---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 04/06/10: 42 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:03 AM - Re: Obfuscatory perambulation (Jim Ash) 2. 05:28 AM - Tail Wheel Assembly (Pieti Lowell) 3. 06:00 AM - Re: weekend cowl work (taildrags) 4. 06:31 AM - Re: Re: weekend cowl work (Michael Groah) 5. 06:43 AM - Re: Tail Wheel Assembly (Ryan Mueller) 6. 06:59 AM - ELT - EPIRB Shopping (Mike King) 7. 06:59 AM - Re: Obfuscatory perambulation (TOM STINEMETZE) 8. 07:03 AM - Re: ELT - EPIRB Shopping (Jack Phillips) 9. 09:42 AM - Re: ELT - EPIRB Shopping (Rick Holland) 10. 09:54 AM - Re: weekend cowl work (Rick Holland) 11. 09:59 AM - Re: ELT - EPIRB Shopping (rgow@avionicsdesign.ca) 12. 10:53 AM - 800x4 Cub wheels and brakes FS (Ryan Mueller) 13. 10:58 AM - Re: ELT - EPIRB Shopping (Jim Ash) 14. 12:10 PM - Toe-in (skellytown flyer) 15. 12:24 PM - Re: Toe-in (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation]) 16. 12:58 PM - Re: Toe-in (David Paule) 17. 01:31 PM - Re: weekend cowl work (Jim) 18. 01:48 PM - Re: weekend cowl work (Michael Groah) 19. 02:13 PM - Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! (Douwe Blumberg) 20. 02:27 PM - Ohio piet fly-in 2010 (shad bell) 21. 02:27 PM - Re: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! (Ryan Mueller) 22. 02:38 PM - Re: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! (Tim Willis) 23. 02:40 PM - Re: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! (shad bell) 24. 02:45 PM - Re: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! (David Paule) 25. 02:52 PM - Re: ELT - EPIRB Shopping (gcardinal) 26. 02:58 PM - PIetenpol Wood (bcolleran@comcast.net) 27. 03:20 PM - Re: PIetenpol Wood (Ben Charvet) 28. 03:38 PM - Re: PIetenpol Wood (Bill Church) 29. 03:59 PM - Re: weekend cowl work (Michael Groah) 30. 04:04 PM - Re: Re: PIetenpol Wood (walt) 31. 04:18 PM - Re: Ohio piet fly-in 2010 (Jason Holmes) 32. 04:18 PM - Re: ELT - EPIRB Shopping (Jack Phillips) 33. 04:36 PM - Re: weekend cowl work (Gary Boothe) 34. 04:36 PM - Re: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! (Jack Phillips) 35. 05:08 PM - Re: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! (Gene & Tammy) 36. 05:22 PM - New England pietenpol (William Colleran) 37. 05:49 PM - Re: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! (airlion) 38. 06:42 PM - Mike Groah--your side door (John Fay) 39. 06:52 PM - Re: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! (Dick N) 40. 08:08 PM - Re: weekend cowl work (Michael Groah) 41. 08:41 PM - Re: Mike Groah--your side door (Michael Groah) 42. 08:56 PM - Re: New England pietenpol (Glenn Thomas) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:03:40 AM PST US From: Jim Ash Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Obfuscatory perambulation The two needs to be outside the perenthesis. Jim -----Original Message----- From: TOM STINEMETZE Sent: Apr 5, 2010 2:24 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Obfuscatory perambulation The gentleman in this video has been hired by the Crank Snappin' Corvair Society (CS) to articulate our cause to the masses. I am sure that you will all understand the veracity of our prognostications re: our choice of motive appliance, once you hear him. http://home.comcast.net/~steveham21/turbo.mpg The real story is as follows: Several years ago, Rockwell International decided to get into the heavy duty transmission business. They were getting ready to tape a first introduction video, and as a warm up, the professional narrator began what has become a legend within the trucking industry. This man should have won an academy award for his stellar performance. Now remember this is strictly off the cuff, nothing is written down, this became the biggest talk in the industry, vs the new product which they were introducing. Stinemetze N328X ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:28:57 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Tail Wheel Assembly From: "Pieti Lowell" I have a Ken Perkins Tail Wheel Assembly that is a ,steerable- full swivel, with spring, used as an experimental unit on 3 flights. It is available to the highest bidder. Contact me on ( lowellcfrank@yahoo.com ). Pieti Lowell Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=293165#293165 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:00:31 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: weekend cowl work From: "taildrags" VERY handsome piece of work! Clean lines, nice exhaust exits, tapered eyebrows... I like it better than most of the Corvair Piet cowlings. And is that a Tennessee Prop on the engine? Last question: have you figured out how you'll do the air intake/filter for the carb yet? -------- Oscar Zuniga San Antonio, TX Air Camper NX41CC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=293169#293169 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:31:55 AM PST US From: Michael Groah Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: weekend cowl work Oscar, The prop is a Culver. I'm still working on how i'm going to to the carb inlet area. I have several possible ideas, but I'm still working that part out. I'll get the rest of the cowl made and then come back to that and make a decision. ________________________________ From: taildrags Sent: Tue, April 6, 2010 6:00:13 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: weekend cowl work VERY handsome piece of work! Clean lines, nice exhaust exits, tapered eyebrows... I like it better than most of the Corvair Piet cowlings. And is that a Tennessee Prop on the engine? Last question: have you figured out how you'll do the air intake/filter for the carb yet? -------- Oscar Zuniga San Antonio, TX Air Camper NX41CC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=293169#293169 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:43:46 AM PST US From: Ryan Mueller Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Tail Wheel Assembly Hi Lowell, Just out of curiosity, is this the tailwheel that was on the airplane when it went to Oshkosh? Thanks, Ryan Sent from my iPhone On Apr 6, 2010, at 7:28 AM, "Pieti Lowell" wrote: > > > > I have a Ken Perkins Tail Wheel Assembly that is a ,steerable- full > swivel, with spring, used as an experimental unit on 3 flights. It > is available to the highest bidder. Contact me on ( lowellcfrank@yahoo.com > ). > Pieti Lowell > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=293165#293165 > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:59:08 AM PST US From: Mike King Subject: Pietenpol-List: ELT - EPIRB Shopping Hey gang, I have to replace my 12 year old ECK Technologies ELT. Since 121.5 is not monitored by satellites, I am now in the market for a 406 MHz transmitter or a combination of 406 / 121.5 transmission. I looked online at Aircraft Spruce and Wag Aero and saw the high priced offerings. Has anyone bought an ELT lately and if so, where and how much are they asking. Thanks in advance for the info. Mike King 77MK GN-1 Corpus Christi, Texas ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:59:08 AM PST US From: "TOM STINEMETZE" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Obfuscatory perambulation To the quick I am cut! I am soooo embarrassed! How could I have missed so obvious an error? Stinemetze >>> Jim Ash 4/6/2010 6:03 AM >>> The two needs to be outside the perenthesis. Jim -----Original Message----- From: TOM STINEMETZE Sent: Apr 5, 2010 2:24 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Obfuscatory perambulation The gentleman in this video has been hired by the Crank Snappin' Corvair Society (CS) to articulate our cause to the masses. ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 07:03:10 AM PST US From: "Jack Phillips" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: ELT - EPIRB Shopping There is no law requiring changing to 406 MHz (yet). How many Pietenpols have been found by satellites when presumed lost? 406 MHz didn't help Steve Fossett much. Jack Phillips NX899JP Raleigh, NC -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mike King Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2010 9:33 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: ELT - EPIRB Shopping Hey gang, I have to replace my 12 year old ECK Technologies ELT. Since 121.5 is not monitored by satellites, I am now in the market for a 406 MHz transmitter or a combination of 406 / 121.5 transmission. I looked online at Aircraft Spruce and Wag Aero and saw the high priced offerings. Has anyone bought an ELT lately and if so, where and how much are they asking. Thanks in advance for the info. Mike King 77MK GN-1 Corpus Christi, Texas ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 09:42:31 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: ELT - EPIRB Shopping From: Rick Holland Is an ELT required for a Piet to pass an airworthiness inspection? rick On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 7:32 AM, Mike King wrote: > > Hey gang, > > I have to replace my 12 year old ECK Technologies ELT. Since 121.5 is not monitored > by satellites, I am now in the market for a 406 MHz transmitter or a combination of > 406 / 121.5 transmission. > > I looked online at Aircraft Spruce and Wag Aero and saw the high priced offerings. > > Has anyone bought an ELT lately and if so, where and how much are they asking. > > Thanks in advance for the info. > > Mike King > 77MK > GN-1 > Corpus Christi, Texas > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 09:54:12 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: weekend cowl work From: Rick Holland Nice Mike, like the rounded bottom, kind of like the original Model A cowling. I was lazy and made mine flat on the bottom like most CSCS builders. rick On Mon, Apr 5, 2010 at 6:34 PM, Michael Groah wrote: > > I just thought I'd post some pics of the work we got done on the cowl this > past weekend. So far we just have the nose, top and bottom roughed in. We > will get to the sides in time. We have masking tape on the intake and > cooling scoops to keep from scratching them. We're no metal experts, but we > should be able to hack a cowl out of this. Anyways, I just thought I'd > share our progress. > > Mike Groah > Tulare CA > > > ** > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 09:59:31 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: ELT - EPIRB Shopping From: rgow@avionicsdesign.ca The cheapest one we sell is the Kanad for about 1,000$ Bob Sent on the TELUS Mobility network with BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: Rick Holland Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: ELT - EPIRB Shopping Is an ELT required for a Piet to pass an airworthiness inspection? rick On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 7:32 AM, Mike King wrote: > > Hey gang, > > I have to replace my 12 year old ECK Technologies ELT. Since 121.5 is not monitored > by satellites, I am now in the market for a 406 MHz transmitter or a combination of > 406 / 121.5 transmission. > > I looked online at Aircraft Spruce and Wag Aero and saw the high priced offerings. > > Has anyone bought an ELT lately and if so, where and how much are they asking. > > Thanks in advance for the info. > > Mike King > 77MK > GN-1 > Corpus Christi, Texas > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:53:17 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: 800x4 Cub wheels and brakes FS From: Ryan Mueller Good afternoon all, We still have a set of 800x4 wheels and brakes for sale. They were removed from a flying J-3 for an upgrade to larger wheels and tires. The wheels are in very good shape, and the Goodyear tires still have life left in them. They come with complete expander tube brake assemblies and drums, and Cub wheel covers. $*600* + shipping is what we are asking. We bought them for our Piet to have the nice, fat balloon tire look, but we are not going to need them any longer. Let me know if you are interested, and I can send some pictures. Thanks! Ryan ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 10:58:30 AM PST US From: Jim Ash Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: ELT - EPIRB Shopping I have a vague recollection of this question 15(?) years ago when I went to take the Cub out without one. IIRC, there was a loophole in the law that allowed for 'training flights' without one. There was also a 25nm limit. There were some other restrictions, too; training flights are not required to have an instructor, but cannot carry a passenger. Based on this, I'm thinking the summary answer is 'no'. On the less legal and more practical side, if you expect your inspector to be picky and he says you need one, I don't think I'd have the nerve to shove the law in his face as he's signing off your plane. You're gonna need one anyhow. If economics are an issue, borrow one for the day and 'temporarily' mount it. Jim Ash -----Original Message----- >From: Rick Holland >Sent: Apr 6, 2010 12:41 PM >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: ELT - EPIRB Shopping > > >Is an ELT required for a Piet to pass an airworthiness inspection? > >rick > >On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 7:32 AM, Mike King wrote: >> >> Hey gang, >> >> I have to replace my 12 year old ECK Technologies ELT. Since 121.5 is not monitored >> by satellites, I am now in the market for a 406 MHz transmitter or a combination of >> 406 / 121.5 transmission. >> >> I looked online at Aircraft Spruce and Wag Aero and saw the high priced offerings. >> >> Has anyone bought an ELT lately and if so, where and how much are they asking. >> >> Thanks in advance for the info. >> >> Mike King >> 77MK >> GN-1 >> Corpus Christi, Texas >> >> >> >> >> > > >-- >Rick Holland >Castle Rock, Colorado > >"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 12:10:41 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Toe-in From: "skellytown flyer" Well after the terrible news about the landing incident I decided to check the toe-in or out on my project I'm trying to complete.as usual I find more than I wanted to. the Cub gear I got from D.J. looks really nice with the white powder coat finish.I know I had to modify the mounting holes in a couple of locations when I mounted it.but figured all was well. good thing I went back and checked. there seems to be almost a full 3/8" toe in from the front of the tire to the rear.that is what I call a pretty significant amount -especially when I have been told that if anything it is better to have a slight toe out on conventional gear.not sure whether I'll have to use heat or just what to adjust this but if anybody has advice concerning lining up Cub style gear I'd appreciate it.I'm glad I found it now rather than later. I am doing the check with the tail up in near normal flight attitude.Raymond Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=293218#293218 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 12:24:17 PM PST US From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation]" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Toe-in Raymond-- if you own the Bingelis books he specifically talks about how to measure and correct for toe in/out issues. ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 12:58:17 PM PST US From: "David Paule" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Toe-in Can't help with a Cub gear, but for a Cessna 180 or 185, at flight weight, there's supposed to be zero toe-in or toe-out. I'd think that would be a good starting place. Mechanics use grease-plates for this to account for gear flex. You can use plastic trash bags instead of grease. Get a couple large aluminum plates (1/8" thick works okay) and either put a trash bag between them or a handful of grease, and then roll the main wheel tire on to them. The upper plate will side around a bit and that'll change the indication of toe-in somewhat. As memory goes, on a 185, the maximum toe-in was 1/8" across the wheel rim itself, not the whole tire. But I could be wrong about that - the zero toe-in at flight weight is a reliable data point. David Paule > > > Well after the terrible news about the landing incident I decided to check > the toe-in or out on my project I'm trying to complete.as usual I find > more than I wanted to. the Cub gear I got from D.J. looks really nice with > the white powder coat finish.I know I had to modify the mounting holes in > a couple of locations when I mounted it.but figured all was well. good > thing I went back and checked. there seems to be almost a full 3/8" toe in > from the front of the tire to the rear.that is what I call a pretty > significant amount -especially when I have been told that if anything it > is better to have a slight toe out on conventional gear.not sure whether > I'll have to use heat or just what to adjust this but if anybody has > advice concerning lining up Cub style gear I'd appreciate it.I'm glad I > found it now rather than later. I am doing the check with the tail up in > near normal flight attitude.Raymond > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 