Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:34 AM - Re: couple of new guy questions... (bubbleboy)
2. 02:57 AM - ELT Story from AOPA (Jack)
3. 04:25 AM - Re: couple of new guy questions... (j_dunavin)
4. 04:40 AM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (Kip and Beth Gardner)
5. 05:19 AM - Re: Split Axle Gear (Ben Charvet)
6. 05:21 AM - Re: NX929DH progress report (Ben Charvet)
7. 06:03 AM - Re: Split Axle Gear (TOM STINEMETZE)
8. 06:03 AM - Re: NX929DH progress report (Jack Phillips)
9. 06:10 AM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (Jack Phillips)
10. 06:44 AM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (Ryan Mueller)
11. 06:57 AM - Re: Split Axle Gear (Chris)
12. 07:15 AM - Re: Split Axle Gear (TOM STINEMETZE)
13. 08:54 AM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... Corvair engines (Tim Willis)
14. 08:55 AM - Wheels (skellytown flyer)
15. 09:18 AM - Re: NX929DH progress report (AircamperN11MS)
16. 11:13 AM - Re: couple of new guy questions... (j_dunavin)
17. 11:23 AM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (Ryan Mueller)
18. 11:25 AM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (John Recine)
19. 11:37 AM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (Perry Rhoads)
20. 11:38 AM - Re: couple of new guy questions... (j_dunavin)
21. 11:38 AM - Re: couple of new guy questions... (j_dunavin)
22. 11:46 AM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (Jim Markle)
23. 12:00 PM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (John Recine)
24. 12:07 PM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (Rick Holland)
25. 12:21 PM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (Rick Holland)
26. 12:22 PM - Re: local evening flight (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC Aerospace Corporation])
27. 01:30 PM - Re: NX929DH progress report (Pieti Lowell)
28. 02:49 PM - Re: couple of new guy questions... (j_dunavin)
29. 02:59 PM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (Gary Boothe)
30. 03:06 PM - Piet Aerobatics (Gary Boothe)
31. 03:06 PM - Fw: Dan Yocum wrote on your Wall... (airlion)
32. 03:07 PM - Re: couple of new guy questions... (bubbleboy)
33. 03:22 PM - Re: Piet Aerobatics (Jeff Boatright)
34. 03:22 PM - Re: Fw: Dan Yocum wrote on your Wall... (Jeff Boatright)
35. 03:31 PM - 2 Piet fuselages available (jeff wilson)
36. 03:39 PM - Re: Re: Piet Aerobatics (Jim)
37. 03:39 PM - Re: Piet Aerobatics (shad bell)
38. 03:52 PM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (Jack Phillips)
39. 03:55 PM - Re: Piet Aerobatics (Gary Boothe)
40. 04:17 PM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (John Recine)
41. 04:32 PM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (John Recine)
42. 04:43 PM - Re: 2 Piet fuselages available (H RULE)
43. 05:06 PM - Re: Dan Yocum wrote on your Wall... (skellytown flyer)
44. 05:08 PM - Re: Re: Split Axle Gear (Jack)
45. 05:10 PM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (Jack)
46. 05:22 PM - Re: Re: NX929DH progress report (helspersew@aol.com)
47. 05:22 PM - Re: Re: Dan Yocum wrote on your Wall... (Ryan Mueller)
48. 05:33 PM - Re: Order plans (Todd Pryby)
49. 05:34 PM - Re: Re: NX929DH progress report (John Recine)
50. 05:39 PM - Re: Piet Aerobatics (Dan Yocum)
51. 06:44 PM - Re: Order plans (Jerry Dotson)
52. 08:07 PM - Re: Piet Aerobatics (Darrel Jones)
53. 09:23 PM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (Rick Holland)
54. 09:37 PM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... (Rick Holland)
55. 11:09 PM - Re: couple of new guy questions... Corvair engines (j_dunavin)
56. 11:22 PM - Re: Re: couple of new guy questions... Corvair engines (Ryan Mueller)
57. 11:49 PM - Re: couple of new guy questions... Corvair engines (j_dunavin)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
Hi Rick...yes the Piet is progressing slowly. Received a box of Corvair parts yesterday
so will clean those ready to fit. I dont have a Fifth Bearing yet but
am looking at Dan Weseman's unit. Looks nice and easily fitted. Im not anywhere
near that stage yet so see what comes up when I need it. I havent decided on
the engine management unit yet. I like the idea of monitoring all 6 cylinders
hence I was looking at that unit. I would like to speak to anyone who has one
to see how it goes. I have all the other instruments here. I do love the old
stuff but am a realist when it comes to monitoring the life threatening parts
of the plane...lol
Scotty
--------
Scotty
Tamworth, Australia
Building a Corvair Powered Pietenpol Air Camper
www.scottyspietenpol.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302450#302450
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| Subject: | ELT Story from AOPA |
The Federal Communications Commission (FCC) June 15 released the notice of a
rule prohibiting the "certification, manufacture, importation, sale, or
continued use of 121.5 MHz ELTs." The rule would suddenly make aircraft that
are in full compliance with the federal aviation regulations in violation of
federal communications law.
"At this time, we caution anyone against purchasing a new ELT until this
issue is resolved," said AOPA Vice President of Regulatory Affairs Rob
Hackman. "There's a lot of misunderstanding at this time as to the status of
this rule. As verified by the FCC, the rule has not been published in the
Federal Register, and thereby no effective date can be determined. This
provides AOPA and the general aviation industry the opportunity to address
our concerns with the FCC and potentially influence the outcome."
14 CFR Part 91.207 currently requires aircraft to carry a fixed ELT, but
does not specify either 121.5 or 406 MHz. The FCC's change to 47 CFR Part 87
would outlaw the use of the former-effectively forcing general aviation
aircraft owners to buy the 406 MHz ELT. The rule would go into effect 60
days after publication in the Federal Register. AOPA is aggressively
pursuing all options to have the FCC and FAA delay and re-evaluate the rule,
highlighting the economic and operational impact to the more than 220,000
aircraft in the GA fleet, most of whom still carry the 121.5 MHz ELTs.
"The FCC is making a regulatory change that would impose an extra cost on GA
operators, without properly communicating with the industry or understanding
the implications of its action," Hackman said. "There is no FAA requirement
to replace 121.5 MHz units with 406 MHz technology. When two government
agencies don't coordinate, GA can suffer."
Both the 121.5 MHz and 406 MHz ELTs meet the FAA's regulatory requirements
if manufactured to the proper technical standard order. While satellites no
longer monitor the 121.5 MHz frequency as of Feb. 1, 2009, the frequency is
monitored by ATC, the military, and other pilots. AOPA is exploring all
avenues of action to address this rule before it goes into effect.
It would be impossible to outfit all aircraft in the timeframe of the FCC
rule and cost prohibitive for GA aircraft owners. The rule highlights the
fact that threats to GA can come from many different areas, Hackman said.
