Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:04 AM - Cockpit covering for tying down outside (Oscar Zuniga)
2. 06:24 AM - Drill guide (brian.e.jardine@l-3com.com)
3. 06:42 AM - Re: Drill guide (Chris)
4. 06:48 AM - Re: Drill guide (Gary Boothe)
5. 07:09 AM - Re: Drill guide (Richard Schreiber)
6. 09:55 AM - Re: Re: Piano hinge instalation (Ray Krause)
7. 11:08 AM - Re: Re: Piano hinge instalation (Jeff wilson)
8. 11:22 AM - Terry Burtz Model A (pflyboy)
9. 11:55 AM - Re: Drill guide (Catdesigns)
10. 12:02 PM - Re: Terry Burtz Model A (Rick Holland)
11. 12:45 PM - Re: Re: Piano hinge instalation (Ray Krause)
12. 01:35 PM - Re: [piet] Re: Cockpit covering for tying down outside (Mike Whaley)
13. 01:51 PM - Re: Re: Drill guide (Rick Holland)
14. 02:23 PM - Re: [piet] Re: Cockpit covering for tying down outside (Dan Yocum)
15. 02:33 PM - Re: Re: Drill guide (brian.e.jardine@l-3com.com)
16. 03:13 PM - Re: Re: Drill guide (Richard Schreiber)
17. 03:53 PM - Re: Terry Burtz Model A (pflyboy)
18. 05:08 PM - Re: Re: Terry Burtz Model A (Tim Willis)
19. 05:21 PM - Re: Terry Burtz Model A (pflyboy)
20. 05:38 PM - Re: Re: Terry Burtz Model A (Ryan Mueller)
21. 05:38 PM - Re: [piet] Re: Cockpit covering for tying down outside (David Paule)
22. 05:45 PM - Re: Terry Burtz Model A (pflyboy)
23. 07:34 PM - Re: Terry Burtz Model A (Pieti Lowell)
24. 07:48 PM - Re: Terry Burtz Model A (regchief)
25. 08:05 PM - Re: Re: Terry Burtz Model A (Jeff Boatright)
26. 08:16 PM - Re: Drill guide (coxwelljon)
27. 09:07 PM - Gary's panel [was: Re: Ryan's Piet] (coxwelljon)
28. 09:25 PM - Re: Gary's panel [was: Re: Ryan's Piet] (gboothe5@comcast.net)
29. 09:48 PM - Re: [piet] Re: Cockpit covering for tying down outside (Mike Whaley)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Cockpit covering for tying down outside |
Mike asked:
>BTW, anyone know anything about reprogramming
>a B-52 flight data computer?
No, but maybe you can go over to the Subaru list
and ask ;o)
do not archive
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC
San Antonio, TX
mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 2
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Does anyone have pictures of this drill guide that has been mentioned or
a drawing diagram? Thanks.
Brian
SLC-UT
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard
Schreiber
Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2010 5:22 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piano hinge instalation
<lmforge@earthlink.net>
Chris
The space between my aileron bay false spar and the edge/corner of the
aileron false spar was 3/16 inch. Once the wing false spar was glued in
place I clamped three or four 3/16 inch shims in place and then glued in
the aileron false spar. I have a autocad drwing of what I did if you can
read it.
Your sure right about the drill guide. I use it all the time.
Rick
> [Original Message]
> From: Catdesigns <Catdesigns@att.net>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Date: 4/20/2010 2:43:52 PM
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piano hinge instalation
>
<Catdesigns@att.net>
>
> Rick
>
> Thanks for the pictures and advice. That is exactly the help I
needed.
I too am planning on using the washer head screws. And that drill guide,
don't you just love how well it works. I use the same thing all the
time.
Do you happen to remember the gap you left between the 1/2 inch false
spars? I measure the rolled part of the hinge to be 1/4 inch on my
hinge.
>
> Chris
>
> --------
> Chris
> Sacramento, CA
> WestCoastPiet.com
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295013#295013
>
>
Message 3
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Brian
This is the one I have used for almost ever hole so far.
http://westcoastpiet.com/drilling_holes.htm
Chris
Sacramento,Ca
Westcoastpiet.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
brian.e.jardine@l-3com.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 6:19 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Drill guide
Does anyone have pictures of this drill guide that has been mentioned or a
drawing diagram? Thanks.
Brian
SLC-UT
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard
Schreiber
Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2010 5:22 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piano hinge instalation
<lmforge@earthlink.net>
Chris
The space between my aileron bay false spar and the edge/corner of the
aileron false spar was 3/16 inch. Once the wing false spar was glued in
place I clamped three or four 3/16 inch shims in place and then glued in the
aileron false spar. I have a autocad drwing of what I did if you can read
it.
Your sure right about the drill guide. I use it all the time.
