---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 03/22/10: 57 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:53 AM - Re: just another idea and concept to ponder (H RULE) 2. 05:04 AM - Re: just another idea and concept to ponder (John Recine) 3. 05:04 AM - Fuselage Update (Jack) 4. 06:18 AM - Re: Fuselage Update (helspersew@aol.com) 5. 06:42 AM - A-65 cost (chase143(at)aol.com) 6. 07:17 AM - Re: A-65 cost (taildrags) 7. 08:19 AM - Re: Re: GN-1 cabane length (bryan green) 8. 09:20 AM - Re: just another idea and concept to ponder (H RULE) 9. 09:21 AM - Re: Fuselage Update (Jack Phillips) 10. 09:21 AM - for the absolute best source of Pietenpol photos anywhere (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation]) 11. 09:21 AM - Re: Fuselage Update (Pastor Mike Townsley) 12. 09:23 AM - Re: just another idea and concept to ponder (Jim Ash) 13. 09:24 AM - phase one (Douwe Blumberg) 14. 09:24 AM - Re: A-65 cost (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation]) 15. 09:45 AM - Re: Phase I complete for 6926J (Skip Gadd) 16. 09:45 AM - Re: just another idea and concept to ponder (Dan Yocum) 17. 09:45 AM - Re: Fuselage Update (Rick Holland) 18. 09:45 AM - Re: A-65 cost (Jim Ash) 19. 09:45 AM - Re: A-65 cost (John Hofmann) 20. 09:45 AM - Re: Fuselage Update (taildrags) 21. 09:46 AM - Re: A-65 cost (Jack Phillips) 22. 09:46 AM - Re: A-65 cost (Gerry Holland) 23. 10:14 AM - Re: A-65 cost (Michael Perez) 24. 10:15 AM - Re: A-65 cost (Steve Ruse) 25. 10:38 AM - Re: A-65 cost (chase143(at)aol.com) 26. 10:48 AM - Re: Fuselage Update (Jim) 27. 10:51 AM - Re: Fuselage Update (K5YAC) 28. 10:52 AM - Re: A-65 cost (Mike King) 29. 11:07 AM - Re: just another idea and concept to ponder (K5YAC) 30. 11:12 AM - Re: Phase I complete for 6926J (Rick Holland) 31. 11:46 AM - Re: Re: A-65 cost - Engine TBO & EAA article (Steve Ruse) 32. 12:06 PM - Re: Re: A-65 cost - Engine TBO & EAA article (Doug Dever) 33. 12:41 PM - Re: Re: just another idea and concept to ponder (AMsafetyC@aol.com) 34. 12:49 PM - Re: just another idea and concept to ponder (AMsafetyC@aol.com) 35. 12:58 PM - Re: Fuselage Update (Bill Church) 36. 01:24 PM - Re: Re: A-65 cost - Engine TBO & EAA article (Steve Ruse) 37. 01:28 PM - Re: Re: Fuselage Update (Rick Holland) 38. 01:30 PM - Re: Re: A-65 cost - Engine TBO & EAA article (Rick Holland) 39. 01:35 PM - Re: just another idea and concept to ponder (K5YAC) 40. 01:38 PM - Re: Fuselage Update (Bill Church) 41. 01:52 PM - Re: A-65 cost (walt) 42. 01:53 PM - Re: Re: Fuselage Update (brian.e.jardine@l-3com.com) 43. 02:30 PM - What size prop (jeff wilson) 44. 02:35 PM - Re: What size prop (Ben Charvet) 45. 02:36 PM - Re: just another idea and concept to ponder (walt) 46. 02:37 PM - Re: Re: Fuselage Update (walt) 47. 03:37 PM - Re: just another idea and concept to ponder (Ben Charvet) 48. 04:41 PM - Re: Re: Fuselage Update (airlion) 49. 05:57 PM - Re: Re: Fuselage Update (Jack) 50. 06:06 PM - intercom (Douwe Blumberg) 51. 06:09 PM - Instrument Template (Jack) 52. 06:29 PM - Re: intercom (Jeff Boatright) 53. 07:54 PM - Re: What size prop (Tim Willis) 54. 08:04 PM - Re: What size prop (Jeff Boatright) 55. 08:07 PM - Re: What size prop (gcardinal) 56. 08:13 PM - Re: What size prop (Ryan Mueller) 57. 08:24 PM - Re: What size prop (Tim Willis) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:53:40 AM PST US From: H RULE Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder How bout a metal fuselage and wood wings or perhaps metal wings as well.Eac h man would only have to spend a max 1/2 hour at a time,not the whole weeke nd.I have seen pictures on this web page of some pretty nice metal PIETS.I like the idea of making Brodhead a whole week as well.Whether made out of w ood or metal,the project could span a few years of Brodhead get togethers.J ust throwing ideas out here.-=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A_____________________________ ___=0AFrom: Dick N =0ATo: pietenpol-list@matronics .com=0ASent: Mon, March 22, 2010 12:12:35 AM=0ASubject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder=0A=0A=0ANo, that couldn't be done. - Not to a completed ship if that's what you are suggesting.- A bare fu selage would take 6 days alone.- Just think of the work involved in the w ings.- =0ADick N.=0A----- Original Message ----- =0A>From: H RULE =0A>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com =0A>Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 10:12 PM=0A> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder=0A>=0A >=0A>another question along the same lines would be" could a PIET be built by as many builders as it would take over the Brodhead weekend?"Much the sa me way as they build the aluminum stol aircraft, CH701,at the Sun N Fun wee kend.Then auction or raffle it off at the end of the weekend for some lucky person to take home.=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A________________________________=0AFrom : Jim Markle =0A>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.co m=0A>Sent: Sun, March 21, 2010 10:47:10 PM=0A>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder=0A>=0A>--> Pietenpol-List message p osted by: Jim Markle =0A>=0A>VERY cool idea.- Logistics will be the challenge but I'm definitely in!=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>----- Original Message-----=0A>=0A>From: AMsafetyC@aol.com=0A>=0A>Sent: Mar 19, 2 010 7:00 PM=0A>=0A>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0A>=0A>Subject: Pietenp ol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A >=0A>=0A>Hello good people.....=0A>=0A>A new idea and concept for the group to ponder.=0A>=0A>As we all know and have recognized we all share a common bond as fellow =0A>lovers of the blue, aviators, builders connected throug h the design genius of =0A>Bernard Pietenpol and his flying contraption the aeroplane. We as a collection =0A>of builders have at our disposal some, m any and all of the requisite skill =0A>levels to construct such a machine w ith little assistance or intervention from =0A>the outside world.=0A>=0A>Th e there are those who would love to join our ranks but may be lacking in =0A>skills, equipment and time to turn their dream into a reality. From =0A >prints to Piet if you will. We know that everyone has a skill set that is good =0A>in some areas and not so good in others. Knowing these basic tenan ts I am =0A>curious as to who or what builders would welcome the talents of other builders =0A>equipped with tools and skills would be interested in h aving a group of builders =0A>show up at their hanger, barn, basement or ga rage for a weekend build utilizing =0A>all the skills of the people interes ted in lending a hand to accomplish a number =0A>of tasks to get the projec t going bring the tools to get the certain aspects =0A>completed. Woodworke rs, metal workers, mechanical workers and the like showing =0A>up to get a build from a stalled stage to a more accomplished state of being a =0A>Piet enpol.=0A>=0A>I am speaking about two groups of people, those with the skil ls and =0A>resources capable of committing to a 2 or 3 day weekend to parti cipate in =0A>building another Piet as one group. The other group would be a builder or would =0A>be builder who in need of assistance in advancing th eir project to a next or =0A>greater level of completion.=0A>=0A>This again is but another concept for consideration. For example I have =0A>both tool s not all that I need but certainly more than other that are portable, =0A> a trailer to transport them and no skills to speak of. I also have lodging as in =0A>a popup/tent camper to bring to a build site for a few days to he lp another =0A>builder. There are others with tools and skills that may als o be portable. =0A>=0A>=0A>Through this cooperative of a half dozen or more people who would be =0A>willing to share their time and expertise to get a nother build moving and =0A>another builder to a next level of completion. =0A>=0A>I am wonder how many of us would be willing to pitch in for a week end to =0A>help and how many would be interested in receiving those willing to help. =0A>=0A>Before I go any further with this concept it would be nic e to know if there =0A>is any interest at all in helping or being helped. =0A>=0A>Just in case you were wondering, I have all of my tools marked for =0A>identification purposes. I know how this works.=0A>=0A>Helpers bring to ols and skills and resources as needed helped =0A>provide a keg on tap burg ers and a place for a fire and I think we are cooking =0A>with gas! =0A>=0A >What say you?=0A>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?sp; - - - - // forums.matronics.com/" target=_blank>http://forums.matronics.com=0A>=0A> =0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-Li st">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List=0A>href="http://for ums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com=0A>href="http://www.matron =========== ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:04:13 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder From: "John Recine" VmFsdWFibGUgY29tbWVudHMgdGhhbmtzDQoNCkFjdHVhbGx5IG5vdCB0YWxraW5nIGFib3V0IGEg Y29tcGxldGUgc2hpcCBhbmQgbm90IGF0IEJyb2RoZWFkLiANCg0KSnVzdCBhdCBhIGJ1aWxkZXJz IGxvY2F0aW9uIGxvb2tpbmcgZm9yIGEgd2Vla2VuZCBvZiBpbnRlbnNlIGJ1aWxkaW5nIGJ5IGEg 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IG9mIHVzIHdvdWxkIGJlIHdpbGxpbmcgdG8gcGl0Y2ggaW4gZm9yIGEgd2VlayBlbmQgdG8gDQog IGhlbHAgYW5kIGhvdyBtYW55IHdvdWxkIGJlIGludGVyZXN0ZWQgaW4gcmVjZWl2aW5nIHRob3Nl IHdpbGxpbmcgdG8gaGVscC4gDQoNCiAgQmVmb3JlIEkgZ28gYW55IGZ1cnRoZXIgd2l0aCB0aGlz IGNvbmNlcHQgaXQgd291bGQgYmUgbmljZSB0byBrbm93IGlmIHRoZXJlIA0KICBpcyBhbnkgaW50 ZXJlc3QgYXQgYWxsIGluIGhlbHBpbmcgb3IgYmVpbmcgaGVscGVkLg0KDQogIEp1c3QgaW4gY2Fz ZSB5b3Ugd2VyZSB3b25kZXJpbmcsIEkgaGF2ZSBhbGwgb2YgbXkgdG9vbHMgbWFya2VkIGZvciAN CiAgaWRlbnRpZmljYXRpb24gcHVycG9zZXMuIEkga25vdyBob3cgdGhpcyB3b3Jrcy4NCg0KICBI ZWxwZXJzIGJyaW5nIHRvb2xzIGFuZCBza2lsbHMgYW5kIHJlc291cmNlcyBhcyBuZWVkZWQgaGVs cGVkIA0KICBwcm92aWRlIGEga2VnIG9uIHRhcCBidXJnZXJzIGFuZCBhIHBsYWNlIGZvciBhIGZp cmUgYW5kIEkgdGhpbmsgd2UgYXJlIGNvb2tpbmcgDQogIHdpdGggZ2FzISANCg0KICBXaGF0IHNh eSB5b3U/DQogIGh0dHA6Ly93d3cubWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbS9OYXZpZ2F0b3I/c3A7ICAgICAgICAg Ly9mb3J1bXMubWF0cm9uaWNzLmNvbS8iIHRhcmdldD1fYmxhbms+aHR0cDovL2ZvcnVtcy5tYXRy b25pY3MuY29tDQoNCg0KDQoNCg0KDQoNCg= ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:04:16 AM PST US From: "Jack" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuselage Update Fuselage is going well. I updated my site with some more photos. http://www.textors.com/PietProject.html Jack DSM www.textors.com ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:18:46 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuselage Update From: helspersew@aol.com Jack, You should be very proud of your work. Very nice websight. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. NX929DH -----Original Message----- From: Jack Sent: Mon, Mar 22, 2010 6:03 am Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuselage Update Fuselage is going well. I updated my site with some more photos. http:// www.textors.com/PietProject.html Jack DSM www.textors.com ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:42:00 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost From: "chase143(at)aol.com" A friend offered me an A-65, with spare mags, carburetor, pieces as required. Describes it in good shape, running recently, replaced for larger engine. How does $1800 sound? I know there can be a big disparity, but I have no recent price experience. I would probably overhaul anyway based on what I am able to do myself and/or cost to have someone else do it if required. Any recent cost experiences? Thanks, Steve -------- Steve www.mypiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291233#291233 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:17:28 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: A-65 cost From: "taildrags" Steve; that sounds like a piece of junk and you should run away as fast as you can. Dangerous, unreliable. Give me your friend's name and phone number so I can buy it and keep you out of trouble ;o) Seriously, you should jump on it. I just sold the A65 that came out of 41CC for a good deal more than that, so I think you'll be getting a great deal. Note the recent emails from Walt and others on how nice these old Continentals are. -------- Oscar Zuniga San Antonio, TX Air Camper NX41CC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291234#291234 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:19:05 AM PST US From: bryan green Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: GN-1 cabane length The cabanes are 23.5 inches hole center to center and the picture and post should be in the archives Jon. do not archive coxwelljon wrote: > > > luther b green wrote: > >> My cabanes need rebuilding but are measurable and I will do that and post >> results today sometime. The picture of mine in flight looks level to me so I >> will keep the length to start with. I'll post the picture also so you guys >> can take a look. >> Bryan Green >> Elgin SC >> GN-1 rebuilding >> --- >> > > > Thanks Bryan, I would like to know the lengths and see a picture. > > Skip, Thanks for that information as well. It sounds like I am in the ball park. Still haven't calculated what 1" equates to on the Piet for comparison but will do it and post it. > > Jon Coxwell > > -------- > Jon Coxwell > GN-1 Builder > Recycle and preserve the planet > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291186#291186 > > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:20:59 AM PST US From: H RULE Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder Oh, I know you were not talking about Brodhead,that was just another idea I came up with ,piggy backing on your idea.=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A_ _______________________________=0AFrom: John Recine =0AT o: Pietenpol builders Board =0ASent: Mon, Mar ch 22, 2010 6:51:49 AM=0ASubject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder=0A=0AValuable comments thanks=0A=0AActually not talking about a complete ship and not at Brodhead. =0A=0AJust at a builders locatio n looking for a weekend of intense building by a group able and capable of working on everything in need of help to advance the project. =0A=0AAll bas ed on the builders wants,needs,schedule and raw materials/parts on hand. =0A=0AWith enough bench space,clamps, jigging and a saw man it is possible to frame out the fuse and tail feathers in a weekend. =0A=0AI am not advoca ting we do this tomorrow but if there were interested parties maybe in 6 mo nth or so=0A=0AJohn =0ASent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry=0A_________ _______________________=0A=0AFrom: "Dick N" =0ADa te: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 23:12:35 -0500=0ATo: =0A Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder=0A=0AN o, that couldn't be done.=C2- Not to a completed ship if that's what you are suggesting.=C2- A bare fuselage would take 6 days alone.=C2- Just t hink of the work involved in the wings.=C2- =0ADick N.=0A----- Original M essage ----- =0A>From: H RULE =0A>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com =0A>Sent : Sunday, March 21, 2010 10:12 PM=0A>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just anot her idea and concept to ponder=0A>=0A>=0A>another question along the same l ines would be" could a PIET be built by as many builders as it would take o ver the Brodhead weekend?"Much the same way as they build the aluminum stol aircraft, CH701,at the Sun N Fun weekend.Then auction or raffle it off at the end of the weekend for some lucky person to take home.=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A__ ______________________________=0AFrom: Jim Markle =0A>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0A>Sent: Sun, March 21, 2010 10:47:1 0 PM=0A>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponde pring.com>=0A>=0A>VERY cool idea.=C2- Logistics will be the challenge but I'm definitely in!=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>-----Original Message-----=0A>=0A>From: AMsafetyC@aol.com=0A>=0A>Sent: Mar 19, 2010 7:00 PM=0A>=0A>To: pietenpol-li st@matronics.com=0A>=0A>Subject: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and conc ept to ponder=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>Hello good people.....=0A> =0A>A new idea and concept for the group to ponder.=0A>=0A>As we all know a nd have recognized we all share a common bond as fellow =0A>lovers of the b lue, aviators, builders connected through the design genius of =0A>Bernard Pietenpol and his flying contraption the aeroplane. We as a collection =0A> of builders have at our disposal some, many and all of the requisite skill =0A>levels to construct such a machine with little assistance or interventi on from =0A>the outside world.=0A>=0A>The there are those who would love to join our ranks but may be lacking in =0A>skills, equipment and time to tur n their dream into a reality. From =0A>prints to Piet if you will. We know that everyone has a skill set that is good =0A>in some areas and not so goo d in others. Knowing these basic tenants I am =0A>curious as to who or what builders would welcome the talents of other builders =0A>equipped with too ls and skills would be interested in having a group of builders =0A>show up at their hanger, barn, basement or garage for a weekend build utilizing =0A>all the skills of the people interested in lending a hand to accomplish a number =0A>of tasks to get the project going bring the tools to get the certain aspects =0A>completed. Woodworkers, metal workers, mechanical worke rs and the like showing =0A>up to get a build from a stalled stage to a mor e accomplished state of being a =0A>Pietenpol.=0A>=0A>I am speaking about t wo groups of people, those with the skills and =0A>resources capable of com mitting to a 2 or 3 day weekend to participate in =0A>building another Piet as one group. The other group would be a builder or would =0A>be builder w ho in need of assistance in advancing their project to a next or =0A>greate r level of completion.=0A>=0A>This again is but another concept for conside ration. For example I have =0A>both tools not all that I need but certainly more than other that are portable, =0A>a trailer to transport them and no skills to speak of. I also have lodging as in =0A>a popup/tent camper to br ing to a build site for a few days to help another =0A>builder. There are o thers with tools and skills that may also be portable. =0A>=0A>=0A>Through this cooperative of a half dozen or more people who would be =0A>willing to share their time and expertise to get another build moving and =0A>another builder to a next level of completion.=0A>=0A>I am wonder how many of us w ould be willing to pitch in for a week end to =0A>help and how many would b e interested in receiving those willing to help. =0A>=0A>Before I go any fu rther with this concept it would be nice to know if there =0A>is any intere st at all in helping or being helped.=0A>=0A>Just in case you were wonderin g, I have all of my tools marked for =0A>identification purposes. I know ho w this works.=0A>=0A>Helpers bring tools and skills and resources as needed helped =0A>provide a keg on tap burgers and a place for a fire and I think we are cooking =0A>with gas! =0A>=0A>What say you?=0A>http://www.matronics .com/Navigator?sp; =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- //forums.matronics.com/" tar get=_blank>http://forums.matronics.com=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>=0A>href= "http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics.co m/Navigator?Pietenpol-List=0A>href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://f orums.matronics.com=0A>href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http: ====0A=0A=C2=C2=B7=BA~=B0=C3=AD=C2=B2,=C3=9Eg( =93=C5-=C3=93M4=C3=93G=C3=9Aq=C3=BC=C2=A2=C3=C3=A2z=C2=B9=C3=9E=C3=81 =C3=8A.=C2=AE'=C2=AB8^>'=C2=ADzzh=9D=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B4I=C5=A1=C5-Qh =C2=AE=C3=A9R=C3=87=C2=AD=C3=A3=C2=B6=C2=BA'=B0=C3=8B=C5- =C3=8BEy=C2=ABn=C2=AD=C3=AB j=C3=B8=C2-j=C3=9A+=C2=B6-=C3=AB=C2 =A3=C3=98^=84=A2=C2=A9=C3=B2.+-=C2=BA=C3=98=C2=A5=C5-=C3=98=C5=BE=C2 =B2=C3=8B=C5=93=C2=AB=C5-=C3=8BT=C5=B8=C3=B4=C2=AEn=C3=87+=C5- =BAb=C2=A2p=C2=AD=C3=88b=C2=BD=C3=A4=C5=BEj=C2=B7!