Government agencies outside of the FAA don't necessarily understand the
effects of their actions on aviation, and poor communication can compound
the problem. In addition to the unnecessary cost, this ruling also raises
the question of the legality of the 406 MHz ELTs because they also transmit
a low-power signal on 121.5 MHz to allow the search-and-rescue community to
home as part of the rescue process.
Jack
DSM
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
Sounds like the 5th bearing conversion is almost a necessity?
I didn't think the corvair motor took that much conversion to make it an airplane
engine.
Should I consider other power plant options?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302453#302453
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
Just a quick comment.
We have 4 guys building Corvairs here locally, and all of us consider
Roy's 5th bearing to be a better design. Three of us hosted a
Corvair College here about 5 years ago & have been very involved in
the Corvair community. One is a professional performance engine
builder. I'm the least qualified to comment of the 4 as I've only
rebuilt a couple of engines in my day. Of course, you'll pay more &
it may not be an option for you, since Roy likes to fit each bearing
to each case for best precision and fit.
Kip Gardner
On Jun 25, 2010, at 5:33 AM, bubbleboy wrote:
> <scott.dawson@optusnet.com.au>
>
> Hi Rick...yes the Piet is progressing slowly. Received a box of
> Corvair parts yesterday so will clean those ready to fit. I dont
> have a Fifth Bearing yet but am looking at Dan Weseman's unit.
> Looks nice and easily fitted. Im not anywhere near that stage yet
> so see what comes up when I need it. I havent decided on the engine
> management unit yet. I like the idea of monitoring all 6 cylinders
> hence I was looking at that unit. I would like to speak to anyone
> who has one to see how it goes. I have all the other instruments
> here. I do love the old stuff but am a realist when it comes to
> monitoring the life threatening parts of the plane...lol
>
> Scotty
>
> --------
> Scotty
>
> Tamworth, Australia
> Building a Corvair Powered Pietenpol Air Camper
>
> www.scottyspietenpol.com
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302450#302450
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Split Axle Gear |
Thats what I did. If you look carefully you can still see the hammer
marks. The metal was too thick for the vise to work.
Ben
On 6/24/2010 4:16 PM, TOM STINEMETZE wrote:
> *Here's a question for you metal workers out there. The split axle
> gear plans show the top of the two pipes forming the "A" frame member
> being "flattened" prior to cutting at the proper angle and having the
> bearing lugs welded on. How does someone do this flattening if you do
> not have access to a hydraulic press? Is it acceptable to heat the
> metal and then flatten with a vise or hammer?*
> *Tom*
> *N328X*
> *
>
>
> *
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: NX929DH progress report |
From what I had read before hand, it was better just to fly. Crow hops
end up being several landings in a row, and I couldn't see any
advantage. The FAA has a great advisory circular about how to do your
flight testing, that every builder should read. Basically it says to do
a high speed taxi test fast enough to make sure you have aileron
authority, then just fly it up to 3000 ft before you level off.. Then
practice landing flares at altitude to get an idea what the slow speed
handling characteristics are _while still at altitude._ Setting up your
first landing from the traffic pattern is probably safer than doing it
from 6 ft. I followed the advisory circular, and was glad that I did.
Your results may vary...
Ben
On 6/24/2010 4:53 PM, Rick Holland wrote:
> That's something I have wondered about when its time for my first
> flight, whether its best to crow hop down the runway several times or
> just get it in the air and away from the hard ground as quickly as
> possible (always well above stall speed of course in case of engine
> problems). Sounds like its done both ways by a lot of people.
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Split Axle Gear |
Thanks Rick and Ben! That looks like it works pretty well. I like the
look of your axle/brake assembly as well.
Tom
N328X
do not archive
>>> Rick Holland <at7000ft@gmail.com> 6/24/2010 5:06 PM >>>
Howdy Tom
I didn't flatten the ends of the A frame pieces just indented them a small
amount by beating it with a big hammer (no heat). I welded in a piece to
close the end to prevent water from getting in.
rick
Message 8
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| Subject: | NX929DH progress report |
I agree completely, Ben. I think crow hops are useless and dangerous. With
any flight test, there should be an objective to the test. What is the
objective to a crow hop? To see if you can control the airplane at its
least controllable moment, when you have a total of 2 seconds flight time in
it? What have you learned if you do it successfully, that couldn't be
learend better making a stabilized approach from altitude?
Having said that, I actually did an inadvertant crow hop when I was doing a
high speed taxi test (high altitude taxi test?) in my Pietenpol. I ran it
down the runway to about 40 mph and lifted the tail to test directional
control. I was not prepared to fly and did not have my goggles on. At
about 40 mph, 8 years worth of dirt and sawdust came boiling up out of all
the nooks and crannies of the cockpit and got in my eyes. Next thing I
knew, I was flying about 8 feet off the ground. I chopped the throttle and
landed, uneventfully. The point of this story is that any time you are
moving the airplane close to flying speed, be prepared to FLY it.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Raleigh, NC
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ben Charvet
Sent: Friday, June 25, 2010 8:22 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: NX929DH progress report
>From what I had read before hand, it was better just to fly. Crow hops end
up being several landings in a row, and I couldn't see any advantage. The
FAA has a great advisory circular about how to do your flight testing, that
every builder should read. Basically it says to do a high speed taxi test
fast enough to make sure you have aileron authority, then just fly it up to
3000 ft before you level off.. Then practice landing flares at altitude to
get an idea what the slow speed handling characteristics are while still at
altitude. Setting up your first landing from the traffic pattern is
probably safer than doing it from 6 ft. I followed the advisory circular,
and was glad that I did. Your results may vary...
Ben
On 6/24/2010 4:53 PM, Rick Holland wrote:
That's something I have wondered about when its time for my first flight,
whether its best to crow hop down the runway several times or just get it in
the air and away from the hard ground as quickly as possible (always well
above stall speed of course in case of engine problems). Sounds like its
done both ways by a lot of people.
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
J_dunavin,
(BTW, do you have a name?),
I'm not a fan of the corvair conversions, as others on this list know. The
design requirements of an automobile engine are totally different from those
of an aircraft engine. Auto engines are simply not designed to operate at
or near full power for more than a few seconds at a time, where an airplane
engine must do so continuously, and reliably.
So to use an auto engine conversion, it must offer advantages over available
aircraft engines. I have a 65 horsepower Continental aircraft engine in
mine and I made it essentially a brand new engine for a total cost of $7500.
With all the mods that must be made to a Corvair to make it somewhat
reliable, I doubt you can do it for much less than $7500.
You can buy a running, serviceable (even though close to overhaul)
Continental for $3500 and get several years of flying behind it before
needing to overhaul it.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Raleigh, NC
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of j_dunavin
Sent: Friday, June 25, 2010 7:25 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: couple of new guy questions...
Sounds like the 5th bearing conversion is almost a necessity?
I didn't think the corvair motor took that much conversion to make it an
airplane engine.
