---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 03/06/10: 26 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:17 AM - Re: First Major Milestone (helspersew@aol.com) 2. 04:51 AM - Re: Construction Photos (Jack) 3. 04:57 AM - Re: First Major Milestone (Jack) 4. 06:47 AM - Re: First Major Milestone (Jim Markle) 5. 07:15 AM - Re: First Major Milestone (Gary Boothe) 6. 07:46 AM - Re: First Major Milestone (Tim Willis) 7. 09:42 AM - Re: First Major Milestone (K5YAC) 8. 10:11 AM - Wood (William Colleran) 9. 01:25 PM - Re: Wood (Jack Phillips) 10. 03:12 PM - Cool altimeter on ebay (helspersew@aol.com) 11. 04:06 PM - dimple tape (airlion) 12. 04:23 PM - Re: dimple tape (Ben Charvet) 13. 04:35 PM - Re: Re: Just Hello (shad bell) 14. 04:46 PM - Re: Wood (K5YAC) 15. 04:58 PM - Re: Wood (Dan Yocum) 16. 04:58 PM - Re: Wood (Dan Yocum) 17. 05:46 PM - Re: Wood (Gary Boothe) 18. 06:21 PM - Coverall Comps (mr-fix-all) 19. 06:43 PM - Re: Coverall Comps (Tim Willis) 20. 06:45 PM - Re: dimple tape (Pieti Lowell) 21. 07:05 PM - Re: Coverall Comps (mr-fix-all) 22. 07:14 PM - Re: Coverall Comps (VanDy) 23. 07:27 PM - Re: Coverall Comps (mr-fix-all) 24. 07:31 PM - Re: Wood (Clif Dawson) 25. 09:39 PM - Re: Wood (Mike Townsley) 26. 11:42 PM - Re: Wood (Clif Dawson) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:17:21 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: First Major Milestone From: helspersew@aol.com Mark, Anytime you are proud of your work, and need to stand back and look, it's a milestone. Very nice work. It must be great to get it out into the ligh t. Keep plugging! Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. -----Original Message----- From: K5YAC Sent: Fri, Mar 5, 2010 10:41 pm Subject: Pietenpol-List: First Major Milestone I'm not sure if this is actually a milestone, but I'm feeling pretty good about t. I took my left wing panel off the jig today and trial fit the aileron. oday was one of the first really nice days we have had in a long time, so I ook my wing panel outside and set it on saw horses so I could look it over in he sun light. It all looks good so far. I still need to install control ulleys and LE sheeting, but the framework is complete. We measured the dimensions (front to rear spar - tip to root) and found th at here is less than 1/8" difference in the measurements. I was told that is retty good. I also wanted to check my jig with the water level before to starting the right ing panel... it hasn't moved since we locked it down, prior to starting ssembly on the let panel. Here are a few photos. -------- ark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=289365#289365 ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050408_768x576_159.jpg ttp://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050410_768x576_118.jpg ttp://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050412_768x576_128.jpg ttp://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050413_768x576_133.jpg ttp://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050415_768x576_123.jpg -======================== ======================== =========== -= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum - -= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse -= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription, -= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, -= Photoshare, and much much more: - -= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - -= Same great content also available via the Web Forums! - -= --> http://forums.matronics.com - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - List Contribution Web Site - -= Thank you for your generous support! -= -Matt Dralle, List Admin. -= --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution -======================== ======================== =========== ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 04:51:04 AM PST US From: "Jack" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Construction Photos Great shots and comments Kevin, thank you! Jack DSM Hi - I haven't been able to get ahold of the (sainted) west coast piet webmaster to post construction photos of NX899KP. The Girl taught me how to post photos on a google blog. Here's the link: http://nx899kp.blogspot.com/ I'll continue to add pictures as I can. If I have any notes I put them as comments. Best regards, Kevin Purtee NX899KP Austin/Georgetown Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=289353#289353 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 04:57:21 AM PST US From: "Jack" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: First Major Milestone I agree, great milestone Mark, it get better every day! Jack DSM Do not archive I'm not sure if this is actually a milestone, but I'm feeling pretty good about it. I took my left wing panel off the jig today and trial fit the aileron. Today was one of the first really nice days we have had in a long time, so I took my wing panel outside and set it on saw horses so I could look it over in the sun light. It all looks good so far. I still need to install control pulleys and LE sheeting, but the framework is complete. We measured the dimensions (front to rear spar - tip to root) and found that there is less than 1/8" difference in the measurements. I was told that is pretty good. I also wanted to check my jig with the water level before to starting the right wing panel... it hasn't moved since we locked it down, prior to starting assembly on the let panel. Here are a few photos. -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=289365#289365 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050408_768x576_159.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050410_768x576_118.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050412_768x576_128.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050413_768x576_133.