Rick
> [Original Message]
> From: Catdesigns <Catdesigns@att.net>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Date: 4/20/2010 2:43:52 PM
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piano hinge instalation
>
<Catdesigns@att.net>
>
> Rick
>
> Thanks for the pictures and advice. That is exactly the help I
needed.
I too am planning on using the washer head screws. And that drill guide,
don't you just love how well it works. I use the same thing all the time.
Do you happen to remember the gap you left between the 1/2 inch false spars?
I measure the rolled part of the hinge to be 1/4 inch on my hinge.
>
> Chris
>
> --------
> Chris
> Sacramento, CA
> WestCoastPiet.com
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295013#295013
>
>
Message 4
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Brian,
I think, with tongue in cheek, Chris was referring to the block of wood.
Mine consists of a block of Oak, with various hole sizes drilled from my
drill press. You can locate the block with an awl or center punch, clamp in
to place, drill away.
Gary Boothe
Cool, CA
Pietenpol
WW Corvair Conversion
Tail done, Fuselage on gear
18 ribs done
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
brian.e.jardine@l-3com.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 6:19 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Drill guide
Does anyone have pictures of this drill guide that has been mentioned or
a drawing diagram? Thanks.
Brian
SLC-UT
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard
Schreiber
Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2010 5:22 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piano hinge instalation
<lmforge@earthlink.net>
Chris
The space between my aileron bay false spar and the edge/corner of the
aileron false spar was 3/16 inch. Once the wing false spar was glued in
place I clamped three or four 3/16 inch shims in place and then glued in
the aileron false spar. I have a autocad drwing of what I did if you can
read it.
Your sure right about the drill guide. I use it all the time.
Rick
> [Original Message]
> From: Catdesigns <Catdesigns@att.net>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Date: 4/20/2010 2:43:52 PM
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piano hinge instalation
>
<Catdesigns@att.net>
>
> Rick
>
> Thanks for the pictures and advice. That is exactly the help I
needed.
I too am planning on using the washer head screws. And that drill guide,
don't you just love how well it works. I use the same thing all the
time.
Do you happen to remember the gap you left between the 1/2 inch false
spars? I measure the rolled part of the hinge to be 1/4 inch on my
hinge.
>
> Chris
>
> --------
> Chris
> Sacramento, CA
> WestCoastPiet.com
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295013#295013
>
>
Message 5
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Brian
In addition to the hardwood block design that Chris just mentioned I also
used a "U" shaped jig made from copper water pipe fittings and stainless
steel tubing. Complete info on the drill jig came from Clif Dawson. Here is
a link..... http://clifdawson.ca/Tools_and_Tips.html. The copper tubing
jig works great for drilling the fittings on the spars. I have attaced
photos of both type drill jigs in use.
Rick Schreiber
> [Original Message]
> From: <brian.e.jardine@l-3com.com>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Date: 4/21/2010 8:25:56 AM
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Drill guide
>
>
> Does anyone have pictures of this drill guide that has been mentioned or
> a drawing diagram? Thanks.
>
> Brian
> SLC-UT
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard
> Schreiber
> Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2010 5:22 PM
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piano hinge instalation
>
> <lmforge@earthlink.net>
>
> Chris
> The space between my aileron bay false spar and the edge/corner of the
> aileron false spar was 3/16 inch. Once the wing false spar was glued in
> place I clamped three or four 3/16 inch shims in place and then glued in
> the aileron false spar. I have a autocad drwing of what I did if you can
> read it.
>
> Your sure right about the drill guide. I use it all the time.
>
> Rick
>
>
> > [Original Message]
> > From: Catdesigns <Catdesigns@att.net>
> > To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> > Date: 4/20/2010 2:43:52 PM
> > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piano hinge instalation
> >
> <Catdesigns@att.net>
> >
> > Rick
> >
> > Thanks for the pictures and advice. That is exactly the help I
> needed.
> I too am planning on using the washer head screws. And that drill guide,
> don't you just love how well it works. I use the same thing all the
> time.
> Do you happen to remember the gap you left between the 1/2 inch false
> spars? I measure the rolled part of the hinge to be 1/4 inch on my
> hinge.
> >
> > Chris
> >
> > --------
> > Chris
> > Sacramento, CA
> > WestCoastPiet.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295013#295013
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Piano hinge instalation |
Drill guide: What one are you folks using? Where do you purchase one? I
have a very old one, but there must be a better one since this one was
manufactured 50 years ago!
Thanks,
Ray Krause
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Schreiber" <lmforge@earthlink.net>
Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2010 4:22 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piano hinge instalation
> <lmforge@earthlink.net>
>
> Chris
> The space between my aileron bay false spar and the edge/corner of the
> aileron false spar was 3/16 inch. Once the wing false spar was glued in
> place I clamped three or four 3/16 inch shims in place and then glued in
> the aileron false spar. I have a autocad drwing of what I did if you can
> read it.