Should I consider other power plant options?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302453#302453
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
I agree with Jack, insofar as how his comments apply to auto engine conversions
in general. However, there are a couple of his points that I feel cannot be fairly
applied to the Corvair specifically. I'll address the WW based conversion,
as I think it's safe to say it is the most popular.
Operation at or near full power continuously: the WW based Corvair conversion produces
full power (approx 100hp) at a far lower RPM than full power in the car.
Corvair engines in the auto role redline around 5,500. In the aircraft conversion
you are turning, in a Piet, low 3,000s at most at full throttle. The engine
is essentially being derated and not stressed to produce it's power like
some other auto conversions might be.
Cost: I agree with Jack that you can overhaul an A-65 for just as much, or even
less than what a full boat Corvair overhaul is goon to cost you. However I feel
this a bit of an apples to oranges comparison, as you are talking a 65hp engine
versus a 100hp engine. A fairer comparison would be the cost of a proper
overhaul/conversion of a Corvair versus the cost of acquisition and a good overhaul
on an 0-200. In that case the Corvair is a less expensive alternative.
The nice thing about a Piet is that it certainly does not need 100hp to fly. If
you did not need or want 100hp for your Piet, then you can go with an A-65 and
have a solid, reliable aircraft engine for what (I feel) a very well built Corvair
would cost. If you need/want that 100hp, then the Corvair is a viable alternative
to the expense of an O-200.
My two cents. :)
Ryan
Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 25, 2010, at 8:10 AM, "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
> J_dunavin,
>
> (BTW, do you have a name?),
>
> I'm not a fan of the corvair conversions, as others on this list know. The
> design requirements of an automobile engine are totally different from those
> of an aircraft engine. Auto engines are simply not designed to operate at
> or near full power for more than a few seconds at a time, where an airplane
> engine must do so continuously, and reliably.
>
> So to use an auto engine conversion, it must offer advantages over available
> aircraft engines. I have a 65 horsepower Continental aircraft engine in
> mine and I made it essentially a brand new engine for a total cost of $7500.
> With all the mods that must be made to a Corvair to make it somewhat
> reliable, I doubt you can do it for much less than $7500.
>
> You can buy a running, serviceable (even though close to overhaul)
> Continental for $3500 and get several years of flying behind it before
> needing to overhaul it.
>
> Jack Phillips
> NX899JP
> Raleigh, NC
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of j_dunavin
> Sent: Friday, June 25, 2010 7:25 AM
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: couple of new guy questions...
>
>
> Sounds like the 5th bearing conversion is almost a necessity?
> I didn't think the corvair motor took that much conversion to make it an
> airplane engine.
> Should I consider other power plant options?
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302453#302453
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 11
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My experience with working with 4130 has shown that it is better to heat and
flatten then to do it cold. When doing it cold I got numerous fine cracks
in the tubing. When heated to a nice orange color it bends like butter in a
vice and no cracks. I personally would not hit tubing with a hammer when
hot. The heat needed to bend should have no effect on the strength of the
metal.
Chris
Sacramento, Ca
Westcoastpiet.com
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of TOM
STINEMETZE
Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2010 1:16 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Split Axle Gear
Here's a question for you metal workers out there. The split axle gear
plans show the top of the two pipes forming the "A" frame member being
"flattened" prior to cutting at the proper angle and having the bearing lugs
welded on. How does someone do this flattening if you do not have access to
a hydraulic press? Is it acceptable to heat the metal and then flatten with
a vise or hammer?
Tom
N328X
Message 12
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Thanks Chris. I'm going to give that a try.
Tom
N328X
do not archive
____ | ____
\8/
/ \
>>> "Chris" <catdesigns@att.net> 6/25/2010 8:57 AM >>>
My experience with working with 4130 has shown that it is better to heat
and flatten then to do it cold. When doing it cold I got numerous fine
cracks in the tubing. When heated to a nice orange color it bends like
butter in a vice and no cracks. I personally would not hit tubing with a
hammer when hot. The heat needed to bend should have no effect on the
strength of the metal.
Chris
Sacramento, Ca
Westcoastpiet.com
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... Corvair engines |
I believe both Ryan and Jack are right-- each in his own way. First let me say
that I'd never argue with Jack Phillips on anything aero. Now I am going to
sound like an economist: "on the other hand."
Re the Corvair, the problems some have had with un-nitrided crankshafts, cooling
and other mechanical problems show that there are ways to be unhappy with what
sounds like a great idea-- a zero time 100 hp engine for about $8K, maybe quite
a bit less, with good scrounging and personal wrench work.
Shad Bell, a great machanic and flier, had his Corvair problems in 2007-08, but
he licked them through intelligent and repeated fixes. Many Pieters don't have
that rigor, though. Shad lives aviation and machines. Some of us would not
get the right things done with a Corvair.
A few days ago I saw Kevin Purtee's Corvair. It is a very nice installation.
With a standard 12-fin Corvair cooler, he has had no cooling problems. He nitrided
his crank, not after his own problems, but wisely responding to others'
reports. He told me that if he rebuilds or repairs, he likely will add the fifth
bearing. Kevin lives aviation in his "day job," and like the great pros,
he thinks and lives maintenance, safety and reliability. Unable to fly for a
few days from a wheel problem, he took the opportunity to look into the engine.
The engine is a beauty; its rocker arms gleam. No surprise, since it is Kevin's.
As I said, I can see the good points of both views. I have a dismantled Corvair
and a rebuilt (by Corky of this board) A-65. I am going with the A-65 for its
simplicity and dependability, and was very glad to get it.
Being a fat boy in a warm climate, though, I may need more hp or lift to get me,
a full tank, and a passenger into the air. If my beautiful spars were not already
at standard design length, I would add 4 ft overall to wingspan, more like
a Cub, to mile more lift and make the A-65 more effective in climb. However,
I am holding onto the Corvair as a fallback for the future. Having the benefit
of experience of many, if I use that engine, I will go with the fifth bearing.
It adds peace of mind.
Ryan is right about the operating range of the Corvair after conversion. The magic
is in the replacement cam, per WW. The cam greatly lowers the peak torque
and hp to 2800-3200 rpm, as I recall. Operating at 2500-2800 rpm is a walk
in the park for the modified engine. This rpm range is higher than an A-65 (2150
or so in cruise, 2300 rpm takeoff, as I recall). However it is very close
to the range of more modern Continental and Lycomings. This goes a long way
toward making it an aircraft engine.
Tim in central TX
-----Original Message-----
>From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com>
>Sent: Jun 25, 2010 8:43 AM
>To: "pietenpol-list@matronics.com" <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: couple of new guy questions...
>
>
>I agree with Jack, insofar as how his comments apply to auto engine conversions
in general. However, there are a couple of his points that I feel cannot be
fairly applied to the Corvair specifically. I'll address the WW based conversion,
as I think it's safe to say it is the most popular.
>
>Operation at or near full power continuously: the WW based Corvair conversion
produces full power (approx 100hp) at a far lower RPM than full power in the car.
