Pietenpol-List Digest Archive

Thu 12/16/10


Total Messages Posted: 48



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 02:11 AM - Re: looking for Fairchild N81288 (off-topic) (Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG FORSCOM)
     2. 02:15 AM - Re: TIG inverter welder? (Charles Campbell)
     3. 04:13 AM - Please report in (helspersew@aol.com)
     4. 04:50 AM - Re: looking for Fairchild N81288 (off-topic) (Jerry Dotson)
     5. 05:01 AM - Cowl (pineymb)
     6. 05:43 AM - Re: Cowl (Jeff Boatright)
     7. 05:55 AM - Re: Please report in (airlion)
     8. 06:08 AM - Re: Please report in (Pieti Lowell)
     9. 06:24 AM - Re: progress (bender)
    10. 06:26 AM - Re: Please report in (bender)
    11. 06:52 AM - Re: Please report in (TOM STINEMETZE)
    12. 06:53 AM - Re: TIG inverter welder? (Michael Perez)
    13. 06:57 AM - Re: Please report in (jeff wilson)
    14. 07:00 AM - Re: Please report in (Michael Perez)
    15. 07:03 AM - Covering question (Jim Birke)
    16. 07:37 AM - welding (Douwe Blumberg)
    17. 07:39 AM - Re: Covering question (Jack Phillips)
    18. 07:43 AM - Re: Please report in (Charles Campbell)
    19. 07:44 AM - welding (Douwe Blumberg)
    20. 07:50 AM - Re: Re: Please report in (Charles Campbell)
    21. 07:54 AM - Re: progress (AlRice)
    22. 07:55 AM - Re: Please report in (Charles Campbell)
    23. 07:56 AM - Re: Covering question (Jeff Boatright)
    24. 07:56 AM - Re: Please report in (Charles Campbell)
    25. 07:57 AM - Re: Please report in (Jeff Boatright)
    26. 07:59 AM - Re: Covering question (Charles Campbell)
    27. 08:04 AM - Re: Re: Please report in (TOM STINEMETZE)
    28. 08:13 AM - Re: TIG inverter welder? (Charles Campbell)
    29. 09:04 AM - Re: A-65 & O-200 (brian.e.jardine@l-3com.com)
    30. 09:08 AM - Re: welding (Ken Chambers)
    31. 09:24 AM - Re: TIG....no no no (Rick Holland)
    32. 09:25 AM - test msg (dnboyd1@comcast.net)
    33. 09:31 AM - Re: TIG inverter welder? (Ken Chambers)
    34. 09:34 AM - Re: TIG inverter welder? (Michael Perez)
    35. 09:44 AM - Re: test msg (Bill Church)
    36. 09:47 AM - Re: test msg (airlion)
    37. 09:51 AM - Re: welding (Rick Holland)
    38. 09:53 AM - Re: TIG inverter welder=?UTF-8?B?Pw==? (AmsafetyC@aol.com)
    39. 10:53 AM - Re: Covering question (AlRice)
    40. 12:00 PM - Re: Covering question (Ben Charvet)
    41. 01:20 PM - Re: Re: progress (Mike Tunnicliffe)
    42. 01:40 PM - Re: TIG....no no no (Charles Campbell)
    43. 02:14 PM - Re: Please report in (gliderx5@comcast.net)
    44. 03:00 PM - Re: TIG....no no no (hvandervoo@aol.com)
    45. 03:09 PM - Re: Re: progress (Charles Campbell)
    46. 03:12 PM - Re: Covering question (Charles Campbell)
    47. 05:42 PM - Re: Please report in (Dangerous Dave)
    48. 06:55 PM - Re: Re: Please report in (Rick Holland)
 
 
 