>
> Your sure right about the drill guide. I use it all the time.
>
> Rick
>
>
>> [Original Message]
>> From: Catdesigns <Catdesigns@att.net>
>> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>> Date: 4/20/2010 2:43:52 PM
>> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piano hinge instalation
>>
>>
>> Rick
>>
>> Thanks for the pictures and advice. That is exactly the help I needed.
> I too am planning on using the washer head screws. And that drill guide,
> don't you just love how well it works. I use the same thing all the time.
> Do you happen to remember the gap you left between the 1/2 inch false
> spars? I measure the rolled part of the hinge to be 1/4 inch on my hinge.
>>
>> Chris
>>
>> --------
>> Chris
>> Sacramento, CA
>> WestCoastPiet.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295013#295013
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Piano hinge instalation |
If your drill guide is 50 years old, it was probably made in America. How can
you get better than that?
Jeff Wilson
N899WT
Message 8
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| Subject: | Terry Burtz Model A |
Has anybody here seen this? Living in Colorado, I am VERY interested.
http://www.modelaengine.com/
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295124#295124
Message 9
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Great pictures Rick! These are the kind of pictures we all need to post more often.
This way people can see how we do things not just how they look when finished.
I used to be so afraid of drilling holes that I didn't do it for a long
time. Pictures like these would have been invaluable to me when I started this
3 year project 8 years ago.
I also drilled the holes for my wing strut fittings by hand but did it slightly
different than you did. I only drill holes in one of the fittings then use this
as a guide to drill the holes in the spar (or what ever you are drilling).
Then I clamped on the back fitting and use the newly drilled holes in the spar
as a guide (with the brass tubing protecting the hole) to drill the holes in
the back fitting. Note, do not cut the back fitting to final size until after
drilling all the holes. (learned the hard way)
As an example, here is a shot of me drilling the inner fitting on the landing gear.
( I guess need to upload some pictures of me drilling the other wing fittings.)
http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/Construction%20of%20Wood%20Gear/IMG_1656.JPG
And here is how I drilled the center fitting for the 3-piece wing.
http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/IMG_1967.JPG
http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/IMG_1981.JPG
Chris
--------
Chris
Sacramento, CA
WestCoastPiet.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295129#295129
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Terry Burtz Model A |
Am building a Corvair/Piet in Castle Rock Colorado Terry if you may be
interested in coming over and taking a look. Would be great to be able to
build a Model A Piet with enough power to handle 10,000 ft. density
altitudes.
rick
On Wed, Apr 21, 2010 at 12:22 PM, pflyboy <nick_d_av8r@msn.com> wrote:
>
> Has anybody here seen this? Living in Colorado, I am VERY interested.
>
> http://www.modelaengine.com/
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295124#295124
>
>
--
Rick Holland
Castle Rock, Colorado
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Piano hinge instalation |
I will take a picture and send it along, If I can figure how to do it! I
inherited it from my Dad.
Ray Krause
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff wilson" <jlwilsonnn@yahoo.com>
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 11:07 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piano hinge instalation
>
> If your drill guide is 50 years old, it was probably made in America. How
> can you get better than that?
> Jeff Wilson
> N899WT
>
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Cockpit covering for tying down outside |
Actually I've changed out the B-52 computer now for a surplus NASA unit from
the Space Shuttle. It weighs a lot more, and it's actually fairly low-tech,
but it's radiation hardened which could be important on those long trips at
high altitude. Besides, unemployed shuttle engineers are a dime a dozen
around here, so support won't be much of a problem. Also in keeping with the
Shuttle thing, I've decided to build a reinforced titanium capsule for the
occupants, which can be ejected at any altitude, attitude, or speed by four
military JATO rockets I have acquired. With the cockpit covering doors
closed, the capsule should be watertight down to about 80 meters. Which is
good, because I don't think it's going to float very well like the old F-111
escape capsules (I estimate the weight at between 2,900 and 3,300 lbs). Of
course I've added an oxygen supply good for 8 days and a full kitchenette
and pantry... just in case.
Only downside to all my improvements are that the original wire wheels
deformed badly under the increased load, so I'm installing a set of surplus
727 main wheel asemblies that I got a good deal on from eBay. I'm also
adding 6 inches to each wing to make up for the additional weight of the
wheels.
What could possibly go wrong?
-Mike
Mike Whaley
MerlinFAC@cfl.rr.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Paule" <dpaule@frii.com>
Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2010 2:29 PM
Subject: [piet] Re: Pietenpol-List: Cockpit covering for tying down outside
>
> Dang, and I gave away my old B-52 flight manual, too. Sorry! But I think
> that if you change out the printed circuit card for the -H version, it'll
> work well enough. Maybe you can get a local high school kid to help with
> that.
