Pietenpol-List Digest Archive

Sun 08/29/10


Total Messages Posted: 50



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 12:05 AM - Re: Plans Question (Clif Dawson)
     2. 12:56 AM - Re: Lycoming 0290 for Piet ? (Clif Dawson)
     3. 05:28 AM - Re: Re: O-235 purchase (Thomas Bernie)
     4. 06:45 AM - 40 hour fly-off (helspersew@aol.com)
     5. 06:51 AM - Re: Looking for a piet (Dan P)
     6. 07:03 AM - Re: 40 hour fly-off (airlion)
     7. 07:29 AM - Re: 40 hour fly-off (Gary Boothe)
     8. 07:31 AM - Re: 40 hour fly-off (Gary Boothe)
     9. 07:34 AM - Re: 40 hour fly-off (Jeff Boatright)
    10. 08:28 AM - Re: 40 hour fly-off (Doug Dever)
    11. 09:09 AM - Re: 40 hour fly-off (airlion)
    12. 10:00 AM - Re: Wife went for first flight tongh in GN-1 (Dan P)
    13. 12:22 PM - Re: Plans Question (Michael Perez)
    14. 12:26 PM - Re: Rib drawing (JGriff)
    15. 12:33 PM - Re: 40 hour fly-off (Dan Yocum)
    16. 12:35 PM - Re: Rib drawing (Dan Yocum)
    17. 12:35 PM - Re: Plans Question (Michael Perez)
    18. 12:53 PM - Re: Plans Question (Michael Perez)
    19. 01:22 PM - Re: 40 hour fly-off, state of model A (helspersew@aol.com)
    20. 01:23 PM - Re: 40 hour fly-off (helspersew@aol.com)
    21. 01:33 PM - Re: 40 hour fly-off, state of model A (Ryan Mueller)
    22. 01:41 PM - Re: Re: Rib drawing (Jim Boyer)
    23. 01:43 PM - Re: 40 hour fly-off (Jim Boyer)
    24. 02:00 PM - Re: Rib drawing (K5YAC)
    25. 02:11 PM - Re: Rib drawing (JGriff)
    26. 03:13 PM - Re: Looking for a piet (K5YAC)
    27. 03:34 PM - Re: 40 hour fly-off (airlion)
    28. 03:46 PM - New metal fuse Piet for sale (jeff wilson)
    29. 03:59 PM - Re: CG for heavy pilots (KM Heide CPO/FAAOP)
    30. 04:33 PM - Re: CG for heavy pilots (Ryan Mueller)
    31. 04:34 PM - Re: Re: Looking for a piet (Pietn38b@aol.com)
    32. 04:48 PM - Re: New metal fuse Piet for sale (Ryan Mueller)
    33. 04:53 PM - Re: 40 hour fly-off, state of model A (helspersew@aol.com)
    34. 04:59 PM - Re: Re: Rib drawing (helspersew@aol.com)
    35. 05:01 PM - Re: 40 hour fly-off, state of model A (Ryan Mueller)
    36. 05:03 PM - Re: Re: Rib drawing (Ryan Mueller)
    37. 05:32 PM - Re: Re: Rib drawing (Dan Yocum)
    38. 06:22 PM - Re: Re: Looking for a piet (Dan Yocum)
    39. 06:26 PM - Re: Re: Rib drawing (Rick Holland)
    40. 06:27 PM - Re: Rib drawing (K5YAC)
    41. 06:29 PM - Re: Re: Rib drawing (Rick Holland)
    42. 06:32 PM - Re: 40 hour fly-off, state of model A (shad bell)
    43. 06:39 PM - Re: testing on pavement (shad bell)
    44. 06:40 PM - Re: CG for heavy pilots (Dan Yocum)
    45. 06:44 PM - Re: Re: Rib drawing (Gary Boothe)
    46. 06:59 PM - Re: CG for heavy pilots (Rick Holland)
    47. 07:21 PM - Re: CG for heavy pilots (Rick Holland)
    48. 08:20 PM - Re: plnas came in (Rick Holland)
    49. 11:21 PM - Re: CG for heavy pilots (Matthew VanDervort)
    50. 11:42 PM - Re: CG for heavy pilots (Ryan Mueller)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 12:05:31 AM PST US
    From: "Clif Dawson" <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca>
    Subject: Re: Plans Question
    I'm looking at page 8 of the 1932 F&G right now. The crossmember at both the front and rear landing gear/wing strut locations is 1" X 3/4" spruce. Remember also that you're not just talking about the landing gear but also the wing struts. These crossmembers are a continuation of the strut system. They are compression loaded in negative G and tension loaded in positive G. The bottom plywood takes some of this load also. Clif "Perfection is achieved, not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing left to take away." Antoine de Saint-Exupery get what figured out?? My first response to him was correct and still stands. He asked about the dimensions of the ash piece when using the wooden gear, and I correctly pointed out that per the plans, there is no ash piece in the fuselage when building the wooden gear. Gene do not archive


    Message 2


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    Time: 12:56:22 AM PST US
    From: "Clif Dawson" <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca>
    Subject: Re: Lycoming 0290 for Piet ?
    This is from the 1988 Operator's Manual 60297-9 O-290-D = 260 lb O-290-D2A, D2C = 264 lb O-290-D2B = 265 lb According to the F&G the "A" weighs 244 lb. Add radiator, plumbing and water and you're likely looking at 260 plus lb. So, you guys with A's, how much does that stuff actually weigh? I have both a "D" and a "D2". The difference is 6.5:1 compression ratio on the D and 7.5:1 on the D2. D D2 TO hp 130 140 TO rpm 2800 2800 Rated hp 125 135 Rated rpm 2600 2600 With this kind of power you can balance the rpm/hp to the performance you want, lower rpm, lower hp thus lower fuel burn. The approximate rule of thumb is 0.5 lb of fuel per hp per hour. 2000 rpm on a D2 gives 60 hp. 60 x 0.5 = 30lb/hr. 30lb= 5 gal/hr. The D, at 2025 rpm, should burn 5 gal/hr. So running a prop that will cruise at your desired speed at these rpm will trade off to lesser takeoff and climb performance than these engines are capable of. So the question is, is this tradeoff acceptable to you in your circumstance? Buy the damn engine!!! :-) Clif "Our doubts are traitors, and make us lose the good we oft might win, by fearing to attempt." ....... William Shakespeare I have found a local, 0 time since factory remanufacture Lycoming 0290 (125hp) cheap. It is complete. When I say cheap I am talking less than a Covair project. This seems an excessive amount of horsepower for a Piet. Best I can determine this model 0290 weighs 240lb dry. That is not much different than a model =93A=94 from a weigh perspective. Does anyone know of a successful Piet flying with a 0290? The owner is going to list it Monday so I must act quickly. All thoughts welcome. Thanks, Don


    Message 3


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    Time: 05:28:24 AM PST US
    From: Thomas Bernie <tsbernie@earthlink.net>
    Subject: Re: O-235 purchase
    Guys, My C85 had a clean log book to day one. I put new Slick mags on, and because I was not an A&P my inspector said the engine was not "certified" and gave me 40 hours, but that's OK I'll go over 40 this week. Also I'm on my own as far as the Repairman Certificate goes. Tom Bernie GN-1 N666TB On Aug 28, 2010, at 11:48 PM, Doug Dever wrote: > You have a point, but I don't think that is interpretation. That would be bending and some inspectors might be willing to bend more than others. > > Doug Dever > In beautiful Stow Ohio > > > > > > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: O-235 purchase > > From: glidermikeg@yahoo.com > > Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2010 14:48:28 -0700 > > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > > <glidermikeg@yahoo.com> > > > > The interpretation comes into play, when the certified engine has non PMA parts and accessories installed, and is rebuilt by someone other than a person with an A&P rating. If there isn't a paperwork trail on a part going back to Noah and the Ark, it most likely isn't PMA approved, at which time the certified engine does not conform to the TCDS, and is no longer a certified engine. My understanding is, the engine and/or propeller has to conform to the TCDS to continue to be a certified engine. The builder can get a repairman's Certificate after it is completed, but he didn't have one when the engine was rebuilt. Obviously, some FSDO people see this as OK. I suspect there are some who don't see it as OK. > > > > My last two cents. > > > > I get wound up by involving myself in discussions like this, and begin to wonder why I took the time and went to the expense to get an A&P rating. Especially since I have been looking for a job for nearly 4 months since getting the rating. Everyone wants at least 3 to 5 years experience. > > > > -------- > > HOMEBUILDER > > Will WORK for Spruce > > Long flights, smooth air, and soft landings, > > GliderMike, aka Mike Glasgow > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310416#310416 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >


    Message 4


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    Time: 06:45:02 AM PST US
    Subject: 40 hour fly-off
    From: helspersew@aol.com
    Good people, I myself am enjoying my Piet, and really don't mind the 40 hour, Phase-1 fly-off period that is required for a non-certified prop and engine. It was a long, but enjoyable journey (10 year building process) to get this far.....I am loving every minute of it. 12 hours flown-off so far. I have been able to work out a few bugs, such as my nose-heaviness, excessive ra diator overflow on climb-out, oil leaks, brake adjustments, magneto slippa ge etc. With every flight I am learning the machine and gaining the requir ed confidence I will need in order to fly passengers safely. Yesterday I went on a mini cross country, from Poplar Grove, Bigfoot in Walworth WI, Dacy in Harvard IL, and back to Poplar Grove. Not very far but neverthele ss a building block for me and my airplane. I am fortunate to have these grass strips so conveniently located so close to home. I still haven't ha d the cohones to try a hard- surface landing. Yesterday I also tried-out my quick disconnect tail wheel-to-skid set up. Worked like a charm! I cha nged it at the end of the runway with the engine idling. At some point I will start loading up the front seat with sandbags. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL.


    Message 5


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    Time: 06:51:23 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Looking for a piet
    From: "Dan P" <dlplett@swko.net>
    When I bought my Piet a couple of months ago there was also another one for sale in Collinsville, OK. I didn't get any pictures of it or any details. I believe it was Corvair powered and it could be a GN1. I really don't remember the details but it might be worth a phone call for details and pictures. -------- Dan Plett Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310470#310470 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/sam_0755_828.jpg


    Message 6


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    Time: 07:03:57 AM PST US
    From: airlion <airlion@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: Re: 40 hour fly-off
    I have just finished my 40 hr fly off friday and flew my first xcountry to Peachstate aerodrome for their vintage day fly in. The flight was wonderfull and the piet performed great. I had a lot of interest in the piane. Hopefully more people will stare building. Cheers, Gardiner ________________________________ From: "helspersew@aol.com" <helspersew@aol.com> Sent: Sun, August 29, 2010 9:44:11 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off Good people, I myself am enjoying my Piet, and really don't mind the 40 hour, Phase-1 fly-off period that is required for a non-certified prop and engine. It was a long, but enjoyable journey (10 year building process) to get this far.....I am loving every minute of it. 12 hours flown-off so far. I have been able to work out a few bugs, such as my nose-heaviness, excessive radiator overflow on climb-out, oil leaks, brake adjustments, magneto slippage etc. With every flight I am learning the machine and gaining the required confidence I will need in order to fly passengers safely. Yesterday I went on a mini cross country, from Poplar Grove, Bigfoot in Walworth WI, Dacy in Harvard IL, and back to Poplar Grove. Not very far but nevertheless a building block for me and my airplane. I am fortunate to have these grass strips so conveniently located so close to home. I still haven't had the cohones to try a hard- surface landing. Yesterday I also tried-out my quick disconnect tail wheel-to-skid set up. Worked like a charm! I changed it at the end of the runway with the engine idling. At some point I will start loading up the front seat with sandbags. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL.