Message 1


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    Time: 02:11:30 AM PST US
    From: "Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG FORSCOM" <steven.d.dortch@us.army.mil>
    Subject: Re: looking for Fairchild N81288 (off-topic)
    How about the owners group? http://www.fairchildclub.org/ Blue Skies, Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: looking for Fairchild N81288 (off-topic) > > Thanks to all who responded, especially Hans in Waller, TX... > where Malcolm owns a hangar (or his estate does). > > Now on to the next bit of the trail: the Fairchild may be, or have > been, in Lakeland Florida. It is very obviously no longer in > Malcolm's hangar in Waller, Texas. If anyone in the Lakeland area > knows of a Fairchild or someone who is into old airplanes who > might be aware of it, I'd appreciate any help... off-list, please. > > Oscar Zuniga > Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" > San Antonio, TX > website at http://www.flysquirrel.net > > > >


    Message 2


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    Time: 02:15:34 AM PST US
    From: "Charles Campbell" <cncampbell@windstream.net>
    Subject: Re: TIG inverter welder?
    For what little welding I would have to do on my Piet I don't think I want to spend $2K on a welder. But thanks for the information. I have a good friend who lives about 30 miles away who is an AI who says he can teach me to weld with oxyaccel in a day -- maybe 2. I'm sure I'll go that route. Chuck ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Franklin" <jbfjr@peoplepc.com> Sent: Wednesday, December 15, 2010 8:41 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: TIG inverter welder? > > Ken, > > Weekend before last I took the EAA gas welding class here in Houston, so > obviously I'm a novice, but I can repeat some of the instructor's comments > about TIG and oxyacetylene; > 1. Oxyacetylene is a dying art, only used by individuals. The commercial > world has already gone to TIG. It is getting more and more difficult to > buy welding tips, rods, etc. > 2. A decent TIG rig will cost about $2K. He only recommended Lincoln or > Miller. I think he said Hobart is made by Miller but I'm not sure. > 3. If you can weld oxyacetylene, you can weld with TIG. > > I'm also fairly certain that William Wynne recommends that first-timers > use oxyacetylene on their homebuilts. If you would like the EAA welding > instructor's email address, I'm sure he wouldn't mind answering any > questions you might have. Contact me offline and I'll get you his email > address. > > Best regards, > John F. > > > -----Original Message----- >>From: Ken Chambers <ken.riffic@gmail.com> >>Sent: Dec 15, 2010 1:27 PM >>To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >>Subject: Pietenpol-List: TIG inverter welder? >> >>Anyone have any experience with these? The welder below gets great reviews >>on Amazon. >> >>And it looks like it can handle typical Pietenpol thicknesses. >> >>Amazingly cheap too. >> >> >>Forney 00390 AT-100 ARC-TIG Inverter Welder >> >> >>Ken, who's got to start welding soon. > > > ________________________________________ > > >


    Message 3


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    Time: 04:13:37 AM PST US
    Subject: Please report in
    From: helspersew@aol.com
    Are there any new Piets on track for first arrival at Brodhead 2011? Gene Rambo, please report. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL.


    Message 4


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    Time: 04:50:20 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: looking for Fairchild N81288 (off-topic)
    From: "Jerry Dotson" <jdotson@centurylink.net>
    Oscar I am working on it.( Fairchild N81288) I have a friend in Orlando that goes to Lakeland and lots of grass roots fly-ins in central Florida. He has a pristine J-3. His last name is Dixon but his folks are in Georgia. do not archive -------- Jerry Dotson 59 Daniel Johnson Rd Baker, FL 32531 Started building NX510JD July, 2009 wing, tailfeathers done using Lycoming O-235 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323518#323518


    Message 5


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    Time: 05:01:32 AM PST US
    Subject: Cowl
    From: "pineymb" <airltd@mts.net>
    Any of you guys out there that are running small continental engines, what is you advice regarding openings in the nose cone. Are they required and if so size and location. I have seen pictures of Piets with and without. Any feedback would be greatly appreciated. -------- Adrian M Winnipeg, MB Canada Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323519#323519 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc00333_872.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc00328_124.jpg


