---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 08/15/10: 19 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:02 AM - Re: Re: plans messures (Jack) 2. 04:19 AM - Re: plans messures (Jack) 3. 04:38 AM - Re: plans messures (Jack) 4. 06:02 AM - Corvair core (skellytown flyer) 5. 06:36 AM - Re: Re: plans messures (Jim Markle) 6. 06:51 AM - Re: number of coats of finish on wood? (kevinpurtee) 7. 06:59 AM - Re: OT Our new addition to the CAF hanger! (John Franklin) 8. 07:11 AM - Re: OT Our new addition to the CAF hanger! (Kelly Klaus) 9. 08:29 AM - Re: Re: Penetrating oil comparison (Doug Dever) 10. 08:36 AM - Re: Re: Penetrating oil comparison (Ryan Mueller) 11. 12:33 PM - Re: Re: Penetrating oil comparison (Doug Dever) 12. 12:34 PM - T-Shirts and HINT video #6 (Michael Perez) 13. 01:04 PM - amateur aircraft building and flying (Oscar Zuniga) 14. 01:04 PM - amateur aircraft building and flying (Oscar Zuniga) 15. 02:41 PM - Re: Penetrating oil comparison (coxwelljon) 16. 02:53 PM - Re: plans messures (giacummo) 17. 03:20 PM - Re: Re: plans messures (Jim Markle) 18. 05:07 PM - Re: T-Shirts and HINT video #6 (Rick Holland) 19. 08:10 PM - Re: Penetrating oil comparison (Bill Church) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:02:16 AM PST US From: "Jack" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: plans messures Hello again Mario, I've enjoyed our visits off-line. You, Oscar and Ryan are all correct on the plans. I enjoyed your website even though I know zero Spanish. It looks like your "smoothed" rib drawing is right on. Mr. Pietenpol mentioned the correction in the 1932 Flying and Glider Manual, "The drawing at figure 5-A shows a dimension of 6" in the top center of the wing section just a little below and to the left of the figure 60", See it? It's wrong. Should read 60 1/8" instead." If you don't have a copy of the manual let me know off-line and I can get you one. I like the pictures of your boat and beautiful family. I've attached a copy of "Piet Builders Guide to the Universe" which I believe Jim Markel put together; some of the sites are dated. It may be helpful to you. Best regards, Jack DSM -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of giacummo Sent: Saturday, August 14, 2010 11:06 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: plans messures Hello Nice to meet you Oscar; I remember you from your Squirrel page; and your Spanish name and surename. I am from Uruguay, and unfortunetly there is not any piet around in the country, at least any known. The experimental, and ultralight universe here is small and (I do not know why) very closed. I am a kind of crazy people just because I plan to build an airplane ( I know, its a not common thing to do) , but is the only way I have to fly, any ultralight si very expensive, so why not build one?. I decide to build this because it is enterely of wood, and this is the only aircraft material I can find here; aluminium 6061 do not exist, may be in Brazil, or Argentine, but to expendive. so the options where two, a Piet or a SkyPup. We chose the Piet. But the plans are... a guide, not real plans; lost mesures, not very clear drawings, may be incomplete, or with differences in mesures from one poijnt of view to another. The wing profile ... why not a simple cad file?. Thank for your words about "obvious".. ;0) I think a lot of things may come from one, they are not very difficult to resolv; but is an airplane, not a boat, so I prefer to be a little more sure on the things I will do. Thank you Oscar, I hope have something done in few weeks. here is the state of it now http://vgmk1.blogspot.com/ ;0) Regards. Mario Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308855#308855 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 04:19:51 AM PST US From: "Jack" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: plans messures Hello again Mario, I've enjoyed our visits off-line. You, Oscar and Ryan are all correct on the plans. I enjoyed your website even though I know zero Spanish. It looks like your "smoothed" rib drawing is right on. Mr. Pietenpol mentioned the correction in the 1932 Flying and Glider Manual, "The drawing at figure 5-A shows a dimension of 6" in the top center of the wing section just a little below and to the left of the figure 60", See it? It's wrong. Should read 60 1/8" instead." If you don't have a copy of the manual let me know off-line and I can get you one. I like the pictures of your boat and beautiful family. I tried to attach a copy of "Piet Builders Guide to the Universe" which I believe Jim Markel put together; some of the sites are dated, but it was returned. I will send it directly off-line. It may be helpful to you. Best regards, Jack DSM -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of giacummo Sent: Friday, August 13, 2010 9:21 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: plans messures Hello, I am new in the forum, and in the airplane building. I am planing to build a Piet and I have some doubts in this moment. I was reading some mesures and I saw that there are not the same in fifferent drawings (or seccion of a drawing), an in some places or are wrong or they arent there... Is this OK?, the differences are very small, but are there.. I have to improvise too much?... For example, I was looking the rudder and the end of the fusselage, the height of the "movible" ruddr is less then the height of the fixed part plus the estabilizer plus the end of the fuselage. This is ok? thank in advance for any answer, best regards mario Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308739#308739 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 04:38:18 AM PST US From: "Jack" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: plans messures Mario, You