Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:38 AM - Re: Lower wing strut attachment (helspersew@aol.com)
2. 06:54 AM - Re: Re: Great trip to Oklahoma (John Recine)
3. 02:38 PM - Re: Lower wing strut attachment (Ben Charvet)
4. 02:38 PM - Re: Officially joined the "Oh sh$#@!" club tonight... (Gary Boothe)
5. 02:53 PM - Last reminder for ohio piet gathering (shad bell)
6. 02:53 PM - Re: Question for the West Coast Piet Infidels (Gary Boothe)
7. 02:53 PM - Re: Lower wing strut attachment (Doug Dever)
8. 02:58 PM - Re: Perseverance.Patience.Cutting Tools (AMsafetyC@aol.com)
9. 03:10 PM - Re: Question for the West Coast Piet Infidels (Pieti Lowell)
10. 03:40 PM - Re: Lower wing strut attachment (helspersew@aol.com)
11. 03:51 PM - Re: Lower wing strut attachment (Doug Dever)
12. 05:24 PM - Re: Model A questions (helspersew@aol.com)
13. 06:01 PM - Re: Lower wing strut attachment (John Recine)
14. 06:22 PM - CG calculations on a GN-1. (skellytown flyer)
Message 1
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Subject: | Re: Lower wing strut attachment |
Doug,
I though about all this stuff too. Then I thought well, I have four steel
cabane struts, and also four large-diameter tapped forks, to distribute
the wing loading. Considering my G-pulling will be kept to a minimum (30
degree banks) I am OK with all this. On my Aeronca Sedan, there is only
one diagonal strut per side, like most Cessnas. When I am pulling large
G's in that airplane I often look over at theses struts and wonder??...bu
t then I divert my thoughts to something more pleasant.
One thing to consider, is that with my design on the upper strut ends, it
will not allow any fore and aft adjustment of the wing. So for purists li
ke myself this is acceptable, because I cannot allow myself to deviate fro
m the vertical cabane strut positions :O). (I know, I know, the FGM says
these are slanted back 1/2", Santiago, et.al.) :O)
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
Dan,
Yours is one of the options I thought of. Questioned the strength of tapp
ing the Alum bar. Probably way more than we need though. In looking at
the West Coast Piet site I've noticed several that have no adjustment.
If any have not used a fork and have a fixed, bolted attachment, please
chime is as to how you did it so as not to need any method of adjusting.
Those forks are big bucks. But as I see it you might only need the rear
strut to adjust. That would cut the cost in half.
Doug Dever
In beautiful Stow Ohio
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Lower wing strut attachment
From: helspersew@aol.com
Hi Doug,
Wa-la (see attached photos). I used an aluminum insert 7075 alloy, threade
d to accept a J-3 fork (from Wag Aero $$$$$). Secure with two 1/4" bolts.
I am sure you could find a lower priced fork somewhere.
Disclaimer: Haven't flown behind it yet, but Larry Williams has something
very similar and is doing just fine.
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Dever <chiefpepperhead@hotmail.com>
Sent: Thu, Jun 17, 2010 2:55 pm
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Lower wing strut attachment
I know I'm getting a little ahead of myself as I'm still building ribs. fo
r those that have not used steel struts how have you done the lower lift
strut attachment so as to have the ability to ajust the length. Carlson
aircraft has some streamlined alum strut material very reasonable. But,
you cant weld a fork and barrel assy into them, of course. And the FAA
PMA fork and barrel sets are hideously priced.
Doug Dever
In beautiful Stow Ohio
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Subject: | Re: Great trip to Oklahoma |
Mark
Next time we'll markle us a prop and tail wheel assembly Jim will never notice
they're missing. He'll think the concrete block tied to th tail got caught on
something and kept it from moving. It could be a good raid on his stuff
------Original Message------
From: Mark Chunard
Sender: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
ReplyTo: Pietenpol builders Board
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Great trip to Oklahoma
Sent: Jun 17, 2010 11:06 PM
I forgot... I have evidence!