01:31:46 PM PST US From: Jim Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: weekend cowl work Your cowling is looking good Mike. I am always curious about how to cowl the Corvair and not have the rocker arm covers show. I'm going to try a PA-18 style pressure cowl, but thats quite still quite a way off yet. How close to running your engine are you? Jim B. Jim Boyer Santa Rosa, CA Pietenpol on wheels Tail surfaces done Wing ribs done Corvair engine Apr 5, 2010 05:52:21 PM, pietenpol-list@matronics.com wrote: I just thought I'd post some pics of the work we got done on the cowl this past weekend. So far we just have the nose, top and bottom roughed in. We will get to the sides in time. We have masking tape on the intake and cooling scoops to keep from scratching them. We're no metal experts, but we should be able to hack a cowl out of this. Anyways, I just thought I'd share our progress. Mike Groah Tulare CA ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 01:48:56 PM PST US From: Michael Groah Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: weekend cowl work Jim..., Your PA-18 style cowl will look good. I just wanted a little older look than that. My goal at this time is to run the engine this summer. I have most things wired and I can now push the starter button on the panel and crank the engine over! I just have to finish a little wiring and plumbing (both fuel and oil) and I'll be close. I'm really looking forward to hearing that engine run and feeling the breeze come off that hunk of wood on the end of the crankshaft. I'm excited to see pics of your progress too. Get some pics and let us all see how you're progressing. ________________________________ From: Jim Sent: Tue, April 6, 2010 1:30:28 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: weekend cowl work Your cowling is looking good Mike. I am always curious about how to cowl the Corvair and not have the rocker arm covers show. I'm going to try a PA-18 style pressure cowl, but thats quite still quite a way off yet. How close to running your engine are you? Jim B. Jim Boyer Santa Rosa, CA Pietenpol on wheels Tail surfaces done Wing ribs done Corvair engine Apr 5, 2010 05:52:21 PM, pietenpol-list@matronics.com wrote: I just thought I'd post some pics of the work we got done on the cowl this past weekend. So far we just have the nose, top and bottom roughed in. We will get to the sides in time. We have masking tape on the intake and cooling scoops to keep from scratching them. We're no metal experts, but we should be able to hack a cowl out of this. Anyways, I just thought I'd share our progress. Mike Groah Tulare CA ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 02:13:39 PM PST US From: "Douwe Blumberg" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! Okay, here goes... First of all, thank you guys from the bottom of my heart for your genuine letters of encouragement and sympathy. No feelings have been hurt, and I actually appreciate the "kick in the pants" approach. I spent the morning going over the damage. The end result is that I will absolutely rebuild her and plan on bringing her home this week to start. Won't be at Brodhead this year, maybe next? The main damage that I am a bit unsure of how to fix is to the left wing, outboard of the strut attach points. As it rolled, the leading edge was pushed down and cracked the leading edge ribs and the bottom of the ribs from the struts outward. The spars are fine and the leading edge is fine, just the ribs are crunched. Just ordered the FAA repair manual to see what it has to say, and any suggestions would be appreciated. Anybody up for a wing fixing party (Larry Williams, Gene??) other fixes: Fix, recover and repaint left wing fin leading edge cracked various brace cables busted wheels, axle and brakes shot wing tank dented rad dented replace prop some bulkhead damage in pilot leg holes cross brace busted loos behind pilot seatback bulkhead check out engine (sure it's fine, didn't really hit, just the prop tips hit until it turned over). some sheet metal repair. turtle deck repair where shoulder harness pulled up and through fabric as Lowell hung there. try to match paint and repaint turtledeck to match rest of fuse bent throttle rod at quadrant leaky fuel connection new diagonal cabane braces did I miss anything?.... A few lessons learned from inspecting the damage. 1. If you used 1/16th cable to brace your tail... double nicropress them, two or three pulled out of the nico sleeve, and I had gauged them. I will use heavier next time. 2. Don't try to save a couple ounces with the diagonal cabane braces, make them stout enough to keep the wing back because if you have a wing tank, or a passenger, you really want that wing to stay put. 3. The "Jenny" gear is as tough as BHP said it was, while the wheels took up a lot of the impact, and were trashed, the basic gear is fairly unscathed. I have no doubt the slit gear would have sheared off, I'm not saying one is better than the other, they are just strong in different areas. 4. USE GOOD SHOULDER HARNESS, AND ANCHOR IT WELL!! mine is the short fuse and you are right up to the instrument panel. Lowell didn't even scratch his nose, yet he rebounded hard enough to break the brace behind the seatback bulkhead. Thank God I spent a lot of effort here. Also, the seatbelt held him in as he hung there and maybe prevented some nasty neck injuries. This was just a simple ground loop that can happen to anyone, but could have been disasterous because of the ditch, but it wasn't because of the belt and harness. 5. Lowell suggests, padding or rounding under the edge of the instrument panel. When upside down, crawling out, that edge peeled some skin off his shins which were already skinned by the tops of the leg apetures in the bulkhead. Maybe enlarge these and pad them? 6. You guys building wood struts or cabanes, don't worry about their strength. thanks again guys! Douwe ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 02:27:45 PM PST US From: shad bell Subject: Pietenpol-List: Ohio piet fly-in 2010 OK Group, I have been out in the hanger today starting on the annual on the piet, I am trying to get another estimate on atendance. It will be Sat June 19, the day befor father's day. If people want to fly in on friday afternoon that is fine with me, I have room for tent camping, or you can put a air-matress in the hanger. I have only a garden hose for water, and plan on getting some "Mexican Space Capsules" (terd closets) for nature calls. There are hotels within 20 min of here, and I can provide a ride for a few people or you can borrow my "courtisy car" if you perfer a hotel room. I need to get a rough head count so I can plan for buying the food, beverages etc. I should have plenty of parking for aircraft, and probably enough room for about 15-20 cars, possibly more if you walk about 1/4 mile. I do not have room for RV's (the 6 wheeled kind), the flying ones are welcome. Be advised that there is a NOTAM (or probably will be) that the field is for tailwheels only, per the airport owner. Our field has recently been opened for public use, for airport protection from a utillity company. I look forward to any and all who plan to fly in, Jack Phillips, You can buzz up here in your RV-4 so Mike C. won't have any excuse not to come down. Beer will be cold,(after the flying is done) The B.S. deep, and good times for all. The Date again is June 19, 2010, Location is OH71, Centerburg Ohio (25 miles North of Columbus), Fuel is available at Wynkoop Airport about 15 miles away, and he usually has the lowest price, he sells for about .20 over cost, at least that's what it was the past few years. Shad ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 02:27:46 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! From: Ryan Mueller Congratulations Douwe! Great to hear. I'm sure she will come out looking as good or better than before! Ryan do not archive On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 4:17 PM, Douwe Blumberg wrote: > douweblumberg@earthlink.net> > > Okay, here goes... > > First of all, thank you guys from the bottom of my heart for your genuine > letters of encouragement and sympathy. No feelings have been hurt, and I > actually appreciate the "kick in the pants" approach. > > I spent the morning going over the damage. The end result is that I will > absolutely rebuild her and plan on bringing her home this week to start. > Won't be at Brodhead this year, maybe next? > > The main damage that I am a bit unsure of how