>
> Still, I've got to ask... did you install the zero-zero ejection seats or
> the original ones that needed some altitude to work with? If you used the
> original ones be careful, because they don't like a rate of descent. Best
to
> operate while still in a rate of ascent, if achievable.
>
> David Paule
>
>
<MerlinFAC@cfl.rr.com>
> >
> > I considered this same issue and lucked into an elegant solution... I
> > found
> > some surplus bomb bay actuators and hanges at an aviation flea market a
> > couple years ago, they only cost me a couple thousand bucks for the
whole
> > set of 16. A few hundred more to restore the 8 units that I actually
need,
> > and they look spiffy. The guy said they were from a B-36 but I think he
> > either lied or was confused since the serial numbers match a B-58, which
> > is
> > fine for my purposes. I also got a surplus high-pressure hydraulic pump
to
> > drive them, it's not that much bigger than the Corvair, so I think I can
> > mount that into a very unobtrusive pod under the fuselage. I'm making a
> > remotely-actuated, bifold, articulated cockpit cover to close over both
> > the
> > front and rear 'pits to protect from the weather and such. I also got a
> > good
> > deal on some old B-29 wing skins that are slightly curved in just the
> > right
> > way, so I'll just cut those to shape for the 'pit covers. I'm also going
> > to
> > drive the wing flop position with the same system. My flight data
computer
> > (surplus B-52 part, it's about the size of a microwave oven and only
about
> > 85 lbs, but I haven't re-wired it yet) should be able to automatically
> > calculate the proper flop position several times a second, so it can
> > double
> > as both a flap for takeoff and as a spoiler for quick descents. I figure
> > that I'll need that capability, since with all the streamlining and such
> > it'll be hard to get the Piet to come down otherwise.
> >
> > BTW, anyone know anything about reprogramming a B-52 flight data
computer?
> >
> > -Mike
> >
> > Mike Whaley
> > MerlinFAC@cfl.rr.com
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Ryan Mueller" <rmueller23@gmail.com>
> > To: "Pietenpol List" <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2010 12:42 PM
> > Subject: [piet] Pietenpol-List: Cockpit covering for tying down outside
> >
> >
> >> Here's a question for Piet (or open cockpit in general) fliers:
> >>
> >> For those that do not have, or did not always have, custom snap on/in
> >> cockpit covers for your Piet, how do you cover the cockpits when having
> >> to
> >> leave the airplane tied down outside overnight or in inclement weather?
> > For
> >> example, we will be meeting our Piet at Brodhead this year, and we'll
> >> probably have it there Thursday through Sunday morning. I would imagine
a
> >> tarp and some light rope would be sufficient, but I thought I would ask
> > and
> >> see if there was a better/more desirable solution. Thanks,
> >>
> >> Ryan
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 13
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Or you can use something like my somewhat crud but effective drill guide
(see attached). No surprises where the drill is going to emerge out the
other side of your spar. Can predrill all your strut fittings identically.
Notice I welded on an extra pair of tubes so the same guide will do 1/4" and
3/16".
rick
On Wed, Apr 21, 2010 at 12:55 PM, Catdesigns <Catdesigns@att.net> wrote:
>
> Great pictures Rick! These are the kind of pictures we all need to post
> more often. This way people can see how we do things not just how they look
> when finished. I used to be so afraid of drilling holes that I didn't do it
> for a long time. Pictures like these would have been invaluable to me when I
> started this 3 year project 8 years ago.
>
> I also drilled the holes for my wing strut fittings by hand but did it
> slightly different than you did. I only drill holes in one of the fittings
> then use this as a guide to drill the holes in the spar (or what ever you
> are drilling). Then I clamped on the back fitting and use the newly drilled
> holes in the spar as a guide (with the brass tubing protecting the hole) to
> drill the holes in the back fitting. Note, do not cut the back fitting to
> final size until after drilling all the holes. (learned the hard way)
>
> As an example, here is a shot of me drilling the inner fitting on the
> landing gear. ( I guess need to upload some pictures of me drilling the
> other wing fittings.)
>
> http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/Construction%20of%20Wood%20Gear/IMG_1656.JPG
>
> And here is how I drilled the center fitting for the 3-piece wing.
