2010 1:10 PM
> >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
> >
> >
> >Jim,
> >Are you sure he was not talking about the U-2? Such a difference between cruising
and stalling on a U-2.
> >Tim in central TX
> >do not archive
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >>From: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 11:28 AM
> >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
> >>
> >>
> >>Once lived next door to an Ex-SR71 pilot...he told me the difference between
stall and Vne at altitude was something like 4 knots...not related to anything
in this conversation but I thought that was VERY interesting.
> >>
> >>do not archive
> >>
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>
> >>From: David Paule
> >>
> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 8:51 AM
> >>
> >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >>
> >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>This was primarily for thermal expansion and
> >>secondarily for stiffness. It had nothing to do with the transition to turbulent
> >>flow, as the SR-71 operated at a very high Reynolds Number, even at
> >>"low" speeds.
> >>
> >>David Paule
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> >> If you look at the underside of an SR-71, it is
> >>corrugated.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
&===
>
>
>
~,g(M4Gqz.'8^>'­zzhIQhR­'Eyn­ j j+^.+-Tn+bp­bj!'60j@C,jwfffky0kx&­zKa0kx&­zKl4N4X@E9L+y\{^j)ZnWaygj|m~'hm~'onbum(­|jy2*.z.
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: a Piet is a Piet |
Larry,
I'm not questioning you - a friend of mine, who now flies for America
West, ferried a Piper Apache over the mountains in N. California using
wave lift to gain enough altitude to get over. The owner, who was
flying with him, was flabbergasted, thinking that they'd never make it.
If I recall correctly, he powered back to idle to prove that he could
still climb with no power. The wave lift was pretty strong that day.
Now, I don't know exactly where you're located in AR, but looking at
those ridges that run E-W down there, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if
you could find some wave lift on the leeward side if the wind was coming
from the right direction.
In fact, now that I think about it, there was an article in a recent
issue of Soaring magazine about wave lift in Arkansas. Guys were
getting up to 12-13k. Of course, these are gliders with L/D in the
35-40 range and minimum sink rates of <180fpm.
On a strong day, I can easily imagine a Piet getting up to 8K using wave
lift.
Cheers,
Dan
do not archive
On 03/03/2010 08:37 AM, Lawrence Williams wrote:
> Ok, Ok. Go get your "grain of salt" pills and re read my epic adventure.
> Also keep the pills handy whenever you see one of my infrequent posts.
> As for Vne vs. stall speed, it ain't uncommon at all. One of our
> Canadair RJ's was leveling out at about
>
>
> *
>
>
> *
--
Dan Yocum
Fermilab 630.840.6509
yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov
"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: a Piet is a Piet |
With specific hat tip to Arkansas, Oklahoma, and parts of Texas under
"Favored Areas":
http://www.aviationweather.ws/099_Mountain_Wave_Soaring.php
--
Jeff Boatright
"Now let's think about this..."
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller |
It would have been interesting to see if the Iroquois engine that was desig
ned to go into our Avro Arrow would have needed those cones.The Avro Arrow
was being tested while the SR-71 was being built.Originally the SR-71 was c
alled Archangel and then changed to Oxcart.The Avro Arrow was touted as bei
ng able to reach speeds of mach 5 with two Iroquois engines on board.Never
actually proved since we were told by the US to destroy this aircraft. I th
ink in my own personal opinion because it was the only plane in the world c
apable of catching the Black Bird.The danger was that we would sell to the
French who would in turn sell to the Russians.I would have loved to have se
en the two birds flying side by side.It is all speculation now as to whethe
r or not our bird could have in fact out flown it.=C2-=C2-=C2-=0A=0A
=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFrom: Jim Ash <ashcan@earthlink
.net>=0ATo: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Wed, March 3, 2010 11:58:2
4 AM=0ASubject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a prope
et>=0A=0AAn old friend's father-in-law was one of the engineers on the SR-7
1 engine inlet cones. I remember that chat with him, maybe 25 years ago. No
t a simple problem.=0A=0AJim Ash=0A=0A=0A-----Original Message----- =0AFrom
: Mike =0ASent: Mar 3, 2010 11:04 AM =0ATo: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
=0ASubject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
=0A=0A=EF=BB =0A=0A=0AThe limit on the U-2 was the "Dead Man's notch,"
the high-altitude corner right below stall true airspeed and critical Mach
number.=C2- This same notch killed several Lear 24/25 pilots when those a
ircraft became cheap enough to filter down to companies who couldn't' affor
d in-depth pilot training.=C2- In subsonic planes like the U-2 and the Le
ar, exceeding critical Mach can cause an uncontrollable pitch down which on
ly results in going faster, with no ability to pull the nose up.=0AThe SR-7
1 doesn't have a Mach number that makes it uncontrollable; its speed is lim
ited by compression heating on the nose and leading edges, as well as keepi
ng the shock wave properly captured in those all-too-critical engine inlets
.=0ABTW, at speed and altitude over the equator, headed east, approximately
14% of the weight of the SR and its crew is supported by orbital accelerat
ion.=C2- (You weigh less in the seat.)=0AMike Hardaway=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
=0A=0AThe SR71 had a nasty habit of blowback which would make the engine cu
t out.Those nose cones had to be moved at just the right time in just the r
ight conditions or this would happen.In effect the engines would stall not
the wing.But I'm sure if you brought the wing to the proper angle of attack
it would stall as all others do.=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0AI think it must be
the U2, as the SR71 is supersonic and technically a plane flying supersoni
c cannot stall. At least that is my experience. =0A=0A=0AMax=0A=0A> Date: T
ue, 2 Mar 2010 19:40:47 -0600=0A> From: jim_markle@mindspring.com=0A> To: p
ietenpol-list@matronics.com=0A> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircra
ft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A> =0A> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by
: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>=0A> =0A> Am I sure he was not talk
ing about the U-2???? Nope, I'm not sure at all! As good as MY memory is, m
aybe he was talking about the Jenny! :-)=0A> =0A> I think it was the SR71..