to fix is to the left wing, > outboard of the strut attach points. As it rolled, the leading edge was > pushed down and cracked the leading edge ribs and the bottom of the ribs > from the struts outward. The spars are fine and the leading edge is fine, > just the ribs are crunched. Just ordered the FAA repair manual to see what > it has to say, and any suggestions would be appreciated. Anybody up for a > wing fixing party (Larry Williams, Gene??) > > other fixes: > > Fix, recover and repaint left wing > fin leading edge cracked > various brace cables busted > wheels, axle and brakes shot > wing tank dented > rad dented > replace prop > some bulkhead damage in pilot leg holes > cross brace busted loos behind pilot seatback bulkhead > check out engine (sure it's fine, didn't really hit, just the prop tips hit > until it turned over). > some sheet metal repair. > turtle deck repair where shoulder harness pulled up and through fabric as > Lowell hung there. > try to match paint and repaint turtledeck to match rest of fuse > bent throttle rod at quadrant > leaky fuel connection > new diagonal cabane braces > > did I miss anything?.... > > A few lessons learned from inspecting the damage. > 1. If you used 1/16th cable to brace your tail... double nicropress them, > two or three pulled out of the nico sleeve, and I had gauged them. I will > use heavier next time. > > 2. Don't try to save a couple ounces with the diagonal cabane braces, make > them stout enough to keep the wing back because if you have a wing tank, or > a passenger, you really want that wing to stay put. > > 3. The "Jenny" gear is as tough as BHP said it was, while the wheels took > up a lot of the impact, and were trashed, the basic gear is fairly > unscathed. I have no doubt the slit gear would have sheared off, I'm not > saying one is better than the other, they are just strong in different > areas. > > 4. USE GOOD SHOULDER HARNESS, AND ANCHOR IT WELL!! mine is the short fuse > and you are right up to the instrument panel. Lowell didn't even scratch > his nose, yet he rebounded hard enough to break the brace behind the > seatback bulkhead. Thank God I spent a lot of effort here. Also, the > seatbelt held him in as he hung there and maybe prevented some nasty neck > injuries. This was just a simple ground loop that can happen to anyone, > but > could have been disasterous because of the ditch, but it wasn't because of > the belt and harness. > > 5. Lowell suggests, padding or rounding under the edge of the instrument > panel. When upside down, crawling out, that edge peeled some skin off his > shins which were already skinned by the tops of the leg apetures in the > bulkhead. Maybe enlarge these and pad them? > > 6. You guys building wood struts or cabanes, don't worry about their > strength. > > > thanks again guys! > > Douwe > > ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 02:38:40 PM PST US From: Tim Willis Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! Douwe, Readnig the details, the damage sounds extensive, but the real structural damage sounds pretty minimal. Best news-- great!-- is that your psyche has recovered. Thanks for sharing the tips. What do you mean by "double nicopress" on the sleeves? Thanks, Tim in central TX -----Original Message----- >From: Douwe Blumberg >Sent: Apr 6, 2010 4:17 PM >To: pietenpolgroup >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! > > >Okay, here goes... > >First of all, thank you guys from the bottom of my heart for your genuine >letters of encouragement and sympathy. No feelings have been hurt, and I >actually appreciate the "kick in the pants" approach. > >I spent the morning going over the damage. The end result is that I will >absolutely rebuild her and plan on bringing her home this week to start. >Won't be at Brodhead this year, maybe next? > >The main damage that I am a bit unsure of how to fix is to the left wing, >outboard of the strut attach points. As it rolled, the leading edge was >pushed down and cracked the leading edge ribs and the bottom of the ribs >from the struts outward. The spars are fine and the leading edge is fine, >just the ribs are crunched. Just ordered the FAA repair manual to see what >it has to say, and any suggestions would be appreciated. Anybody up for a >wing fixing party (Larry Williams, Gene??) > >other fixes: > >Fix, recover and repaint left wing >fin leading edge cracked >various brace cables busted >wheels, axle and brakes shot >wing tank dented >rad dented >replace prop >some bulkhead damage in pilot leg holes >cross brace busted loos behind pilot seatback bulkhead >check out engine (sure it's fine, didn't really hit, just the prop tips hit >until it turned over). >some sheet metal repair. >turtle deck repair where shoulder harness pulled up and through fabric as >Lowell hung there. >try to match paint and repaint turtledeck to match rest of fuse >bent throttle rod at quadrant >leaky fuel connection >new diagonal cabane braces > >did I miss anything?.... > >A few lessons learned from inspecting the damage. >1. If you used 1/16th cable to brace your tail... double nicropress them, >two or three pulled out of the nico sleeve, and I had gauged them. I will >use heavier next time. > >2. Don't try to save a couple ounces with the diagonal cabane braces, make >them stout enough to keep the wing back because if you have a wing tank, or >a passenger, you really want that wing to stay put. > >3. The "Jenny" gear is as tough as BHP said it was, while the wheels took >up a lot of the impact, and were trashed, the basic gear is fairly >unscathed. I have no doubt the slit gear would have sheared off, I'm not >saying one is better than the other, they are just strong in different >areas. > >4. USE GOOD SHOULDER HARNESS, AND ANCHOR IT WELL!! mine is the short fuse >and you are right up to the instrument panel. Lowell didn't even scratch >his nose, yet he rebounded hard enough to break the brace behind the >seatback bulkhead. Thank God I spent a lot of effort here. Also, the >seatbelt held him in as he hung there and maybe prevented some nasty neck >injuries. This was just a simple ground loop that can happen to anyone, but >could have been disasterous because of the ditch, but it wasn't because of >the belt and harness. > >5. Lowell suggests, padding or rounding under the edge of the instrument >panel. When upside down, crawling out, that edge peeled some skin off his >shins which were already skinned by the tops of the leg apetures in the >bulkhead. Maybe enlarge these and pad them? > >6. You guys building wood struts or cabanes, don't worry about their >strength. > > >thanks again guys! > >Douwe > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 02:40:10 PM PST US From: shad bell Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! Att'a boy Douwe, get back in there! As for rib repairs look at ac-43-13. I had some rib repairs to do when my Jungster wing hit the floor, I used a combo of ac-43-13, and some boyhood experiances of rebuilding crashed model airplanes to fix the ribs. One option that may be appropriate st to scarff the broken caps togeather, and cut a piece of 1/16 ply to the profile of the rib and glue it to one side of the rib, in place of the other little gussets. This worked on 2 of my broken ribs, of course don't overbuild as it ads weight. I know how it can piss you off, I allmost threw my wing in the yard and ran it over with the tractor. After I got started on repairs they only took about 10-15 hrs. As for getting a good gluing surface, I used a GOOD, sharp wood chissle to scrape the varnish off. Hold the chissle almost 90 degrees from your work, and draw it across the wood, and the varnish will scrape off nicely. I would recomend T-88 for a repair glue, just in case the varnish was thinned enough to really soak into the wood fibers and deeply seal them. T-88 is forgiving as well, keep joints tight, but t-88 will fill small imperfections. It will go faster than you think. Shad ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 02:45:55 PM PST US From: "David Paule" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! Douwe, (Offline) Thanks so much for the helpful suggestions. That's absolutely a great thing for you to write, and just wanted to say, way to go! on that. Thanks, David Paule ----- Original Message ----- From: "Douwe Blumberg" Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2010 3:17 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! > > > Okay, here goes... > > First of all, thank you guys from the bottom