    Message 6


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    Time: 05:43:09 AM PST US
    From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri@emory.edu>
    Subject: Re: Cowl
    We run a C-85. Our cowling has openings in the front, but I don't think they're needed. We keep them covered, or could keep them covered, nearly all year. Our engine temp has only gotten over 180 once, as far as I can recall. Maybe start without them, and then if your temps seem high, start cutting. However, I would think that cooling the cylinders and heads is much more important. > >Any of you guys out there that are running small continental >engines, what is you advice regarding openings in the nose cone. > >Are they required and if so size and location. > >I have seen pictures of Piets with and without. > >Any feedback would be greatly appreciated. > >-------- >Adrian M >Winnipeg, MB >Canada > -- --- Jeffrey H. Boatright, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Ophthalmology Emory University School of Medicine Editor-in-Chief Molecular Vision


    Message 7


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    Time: 05:55:19 AM PST US
    From: airlion <airlion@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: Re: Please report in
    I am planning on being there for a first arrival in my Piet. Gardiner Mason ----- Original Message ---- From: "helspersew@aol.com" <helspersew@aol.com> Sent: Thu, December 16, 2010 7:11:12 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Please report in Are there any new Piets on track for first arrival at Brodhead 2011? Gene Rambo, please report. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL.


    Message 8


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    Time: 06:08:26 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Please report in
    From: "Pieti Lowell" <Lowellcfrank@yahoo.com>
    Will be there with Bells on. Need 36 caps. Pieti Lowell Don't archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323526#323526


    Message 9


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    Time: 06:24:22 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: progress
    From: "bender" <jfaith@solairusaviation.com>
    the caning came from Woodcraft... i didn't even know they had it till last week .. i stopped in to pick up the inlay and maple veneer for the dash and just happened to see it.. i bought 2 feet and 10 feet of reed to hold it in place... then looked at a video on youtube to get the basic idea of how to do it.. i don't have a table saw so i marked the width of the groove i needed and carefully cut it with a cordless circular saw it's actually very comfortable to sit on and easy to do jeff Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323528#323528


    Message 10


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    Time: 06:26:06 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Please report in
    From: "bender" <jfaith@solairusaviation.com>
    i have dreams but.... like Mr Cuy says... plan on double the time jeff Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323529#323529


    Message 11


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    Time: 06:52:12 AM PST US
    From: "TOM STINEMETZE" <TOMS@mcpcity.com>
    Subject: Re: Please report in
    Speaking of Mr. Cuy. Why isn't your name on that official list of project builders/owners? I believe you might barely qualify. Stinemetze >>> "bender" <jfaith@solairusaviation.com> 12/16/2010 8:24 AM >>> i have dreams but.... like Mr Cuy says... plan on double the time jeff


    Message 12


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    Time: 06:53:43 AM PST US
    From: Michael Perez <speedbrake@sbcglobal.net>
    Subject: Re: TIG inverter welder?
    I am not all that experienced with TIG welding, but I am successful at it. I love to weld now and it is quite easy to TIG just about anything. All of my welds are TIG. Takes some time and practice...it took me about 5-10 hours of actual welding to feel very comfortable doing steel stainless and even some aluminum. Michael Perez Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com


    Message 13


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    Time: 06:57:45 AM PST US
    From: jeff wilson <jlwilsonnn@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: Please report in
    ------ Here is two possibilities. EAA chapter 64, KCPS, is buil ding a Piet under the sub group "Scrounge Dawgs". We wanted to have it done for last years reunion but I think that was more of a rallying point. It c ould happen this year though, all we have left to build is the Center wing section. ------ I am also building my own Piet and I expect it to be rea dy to fly this summer BUT it may be a close shave considering 50 hour fly o ff time plus my own flying experience does not include any conventional gea r time. ----- So look for- a basic green colored "Scrounge Dawg" Piet o r mine is N899WT and will be painted in Army Air Corps trainer Blue and Yel low. Jeff Wilson St. Louis H49 --- On Thu, 12/16/10, helspersew@aol.com <helspersew@aol.com> wrote: From: helspersew@aol.com <helspersew@aol.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Please report in Are there any new Piets on track for first arrival at Brodhead 2011? Gene Rambo, please report. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL. le, List Admin. =0A=0A=0A