..but who knows..... :-)=0A> =0A> do not archive=0A> =0A> =0A> -----Origina
l Message-----=0A> >From: Tim Willis <timothywillis@earthlink.net>=0A> >Sen
t: Mar 2, 2010 1:10 PM=0A> >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0A> >Subject:
Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A> >=0A> >
et>=0A> >=0A> >Jim,=0A> >Are you sure he was not talking about the U-2? Suc
h a difference between cruising and stalling on a U-2. =0A> >Tim in central
TX=0A> >do not archive=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >-----Original Message-----=0A> >>F
rom: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>=0A> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 11:28 A
M=0A> >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0A> >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List:
Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A> >>=0A> >>--> Pietenpol-Lis
t message posted by: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>=0A> >>=0A> >>On
ce lived next door to an Ex-SR71 pilot...he told me the difference between
stall and Vne at altitude was something like 4 knots...not related to anyth
ing in this conversation but I thought that was VERY interesting.=0A> >>=0A
> >>do not archive=0A> >>=0A> >>-----Original Message-----=0A> >>=0A> >>Fro
m: David Paule =0A> >>=0A> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 8:51 AM=0A> >>=0A> >>To: pie
tenpol-list@matronics.com=0A> >>=0A> >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: Cor
vAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=C3=AF=C2
=BB=C2=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>This was primaril
y for thermal expansion and =0A> >>secondarily for stiffness. It had nothin
g to do with the transition to turbulent =0A> >>flow, as the SR-71 operated
at a very high Reynolds Number, even at =0A> >>"low" speeds.=0A> >> =0A> >
>David Paule=0A> >> =0A> >> =0A> >> =0A> >> >> If you look at the underside
of an SR-71, it is =0A> >>corrugated. =0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>
=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >
=0A> >=0A> >=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A&=====0A> =0A> =0A> =0A=C2
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=C2=BA'=B0=C3=8B=C2=A2o=C3=9A=C3=A2=C2=B2=C3=90=C2=A8=C5=BE=C3=9A=C3
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Pietenpol-List=0Ahref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matroni
cs.com=0Ahref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronic
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- -Matt Dralle
=========
Message 16
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| Subject: | a piet is a piet |
Ahem.....as I was saying before the GN-1 censor cut my message off:
-
One of our RJ's was leveling off at about 390 when it was noticed that the
bugs on the speed tape were moving toward eachother and the stall horn soun
ded followed quickly by the stick shaker. They lost a few thousand feet bef
ore recovering and a new operating procedure was established by Bombardier.
It was found that several other customers had similiar experiences.
-
At higher altitudes and higher Mach numbers my Piet airspeed spread between
cruise and stall is about 20-25 kts so I feel pretty immune to that phenom
enon. Something to keep ion mind, though for those of you with more that 50
hp and dimple tape who might explore ever-higher altitude records in the f
uture.
-
I'd like to get some of the coveralls that are being talked about but only
if they are immune to oil drips and won't make us look as gay as the Flitze
r group.
-
Later-
-
Larry
-
-=0A=0A=0A
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller-- NOW |
"Orbital Acceleration"
I think that orbital acceleration is impossible without milk jugs.They are
a necessity.=0Ado not archive=C2-=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A_________________________
_______=0AFrom: Tim Willis <timothywillis@earthlink.net>=0ATo: pietenpol-li
st@matronics.com=0ASent: Wed, March 3, 2010 11:41:17 AM=0ASubject: RE: Piet
enpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller-- NOW "Orbital Acce
lis@earthlink.net>=0A=0AAt altitude and speed at the equator, how much orbi
tal acceleration would a Piet have?=0APerhaps we can ask the Fisherman to f
ly south from Belize and check it out.=0A>From now on,the "orbital accelera
tion issue" can replace the "milk jugs issue" for us Pietenpolers.=0ACollec
tively, GROOOOOAAAAN!=0ATim in central TX=0Ado not archive=0A=0A-----Origin
al Message----- =0AFrom: Mike =0ASent: Mar 3, 2010 10:04 AM =0ATo: pietenpo
l-list@matronics.com =0ASubject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimp
letape on a propeller =0A=0A=EF=BB =0A=0A=0AThe limit on the U-2 was the
"Dead Man's notch," the high-altitude corner right below stall true airspe
ed and critical Mach number.=C2- This same notch killed several Lear 24/2
5 pilots when those aircraft became cheap enough to filter down to companie
s who couldn't' afford in-depth pilot training.=C2- In subsonic planes li
ke the U-2 and the Lear, exceeding critical Mach can cause an uncontrollabl
e pitch down which only results in going faster, with no ability to pull th
e nose up.=0AThe SR-71 doesn't have a Mach number that makes it uncontrolla
ble; its speed is limited by compression heating on the nose and leading ed
ges, as well as keeping the shock wave properly captured in those all-too-c
ritical engine inlets.=0ABTW, at speed and altitude over the equator, heade
d east, approximately 14% of the weight of the SR and its crew is supported