>
> http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/IMG_1967.JPG
> http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/IMG_1981.JPG
>
>
> Chris
>
> --------
> Chris
> Sacramento, CA
> WestCoastPiet.com
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295129#295129
>
>
--
Rick Holland
Castle Rock, Colorado
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Cockpit covering for tying down outside |
On 04/21/2010 03:07 PM, Mike Whaley wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Mike Whaley"<MerlinFAC@cfl.rr.com>
>
> Actually I've changed out the B-52 computer now for a surplus NASA unit from
> the Space Shuttle. It weighs a lot more, and it's actually fairly low-tech,
> but it's radiation hardened which could be important on those long trips at
> high altitude. Besides, unemployed shuttle engineers are a dime a dozen
> around here, so support won't be much of a problem. Also in keeping with the
> Shuttle thing, I've decided to build a reinforced titanium capsule for the
> occupants, which can be ejected at any altitude, attitude, or speed by four
> military JATO rockets I have acquired. With the cockpit covering doors
> closed, the capsule should be watertight down to about 80 meters. Which is
> good, because I don't think it's going to float very well like the old F-111
> escape capsules (I estimate the weight at between 2,900 and 3,300 lbs). Of
> course I've added an oxygen supply good for 8 days and a full kitchenette
> and pantry... just in case.
If you need more empty milk jugs, let me know, we go through the stuff
like, uh, milk.
do not archive
--
Dan Yocum
Fermilab 630.840.6509
yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov
"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
Message 15
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Thanks guys for all the replies on the drill guide. The pictures speak
for themselves, now I get to go make me one.
Brian
SLC-UT
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick
Holland
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2010 2:51 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Drill guide
Or you can use something like my somewhat crud but effective drill guide
(see attached). No surprises where the drill is going to emerge out the
other side of your spar. Can predrill all your strut fittings
identically. Notice I welded on an extra pair of tubes so the same guide
will do 1/4" and 3/16".
rick
On Wed, Apr 21, 2010 at 12:55 PM, Catdesigns <Catdesigns@att.net> wrote:
Great pictures Rick! These are the kind of pictures we all need to post
more often. This way people can see how we do things not just how they
look when finished. I used to be so afraid of drilling holes that I
didn't do it for a long time. Pictures like these would have been
invaluable to me when I started this 3 year project 8 years ago.
I also drilled the holes for my wing strut fittings by hand but did it
slightly different than you did. I only drill holes in one of the
fittings then use this as a guide to drill the holes in the spar (or
what ever you are drilling). Then I clamped on the back fitting and use
the newly drilled holes in the spar as a guide (with the brass tubing
protecting the hole) to drill the holes in the back fitting. Note, do
not cut the back fitting to final size until after drilling all the
holes. (learned the hard way)
As an example, here is a shot of me drilling the inner fitting on the
landing gear. ( I guess need to upload some pictures of me drilling the
other wing fittings.)
http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/Construction%20of%20Wood%20Gear/IMG_
1656.JPG
And here is how I drilled the center fitting for the 3-piece wing.
http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/IMG_1967.JPG
http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/IMG_1981.JPG
Chris
--------
Chris
Sacramento, CA
WestCoastPiet.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295129#295129
st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
http://forums.matronics.com
le, List Admin.
="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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Rick Holland
Castle Rock, Colorado
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 16
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Rick
Your method is the same as I used. I just didn't want to weld up the jig. The copper
tubing and fittings was simple and I had the raw material in stock. I liked
the fact that I could drill the strut fittings as a matched set on the drill
press. I then clamped then in place on the spar and drilled with the jig. Because
of the set up the hole has to come out perfectly aligned.
Rick Schreiber
----- Original Message -----
From: Rick Holland
Sent: 4/21/2010 3:58:33 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Drill guide
Or you can use something like my somewhat crud but effective drill guide (see attached).
No surprises where the drill is going to emerge out the other side of
your spar. Can predrill all your strut fittings identically. Notice I welded
on an extra pair of tubes so the same guide will do 1/4" and 3/16".
rick
On Wed, Apr 21, 2010 at 12:55 PM, Catdesigns <Catdesigns@att.net> wrote:
Great pictures Rick! These are the kind of pictures we all need to post more often.
This way people can see how we do things not just how they look when finished.
I used to be so afraid of drilling holes that I didn't do it for a long
time. Pictures like these would have been invaluable to me when I started this
3 year project 8 years ago.
I also drilled the holes for my wing strut fittings by hand but did it slightly
different than you did. I only drill holes in one of the fittings then use this
as a guide to drill the holes in the spar (or what ever you are drilling).
Then I clamped on the back fitting and use the newly drilled holes in the spar
as a guide (with the brass tubing protecting the hole) to drill the holes in
the back fitting. Note, do not cut the back fitting to final size until after
drilling all the holes. (learned the hard way)
As an example, here is a shot of me drilling the inner fitting on the landing gear.
( I guess need to upload some pictures of me drilling the other wing fittings.)
http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/Construction%20of%20Wood%20Gear/IMG_1656.JPG
And here is how I drilled the center fitting for the 3-piece wing.
http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/IMG_1967.JPG
http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/Chris%20Tracy/IMG_1981.JPG
Chris
--------
Chris
Sacramento, CA
WestCoastPiet.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295129#295129
==========
st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
==========
http://forums.matronics.com
==========
le, List Admin.