of my heart for your genuine > letters of encouragement and sympathy. No feelings have been hurt, and I > actually appreciate the "kick in the pants" approach. > > I spent the morning going over the damage. The end result is that I will > absolutely rebuild her and plan on bringing her home this week to start. > Won't be at Brodhead this year, maybe next? > > The main damage that I am a bit unsure of how to fix is to the left wing, > outboard of the strut attach points. As it rolled, the leading edge was > pushed down and cracked the leading edge ribs and the bottom of the ribs > from the struts outward. The spars are fine and the leading edge is fine, > just the ribs are crunched. Just ordered the FAA repair manual to see > what > it has to say, and any suggestions would be appreciated. Anybody up for a > wing fixing party (Larry Williams, Gene??) > > other fixes: > > Fix, recover and repaint left wing > fin leading edge cracked > various brace cables busted > wheels, axle and brakes shot > wing tank dented > rad dented > replace prop > some bulkhead damage in pilot leg holes > cross brace busted loos behind pilot seatback bulkhead > check out engine (sure it's fine, didn't really hit, just the prop tips > hit > until it turned over). > some sheet metal repair. > turtle deck repair where shoulder harness pulled up and through fabric as > Lowell hung there. > try to match paint and repaint turtledeck to match rest of fuse > bent throttle rod at quadrant > leaky fuel connection > new diagonal cabane braces > > did I miss anything?.... > > A few lessons learned from inspecting the damage. > 1. If you used 1/16th cable to brace your tail... double nicropress them, > two or three pulled out of the nico sleeve, and I had gauged them. I will > use heavier next time. > > 2. Don't try to save a couple ounces with the diagonal cabane braces, > make > them stout enough to keep the wing back because if you have a wing tank, > or > a passenger, you really want that wing to stay put. > > 3. The "Jenny" gear is as tough as BHP said it was, while the wheels took > up a lot of the impact, and were trashed, the basic gear is fairly > unscathed. I have no doubt the slit gear would have sheared off, I'm not > saying one is better than the other, they are just strong in different > areas. > > 4. USE GOOD SHOULDER HARNESS, AND ANCHOR IT WELL!! mine is the short > fuse > and you are right up to the instrument panel. Lowell didn't even scratch > his nose, yet he rebounded hard enough to break the brace behind the > seatback bulkhead. Thank God I spent a lot of effort here. Also, the > seatbelt held him in as he hung there and maybe prevented some nasty neck > injuries. This was just a simple ground loop that can happen to anyone, > but > could have been disasterous because of the ditch, but it wasn't because of > the belt and harness. > > 5. Lowell suggests, padding or rounding under the edge of the instrument > panel. When upside down, crawling out, that edge peeled some skin off his > shins which were already skinned by the tops of the leg apetures in the > bulkhead. Maybe enlarge these and pad them? > > 6. You guys building wood struts or cabanes, don't worry about their > strength. > > > thanks again guys! > > Douwe > > > ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 02:52:44 PM PST US From: "gcardinal" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: ELT - EPIRB Shopping Rick An ELT is not required to pass an airworthiness inspection. Greg Cardinal ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rick Holland" Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2010 11:41 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: ELT - EPIRB Shopping > > Is an ELT required for a Piet to pass an airworthiness inspection? > > rick > > On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 7:32 AM, Mike King wrote: >> >> Hey gang, >> >> I have to replace my 12 year old ECK Technologies ELT. Since 121.5 is not >> monitored >> by satellites, I am now in the market for a 406 MHz transmitter or a >> combination of >> 406 / 121.5 transmission. >> >> I looked online at Aircraft Spruce and Wag Aero and saw the high priced >> offerings. >> >> Has anyone bought an ELT lately and if so, where and how much are they >> asking. >> >> Thanks in advance for the info. >> >> Mike King >> 77MK >> GN-1 >> Corpus Christi, Texas >> >> >> >> >> > > > -- > Rick Holland > Castle Rock, Colorado > > "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" > > > ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 02:58:46 PM PST US From: bcolleran@comcast.net Subject: Pietenpol-List: PIetenpol Wood Hey guys getting ready to place my wood order and got a great price from ai rcraft spruce with shipping.=C2- They say I should order another 500 ft o f 1/2" x 1/4" capstrip.=C2- Any idea what this is for?=C2- Glue, I see T-88 is the prefered glue, any suggestions on what size to orde r?=C2- How do you prefer it ready mix or mix it yourself?=C2- Lastly, sorry I do not have my plans in front of me and I want to get this order in, for gusset plywood what are you all ordering?=C2- Thanks, Bill ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 03:20:06 PM PST US From: Ben Charvet Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: PIetenpol Wood As I remember, the Aircraft Spruce wood kit for the Pietenpol doesn't include the 1/2 x 1/4 strips for making the wing ribs and tail surfaces. 500 ft sounds about right if you are planning to buy from them. I used a total of 3 quarts of T-88, but I would just order one quart to start. I ordered a 2 ft X 4 ft piece of 1/16" birch plywood from either wicks or aircraft spruce for the wing rib gussets. Ribs are a good place to start to see if you have the stamina for the long haul. I spent 2 months making mine. Ben Charvet NX866BC On 4/6/2010 5:58 PM, bcolleran@comcast.net wrote: > > Hey guys getting ready to place my wood order and got a great price > from aircraft spruce with shipping. They say I should order another > 500 ft of 1/2" x 1/4" capstrip. Any idea what this is for? > > Glue, I see T-88 is the prefered glue, any suggestions on what size to > order? How do you prefer it ready mix or mix it yourself? > > Lastly, sorry I do not have my plans in front of me and I want to get > this order in, for gusset plywood what are you all ordering? > > Thanks, > > Bill > > * > > > * ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 03:38:33 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: PIetenpol Wood From: "Bill Church" I wouldn't recommend buying your T-88 pre-mixed. It'll be really hard to get out of the bottle. DO NOT ARCHIVE Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=293244#293244 ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 03:59:03 PM PST US From: Michael Groah Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: weekend cowl work Thanks Rick. I really like the rounded bottoms that the model A and some of the A65 guys have too, and I wanted to have that look, but with the Corvair. My dad spent a lot of time making poster board patterns and then created the oval nosecone which was located in it's place. Then he and I spent a couple days creating the top and bottom cowls that you saw in the pics. It wasn't too difficult really, just careful work. The top cowl was done on a slip roll but the bottom one my dad used a wood post and the pole of a basketball hoop to hand form the curve (so there is no need of any special tools). Then we just cut and fit it. I'm looking forward to getting some sides on it to complete the look. Mike Groah ________________________________ From: Rick Holland Sent: Tue, April 6, 2010 9:53:23 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: weekend cowl work Nice Mike, like the rounded bottom, kind of like the original Model A cowling. I was lazy and made mine flat on the bottom like most CSCS builders. rick On Mon, Apr 5, 2010 at 6:34 PM, Michael Groah wrote: > >I just thought I'd post some pics of the work we got done on the cowl this past weekend. So far we just have the nose, top and bottom roughed in. We will get to the sides in time. We have masking tape on the intake and cooling scoops to keep from scratching them. We're no metal experts, but we should be able to hack a cowl out of this. Anyways, I just thought I'd share our progress. > >Mike Groah >Tulare CA > > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 04:04:43 PM PST US From: "walt" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: PIetenpol Wood Good one! walt