by orbital acceleration.=C2- (You weigh less in the seat.)=0AMike Hardaw
ay=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0AThe SR71 had a nasty habit of blowback which woul
d make the engine cut out.Those nose cones had to be moved at just the righ
t time in just the right conditions or this would happen.In effect the engi
nes would stall not the wing.But I'm sure if you brought the wing to the pr
oper angle of attack it would stall as all others do.=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
=0AI think it must be the U2, as the SR71 is supersonic and technically a p
lane flying supersonic cannot stall. At least that is my experience. =0A=0A
=0AMax=0A=0A> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 19:40:47 -0600=0A> From: jim_markle@min
dspring.com=0A> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0A> Subject: Re: Pietenpol
-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A> =0A> --> Pietenpol-L
ist message posted by: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>=0A> =0A> Am I
sure he was not talking about the U-2???? Nope, I'm not sure at all! As go
od as MY memory is, maybe he was talking about the Jenny! :-)=0A> =0A> I th
ink it was the SR71....but who knows..... :-)=0A> =0A> do not archive=0A>
=0A> =0A> -----Original Message-----=0A> >From: Tim Willis <timothywillis@e
arthlink.net>=0A> >Sent: Mar 2, 2010 1:10 PM=0A> >To: pietenpol-list@matron
ics.com=0A> >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a
othywillis@earthlink.net>=0A> >=0A> >Jim,=0A> >Are you sure he was not talk
ing about the U-2? Such a difference between cruising and stalling on a U-2
. =0A> >Tim in central TX=0A> >do not archive=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >-----Origina
l Message-----=0A> >>From: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>=0A> >>Sen
t: Mar 2, 2010 11:28 AM=0A> >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0A> >>Subjec
t: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A> >>
ing.com>=0A> >>=0A> >>Once lived next door to an Ex-SR71 pilot...he told me
the difference between stall and Vne at altitude was something like 4 knot
s...not related to anything in this conversation but I thought that was VER
Y interesting.=0A> >>=0A> >>do not archive=0A> >>=0A> >>-----Original Messa
ge-----=0A> >>=0A> >>From: David Paule =0A> >>=0A> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 8:51
AM=0A> >>=0A> >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0A> >>=0A> >>Subject: Re:
Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller=0A> >>=0A> >>
=0A> >>=0A> >>=C3=AF=C2=BB=C2=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>
=0A> >>This was primarily for thermal expansion and =0A> >>secondarily for
stiffness. It had nothing to do with the transition to turbulent =0A> >>flo
w, as the SR-71 operated at a very high Reynolds Number, even at =0A> >>"lo
w" speeds.=0A> >> =0A> >>David Paule=0A> >> =0A> >> =0A> >> =0A> >> >> If y
ou look at the underside of an SR-71, it is =0A> >>corrugated. =0A> >>=0A>
>>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A> >>=0A
> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A> =0A&====
=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A=C2=C2=B7=BA~=B0=C3=AD=C2=B2,=C3=9Eg(
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=C3=BC=C3'=C2=AF=C5-­=C2=A2=C2=B3=C3=A2z=C3=97=C2=A7=C2=B0
K=C5-=C3=8Bl4N4=82=AC=99X@E9L=C5=A1=84=A2=C3=A8+y=C2=AB\=C2
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=C3=AE=C5=A1=C3=89=C5=A1=C2=B6=C2=BA'=B0=C3=8B=C2=A2o=C3=9A=C3=A2=C2
=B2=C3=90=C2=A8=C5=BE=C3=9A=C3=A2n=C3=ABb=C2=A2u=C5=BEm(­|=C3=A1jy2=C2
=A2=C3=A7=C3=A8=C2=AF*.=C2=AE=C2=A7z=C2=BA.=C2=B2=C3=8B=C2=A9=C2=C5-
=C3=AD=0A=0Ahref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http
://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List=0Ahref="http://forums.matro
nics.com">http://forums.matronics.com=0Ahref="http://www.matronics.com/co
=========================0A
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2
===================
Message 18
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| Subject: | A Piet is a Piet or a Snowflake........... |
I don't know why I feel like stirring the pots because I really like Larry
Williams but I know he doesn't like Doc Mosher's reference to GN-1's, Piete
npols,
and Pietenpol-like airplanes as all being in the family but are differentia
ted like snowflakes all looking similar but structurally
they are intricately different but....I'm going to anyway !
Good Pietenpol flying story Larry. I'm amazed at how much forward stick
and back throttle I have to use on hot, convective days when flying over ar
eas of terrain that produced huge heat waves and uplifting. You just feel
like you're on a bucking bronco with 150 hp Lycoming up front.
Then you encounter the other side of the lift and even with more than cruis
e power you're dropping altitude like a brick. The Pietenpol is really pro
ne to these kinds of thermal air mass excursions.
No wonder we so enjoy early morning or sunset type flying when the air is u
sually smooth and graceful. A Bonanza or heavy Cessna might take those
thermals much easier than Piet but there is nothing like fingertip flying
a Pietenpol in perfectly smooth and calm conditions.
Even more fun if you have smoke where you lay out a patch of smoke in cruis
e and then do pull ups and turn around to see the elevator create smoke rin
gs that curl in upon one another.
Another cool thing is to do a 360 with smoke and fly thru your own smoke.
You can get some instrument time while smelling the scent that makes you
feel like you're at a good old fashioned air show.
Mike C.