=C5=92'=93 -=EF=BD=C3=AC6=C2=B2=C2=BA0=C2=B1=C3-=C2=A1j=C3=91@C=C3=A1=C2=A2 =C3=9A,=C2=C3=9Ejwf=C2=B9=C3=88f=C2=B9=C3=88f=C2=A2=C2=B7=EF =BD=C2=A8ky=C3=B1=C2=B6=C3=9A=C30=84=A2=C2=ABk=C2=A2x=C5=93=C2=B1=C3 =8A&=C3=BC=C3'=C2=AF=C5-=C2=AD=C2=A2=C2=B3=C3=A2z=C3=97=C2=A7=C2 =B0K=C5-=C3=8Ba=C2=B6=C3=9A=C30=84=A2=C2=ABk=C2=A2x=C5=93=C2=B1 =C3=8A&=C3=BC=C3'=C2=AF=C5-=C2=AD=C2=A2=C2=B3=C3=A2z=C3=97=C2=A7=C2 =B0K=C5-=C3=8Bl4N4=82=AC=99X@E9L=C5=A1=84=A2=C3=A8+y=C2 =AB\=C2=A2{^=C5=BE=C3'=C2=A5=C2=B2-=C2=AFj)ZnW=C2=AF=B0=C2 =ABayg=BA=C5-=C3=AE=C5=A1j=C3=9E|m=C2=B6=C5=B8=C3~=C5-=C3=AE =C5=A1=C3=89=C5=A1=C2=B6=C2=BA'=B0=C3=8B=C2=A2hm=C2=B6=C5=B8=C3~ =C5-=C3=AE=C5=A1=C3=89=C5=A1=C2=B6=C2=BA'=B0=C3=8B=C2=A2o=C3=9A=C3 =A2=C2=B2=C3=90=C2=A8=C5=BE=C3=9A=C3=A2n=C3=ABb=C2=A2u=C5=BEm(=C2=AD|=C3=A1 jy2=C2=A2=C3=A7=C3=A8=C2=AF*.=C2=AE=C2=A7z=C2=BA.=C2=B2=C3=8B=C2=A9=C2 =C5-=C3=AD ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 09:21:25 AM PST US From: "Jack Phillips" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Fuselage Update Looking very nice, Jack Jack Phillips NX899JP Raleigh, NC _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jack Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 7:04 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Fuselage Update Fuselage is going well. I updated my site with some more photos. http://www.textors.com/PietProject.html Jack DSM www.textors.com ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 09:21:28 AM PST US From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation]" Subject: Pietenpol-List: for the absolute best source of Pietenpol photos anywhere By far, without question, Chris Tracy's Westcoast Piet web site has the fin est selection of Pietenpol photos anywhere. http://www.westcoastpiet.com/pictures.htm You could spend hours here easily and you'll see more detail and more plane s than you would see in going to five Brodhead events. (but come anyway, please......espec ially if you wear high black dress socks up to your knees in sandals with suspenders, a plaid shirt, and wear a pith he lmet) ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 09:21:59 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuselage Update From: Pastor Mike Townsley Looks very nice Jack! Mike Townsley On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 6:03 AM, Jack wrote: > Fuselage is going well. I updated my site with some more photos. > http://www.textors.com/PietProject.html > > Jack > > DSM > > www.textors.com > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 09:23:29 AM PST US From: Jim Ash Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder Would you want to fly a plane built using the primary goal of 'Did it in a weekend?' I would have my hesitations. Are they still doing the build-it-during-the-week thing with the Zenair's at Sun 'n Fun? I remember them doing it back in the early 90's, but I thought the practice had been discontinued. The choreography for a Piet would be far different. A riveted joint is bang bang bang, ready to fly, right away, no glue to dry. Figuring out how to coordinate construction of assemblies while the glue is drying on others would be quite the challenge. I suppose you could have everybody build a rib (one glue pause) then assemble them all (second glue pause). I'd have to think about the glue pauses for a wood fuselage. Jim -----Original Message----- From: H RULE Sent: Mar 21, 2010 11:12 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder another question along the same lines would be" could a PIET be built by as many builders as it would take over the Brodhead weekend?"Much the same way as they build the aluminum stol aircraft, CH701,at the Sun N Fun weekend.Then auction or raffle it off at the end of the weekend for some lucky person to take home. From: Jim Markle Sent: Sun, March 21, 2010 10:47:10 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder VERY cool idea. Logistics will be the challenge but I'm definitely in! -----Original Message----- From: AMsafetyC@aol.com Sent: Mar 19, 2010 7:00 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder Hello good people..... A new idea and concept for the group to ponder. As we all know and have recognized we all share a common bond as fellow lovers of the blue, aviators, builders connected through the design genius of Bernard Pietenpol and his flying contraption the aeroplane. We as a collection of builders have at our disposal some, many and all of the requisite skill levels to construct such a machine with little assistance or intervention from the outside world. The there are those who would love to join our ranks but may be lacking in skills, equipment and time to turn their dream into a reality. From prints to Piet if you will. We know that everyone has a skill set that is good in some areas and not so good in others. Knowing these basic tenants I am curious as to who or what builders would welcome the talents of other builders equipped with tools and skills would be interested in having a group of builders show up at their hanger, barn, basement or garage for a weekend build utilizing all the skills of the people interested in lending a hand to accomplish a number of tasks to get the project going bring the tools to get the certain aspects completed. Woodworkers, metal workers, mechanical workers and the like showing up to get a build from a stalled stage to a more accomplished state of being a Pietenpol. I am speaking about two groups of people, those with the skills and resources capable of committing to a 2 or 3 day weekend to participate in building another Piet as one group. The other group would be a builder or would be builder who in need of assistance in advancing their project to a next or greater level of completion. This again is but another concept for consideration. For example I have both tools not all that I need but certainly more than other that are portable, a trailer to transport them and no skills to speak of. I also have lodging as in a popup/tent camper to bring to a build site for a few days to help another builder. There are others with tools and skills that may also be portable. Through this cooperative of a half dozen or more people who would be willing to share their time and expertise to get another build moving and another builder to a next level of completion. I am wonder how many of us would be willing to pitch in for a week end to help and how many would be interested in receiving those willing to help. Before I go any further with this concept it would be nice to know if there is any interest at all in helping or being helped. Just in case you were wondering, I have all of my tools marked for identification purposes. I know how this works. Helpers bring tools and skills and resources as needed helped provide a keg on tap burgers and a place for a fire and I think we are cooking with gas! What say you? http://forums.matronics.com
Subject: Pietenpol-List: phase one Congrats Skip! ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 09:24:55 AM PST US From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation]" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost BUY IT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You can't loose at that price. BUY IT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol- >list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of chase143(at)aol.com >Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 9:42 AM >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost > > > >A friend offered me an A-65, with spare mags, carburetor, pieces as >required. Describes it in good shape, running recently, replaced for >larger engine. How does $1800 sound? I know there can be a big >disparity, but I have no recent price experience. I would probably >overhaul anyway based on what I am able to do myself and/or cost to have >someone else do it if required. Any recent cost experiences? >Thanks, >Steve > >-------- >Steve >www.mypiet.com > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291233#291233 > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 09:45:00 AM PST US From: "Skip Gadd" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Phase I complete for 6926J Thanks Ben and Rick, Rick, Go for it! Actually the guy selling, Mike Frazier has a steel tube Piet project, so a guy might be able to get a home on a runway and the Piet project all at one shot. Skip > wow, only $149K for a nice house with a 40x40 > hanger at your airpark. I could almost afford to retire now to a place > that reasonable, and then we would have 3 Piets on the field. > > rick > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 09:45:21 AM PST US From: Dan Yocum Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder John, Sounds like an old-fashioned barn-raising where the whole community turned out to build a neighbor's barn. I like it! I don't know if I'd be able to get it past the head of the ways and means committee, though. *sigh* Reading more of the thread - if someone showed up with all the ribs and tips built, could the rest of the wing be done in a couple of days? Dan On 03/19/2010 07:00 PM, AMsafetyC@aol.com wrote: > Hello good people..... > A new idea and concept for the group to ponder. > As we all know and have recognized we all share a common bond as fellow > lovers of the blue, aviators, builders connected through the design > genius of Bernard Pietenpol and his flying contraption the aeroplane. We > as a collection of builders have at our disposal some, many and all of > the requisite skill levels to construct such a machine with little > assistance or intervention from the outside world. > The there are those who would love to join our ranks but may be lacking > in skills, equipment and time to turn their dream into a reality. From > prints to Piet if you will. We know that everyone has a skill set that > is good in some areas and not so good in others. Knowing these basic > tenants I am curious as to who or what builders would welcome the > talents of other builders equipped with tools and skills would be > interested in having a group of builders show up at their hanger, barn, > basement or garage for a weekend build utilizing all the skills of the > people interested in lending a hand to accomplish a number of tasks to > get the project going bring the tools to get the certain aspects > completed. Woodworkers, metal workers, mechanical workers and the like > showing up to get a build from a