evans NX140DL ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Church To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2010 6:38 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: PIetenpol Wood I wouldn't recommend buying your T-88 pre-mixed. It'll be really hard to get out of the bottle. DO NOT ARCHIVE Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=293244#293244 ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 04:18:32 PM PST US From: "Jason Holmes" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Ohio piet fly-in 2010 Shad, My Dad and I will be driving in for the afternoon or so. I need to get some pictures and some motivation to start my Piet. Jason Holmes -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of shad bell Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2010 5:25 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Ohio piet fly-in 2010 OK Group, I have been out in the hanger today starting on the annual on the piet, I am trying to get another estimate on atendance. It will be Sat June 19, the day befor father's day. If people want to fly in on friday afternoon that is fine with me, I have room for tent camping, or you can put a air-matress in the hanger. I have only a garden hose for water, and plan on getting some "Mexican Space Capsules" (terd closets) for nature calls. There are hotels within 20 min of here, and I can provide a ride for a few people or you can borrow my "courtisy car" if you perfer a hotel room. I need to get a rough head count so I can plan for buying the food, beverages etc. I should have plenty of parking for aircraft, and probably enough room for about 15-20 cars, possibly more if you walk about 1/4 mile. I do not have room for RV's (the 6 wheeled kind), the flying ones are welcome. Be advised that there is a NOTAM (or probably will be) that the field is for tailwheels only, per the airport owner. Our field has recently been opened for public use, for airport protection from a utillity company. I look forward to any and all who plan to fly in, Jack Phillips, You can buzz up here in your RV-4 so Mike C. won't have any excuse not to come down. Beer will be cold,(after the flying is done) The B.S. deep, and good times for all. The Date again is June 19, 2010, Location is OH71, Centerburg Ohio (25 miles North of Columbus), Fuel is available at Wynkoop Airport about 15 miles away, and he usually has the lowest price, he sells for about .20 over cost, at least that's what it was the past few years. Shad ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 04:18:32 PM PST US From: "Jack Phillips" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: ELT - EPIRB Shopping No. The only time you might get checked is if you have a ramp check by the feds. An inspector from the FSDO did my A/W inspection and never asked about the ELT. ELT's are not required during flight testing an aircraft. Jack Phillips NX899JP Raleigh, NC -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Holland Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2010 12:42 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: ELT - EPIRB Shopping Is an ELT required for a Piet to pass an airworthiness inspection? rick On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 7:32 AM, Mike King wrote: > > Hey gang, > > I have to replace my 12 year old ECK Technologies ELT. Since 121.5 is not monitored > by satellites, I am now in the market for a 406 MHz transmitter or a combination of > 406 / 121.5 transmission. > > I looked online at Aircraft Spruce and Wag Aero and saw the high priced offerings. > > Has anyone bought an ELT lately and if so, where and how much are they asking. > > Thanks in advance for the info. > > Mike King > 77MK > GN-1 > Corpus Christi, Texas > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 04:36:27 PM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: weekend cowl work Rick, I like your 'louvers' in the nose! Gary Boothe Cool, CA Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion Tail done, Fuselage on gear 18 ribs done From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Holland Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2010 9:53 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: weekend cowl work Nice Mike, like the rounded bottom, kind of like the original Model A cowling. I was lazy and made mine flat on the bottom like most CSCS builders. rick On Mon, Apr 5, 2010 at 6:34 PM, Michael Groah wrote: I just thought I'd post some pics of the work we got done on the cowl this past weekend. So far we just have the nose, top and bottom roughed in. We will get to the sides in time. We have masking tape on the intake and cooling scoops to keep from scratching them. We're no metal experts, but we should be able to hack a cowl out of this. Anyways, I just thought I'd share our progress. Mike Groah Tulare CA -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 04:36:49 PM PST US From: "Jack Phillips" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! Excellent, Douwe! Shad is right, AC 43.13 will detail how the ribs should be repaired. I had one broken rib in my mishap and was able to repair it without removing the fabric (it helps to have worked for a company that made laparoscopic surgical instruments). If all the outboard ribs are borken you will probably have to remove the fabric, at least on that portion of the wing. That will make the actual rib repairs much easier. As Shad said, you can probably scarf the capstrips back together if they weren't splintered too badly and add 1/16" plywood gussets on either side of each rib. The lessons learned was very good. Very insightful and useful information based on real world experience. Thanks! Best of luck with the repairs. Let us know the date of the Wing Repair Party and if I can, I'll be there. Where are you located? Jack Phillips NX899JP Raleigh, NC -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Douwe Blumberg Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2010 5:17 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! Okay, here goes... First of all, thank you guys from the bottom of my heart for your genuine letters of encouragement and sympathy. No feelings have been hurt, and I actually appreciate the "kick in the pants" approach. I spent the morning going over the damage. The end result is that I will absolutely rebuild her and plan on bringing her home this week to start. Won't be at Brodhead this year, maybe next? The main damage that I am a bit unsure of how to fix is to the left wing, outboard of the strut attach points. As it rolled, the leading edge was pushed down and cracked the leading edge ribs and the bottom of the ribs from the struts outward. The spars are fine and the leading edge is fine, just the ribs are crunched. Just ordered the FAA repair manual to see what it has to say, and any suggestions would be appreciated. Anybody up for a wing fixing party (Larry Williams, Gene??) other fixes: Fix, recover and repaint left wing fin leading edge cracked various brace cables busted wheels, axle and brakes shot wing tank dented rad dented replace prop some bulkhead damage in pilot leg holes cross brace busted loos behind pilot seatback bulkhead check out engine (sure it's fine, didn't really hit, just the prop tips hit until it turned over). some sheet metal repair. turtle deck repair where shoulder harness pulled up and through fabric as Lowell hung there. try to match paint and repaint turtledeck to match rest of fuse bent throttle rod at quadrant leaky fuel connection new diagonal cabane braces did I miss anything?.... A few lessons learned from inspecting the damage. 1. If you used 1/16th cable to brace your tail... double nicropress them, two or three pulled out of the nico sleeve, and I had gauged them. I will use heavier next time. 2. Don't try to save a couple ounces with the diagonal cabane braces, make them stout enough to keep the wing back because if you have a wing tank, or a passenger, you really want that wing to stay put. 3. The "Jenny" gear is as tough as BHP said it was, while the wheels took up a lot of the impact, and were trashed, the basic gear is fairly unscathed. I have no doubt the slit gear would have sheared off, I'm not saying one is better than the other, they are just strong in different areas. 