Corvair engines in the auto role redline around 5,500. In the aircraft conversion
you are turning, in a Piet, low 3,000s at most at full throttle. The engine
is essentially being derated and not stressed to produce it's power like
some other auto conversions might be.
>
>Cost: I agree with Jack that you can overhaul an A-65 for just as much, or even
less than what a full boat Corvair overhaul is goon to cost you. However I feel
this a bit of an apples to oranges comparison, as you are talking a 65hp engine
versus a 100hp engine. A fairer comparison would be the cost of a proper
overhaul/conversion of a Corvair versus the cost of acquisition and a good overhaul
on an 0-200. In that case the Corvair is a less expensive alternative.
>
>The nice thing about a Piet is that it certainly does not need 100hp to fly. If
you did not need or want 100hp for your Piet, then you can go with an A-65 and
have a solid, reliable aircraft engine for what (I feel) a very well built
Corvair would cost. If you need/want that 100hp, then the Corvair is a viable
alternative to the expense of an O-200.
>
>My two cents. :)
>
>Ryan
>
>Sent from my iPhone
>
>On Jun 25, 2010, at 8:10 AM, "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
>>
>> J_dunavin,
>>
>> (BTW, do you have a name?),
>>
>> I'm not a fan of the corvair conversions, as others on this list know. The
>> design requirements of an automobile engine are totally different from those
>> of an aircraft engine. Auto engines are simply not designed to operate at
>> or near full power for more than a few seconds at a time, where an airplane
>> engine must do so continuously, and reliably.
>>
>> So to use an auto engine conversion, it must offer advantages over available
>> aircraft engines. I have a 65 horsepower Continental aircraft engine in
>> mine and I made it essentially a brand new engine for a total cost of $7500.
>> With all the mods that must be made to a Corvair to make it somewhat
>> reliable, I doubt you can do it for much less than $7500.
>>
>> You can buy a running, serviceable (even though close to overhaul)
>> Continental for $3500 and get several years of flying behind it before
>> needing to overhaul it.
>>
>> Jack Phillips
>> NX899JP
>> Raleigh, NC
>>
<clip>
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Well I don't know what I might find-but what I have is a new set of 5" aircraft
wheels with Grove disc brakes on my Pietenpol project. and new 5:00 X 5" aero
trainer tires.and with my very poor and rough runway I would sure like to trade
them for some 6" wheels with maybe drum brakes or such that should not be so
strong.my plane will be light and I don't want to flip it on it's nose by getting
heavy footed or dropping a tire into a low spot.so if you know anyone that
has a set of 6" wheels that have bearings that will fit what looks like 1 1/4"
axles on Piper cub gear I'd like to talk trade. also the plane has an EIS
unit in the panel and I have no real desire to look at that thing in a Piet-n
well a GN-1 version. so it is sure trading material too.thanks for any help or
advice. Raymond
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302477#302477
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| Subject: | Re: NX929DH progress report |
Hello Dan,
I am new to this site but have been flying my piet on the west coast for 38 years.
i have also got wire wheels and no brakes. I understand what you are saying
about slowing and stopping the plane from moving. I have found that if I
run the tires to where the look almost half flat that it creates enough rolling
resistance that I can roll out and stop on a hard surface in about 700'. The
plane won't creep at the hold short line at idle either. I hope this may help
you some.
Regards,
--------
Scott Liefeld
Flying N11MS since March 1972
Steel Tube
C-85-12
Wire Wheels
Broadhead in 1996
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302482#302482
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/1253078173jzpqtlv_580.jpg
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
I do actually have a name, it's Joe, or Joseph, but only my mother calls me by
my full name.... or when the wife is mad at me. :o
Anyway, I don't know if i NEED a 100hp. I do want to be able to take my dad and
I up or whatever friends I want. We are also on a budget, and want the best bang
for the buck, of course. The corvair motor seems like a good idea becasue:
A) it is in the plans,
B) I think I can pick up a core for next to nothing. ( mybuddy's dad has three
of them )
C) overhaul kits would be cheaper? maybe?
D) and I think i need the power so I can take others up with me. And or for longer
X country flights.
I'm also open for other engine ideas... I hear a VW is not a good idea?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302488#302488
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
What is your budget, just out of curiosity?
Ryan
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 1:12 PM, j_dunavin <j_dunavin@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> I do actually have a name, it's Joe, or Joseph, but only my mother calls me
> by my full name.... or when the wife is mad at me. :o
> Anyway, I don't know if i NEED a 100hp. I do want to be able to take my dad
> and I up or whatever friends I want. We are also on a budget, and want the
> best bang for the buck, of course. The corvair motor seems like a good idea
> becasue:
> A) it is in the plans,
> B) I think I can pick up a core for next to nothing. ( mybuddy's dad has
> three of them )
> C) overhaul kits would be cheaper? maybe?
> D) and I think i need the power so I can take others up with me. And or for
> longer X country flights.
>
> I'm also open for other engine ideas... I hear a VW is not a good idea?
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302488#302488
>
>
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
Time to ask if you have read Tony B s firewall forward?
He talks of such things especially about getting a solid ac engine for near the
cost of a conversion. Actually I located a good lycoming 0235 core and when
I am done will have maybe 8K in it and a completely rebuilt engine designed to
run at full rpm for extended periods.
The next to nothing Corvairs sound attractive but after the time and 8500 bucks
you still have a car engine in your piet.
I figure I am building an airplane, why not use an airplane engine?
John
------Original Message------
From: j_dunavin
Sender: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
ReplyTo: Pietenpol builders Board
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: couple of new guy questions...
Sent: Jun 25, 2010 2:12 PM
I do actually have a name, it's Joe, or Joseph, but only my mother calls me by
my full name.... or when the wife is mad at me. :o
Anyway, I don't know if i NEED a 100hp. I do want to be able to take my dad and
I up or whatever friends I want. We are also on a budget, and want the best bang
for the buck, of course. The corvair motor seems like a good idea becasue:
A) it is in the plans,
B) I think I can pick up a core for next to nothing. ( mybuddy's dad has three
of them )
C) overhaul kits would be cheaper? maybe?
D) and I think i need the power so I can take others up with me. And or for longer
X country flights.
I'm also open for other engine ideas... I hear a VW is not a good idea?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302488#302488
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
My home airport is 690' elevation. Last week I took a retired airline pilot
for a ride when the DA was 2700'. I weigh 230 and he weighs 210, we had 8
gallons 100LL on board. Continental A-65 proved plenty capable. We took off
using only a few hundred feet of the 3900 asphalt and landed on the 1800'
grass using half of it. N12939 weighs 664 empty.
Unless you're flying high and hot, get the A-65.
Perry Rhoads
N12939
----- Original Message -----
From: "j_dunavin" <j_dunavin@hotmail.com>
Sent: Friday, June 25, 2010 1:12 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: couple of new guy questions...