stalled stage to a more accomplished > state of being a Pietenpol. > I am speaking about two groups of people, those with the skills and > resources capable of committing to a 2 or 3 day weekend to participate > in building another Piet as one group. The other group would be a > builder or would be builder who in need of assistance in advancing their > project to a next or greater level of completion. > This again is but another concept for consideration. For example I have > both tools not all that I need but certainly more than other that are > portable, a trailer to transport them and no skills to speak of. I also > have lodging as in a popup/tent camper to bring to a build site for a > few days to help another builder. There are others with tools and skills > that may also be portable. > Through this cooperative of a half dozen or more people who would be > willing to share their time and expertise to get another build moving > and another builder to a next level of completion. > I am wonder how many of us would be willing to pitch in for a week end > to help and how many would be interested in receiving those willing to > help. > Before I go any further with this concept it would be nice to know if > there is any interest at all in helping or being helped. > Just in case you were wondering, I have all of my tools marked for > identification purposes. I know how this works. > Helpers bring tools and skills and resources as needed helped provide a > keg on tap burgers and a place for a fire and I think we are cooking > with gas! > What say you? > John > > * > > > * -- Dan Yocum Fermilab 630.840.6509 yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 09:45:26 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuselage Update From: Rick Holland Very nice, looks just like my workshop with two completed wings hanging overhead waiting for covering. Rick On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 5:03 AM, Jack wrote: > Fuselage is going well. I updated my site with some more photos. > http://www.textors.com/PietProject.html > > Jack > > DSM > > www.textors.com > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 09:45:27 AM PST US From: Jim Ash Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost I'd have two questions which could vary the value of it significantly. 1. Is it a certified engine with logs? A certified engine will obviously bring more than a non-certified engine, or one that once was certified but hasn't been maintained that way. IIRC, a certified engine in your Piet would also reduce the required time for your test flights from 40 hours down to 25. 2. What are the compression numbers on the cylinders? This is a standard benchmark of engine health. While it doesn't guarantee perfection, it's a good starting point. Neither of these are show-stoppers; they just change the numbers. Jim Ash -----Original Message----- >From: "chase143(at)aol.com" >Sent: Mar 22, 2010 9:41 AM >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost > > >A friend offered me an A-65, with spare mags, carburetor, pieces as required. Describes it in good shape, running recently, replaced for larger engine. How does $1800 sound? I know there can be a big disparity, but I have no recent price experience. I would probably overhaul anyway based on what I am able to do myself and/or cost to have someone else do it if required. Any recent cost experiences? >Thanks, >Steve > >-------- >Steve >www.mypiet.com > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291233#291233 > > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 09:45:31 AM PST US From: John Hofmann Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost With accessories and even if it is run-out, that is a good price. -john- John Hofmann Vice-President, Information Technology The Rees Group, Inc. 2810 Crossroads Drive, Ste 3800 Madison, WI 53718 Phone: 608.443.2468 ext 150 Fax: 608.443.2474 Email: jhofmann@reesgroupinc.com On Mar 22, 2010, at 8:41 AM, chase143(at)aol.com wrote: > > A friend offered me an A-65, with spare mags, carburetor, pieces as required. Describes it in good shape, running recently, replaced for larger engine. How does $1800 sound? I know there can be a big disparity, but I have no recent price experience. I would probably overhaul anyway based on what I am able to do myself and/or cost to have someone else do it if required. Any recent cost experiences? > Thanks, > Steve > > -------- > Steve > www.mypiet.com > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291233#291233 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 09:45:57 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Fuselage Update From: "taildrags" Seeing the bare fuselage gives an idea of just how robust the Piet airframe is. Those beefy 1x1 framing members really make for a stout airplane. Very clean work, Jack. -------- Oscar Zuniga San Antonio, TX Air Camper NX41CC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291261#291261 ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 09:46:31 AM PST US From: "Jack Phillips" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost Sounds like a good price to me, Steve. I paid $1500 for my A-65 as literally a box of parts 10 years ago. I put another $6,000 into it in overhauling it, including new cylinders and pistons, new camshaft, new magnetos, etc. As for overhauling it yourself, I heartily recommend it. Buy the Mattituck video on how to overhaul an O-200 (available from AS&S) and just follow the same procedures. Overhaul manuals for A65's are readily available. They are pretty easy to follow and few special tools are required, other than a piston ring compressor. When you are done, you will know your engine thoroughly. Jack Phillips -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of chase143(at)aol.com Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 9:42 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost A friend offered me an A-65, with spare mags, carburetor, pieces as required. Describes it in good shape, running recently, replaced for larger engine. How does $1800 sound? I know there can be a big disparity, but I have no recent price experience. I would probably overhaul anyway based on what I am able to do myself and/or cost to have someone else do it if required. Any recent cost experiences? Thanks, Steve -------- Steve www.mypiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291233#291233 ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 09:46:31 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost From: Gerry Holland Steve Hi from UK. To protect your friend from any liability and litigation can I suggest I'll take the A65 off his hands and save you wasting your money! Seriously though at that price you should snap it up. In fact I think it would be economic to ship to UK even. Go for it and even if it's not used you can resell it anytime and it will go. Regards Gerry ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 10:14:59 AM PST US From: Michael Perez Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost Take it, don't look back! I would jump all over it for that price. --- On Mon, 3/22/10, chase143(at)aol.com wrote: From: chase143(at)aol.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost om> A friend offered me an A-65, with spare mags, carburetor, pieces as require d. Describes it in good shape, running recently, replaced for larger engine . How does $1800 sound? I know there can be a big disparity, but I have no recent price experience. I would probably overhaul anyway based on what I a m able to do myself and/or cost to have someone else do it if required. Any recent cost experiences? Thanks, Steve -------- Steve www.mypiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291233#291233 le, List Admin. ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 10:15:33 AM PST US From: Steve Ruse Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost How many hours does it have in the last 3-5 years? What are the compressions? What state are the mags in? How long since major? Some or a lot of recent time is good. Can you check the cylinders and cam for corrosion before buying? It'd be nice to pop a cylinder or two off. If it was built with good parts, $1,800 is a good deal. I just paid $900 to overhaul two cylinders a few months ago. Also, did you see the recent article in EAA Sport Aviation magazine about engines having substantially lower failure rates as they have more and more hours? Because that is the case, I'd be more interested in this engine if it has 500 hours than if it has 50 hours. Steve Ruse Quoting "chase143(at)aol.com" : > > > A friend offered me an A-65, with spare mags, carburetor, pieces as > required. Describes it in good shape, running recently, replaced for > larger engine. How does $1800 sound? I know there can be a big > disparity, but I have no recent price experience. I would probably > overhaul anyway based on what I am able to do myself and/or cost to > have someone else do it if required. Any recent cost experiences? > Thanks, > Steve > > -------- > Steve > www.mypiet.com > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291233#291233 > > ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 10:38:54 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: A-65 cost From: "chase143(at)aol.com" Great replies all!! ~I believe it is certified, has all log books (and many spare parts) ~Jack, I will look for the video, I'd like to rebuild myself (I have a ring compressor I once used on my 351 Cleveland) ~Steve, very interesting stats, I will look up the EAA article. ~Thanks for all the offers to take off my hands! That answers my question! lol I think it's a done deal! Thanks again. Steve -------- Steve www.mypiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291272#291272 ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 10:48:44 AM PST US From: Jim Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Fuselage Update Hi Jack, Your fuselage shows very nice and good work. Its really looking good and making good progress. Keep it up, Jim B. Jim Boyer Santa Rosa, CA Pietenpol on wheels Tail surfaces done Wing ribs done Corvair engine Mar 22, 2010 05:08:21 AM, pietenpol-list@matronics.com wrote: Fuselage is going well. I updated my site with some more photos. http://www.textors.com/PietProject.html Jack DSM www.textors.com ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 10:51:42 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Fuselage Update From: "K5YAC" Beautiful work Jack! I hope mine will look as good. -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291276#291276 ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 10:52:11 AM PST US From: "Mike King" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost Same here. Can't beat the Cont. Mine is 70 years old and has plenty left in her. Like the guys say......BUY IT. Mike King 77MK GN-1 Corpus Christi ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael Perez Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 9:18 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost Take it, don't look back! I would jump all over it for that price. --- On Mon, 3/22/10, chase143(at)aol.com wrote: From: chase143(at)aol.