Rambling for no apparent reason
do not archive
Message 19
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| Subject: | Coveralls and Flitzer group-nice one Larry ! |
Larry Williams wrote:
>I'd like to get some of the coveralls that are being talked about but
>only if they are immune to oil drips and won't make us look as gay as
>the Flitzer group.
Right there is one reason not to get a pair of those coveralls Larry. I h
ave a litmus test
for you. Let's have Bobka try on a pair and then we'll make our final dec
ision
on those coveralls eh ?
If you would be seen in public like say at a restaurant with Bobka in those
coveralls
then it would be okay to get them....otherwise we'll pass. Let me know wh
at you think.
Mike C.
do not archive
[cid:image001.jpg@01CABAE4.2DDD7B40]
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: a Piet is a Piet |
I just don't undrstand anyone doubting what a Piet can do.
Gene
N502R
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Boatright" <jboatri@emory.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 11:41 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: a Piet is a Piet
>
> With specific hat tip to Arkansas, Oklahoma, and parts of Texas under
> "Favored Areas":
>
> http://www.aviationweather.ws/099_Mountain_Wave_Soaring.php
>
> --
>
> Jeff Boatright
> "Now let's think about this..."
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
07:34:00
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller |
The Arrow story is very interesting. I encourage list members to
google it, but only if you have a spare hour or three...
>It would have been interesting to see if the Iroquois engine that
>was designed to go into our Avro Arrow would have needed those
>cones.The Avro Arrow was being tested while the SR-71 was being
>built.Originally the SR-71 was called Archangel and then changed to
>Oxcart.The Avro Arrow was touted as being able to reach speeds of
>mach 5 with two Iroquois engines on board.Never actually proved
>since we were told by the US to destroy this aircraft. I think in my
>own personal opinion because it was the only plane in the world
>capable of catching the Black Bird.The danger was that we would sell
>to the French who would in turn sell to the Russians.I would have
>loved to have seen the two birds flying side by side.It is all
>speculation now as to whether or not our bird could have in fact out
>flown it.
--
Jeff Boatright
"Now let's think about this..."
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller |
Among many reasons to follow this amazing group of people, learning
something new about virtually everything in aviation on a daily basis
is my favorite. Thanks Max and everyone...
Rodrigo
Em 03/03/2010, =E0s 11:14, Max Hegler escreveu:
> The purpose of the nose cone (or spike) was to keep the supersonic
> bow wave attached to the inlet of the engine. Jet (turbine) engines
> will not operate with supersonic airflow going through the engines.
> If the spike was not in the proper place the engine would compressor
> stall and flameout. At cruise (mach 3+) this would cause a yawing
> into the dead engine resulting in loss of control and breakup of the
> aircraft. This was the cause of all but one of the SR-71 crashes. To
> fix this, they added automatic shutdown of the good engine if thrust
> on one side suddenly dropped. The reason you can't stall
> supersonically is the controls are not as effective and would not
> bring the wing into a stall angle of attack...or something like that.
>
> Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 05:05:18 -0800
> From: harvey.rule@rogers.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a
> propeller
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>
> The SR71 had a nasty habit of blowback which would make the engine
> cut out.Those nose cones had to be moved at just the right time in
> just the right conditions or this would happen.In effect the engines
> would stall not the wing.But I'm sure if you brought the wing to the
> proper angle of attack it would stall as all others do.
>
> From: Max Hegler <maxhegler@msn.com>
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Tue, March 2, 2010 10:56:33 PM
> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a
> propeller
>
> I think it must be the U2, as the SR71 is supersonic and technically
> a plane flying supersonic cannot stall. At least that is my
> experience.
>
> Max
>
> > Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 19:40:47 -0600
> > From: jim_markle@mindspring.com
> > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a
> propeller
> >
<jim_markle@mindspring.com
> >
> >
> > Am I sure he was not talking about the U-2???? Nope, I'm not sure
> at all! As good as MY memory is, maybe he was talking about the
> Jenny! :-)
> >
> > I think it was the SR71....but who knows..... :-)
> >
> > do not archive
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > >From: Tim Willis <timothywillis@earthlink.net>
> > >Sent: Mar 2, 2010 1:10 PM
> > >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> > >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a
> propeller
> > >
<timothywillis@earthlink.net
> >
> > >
> > >Jim,
> > >Are you sure he was not talking about the U-2? Such a difference
> between cruising and stalling on a U-2.
> > >Tim in central TX
> > >do not archive
> > >
> > >
> > >-----Original Message-----
> > >>From: Jim Markle <jim_markle@mindspring.com>
> > >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 11:28 AM
> > >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> > >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a
> propeller
> > >>
<jim_markle@mindspring.com
> >
> > >>
> > >>Once lived next door to an Ex-SR71 pilot...he told me the
> difference between stall and Vne at altitude was something like 4
> knots...not related to anything in this conversation but I thought
> that was VERY interesting.
> > >>
> > >>do not archive
> > >>
> > >>-----Original Message-----
> > >>
> > >>From: David Paule
> > >>
> > >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 8:51 AM
> > >>
> > >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> > >>
> > >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a
> propeller
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>=C3=AF=C2=BB=C2
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>This was primarily for thermal expansion and
> > >>secondarily for stiffness. It had nothing to do with the
> transition to turbulent
> > >>flow, as the SR-71 operated at a very high Reynolds Number, even
> at
> > >>"low" speeds.