    Message 14


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    Time: 07:00:01 AM PST US
    From: Michael Perez <speedbrake@sbcglobal.net>
    Subject: Re: Please report in
    My plane will not be there, but I myself may actually make the trip to get a feel for what it is all about. (in prep. for my "official" arrival in 2012...maybe.) Michael Perez Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com Do Not Archive


    Message 15


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    Time: 07:03:25 AM PST US
    From: "Jim Birke" <jimbir@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Covering question
    We are building an air camper with a three piece wing. according to the plans, there is a 2-3/8" gap between the wing panel butt rib and the center section butt rib. Since this is the separation point between the two panels, what is done with this gap when covering the wing? We don't see any way of supporting the covering at the butt end of the center section. Thanks, Jim Birke Ira G. Ross Aerospace museum Restoration facility Niagara Falls N.Y.


    Message 16


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    Time: 07:37:39 AM PST US
    From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg@earthlink.net>
    Subject: welding
    I've been welding for 30 years in various capacities, and probably weld every other day in my sculpting studio. Learned on Oxyacetylene, then learned stick, mig and tig. I'm not expert welder, but I've worked with them all. MIG welding, commonly called "wire feed" is one of the most common welding methods out there because it's real fast. It is however, not recommended for airplane construction as it is difficult to control the quality of the weld and penetration to the degree required. I'm sure a top welder could produce a serviceable aircraft structure, but it's tricky for most guys. Stick welding is not for airplanes. Gas welding or Oxyacetylene welding uses two tanks of gas, oxygen and acetylene to produce an actual flame which is used to do the welding. It has been used forever on aircraft and can produce great welds. More heat is generated over a larger area than the electric welding methods, which can cause problems, but can also be used to straighten things. A gas rig is cheaper than most tig rigs. Tig welding to me, really feels a lot like gas welding as you're holding the torch in one hand, and the filler rod in the other. Tig to me is the way to go, though the machines are expensive. They easily weld steel, stainless and aluminum, and lots of other metals. I much prefer tig welding, and as stated earlier by others, is now the standard aircraft welding method worldwide. I find it requires about the same amount of technique as gas, is cleaner and faster and very, very handy around the shop. I also have a gas rig though for other jobs like brazing, silver soldering, stress relieving and removing warps. Douwe


    Message 17


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    Time: 07:39:52 AM PST US
    From: "Jack Phillips" <pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: Covering question
    Hi Jim, I used a 4" wide strip of .025" thick 2024-T3 aluminum to cover the gap. I drilled #10 holes about 4" apart and screwed the fairings directly to the ribs of the wing root and centersection butt with # 10 sheet metal screws. The fairings are each one piece, starting at the trailing edge, wrapping around the leading edge and back to the trailing edge. As you can see in the picture below, I started by screwing the bottom of the trailing edge to the ribs, then wrapped around the leaading edge and put tension on the strip with a weight (the cinder block you see hanging from the strip) to hold it tight while I got all the screw holes done. Once the holes were positioned, I trimmed the trailing edge and tucked it under the fairing on the bottom of the wing so there was not an edge exposed to the slipstream. They have worked just fine for 5 years and over 200 hours of flying. Good luck! Jack Phillips NX899JP "Icarus Plummet" Raleigh, NC _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Birke Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 10:03 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Covering question We are building an air camper with a three piece wing. according to the plans, there is a 2-3/8" gap between the wing panel butt rib and the center section butt rib. Since this is the separation point between the two panels, what is done with this gap when covering the wing? We don't see any way of supporting the covering at the butt end of the center section. Thanks, Jim Birke Ira G. Ross Aerospace museum Restoration facility Niagara Falls N.Y.