>
> I do actually have a name, it's Joe, or Joseph, but only my mother calls
> me by my full name.... or when the wife is mad at me. :o
> Anyway, I don't know if i NEED a 100hp. I do want to be able to take my
> dad and I up or whatever friends I want. We are also on a budget, and want
> the best bang for the buck, of course. The corvair motor seems like a good
> idea becasue:
> A) it is in the plans,
> B) I think I can pick up a core for next to nothing. ( mybuddy's dad has
> three of them )
> C) overhaul kits would be cheaper? maybe?
> D) and I think i need the power so I can take others up with me. And or
> for longer X country flights.
>
> I'm also open for other engine ideas... I hear a VW is not a good idea?
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302488#302488
>
>
>
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
Well having never built a plane before, I have read that the mean average build
cost of a piet is $8,000. I would like to try for $6,000. We have time, and we
can scrounge. I can also come up with a lot of hardware, ect. as I am an A&P
and we have lots of goodies at the shop.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302491#302491
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
I have also not read Tony B's firewall forward.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302492#302492
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
blah, blah, blah.....
>
>I figure I am building an airplane, why not use an airplane engine?
>
Good point John! That's why I'm using the ORIGINAL Pietenpol engine (Model A of
course!) in mine!!
:-)
>John
>------Original Message------
>From: j_dunavin
>Sender: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
>To: Pietenpol builders Board
>ReplyTo: Pietenpol builders Board
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: couple of new guy questions...
>Sent: Jun 25, 2010 2:12 PM
>
>
>I do actually have a name, it's Joe, or Joseph, but only my mother calls me by
my full name.... or when the wife is mad at me. :o
>Anyway, I don't know if i NEED a 100hp. I do want to be able to take my dad and
I up or whatever friends I want. We are also on a budget, and want the best
bang for the buck, of course. The corvair motor seems like a good idea becasue:
>A) it is in the plans,
>B) I think I can pick up a core for next to nothing. ( mybuddy's dad has three
of them )
>C) overhaul kits would be cheaper? maybe?
>D) and I think i need the power so I can take others up with me. And or for longer
X country flights.
>
>I'm also open for other engine ideas... I hear a VW is not a good idea?
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302488#302488
>
>
>Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
>
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
"And that's why you're gettin all the glory"!
Do not archive
John
------Original Message------
From: Jim Markle
Sender: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
ReplyTo: Pietenpol builders Board
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: couple of new guy questions...
Sent: Jun 25, 2010 2:46 PM
blah, blah, blah.....
>
>I figure I am building an airplane, why not use an airplane engine?
>
Good point John! That's why I'm using the ORIGINAL Pietenpol engine (Model A of
course!) in mine!!
:-)
>John
>------Original Message------
>From: j_dunavin
>Sender: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
>To: Pietenpol builders Board
>ReplyTo: Pietenpol builders Board
>Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: couple of new guy questions...
>Sent: Jun 25, 2010 2:12 PM
>
>
>I do actually have a name, it's Joe, or Joseph, but only my mother calls me by
my full name.... or when the wife is mad at me. :o
>Anyway, I don't know if i NEED a 100hp. I do want to be able to take my dad and
I up or whatever friends I want. We are also on a budget, and want the best
bang for the buck, of course. The corvair motor seems like a good idea becasue:
>A) it is in the plans,
>B) I think I can pick up a core for next to nothing. ( mybuddy's dad has three
of them )
>C) overhaul kits would be cheaper? maybe?
>D) and I think i need the power so I can take others up with me. And or for longer
X country flights.
>
>I'm also open for other engine ideas... I hear a VW is not a good idea?
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302488#302488
>
>
>Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
>
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
I figured I needed more than 65 HP flying from 7000ft airports so the choice
was a O-200 or Corvair. The O-200 would have been around $10,000 (maybe less
if I got lucky on a used engine in the back of a hanger that didn't need
total rebuild) and the Corvair cost me $6000 however adding a 5th bearing
will add another $1200 (still may add that). One other plus for the Corvair
is the rebuild cost (assuming you own it long enough to do one), can replace
all 6 cylinders/forged pistons/rings/bearings/rods for around $600.
However the extra money spent on the O-200 could probably be recovered
whenever you sell. Any aircraft with an aircraft engine has got to be far
easier to sell than with an auto engine.
rick
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 12:12 PM, j_dunavin <j_dunavin@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> I do actually have a name, it's Joe, or Joseph, but only my mother calls me
> by my full name.... or when the wife is mad at me. :o
> Anyway, I don't know if i NEED a 100hp. I do want to be able to take my dad
> and I up or whatever friends I want. We are also on a budget, and want the
> best bang for the buck, of course. The corvair motor seems like a good idea
> becasue:
> A) it is in the plans,
> B) I think I can pick up a core for next to nothing. ( mybuddy's dad has
> three of them )
> C) overhaul kits would be cheaper? maybe?
> D) and I think i need the power so I can take others up with me. And or for
> longer X country flights.
>
> I'm also open for other engine ideas... I hear a VW is not a good idea?
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302488#302488
>
>
--
Rick Holland
Castle Rock, Colorado
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
$8000 for an average sounds a bit low, unless you live at an aircraft
junkyard will lots of usable stuff laying around. I have spent about $6000
airframe and $6000 Corvair engine (although the Model A engine I understand
can be built for a far amount less).
rick
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 12:37 PM, j_dunavin <j_dunavin@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Well having never built a plane before, I have read that the mean average
> build cost of a piet is $8,000. I would like to try for $6,000. We have
> time, and we can scrounge. I can also come up with a lot of hardware, ect.
> as I am an A&P and we have lots of goodies at the shop.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302491#302491
>
>
--
Rick Holland
Castle Rock, Colorado
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
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| Subject: | local evening flight |
Nice report Shad. I too had a gorgeous flight last night about 20 minutes before
sunset
after installing new bungee cords (inspired by Dan Helsper doing his bungee cords
recently)
Mike C.
do not archive
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| Subject: | Re: NX929DH progress report |
. Hi Dan,
Keep up with your testing the way you are comfortable with,
What is the Ford turning at fast taxi speeds ?
What water pump are you using and at what pulley ratios.
My Funk pump requires a good overhaul so I installed a T pump with a 2.5 driven
and a 3" driver. Today with 80 ambient she went to 195. I think a speed-up is
advisable.
What are other Ford side mounted pumps turning ?
Pieti Lowell
!!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302502#302502
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
$6000 on the airframe alone?? That must include instruments?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302504#302504
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
J,
Wanna shave $1,000 more off of that $8K? Use Poplar instead of Spruce.
Gary Boothe
Cool, CA
Pietenpol
WW Corvair Conversion
Tail done, Fuselage on gear
19 ribs done
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of j_dunavin
Sent: Friday, June 25, 2010 11:38 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: couple of new guy questions...