--------
Mark Chouinard
Finishing up Wings - Working on Center Section
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=301642#301642
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/markles_ride_588.jpg
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
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Subject: | Re: Lower wing strut attachment |
I have similar lift strut fittings on the top, and the spar brackets have
enough "give" to allow moving the wing back..just in case you change your
mind.
Ben Charvet
On Fri, Jun 18, 2010 at 7:26 AM, <helspersew@aol.com> wrote:
> Doug,
>
> I though about all this stuff too. Then I thought well, I have four steel
> cabane struts, and also four large-diameter tapped forks, to distribute the
> wing loading. Considering my G-pulling will be kept to a minimum (30 degree
> banks) I am OK with all this. On my Aeronca Sedan, there is only one
> diagonal strut per side, like most Cessnas. When I am pulling large G's in
> that airplane I often look over at theses struts and wonder??...but then I
> divert my thoughts to something more pleasant.
>
> One thing to consider, is that with my design on the upper strut ends, it
> will not allow any fore and aft adjustment of the wing. So for purists like
> myself this is acceptable, because I cannot allow myself to deviate from the
> vertical cabane strut positions :O). (I know, I know, the FGM says these are
> slanted back 1/2", Santiago, et.al.) :O)
>
> Dan Helsper
> Poplar Grove, IL.
>
>
> Dan,
> Yours is one of the options I thought of. Questioned the strength of
> tapping the Alum bar. Probably way more than we need though. In looking at
> the West Coast Piet site I've noticed several that have no adjustment. If
> any have not used a fork and have a fixed, bolted attachment, please chime
> is as to how you did it so as not to need any method of adjusting. Those
> forks are big bucks. But as I see it you might only need the rear strut to
> adjust. That would cut the cost in half.
>
> Doug Dever
> In beautiful Stow Ohio
>
>
> ------------------------------
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Lower wing strut attachment
> Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2010 19:23:34 -0400
> From: helspersew@aol.com
>
> Hi Doug,
>
> Wa-la (see attached photos). I used an aluminum insert 7075 alloy, threaded
> to accept a J-3 fork (from Wag Aero $$$$$). Secure with two 1/4" bolts. I am
> sure you could find a lower priced fork somewhere.
>
> Disclaimer: Haven't flown behind it yet, but Larry Williams has something
> very similar and is doing just fine.
>
> Dan Helsper
> Poplar Grove, IL.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Doug Dever <chiefpepperhead@hotmail.com>
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Thu, Jun 17, 2010 2:55 pm
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Lower wing strut attachment
>
> I know I'm getting a little ahead of myself as I'm still building ribs.
> for those that have not used steel struts how have you done the lower lift
> strut attachment so as to have the ability to ajust the length. Carlson
> aircraft has some streamlined alum strut material very reasonable. But, you
> cant weld a fork and barrel assy into them, of course. And the FAA PMA fork
> and barrel sets are hideously priced.
>
> Doug Dever
> In beautiful Stow Ohio
>
>
> ------------------------------
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Subject: | Officially joined the "Oh sh$#@!" club tonight... |
Lorin,
I would have jumped out yelled, "Is that where you wanted me to park it?"
Gary Boothe
Cool, Ca.
Pietenpol
WW Corvair Conversion, mounted
Tail done, Fuselage on gear
(19 ribs down.)
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of ldmill
Sent: Wednesday, June 16, 2010 8:14 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Officially joined the "Oh sh$#@!" club tonight...
The old saying - "those that have, and those that are going to..." Yes, you
know what I'm talking about (please don't make me utter the blasphemous
words aloud), I successfully accomplished my first with the GN-1 tonight.
Unfortunately, 3/4 of the EAA chapter were out flying also - and not the
quiet 3/4 either. There was much discussion/threats afterwords about
painting a circle on the side of the nose. At least they helped cleaning the
grass out of the wheelpants...