> > >>
> > >>David Paule
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> >> If you look at the underside of an SR-71, it is
> > >>corrugated.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> &===
> >
> >
> >
> =C2=C2=B7=BA~=B0=C3 =C2=B2,=C3=9Eg(=93=C5
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>
>
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> Esta mensagem foi verificada pelo E-mail Protegido Terra.
> Atualizado em 03/03/2010
Message 23
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| Subject: | Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller |
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Message 24
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| Subject: | Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller |
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Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller |
Sorry, if I'd known that was your car stuck in the mud outside the
Camden tavern for a week, I'd stopped & given you a ride outa town. See
you at your fly-in.
Gene
DO NOT ARCHIVE
----- Original Message -----
From: Max Hegler
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 4:14 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a
propeller
I spent a week there one day...maybe will come over when you will be
around. Hohenwald will be having there fly-in 15 May, be sure to fly in.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: zharvey@bentoncountycable.net
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a
propeller
Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 09:50:58 -0600
Max, when are you coming over to the Center of the World (also known
as Camden)?
Gene
N502R
http://www.matnbsp; via the Web
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
_p; generous bsp;
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
================
=EF=BD=EF=BD=EF=BD~=EF=BD=EF=BD=EF=BD,=EF=BD=03g(=EF
=BD=EF=BD=EF=BDM=EF=BDGq=EF=BDz=EF=BD=EF=BD
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
- Release Date: 03/03/10 07:34:00
=EF=BD=EF=BD~=EF=BD=EF=BD,=03g=EF=BD=EF=BD=EF=BD
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
03/03/10 07:34:00
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: logos, coveralls etc. |
Hey Guys,
The Piet logos are very nice and I am sure the talent on this list will
offer a great logo for clothing and the plane alike.
My question is: Since we have both Piet and GN-1 builders and pilots
on this list, would the Piet logo be welcomed on the GN-1? This was
Bernard's design and concept and John Grega came along later with
his revisions to the same concept.
If both parties are in agreement, then I would like to order a coverall
and logo for my GN-1.
Thanks.
Mike King
77Mk
GN-1
Corpus Christi, Texas
----- Original Message -----
From: gboothe5@comcast.net
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2010 6:10 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: logos, coveralls etc.
I'm in, too.
Gary Boothe
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: Roman Bukolt <conceptmodels@tds.net>
Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 15:13:29
To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: logos, coveralls etc.
<conceptmodels@tds.net>
I'm interested,
Roman Bukolt NX20795
On Mar 2, 2010, at 9:04 AM, Douwe Blumberg wrote:
<douweblumberg@earthlink.net
> >
>
> Hey Don,
>
> Great minds think alike eh?
>
> I talked to my friend at Old Rhinebeck (owns the beautiful "626"
> that used
> to fly there) since they are really good at the period look. He
> directed me
> to Universal Overall company as the only place he could find old
> cotton
> coveralls. Ck out their site, they have cotton coveralls with
hidden
> buttons. I'd have somebody put buttons down the front. They come
> in many
> colors, but White or unbleached probably would look great.
>
> I just got a pretty good old Mobilgas image that would certainly
> have that
> thirties look, and the kind folks from this site have been sending
> me stuff
> too, so we'll see. Let's talk and see what we come up with. Being
an
> artist, I can always clean on of these up or make our own. The
> important
> thing to me is to get something that really looks old.
>
> Sounds like we have an offer from a silkscreener to make screens
> (thanks
> Jake!) which is the best printing way to go as it'll outlast and
stay
> fresher than a heat transfer. The ultimate would be to have it
> embroidered,
> but I'll have to ck out the price on that, and it probably is way
> overkill.
>
> Don, let me know if you want to order a few coveralls with me, and
> anybody
> else and let's put our heads together about a logo so we can get
> something
> done before flying season.
>
> Douwe
> douweblumberg@earthlink.net
>
>
>
>
>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: logos, coveralls etc. |
We Piet builders will tar and feather any GN-1 driver with a Pietenpol logo.
On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 4:45 PM, Mike King <mikek120@mindspring.com> wrote:
> Hey Guys,
>
>
> The Piet logos are very nice and I am sure the talent on this list will
>
> offer a great logo for clothing and the plane alike.
>
>
> My question is: Since we have both Piet and GN-1 builders and pilots
>
> on this list, would the Piet logo be welcomed on the GN-1? This was
>
> Bernard's design and concept and John Grega came along later with
>
> his revisions to the same concept.
>
>
> If both parties are in agreement, then I would like to order a coverall
>
> and logo for my GN-1.
>
>
> Thanks.
>
> Mike King
>
> 77Mk
>
> GN-1
>
> Corpus Christi, Texas
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: gboothe5@comcast.net
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2010 6:10 PM
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: logos, coveralls etc.
>
> I'm in, too.
>
> Gary Boothe
> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Roman Bukolt <conceptmodels@tds.net>
> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 15:13:29
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: logos, coveralls etc.
>
>
> I'm interested,
> Roman Bukolt NX20795
> On Mar 2, 2010, at 9:04 AM, Douwe Blumberg wrote:
>
>> <douweblumberg@earthlink.net
>> >
>>
>> Hey Don,
>>
>> Great minds think alike eh?
>>
>> I talked to my friend at Old Rhinebeck (owns the beautiful "626"
>> that used
>> to fly there) since they are really good at the period look. He
>> directed me
>> to Universal Overall company as the only place he could find old
>> cotton
>> coveralls. Ck out their site, they have cotton coveralls with hidden
>> buttons. I'd have somebody put buttons down the front. They come
>> in many
>> colors, but White or unbleached probably would look great.