Well having never built a plane before, I have read that the mean average
build cost of a piet is $8,000. I would like to try for $6,000. We have
time, and we can scrounge. I can also come up with a lot of hardware, ect.
as I am an A&P and we have lots of goodies at the shop.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302491#302491
Message 30
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...and for those who may doubt it, Scott demonstrated some of the aerobatic
abilities of a Piet at the recent West Coast Piet Gathering.
Gary Boothe
Cool, CA
Pietenpol
WW Corvair Conversion
Tail done, Fuselage on gear
19 ribs done
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
AircamperN11MS
Sent: Friday, June 25, 2010 9:18 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: NX929DH progress report
<Scott.liefeld@lacity.org>
Hello Dan,
I am new to this site but have been flying my piet on the west coast for 38
years. i have also got wire wheels and no brakes. I understand what you
are saying about slowing and stopping the plane from moving. I have found
that if I run the tires to where the look almost half flat that it creates
enough rolling resistance that I can roll out and stop on a hard surface in
about 700'. The plane won't creep at the hold short line at idle either. I
hope this may help you some.
Regards,
--------
Scott Liefeld
Flying N11MS since March 1972
Steel Tube
C-85-12
Wire Wheels
Broadhead in 1996
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302482#302482
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/1253078173jzpqtlv_580.jpg
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| Subject: | Fw: Dan Yocum wrote on your Wall... |
Hi all, Today is friday and I just got back to my hangar with my engine after spending
a couple of days with William Wynne. The right cylinder head had to be
reworked and new pistons installed. Also the distributor had to be reworked.
I also have to re doo the baffeling. The engine ran great on the test stand.
William is great to work with and has an answer for any question. I hope I can
get 20 more hours flown off so I can get it to Brodhead. If not ,then I will
be up there in my Cessna 140.
----- Forwarded Message ----
From: Facebook <fbmessage+za6oo949@facebookmail.com>
Sent: Thu, June 24, 2010 1:46:03 PM
Subject: Dan Yocum wrote on your Wall...
Dan posted something on your Wall and wrote:
"How are your Corvair issues coming? Will we see you and your new bird at Brodhead
in 4 weeks?"
Reply to this email to comment on this post.
To see your Wall or to write on Dan's Wall, follow the link below:
http://www.facebook.com/n/?profile.php&id=1230512212&v=wall&story_fbid=1316932323301&mid=28d9709G49582054G116b125G1&bcode=MrKdO&n_m=airlion%40bellsouth.net
Thanks,
The Facebook Team
___
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Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
Someone with more knowledge of the Corvair please correct me if im wrong but I
recall reading that the Corvair engine was designed originally for a helicopter
under a tender process. When the company that requested it turned it down they
decided to recoup their design costs and build a car for it.
I believe there are enough of them flying to be able to put the aero versus auto
conversion issue to bed.
Scotty
--------
Scotty
Tamworth, Australia
Building a Corvair Powered Pietenpol Air Camper
www.scottyspietenpol.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302508#302508
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| Subject: | Re: Piet Aerobatics |
What maneuvers did he do?
This brings up a question I've always had: Has anyone done a real g
stress analysis on the Piet? One-piece and three-piece wing? Short
and long fuselage? With and without wing strut intercostals? Etc. I
know that the Flying and Glider Manual article states that an
engineer said that the Piet was plenty strong, but plenty strong for
what?
>
>...and for those who may doubt it, Scott demonstrated some of the aerobatic
>abilities of a Piet at the recent West Coast Piet Gathering.
>
>Gary Boothe
--
---
Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D.
Associate Professor of Ophthalmology
Emory University School of Medicine
Editor-in-Chief
Molecular Vision
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| Subject: | Re: Fw: Dan Yocum wrote on your Wall... |
Gardiner,
Good job! We need to fly together some time,
Jeff
>
>Hi all, Today is friday and I just got back to my hangar with my
>engine after spending a couple of days with William Wynne. The right
>cylinder head had to be reworked and new pistons installed. Also the
>distributor had to be reworked. I also have to re doo the baffeling.
>The engine ran great on the test stand. William is great to work
>with and has an answer for any question. I hope I can get 20 more
>hours flown off so I can get it to Brodhead. If not ,then I will be
>up there in my Cessna 140.
--
Jeff Boatright
"Now let's think about this..."
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| Subject: | 2 Piet fuselages available |
Spread the word.- The EAA Chapter 64 splinter group, "Scrounge Dawg Aviat
ion", is building a Pietenpol and we need to raise some money. We have 2 ne
arly completed Fuselage's for sale. Pictures attached. Price: $500 each obo
.
One is short or original at 163.5 inches firewall to tail post and normal w
idth. It is 12" from firewall to first bulkhead and includes rudder pedals
mounted and many metal fittings including cabane mount points and landing g
ear mounts. Just by eyeballing, it looks like its built close to plans. App
ears to have been built with epoxy throughout. Check photos-1 thru 12
The other is long at 173.5 inches from tail post to firewall and 15" from f
irewall to first bulkhead.This one has Model A motor mounts installed.- I
t appears to have been built with epoxy throughout and construction methods
deviate somewhat from plans. Longerons are two .5" x 1" and sandwiched wit
h plywood between.- It does appear to be very sturdy and is somewhat heav
y. Written on front of firewall is 111 lbs.- Check photos-13 thru 18.
Any questions can be directed to me off site - jlwilsonnn(at)yahoo.com
If you can't see photos, I'll be glad to send them to you via email. Help u
s finish our club Piet and get 2 more started.
The Scrounge Dawg Aviation Piet is on gear, wings and tail feathers complet
e. We need to build one more strut and a couple cabanes. Next step is assem
bly and engine mounting so we can check fitment and CG.
Flyin low and slow.
Jeff Wilson
NX899WT
=0A=0A=0A
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| Subject: | Re: Piet Aerobatics |
Hi Jeff,
Scott did two slow rolls one right after the other. Looked really good doing them.
Jim
Jim Boyer
Santa Rosa, CA
Pietenpol on wheels
Tail surfaces done
Wing ribs done
Corvair engine
On Jun 25, 2010, Jeff Boatright <jboatri@emory.edu> wrote:
What maneuvers did he do?
This brings up a question I've always had: Has anyone done a real g
stress analysis on the Piet? One-piece and three-piece wing? Short
and long fuselage? With and without wing strut intercostals? Etc. I
know that the Flying and Glider Manual article states that an
engineer said that the Piet was plenty strong, but plenty strong for
what?
>
>...and for those who may doubt it, Scott demonstrated some of the aerobatic
>abilities of a Piet at the recent West Coast Piet Gathering.
>
>Gary Boothe
--
---
Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D.
Associate Professor of Ophthalmology
Emory University School of Medicine
Editor-in-Chief
Molecular Vision
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|
| Subject: | Re: Piet Aerobatics |
The piet should easily do spins, hamerheads (if you have a corvair, or pt-6), and
ground loops with no problem, but I ain't try'n none of them on purpose.