    Message 7


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    Time: 07:29:45 AM PST US
    From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5@comcast.net>
    Subject: 40 hour fly-off
    Gardiner, Congratulations! I know the fly-off wasn't without challenges.but you got 'er done! Gary Boothe Cool, CA Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion Tail done, Fuselage on gear 20 ribs done Do not archive From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of airlion Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2010 7:04 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off I have just finished my 40 hr fly off friday and flew my first xcountry to Peachstate aerodrome for their vintage day fly in. The flight was wonderfull and the piet performed great. I had a lot of interest in the piane. Hopefully more people will stare building. Cheers, Gardiner _____ From: "helspersew@aol.com" <helspersew@aol.com> Sent: Sun, August 29, 2010 9:44:11 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off Good people, I myself am enjoying my Piet, and really don't mind the 40 hour, Phase-1 fly-off period that is required for a non-certified prop and engine. It was a long, but enjoyable journey (10 year building process) to get this far.....I am loving every minute of it. 12 hours flown-off so far. I have been able to work out a few bugs, such as my nose-heaviness, excessive radiator overflow on climb-out, oil leaks, brake adjustments, magneto slippage etc. With every flight I am learning the machine and gaining the required confidence I will need in order to fly passengers safely. Yesterday I went on a mini cross country, from Poplar Grove, Bigfoot in Walworth WI, Dacy in Harvard IL, and back to Poplar Grove. Not very far but nevertheless a building block for me and my airplane. I am fortunate to have these grass strips so conveniently located so close to home. I still haven't had the cohones to try a hard- surface landing. Yesterday I also tried-out my quick disconnect tail wheel-to-skid set up. Worked like a charm! I changed it at the end of the runway with the engine idling. At some point I will start loading up the front seat with sandbags. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL.


    Message 8


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    Time: 07:31:35 AM PST US
    From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5@comcast.net>
    Subject: 40 hour fly-off
    Dan, Grass strips are something we do not have plethora of out west.glad to see you having fun! Gary Boothe Cool, CA Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion Tail done, Fuselage on gear 20 ribs done Do not archive From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of helspersew@aol.com Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2010 6:44 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off Good people, I myself am enjoying my Piet, and really don't mind the 40 hour, Phase-1 fly-off period that is required for a non-certified prop and engine. It was a long, but enjoyable journey (10 year building process) to get this far.....I am loving every minute of it. 12 hours flown-off so far. I have been able to work out a few bugs, such as my nose-heaviness, excessive radiator overflow on climb-out, oil leaks, brake adjustments, magneto slippage etc. With every flight I am learning the machine and gaining the required confidence I will need in order to fly passengers safely. Yesterday I went on a mini cross country, from Poplar Grove, Bigfoot in Walworth WI, Dacy in Harvard IL, and back to Poplar Grove. Not very far but nevertheless a building block for me and my airplane. I am fortunate to have these grass strips so conveniently located so close to home. I still haven't had the cohones to try a hard- surface landing. Yesterday I also tried-out my quick disconnect tail wheel-to-skid set up. Worked like a charm! I changed it at the end of the runway with the engine idling. At some point I will start loading up the front seat with sandbags. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL.


    Message 9


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    Time: 07:34:53 AM PST US
    From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri@emory.edu>
    Subject: Re: 40 hour fly-off
    Hey Gardiner, Congratulations! What an accomplishment - the first cross country and to such a good destination for it! Sorry I missed you (and everyone else) at P-state. We had a broken exhaust stack and ended up pulling, welding, filing, and fitting. How was the fly-in? Did you get a chance to stay long? The morning's weather didn't look so good at 2GA9. Jeff >I have just finished my 40 hr fly off friday and flew my first >xcountry to Peachstate aerodrome for their vintage day fly in. The >flight was wonderfull and the piet performed great. I had a lot of >interest in the piane. Hopefully more people will stare building. >Cheers, Gardiner > -- Jeff Boatright "Now let's think about this..."


    Message 10


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    Time: 08:28:21 AM PST US
    From: Doug Dever <chiefpepperhead@hotmail.com>
    Subject: 40 hour fly-off
    Dan=2C I personally would mind the 40 hrs either. Takes you that long to learn th e aircraft. How's the "A" running? You mentioned it was stopping at idle and thought it was just because it was tight. I'm still leanig heavily to wards an "A". I would prefer a Warner Scarab Jr or a lambert=2C but they a re way out of my price range for now. Doug Dever In beautiful Stow Ohio Subject: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off From: helspersew@aol.com Good people=2C I myself am enjoying my Piet=2C and really don't mind the 40 hour=2C Phase- 1 fly-off period that is required for a non-certified prop and engine. It w as a long=2C but enjoyable journey (10 year building process) to get this f ar.....I am loving every minute of it. 12 hours flown-off so far. I have be en able to work out a few bugs=2C such as my nose-heaviness=2C excessive ra diator overflow on climb-out=2C oil leaks=2C brake adjustments=2C magneto s lippage etc. With every flight I am learning the machine and gaining the re quired confidence I will need in order to fly passengers safely. Yesterday I went on a mini cross country=2C from Poplar Grove=2C Bigfoot in Walworth WI=2C Dacy in Harvard IL=2C and back to Poplar Grove. Not very far but neve rtheless a building block for me and my airplane. I am fortunate to have th ese grass strips so conveniently located so close to home. I still haven't had the cohones to try a hard- surface landing. Yesterday I also tried-out my quick disconnect tail wheel-to-skid set up. Worked like a charm! I chang ed it at the end of the runway with the engine idling. At some point I will start loading up the front seat with sandbags. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove=2C IL.


    Message 11


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    Time: 09:09:00 AM PST US
    From: airlion <airlion@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: Re: 40 hour fly-off
    Jeff, the fly in was great- a lot better than last time. A lot of planes, antique cars and motorcycles.. The food was handled a lot better too. I left Lagrange at 11 am and had one shower going over but the rest of the day was perfect.with some high speed flyovers by a P51anf a T28. Cheers, Gardiner ----- Original Message ---- From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri@emory.edu> Sent: Sun, August 29, 2010 10:34:32 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off Hey Gardiner, Congratulations! What an accomplishment - the first cross country and to such a good destination for it! Sorry I missed you (and everyone else) at P-state. We had a broken exhaust stack and ended up pulling, welding, filing, and fitting. How was the fly-in? Did you get a chance to stay long? The morning's weather didn't look so good at 2GA9. Jeff > I have just finished my 40 hr fly off friday and flew my first xcountry to >Peachstate aerodrome for their vintage day fly in. The flight was wonderfull and >the piet performed great. I had a lot of interest in the piane. Hopefully more >people will stare building. Cheers, Gardiner > -- Jeff Boatright "Now let's think about this..."


    Message 12


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    Time: 10:00:41 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Wife went for first flight tongh in GN-1
    From: "Dan P" <dlplett@swko.net>
    That's great Lorin. My wife has been asking for a ride in the Piet. The Mooney comment made me laugh. The majority of my hours are in a Mooney and it pretty much the only GA airplane my wife has flown in. It's kind of a culture shock going backwards, so to speak. :D -------- Dan Plett Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310499#310499


    Message 13


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    Time: 12:22:06 PM PST US
    From: Michael Perez <speedbrake@sbcglobal.net>
    Subject: Plans Question
    What plans are you looking at Gene? My plans show the two ash pieces. Are you looking at the Glider manual plans? What other plans are there that do not show said ash? Michael Perez Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com --- On Sat, 8/28/10, Gene Rambo <generambo@msn.com> wrote: > From: Gene Rambo <generambo@msn.com> > Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Plans Question > To: "pietenpol-list" <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> > Date: Saturday, August 28, 2010, 11:58 PM > > > > > > get what figured out?? My first response to him was > correct and still stands. He asked about the > dimensions of the ash piece when using the wooden gear, and > I correctly pointed out that per the plans, there is no ash > piece in the fuselage when building the wooden gear. > The only ash is the block at the bottom of the gear, which I > assume he isnot asking about. He can, of course, > build to the later plans which include an ash piece, and > then modify his gear fittings accordingly, but his original > question was answered the same day. > > > > Gene > > do not archive > > > > > Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2010 08:23:08 -0700 > From: speedbrake@sbcglobal.net > Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Plans Question > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > > > > > > I can post a small picture of that part of > the plan I am referring to if it would help. By now, (or by > the time we get it figured out) the original poster will > have his gear finished. > > Michael Perez > Karetaker Aero > www.karetakeraero.com > > --- On Sat, 8/28/10, Gene Rambo > <generambo@msn.com> wrote: > > > From: Gene Rambo <generambo@msn.com> > Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Plans Question > To: "pietenpol-list" > <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> > Date: Saturday, August 28, 2010, 11:00 AM > > > > > #yiv2037551919 .yiv2037551919ExternalClass > #yiv2037551919ecxyiv366445809 > .yiv2037551919ecxyiv366445809hmmessage P > {padding:0px;} > #yiv2037551919 .yiv2037551919ExternalClass > #yiv2037551919ecxyiv366445809 > .yiv2037551919ecxyiv366445809hmmessage > {font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma;} > > > I had thought it was 1" square, but do not have plans > in fornt of me. If they are 1" x 3/4, then the > 1" isin the fore and aft plane, 3/4" tall > asshownin the drawing Ryan posted. > > Gene > > > From: catdesigns@att.net > > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > > Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Plans Question > > Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2010 22:57:58 -0700 > > > "Chris" <catdesigns@att.net> > > > > True Mike but look on the steel split axel gear page > upper right drawing, it > > clearly says the front ash cross piece is > 2"x1" with the ends tapered to > > 3/4". > > > > Fortunately either way works. > > > > Now on the original fuselage (wood landing gear) there > are no ash cross > > braces. There are 1"x3/4" spruce cross > braces. What orientation the 1" > > dimension should be is debatable. > > > > Welcome to the world of Pietenpol drawings. > > > > Chris > > Sacramento, Ca > > Westcoastpiet.com > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On > Behalf Of Michael > > Perez > > Sent: Friday, August 27, 2010 3:06 PM > > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Plans Question > > > > > --> <speedbrake@sbcglobal.net> > > > > Just checked my plans and both ash pieces are shown on > the fuselage page. > > Both pieces are 3/4" X 2". > > > > Yes, I really should keep the floor and shop a little > cleaner. > > > > > > Michael Perez > > Karetaker Aero > > Www.karetakeraero.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " rel=nofollow > target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > et=_blank>http://forums.matronics.com > llow target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > > st" > target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > ttp://forums.matronics.com > =_blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > > > > >


    Message 14


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    Time: 12:26:07 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Rib drawing
    From: "JGriff" <jgriffith19@comcast.net>
    One more question about spar placement. I know the 27 3/4" measurement on the rib drawing is the important dimension. If I am going with 3/4" spars than should I center the 3/4" spars in the 1" spar area so the new measurement distance between the 2 qty 3/4" spars will now be 28" correct? Did any of you place a piece of 3/4 x 4 3/4 spar material right on the jig to build the ribs around or should I not do that. Thanks again for all the help in getting me started. Jamie Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310512#310512


    Message 15


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    Time: 12:33:37 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: 40 hour fly-off
    From: Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com>
    Hey Dan, Have you done any WAGing of the rate of climb? Dan -- Dan Yocum yocum137@gmail.com "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." On Aug 29, 2010, at 9:44 AM, helspersew@aol.com wrote: > Good people, > > I myself am enjoying my Piet, and really don't mind the 40 hour, Phase-1 f ly-off period that is required for a non-certified prop and engine. It was a long, but enjoyable journey (10 year building process) to get this far..... I am loving every minute of it. 12 hours flown-off so far. I have been able t o work out a few bugs, such as my nose-heaviness, excessive radiator overflo w on climb-out, oil leaks, brake adjustments, magneto slippage etc. With eve ry flight I am learning the machine and gaining the required confidence I wi ll need in order to fly passengers safely. Yesterday I went on a mini cross c ountry, from Poplar Grove, Bigfoot in Walworth WI, Dacy in Harvard IL, and b ack to Poplar Grove. Not very far but nevertheless a building block for me a nd my airplane. I am fortunate to have these grass strips so conveniently lo cated so close to home. I still haven't had the cohones to try a hard- surfa ce landing. Yesterday I also tried-out my quick disconnect tail wheel-to-ski d set up. Worked like a charm! I changed it at the end of the runway with th e engine idling. > > At some point I will start loading up the front seat with sandbags. > > Dan Helsper > Poplar Grove, IL. > > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= >


    Message 16


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    Time: 12:35:46 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Rib drawing
    From: Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com>
    I disagree. I think 29" on-center is a better dimension. It matches the 29" between the attach points on the fuse. And even though WW thinks it's a misguided belief that one can shift the wing back and forth to correct for CoG issues, a perfect parallelogram *will* allow for such shifting. I do agree with his assessment that the attach points for the diagonal cabanes should be heavy duty, permanent jobs, if not welded, but that's a different issue. Dan -- Dan Yocum yocum137@gmail.com "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." On Aug 28, 2010, at 5:46 PM, Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com> wrote: > > The 27 3/4 is the important dimension. Go ahead and use it! > > Ryan > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Aug 28, 2010, at 4:35 PM, JGriff <jgriffith19@comcast.net> wrote: > >> >> I received my plans and am about to construct my rib jig on 3/4" MDF. I didn't give much thought to using the supplied rib drawing and instead was going to plot out the shape because so many posts in the archive say not to use it since the drawing is off due to the xerox reproduction. I just double checked the drawing and it seems pretty accurate. The chord is 58" which I assume is correct because it doesn't include the leading or trailing edge. Also the 27 3/4 inch dim given between the spars is spot on. Has the drawing improved from years past? I'm thinking of using it - has anyone else used it instead of plotting it out? >> Thanks. >> Jamie >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310413#310413 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > >


    Message 17


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    Time: 12:35:59 PM PST US
    From: Michael Perez <speedbrake@sbcglobal.net>
    Subject: Re: Plans Question
    So, the f&g manual shows no ash. But as Gene pointed out, the original poster was asking about the ash piece with the wood gear. Where did the poster see this ash piece? Gene said the plans do not show an ash piece, but people have "added" it. My plans show both ash pieces, clearly. I am trying to figure out what plans,(not book or manual) show the fuselage with no ash pieces. It sounds like there are plans out there different then mine. Michael Perez Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com --- On Sun, 8/29/10, Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca> wrote: > From: Clif Dawson <CDAWSON5854@shaw.ca> > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Plans Question > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Date: Sunday, August 29, 2010, 3:05 AM > > > > #yiv1731749888 .yiv1731749888hmmessage P { > PADDING-BOTTOM:0px;MARGIN:0px;PADDING-LEFT:0px;PADDING-RIGHT:0px;PADDING-TOP:0px;} > #yiv1731749888 .yiv1731749888hmmessage { > FONT-FAMILY:Tahoma;FONT-SIZE:10pt;} > > > > > I'm looking at page 8 of the > 1932 F&G right now. The > crossmember at both the > front and rear landing gear/wing > strut locations is 1" X > 3/4" spruce. > > Remember also that you're not > just talking about the > landing gear but also the > wing struts. These crossmembers are > a continuation of the > strut system. They > are compression loaded in negative > G and tension loaded in > positive G. The > bottom plywood takes some of this > load also. > > Clif > > > "Perfection is achieved, not > when there is nothing more to add, but when there is > nothing left to take away." > Antoine de Saint-Exupery > > > > get what figured out?? My first >response to him was correct and still stands. He > asked about the >dimensions of the ash piece when using the wooden gear, > and I correctly >pointed out that per the plans, there is no ash piece in > the fuselage when >building the wooden gear. > Gene > do not > archive > > > > > > > >


    Message 18


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    Time: 12:53:45 PM PST US
    From: Michael Perez <speedbrake@sbcglobal.net>
    Subject: Plans Question
    All right, I went to the Matronics site and read this thread in the order t he posts were made. I now see the what Gene is talking about, as well as th e others and concur. As drawn wood gear, no ash. Improved plans show the as h, but mods will need to be made to the original wood gear fittings to work .- My apologies for the confusion. - Michael Perez Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com


    Message 19


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    Time: 01:22:18 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: 40 hour fly-off, state of model A
    From: helspersew@aol.com
    Doug, My engine is running like a top, but I can still detect the sputtering on final at very low idle. I still can't figure out why. Like yesterday, no sign of induction condensation, but it still happened. Runs fine as soon as I coast out and on the ground. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. -----Original Message----- From: Doug Dever <chiefpepperhead@hotmail.com> Sent: Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:27 am Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off Dan, I personally would mind the 40 hrs either. Takes you that long to learn the aircraft. How's the "A" running? You mentioned it was stopping at idle and thought it was just because it was tight. I'm still leanig heav ily towards an "A". I would prefer a Warner Scarab Jr or a lambert, but they are way out of my price range for now. Doug Dever In beautiful Stow Ohio Subject: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off From: helspersew@aol.com Good people, I myself am enjoying my Piet, and really don't mind the 40 hour, Phase-1 fly-off period that is required for a non-certified prop and engine. It was a long, but enjoyable journey (10 year building process) to get this far.....I am loving every minute of it. 12 hours flown-off so far. I have been able to work out a few bugs, such as my nose-heaviness, excessive ra diator overflow on climb-out, oil leaks, brake adjustments, magneto slippa ge etc. With every flight I am learning the machine and gaining the requir ed confidence I will need in order to fly passengers safely. Yesterday I went on a mini cross country, from Poplar Grove, Bigfoot in Walworth WI, Dacy in Harvard IL, and back to Poplar Grove. Not very far but neverthele ss a building block for me and my airplane. I am fortunate to have these grass strips so conveniently located so close to home. I still haven't ha d the cohones to try a hard- surface landing. Yesterday I also tried-out my quick disconnect tail wheel-to-skid set up. Worked like a charm! I cha nged it at the end of the runway with the engine idling. At some point I will start loading up the front seat with sandbags. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. st" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution ======================== =========== -= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum - -= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse -= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription, -= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, -= Photoshare, and much much more: - -= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - -= Same great content also available via the Web Forums! - -= --> http://forums.matronics.com - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - List Contribution Web Site - -= Thank you for your generous support! -= -Matt Dralle, List Admin. -= --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution -======================== ======================== ===========


    Message 20


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    Time: 01:23:50 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: 40 hour fly-off
    From: helspersew@aol.com
    Dan, No I haven't. Mostly because my airspeed indicator is not working right. As soon as I get that working at a reliable level, I can do some rate-of- climb tests. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. -----Original Message----- From: Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com> Sent: Sun, Aug 29, 2010 2:27 pm Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off Hey Dan, Have you done any WAGing of the rate of climb? Dan -- Dan Yocum yocum137@gmail.com "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." On Aug 29, 2010, at 9:44 AM, helspersew@aol.com wrote: Good people, I myself am enjoying my Piet, and really don't mind the 40 hour, Phase-1 fly-off period that is required for a non-certified prop and engine. It was a long, but enjoyable journey (10 year building process) to get this far.....I am loving every minute of it. 12 hours flown-off so far. I have been able to work out a few bugs, such as my nose-heaviness, excessive ra diator overflow on climb-out, oil leaks, brake adjustments, magneto slippa ge etc. With every flight I am learning the machine and gaining the requir ed confidence I will need in order to fly passengers safely. Yesterday I went on a mini cross country, from Poplar Grove, Bigfoot in Walworth WI, Dacy in Harvard IL, and back to Poplar Grove. Not very far but neverthele ss a building block for me and my airplane. I am fortunate to have these grass strips so conveniently located so close to home. I still haven't ha d the cohones to try a hard- surface landing. Yesterday I also tried-out my quick disconnect tail wheel-to-skid set up. Worked like a charm! I cha nged it at the end of the runway with the engine idling. At some point I will start loading up the front seat with sandbags. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. ======================== http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List ======================== ========= ms.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com ======================== ========= ttp://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contributio n ======================== ========= ======================== =========== -= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum - -= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse -= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription, -= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, -= Photoshare, and much much more: - -= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - -= Same great content also available via the Web Forums! - -= --> http://forums.matronics.com - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - List Contribution Web Site - -= Thank you for your generous support! -= -Matt Dralle, List Admin. -= --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution -======================== ======================== ===========


    Message 21


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    Time: 01:33:03 PM PST US
    From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: 40 hour fly-off, state of model A
    I don't know if you've done this or not, but what about starting the engine and then raising the tail and setting on a sawhorse/blocking get it to level, and see if that will duplicate the issue.... Ryan Sent from my iPhone On Aug 29, 2010, at 3:20 PM, helspersew@aol.com wrote: Doug, My engine is running like a top, but I can still detect the sputtering on final at very low idle. I still can't figure out why. Like yesterday, no sign of induction condensation, but it still happened. Runs fine as soon as I coast out and on the ground. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. -----Original Message----- From: Doug Dever <chiefpepperhead@hotmail.com> Sent: Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:27 am Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off Dan, I personally would mind the 40 hrs either. Takes you that long to learn the aircraft. How's the "A" running? You mentioned it was stopping at idle and thought it was just because it was tight. I'm still leanig heavily towards an "A". I would prefer a Warner Scarab Jr or a lambert, but they are way out of my price range for now. Doug Dever In beautiful Stow Ohio ------------------------------ Subject: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off From: helspersew@aol.com Good people, I myself am enjoying my Piet, and really don't mind the 40 hour, Phase-1 fly-off period that is required for a non-certified prop and engine. It was a long, but enjoyable journey (10 year building process) to get this far.....I am loving every minute of it. 12 hours flown-off so far. I have been able to work out a few bugs, such as my nose-heaviness, excessive radiator overflow on climb-out, oil leaks, brake adjustments, magneto slippage etc. With every flight I am learning the machine and gaining the required confidence I will need in order to fly passengers safely. Yesterday I went on a mini cross country, from Poplar Grove, Bigfoot in Walworth WI, Dacy in Harvard IL, and back to Poplar Grove. Not very far but nevertheless a building block for me and my airplane. I am fortunate to have these grass strips so conveniently located so close to home. I still haven't had the cohones to try a hard- surface landing. Yesterday I also tried-out my quick disconnect tail wheel-to-skid set up. Worked like a charm! I changed it at the end of the runway with the engine idling. At some point I will start loading up the front seat with sandbags. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. * st" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List ttp://forums.matronics.com =_blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution * * =================================== t" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List =================================== tp://forums.matronics.com =================================== _blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution =================================== * * *