>>
>> I just got a pretty good old Mobilgas image that would certainly
>> have that
>> thirties look, and the kind folks from this site have been sending
>> me stuff
>> too, so we'll see. Let's talk and see what we come up with. Being an
>> artist, I can always clean on of these up or make our own. The
>> important
>> thing to me is to get something that really looks old.
>>
>> Sounds like we have an offer from a silkscreener to make screens
>> (thanks
>> Jake!) which is the best printing way to go as it'll outlast and stay
>> fresher than a heat transfer. The ultimate would be to have it
>> embroidered,
>> but I'll have to ck out the price on that, and it probably is way
>> overkill.
>>
>> Don, let me know if you want to order a few coveralls with me, and
>> anybody
>> else and let's put our heads together about a logo so we can get
>> something
>> done before flying season.
>>
>> Douwe
>> douweblumberg@earthlink.net
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> http://www.matnbsp; via the Web
> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
> _p; generous bsp;
> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c================
>
>
--
Rick Holland
Castle Rock, Colorado
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 28
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|
| Subject: | Re: logos, coveralls etc. |
Mike,
I admire your desire to be sensitive to other's view of the world.
And before I unload, let me say that I welcome the Piet logo on your
GN-1. I agree with your reasoning: Bernard->Grega->Mike. But...
Heck, Mike Cuy has an EASTERN (who's zoomin' who?) AIRLINES logo on
his Pietenpol. D'ya think Frank Borman gave Mike permission to do
that? Heck NO! Frank Borman only WISHES he was as cool and with it
as Mike Cuy. And by extension, the rest of us on this h'yar list.
Order away!
Jeff
>Hey Guys,
>
>
>The Piet logos are very nice and I am sure the talent on this list will
>
>offer a great logo for clothing and the plane alike.
>
>
>My question is: Since we have both Piet and GN-1 builders and pilots
>
>on this list, would the Piet logo be welcomed on the GN-1? This was
>
>Bernard's design and concept and John Grega came along later with
>
>his revisions to the same concept.
>
>
>If both parties are in agreement, then I would like to order a coverall
>
>and logo for my GN-1.
>
>
>Thanks.
>
>Mike King
>
>77Mk
>
>GN-1
>
>Corpus Christi, Texas
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: <mailto:gboothe5@comcast.net>gboothe5@comcast.net
>To: <mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2010 6:10 PM
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: logos, coveralls etc.
>
><mailto:gboothe5@comcast.net>gboothe5@comcast.net
>
>I'm in, too.
>
>Gary Boothe
>Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Roman Bukolt <<mailto:conceptmodels@tds.net>conceptmodels@tds.net>
>Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 15:13:29
>To: <<mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: logos, coveralls etc.
>
><<mailto:conceptmodels@tds.net>conceptmodels@tds.net>
>
>I'm interested,
>Roman Bukolt NX20795
>On Mar 2, 2010, at 9:04 AM, Douwe Blumberg wrote:
>
>><<mailto:douweblumberg@earthlink.net>douweblumberg@earthlink.net
>> >
>>
>> Hey Don,
>>
>> Great minds think alike eh?
>>
>> I talked to my friend at Old Rhinebeck (owns the beautiful "626"
>> that used
>> to fly there) since they are really good at the period look. He
>> directed me
>> to Universal Overall company as the only place he could find old
>> cotton
>> coveralls. Ck out their site, they have cotton coveralls with hidden
>> buttons. I'd have somebody put buttons down the front. They come
>> in many
>> colors, but White or unbleached probably would look great.
>>
>> I just got a pretty good old Mobilgas image that would certainly
>> have that
>> thirties look, and the kind folks from this site have been sending
>> me stuff
>> too, so we'll see. Let's talk and see what we come up with. Being an
>> artist, I can always clean on of these up or make our own. The
>> important
>> thing to me is to get something that really looks old.
>>
>> Sounds like we have an offer from a silkscreener to make screens
>> (thanks
>> Jake!) which is the best printing way to go as it'll outlast and stay
>> fresher than a heat transfer. The ultimate would be to have it
>> embroidered,
>> but I'll have to ck out the price on that, and it probably is way
>> overkill.
>>
>> Don, let me know if you want to order a few coveralls with me, and
>> anybody
>> else and let's put our heads together about a logo so we can get
>> something
>> done before flying season.
>>
>> Douwe
>> <mailto:douweblumberg@earthlink.net>douweblumberg@earthlink.net
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>http://www.matnbsp; via the Web
>href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
>_p; generous bsp;
>href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c================
>
>
><http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
><http://www.matronics.com/contribution>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
--
---
Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D.
Associate Professor of Ophthalmology
Emory University School of Medicine
Editor-in-Chief
Molecular Vision
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller |
While this is all very interesting, SR-71s have little to do with Pietenpol
s and/or dimple tape. Does anyone else have anything to add about dimple ta
pe, or could we please start a different SR-71 thread.
Thanks
Malcolm Morrison
----- Original Message -----
From: "H RULE" <harvey.rule@rogers.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 3, 2010 1:36:23 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
It would have been interesting to see if the Iroquois engine that was desig
ned to go into our Avro Arrow would have needed those cones.The Avro Arrow
was being tested while the SR-71 was being built.Originally the SR-71 was c
alled Archangel and then changed to Oxcart.The Avro Arrow was touted as bei
ng able to reach speeds of mach 5 with two Iroquois engines on board.Never
actually proved since we were told by the US to destroy this aircraft. I th
ink in my own personal opinion because it was the only plane in the world c
apable of catching the Black Bird.The danger was that we would sell to the
French who would in turn sell to the Russians.I would have loved to have se
en the two birds flying side by side.It is all speculation now as to whethe
r or not our bird could have in fact out flown it.