Message 38
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
My Pietenpol cost me $15,000 to build, of which $7500 was in zero-timing the
Continental A65 (new cylinders and pistons, new camshaft, new mags,
overhauled crankcase and crankshaft). All aircraft grade materials. It
took me 8 years to build and I like to tell people I spent the same amount
in that 8 years as a 2-pack a day smoker would have spent on cigarettes.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Raleigh, NC
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Holland
Sent: Friday, June 25, 2010 3:15 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: couple of new guy questions...
$8000 for an average sounds a bit low, unless you live at an aircraft
junkyard will lots of usable stuff laying around. I have spent about $6000
airframe and $6000 Corvair engine (although the Model A engine I understand
can be built for a far amount less).
rick
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 12:37 PM, j_dunavin <j_dunavin@hotmail.com> wrote:
Well having never built a plane before, I have read that the mean average
build cost of a piet is $8,000. I would like to try for $6,000. We have
time, and we can scrounge. I can also come up with a lot of hardware, ect.
as I am an A&P and we have lots of goodies at the shop.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302491#302491
==========
st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
==========
http://forums.matronics.com
==========
le, List Admin.
="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
==========
--
Rick Holland
Castle Rock, Colorado
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 39
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Tail slides, outside loops, snap rolls...you know, kid's stuff.
Gary Boothe
Cool, CA
Pietenpol
WW Corvair Conversion
Tail done, Fuselage on gear
19 ribs done
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jeff
Boatright
Sent: Friday, June 25, 2010 3:18 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Piet Aerobatics
What maneuvers did he do?
This brings up a question I've always had: Has anyone done a real g
stress analysis on the Piet? One-piece and three-piece wing? Short
and long fuselage? With and without wing strut intercostals? Etc. I
know that the Flying and Glider Manual article states that an
engineer said that the Piet was plenty strong, but plenty strong for
what?
>
>...and for those who may doubt it, Scott demonstrated some of the aerobatic
>abilities of a Piet at the recent West Coast Piet Gathering.
>
>Gary Boothe
--
---
Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D.
Associate Professor of Ophthalmology
Emory University School of Medicine
Editor-in-Chief
Molecular Vision
Message 40
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|
| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
Poplar rules !
Man I really enjoy working with that wood.
John
Do not archive
------Original Message------
From: Gary Boothe
Sender: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
ReplyTo: Pietenpol builders Board
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: couple of new guy questions...
Sent: Jun 25, 2010 5:59 PM
J,
Wanna shave $1,000 more off of that $8K? Use Poplar instead of Spruce.
Gary Boothe
Cool, CA
Pietenpol
WW Corvair Conversion
Tail done, Fuselage on gear
19 ribs done
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of j_dunavin
Sent: Friday, June 25, 2010 11:38 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: couple of new guy questions...
Well having never built a plane before, I have read that the mean average
build cost of a piet is $8,000. I would like to try for $6,000. We have
time, and we can scrounge. I can also come up with a lot of hardware, ect.
as I am an A&P and we have lots of goodies at the shop.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302491#302491
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
Message 41
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
He makes some good arguments for using as engines over the other possible choices.
You may want to give it a read before making an engine commitment
John
Do not archive
------Original Message------
From: j_dunavin
Sender: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
ReplyTo: Pietenpol builders Board
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: couple of new guy questions...
Sent: Jun 25, 2010 2:38 PM
I have also not read Tony B's firewall forward.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302492#302492
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
Message 42
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| Subject: | Re: 2 Piet fuselages available |
Check out the legs!!!=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A______________________
__________=0AFrom: jeff wilson <jlwilsonnn@yahoo.com>=0ATo: pietenpol-list@
matronics.com=0ASent: Fri, June 25, 2010 6:17:59 PM=0ASubject: Pietenpol-Li
st: 2 Piet fuselages available=0A=0A=0ASpread the word.- The EAA Chapter
64 splinter group, "Scrounge Dawg Aviation", is building a Pietenpol and we
need to raise some money. We have 2 nearly completed Fuselage's for sale.
Pictures attached. Price: $500 each obo.=0A=0AOne is short or original at 1
63.5 inches firewall to tail post and normal width. It is 12" from firewall
to first bulkhead and includes rudder pedals mounted and many metal fittin
gs including cabane mount points and landing gear mounts. Just by eyeballin
g, it looks like its built close to plans. Appears to have been built with
epoxy throughout. Check photos-1 thru 12=0A=0AThe other is long at 173.5
inches from tail post to firewall and 15" from firewall to first bulkhead.T
his one has Model A motor mounts installed.- It appears to have been buil
t with epoxy throughout and construction methods deviate somewhat from plan
s. Longerons are two .5" x 1" and sandwiched with plywood between.- It do
es appear to be very sturdy and is somewhat heavy. Written on front of fire
wall is 111 lbs.- Check photos-13 thru 18.=0A=0AAny questions can be di
rected to me off site - jlwilsonnn(at)yahoo.com=0AIf you can't see photos,
I'll be glad to send them to you via email. Help us finish our club Piet an
d get 2 more started.=0A=0AThe Scrounge Dawg Aviation Piet is on gear, wing
s and tail feathers complete. We need to build one more strut and a couple
cabanes. Next step is assembly and engine mounting so we can check fitment
and CG.=0A=0AFlyin low and slow.=0AJeff Wilson=0ANX899WT
Message 43
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| Subject: | Re: Dan Yocum wrote on your Wall... |
I must have missed it-but sounds like you got the head hot? was there a bottom
cylinder baffle that came loose or something? I am kind surprised at how little
holds them in place.I made the left side scoop long to include the oil cooler
mounted right behind the head on mine.I sure hope simple scoops and bottom baffles
are enough to cool it.can you tell a little more about what you think caused
the initial problem? Raymond
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302524#302524
Message 44
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Tom,
I like the vcard attachment. Do others agree? Wonder if it's ok with Matt.
Jack
DSM
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of TOM
STINEMETZE
Sent: Friday, June 25, 2010 9:14 AM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Split Axle Gear
Thanks Chris. I'm going to give that a try.
Tom
N328X
do not archive
____ | ____
\8/
/ \
>>> "Chris" <catdesigns@att.net> 6/25/2010 8:57 AM >>>
My experience with working with 4130 has shown that it is better to heat and
flatten then to do it cold. When doing it cold I got numerous fine cracks
in the tubing. When heated to a nice orange color it bends like butter in a
vice and no cracks. I personally would not hit tubing with a hammer when
hot. The heat needed to bend should have no effect on the strength of the
metal.
Chris
Sacramento, Ca
Westcoastpiet.com
Message 45
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
Joe,
I did my C-85 overhaul for $4500...
Jack
DSM
www.textors.com
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of j_dunavin
Sent: Friday, June 25, 2010 1:13 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: couple of new guy questions...
I do actually have a name, it's Joe, or Joseph, but only my mother calls me
by my full name.... or when the wife is mad at me. :o
Anyway, I don't know if i NEED a 100hp. I do want to be able to take my dad
and I up or whatever friends I want. We are also on a budget, and want the
best bang for the buck, of course. The corvair motor seems like a good idea
becasue:
A) it is in the plans,
B) I think I can pick up a core for next to nothing. ( mybuddy's dad has
three of them )
C) overhaul kits would be cheaper? maybe?