No damage, didn't hit anything, wing didn't dip or touch ground, tires
didn't skid or slide, only did a nice easy 90 degree attention catching
turn, and ended up in the grass.
So now, all I can say is "been there - done that". NOT to be repeated
again... That much luck only happens once.
What a gorgeous night to fly though!
Lorin
--------
Lorin Miller
Waiex N81YX
GN-1 N30PP
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=301500#301500
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Subject: | Last reminder for ohio piet gathering |
OK Fellers, tommorow is the Ohio Piet Gathering here at Chapman Memorial Field
(OH71). Hope to see some of you there, bring a dish to pass, or feel free to
drop what ever amount you want in the donation jar. I will see how this year
goes, and use the donation money to pay off the port-o-potty, food cost, and the
remainder gets saved for next year's Ohio Piet Gathering.
Shad
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Subject: | Question for the West Coast Piet Infidels |
Mike,
The price I must pay for keeping piece in the family is to attend the
semi-decade family reunion, on my wife's side! But I am sending my clone,
Mike Hardaway, hoping someone will take pictures of him there, and Chris
Tracy will think I'm not building ribs.which reminds me.Chris, I have A LOT
more than 18 ribs built!
Gary Boothe
Cool, Ca.
Pietenpol
WW Corvair Conversion, mounted
Tail done, Fuselage on gear
(19 ribs down.)
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Cuy, Michael
D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation]
Sent: Wednesday, June 16, 2010 10:55 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Question for the West Coast Piet Infidels
Gentlemen,
(and I use that term with reservations) You seem like a fun group of guys
who like to needle each other and encourage each other's building
efforts so I was wondering if we might get to meet any of you at Brodhead in
a few weeks ?
Mike C.
do not archive
Message 7
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Subject: | Lower wing strut attachment |
Dan=2C
Your comments lead me to another question. How did your W&B come out? I'm
a std FAA person at 170. I remember a short while back you were concerned
but I can't seem to find your final results.
Doug Dever
In beautiful Stow Ohio
_________________________________________________________________
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Subject: | Re: Perseverance.Patience.Cutting Tools |
In a message dated 6/17/2010 6:15:08 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
johnnysdrop@googlemail.com writes:
Have been modifying a wooden venetian blind to fit a window opening today.
It made me think of the similarities to rib making and rib stitching.
1. Repetitive cutting of thin wood Buy ribs from another builder
then you can swear at him
2. Lacing the slats (stitching) Buy new ones or get the wife
to do it or just get a bigger hammer and make the window fit the blinds.
Some times its about the destination and sometimes about the journey and
sometimes its about the size of ones hammer that makes the job go smoother
3. Personal qualities needed (patience/perseverance) and a big Beer
budget is more than helpful
4. Fine cutting tools Cutting tools are best in you fin them in
someone else's shop Markle them and you will never be disappointed!
>From this I have some questions relating to aircraft building:
1. Which is the more important quality, patience or perseverance (I
have more of the latter so swear often) Copious amounts of beer have a great
impact on both so buy plenty
2. Is a hand saw better than power saws (band or circular) Markle a
saw from your neighbor, those work best
3. How do you stop splintering in thin wood Use thicker wood
4. Does splintering matter if slight Only when you sit on them
What are your opinions? Opinions are like tools, you have too many until
you need one then you never have enough
John T
By all means do not archive
(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List)
(http://www.matronics.com/contribution)
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Subject: | Re: Question for the West Coast Piet Infidels |
Hi Ben
I can not guarantee your wife will want you to help her into the front spot after
I do the hard work of teaching the fellows the tricks of the entry.
I am trying to encourage the (Pieti Girl) to come with me and demo the art of graceful
entry with-out blushing. The proper shoulder strap adjustments will be
an art form. pictures and videos
can be taken for future slower learners that require many on the spot lessons.