    Message 22


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    Time: 01:41:51 PM PST US
    From: Jim Boyer <boyerjrb@comcast.net>
    Subject: Re: Rib drawing
    I placed a piece of spar material at both spar positions in my rib jig. Wor ked fine. I'm using 3/4 inch spars. Jim B. ----- Original Message ----- From: "JGriff" <jgriffith19@comcast.net> Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2010 12:25:54 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Rib drawing One more question about spar placement. I know the 27 3/4" measurement on t he rib drawing is the important dimension. If I am going with 3/4" spars th an should I center the 3/4" spars in the 1" spar area so the new measuremen t distance between the 2 qty 3/4" spars will now be 28" correct? Did any of you place a piece of 3/4 x 4 3/4 spar material right on the jig to build the ribs around or should I not do that. Thanks again for all the help in getting me started. Jamie Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310512#310512 =========== =========== MS - =========== e - =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2--Matt Dralle, List Admin. ===========


    Message 23


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    Time: 01:43:23 PM PST US
    From: Jim Boyer <boyerjrb@comcast.net>
    Subject: Re: 40 hour fly-off
    Way to go Gardiner, Glad to=C2- see another Corvair Piet get through the 40 hours and join th e flying fleet. Hopefully we will have three of them in the West coast grou p soon. Jim B. ----- Original Message ----- From: "airlion" <airlion@bellsouth.net> Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2010 7:03:33 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off I have just finished my 40 hr fly off friday and flew my first xcountry to Peachstate aerodrome for their vintage day fly in. The flight was wonderful l and the piet performed great.=C2- I had a lot of interest in the piane. Hopefully more people will stare building. Cheers, Gardiner From: "helspersew@aol.com" <helspersew@aol.com> Sent: Sun, August 29, 2010 9:44:11 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off Good people, I myself am enjoying my Piet, and really don't mind the 40 hour, Phase-1 fl y-off period that is required for a non-certified prop and engine. It was a long, but enjoyable journey (10 year building process) to get this far.... .I am loving every minute of it. 12 hours flown-off so far. I have been abl e to work out a few bugs, such as my nose-heaviness, excessive radiator ove rflow on climb-out, oil leaks, brake adjustments, magneto slippage etc. Wit h every flight I am learning the machine and gaining the required confidenc e I will need in order to fly passengers safely. Yesterday I went on a mini cross country, from Poplar Grove, Bigfoot in Walworth WI, Dacy in Harvard IL, and back to Poplar Grove. Not very far but nevertheless a building bloc k for me and my airplane. I am fortunate to have these grass strips so conv eniently located so close to home. I still haven't had the cohones to try a hard- surface landing. Yesterday I also tried-out my quick disconnect tail wheel-to-skid set up. Worked like a charm! I changed it at the end of the runway with the engine idling. At some point I will start loading up the front seat with sandbags.=C2- Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. =C2- ==


    Message 24


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    Time: 02:00:56 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Rib drawing
    From: "K5YAC" <hangar10@cox.net>
    In order to keep the original print in good shape, my wife suggested that I use carbon paper and trace the original print to the MDF. At first I thought that would be difficult, but carbon paper is cheap (especially if you have an Office Depot or Staples nearby) and the MDF is smooth so I gave it a try. It only took about 30 minutes and I had an exact reproduction on my jig. This really helped a lot when it came to placing blocks and cams for aligning the pieces. Just figured I'd share that since it worked out good for me... I chose to glue and nail my ribs. If you prefer to clamp, just look around as there are several other cool variations around here. -------- Mark Chouinard Finishing up Wings - Working on Center Section Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310535#310535 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/wing_jig_342.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/wing_jig_2_165.jpg


    Message 25


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    Time: 02:11:07 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Rib drawing
    From: "JGriff" <jgriffith19@comcast.net>
    I'm getting 28.75" between the centerline of both 3/4" spars and 28" from the rear edge of the front spar to the front edge of the rear spar. yocum137(at)gmail.com wrote: > I disagree. I think 29" on-center is a better dimension. > -- > Dan Yocum > yocum137@gmail.com > "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." > > On Aug 28, 2010, at 5:46 PM, Ryan Mueller wrote: > > > > > > > > The 27 3/4 is the important dimension. Go ahead and use it! > > > > Ryan > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > On Aug 28, 2010, at 4:35 PM, JGriff wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > I received my plans and am about to construct my rib jig on 3/4" MDF. I didn't give much thought to using the supplied rib drawing and instead was going to plot out the shape because so many posts in the archive say not to use it since the drawing is off due to the xerox reproduction. I just double checked the drawing and it seems pretty accurate. The chord is 58" which I assume is correct because it doesn't include the leading or trailing edge. Also the 27 3/4 inch dim given between the spars is spot on. Has the drawing improved from years past? I'm thinking of using it - has anyone else used it instead of plotting it out? > > > Thanks. > > > Jamie > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310413#310413 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310536#310536


    Message 26


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    Time: 03:13:20 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Looking for a piet
    From: "K5YAC" <hangar10@cox.net>
    Since Dan brought it up, I'll provide what details I can on Roger White's airplane. I have been hesitant on offering this info, but I spoke to him Friday night and he said he wouldn't mind me posting some information here. Roger completed "Precious Pete" in 1996. While it's not an exact Pietenpol reproduction, it apparently flies real good according to those who have flown it and it looks neat. If I remember correctly, he has a long steel tube fuse, metal empennage, a single point wing attach (rather than the pair of cabanes shown in the plans), steel gear and a Continental A-65 with metal prop for power. I don't know much more on the specifics other than I think he was asking $15,000. That may be negotiable, not sure what he would take. For those that don't know Roger White... he is a master homebuilder (EAA #41) with several aircraft to his credit and a super nice guy. He has built several types, such as the Wittman Tailwind, Cassut Racer and a Glassair to name a few... he is currently working on a Corvair powered Bolkow Junior. Jim Ballew is a good friend of Roger's that lives on the same field... he also frequents the boards here. Perhaps he can offer more details or clarification. -------- Mark Chouinard Wings and Center Section framed up - Working on Empannage Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310539#310539 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/p9260052_183.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p9260062_191.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p9260068_158.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p9260055_976.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p9260057_868.jpg


    Message 27


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    Time: 03:34:27 PM PST US
    From: airlion <airlion@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: Re: 40 hour fly-off
    Dan, I flew 38 hours before I got my nerve up to do a hard surface landing. It did fine but I do like grass better. I haven't figured the rate of climb test. All I know is that it takes off in about 350 ft and I can be at 500 ft. by the end of a 5000 ft runway. After that my roc drops down and my math is not good enough to go from there. Cheers, gardiner ________________________________ From: "helspersew@aol.com" <helspersew@aol.com> Sent: Sun, August 29, 2010 4:23:28 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off Dan, No I haven't. Mostly because my airspeed indicator is not working right. As soon as I get that working at a reliable level, I can do some rate-of-climb tests. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. -----Original Message----- From: Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com> Sent: Sun, Aug 29, 2010 2:27 pm Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off Hey Dan, Have you done any WAGing of the rate of climb? Dan -- Dan Yocum yocum137@gmail.com "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." On Aug 29, 2010, at 9:44 AM, helspersew@aol.com wrote: Good people, > >I myself am enjoying my Piet, and really don't mind the 40 hour, Phase-1 fly-off >period that is required for a non-certified prop and engine. It was a long, but >enjoyable journey (10 year building process) to get this far.....I am loving >every minute of it. 12 hours flown-off so far. I have been able to work out a >few bugs, such as my nose-heaviness, excessive radiator overflow on climb-out, >oil leaks, brake adjustments, magneto slippage etc. With every flight I am >learning the machine and gaining the required confidence I will need in order to >fly passengers safely. Yesterday I went on a mini cross country, from Poplar >Grove, Bigfoot in Walworth WI, Dacy in Harvard IL, and back to Poplar Grove. Not >very far but nevertheless a building block for me and my airplane. I am >fortunate to have these grass strips so conveniently located so close to home. I >still haven't had the cohones to try a hard- surface landing. Yesterday I also >tried-out my quick disconnect tail wheel-to-skid set up. Worked like a charm! I >changed it at the end of the runway with the engine idling. > >At some point I will start loading up the front seat with sandbags. > >Dan Helsper >Poplar Grove, IL. > > > ========================>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >========================ums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com/ >========================http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > ======================== > ==================================== t" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List=================================== tp://forums.matronics.com ==================================== _blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution====================================


    Message 28


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    Time: 03:46:29 PM PST US
    From: jeff wilson <jlwilsonnn@yahoo.com>
    Subject: New metal fuse Piet for sale
    Here is another Piet for sale. Just passing along the info. Berlin=0A Batesel in Willow Springs, MO (Chapter 1218 VP) talking about the ir =0APietenpol (metal fuselage) they completed and have for sale now (they =0Aare asking $21K for it). =0A =0ABy the way, Chapter 1218 holds their meetings on the 2nd Saturday of the =0A month at either noon or 4 pm at 1H5 (128 NM SW from CPS). They are a =0AVERY active building chapter and Berlin welcomed us to drive or fly over =0A for a meeting. =0A =0AAd info: =0A2010 PIETENPOL 32HRS TT 65HP =A2 FOR SALE =A2 Continental en gine 32 hrs SMOH. First flight 4/22 Built by EAA Chapter 1218 Members South Central MO. Metal Fuselage w/Fabric has cockpit doors, Cleveland brakes, S cott tail wheel, two fuel tanks, Culver wood prop. Located in Willow Spring s, MO (1H5) Please Call BERLIN BATESEL at (417)469-3686 for more informatio n. Do Not Archive =0A=0A=0A=0A