D) and I think i need the power so I can take others up with me. And or for
longer X country flights.
I'm also open for other engine ideas... I hear a VW is not a good idea?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302488#302488
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| Subject: | Re: NX929DH progress report |
Hi Pieti,
Tomorrow is the day. I have my alarm set for 4 am. for a 6 am start-up. Co
mpletely disassembled the Model B carb today and soaked it in Gunk carb cl
eaner for an hour. Reassembled, and she is running beautifully. Taxied ove
r to the FBO pumps and filled tank with no-alcohol auto fuel. Double check
ed all safety wire, nuts etc. I have my contingent of safety crew assemble
d and at the ready, and they will be present in the morning.
I am using a Ken Perkins water pump. I am not sure of the pulley ratio. I
used what Ken provided. My temps were about 170 during taxi today.
Wish me luck, and if you are inclined, a prayer would be in order, and app
reciated.
Dan Helsper
Poplar Grove, IL.
-----Original Message-----
From: Pieti Lowell <Lowellcfrank@yahoo.com>
Sent: Fri, Jun 25, 2010 3:30 pm
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: NX929DH progress report
om>
. Hi Dan,
eep up with your testing the way you are comfortable with,
hat is the Ford turning at fast taxi speeds ?
hat water pump are you using and at what pulley ratios.
y Funk pump requires a good overhaul so I installed a T pump with a 2.5 dr
iven
nd a 3" driver. Today with 80 ambient she went to 195. I think a speed-up
is
dvisable.
hat are other Ford side mounted pumps turning ?
ieti Lowell
!
ead this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302502#302502
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| Subject: | Re: Dan Yocum wrote on your Wall... |
Here's all the info on the situation:
http://flycorvair.com/pietengineissue.html
Ryan
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 7:05 PM, skellytown flyer <skellflyer1@yahoo.com>wrote:
> skellflyer1@yahoo.com>
>
> I must have missed it-but sounds like you got the head hot? was there a
> bottom cylinder baffle that came loose or something? I am kind surprised at
> how little holds them in place.I made the left side scoop long to include
> the oil cooler mounted right behind the head on mine.I sure hope simple
> scoops and bottom baffles are enough to cool it.can you tell a little more
> about what you think caused the initial problem? Raymond
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302524#302524
>
>
Message 48
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Where can I order plans for the Pietenpol from?
Thank you,
Todd
Message 49
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| Subject: | Re: NX929DH progress report |
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Message 50
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| Subject: | Re: Piet Aerobatics |
Search the archives - Rob Bach described the aerobatics he's done in his blue Piet.
--
yocum@gmail.com
On Jun 25, 2010, at 5:17 PM, Jeff Boatright <jboatri@emory.edu> wrote:
>
> What maneuvers did he do?
>
> This brings up a question I've always had: Has anyone done a real g stress analysis
on the Piet? One-piece and three-piece wing? Short and long fuselage? With
and without wing strut intercostals? Etc. I know that the Flying and Glider
Manual article states that an engineer said that the Piet was plenty strong,
but plenty strong for what?
>
>
>>
>> ...and for those who may doubt it, Scott demonstrated some of the aerobatic
>> abilities of a Piet at the recent West Coast Piet Gathering.
>>
>> Gary Boothe
>
> --
> ---
>
> Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D.
> Associate Professor of Ophthalmology
> Emory University School of Medicine
> Editor-in-Chief
> Molecular Vision
>
>
>
>
Message 51
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This kink will take you where you need to go:
http://www.pressenter.com/~apietenp/Product.html
--------
Jerry Dotson
59 Daniel Johnson Rd
Baker, FL 32531
Started building NX510JD July, 2009
Ribs and tailfeathers done
using Lycoming O-235
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302536#302536
Message 52
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| Subject: | Re: Piet Aerobatics |
Man, we could get an aero demonstration team together and take it on the
circuit. The Blue Piets? On the air show schedule at Oshkosh? The
possibilities are ... frightening.
Open invitation for Pieter's at Sonoma Skypark as well. Walt moved his
Model A over the Schellville but that's only two mile by car with a lot
of other neat airplanes to look at.
Darrel Jones
Pfeifer Sport N154JP
On 6/25/2010 3:54 PM, Gary Boothe wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Gary Boothe"<gboothe5@comcast.net>
>
> Tail slides, outside loops, snap rolls...you know, kid's stuff.
>
> Gary Boothe
> Cool, CA
> Pietenpol
> WW Corvair Conversion
> Tail done, Fuselage on gear
> 19 ribs done
>
>
Message 53
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
Includes all instruments, cover, paint, engine mount.
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 3:49 PM, j_dunavin <j_dunavin@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> $6000 on the airframe alone?? That must include instruments?
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302504#302504
>
>
--
Rick Holland
Castle Rock, Colorado
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 54
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... |
Including the cost of the core?
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 6:10 PM, Jack <jack@textors.com> wrote:
>
> Joe,
> I did my C-85 overhaul for $4500...
> Jack
> DSM
> www.textors.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of j_dunavin
> Sent: Friday, June 25, 2010 1:13 PM
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: couple of new guy questions...
>
>
> I do actually have a name, it's Joe, or Joseph, but only my mother calls me
> by my full name.... or when the wife is mad at me. :o
> Anyway, I don't know if i NEED a 100hp. I do want to be able to take my dad
> and I up or whatever friends I want. We are also on a budget, and want the
> best bang for the buck, of course. The corvair motor seems like a good idea
> becasue:
> A) it is in the plans,
> B) I think I can pick up a core for next to nothing. ( mybuddy's dad has
> three of them )
> C) overhaul kits would be cheaper? maybe?
> D) and I think i need the power so I can take others up with me. And or for
> longer X country flights.
>
> I'm also open for other engine ideas... I hear a VW is not a good idea?
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302488#302488
>
>
--
Rick Holland
Castle Rock, Colorado
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 55
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... Corvair engines |
Well I'm going over to my Buddie's dad's farm tomorrow and ask about the motor.
Maybe if I get him all jazzed up first about the piet, he'll be more willing to
sell me the core for cheap!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302553#302553
Message 56
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... Corvair engines |
Make sure you check the engine code to determine if it will be suitable for
aircraft use. Checking to see if it turns over is always a good idea too....
Ryan
On Sat, Jun 26, 2010 at 1:09 AM, j_dunavin <j_dunavin@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Well I'm going over to my Buddie's dad's farm tomorrow and ask about the
> motor.
> Maybe if I get him all jazzed up first about the piet, he'll be more
> willing to sell me the core for cheap!
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302553#302553
>
>
Message 57
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| Subject: | Re: couple of new guy questions... Corvair engines |
uh ho, which are good codes?
This one is apparently the 110HP version??
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=302555#302555
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