From: Jim Ash <ashcan@earthlink.net>
Sent: Wed, March 3, 2010 11:58:24 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
An old friend's father-in-law was one of the engineers on the SR-71 engine
inlet cones. I remember that chat with him, maybe 25 years ago. Not a simpl
e problem.
Jim Ash
-----Original Message-----
From: Mike
Sent: Mar 3, 2010 11:04 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
=EF=BB
The limit on the U-2 was the "Dead Man's notch," the high-altitude corner r
ight below stall true airspeed and critical Mach number. This same notch ki
lled several Lear 24/25 pilots when those aircraft became cheap enough to f
ilter down to companies who couldn't' afford in-depth pilot training. In su
bsonic planes like the U-2 and the Lear, exceeding critical Mach can cause
an uncontrollable pitch down which only results in going faster, with no ab
ility to pull the nose up.
The SR-71 doesn't have a Mach number that makes it uncontrollable; its spee
d is limited by compression heating on the nose and leading edges, as well
as keeping the shock wave properly captured in those all-too-critical engin
e inlets.
BTW, at speed and altitude over the equator, headed east, approximately 14%
of the weight of the SR and its crew is supported by orbital acceleration.
(You weigh less in the seat.)
Mike Hardaway
The SR71 had a nasty habit of blowback which would make the engine cut out.
Those nose cones had to be moved at just the right time in just the right c
onditions or this would happen.In effect the engines would stall not the wi
ng.But I'm sure if you brought the wing to the proper angle of attack it wo
uld stall as all others do.
I think it must be the U2, as the SR71 is supersonic and technically a plan
e flying supersonic cannot stall. At least that is my experience.
Max
> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 19:40:47 -0600
> From: jim_markle@mindspring.com
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
>
com >
>
> Am I sure he was not talking about the U-2???? Nope, I'm not sure at all!
As good as MY memory is, maybe he was talking about the Jenny! :-)
>
> I think it was the SR71....but who knows..... :-)
>
> do not archive
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: Tim Willis < timothywillis@earthlink.net >
> >Sent: Mar 2, 2010 1:10 PM
> >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propeller
> >
nk.net >
> >
> >Jim,
> >Are you sure he was not talking about the U-2? Such a difference between
cruising and stalling on a U-2.
> >Tim in central TX
> >do not archive
> >
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >>From: Jim Markle < jim_markle@mindspring.com >
> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 11:28 AM
> >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propelle
r
> >>
g.com >
> >>
> >>Once lived next door to an Ex-SR71 pilot...he told me the difference be
tween stall and Vne at altitude was something like 4 knots...not related to
anything in this conversation but I thought that was VERY interesting.
> >>
> >>do not archive
> >>
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>
> >>From: David Paule
> >>
> >>Sent: Mar 2, 2010 8:51 AM
> >>
> >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> >>
> >>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fw: CorvAircraft> Dimpletape on a propelle
r
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>=C3=AF=C2=BB=C2
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>This was primarily for thermal expansion and
> >>secondarily for stiffness. It had nothing to do with the transition to
turbulent
> >>flow, as the SR-71 operated at a very high Reynolds Number, even at
> >>"low" speeds.
> >>
> >>David Paule
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> >> If you look at the underside of an SR-71, it is
> >>corrugated.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
&====
>
>
>
=C2=C2=B7=BA~=B0=C3=AD=C2=B2,=C3=9Eg(=93=C5-=C3=93M4
=C3=93G=C3=9Aq=C3=BC=C2=A2=C3=C3=A2z=C2=B9=C3=9E=C3=81=C3=8A.=C2=AE'=C2
=AB8^>'­zzh=9D=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B4I=C5=A1=C5-Qh=C2=AE=C3=A9R=C3
=87­=C3=A3=C2=B6=C2=BA'=B0=C3=8B=C5-=C3=8BEy=C2=ABn&sh
y;=C3=AB j=C3=B8 j=C3=9A+=C2=B6-=C3=AB=C2=A3=C3=98^=84=A2=C2=A9
=C3=B2.+-=C2=BA=C3=98=C2=A5=C5-=C3=98=C5=BE=C2=B2=C3=8B=C5=93=C2
=AB=C5-=C3=8BT=C5=B8=C3=B4=C2=AEn=C3=87+=C5-=BAb=C2=A2p­=C3
=88b=C2=BD=C3=A4=C5=BEj=C2=B7!=C5=92'=93-=EF=BD=C3=AC6=C2
=B2=C2=BA0=C2=B1=C3-=C2=A1j=C3=91@C=C3=A1=C2=A2=C3=9A,=C2=C3
=9Ejwf=C2=B9=C3=88f=C2=B9=C3=88f=C2=A2=C2=B7=EF=BD=C2=A8ky=C3=B1=C2=B6
=C3=9A=C30=84=A2=C2=ABk=C2=A2x=C5=93=C2=B1=C3=8A&=C3=BC=C3'=C2=AF
=C5-­=C2=A2=C2=B3=C3=A2z=C3=97=C2=A7=C2=B0K=C5-=C3=8Ba=C2
=B6=C3=9A=C30=84=A2=C2=ABk=C2=A2x=C5=93=C2=B1=C3=8A&=C3=BC=C3'=C2
=AF=C5-­=C2=A2=C2=B3=C3=A2z=C3=97=C2=A7=C2=B0K=C5-=C3=8Bl4
N4=82=AC=99X@E9L=C5=A1=84=A2=C3=A8+y=C2=AB\=C2=A2{^=C5=BE=C3'
=C2=A5=C2=B2-=C2=AFj)ZnW=C2=AF=B0=C2=ABayg=BA=C5-=C3
=AE=C5=A1j=C3=9E|m=C2=B6=C5=B8=C3~=C5-=C3=AE=C5=A1=C3=89=C5=A1=C2=B6
=C2=BA'=B0=C3=8B=C2=A2hm=C2=B6=C5=B8=C3~=C5-=C3=AE=C5=A1=C3=89
=C5=A1=C2=B6=C2=BA'=B0=C3=8B=C2=A2o=C3=9A=C3=A2=C2=B2=C3=90=C2=A8=C5