    Message 29


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    Time: 03:59:53 PM PST US
    From: KM Heide CPO/FAAOP <kmheidecpo@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: CG for heavy pilots
    Dan, - Then for a guy like me (who is 6'0 and 270 lb. mass of water, bones, and fa t)-should-I then make my fuse longer to compensate for the heaviness of my weight? It is reasonable for one to figure out the CG by adding the eng ine weight, weight of pilot, weight of fuse on tail wheel, then-use that -number to see if you have enough wing movement aft for compensation? Has anyone figured out what modifications are needed to compensate for a heavi er pilot say 270? KMH - --- On Sun, 8/29/10, Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com> wrote: From: Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Rib drawing I disagree. I think 29" on-center is a better dimension. It matches the 29" between the attach points on the fuse. And even though WW thinks it's a mi sguided belief that one can shift the wing back and forth to correct for Co G issues, a perfect parallelogram *will* allow for such shifting. I do agre e with his assessment that the attach points for the diagonal cabanes shoul d be heavy duty, permanent jobs, if not welded, but that's a different issu e. Dan -- Dan Yocum yocum137@gmail.com "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." On Aug 28, 2010, at 5:46 PM, Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com> wrote: > > The 27 3/4 is the important dimension. Go ahead and use it! > > Ryan > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Aug 28, 2010, at 4:35 PM, JGriff <jgriffith19@comcast.net> wrote: > >> >> I received my plans and am about to construct my rib jig on 3/4" MDF. I didn't give much thought to using the supplied rib drawing and instead was going to plot out the shape because so many posts in the archive say not to use it since the drawing is off due to the xerox reproduction. I just doub le checked the drawing and it seems pretty accurate. The chord is 58" which I assume is correct because it doesn't include the leading or trailing edg e. Also the 27 3/4 inch dim given between the spars is spot on. Has the dra wing improved from years past? I'm thinking of using it - has anyone else u sed it instead of plotting it out? >> Thanks. >> Jamie >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310413#310413 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > le, List Admin. =0A=0A=0A


    Message 30


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    Time: 04:33:04 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: CG for heavy pilots
    From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com>
    Hi Ken, I think William's point is that you should not design your wing or it's attach points with the ability to shift them fore or aft whenever you decide you need to. I would think that a significant factor behind this belief is the fact that he was burned in an Piet accident where the wing shifted forward, fuel lines were ruptured, and bad things happened. You can move the wing fore and aft, while you are building, to correct for a known CG issue....but your ultimate construction of the diagonal strut attachment, once you determine where the wing should be ought to be be permanent (welded), or so beefy that it is just as strong. Ryan On Sun, Aug 29, 2010 at 5:57 PM, KM Heide CPO/FAAOP <kmheidecpo@yahoo.com>wrote: > Dan, > > Then for a guy like me (who is 6'0 and 270 lb. mass of water, bones, and > fat) should I then make my fuse longer to compensate for the heaviness of my > weight? It is reasonable for one to figure out the CG by adding the engine > weight, weight of pilot, weight of fuse on tail wheel, then use that number > to see if you have enough wing movement aft for compensation? Has anyone > figured out what modifications are needed to compensate for a heavier pilot > say 270? > > KMH > * > * > ** > > > --- On *Sun, 8/29/10, Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com>* wrote: > > > From: Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com> > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Rib drawing > To: "pietenpol-list@matronics.com" <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> > Date: Sunday, August 29, 2010, 2:34 PM > > > > > I disagree. I think 29" on-center is a better dimension. It matches the 29" > between the attach points on the fuse. And even though WW thinks it's a > misguided belief that one can shift the wing back and forth to correct for > CoG issues, a perfect parallelogram *will* allow for such shifting. I do > agree with his assessment that the attach points for the diagonal cabanes > should be heavy duty, permanent jobs, if not welded, but that's a different > issue. > > Dan > > -- > Dan Yocum > yocum137@gmail.com<http://us.mc527.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=yocum137@gmail.com> > "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." > > On Aug 28, 2010, at 5:46 PM, Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com<http://us.mc527.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rmueller23@gmail.com>> > wrote: > > > > > > > The 27 3/4 is the important dimension. Go ahead and use it! > > > > Ryan > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > On Aug 28, 2010, at 4:35 PM, JGriff <jgriffith19@comcast.net<http://us.mc527.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=jgriffith19@comcast.net>> > wrote: > > > > > >> > >> I received my plans and am about to construct my rib jig on 3/4" MDF. I > didn't give much thought to using the supplied rib drawing and instead was > going to plot out the shape because so many posts in the archive say not to > use it since the drawing is off due to the xerox reproduction. I just double > checked the drawing and it seems pretty accurate. The chord is 58" which I > assume is correct because it doesn't include the leading or trailing edge. > Also the 27 3/4 inch dim given between the spars is spot on. Has the drawing > improved from years past? I'm thinking of using it - has anyone else used it > instead of plotting it out? > >> Thanks. > >> Jamie > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Read this topic online here: > >> > >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310413#310413 > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > &tor?Pietenpol-List" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet - MATRONICS WEB FORUM href=" > http://forums.matronics.com/" target=_blank>http://forums.matronbsp; > - List Contribution Web Site -http://www====================== > > > * > > * > >


    Message 31


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    Time: 04:34:46 PM PST US
    From: Pietn38b@aol.com
    Subject: Re: Looking for a piet
    I think the engine is an 85 and has had a recent top overhaul. The wing span is longer than standard but I don't know by how much. The fuel tank is just behind the firewall and I believe about 18 gal. I have never flown in it but the observed performance seems to be very good. Hope this helps a little. Jim Ballew Piet N38B In a message dated 8/29/2010 5:13:48 P.M. Central Daylight Time, hangar10@cox.net writes: --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "K5YAC" <hangar10@cox.net> Since Dan brought it up, I'll provide what details I can on Roger White's airplane. I have been hesitant on offering this info, but I spoke to him Friday night and he said he wouldn't mind me posting some information here. Roger completed "Precious Pete" in 1996. While it's not an exact Pietenpol reproduction, it apparently flies real good according to those who have flown it and it looks neat. If I remember correctly, he has a long steel tube fuse, metal empennage, a single point wing attach (rather than the pair of cabanes shown in the plans), steel gear and a Continental A-65 with metal prop for power. I don't know much more on the specifics other than I think he was asking $15,000. That may be negotiable, not sure what he would take. For those that don't know Roger White... he is a master homebuilder (EAA #41) with several aircraft to his credit and a super nice guy. He has built several types, such as the Wittman Tailwind, Cassut Racer and a Glassair to name a few... he is currently working on a Corvair powered Bolkow Junior. Jim Ballew is a good friend of Roger's that lives on the same field... he also frequents the boards here. Perhaps he can offer more details or clarification. -------- Mark Chouinard Wings and Center Section framed up - Working on Empannage Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310539#310539 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/p9260052_183.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p9260062_191.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p9260068_158.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p9260055_976.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p9260057_868.jpg


    Message 32


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    Time: 04:48:23 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: New metal fuse Piet for sale
    From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com>
    Haha....we bought our beautiful to-the-plans Piet from Gene in TN for $15.5 , and it flies beautifully on 65hp. $21k for that morphadite thing is a bit ridiculous. Ryan On Sun, Aug 29, 2010 at 5:45 PM, jeff wilson <jlwilsonnn@yahoo.com> wrote: > Here is another Piet for sale. Just passing along the info. > > Berlin Batesel in Willow Springs, MO (Chapter 1218 VP) talking about thei r > Pietenpol (metal fuselage) they completed and have for sale now (they are > asking $21K for it). > > By the way, Chapter 1218 holds their meetings on the 2nd Saturday of the > month at either noon or 4 pm at 1H5 (128 NM SW from CPS). They are a VERY > active building chapter and Berlin welcomed us to drive or fly over for a > meeting. > > Ad info: > 2010 PIETENPOL 32HRS TT 65HP - FOR SALE - Continental engine 32 hrs S MOH. First > flight 4/22 Built by EAA Chapter 1218 Members South Central MO. Metal > Fuselage w/Fabric has cockpit doors, Cleveland brakes, Scott tail wheel, > two fuel tanks, Culver wood prop. Located in Willow Springs, MO (1H5) > Please Call BERLIN BATESEL at (417)469-3686 for more information. > > Do Not Archive > > * > =========== =========== =========== =========== > * > >


    Message 33


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    Time: 04:53:57 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: 40 hour fly-off, state of model A
    From: helspersew@aol.com
    Hi Ryan, I've tried that........nothing. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. -----Original Message----- From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com> Sent: Sun, Aug 29, 2010 3:31 pm Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off, state of model A I don't know if you've done this or not, but what about starting the engin e and then raising the tail and setting on a sawhorse/blocking get it to level, and see if that will duplicate the issue.... Ryan Sent from my iPhone On Aug 29, 2010, at 3:20 PM, helspersew@aol.com wrote: Doug, My engine is running like a top, but I can still detect the sputtering on final at very low idle. I still can't figure out why. Like yesterday, no sign of induction condensation, but it still happened. Runs fine as soon as I coast out and on the ground. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. -----Original Message----- From: Doug Dever <chiefpepperhead@hotmail.com> Sent: Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:27 am Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off Dan, I personally would mind the 40 hrs either. Takes you that long to learn the aircraft. How's the "A" running? You mentioned it was stopping at idle and thought it was just because it was tight. I'm still leanig heav ily towards an "A". I would prefer a Warner Scarab Jr or a lambert, but they are way out of my price range for now. Doug Dever In beautiful Stow Ohio Subject: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off From: helspersew@aol.com Good people, I myself am enjoying my Piet, and really don't mind the 40 hour, Phase-1 fly-off period that is required for a non-certified prop and engine. It was a long, but enjoyable journey (10 year building process) to get this far.....I am loving every minute of it. 12 hours flown-off so far. I have been able to work out a few bugs, such as my nose-heaviness, excessive ra diator overflow on climb-out, oil leaks, brake adjustments, magneto slippa ge etc. With every flight I am learning the machine and gaining the requir ed confidence I will need in order to fly passengers safely. Yesterday I went on a mini cross country, from Poplar Grove, Bigfoot in Walworth WI, Dacy in Harvard IL, and back to Poplar Grove. Not very far but neverthele ss a building block for me and my airplane. I am fortunate to have these grass strips so conveniently located so close to home. I still haven't ha d the cohones to try a hard- surface landing. Yesterday I also tried-out my quick disconnect tail wheel-to-skid set up. Worked like a charm! I cha nged it at the end of the runway with the engine idling. At some point I will start loading up the front seat with sandbags. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. st" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution t" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List p://forums.matronics.com blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution ">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List ums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contributi on ======================== =========== -= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum - -= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse -= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription, -= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, -= Photoshare, and much much more: - -= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - -= Same great content also available via the Web Forums! - -= --> http://forums.matronics.com - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - List Contribution Web Site - -= Thank you for your generous support! -= -Matt Dralle, List Admin. -= --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution -======================== ======================== ===========


    Message 34


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    Time: 04:59:58 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Rib drawing
    From: helspersew@aol.com
    Keep that wife. do not archive -----Original Message----- From: K5YAC <hangar10@cox.net> Sent: Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:00 pm Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Rib drawing In order to keep the original print in good shape, my wife suggested that I use arbon paper and trace the original print to the MDF. At first I thought that ould be difficult, but carbon paper is cheap (especially if you have an Of fice epot or Staples nearby) and the MDF is smooth so I gave it a try. It only took bout 30 minutes and I had an exact reproduction on my jig. This really he lped lot when it came to placing blocks and cams for aligning the pieces. Just figured I'd share that since it worked out good for me... I chose to glue nd nail my ribs. If you prefer to clamp, just look around as there are se veral ther cool variations around here. -------- ark Chouinard inishing up Wings - Working on Center Section Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310535#310535 ttachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/wing_jig_342.jpg ttp://forums.matronics.com//files/wing_jig_2_165.jpg -======================== ======================== =========== -= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum - -= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse -= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription, -= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, -= Photoshare, and much much more: - -= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - -= Same great content also available via the Web Forums! - -= --> http://forums.matronics.com - -======================== ======================== =========== -= - List Contribution Web Site - -= Thank you for your generous support! -= -Matt Dralle, List Admin. -= --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution -======================== ======================== ===========