="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
==========
--
Rick Holland
Castle Rock, Colorado
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Terry Burtz Model A |
Actually, Terry has a mailing list you can join and get monthly updates. Right
now, I think he's in the pre-casting stage!
The ONLY thing keeping me from building a Piet is the lack of Model A power.
I guess we really have to wait for the final power graphs. It would be nice if
it puts out at least 70 hp at a suitable prop RPM.
If that was the case, couldn't we go direct drive and govern the RPM? The throttle
could be pushed forward to maintain RPM as altitude goes up...?
Nick
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295167#295167
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| Subject: | Re: Terry Burtz Model A |
"Direct drive" with a Model A engine?
Nick, to the best of my knowledge, the Model A Pieters all use direct drive, just
like BP did. I think they run at substantially less than the rpms shown on
the charts on Burt's site, but at a sweet spot on the torque curve. Model A
guys, chime in.
BTW, the Corvair engines get their power for aircraft use by using direct drive
and a very different cam. That cam likewise lowers the rpm where peak torque
and power are produced.
Tim in central TX
-----Original Message-----
>From: pflyboy <nick_d_av8r@msn.com>
>Sent: Apr 21, 2010 5:53 PM
>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Terry Burtz Model A
>
>
>Actually, Terry has a mailing list you can join and get monthly updates. Right
now, I think he's in the pre-casting stage!
>
>The ONLY thing keeping me from building a Piet is the lack of Model A power.
>
>I guess we really have to wait for the final power graphs. It would be nice if
it puts out at least 70 hp at a suitable prop RPM.
>
>If that was the case, couldn't we go direct drive and govern the RPM? The throttle
could be pushed forward to maintain RPM as altitude goes up...?
>
>Nick
>
<clip>
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| Subject: | Re: Terry Burtz Model A |
What I meant was, this new design model A is supposed to put out 158 hp at 5000
RPM. That's way too much RPM, so unless it also puts out an acceptable HP at
a decent prop RPM, say 2200-2400, a gearbox would be necessary to take full advantage
of the power.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295179#295179
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| Subject: | Re: Terry Burtz Model A |
If the ONLY thing keeping you from building a Piet is the lack of Model A
power....well...you know, you can put other engines on it. :P A Corvair
would do nicely...
Ryan
do not archive
On Wed, Apr 21, 2010 at 5:53 PM, pflyboy <nick_d_av8r@msn.com> wrote:
>
> Actually, Terry has a mailing list you can join and get monthly updates.
> Right now, I think he's in the pre-casting stage!
>
> The ONLY thing keeping me from building a Piet is the lack of Model A
> power.
>
> I guess we really have to wait for the final power graphs. It would be
> nice if it puts out at least 70 hp at a suitable prop RPM.
>
> If that was the case, couldn't we go direct drive and govern the RPM? The
> throttle could be pushed forward to maintain RPM as altitude goes up...?
>
> Nick
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295167#295167
>
>
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Cockpit covering for tying down outside |
Mike,
Pure Pietenpol all the way. Good for you.
Dave
>
> Actually I've changed out the B-52 computer now for a surplus NASA unit
> from
> the Space Shuttle. It weighs a lot more, and it's actually fairly
> low-tech,
> but it's radiation hardened which could be important on those long trips
> at
> high altitude. Besides, unemployed shuttle engineers are a dime a dozen
> around here, so support won't be much of a problem. Also in keeping with
> the
> Shuttle thing, I've decided to build a reinforced titanium capsule for the
> occupants, which can be ejected at any altitude, attitude, or speed by
> four
> military JATO rockets I have acquired. With the cockpit covering doors
> closed, the capsule should be watertight down to about 80 meters. Which is
> good, because I don't think it's going to float very well like the old
> F-111
> escape capsules (I estimate the weight at between 2,900 and 3,300 lbs). Of
> course I've added an oxygen supply good for 8 days and a full kitchenette
> and pantry... just in case.
>
> Only downside to all my improvements are that the original wire wheels
> deformed badly under the increased load, so I'm installing a set of
> surplus
> 727 main wheel asemblies that I got a good deal on from eBay. I'm also
> adding 6 inches to each wing to make up for the additional weight of the
> wheels.
>
> What could possibly go wrong?
>
> -Mike
>
> Mike Whaley
> MerlinFAC@cfl.rr.com
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "David Paule" <dpaule@frii.com>
> To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2010 2:29 PM
> Subject: [piet] Re: Pietenpol-List: Cockpit covering for tying down
> outside
>
>
>>
>> Dang, and I gave away my old B-52 flight manual, too. Sorry! But I think
>> that if you change out the printed circuit card for the -H version, it'll
>> work well enough. Maybe you can get a local high school kid to help with
>> that.