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost A friend offered me an A-65, with spare mags, carburetor, pieces as required. Describes it in good shape, running recently, replaced for larger engine. How does $1800 sound? I know there can be a big disparity, but I have no recent price experience. I would probably overhaul anyway based on what I am able to do myself and/or cost to have someone else do it if required. Any recent cost experiences? Thanks, Steve -------- Steve www.mypiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291233#29123= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum -http://www.matronics.com/Na======================= ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 11:07:57 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: just another idea and concept to ponder From: "K5YAC" So... what assemblies are you lacking John? Do you have all the materials or will we spend most of the first day down at the lumber yard sifting through scraps? Will you be providing food and drink? How big is the basement? [Laughing] [quote="Amsafetyc"]Valuable comments thanksActually not talking about a complete ship and not at Brodhead. Just at a builders location looking for a weekend of intense building by a group able and capable of working on everything in need of help to advance the project. All based on the builders wants,needs,schedule and raw materials/parts on hand. With enough bench space,clamps, jigging and a saw man it is possible to frame out the fuse and tail feathers in a weekend. I am not advocating we do this tomorrow but if there were interested parties maybe in 6 month or soJohn Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerryFrom: "Dick N" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder No, that couldn't be done. Not to a completed ship if that's what you are suggesting. A bare fuselage would take 6 days alone. Just think of the work involved in the wings. Dick N. > --- -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291281#291281 ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 11:12:16 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Phase I complete for 6926J From: Rick Holland > Rick, Go for it! Actually the guy selling, Mike Frazier has a steel tube > Piet project, so a guy might be able to get a home on a runway and the Piet > project all at one shot. > Skip Kind of a aviation/piet geek trifecta. ;) do not archive -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 11:46:03 AM PST US From: Steve Ruse Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: A-65 cost - Engine TBO & EAA article Below is a link to the article I was referring to. You have to sign up to Oshkosh365.org to read them I think. Good article. A 2nd article in the series was in this month's magazine: http://www.sportaviationonline.org/sportaviation/201002/#pg90 Steve Quoting "chase143(at)aol.com" : > > > Great replies all!! > ~I believe it is certified, has all log books (and many spare parts) > ~Jack, I will look for the video, I'd like to rebuild myself (I have > a ring compressor I once used on my 351 Cleveland) > ~Steve, very interesting stats, I will look up the EAA article. > ~Thanks for all the offers to take off my hands! That answers my > question! lol > I think it's a done deal! Thanks again. > Steve > > -------- > Steve > www.mypiet.com > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291272#291272 > > ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 12:06:38 PM PST US From: Doug Dever Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: A-65 cost - Engine TBO & EAA article I didn't read the article =2C but I think it will say that frequency is mor e important than total. An engine that flies 5 hrs/yr won't even come clos e to TBO=2C but one that flies 100 hrs/yr will. The last airplane we had w as still flying with good numbers past TBO. It was flown 150hrs/yr. Doug Dever In beautiful Stow Ohio _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:O N:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_2 ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 12:41:28 PM PST US From: AMsafetyC@aol.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: just another idea and concept to ponder Mark, I got my fuse , wings, tail feathers, center section, landing gear, cabane's and struts built along with most of my metal fittings in stainles s done and the firewall is installed. As soon as I can get a hanger I plan to beg in my trial fits and finishing mounting brackets for alignment. I also had 2 tanks nearly built however 032 aluminum is easily bent on my home made large profile brake just not to easy to get the tig welding settings exac tly right. First arc big honking holes. Soon as I move into a hanger I can do more adjusting on the Piet and I am planning the construction of my hanger kegger just in case the thirst hits me. Right now we are talking about electric, I need 220/100 amp service to run my welders and compressor and the airport only provides one single 11 0 v 15 amp circuit. not nearly enough for serious builders with tools. Soon as I can load the flatbed with steel for the benches and tools I am ready to move the piet to its new home, were I can drink and make sparks all the day. John Bring it on home boy In a message dated 3/22/2010 2:08:12 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, hangar10@cox.net writes: --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "K5YAC" So... what assemblies are you lacking John? Do you have all the material s or will we spend most of the first day down at the lumber yard sifting through scraps? Will you be providing food and drink? How big is the basement? [Laughing] [quote="Amsafetyc"]Valuable comments thanksActually not talking about a complete ship and not at Brodhead. Just at a builders location looking fo r a weekend of intense building by a group able and capable of working on everything in need of help to advance the project. All based on the build ers wants,needs,schedule and raw materials/parts on hand. With enough bench space,clamps, jigging and a saw man it is possible to frame out the fuse and tail feathers in a weekend. I am not advocating we do this tomorrow but if there were interested parties maybe in 6 month or soJohn Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerryFrom: "Dick N" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder No, that couldn't be done.=EF=BD Not to a completed ship if that's wh at you are suggesting.=EF=BD A bare fuselage would take 6 days alone.=EF =BD Just think of the work involved in the wings.=EF=BD Dick N. > --- -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291281#291281 ======================== =========== ======================== =========== ======================== =========== ======================== =========== ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 12:49:31 PM PST US From: AMsafetyC@aol.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder Dan, That is exactly the concept. Living in Lancaster PA we often have a chance to run across an Amish barn being built, just like in the movie Witness or a Kingdom Hall like the Jehovah witnesses. Really its about a bunch of folks pitching in to get another Piet project off the ground. I am certain that much can be accomplished is short order with the right hands doing there best to make it happen. To me it sounds like fun and a chance to learn from all the others there is much for each of us to share and learn. John In a message dated 3/22/2010 12:45:39 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, yocum@fnal.gov writes: --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Dan Yocum John, Sounds like an old-fashioned barn-raising where the whole community turned out to build a neighbor's barn. I like it! I don't know if I'd be able to get it past the head of the ways and means committee, though. *sigh* Reading more of the thread - if someone showed up with all the ribs and tips built, could the rest of the wing be done in a couple of days? Dan On 03/19/2010 07:00 PM, AMsafetyC@aol.com wrote: > Hello good people..... > A new idea and concept for the group to ponder. > As we all know and have recognized we all share a common bond as fellow > lovers of the blue, aviators, builders connected through the design > genius of Bernard Pietenpol and his flying contraption the aeroplane. We > as a collection of builders have at our disposal some, many and all of > the requisite skill levels to construct such a machine with little > assistance or intervention from the outside world. > The there are those who would love to join our ranks but may be lacking > in skills, equipment and time to turn their dream into a reality. From > prints to Piet if you will. We know that everyone has a skill set that > is good in some areas and not so good in others. Knowing these basic > tenants I am curious as to who or what builders would welcome the > talents of other builders equipped with tools and skills would be > interested in having a group of builders show up at their hanger, barn, > basement or garage for a weekend build utilizing all the skills of the > people interested in lending a hand to accomplish a number of tasks to > get the project going bring the tools to get the certain aspects > completed. Woodworkers, metal workers, mechanical workers and the like > showing up to get a build from a stalled stage to a more accomplished > state of being a Pietenpol. > I am speaking about two groups of people, those with the skills and > resources capable of committing to a 2 or 3 day weekend to participate > in building another Piet as one group. The other group would be a > builder or would be builder who in need of assistance in advancing their > project to a next or greater level of completion. > This again is but another concept for consideration. For example I have > both tools not all that I need but certainly more than other that are > portable, a trailer to transport them and no skills to speak of. I also > have lodging as in a popup/tent camper to bring to a build site for a > few days to help another builder. There are others with tools and skills > that may also be portable. > Through this cooperative of a half dozen or more people who would be > willing to share their time and expertise to get another build moving > and another builder to a next level of completion. > I am wonder how many of us would be willing to pitch in for a week end > to help and how many would be interested in receiving those willing to > help. > Before I go any further with this concept it would be nice to know if > there is any interest at all in helping or being helped. > Just in case you were wondering, I have all of my tools marked for > identification purposes. I know how this works. > Helpers bring tools and skills and resources as needed helped provide a > keg on tap burgers and a place for a fire and I think we are cooking > with gas! > What say you? > John > > * > > > * -- Dan Yocum Fermilab 630.840.6509 yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________ Time: 12:58:59 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Fuselage Update From: "Bill Church" Yuck! Just thought I'd throw that in there for contrast. Really, though, Jack - like everyone else said, you're doing VERY nice work. But your shop is a mess! In one of the photos, it looks like there's a binder under your workbench that is sticking out about 3/4"! That can't actually be a real workshop. I should post a photo of my mess, so you can see what the other end of the spectrum looks like. (can you tell I'm jealous?) Bill C. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291310#291310 ________________________________ Message 36 ____________________________________ Time: 01:24:22 PM PST US From: Steve Ruse Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: A-65 cost - Engine TBO & EAA article Even that depends on other factors, like how the engine is stored. The engine in my plane (an A-75) was last overhauled in 1967...43 years ago. It has about 1,000 total time now. Clearly it has at points gone for years without running in that time. I've put about 400 on it in the last six years, and it is in great shape. The cam and internals look good, and the 400 recent hours I put on it indicate that it is still solid. It has had cylinders replaced, and new mags...but the bottom-end is solid (or is it the middle-end on an opposed engine?). If there had been rust on the cam or crank six years ago, it would've been apparent by now. When I had two cylinders off last year, the internals looked good. Of course, it is BEST to run an engine often. But not running it often doesn't always mean it will be ruined, just that it is more likely. Clearly mine was somehow protected from corrosion. Steve Ruse Quoting Doug Dever : > > I didn't read the article , but I think it will say that frequency > is more important than total. An engine that flies 5 hrs/yr won't > even come close to TBO, but one that flies 100 hrs/yr will. The > last airplane we had was still flying with good numbers past TBO. > It was flown 150hrs/yr. > > Doug Dever > In beautiful Stow Ohio > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more > from your inbox. > http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_2 ________________________________ Message 37 ____________________________________ Time: 01:28:13 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Fuselage Update From: Rick Holland Bet my workshop is messier than yours! My dog doesn't even like being in my shop because its such a mess. rick do not archive On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 1:58 PM, Bill Church wrote: > > Yuck! > > Just thought I'd throw that in there for contrast. > > Really, though, Jack - like everyone else said, you're doing VERY nice work. > > But your shop is a mess! In one of the photos, it looks like there's a binder under your workbench that is sticking out about 3/4"! That can't actually be a real workshop. I should post a photo of my mess, so you can see what the other end of the spectrum looks like. (can you tell I'm jealous?) > > Bill C. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291310#291310 > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________ Message 38 ____________________________________ Time: 01:30:30 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: A-65 cost - Engine TBO & EAA article From: Rick Holland Storing an engine in humid Florida vs. dry Colorado could make a difference over a few decades. rick On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 2:23 PM, Steve Ruse wrote: > > Even that depends on other factors, like how the engine is stored. The > engine in my plane (an A-75) was last overhauled in 1967...43 years ago. It > has about 1,000 total time now. Clearly it has at points gone for years > without running in that time. I've put about 400 on it in the last six > years, and it is in great shape. The cam and internals look good, and the > 400 recent hours I put on it indicate that it is still solid. It has had > cylinders replaced, and new mags...but the bottom-end is solid (or is it the > middle-end on an opposed engine?). If there had been rust on the cam or > crank six years ago, it would've been apparent by now. When I had two > cylinders off last year, the internals looked good. > > Of course, it is BEST to run an engine often. But not running it often > doesn't always mean it will be ruined, just that it is more likely. Clearly > mine was somehow protected from corrosion. > > Steve Ruse > > Quoting Doug Dever : > >> >> I didn't read the article , but I think it will say that frequency is >> more important than total. An engine that flies 5 hrs/yr won't even come >> close to TBO, but one that flies 100 hrs/yr will. The last airplane we had >> was still flying with good numbers past TBO. It was flown 150hrs/yr. >> >> Doug Dever >> In beautiful Stow Ohio >> >> >> >> _________________________________________________________________ >> Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from >> your inbox. >> >> http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID27925::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:032010_2 > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________ Message 39 ____________________________________ Time: 01:35:13 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: just another idea and concept to ponder From: "K5YAC" Ok, I was just trying to be funny. Kind of like... maybe you were recruiting to get some cheap labor. Thanks for the update. LOL! [quote="Amsafetyc"]Mark, I got my fuse , wings, tail feathers, center section, landing gear, cabane's and struts built along with most of my metal fittings in stainless done and the firewall is installed. As soon as I can get a hanger I plan to begin my trial fits and finishing mounting brackets for alignment. I also had 2 tanks nearly built however 032 aluminum is easily bent on my home made large profile brake just not to easy to get the tig welding settings exactly right. First arc big honking holes. Soon as I move into a hanger I can do more adjusting on the Pietand I am planning the construction of my hanger kegger just in case the thirst hits me. Right now we are talking about electric, I need 220/100 amp service to run my welders and compressor and the airport only provides one single 110 v 15 amp circuit. not nearly enough for serious builders with tools. Soon as I can load the flatbed with steel for the benches and tools I am ready to move the piet to its new home, were I can drink and make sparks all the day. John Bring it on home boy In a message dated 3/22/2010 2:08:12 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, hangar10@cox.net writes: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "K5YAC" > > So... what assemblies are you lacking John? Do you have all the materials or will we spend most of the first day down at the lumber yard sifting through scraps? Will you be providing food and drink? How big is the basement? > > [Laughing] > > [quote="Amsafetyc"]Valuable comments thanksActually not talking about a complete ship and not at Brodhead. Just at a builders location looking for a weekend of intense building by a group able and capable of working on everything in need of help to advance the project. All based on the builders wants,needs,schedule and raw materials/parts on hand. With enough bench space,clamps, jigging and a saw man it is possible to frame out the fuse and tail feathers in a weekend. I am not advocating we do this tomorrow but if there were interested parties maybe in 6 month or soJohn > Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerryFrom: "Dick N" > Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 23:12:35 -0500 > To: > Subject: Re: just another idea and concept to ponder > > No, that couldn't be done. Not to a completed ship if that's what you are suggesting. A bare fuselage would take 6 days alone. Just think of the work involved in the wings. > Dick N. > > > > --- > > > > > > > -------- > Mark - working on wings > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291281#291281============================================== > > > [b] -------- Mark - working on wings Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291314#291314 ________________________________ Message 40 ____________________________________ Time: 01:38:06 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Fuselage Update From: "Bill Church" Oh yeah? Well, I can't even FIND my dog in my workshop. (beat that) BC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291317#291317 ________________________________ Message 41 ____________________________________ Time: 01:52:44 PM PST US From: "walt" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost Jim, In answer to your #1, It doesn't have to be certified to have a fly off hour of 25. Mine wasn't and I did the 25 hour Phase 1. Just my 2 cents. walt evans NX140DL ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Ash To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 10:36 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost I'd have two questions which could vary the value of it significantly. 