    Message 35


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    Time: 05:01:37 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: 40 hour fly-off, state of model A
    From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com>
    This is a WAG level thing....but if you go up to altitude, can you produce the behavior? On Sun, Aug 29, 2010 at 6:53 PM, <helspersew@aol.com> wrote: > Hi Ryan, > > I've tried that........nothing. > > Dan Helsper > Poplar Grove, IL. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com> > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> > Sent: Sun, Aug 29, 2010 3:31 pm > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off, state of model A > > I don't know if you've done this or not, but what about starting the > engine and then raising the tail and setting on a sawhorse/blocking get it > to level, and see if that will duplicate the issue.... > > Ryan > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Aug 29, 2010, at 3:20 PM, helspersew@aol.com wrote: > > > Doug, > > My engine is running like a top, but I can still detect the sputtering on > final at very low idle. I still can't figure out why. Like yesterday, no > sign of induction condensation, but it still happened. Runs fine as soon as > I coast out and on the ground. > > Dan Helsper > Poplar Grove, IL. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Doug Dever <chiefpepperhead@hotmail.com> > To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Sent: Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:27 am > Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off > > Dan, > > I personally would mind the 40 hrs either. Takes you that long to learn > the aircraft. How's the "A" running? You mentioned it was stopping at > idle and thought it was just because it was tight. I'm still leanig heavily > towards an "A". I would prefer a Warner Scarab Jr or a lambert, but they > are way out of my price range for now. > > > Doug Dever > In beautiful Stow Ohio > > > ------------------------------ > To: <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off > Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2010 09:44:11 -0400 > From: <helspersew@aol.com>helspersew@aol.com > > Good people, > > I myself am enjoying my Piet, and really don't mind the 40 hour, Phase-1 > fly-off period that is required for a non-certified prop and engine. It was > a long, but enjoyable journey (10 year building process) to get this > far.....I am loving every minute of it. 12 hours flown-off so far. I have > been able to work out a few bugs, such as my nose-heaviness, excessive > radiator overflow on climb-out, oil leaks, brake adjustments, magneto > slippage etc. With every flight I am learning the machine and gaining the > required confidence I will need in order to fly passengers safely. Yesterday > I went on a mini cross country, from Poplar Grove, Bigfoot in Walworth WI, > Dacy in Harvard IL, and back to Poplar Grove. Not very far but nevertheless > a building block for me and my airplane. I am fortunate to have these grass > strips so conveniently located so close to home. I still haven't had the > cohones to try a hard- surface landing. Yesterday I also tried-out my quick > disconnect tail wheel-to-skid set up. Worked like a charm! I changed it at > the end of the runway with the engine idling. > > At some point I will start loading up the front seat with sandbags. > > Dan Helsper > Poplar Grove, IL. > > * > > st" target=_blank> <http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > ttp://forums.matronics.com > =_blank> <http://www.matronics.com/contribution>http://www.matronics.com/contribution > * > > * > > t" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > tp://forums.matronics.com > _blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution > * > > * > > > ">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > rums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > "http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > * > > * > > =================================== > t" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > =================================== > tp://forums.matronics.com > =================================== > _blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution > =================================== > * > > * > > * > >


    Message 36


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    Time: 05:03:08 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Rib drawing
    From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com>
    She can shoot a bow too... ;) On Sun, Aug 29, 2010 at 6:59 PM, <helspersew@aol.com> wrote: > Keep that wife. > > do not archive > > > -----Original Message----- > From: K5YAC <hangar10@cox.net> > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Sent: Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:00 pm > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Rib drawing > > > In order to keep the original print in good shape, my wife suggested that I use > carbon paper and trace the original print to the MDF. At first I thought that > would be difficult, but carbon paper is cheap (especially if you have an Office > Depot or Staples nearby) and the MDF is smooth so I gave it a try. It only took > about 30 minutes and I had an exact reproduction on my jig. This really helped > a lot when it came to placing blocks and cams for aligning the pieces. > > Just figured I'd share that since it worked out good for me... I chose to glue > and nail my ribs. If you prefer to clamp, just look around as there are several > other cool variations around here. > > -------- > Mark Chouinard > Finishing up Wings - Working on Center Section > > > Read this topic online here: > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310535#310535 > > > Attachments: > http://forums.matronics.com//files/wing_jig_342.jpghttp://forums.matronics.com//files/wing_jig_2_165.jpg > > > =================================== > t" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > =================================== > tp://forums.matronics.com > =================================== > _blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution > =================================== > > > * > > * > >


    Message 37


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    Time: 05:32:34 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Rib drawing
    From: Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com>
    Yep. Sounds about right. If you want, split the difference and move each one apart 1/8" to get the 29" on-center measurement. N8031 is 29" OC and it flies just fine. Dan -- Dan Yocum yocum137@gmail.com "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." On Aug 29, 2010, at 5:10 PM, JGriff <jgriffith19@comcast.net> wrote: > > I'm getting 28.75" between the centerline of both 3/4" spars and 28" from the rear edge of the front spar to the front edge of the rear spar. > > >


    Message 38


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    Time: 06:22:01 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Looking for a piet
    From: Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com>
    No, no. That's not the one I was talking about. That looks more like a Piet than the one I'm talking about - Roger's plane looks pretty nice, actually. I like the cowling and the combing is the smoothest I've ever seen. -- Dan Yocum yocum137@gmail.com "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." On Aug 29, 2010, at 6:12 PM, K5YAC <hangar10@cox.net> wrote: > > Since Dan brought it up, I'll provide what details I can on Roger White's airplane.


    Message 39


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    Time: 06:26:41 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Rib drawing
    From: Rick Holland <at7000ft@gmail.com>
    That's one way to do it. The other way is to build the ribs to the plans with a 1" wide piece in the spar position then add 1/8" ply spacers on either side of the 3/4" spar when you install the ribs on the spars. rick On Sun, Aug 29, 2010 at 1:25 PM, JGriff <jgriffith19@comcast.net> wrote: > > One more question about spar placement. I know the 27 3/4" measurement on > the rib drawing is the important dimension. If I am going with 3/4" spars > than should I center the 3/4" spars in the 1" spar area so the new > measurement distance between the 2 qty 3/4" spars will now be 28" correct? > Did any of you place a piece of 3/4 x 4 3/4 spar material right on the jig > to build the ribs around or should I not do that. > Thanks again for all the help in getting me started. > Jamie > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310512#310512 > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"


    Message 40


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    Time: 06:27:32 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Rib drawing
    From: "K5YAC" <hangar10@cox.net>
    Yep, she's pretty good. A keeper for sure. [quote="Ryan Mueller"]She can shoot a bow too... ;) On Sun, Aug 29, 2010 at 6:59 PM, wrote: > Keep that wife. > > do not archive > > > > > > -- -------- Mark Chouinard Wings and Center Section framed up - Working on Empannage Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310563#310563


    Message 41


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    Time: 06:29:39 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Rib drawing
    From: Rick Holland <at7000ft@gmail.com>
    Or get a piece of plexiglass from Home Depot to lay over the rib drawing (and that you nail your rib jig blocks to). rick On Sun, Aug 29, 2010 at 3:00 PM, K5YAC <hangar10@cox.net> wrote: > > In order to keep the original print in good shape, my wife suggested that I > use carbon paper and trace the original print to the MDF. At first I > thought that would be difficult, but carbon paper is cheap (especially if > you have an Office Depot or Staples nearby) and the MDF is smooth so I gave > it a try. It only took about 30 minutes and I had an exact reproduction on > my jig. This really helped a lot when it came to placing blocks and cams > for aligning the pieces. > > Just figured I'd share that since it worked out good for me... I chose to > glue and nail my ribs. If you prefer to clamp, just look around as there > are several other cool variations around here. > > -------- > Mark Chouinard > Finishing up Wings - Working on Center Section > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310535#310535 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/wing_jig_342.jpg > http://forums.matronics.com//files/wing_jig_2_165.jpg > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"


    Message 42


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    Time: 06:32:20 PM PST US
    From: shad bell <aviatorbell@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: 40 hour fly-off, state of model A
    I wonder if it is from the windmilling of the prop?- Think of the rumblin g and popping that come with down shifting a car to a lower gear at idle wh ile slowing down.- Just another w.a.g.- Does it do it at idle with the nose up (while flying)-. At a low idle, and nose down-the wind is-dri ving the prop-faster than your static idle speed-,-possibly just raw fuel that comes on through the exsaust,- with the throttle closed the air is restricted, the engine being spun up a little faster as a result of the relitive wind turning the prop, possibly sucks a little more fuel through the carb venturi, and causes a temporary rich condition. - Just a few thoughts, not sure if they are valid or not.- - Shad- --- On Sun, 8/29/10, helspersew@aol.com <helspersew@aol.com> wrote: From: helspersew@aol.com <helspersew@aol.com> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off, state of model A Hi Ryan, - I've tried that........nothing. - Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. -----Original Message----- From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com> Sent: Sun, Aug 29, 2010 3:31 pm Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off, state of model A I don't know if you've done this or not, but what about starting the engine and then raising the tail and setting on a sawhorse/blocking get it to lev el, and see if that will duplicate the issue.... Ryan Sent from my iPhone On Aug 29, 2010, at 3:20 PM, helspersew@aol.com wrote: Doug, - My engine is running like a top, but I can still detect the sputtering on f inal at very low idle. I still can't figure out why. Like yesterday, no sig n of induction condensation, but it still happened. Runs fine as soon as I coast out and on the ground. - Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. -----Original Message----- From: Doug Dever <chiefpepperhead@hotmail.com> Sent: Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:27 am Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off #yiv1294837877 #yiv1294837877AOLMsgPart_2_7fb30129-6797-47e5-b22b-3d435d04f 6a3 td{color:black;}#yiv1294837877 #yiv1294837877AOLMsgPart_2_7fb30129-6797 -47e5-b22b-3d435d04f6a3 #yiv1294837877AOLMsgPart_2_f7299d4d-c70f-46ef-b36c- a1579a77c21a td{color:black;}#yiv1294837877 #yiv1294837877AOLMsgPart_2_7fb3 0129-6797-47e5-b22b-3d435d04f6a3 #yiv1294837877AOLMsgPart_2_f7299d4d-c70f-4 6ef-b36c-a1579a77c21a .yiv1294837877hmmessage P{margin:0px;padding:0px;}#yi v1294837877 #yiv1294837877AOLMsgPart_2_7fb30129-6797-47e5-b22b-3d435d04f6a3 #yiv1294837877AOLMsgPart_2_f7299d4d-c70f-46ef-b36c-a1579a77c21a body.yiv12 94837877hmmessage{font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma;} Dan, - I personally would mind the 40 hrs either.- Takes you that long to learn the aircraft.-- How's the "A" running?- You mentioned it was stopping at idle and thought it was just because it was tight.- I'm still leanig heavily towards an "A".- I would prefer a Warner Scarab Jr or a lambert, but they are way out of my price range for now. Doug Dever In beautiful Stow Ohio - Subject: Pietenpol-List: 40 hour fly-off From: helspersew@aol.com Good people, - I myself am enjoying my Piet, and really don't mind the 40 hour, Phase-1 fl y-off period that is required for a non-certified prop and engine. It was a long, but enjoyable journey (10 year building process) to get this far.... .I am loving every minute of it. 12 hours flown-off so far. I have been abl e to work out a few bugs, such as my nose-heaviness, excessive radiator ove rflow on climb-out, oil leaks, brake adjustments, magneto slippage etc. Wit h every flight I am learning the machine and gaining the required confidenc e I will need in order to fly passengers safely. Yesterday I went on a mini cross country, from Poplar Grove, Bigfoot in Walworth WI, Dacy in Harvard IL, and back to Poplar Grove. Not very far but nevertheless a building bloc k for me and my airplane. I am fortunate to have these grass strips so conv eniently located so close to home. I still haven't had the cohones to try a hard- surface landing. Yesterday I also tried-out my quick disconnect tail wheel-to-skid set up. Worked like a charm! I changed it at the end of the runway with the engine idling. - At some point I will start loading up the front seat with sandbags.- - Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. - st" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List ttp://forums.matronics.com =_blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution t" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution ">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List rums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com "http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contributi on t" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution =0A=0A=0A