4. USE GOOD SHOULDER HARNESS, AND ANCHOR IT WELL!! mine is the short fuse and you are right up to the instrument panel. Lowell didn't even scratch his nose, yet he rebounded hard enough to break the brace behind the seatback bulkhead. Thank God I spent a lot of effort here. Also, the seatbelt held him in as he hung there and maybe prevented some nasty neck injuries. This was just a simple ground loop that can happen to anyone, but could have been disasterous because of the ditch, but it wasn't because of the belt and harness. 5. Lowell suggests, padding or rounding under the edge of the instrument panel. When upside down, crawling out, that edge peeled some skin off his shins which were already skinned by the tops of the leg apetures in the bulkhead. Maybe enlarge these and pad them? 6. You guys building wood struts or cabanes, don't worry about their strength. thanks again guys! Douwe ________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________ Time: 05:08:31 PM PST US From: "Gene & Tammy" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! Douwe, If there is any way possible, I will be at the wing fixing party! Where do you live? I'm so glad you didn't take me wrong. When an artist creates something as beautiful as you have, he just can't let all of his labors be for nothing. You have made my day! Gene In beautiful Tennessee N502R ----- Original Message ----- From: "Douwe Blumberg" Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2010 4:17 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! > > > Okay, here goes... > > First of all, thank you guys from the bottom of my heart for your genuine > letters of encouragement and sympathy. No feelings have been hurt, and I > actually appreciate the "kick in the pants" approach. > > I spent the morning going over the damage. The end result is that I will > absolutely rebuild her and plan on bringing her home this week to start. > Won't be at Brodhead this year, maybe next? > > The main damage that I am a bit unsure of how to fix is to the left wing, > outboard of the strut attach points. As it rolled, the leading edge was > pushed down and cracked the leading edge ribs and the bottom of the ribs > from the struts outward. The spars are fine and the leading edge is fine, > just the ribs are crunched. Just ordered the FAA repair manual to see > what > it has to say, and any suggestions would be appreciated. Anybody up for a > wing fixing party (Larry Williams, Gene??) > > other fixes: > > Fix, recover and repaint left wing > fin leading edge cracked > various brace cables busted > wheels, axle and brakes shot > wing tank dented > rad dented > replace prop > some bulkhead damage in pilot leg holes > cross brace busted loos behind pilot seatback bulkhead > check out engine (sure it's fine, didn't really hit, just the prop tips > hit > until it turned over). > some sheet metal repair. > turtle deck repair where shoulder harness pulled up and through fabric as > Lowell hung there. > try to match paint and repaint turtledeck to match rest of fuse > bent throttle rod at quadrant > leaky fuel connection > new diagonal cabane braces > > did I miss anything?.... > > A few lessons learned from inspecting the damage. > 1. If you used 1/16th cable to brace your tail... double nicropress them, > two or three pulled out of the nico sleeve, and I had gauged them. I will > use heavier next time. > > 2. Don't try to save a couple ounces with the diagonal cabane braces, > make > them stout enough to keep the wing back because if you have a wing tank, > or > a passenger, you really want that wing to stay put. > > 3. The "Jenny" gear is as tough as BHP said it was, while the wheels took > up a lot of the impact, and were trashed, the basic gear is fairly > unscathed. I have no doubt the slit gear would have sheared off, I'm not > saying one is better than the other, they are just strong in different > areas. > > 4. USE GOOD SHOULDER HARNESS, AND ANCHOR IT WELL!! mine is the short > fuse > and you are right up to the instrument panel. Lowell didn't even scratch > his nose, yet he rebounded hard enough to break the brace behind the > seatback bulkhead. Thank God I spent a lot of effort here. Also, the > seatbelt held him in as he hung there and maybe prevented some nasty neck > injuries. This was just a simple ground loop that can happen to anyone, > but > could have been disasterous because of the ditch, but it wasn't because of > the belt and harness. > > 5. Lowell suggests, padding or rounding under the edge of the instrument > panel. When upside down, crawling out, that edge peeled some skin off his > shins which were already skinned by the tops of the leg apetures in the > bulkhead. Maybe enlarge these and pad them? > > 6. You guys building wood struts or cabanes, don't worry about their > strength. > > > thanks again guys! > > Douwe > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 06:32:00 ________________________________ Message 36 ____________________________________ Time: 05:22:13 PM PST US From: William Colleran Subject: Pietenpol-List: New England pietenpol Hey all looking to see if there is any pietenpols in new England? Bill Sent from my iPhone ________________________________ Message 37 ____________________________________ Time: 05:49:58 PM PST US From: airlion Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! douwe,let me know where you are located. i may be able to come up and help, ----- Original Message ---- From: Douwe Blumberg Sent: Tue, April 6, 2010 5:17:04 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! Okay, here goes... First of all, thank you guys from the bottom of my heart for your genuine letters of encouragement and sympathy. No feelings have been hurt, and I actually appreciate the "kick in the pants" approach. I spent the morning going over the damage. The end result is that I will absolutely rebuild her and plan on bringing her home this week to start. Won't be at Brodhead this year, maybe next? The main damage that I am a bit unsure of how to fix is to the left wing, outboard of the strut attach points. As it rolled, the leading edge was pushed down and cracked the leading edge ribs and the bottom of the ribs from the struts outward. The spars are fine and the leading edge is fine, just the ribs are crunched. Just ordered the FAA repair manual to see what it has to say, and any suggestions would be appreciated. Anybody up for a wing fixing party (Larry Williams, Gene??) other fixes: Fix, recover and repaint left wing fin leading edge cracked various brace cables busted wheels, axle and brakes shot wing tank dented rad dented replace prop some bulkhead damage in pilot leg holes cross brace busted loos behind pilot seatback bulkhead check out engine (sure it's fine, didn't really hit, just the prop tips hit until it turned over). some sheet metal repair. turtle deck repair where shoulder harness pulled up and through fabric as Lowell hung there. try to match paint and repaint turtledeck to match rest of fuse bent throttle rod at quadrant leaky fuel connection new diagonal cabane braces did I miss anything?.... A few lessons learned from inspecting the damage. 1. If you used 1/16th cable to brace your tail... double nicropress them, two or three pulled out of the nico sleeve, and I had gauged them. I will use heavier next time. 2. Don't try to save a couple ounces with the diagonal cabane braces, make them stout enough to keep the wing back because if you have a wing tank, or a passenger, you really want that wing to stay put. 3. The "Jenny" gear is as tough as BHP said it was, while the wheels took up a lot of the impact, and were trashed, the basic gear is fairly unscathed. I have no doubt the slit gear would have sheared off, I'm not saying one is better than the other, they are just strong in different areas. 4. USE GOOD SHOULDER HARNESS, AND ANCHOR IT WELL!! mine is the short fuse and you are right up to the instrument panel. Lowell didn't even scratch his nose, yet he rebounded hard enough to break the brace behind the seatback bulkhead. Thank God I spent a lot of effort here. Also, the seatbelt held him in as he hung there and maybe prevented some nasty neck injuries. This was just a simple ground loop that can happen to anyone, but could have been disasterous because of the ditch, but it wasn't because of the belt and harness. 