1. Is it a certified engine with logs? A certified engine will obviously bring more than a non-certified engine, or one that once was certified but hasn't been maintained that way. IIRC, a certified engine in your Piet would also reduce the required time for your test flights from 40 hours down to 25. 2. What are the compression numbers on the cylinders? This is a standard benchmark of engine health. While it doesn't guarantee perfection, it's a good starting point. Neither of these are show-stoppers; they just change the numbers. Jim Ash -----Original Message----- >From: "chase143(at)aol.com" >Sent: Mar 22, 2010 9:41 AM >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Pietenpol-List: A-65 cost > > >A friend offered me an A-65, with spare mags, carburetor, pieces as required. Describes it in good shape, running recently, replaced for larger engine. How does $1800 sound? I know there can be a big disparity, but I have no recent price experience. I would probably overhaul anyway based on what I am able to do myself and/or cost to have someone else do it if required. Any recent cost experiences? >Thanks, >Steve > >-------- >Steve >www.mypiet.com > > > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291233#291233 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 42 ____________________________________ Time: 01:53:59 PM PST US From: brian.e.jardine@l-3com.com Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Fuselage Update Oh yeah? Well, I can't even FIND my wife in my workshop....oh that's right I got rid of the "Practice Wife", and kept the Piet mistress. BJ -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Church Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 2:38 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Fuselage Update Oh yeah? Well, I can't even FIND my dog in my workshop. (beat that) BC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291317#291317 ________________________________ Message 43 ____________________________________ Time: 02:30:45 PM PST US From: jeff wilson Subject: Pietenpol-List: What size prop I am building a Piet and have decided on the Continental A-65 and I want to hear from everyone. What size prop are you using with the A-65? - Thanks, Jeff=0A=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 44 ____________________________________ Time: 02:35:41 PM PST US From: Ben Charvet Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: What size prop I have a Sensenich 72X40, which is considered a climb prop on a Cub. It pulls the full 2300 RPM in a climb, and I still cruise at 78 mph at 2100 rpm. Ben On 3/22/2010 5:30 PM, jeff wilson wrote: > I am building a Piet and have decided on the Continental A-65 and I > want to hear from everyone. > What size prop are you using with the A-65? > Thanks, Jeff > > > * > > > * ________________________________ Message 45 ____________________________________ Time: 02:36:33 PM PST US From: "walt" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder Remember guys, as some famous writer said,,,"Its not the destination,,,but the journey that's important" I loved working on my Piet,,,without any kind of pressure. "some like to build,,and some like to fly" "don't build to fly" but "build to build" walt evans NX140DL ----- Original Message ----- From: Dan Yocum To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:39 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder John, Sounds like an old-fashioned barn-raising where the whole community turned out to build a neighbor's barn. I like it! I don't know if I'd be able to get it past the head of the ways and means committee, though. *sigh* Reading more of the thread - if someone showed up with all the ribs and tips built, could the rest of the wing be done in a couple of days? Dan On 03/19/2010 07:00 PM, AMsafetyC@aol.com wrote: > Hello good people..... > A new idea and concept for the group to ponder. > As we all know and have recognized we all share a common bond as fellow > lovers of the blue, aviators, builders connected through the design > genius of Bernard Pietenpol and his flying contraption the aeroplane. We > as a collection of builders have at our disposal some, many and all of > the requisite skill levels to construct such a machine with little > assistance or intervention from the outside world. > The there are those who would love to join our ranks but may be lacking > in skills, equipment and time to turn their dream into a reality. From > prints to Piet if you will. We know that everyone has a skill set that > is good in some areas and not so good in others. Knowing these basic > tenants I am curious as to who or what builders would welcome the > talents of other builders equipped with tools and skills would be > interested in having a group of builders show up at their hanger, barn, > basement or garage for a weekend build utilizing all the skills of the > people interested in lending a hand to accomplish a number of tasks to > get the project going bring the tools to get the certain aspects > completed. Woodworkers, metal workers, mechanical workers and the like > showing up to get a build from a stalled stage to a more accomplished > state of being a Pietenpol. > I am speaking about two groups of people, those with the skills and > resources capable of committing to a 2 or 3 day weekend to participate > in building another Piet as one group. The other group would be a > builder or would be builder who in need of assistance in advancing their > project to a next or greater level of completion. > This again is but another concept for consideration. For example I have > both tools not all that I need but certainly more than other that are > portable, a trailer to transport them and no skills to speak of. I also > have lodging as in a popup/tent camper to bring to a build site for a > few days to help another builder. There are others with tools and skills > that may also be portable. > Through this cooperative of a half dozen or more people who would be > willing to share their time and expertise to get another build moving > and another builder to a next level of completion. > I am wonder how many of us would be willing to pitch in for a week end > to help and how many would be interested in receiving those willing to > help. > Before I go any further with this concept it would be nice to know if > there is any interest at all in helping or being helped. > Just in case you were wondering, I have all of my tools marked for > identification purposes. I know how this works. > Helpers bring tools and skills and resources as needed helped provide a > keg on tap burgers and a place for a fire and I think we are cooking > with gas! > What say you? > John > > * > > > * -- Dan Yocum Fermilab 630.840.6509 yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." ________________________________ Message 46 ____________________________________ Time: 02:37:31 PM PST US From: "walt" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Fuselage Update Bj, Wow, I think I like you! walt evans NX140DL ----- Original Message ----- From: brian.e.jardine@l-3com.com To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 4:52 PM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Fuselage Update Oh yeah? Well, I can't even FIND my wife in my workshop....oh that's right I got rid of the "Practice Wife", and kept the Piet mistress. BJ -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Church Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 2:38 PM To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Fuselage Update Oh yeah? Well, I can't even FIND my dog in my workshop. (beat that) BC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291317#291317 ________________________________ Message 47 ____________________________________ Time: 03:37:00 PM PST US From: Ben Charvet Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: just another idea and concept to ponder I was thinking the same thing. With a mass build, who would be responsible for quality control? There is a little reassurance when you strap your butt in and add the throttle, that you have done YOUR best to make it right. The skills you learn during the journey are part of the process. Ben Charvet On 3/22/2010 5:35 PM, walt wrote: > Remember guys, as some famous writer said,,,"Its not the > destination,,,but the journey that's important" > I loved working on my Piet,,,without any kind of pressure. > "some like to build,,and some like to fly" > "don't build to fly" but "build to build" > walt evans > NX140DL > ________________________________ Message 48 ____________________________________ Time: 04:41:42 PM PST US From: airlion Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Fuselage Update I hope the blessed wife does not read your emails ________________________________ From: walt Sent: Mon, March 22, 2010 5:36:01 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Fuselage Update Bj, Wow, I think I like you! walt evans NX140DL ----- Original Message ----- >From: brian.e.jardine@l-3com.com >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 4:52 >PM >Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Fuselage > Update > > >Oh > yeah? > >Well, I can't even FIND my wife in my workshop....oh that's right > I got >rid of the "Practice Wife", and kept the Piet > mistress. > >BJ > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com >[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] > On Behalf Of Bill >Church >Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 2:38 PM >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: > Pietenpol-List: Re: Fuselage Update > >--> Pietenpol-List message > posted by: "Bill Church" > > >Oh > yeah? >Well, I can't even FIND my dog in my workshop. (beat > that) > >BC > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291317#291317 > > >> > http://www.matnbsp; >via the Web > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com >_p; >generous > bsp; > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c================ > > ________________________________ Message 49 ____________________________________ Time: 05:57:45 PM PST US From: "Jack" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Fuselage Update Bill and all, Thanks for the kind words, it all helps! Bill, do you think I'm anal? I do always make sure to dust before mixing epoxy or measuring a for critical cut. Honestly, Wife Susan is very understanding of all the dust, noise and swearing rising up from the family room. Jack DSM Yuck! Just thought I'd throw that in there for contrast. Really, though, Jack - like everyone else said, you're doing VERY nice work. But your shop is a mess! In one of the photos, it looks like there's a binder under your workbench that is sticking out about 3/4"! That can't actually be a real workshop. I should post a photo of my mess, so you can see what the other end of the spectrum looks like. (can you tell I'm jealous?) Bill C. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=291310#291310 ________________________________ Message 50 ____________________________________ Time: 06:06:42 PM PST US From: "Douwe Blumberg" Subject: Pietenpol-List: intercom Okay, so if I have two headsets and want to be able to talk back and forth, what do I need? A battery powered intercom and two push to talk switches (if I don't trust the squelch to work) and that's it? Douwe ________________________________ Message 51 ____________________________________ Time: 06:09:53 PM PST US From: "Jack" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Instrument Template Did some test cutting with my new 3 1/8 forstner bit today, what a honking bit! Does anyone have a PDF for the instrument screw holes? Thanks! Jack DSM ________________________________ Message 52 ____________________________________ Time: 06:29:12 PM PST US From: Jeff Boatright Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: intercom Douwe, you only need one PPT switch, and that's for the pilot to communicate on the radio. The communication between the two people in the airplane simply goes through the intercom without need of a PPT switch - you just speak into the microphone. Now, if you want both the passenger and pilot to be able to communicate on the radio, things get more complicated. > > >Okay, so if I have two headsets and want to be able to talk back and forth, >what do I need? > >A battery powered intercom and two push to talk switches (if I don't trust >the squelch to work) and that's it? > >Douwe -- --- Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Ophthalmology Emory University School of Medicine Editor-in-Chief Molecular Vision ________________________________ Message 53 ____________________________________ Time: 07:54:10 PM PST US From: Tim Willis Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: What size prop Jeff, Ben is certainly getting excellent results with his prop. If I were starting from scratch, I would go for a Cloudcars scimitar prop. The folks there usually recommend a 76X38 prop for Piets with A-65s. That big swing and the scimitar shape tend to maximize the thrust per rev, and the scimitar shape flattens out in climb to allow full revs. Jeff Boatright and Gene in TN got better results from their Piets after they switched to Cloudcars. And they look great on the plane. Lastly Jay at Cloudcars seems great to work with, as well. Check it out. Tim in central TX -----Original Message----- From: Ben Charvet Sent: Mar 22, 2010 4:35 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: What size prop I have a Sensenich 72X40, which is considered a climb prop on a Cub. It pulls the full 2300 RPM in a climb, and I still cruise at 78 mph at 2100 rpm. Ben On 3/22/2010 5:30 PM, jeff wilson wrote: ________________________________ Message 54 ____________________________________ Time: 08:04:56 PM PST US From: Jeff Boatright Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: What size prop We do get great performance with the Cloudcars prop and Jay is easy to work with. I don't know about it flattening out in cruise. I think it's the other way around. I'm not sure at all about this, just based on what I've read. For instance: Pitch change and the Scimitar shape The propeller has a fixed pitch that relies on the forward pull of the propeller to automatically provide pitch change proportional to the amount of force being applied to the propeller disk. When a propeller operates at a slower airspeed than its maximum capability, it has a proportional pull in relation to the velocity of forward motion, so at takeoff and climb, the propeller will have its largest forward pull. Due to the scimitar shape, the tip of the propeller cones forward, as the coning angle changes the propeller will lessen pitch that provides shorter takeoffs and higher rates of climb. As the propeller increases in forward speed the disk pressure is reduced, this forces the propeller to increase pitch and top speed. This change in pitch is approximately four inches from takeoff to cruise. This was taken from http://www.princeaircraft.com/TheProp.aspx HTH, Jeff > >Jeff, > >Ben is certainly getting excellent results with his prop. If I were >starting from scratch, I would go for a Cloudcars scimitar prop. >The folks there usually recommend a 76X38 prop for Piets with A-65s. >That big swing and the scimitar shape tend to maximize the thrust >per rev, and the scimitar shape flattens out in climb to allow full >revs. > >Jeff Boatright and Gene in TN got better results from their Piets >after they switched to Cloudcars. And they look great on the plane. >Lastly Jay at Cloudcars seems great to work with, as well. Check it >out. >Tim in central TX > > >-----Original Message----- >From: Ben Charvet >Sent: Mar 22, 2010 4:35 PM >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: What size prop > >I have a Sensenich 72X40, which is considered a climb prop on a Cub. >It pulls the full 2300 RPM in a climb, and I still cruise at 78 mph >at 2100 rpm. > >Ben >On 3/22/2010 5:30 PM, jeff wilson wrote: > -- --- Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Ophthalmology Emory University School of Medicine Editor-in-Chief Molecular Vision ________________________________ Message 55 ____________________________________ Time: 08:07:56 PM PST US From: "gcardinal" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: What size prop Jeff, NX18235 is flying with a 72 X 42 prop. Climb rate is 500+ fpm when the airplane is light but falls to 200 fpm at heavier weights. At 2050 rpm in level flight I am seeing about 72 - 75 mph. At 2150 rpm I am seeing 78 - 82 mph. Greg Cardinal ----- Original Message ----- From: jeff wilson To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 4:30 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: What size prop I am building a Piet and have decided on the Continental A-65 and I want to hear from everyone. What size prop are you using with the A-65? Thanks, Jeff ________________________________ Message 56 ____________________________________ Time: 08:13:03 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: What size prop From: Ryan Mueller I'll second that. He and Carmen were pleasant to deal with...I'm sure the prop will be top-notch....I'll let you know in two days when FedEx delivers it! :) Ryan On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 9:53 PM, Tim Willis wrote: > timothywillis@earthlink.net> > > Jeff, > > Lastly Jay at Cloudcars seems great to work with, as well. Check it out. > Tim in central TX > > ________________________________ Message 57 ____________________________________ Time: 08:24:01 PM PST US From: Tim Willis Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: What size prop Jeff, look again.... I wrote that it flattened out in climb. Tim in central TX -----Original Message----- From: Jeff Boatright Sent: Mar 22, 2010 10:04 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: What size prop We do get great performance with the Cloudcars prop and Jay is easy to work with. I don't know about it flattening out in cruise. I think it's the other way around. I'm not sure at all about this, just based on what I've read. For instance: Pitch change and the Scimitar shape The propeller has a fixed pitch that relies on the forward pull of the propeller to automatically provide pitch change proportional to the amount of force being applied to the propeller disk. When a propeller operates at a slower airspeed than its maximum capability, it has a proportional pull in relation to the velocity of forward motion, so at takeoff and climb, the propeller will have its largest forward pull. Due to the scimitar shape, the tip of the propeller cones forward, as the coning angle changes the propeller will lessen pitch that provides shorter takeoffs and higher rates of climb. As the propeller increases in forward speed the disk pressure is reduced, this forces the propeller to increase pitch and top speed. This change in pitch is approximately four inches from takeoff to cruise. This was taken from http://www.princeaircraft.com/TheProp.aspx HTH, Jeff Jeff, Ben is certainly getting excellent results with his prop. If I were starting from scratch, I would go for a Cloudcars scimitar prop. The folks there usually recommend a 76X38 prop for Piets with A-65s. That big swing and the scimitar shape tend to maximize the thrust per rev, and the scimitar shape flattens out in climb to allow full revs. Jeff Boatright and Gene in TN got better results from their Piets after they switched to Cloudcars. And they look great on the plane. Lastly Jay at Cloudcars seems great to work with, as well. Check it out. Tim in central TX -----Original Message----- From: Ben Charvet Sent: Mar 22, 2010 4:35 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: What size prop I have a Sensenich 72X40, which is considered a climb prop on a Cub. It pulls the full 2300 RPM in a climb, and I still cruise at 78 mph at 2100 rpm. Ben On 3/22/2010 5:30 PM, jeff wilson wrote: [EDITED] Jeffrey H. 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