    Message 43


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    Time: 06:39:42 PM PST US
    From: shad bell <aviatorbell@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: testing on pavement
    I thought it was kind of tense sometimes while we did the 1st 20 hrs or so on a paved runway, but we did not have a steerable tailwheel.- It was bas ically a rolling tailskid, fixed and not movable.- It definitly keeps you r feet busy, and some times I needed a blast of power to keep the tail behi nd me during crosswind landings.- BUT, now with the steerable tailwheel, pavement is not a big deal, just a little rougher on the tires. - Shad=0A=0A=0A


    Message 44


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    Time: 06:40:34 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: CG for heavy pilots
    From: Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com>
    I'm on vacation this week, so I'm going on memory here - the long fuse adds m ost of the length in the nose, not the tail, so yes it'll help with a heavie r guy like you. There's a limit to the amout you can shift the wing back to m odify the CoG. I think I've read that some people have tilted the cabanes ba ck by up to 4", but it looks a bit odd. Then again, the long nose on N8031 looks a bit odd too, so... Take yer pick o f oddities. ;-) Dan -- Dan Yocum yocum137@gmail.com "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." On Aug 29, 2010, at 6:57 PM, KM Heide CPO/FAAOP <kmheidecpo@yahoo.com> wrote : > Dan, > > Then for a guy like me (who is 6'0 and 270 lb. mass of water, bones, and f at) should I then make my fuse longer to compensate for the heaviness of my w eight? It is reasonable for one to figure out the CG by adding the engine we ight, weight of pilot, weight of fuse on tail wheel, then use that number to see if you have enough wing movement aft for compensation? Has anyone figur ed out what modifications are needed to compensate for a heavier pilot say 2 70? > > KMH > > > > --- On Sun, 8/29/10, Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com> wrote: > > From: Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com> > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Rib drawing > To: "pietenpol-list@matronics.com" <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> > Date: Sunday, August 29, 2010, 2:34 PM > > > I disagree. I think 29" on-center is a better dimension. It matches the 29 " between the attach points on the fuse. And even though WW thinks it's a mi sguided belief that one can shift the wing back and forth to correct for CoG issues, a perfect parallelogram *will* allow for such shifting. I do agree w ith his assessment that the attach points for the diagonal cabanes should be heavy duty, permanent jobs, if not welded, but that's a different issue. > > Dan > > -- > Dan Yocum > yocum137@gmail.com > "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." > > On Aug 28, 2010, at 5:46 PM, Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > The 27 3/4 is the important dimension. Go ahead and use it! > > > > Ryan > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > On Aug 28, 2010, at 4:35 PM, JGriff <jgriffith19@comcast.net> wrote: > > > > >> > >> I received my plans and am about to construct my rib jig on 3/4" MDF. I didn't give much thought to using the supplied rib drawing and instead was g oing to plot out the shape because so many posts in the archive say not to u se it since the drawing is off due to the xerox reproduction. I just double c hecked the drawing and it seems pretty accurate. The chord is 58" which I as sume is correct because it doesn't include the leading or trailing edge. Als o the 27 3/4 inch dim given between the spars is spot on. Has the drawing im proved from years past? I'm thinking of using it - has anyone else used it i nstead of plotting it out? > >> Thanks. > >> Jamie > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Read this topic online here: > >> > >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310413#310413 > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > &tor?Pietenpol-List" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pi et - MATRONICS WEB FORUM href="http://forums.matronics.com/" t arget=_blank>http://forums.matronbsp; - List Contribution Web Sit e -http://www===================== = > > > > > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= >


    Message 45


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    Time: 06:44:16 PM PST US
    From: "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5@comcast.net>
    Subject: Re: Rib drawing
    That's what I did (well, on the 20 ribs so far.).no need to over think it! Gary Boothe Cool, Ca. Pietenpol WW Corvair Conversion, mounted Tail done, Fuselage on gear (20 ribs down.) Do not archive _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Holland Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2010 6:19 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Rib drawing That's one way to do it. The other way is to build the ribs to the plans with a 1" wide piece in the spar position then add 1/8" ply spacers on either side of the 3/4" spar when you install the ribs on the spars. rick On Sun, Aug 29, 2010 at 1:25 PM, JGriff <jgriffith19@comcast.net> wrote: One more question about spar placement. I know the 27 3/4" measurement on the rib drawing is the important dimension. If I am going with 3/4" spars than should I center the 3/4" spars in the 1" spar area so the new measurement distance between the 2 qty 3/4" spars will now be 28" correct? Did any of you place a piece of 3/4 x 4 3/4 spar material right on the jig to build the ribs around or should I not do that. Thanks again for all the help in getting me started. Jamie Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310512#310512 ========== st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List ========== http://forums.matronics.com ========== le, List Admin. ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ========== -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"


    Message 46


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    Time: 06:59:33 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: CG for heavy pilots
    From: Rick Holland <at7000ft@gmail.com>
    Knowing that almost all Pietenpols are tail heavy (sometimes even after moving the wing back several inches) and after reading an interview with Bernard where he suggested moving the firewall forward 6 inches (when using a non-Model -A engine) I decided to do the same. I figured why build an engine mount with say 12" of extra length to get within CG when you can add 6" to the front of the fuselage and 6" to the mount and have the extra leg room and fuel tank room? Yes I know it adds weight but an extended mount and cowling adds weight too. To answer your question the two primary means you have to compensate for your weight is moving the wing back and moving the engine forward (assuming you don't want to redesign the the whole thing). After completing my airframe I borrowed some aircraft scales, assembled the airframe, added a 100 lbs of scrap iron behind the firewall at the fuel tank position, and got the weights on both mains and the tailwheel with me sitting in it (setup with top longerons horizontal ). From that data you can back calculate where the engine needs to be to be within CG (15 to 20 inches aft of the leading edge). Preliminary W&B indicates that I shouldn't have to move my wing back (Corvair engine, long fuselage plans, and I weight 200). But I have not yet flown so all this is currently just idle speculation. rick On Sun, Aug 29, 2010 at 4:57 PM, KM Heide CPO/FAAOP <kmheidecpo@yahoo.com>wrote: > Dan, > > Then for a guy like me (who is 6'0 and 270 lb. mass of water, bones, and > fat) should I then make my fuse longer to compensate for the heaviness of my > weight? It is reasonable for one to figure out the CG by adding the engine > weight, weight of pilot, weight of fuse on tail wheel, then use that number > to see if you have enough wing movement aft for compensation? Has anyone > figured out what modifications are needed to compensate for a heavier pilot > say 270? > > KMH > * > * > ** > > > --- On *Sun, 8/29/10, Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com>* wrote: > > > From: Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com> > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Rib drawing > To: "pietenpol-list@matronics.com" <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> > Date: Sunday, August 29, 2010, 2:34 PM > > > > > I disagree. I think 29" on-center is a better dimension. It matches the 29" > between the attach points on the fuse. And even though WW thinks it's a > misguided belief that one can shift the wing back and forth to correct for > CoG issues, a perfect parallelogram *will* allow for such shifting. I do > agree with his assessment that the attach points for the diagonal cabanes > should be heavy duty, permanent jobs, if not welded, but that's a different > issue. > > Dan > > -- > Dan Yocum > yocum137@gmail.com<http://us.mc527.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=yocum137@gmail.com> > "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." > > On Aug 28, 2010, at 5:46 PM, Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com<http://us.mc527.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rmueller23@gmail.com>> > wrote: > > > > > > > The 27 3/4 is the important dimension. Go ahead and use it! > > > > Ryan > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > On Aug 28, 2010, at 4:35 PM, JGriff <jgriffith19@comcast.net<http://us.mc527.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=jgriffith19@comcast.net>> > wrote: > > > > > >> > >> I received my plans and am about to construct my rib jig on 3/4" MDF. I > didn't give much thought to using the supplied rib drawing and instead was > going to plot out the shape because so many posts in the archive say not to > use it since the drawing is off due to the xerox reproduction. I just double > checked the drawing and it seems pretty accurate. The chord is 58" which I > assume is correct because it doesn't include the leading or trailing edge. > Also the 27 3/4 inch dim given between the spars is spot on. Has the drawing > improved from years past? I'm thinking of using it - has anyone else used it > instead of plotting it out? > >> Thanks. > >> Jamie > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Read this topic online here: > >> > >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310413#310413 > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > &tor?Pietenpol-List" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet - MATRONICS WEB FORUM href=" > http://forums.matronics.com/" target=_blank>http://forums.matronbsp; > - List Contribution Web Site -http://www====================== > > > * > > * > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"