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050415_768x576_123.jpg ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:47:22 AM PST US From: Jim Markle Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: First Major Milestone It IS a milestone....you SHOULD feel pretty good about it....wow, this is great! I got to spend the nice weather yesterday spreading gravel on my (800'+) driveway and trying to get a 1951 tractor running (no spark...still!). Looks like YOU had a LOT more fun!!! Nice work Mark! -----Original Message----- >From: K5YAC >Sent: Mar 5, 2010 10:41 PM >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Pietenpol-List: First Major Milestone > > >I'm not sure if this is actually a milestone, but I'm feeling pretty good about it. I took my left wing panel off the jig today and trial fit the aileron. Today was one of the first really nice days we have had in a long time, so I took my wing panel outside and set it on saw horses so I could look it over in the sun light. It all looks good so far. I still need to install control pulleys and LE sheeting, but the framework is complete. > >We measured the dimensions (front to rear spar - tip to root) and found that there is less than 1/8" difference in the measurements. I was told that is pretty good. > >I also wanted to check my jig with the water level before to starting the right wing panel... it hasn't moved since we locked it down, prior to starting assembly on the let panel. > >Here are a few photos. > >-------- >Mark - working on wings > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=289365#289365 > > >Attachments: > >http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050408_768x576_159.jpg >http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050410_768x576_118.jpg >http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050412_768x576_128.jpg >http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050413_768x576_133.jpg >http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050415_768x576_123.jpg > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:15:54 AM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: First Major Milestone Nice pics, Mark, thanks! I am still a big fan of your wing building jig. That'll work great for me and my cramped work area. How about posting some more in-process pics? Gary Boothe Cool, CA Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion Tail done, Fuselage on gear 18 ribs done -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of K5YAC Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 8:41 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: First Major Milestone I'm not sure if this is actually a milestone, but I'm feeling pretty good about it. I took my left wing panel off the jig today and trial fit the aileron. Today was one of the first really nice days we have had in a long time, so I took my wing panel outside and set it on saw horses so I could look it over in the sun light. It all looks good so far. I still need to install control pulleys and LE sheeting, but the framework is complete. We measured the dimensions (front to rear spar - tip to root) and found that there is less than 1/8" difference in the measurements. I was told that is pretty good. I also wanted to check my jig with the water level before to starting the right wing panel... it hasn't moved since we locked it down, prior to starting assembly on the let panel. Here are a few photos. -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=289365#289365 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050408_768x576_159.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050410_768x576_118.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050412_768x576_128.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050413_768x576_133.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050415_768x576_123.jpg ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:46:01 AM PST US From: Tim Willis Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: First Major Milestone Mark, Thanks for the pix. It all looks great. If you have them, I would like some more details, please. I'd like to see pix-- both a side view and a top view of the wing tip bow and the curved aileron tip, and how they line up and look together. Perhaps your build is not quite there yet-- the tips. In any event, I continue to have trouble visualizing exactly how that goes together. I should have taken a stepladder and a closeup lens to Brodhead in 2006 or 2008. Thanks, Tim in central TX -----Original Message----- >From: K5YAC >Sent: Mar 5, 2010 10:41 PM >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Pietenpol-List: First Major Milestone > > >I'm not sure if this is actually a milestone, but I'm feeling pretty good about it. I took my left wing panel off the jig today and trial fit the aileron. Today was one of the first really nice days we have had in a long time, so I took my wing panel outside and set it on saw horses so I could look it over in the sun light. It all looks good so far. I still need to install control pulleys and LE sheeting, but the framework is complete. > >We measured the dimensions (front to rear spar - tip to root) and found that there is less than 1/8" difference in the measurements. I was told that is pretty good. > >I also wanted to check my jig with the water level before to starting the right wing panel... it hasn't moved since we locked it down, prior to starting assembly on the let panel. > >Here are a few photos. > >-------- >Mark - working on wings > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=289365#289365 > > >Attachments: > >http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050408_768x576_159.jpg >http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050410_768x576_118.jpg >http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050412_768x576_128.jpg >http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050413_768x576_133.jpg >http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3050415_768x576_123.jpg > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:42:54 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: First Major Milestone From: "K5YAC" Thanks for the nice comments fellas. For those that want to see most of my build photos... you can go to my logbook site (posted below in my signature). I've tried to keep it current and relevant to the project, but there are a few "shop" entries that pertain to equipment and such. For those that may not be familiar with mykitlog.com, just click on the link below and when you get to my main page click the ALL link on the right side menu. That will display all of my entries since I've started my project and you can quickly browse for titles and which ones have photos. I do have larger photos available for anyone that is interested in specific details. Perhaps Chris would let me post some of my photos on West Coast Piet? Maybe I'll shoot him a note tonight. Gary, I got the idea for the vertical wing jig from Tony Bingelis' "Sportplane Construction Techniques" (pg. 57). It was super easy to build, and if you have a solid work bench to clamp them to (see my photo above), you won't have to anchor them to the ceiling. I used a water level and shims to get mine leveled up and it is working great. Even if space isn't an issue, I think the vertical configuration allows better access to the entire wing panel. I could be wrong... won't know until I try the other methods. Time to make sawdust! -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=289379#289379 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 10:11:32 AM PST US From: William Colleran Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wood I just ordered my plans for my pietenpol. Who do most of you order your wood from? ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 01:25:56 PM PST US From: "Jack Phillips" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Wood I got most of mine from Wicks Aircraft Supply http://www.wicksaircraft.com/ , and some from Aircraft Spruce and Specialty http://www.aircraftspruce.com/ Jack Phillips NX899JP Raleigh, NC -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of William Colleran Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2010 1:07 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wood I just ordered my plans for my pietenpol. Who do most of you order your wood from? ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 03:12:50 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Cool altimeter on ebay From: helspersew@aol.com Hi Gang, For anyone interested, there is an antique 4-1/4" "Height" gauge currently on Ebay. Item # 270538280371. Price is currently $212.00. Not too bad so far. I paid a lot more for mine. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 04:06:54 PM PST US From: airlion Subject: Pietenpol-List: dimple tape I am flying my hours off and after 5 hours I am really impressed on how my ship handles. It really likes 85 mph at 2500rpm. and will easily go to 95 RPM at 2900 rpm. On final approach to landing I am trying to get used the sink rate for landing. I like to land power off like I was taught., but i FIND THAT IS NOT POSSIBLE. I have been reading about dimple tape as a somewhat solution. Have any of you experienced pietenpollers tried this and does it work? Thanks guys, Gardiner Mason ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 04:23:10 PM PST US From: Ben Charvet Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: dimple tape I too am flying off my hours. Today was my first test of the $3 elevator trim system I installed yesterday. Prior to this I was holding a lot of back pressure for level flight. I also added 1/2 inch of offset to the rudder. Now I can fly hands off for a few seconds while fumbling around changing frequencies, etc. Today was pancake EAA pancake breakfast day for my chapter. When it came time to land the wind was blowing 8 kts right down the paved runway. I basically flew it right down to the pavement at 65 mph and about 1000 rpm. In spite of the large audience by carrying a little power I was able to do a nice wheel landing that was heard more than felt, pulled the throttle, pushed the stick forward, and still only rolled out about 150 ft. My flight advisor suggested wheel landings, and I think they are best done with a little power on. Only 19 hours to go! Ben Charvet Mims Fl On 3/6/2010 7:04 PM, airlion wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: airlion > > I am flying my hours off and after 5 hours I am really impressed on how my ship handles. It really likes 85 mph at 2500rpm. and will easily go to 95 RPM at 2900 rpm. On final approach to landing I am trying to get used the sink rate for landing. I like to land power off like I was taught., but i FIND THAT IS NOT POSSIBLE. I have been reading about dimple tape as a somewhat solution. Have any of you experienced pietenpollers tried this and does it work? Thanks guys, Gardiner Mason > > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 04:35:45 PM PST US From: shad bell Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Just Hello Big Jim knows what engine your supposed to put on a Pietenpol, ha ha ha (That's a Corvair if you didn't know) Shad PS looking forward to getting my ohio piet fly-in planning started, June 19th I think I said, Whatever the day before father's day is. ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 04:46:35 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Wood From: "K5YAC" I got mine from Aircraft Spruce. Aside from one minor, and one not so minor problem, the material is great. For the record (for those that weren't reading the mail a few months ago), Aircraft Spruce quickly took care of both issues. -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=289423#289423 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 04:58:13 PM PST US From: Dan Yocum Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Wood If you're close to Madison, WI, check out McCormick's Lumber. On 03/06/2010 12:06 PM, William Colleran wrote: > > > I just ordered my plans for my pietenpol. Who do most of you order your > wood from? > > -- Dan Yocum Fermilab 630.840.6509 yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 04:58:47 PM PST US From: Dan Yocum Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Wood Oh, and I recently heard a rumor that The Hardwood Connection in Sycamore, IL carries aircraft grade spruce. Dan On 03/06/2010 12:06 PM, William Colleran wrote: > > > I just ordered my plans for my pietenpol. Who do most of you order your > wood from? > > -- Dan Yocum Fermilab 630.840.6509 yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 05:46:23 PM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Wood William, Those who have been on this list for a while know that I would be remiss if I did not point out that you are not locked in to using A/C Spruce. I have Hemlock in my tail, and the rest is Poplar, including the ribs. All was bought at a local hardwood supplier for under $300. Gary Boothe Cool, CA Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion Tail done, Fuselage on gear 18 ribs done -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of William Colleran Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2010 10:07 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Wood I just ordered my plans for my pietenpol. Who do most of you order your wood from? ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 06:21:16 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Coverall Comps From: "mr-fix-all" All, I submit for your critique 2 comps I have created. These can be resized and placed almost anywhere. enjoy -------- "Be who you are and say what you think, those that mind don't matter, and those that matter don't mind" Dr. Seuss Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=289433#289433 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/mobil_150.pdf http://forums.matronics.com//files/piet2_139.pdf ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 06:43:11 PM PST US From: Tim Willis Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Coverall Comps The Pietenpol coverall graphic is very appealing to me. I love the "pulled from an angel" look of the wings and the "circus" look of the script. I'd like to hear more from others. Do I understand that a fellow could iron this on his plane in one version, and on his coveralls in another, adjusting for size? Are these to be vinyl or what? Thanks, Tim in central TX -----Original Message----- >From: mr-fix-all >Sent: Mar 6, 2010 8:19 PM >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Coverall Comps > > >All, > >I submit for your critique 2 comps I have created. >These can be resized and placed almost anywhere. > > >enjoy > >-------- >"Be who you are and say what you think, those that mind don't matter, and those that matter don't mind" Dr. Seuss > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=289433#289433 > > >Attachments: > >http://forums.matronics.com//files/mobil_150.pdf >http://forums.matronics.com//files/piet2_139.pdf > > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 06:45:26 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: dimple tape From: "Pieti Lowell" Ben, I'm waiting with baited breath, to hear the flying data on the 612 wings that are in the works. The glide is not anyway near the glide you are experiencing , nor the sink rate as fast. Pieti Lowell ] I am flying my hours off and after 5 hours I am really impressed on how my ship handles. It really likes 85 mph at 2500rpm. and will easily go to 95 RPM at 2900 rpm. On final approach to landing I am trying to get used the sink rate for landing. I like to land power off like I was taught., but i FIND THAT IS NOT POSSIBLE. I have been reading about dimple tape as a somewhat solution. Have any of you experienced pietenpollers tried this and does it work? Thanks guys, Gardiner Mason [/quote][/quote] Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=289437#289437 ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 07:05:57 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Coverall Comps From: "mr-fix-all" It is possible that you could have these made into a heat transfer, these are possible silkscreenings for the coveralls that have been discussed here. With some research I could silk screen this onto a fabric swatch that could be affixed to your finished craft. I will be posting other comps as I complete them. Jake -------- "Be who you are and say what you think, those that mind don't matter, and those that matter don't mind" Dr. Seuss Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=289442#289442 ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 07:14:34 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Coverall Comps From: "VanDy" i would love to have 2 of each that could be made into t-shirts! heat transfer or silkscreen do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=289443#289443 ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 07:27:59 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Coverall Comps From: "mr-fix-all" Here is my 3rd spin Jake -------- "Be who you are and say what you think, those that mind don't matter, and those that matter don't mind" Dr. Seuss Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=289447#289447 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/piet3_912.pdf ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 07:31:05 PM PST US From: "Clif Dawson" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Wood If you down a ways on this page you will see a chart of wood strength and weight; http://clifdawson.ca/Tools_and_Tips.html My plane is entirely Western Hemlock with Fir Landing Gear and Cabanes. I have found 1" wide Fir planks for my Spars. Clif The voyage of discovery is not in seeking new landscapes, but in having new eyes. -Marcel Proust - > William, you are not locked in to using A/C Spruce. I have > Hemlock in my tail, and the rest is Poplar, including the ribs. All was > bought at a local hardwood supplier for under $300. > > Gary Boothe ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 09:39:59 PM PST US From: Mike Townsley Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Wood Cliff, Where did you go to find that wood? Thanks Mike Townsley Clif Dawson wrote: > > If you down a ways on this page you will see a chart > of wood strength and weight; > > http://clifdawson.ca/Tools_and_Tips.html > > My plane is entirely Western Hemlock with Fir Landing > Gear and Cabanes. I have found 1" wide Fir planks for my > Spars. > > Clif > > The voyage of discovery is not in seeking new landscapes, but in > having new eyes. > -Marcel Proust - > > >> William, > you are not locked in to using A/C Spruce. I have >> Hemlock in my tail, and the rest is Poplar, including the ribs. All >> was bought at a local hardwood supplier for under $300. >> >> Gary Boothe > > ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 11:42:53 PM PST US From: "Clif Dawson" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Wood The longerons and wing rib caps are carefully chosen trim material from lumber yards. I was extremely picky so I made regular rounds to five yards. The spar material is very unusual and only comes in 5" and 6" widths. I found it in a higher end place that carries better materials usually. The longerons are 1 1/16" square stuff that is used as a backing when building up fancy, complicated moldings. Clif > > Cliff, > Where did you go to find that wood? > Thanks > Mike Townsley ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.