>>
>> Still, I've got to ask... did you install the zero-zero ejection seats or
>> the original ones that needed some altitude to work with? If you used the
>> original ones be careful, because they don't like a rate of descent. Best
> to
>> operate while still in a rate of ascent, if achievable.
>>
>> David Paule
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
> <MerlinFAC@cfl.rr.com>
>> >
>> > I considered this same issue and lucked into an elegant solution... I
>> > found
>> > some surplus bomb bay actuators and hanges at an aviation flea market a
>> > couple years ago, they only cost me a couple thousand bucks for the
> whole
>> > set of 16. A few hundred more to restore the 8 units that I actually
> need,
>> > and they look spiffy. The guy said they were from a B-36 but I think he
>> > either lied or was confused since the serial numbers match a B-58,
>> > which
>> > is
>> > fine for my purposes. I also got a surplus high-pressure hydraulic pump
> to
>> > drive them, it's not that much bigger than the Corvair, so I think I
>> > can
>> > mount that into a very unobtrusive pod under the fuselage. I'm making a
>> > remotely-actuated, bifold, articulated cockpit cover to close over both
>> > the
>> > front and rear 'pits to protect from the weather and such. I also got a
>> > good
>> > deal on some old B-29 wing skins that are slightly curved in just the
>> > right
>> > way, so I'll just cut those to shape for the 'pit covers. I'm also
>> > going
>> > to
>> > drive the wing flop position with the same system. My flight data
> computer
>> > (surplus B-52 part, it's about the size of a microwave oven and only
> about
>> > 85 lbs, but I haven't re-wired it yet) should be able to automatically
>> > calculate the proper flop position several times a second, so it can
>> > double
>> > as both a flap for takeoff and as a spoiler for quick descents. I
>> > figure
>> > that I'll need that capability, since with all the streamlining and
>> > such
>> > it'll be hard to get the Piet to come down otherwise.
>> >
>> > BTW, anyone know anything about reprogramming a B-52 flight data
> computer?
>> >
>> > -Mike
>> >
>> > Mike Whaley
>> > MerlinFAC@cfl.rr.com
>> >
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Ryan Mueller" <rmueller23@gmail.com>
>> > To: "Pietenpol List" <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>> > Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2010 12:42 PM
>> > Subject: [piet] Pietenpol-List: Cockpit covering for tying down outside
>> >
>> >
>> >> Here's a question for Piet (or open cockpit in general) fliers:
>> >>
>> >> For those that do not have, or did not always have, custom snap on/in
>> >> cockpit covers for your Piet, how do you cover the cockpits when
>> >> having
>> >> to
>> >> leave the airplane tied down outside overnight or in inclement
>> >> weather?
>> > For
>> >> example, we will be meeting our Piet at Brodhead this year, and we'll
>> >> probably have it there Thursday through Sunday morning. I would
>> >> imagine
> a
>> >> tarp and some light rope would be sufficient, but I thought I would
>> >> ask
>> > and
>> >> see if there was a better/more desirable solution. Thanks,
>> >>
>> >> Ryan
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Terry Burtz Model A |
Okay, okay, so you got me [Laughing] Actually, I once had a Piet fuselage that
was going to be corvair powered, but sold it so I could focus on other things.
There are zillions of other options, but I just LOVE that Model A 8)
Read this topic online here:
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| Subject: | Re: Terry Burtz Model A |
Have you heard of the Donovan " D ".with an Al. block 5 mains etc.
Or have you seen a Ford " B ' with inserts, Hi pressure oil,forged balanced crank,
Funk head 6.25:1 Ratio,aluminum rods, swinging a 76X56 Prop at 2250, direct
drive, and not to mention fuel injected,
Any one want a ride in a short Pietenpol with over 80 HP ?
And by the way this Piet has been flying with a 612 Riblitt clipped wing since
2004,
Give me a call or show up at Palmyra Airport, if you dare .
Pieti Lowell
Read this topic online here:
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| Subject: | Re: Terry Burtz Model A |
I would like a peek at your piet someday Rick. I am the other side of you, down
in Pueblowest
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| Subject: | Re: Terry Burtz Model A |
Pieti,
You bringin' it to C37 this year? I'll be there.
Jeff
--
Jeff Boatright
"Now let's think about this..."
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Hi all,
I have just gone through having to redo almost all of my fitting mountings as a
previous builder did not do a good job of alignment on the fittings. On almost
all fittings I have had to plug the holes in the wood members with hardwood
dowels epoxied in place and re-drill them. In some cases I had to weld holes
shut in fittings and re-drill them. I know that the FAA frowns on welding holes
shut and re-drilling but I checked with my DAR ahead of time and he gave me
his blessing.
Cliff Dawson's copper tube jig was featured in the January issue of the BPA newsletter.