    Message 47


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    Time: 07:21:36 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: CG for heavy pilots
    From: Rick Holland <at7000ft@gmail.com>
    The 1933 fuselage is 163" and the long fuse is 172 3/8". The long fuse moves the firewall forward 2", the rear seat back 2", and all the rest is behind the rear seat. If you are concerned about aft CG you are better off with the short fuselage (even if you are going to use a Corvair or O-200). rick On Sun, Aug 29, 2010 at 7:36 PM, Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com> wrote: > I'm on vacation this week, so I'm going on memory here - the long fuse adds > most of the length in the nose, not the tail, so yes it'll help with a > heavier guy like you. There's a limit to the amout you can shift the wing > back to modify the CoG. I think I've read that some people have tilted the > cabanes back by up to 4", but it looks a bit odd. > > Then again, the long nose on N8031 looks a bit odd too, so... Take yer pick > of oddities. > > ;-) > > Dan > > -- > Dan Yocum > yocum137@gmail.com > "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." > > On Aug 29, 2010, at 6:57 PM, KM Heide CPO/FAAOP <kmheidecpo@yahoo.com> > wrote: > > Dan, > > Then for a guy like me (who is 6'0 and 270 lb. mass of water, bones, and > fat) should I then make my fuse longer to compensate for the heaviness of my > weight? It is reasonable for one to figure out the CG by adding the engine > weight, weight of pilot, weight of fuse on tail wheel, then use that number > to see if you have enough wing movement aft for compensation? Has anyone > figured out what modifications are needed to compensate for a heavier pilot > say 270? > > KMH > * > * > ** > > > --- On *Sun, 8/29/10, Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com>* wrote: > > > From: Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com> > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Rib drawing > To: "pietenpol-list@matronics.com" <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> > Date: Sunday, August 29, 2010, 2:34 PM > > yocum137@gmail.com> > > I disagree. I think 29" on-center is a better dimension. It matches the 29" > between the attach points on the fuse. And even though WW thinks it's a > misguided belief that one can shift the wing back and forth to correct for > CoG issues, a perfect parallelogram *will* allow for such shifting. I do > agree with his assessment that the attach points for the diagonal cabanes > should be heavy duty, permanent jobs, if not welded, but that's a different > issue. > > Dan > > -- > Dan Yocum > <http://us.mc527.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=yocum137@gmail.com> > yocum137@gmail.com > "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." > > On Aug 28, 2010, at 5:46 PM, Ryan Mueller <<http://us.mc527.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rmueller23@gmail.com> > rmueller23@gmail.com> wrote: > > rmueller23@gmail.com> > > > > The 27 3/4 is the important dimension. Go ahead and use it! > > > > Ryan > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > On Aug 28, 2010, at 4:35 PM, JGriff <<http://us.mc527.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=jgriffith19@comcast.net> > jgriffith19@comcast.net> wrote: > > > jgriffith19@comcast.net> > >> > >> I received my plans and am about to construct my rib jig on 3/4" MDF. I > didn't give much thought to using the supplied rib drawing and instead was > going to plot out the shape because so many posts in the archive say not to > use it since the drawing is off due to the xerox reproduction. I just double > checked the drawing and it seems pretty accurate. The chord is 58" which I > assume is correct because it doesn't include the leading or trailing edge. > Also the 27 3/4 inch dim given between the spars is spot on. Has the drawing > improved from years past? I'm thinking of using it - has anyone else used it > instead of plotting it out? > >> Thanks. > >> Jamie > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Read this topic online here: > >> > >> <http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310413#310413> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310413#310413 > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > &tor?Pietenpol-List" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet - MATRONICS WEB FORUM href=" > http://forums.matronics.com/" target=_blank>http://forums.matronbsp; > - List Contribution Web Site -http://www====================== > > > * > > ================================== > >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > ===================================ums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > ===================================http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > ================================== > * > > * > > * > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"


    Message 48


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    Time: 08:20:14 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: plnas came in
    From: Rick Holland <at7000ft@gmail.com>
    If I even design my own airplane I am going to name it the "Plnas Special". do not archive On Wed, Aug 25, 2010 at 1:18 PM, Wayne Bressler <wayne@taildraggersinc.com>wrote: > wayne@taildraggersinc.com> > > I wanted desperately to correct the subject line, but I didn't want to > start a new thread. > > <<<ducking>>> > > Wayne Bressler Jr. > Taildraggers, Inc. > taildraggersinc.com > > Do not archive > > On Aug 25, 2010, at 9:59 AM, Jeff Boatright <jboatri@emory.edu> wrote: > > > > > Well, nobody's perfetc. > > > > > > Do not archive > > -- > > > > Jeff Boatright > > "Now let's think about this..." > > > > > > > > > > > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"


    Message 49


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    Time: 11:21:48 PM PST US
    From: Matthew VanDervort <matthew.vandervort@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: CG for heavy pilots
    I have to double check the fuse length when I get home today, but the Piet I 'm rebuilding with a corvair, has the wing back 6", my grandpa built it like that and he weighed in at 275 when he was flying it, said it made it just a bit nose heavy, and the wing sits back far enough the rain misses the cock pit :) Do not archive Sent from my iPhone On Aug 29, 2010, at 10:20 PM, Rick Holland <at7000ft@gmail.com> wrote: > The 1933 fuselage is 163" and the long fuse is 172 3/8". The long fuse mov es the firewall forward 2", the rear seat back 2", and all the rest is behin d the rear seat. If you are concerned about aft CG you are better off with t he short fuselage (even if you are going to use a Corvair or O-200). > > rick > > On Sun, Aug 29, 2010 at 7:36 PM, Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com> wrote: > I'm on vacation this week, so I'm going on memory here - the long fuse add s most of the length in the nos not the tail, so yes it'll help with a heavi er guy like you. There's a limit to the amout you can shift the wing back to modify the CoG. I think I've read that some people have tilted the cabanes b ack by up to 4", but it looks a bit odd. > > Then again, the long nose on N8031 looks a bit odd too, so... Take yer pic k of oddities. > > ;-) > > Dan > > -- > Dan Yocum > yocum137@gmail.com > "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." > > On Aug 29, 2010, at 6:57 PM, KM Heide CPO/FAAOP <kmheidecpo@yahoo.com> wro te: > >> Dan, >> >> Then for a guy like me (who is 6'0 and 270 lb. mass of water, bones, and f at) should I then make my fuse longer to compensate for the heaviness of my w eight? It is reasonable for one to figure out the CG by adding the engine we ight, weight of pilot, weight of fuse on tail wheel, then use that number to see if you have enough wing movement aft for compensation? Has anyone figur ed out what modifications are needed to compensate for a heavier pilot say 2 70? >> >> KMH >> >> >> >> --- On Sun, 8/29/10, Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> From: Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com> >> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Rib drawing >> To: "pietenpol-list@matronics.com" <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> >> Date: Sunday, August 29, 2010, 2:34 PM >> >> >> I disagree. I think 29" on-center is a better dimension. It matches the 2 9" between the attach points on the fuse. And even though WW thinks it's a m isguided belief that one can shift the wing back and forth to correct for Co G issues, a perfect parallelogram *will* allow for such shifting. I do agree with his assessment that the attach points for the diagonal cabanes should b e heavy duty, permanent jobs, if not welded, but that's a different issue. >> >> Dan >> >> -- >> Dan Yocum >> yocum137@gmail.com >> "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." >> >> On Aug 28, 2010, at 5:46 PM, Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com> wrote: >> m> >> > >> > The 27 3/4 is the important dimension. Go ahead and use it! >> > >> > Ryan >> > >> > Sent from my iPhone >> > >> > On Aug 28, 2010, at 4:35 PM, JGriff <jgriffith19@comcast.net> wrote: >> > t> >> >> >> >> I received my plans and am about to construct my rib jig on 3/4" MDF. I didn't give much thought to using the supplied rib drawing and instead was g oing to plot out the shape because so many posts in the archive say not to u se it since the drawing is off due to the xerox reproduction. I just double c hecked the drawing and it seems pretty accurate. The chord is 58" which I as sume is correct because it doesn't include the leading or trailing edge. Als o the 27 3/4 inch dim given between the spars is spot on. Has the drawing im proved from years past? I'm thinking of using it - has anyone else used it i nstead of plotting it out? >> >> Thanks. >> >> Jamie >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310413#310413 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> &tor?Pietenpol-List" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?P iet - MATRONICS WEB FORUM href="http://forums.matronics.com/" target=_blank>http://forums.matronbsp; - List Contribution Web S ite -http://www===================== = >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ========= >> >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >> ========= >> ums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com >> ========= >> http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribut ion >> ========= >> > > > " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > tp://forums.matronics.com > _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > > > -- > Rick Holland > Castle Rock, Colorado > > "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad" > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= >


    Message 50


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    Time: 11:42:28 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: CG for heavy pilots
    From: Ryan Mueller <rmueller23@gmail.com>
    Must be nice to be able to climb in and set up shop behind the engine when you have to time the mags or clean the oil screen. ;) Ryan do not archive On Sun, Aug 29, 2010 at 8:36 PM, Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com> wrote: > I'm on vacation this week, so I'm going on memory here - the long fuse adds > most of the length in the nose, not the tail, so yes it'll help with a > heavier guy like you. There's a limit to the amout you can shift the wing > back to modify the CoG. I think I've read that some people have tilted the > cabanes back by up to 4", but it looks a bit odd. > > Then again, the long nose on N8031 looks a bit odd too, so... Take yer pick > of oddities. > > ;-) > > Dan > > -- > Dan Yocum > yocum137@gmail.com > "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." > > On Aug 29, 2010, at 6:57 PM, KM Heide CPO/FAAOP <kmheidecpo@yahoo.com> > wrote: > > Dan, > > Then for a guy like me (who is 6'0 and 270 lb. mass of water, bones, and > fat) should I then make my fuse longer to compensate for the heaviness of my > weight? It is reasonable for one to figure out the CG by adding the engine > weight, weight of pilot, weight of fuse on tail wheel, then use that number > to see if you have enough wing movement aft for compensation? Has anyone > figured out what modifications are needed to compensate for a heavier pilot > say 270? > > KMH > * > * > ** > > > --- On *Sun, 8/29/10, Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com>* wrote: > > > From: Dan Yocum <yocum137@gmail.com> > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Rib drawing > To: "pietenpol-list@matronics.com" <pietenpol-list@matronics.com> > Date: Sunday, August 29, 2010, 2:34 PM > > yocum137@gmail.com> > > I disagree. I think 29" on-center is a better dimension. It matches the 29" > between the attach points on the fuse. And even though WW thinks it's a > misguided belief that one can shift the wing back and forth to correct for > CoG issues, a perfect parallelogram *will* allow for such shifting. I do > agree with his assessment that the attach points for the diagonal cabanes > should be heavy duty, permanent jobs, if not welded, but that's a different > issue. > > Dan > > -- > Dan Yocum > <http://us.mc527.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=yocum137@gmail.com> > yocum137@gmail.com > "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." > > On Aug 28, 2010, at 5:46 PM, Ryan Mueller <<http://us.mc527.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rmueller23@gmail.com> > rmueller23@gmail.com> wrote: > > rmueller23@gmail.com> > > > > The 27 3/4 is the important dimension. Go ahead and use it! > > > > Ryan > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > On Aug 28, 2010, at 4:35 PM, JGriff <<http://us.mc527.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=jgriffith19@comcast.net> > jgriffith19@comcast.net> wrote: > > > jgriffith19@comcast.net> > >> > >> I received my plans and am about to construct my rib jig on 3/4" MDF. I > didn't give much thought to using the supplied rib drawing and instead was > going to plot out the shape because so many posts in the archive say not to > use it since the drawing is off due to the xerox reproduction. I just double > checked the drawing and it seems pretty accurate. The chord is 58" which I > assume is correct because it doesn't include the leading or trailing edge. > Also the 27 3/4 inch dim given between the spars is spot on. Has the drawing > improved from years past? I'm thinking of using it - has anyone else used it > instead of plotting it out? > >> Thanks. > >> Jamie > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Read this topic online here: > >> > >> <http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310413#310413> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=310413#310413 > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > &tor?Pietenpol-List" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Piet - MATRONICS WEB FORUM href=" > http://forums.matronics.com/" target=_blank>http://forums.matronbsp; > - List Contribution Web Site -http://www====================== > > > * > > ================================== > >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > ===================================ums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > ===================================http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > ================================== > * > > * > > * > >




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