=BE=C3=9A=C3=A2n=C3=ABb=C2=A2u=C5=BEm(­|=C3=A1jy2=C2=A2=C3=A7=C3=A8=C2
=AF*.=C2=AE=C2=A7z=C2=BA.=C2=B2=C3=8B=C2=A9=C2=C5-=C3=AD
href=" http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List "> http://www.ma
tronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
href=" http://forums.matronics.com "> http://forums.matronics.com
href=" http://www.matronics.com/contribution "> http://www.matronr?Pieten
pol-List" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
_f="http://forums.matronics.com/" target=_blank>http://forums.matronics
.nbsp; onics.com/contribution" =======
==
Message 30
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| Subject: | Eastern and United issues |
Yes sir, Jeff Boatright is correct in saying that I have an old (modified) Eastern
Airlines logo on the sides of my fuselage but in American Airline colors !!!!!!!!
You should see sometimes I'll get retired AA or EA pilots pointing that out to
me. I usually tell them that I wanted to aggravate both demographics so
I mixed the logo and colors just to accomplish that.
And Jeff, I've got a connection with Frank Borman and he told me it was okay to
use the old Eastern logo. He was a cast member with me in the documentary
"The Restorers" a few years ago.
Mike C.
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: logos, coveralls etc. |
You would have to catch us frist, soooo go get ya some dimple tape. LOL
Bryan Green
Elgin SC
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rick Holland" <at7000ft@gmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 7:48 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: logos, coveralls etc.
>
> We Piet builders will tar and feather any GN-1 driver with a Pietenpol
> logo.
>
> On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 4:45 PM, Mike King <mikek120@mindspring.com> wrote:
>> Hey Guys,
>>
>>
>>
>> The Piet logos are very nice and I am sure the talent on this list will
>>
>> offer a great logo for clothing and the plane alike.
>>
>>
>>
>> My question is: Since we have both Piet and GN-1 builders and pilots
>>
>> on this list, would the Piet logo be welcomed on the GN-1? This was
>>
>> Bernard's design and concept and John Grega came along later with
>>
>> his revisions to the same concept.
>>
>>
>>
>> If both parties are in agreement, then I would like to order a coverall
>>
>> and logo for my GN-1.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Mike King
>>
>> 77Mk
>>
>> GN-1
>>
>> Corpus Christi, Texas
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: gboothe5@comcast.net
>> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>> Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2010 6:10 PM
>> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: logos, coveralls etc.
>>
>> I'm in, too.
>>
>> Gary Boothe
>> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Roman Bukolt <conceptmodels@tds.net>
>> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 15:13:29
>> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: logos, coveralls etc.
>>
>> <conceptmodels@tds.net>
>>
>> I'm interested,
>> Roman Bukolt NX20795
>> On Mar 2, 2010, at 9:04 AM, Douwe Blumberg wrote:
>>
>>> <douweblumberg@earthlink.net
>>> >
>>>
>>> Hey Don,
>>>
>>> Great minds think alike eh?
>>>
>>> I talked to my friend at Old Rhinebeck (owns the beautiful "626"
>>> that used
>>> to fly there) since they are really good at the period look. He
>>> directed me
>>> to Universal Overall company as the only place he could find old
>>> cotton
>>> coveralls. Ck out their site, they have cotton coveralls with hidden
>>> buttons. I'd have somebody put buttons down the front. They come
>>> in many
>>> colors, but White or unbleached probably would look great.
>>>
>>> I just got a pretty good old Mobilgas image that would certainly
>>> have that
>>> thirties look, and the kind folks from this site have been sending
>>> me stuff
>>> too, so we'll see. Let's talk and see what we come up with. Being an
>>> artist, I can always clean on of these up or make our own. The
>>> important
>>> thing to me is to get something that really looks old.
>>>
>>> Sounds like we have an offer from a silkscreener to make screens
>>> (thanks
>>> Jake!) which is the best printing way to go as it'll outlast and stay
>>> fresher than a heat transfer. The ultimate would be to have it
>>> embroidered,
>>> but I'll have to ck out the price on that, and it probably is way
>>> overkill.
>>>
>>> Don, let me know if you want to order a few coveralls with me, and
>>> anybody
>>> else and let's put our heads together about a logo so we can get
>>> something
>>> done before flying season.
>>>
>>> Douwe
>>> douweblumberg@earthlink.net
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> http://www.matnbsp; via the Web
>> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
>> _p; generous bsp;
>> href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c================
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Rick Holland
> Castle Rock, Colorado
>
> "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
>
>
>
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