I built a similar jig (photos attached). I have a metal lathe so I
turned inserts on the lathe and bored them out for 3 different sized drills.
3/16, 1/4, 5/16. The picture shows just one. The one thing I would do different
would be to make a deeper "D" section to allow for getting into hard to get
at locations. Mine worked OK but was a little tight at times. Remember I am
working on an existing structure and not building from scratch so I have to
work around other stuff that is already in place. My process was to drill the
first hole in 2 sides of attachment fittings and then bolt them together and
drill the remainder of the holes through both pieces at the same time on a drill
press. I then clamped the fittings in place on the wood member and used the
jig. I did not drill a pilot hole but with the jig was able to drill the right
size hole the first time. In areas where the fitting was attaching another
metal piece to the wood, like the cabanes, I bolted them to the fitting before
I drilled the wood with the jig. I then clamped the whole assembly in place
and drilled the wood. My project is a GN-1 which has a little more complex
fittings than the original Piet in some areas.
Jon Coxwell
--------
Jon Coxwell
GN-1 Builder
Recycle and preserve the planet
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295218#295218
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/img00052_132.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/img00051_128.jpg
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Gary's panel [was: Re: Ryan's Piet] |
Gary,
Where in Montana?
Bozeman is where I took my first instruction as a pilot, Kalispell is where I got
my license and helped restore my first airplane, and Billings and eastern Montana
is where I got most of my hours (1700).
100 HP will be good, but I used to fly a 75 HP Aeronca L-3 Defender across the
mountains from Kalispell to My parents ranch in central Montana. Full fuel (12
gal.) and a passenger we would fly to Lincoln MT of unibomber fame, land and
empty a 5 gal. can from the baggage compartment. Then fly over the rest of the
mountains to Townsend MT. where we would refuel everything. That was enough
fuel to fly over the Little Belt mountains to the ranch and return to Townsend
where the process was reversed. Kalispell is about 3500' and the trip to Lincoln
was about at about 6500' and the hop over the mountains to Townsend needed
to be at 8000' to get through the mountain pass. Again a clime to 8000' and
land at the ranch at 6000'. I did this several times when I was younger and
bolder. I would circle until I could get across the mountains and then glide
to the next landing spot.
All this aside. the Montana mountains deserve care and respect but flying in them
can be a terrific exhilarating experience and can make for a good seat of the
pants pilot. The Piet will be well suited for Montana flying.
Jon Coxwell
Now in upstate NY.
--------
Jon Coxwell
GN-1 Builder
Recycle and preserve the planet
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295221#295221
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Gary's panel [was: Re: Ryan's Piet] |
Jon,
That's encouraging! I'll be living in the Bitteroot Valley (Hamilton), flying out
of Hamilton or Stevensville.
Gary
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: "coxwelljon" <coxwelljon@frontiernet.net>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Gary's panel [was: Re: Ryan's Piet]
Gary,
Where in Montana?
Bozeman is where I took my first instruction as a pilot, Kalispell is where I got
my license and helped restore my first airplane, and Billings and eastern Montana
is where I got most of my hours (1700).
100 HP will be good, but I used to fly a 75 HP Aeronca L-3 Defender across the
mountains from Kalispell to My parents ranch in central Montana. Full fuel (12
gal.) and a passenger we would fly to Lincoln MT of unibomber fame, land and
empty a 5 gal. can from the baggage compartment. Then fly over the rest of the
mountains to Townsend MT. where we would refuel everything. That was enough
fuel to fly over the Little Belt mountains to the ranch and return to Townsend
where the process was reversed. Kalispell is about 3500' and the trip to Lincoln
was about at about 6500' and the hop over the mountains to Townsend needed
to be at 8000' to get through the mountain pass. Again a clime to 8000' and
land at the ranch at 6000'. I did this several times when I was younger and
bolder. I would circle until I could get across the mountains and then glide
to the next landing spot.
All this aside. the Montana mountains deserve care and respect but flying in them
can be a terrific exhilarating experience and can make for a good seat of the
pants pilot. The Piet will be well suited for Montana flying.
Jon Coxwell
Now in upstate NY.
--------
Jon Coxwell
GN-1 Builder
Recycle and preserve the planet
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=295221#295221
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| Subject: | Re: Cockpit covering for tying down outside |
> If you need more empty milk jugs, let me know, we go through the stuff
> like, uh, milk.
Oh wow, I had forgotten about that. The floatation solution was right in
front of my nose. It'll be even easier to stuff the wings with 'em, since I
have a fly-by-wire control system and only have to deal with a couple of
shielded 250-conductor cables and quadruple-redundant hydraulic lines going
out to the actuators, instead of those pesky, antiquated steel aileron
cables.
Mike Whaley
MerlinFAC@cfl.rr.com
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