are correct on the rudder; adjust measurements so rudder does not go below the fuselage. If I remember correctly the rudder was 7/8" too long Jack DSM -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of giacummo Sent: Friday, August 13, 2010 9:21 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: plans messures Hello, I am new in the forum, and in the airplane building. I am planing to build a Piet and I have some doubts in this moment. I was reading some mesures and I saw that there are not the same in fifferent drawings (or seccion of a drawing), an in some places or are wrong or they arent there... Is this OK?, the differences are very small, but are there.. I have to improvise too much?... For example, I was looking the rudder and the end of the fusselage, the height of the "movible" ruddr is less then the height of the fixed part plus the estabilizer plus the end of the fuselage. This is ok? thank in advance for any answer, best regards mario Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308739#308739 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:02:17 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Corvair core From: "skellytown flyer" I know we're not running a for sale list necessarily but I have a friend who just moved to Idaho that does have a Corvair engine he dismantled and cleaned up and packed away that he will never use.he said he'd take a hundred bucks for it and he also has the Wynn manual for it.if anyone wants it give me an e-mail and I'll give his address.I am slowly getting my cowl fixed up for mine.Raymond Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308873#308873 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:36:51 AM PST US From: Jim Markle Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: plans messures Looks like I need to get busy and do some updating on that document! jm -----Original Message----- >From: Jack >Sent: Aug 15, 2010 6:01 AM >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: plans messures > >Hello again Mario, I've enjoyed our visits off-line. You, Oscar and Ryan >are all correct on the plans. I enjoyed your website even though I know >zero Spanish. It looks like your "smoothed" rib drawing is right on. Mr. >Pietenpol mentioned the correction in the 1932 Flying and Glider Manual, >"The drawing at figure 5-A shows a dimension of 6" in the top center of the >wing section just a little below and to the left of the figure 60", See it? >It's wrong. Should read 60 1/8" instead." If you don't have a copy of the >manual let me know off-line and I can get you one. I like the pictures of >your boat and beautiful family. I've attached a copy of "Piet Builders >Guide to the Universe" which I believe Jim Markel put together; some of the >sites are dated. It may be helpful to you. >Best regards, >Jack >DSM > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com >[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of giacummo >Sent: Saturday, August 14, 2010 11:06 PM >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: plans messures > > >Hello >Nice to meet you Oscar; I remember you from your Squirrel page; and your >Spanish name and surename. >I am from Uruguay, and unfortunetly there is not any piet around in the >country, at least any known. The experimental, and ultralight universe here >is small and (I do not know why) very closed. I am a kind of crazy people >just because I plan to build an airplane ( I know, its a not common thing to >do) , but is the only way I have to fly, any ultralight si very expensive, >so why not build one?. > >I decide to build this because it is enterely of wood, and this is the only >aircraft material I can find here; aluminium 6061 do not exist, may be in >Brazil, or Argentine, but to expendive. so the options where two, a Piet or >a SkyPup. We chose the Piet. But the plans are... a guide, not real plans; >lost mesures, not very clear drawings, may be incomplete, or with >differences in mesures from one poijnt of view to another. The wing profile >... why not a simple cad file?. > >Thank for your words about "obvious".. ;0) I think a lot of things may come >from one, they are not very difficult to resolv; but is an airplane, not a >boat, so I prefer to be a little more sure on the things I will do. > >Thank you Oscar, I hope have something done in few weeks. here is the state >of it now http://vgmk1.blogspot.com/ ;0) > >Regards. > >Mario > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308855#308855 > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:51:42 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: number of coats of finish on wood? From: "kevinpurtee" Two coats Poly-u. One coat poly-fiber on parts where fabric would touch. I keep the plane hangared and yet somehow it sat through 3-4 monsoons a couple of weeks ago (right next to Greg's). -------- Kevin Purtee NX899KP Austin/Georgetown, TX Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308875#308875 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:59:25 AM PST US From: John Franklin Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: OT Our new addition to the CAF hanger! Kelly, is Clint Epley still with the CAF there in San Marcos? He and my brother are old Navy buddies... Regards, John F. Richmond, TX -----Original Message----- >From: Kelly Klaus >Sent: Aug 14, 2010 8:21 PM >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Pietenpol-List: OT Our new addition to the CAF hanger! > > >Hey gang, just thought I'd share our new toy at the Centex Wing in San Marcos, TX. It was jointly purchased by two of our members, one being our A&P. Its not a Piet, but just as cool! > >-------- >Kelly Klaus > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308841#308841 > > >Attachments: > >http://forums.matronics.com//files/stearman_448.jpg > > ________________________________________ ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 07:11:48 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: OT Our new addition to the CAF hanger! From: "Kelly Klaus" Yes, Clint is still here, flying the Blue Canoe (Cessna 310). Right now he's out of state on a trip. Those of you in the area should drop by sometime and see us! Unfortunately, I work during the week so the only time I'm at the hanger is Saturdays. Our hanger is open Mon. Wed. Fri. and Sat. 9am to 4 pm. -------- Kelly Klaus Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308878#308878 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 08:29:26 AM PST US From: Doug Dever Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Penetrating oil comparison Keep in mind that WD40 is harmless. The primary ingredient is fish oil. Pr etty tough to beat a blue wrench for rusted nuts. Although Ive used PB bla ster with good results. It's the only stuff we have around the shop. Doug Dever In beautiful Stow Ohio > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Penetrating oil comparison > From: dlplett@swko.net > Date: Fri=2C 13 Aug 2010 13:56:44 -0700 > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > > > Good information. I've used them all at one time or another. WD40 stands for 'Water displacement - 40th attempt'. > > -------- > Dan Plett > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308717#308717 > > > > > > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 08:36:27 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Penetrating oil comparison From: Ryan Mueller Sorry, no fish oil in WD-40: http://www.wd40.com/files/pdf/msds-wd494716385.pdf Ryan On Sun, Aug 15, 2010 at 10:27 AM, Doug Dever wrote: > Keep in mind that WD40 is harmless. The primary ingredient is fish oil. > Pretty tough to beat a blue wrench for rusted nuts. Although Ive used PB > blaster with good results. It's the only stuff we have around the shop. > > Doug Dever > In beautiful Stow Ohio > > > > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Penetrating oil comparison > > From: dlplett@swko.net > > Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2010 13:56:44 -0700 > > > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > > > > > > Good information. I've used them all at one time or another. WD40 stands > for 'Water displacement - 40th attempt'. > > > > -------- > > Dan Plett > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308717#308717 > > > > > > > > = > > > > > > > > * > > * > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 12:33:01 PM PST US From: Doug Dever Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Penetrating oil comparison Just proves the old saying believe half of what you see and none of what yo u hear. Even if it comes from a "good" source Do not archive Doug Dever In beautiful Stow Ohio Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Penetrating oil comparison From: rmueller23@gmail.com Sorry=2C no fish oil in WD-40: http://www.wd40.com/files/pdf/msds-wd494716385.pdf Ryan On Sun=2C Aug 15=2C 2010 at 10:27 AM=2C Doug Dever wrote: Keep in mind that WD40 is harmless. The primary ingredient is fish oil. Pr etty tough to beat a blue wrench for rusted nuts. Although Ive used PB bla ster with good results. It's the only stuff we have around the shop. Doug Dever In beautiful Stow Ohio > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Penetrating oil comparison > From: dlplett@swko.net > Date: Fri=2C 13 Aug 2010 13:56:44 -0700 > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > > > Good information. I've used them all at one time or another. WD40 stands for 'Water displacement - 40th attempt'. > > -------- > Dan Plett > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308717#308717 > > > = > > > " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 12:34:55 PM PST US From: Michael Perez Subject: Pietenpol-List: T-Shirts and HINT video #6 Group, for those interested I now have 6 T-shirts available at Karetaker Ae ro. www.karetakeraero.com-- All the information is on the site plus pic tures of the designs. PLEASE read over the page prior to placing an order. I also updated my picture pages with some new additions. HINT Video #6 Tail Assembly is also available. Michael Perez Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 01:04:22 PM PST US From: Oscar Zuniga Subject: Pietenpol-List: amateur aircraft building and flying I've been loaned a classic book on amateur aircraft construction: Henri Mignet's "Flying Flea". Wonderful book, whether or not you like his little creation. I'll just post a few excerpts from the book here, and see if you don't agree that Mignet understood the same things that Pietenpol did, and from the same era (the 1920s and 30s): "Although the Flying Flea is a novelty it is nevertheless made for amateurs. Because it is destined for amateurs, and is I think (not to look too far ahead) above all a machine for getting a start in Air matters, I have paid more attention to the practical possibilities of its construction than to its technical efficiency. The programme is to build and then to fly as quickly as possible. The amateur is patient and skilful, but he is not a professional. Give him a machine which is unrefined, solid, simple, easy to make without excessive skill or special tools. Let us save him the task of calculating, of seeking solutions, even of choice. Later on he can use his initiative- but this is not the time. First comes flying: invention can follow. The amateur has only a moderate tool-kit and not much room to work. He lives far from a flying ground. He must make everything with the means at his disposal." "To fly! Yes, but first one must get acquainted with the machine and its surroundings. One must roll, do lots of rolling, often on rough ground. One ought to be able to go home at night happy, without having broken anything, without being discouraged by the prospects of the delay of a month to make repairs of doubtful soundness." Great stuff from these early homebuilders... Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 01:04:49 PM PST US From: Oscar Zuniga Subject: Pietenpol-List: amateur aircraft building and flying I've been loaned a classic book on amateur aircraft construction: Henri Mignet's "Flying Flea". Wonderful book, whether or not you like his little creation. I'll just post a few excerpts from the book here, and see if you don't agree that Mignet understood the same things that Pietenpol did, and from the same era (the 1920s and 30s): "Although the Flying Flea is a novelty it is nevertheless made for amateurs. Because it is destined for amateurs, and is I think (not to look too far ahead) above all a machine for getting a start in Air matters, I have paid more attention to the practical possibilities of its construction than to its technical efficiency. The programme is to build and then to fly as quickly as possible. The amateur is patient and skilful, but he is not a professional. Give him a machine which is unrefined, solid, simple, easy to make without excessive skill or special tools. Let us save him the task of calculating, of seeking solutions, even of choice. Later on he can use his initiative- but this is not the time. First comes flying: invention can follow. The amateur has only a moderate tool-kit and not much room to work. He lives far from a flying ground. He must make everything with the means at his disposal." "To fly! Yes, but first one must get acquainted with the machine and its surroundings. One must roll, do lots of rolling, often on rough ground. One ought to be able to go home at night happy, without having broken anything, without being discouraged by the prospects of the delay of a month to make repairs of doubtful soundness." Great stuff from these early homebuilders... Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:41:54 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Penetrating oil comparison From: "coxwelljon" I actually do keep WD-40 around, but only for use on damp plug wires when my car won't start. It actually does work quite well for this, but it has practically no other use around my home or shop although I have found it to be a good cutting fluid when working with aluminum, but not on any other metal. But for rusty fasteners, I use proper penetrating oils. Another good use for WD-40 is to soften up and remove tape stickup left behind by dried up masking tape. It won't hurt most plastics. I used to use it to clean off drafting equipment back in the days when t-square and triangles were the instruments of torture and blueprints were blue. Be sure to to wash it with soap and water after the WD-40. Jon Coxwell -------- Jon Coxwell GN-1 Builder Recycle and preserve the planet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308918#308918 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 02:53:49 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: plans messures From: "giacummo" I do not know who are you dfwplt, but if you give me good/sure/exactly mesures I do the job, in simple 2D dxf/dwg/etc file format. It could avoid future conffusion and misconstruction time, material, money, etc, etc Regards Mario Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308919#308919 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 03:20:41 PM PST US From: Jim Markle Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: plans messures Hi Mario, My message (which was posted out of order on the Matronics online forum) was actually in reply to Jack's note about the "Pietenpol Builder's Guide to the Universe".....I created that a LONG time ago but didn't realize anyone actually ever looked at it... But now that I've gone back and reviewed it, I can see a LOT of good info (copied/pilfered/stolen from a lot of really smart builders!) that could be added....updated....etc. Jim Markle (dfwplt) -----Original Message----- >From: giacummo >Sent: Aug 15, 2010 4:53 PM >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: plans messures > > >I do not know who are you dfwplt, but if you give me good/sure/exactly mesures I do the job, in simple 2D dxf/dwg/etc file format. It could avoid future conffusion and misconstruction time, material, money, etc, etc > >Regards > >Mario > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308919#308919 > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 05:07:30 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: T-Shirts and HINT video #6 From: Rick Holland Nice work Michael, especially the CSCS Corvair badge. rick On Sun, Aug 15, 2010 at 1:17 PM, Michael Perez wrote: > Group, for those interested I now have 6 T-shirts available at Karetaker > Aero. www.karetakeraero.com All the information is on the site plus > pictures of the designs. PLEASE read over the page prior to placing an > order. I also updated my picture pages with some new additions. HINT Video > #6 Tail Assembly is also available. > > Michael Perez > Karetaker Aero > www.karetakeraero.com > > * > > * > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 08:10:15 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Penetrating oil comparison From: "Bill Church" I only believe half of that old saying... quote: Just proves the old saying believe half of what you see and none of what you hear. Even if it comes from a "good" source Do not archive Doug Dever In beautiful Stow Ohio Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=308948#308948 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.