5. Lowell suggests, padding or rounding under the edge of the instrument panel. When upside down, crawling out, that edge peeled some skin off his shins which were already skinned by the tops of the leg apetures in the bulkhead. Maybe enlarge these and pad them? 6. You guys building wood struts or cabanes, don't worry about their strength. thanks again guys! Douwe ________________________________ Message 38 ____________________________________ Time: 06:42:34 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Mike Groah--your side door From: John Fay Mike, I have a quick question about the side door on your fuselage. How did you engineer that to maintain the required fuselage strength, or did you use plans from someone else? John Fay in Peoria ________________________________ Message 39 ____________________________________ Time: 06:52:03 PM PST US From: "Dick N" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! Douwe I am ready to leave for Sun n Fun. Is there anything that our crew can build for you at the show? I can stop by tomorrow if there is something. If there is give me a call 612-805-1742. Dick N. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Douwe Blumberg" Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2010 4:17 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Next steps or... HERE WE GO AGAIN!!! > > > Okay, here goes... > > First of all, thank you guys from the bottom of my heart for your genuine > letters of encouragement and sympathy. No feelings have been hurt, and I > actually appreciate the "kick in the pants" approach. > > I spent the morning going over the damage. The end result is that I will > absolutely rebuild her and plan on bringing her home this week to start. > Won't be at Brodhead this year, maybe next? > > The main damage that I am a bit unsure of how to fix is to the left wing, > outboard of the strut attach points. As it rolled, the leading edge was > pushed down and cracked the leading edge ribs and the bottom of the ribs > from the struts outward. The spars are fine and the leading edge is fine, > just the ribs are crunched. Just ordered the FAA repair manual to see > what > it has to say, and any suggestions would be appreciated. Anybody up for a > wing fixing party (Larry Williams, Gene??) > > other fixes: > > Fix, recover and repaint left wing > fin leading edge cracked > various brace cables busted > wheels, axle and brakes shot > wing tank dented > rad dented > replace prop > some bulkhead damage in pilot leg holes > cross brace busted loos behind pilot seatback bulkhead > check out engine (sure it's fine, didn't really hit, just the prop tips > hit > until it turned over). > some sheet metal repair. > turtle deck repair where shoulder harness pulled up and through fabric as > Lowell hung there. > try to match paint and repaint turtledeck to match rest of fuse > bent throttle rod at quadrant > leaky fuel connection > new diagonal cabane braces > > did I miss anything?.... > > A few lessons learned from inspecting the damage. > 1. If you used 1/16th cable to brace your tail... double nicropress them, > two or three pulled out of the nico sleeve, and I had gauged them. I will > use heavier next time. > > 2. Don't try to save a couple ounces with the diagonal cabane braces, > make > them stout enough to keep the wing back because if you have a wing tank, > or > a passenger, you really want that wing to stay put. > > 3. The "Jenny" gear is as tough as BHP said it was, while the wheels took > up a lot of the impact, and were trashed, the basic gear is fairly > unscathed. I have no doubt the slit gear would have sheared off, I'm not > saying one is better than the other, they are just strong in different > areas. > > 4. USE GOOD SHOULDER HARNESS, AND ANCHOR IT WELL!! mine is the short > fuse > and you are right up to the instrument panel. Lowell didn't even scratch > his nose, yet he rebounded hard enough to break the brace behind the > seatback bulkhead. Thank God I spent a lot of effort here. Also, the > seatbelt held him in as he hung there and maybe prevented some nasty neck > injuries. This was just a simple ground loop that can happen to anyone, > but > could have been disasterous because of the ditch, but it wasn't because of > the belt and harness. > > 5. Lowell suggests, padding or rounding under the edge of the instrument > panel. When upside down, crawling out, that edge peeled some skin off his > shins which were already skinned by the tops of the leg apetures in the > bulkhead. Maybe enlarge these and pad them? > > 6. You guys building wood struts or cabanes, don't worry about their > strength. > > > thanks again guys! > > Douwe > > > ________________________________ Message 40 ____________________________________ Time: 08:08:33 PM PST US From: Michael Groah Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: weekend cowl work Wow... hey I missed the attached pic when I read Rick's email while I was a t work. That is a really nice looking cowling. Are they louvers or rolled beads in that nose? =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AF rom: Gary Boothe =0ATo: pietenpol-list@matronics.com =0ASent: Tue, April 6, 2010 4:35:57 PM=0ASubject: RE: Pietenpol-List: weeke nd cowl work=0A=0A =0ARick,=0A =0AI like your =98louvers=99 in the nose!=0A =0AGary Boothe=0ACool, CA=0APietenpol=0AWW Corvair Conversion =0ATail done, Fuselage on gear=0A18 ribs done=0A =0AFrom:owner-pietenpol-li st-server@matronics.com=0A[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com ] On Behalf Of Rick=0AHolland=0ASent: Tuesday, April 06, 2010 9:53 AM=0ATo: pietenpol-list@matronics.com=0ASubject: Re: Pietenpol-List: weekend cowl w ork=0A =0ANice Mike, like the rounded=0Abottom, kind of like the original M odel A cowling. I was lazy and made mine=0Aflat on the bottom like most CSC S builders.=0A=0Arick=0AOn Mon, Apr 5, 2010 at 6:34 PM, Michael Groah wrote:=0A =0AI just thought I'd post some pics of the wor k we got done on=0Athe cowl this past weekend. So far we just have the no se, top and=0Abottom roughed in. We will get to the sides in time. We hav e=0Amasking tape on the intake and cooling scoops to keep from scratching =0Athem. We're no metal experts, but we should be able to hack a cowl out of=0Athis. Anyways, I just thought I'd share our progress. =0A =0AMike Gr oah=0ATulare CA=0A=0A =0A =0A=0A=0A=0A-- =0ARick Holland=0ACastle Rock, Col orado=0A=0A"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" =0A=0A=0A_ -======================== ==================0A=0A=0A ________________________________ Message 41 ____________________________________ Time: 08:41:42 PM PST US From: Michael Groah Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Mike Groah--your side door John , We used the Kerri Ann Price door plan. I don't know the contact info on her anymore, although it seems like she did a post of her contact info not too long back. I did a quick archive search but didn't find it. Maybe someone else on the list can provide that. I've attached a pic that shows the inside of the fuselage on the door side. You can find some pics of the structure from the outside without the plywood on westcoastpiet.com (just look under my name in the pictures section). If you have any other questions, just ask... I'll try my best to answer them. Mike Groah ________________________________ From: John Fay Sent: Tue, April 6, 2010 6:40:07 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Mike Groah--your side door Mike, I have a quick question about the side door on your fuselage. How did you engineer that to maintain the required fuselage strength, or did you use plans from someone else? John Fay in Peoria ________________________________ Message 42 ____________________________________ Time: 08:56:23 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: New England pietenpol From: "Glenn Thomas" I'm in CT. Not a flying plane, just tail feathers and ribs. By any chance, are you planning on doing a Corvair conversion? I have 2 of them (RH blocks which are one of the recommended types in the WW manual) the WW manual, and a few Corvair manuals that I are recommended in the WW manual. I've got an A65 secured so decided to go that route and the 2 Corvair engines are eating up space in my garage. Email me off list if they're of any interest. As for your other question, I think my initial order for capstrip was approx 500ft. That was for wing ribs. Used 1/16" Finnish birch for gussets. I think they sell it in 1/4 sheets and I needed 2 or 3 of those. If you are in New England you can save yourself some shipping buying plywood from Boulter Plywood and just driving out and picking it up. It's aircraft grade and they deal with aircraft builder types fairly regularly and have a basement full of Sitka spruce. -------- Glenn Thomas N????? http://www.flyingwood.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=293304#293304 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.