Pieti Lowell
On Wed, Jun 16, 2010 at 1:55 PM, Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation]
wrote:
> Gentlemen,
>
> (and I use that term with reservations) You seem like a fun group of guys who
like to needle each other and encourage each others building
> efforts so I was wondering if we might get to meet any of you at Brodhead in
a few weeks ?
>
> Mike C.
>
> do not archive
>
>
> >
> >
> > " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
> > tp://forums.matronics.com
> > _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> >
> >
>
>
>
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=301697#301697
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: Lower wing strut attachment |
Doug,
I just did the final draft of my W&B for the inspection, scheduled for Mon
day. I have concluded, that my airplane is within the CG range with a 180
lb. pilot. This will be the most aft CG condition I can have. Every other
loading condition actually makes the situation better, as far as W&B goes
. The fuel and front seat passenger are of little consequence, since they
are placed virtually ON the CG. So I will do my test flights without any
changes. With me as pilot (150 lbs w/clothes) I will be about 1-1/2" ahea
d of the most aft CG limit. I am told airplanes fly better when loaded thi
s way. So that is good.
Ran into a snag with my Model B carb. I have been turning on and off the
main fuel valve this week for various reasons, with no adverse effects.
Today I turned the Fuel valve ON, and the carb started leaking like a sie
ve. It appears that the main float chamber needle valve is not seating. Do
n't know why. As soon as I am able. I will consult the Model A guru across
the taxi way in this matter. He has some other resources (local Model A
club) to utilize too.
I want to taxi!! I am completely DONE!!!!
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Dever <chiefpepperhead@hotmail.com>
Sent: Fri, Jun 18, 2010 3:57 pm
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Lower wing strut attachment
Dan,
Your comments lead me to another question. How did your W&B come out? I'
m a std FAA person at 170. I remember a short while back you were concern
ed but I can't seem to find your final results.
Doug Dever
In beautiful Stow Ohio
Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your
inbox. See how.
========================
===========
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-= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription,
-= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ,
-= Photoshare, and much much more:
-
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Message 11
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Subject: | Lower wing strut attachment |
I've seen the pics and am envious. With a little luck I shoud be there in
about 3 yrs. I'm limited more by money than time. If I had enough money I
could probably be done in a year.
BTW could you tell me a little about your model A? have you had it on a dyn
o? Do you have inserts or babbited? Counter weighted crank? etc.
Doug Dever
In beautiful Stow Ohio
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Lower wing strut attachment
From: helspersew@aol.com
Doug=2C
I just did the final draft of my W&B for the inspection=2C scheduled for Mo
nday. I have concluded=2C that my airplane is within the CG range with a 18
0 lb. pilot. This will be the most aft CG condition I can have. Every other
loading condition actually makes the situation better=2C as far as W&B goe
s. The fuel and front seat passenger are of little consequence=2C since the
y are placed virtually ON the CG. So I will do my test flights without any
changes. With me as pilot (150 lbs w/clothes) I will be about 1-1/2" ahead
of the most aft CG limit. I am told airplanes fly better when loaded this w
ay. So that is good.
Ran into a snag with my Model B carb. I have been turning on and off the ma
in fuel valve this week for various reasons=2C with no adverse effects. Tod
ay I turned the Fuel valve ON=2C and the carb started leaking like a sieve.
It appears that the main float chamber needle valve is not seating. Don't
know why. As soon as I am able. I will consult the Model A guru across the
taxi way in this matter. He has some other resources (local Model A club) t
o utilize too.
I want to taxi!! I am completely DONE!!!!
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove=2C IL.
-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Dever <chiefpepperhead@hotmail.com>
Sent: Fri=2C Jun 18=2C 2010 3:57 pm
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Lower wing strut attachment
Dan=2C
Your comments lead me to another question. How did your W&B come out? I'm
a std FAA person at 170. I remember a short while back you were concerned
but I can't seem to find your final results.
Doug Dever
In beautiful Stow Ohio
Hotmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your
inbox. See how.
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tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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Message 12
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Subject: | Re: Model A questions |
Bought that Model A on Ebay for $100.00. Drove up to Boscobel, Wi. to pick
it up. It wasn't anything to look at, an oily, greasy hulk, but it was al
l there. Drove it over to Antique Engine Re-builders, in Skokie, IL. This
guy really knows what he is doing. He installed the following parts new:
Pistons
Connecting rods
Modern insert bearings
Oversize intake valves and seats, exhaust valves.
Counter-weighted crank
The bill was about $2500.00. Turns out that this block was out of a 1950
Gleaner Combine. These blocks were 8 lbs. heavier than the old A's becaus
e they were beefed up in certain places. Turns out it was good for me beca
use I needed the extra weight up there.
Then I bought some parts from Ken Perkins, of Olathe, KS. Water pump, cran
k drive for mag, cam gear mag drive for 2nd mag. Modified oil pan. Bought
and installed two new Slick mags. Made up ignition wires to unshielded av
iation plugs (18mm). Sent my aluminum (8 plug) aftermarket head over to Ke
n Perkins and he drilled and tapped the plug holes for me.
Didn't know a THING about Model A engines when I started, but know some no
w through this experience. Have not done any dyno testing, but it runs up
to 1860 RPM static, which is perfect. Put a giant fish scale on the tail
and it registered 260 lbs. of thrust. I am told this is good.
Any other questions let me know.
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Dever <chiefpepperhead@hotmail.com>
Sent: Fri, Jun 18, 2010 5:51 pm
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Lower wing strut attachment
I've seen the pics and am envious. With a little luck I shoud be there in
about 3 yrs. I'm limited more by money than time. If I had enough money
I could probably be done in a year.
BTW could you tell me a little about your model A? have you had it on a dy
no? Do you have inserts or babbited? Counter weighted crank? etc.
Doug Dever
In beautiful Stow Ohio
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Lower wing strut attachment
From: helspersew@aol.com
Doug,
I just did the final draft of my W&B for the inspection, scheduled for Mon
day. I have concluded, that my airplane is within the CG range with a 180
lb. pilot. This will be the most aft CG condition I can have. Every other
loading condition actually makes the situation better, as far as W&B goes
. The fuel and front seat passenger are of little consequence, since they
are placed virtually ON the CG. So I will do my test flights without any
changes. With me as pilot (150 lbs w/clothes) I will be about 1-1/2" ahea
d of the most aft CG limit. I am told airplanes fly better when loaded thi
s way. So that is good.
Ran into a snag with my Model B carb. I have been turning on and off the
main fuel valve this week for various reasons, with no adverse effects.
Today I turned the Fuel valve ON, and the carb started leaking like a sie
ve. It appears that the main float chamber needle valve is not seating. Do
n't know why. As soon as I am able. I will consult the Model A guru across
the taxi way in this matter. He has some other resources (local Model A
club) to utilize too.
I want to taxi!! I am completely DONE!!!!
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Dever <chiefpepperhead@hotmail.com>
Sent: Fri, Jun 18, 2010 3:57 pm
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Lower wing strut attachment
Dan,
Your comments lead me to another question. How did your W&B come out? I'
m a std FAA person at 170. I remember a short while back you were concern
ed but I can't seem to find your final results.
Doug Dever
In beautiful Stow Ohio
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Message 13
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Subject: | Re: Lower wing strut attachment |
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Message 14
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Subject: | CG calculations on a GN-1. |
When I brought it up a while back somebody posted that the plans have a mistake
in them for calculating weight and balance.can someone tell me what it is? I
hope to be back to that step soon. Dan tells me that the CAM-18 specifies 22%
to 34% MAC. that - if I calculated it right is 13.2" to 20.4" MAC on a 60" wing
Chord. that is different than the 18.1 to 20.7 inches I see in my plans. is
that the only mistake anybody knows of? Raymond
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=301713#301713
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