    Message 18


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    Time: 07:43:36 AM PST US
    From: "Charles Campbell" <cncampbell@windstream.net>
    Subject: Re: Please report in
    I'm going to try, but probably won't make it this year. There is still a LOT to do! Chuck ----- Original Message ----- From: <helspersew@aol.com> Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 7:11 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Please report in > > Are there any new Piets on track for first arrival at Brodhead 2011? > > Gene Rambo, please report. > > Dan Helsper > Poplar Grove, IL. > > >


    Message 19


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    Time: 07:44:40 AM PST US
    From: "Douwe Blumberg" <douweblumberg@earthlink.net>
    Subject: welding
    I've been welding for 30 years in various capacities, and probably weld every other day in my sculpting studio. Learned on Oxyacetylene, then learned stick, mig and tig. I'm not expert welder, but I've worked with them all. MIG welding, commonly called "wire feed" is one of the most common welding methods out there because it's real fast. It is however, not recommended for airplane construction as it is difficult to control the quality of the weld and penetration to the degree required. I'm sure a top welder could produce a serviceable aircraft structure, but it's tricky for most guys. Stick welding is not for airplanes. Gas welding or Oxyacetylene welding uses two tanks of gas, oxygen and acetylene to produce an actual flame which is used to do the welding. It has been used forever on aircraft and can produce great welds. More heat is generated over a larger area than the electric welding methods, which can cause problems, but can also be used to straighten things. A gas rig is cheaper than most tig rigs. Tig welding to me, really feels a lot like gas welding as you're holding the torch in one hand, and the filler rod in the other. Tig to me is the way to go, though the machines are expensive. They easily weld steel, stainless and aluminum, and lots of other metals. I much prefer tig welding, and as stated earlier by others, is now the standard aircraft welding method worldwide. I find it requires about the same amount of technique as gas, is cleaner and faster and very, very handy around the shop. I also have a gas rig though for other jobs like brazing, silver soldering, stress relieving and removing warps. Douwe


    Message 20


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    Time: 07:50:42 AM PST US
    From: "Charles Campbell" <cncampbell@windstream.net>
    Subject: Re: Please report in
    I know that was for Jeff but I know my name is probably not on that list either. How do I make the team? Chuck ----- Original Message ----- From: TOM STINEMETZE To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 9:49 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Please report in Speaking of Mr. Cuy. Why isn't your name on that official list of project builders/owners? I believe you might barely qualify. Stinemetze >>> "bender" <jfaith@solairusaviation.com> 12/16/2010 8:24 AM >>> i have dreams but.... like Mr Cuy says... plan on double the time jeff


    Message 21


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    Time: 07:54:05 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: progress
    From: "AlRice" <Allen@allenrice.net>
    Thanks for the info on the seat, Jeff. Hope you don't mind if I copy you. Very vintage! -------- Al Rice Skybolt 260 RV-9A Helping with my grandson's Piet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323546#323546


    Message 22


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    Time: 07:55:00 AM PST US
    From: "Charles Campbell" <cncampbell@windstream.net>
    Subject: Re: Please report in
    Unless things have changed I believe you only need 40 hours fly-off time. Is that correct or have they changed the rules? ----- Original Message ----- From: jeff wilson To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 9:55 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Please report in Here is two possibilities. EAA chapter 64, KCPS, is building a Piet under the sub group "Scrounge Dawgs". We wanted to have it done for last years reunion but I think that was more of a rallying point. It could happen this year though, all we have left to build is the Center wing section. I am also building my own Piet and I expect it to be ready to fly this summer BUT it may be a close shave considering 50 hour fly off time plus my own flying experience does not include any conventional gear time. So look for a basic green colored "Scrounge Dawg" Piet or mine is N899WT and will be painted in Army Air Corps trainer Blue and Yellow. Jeff Wilson St. Louis H49 --- On Thu, 12/16/10, helspersew@aol.com <helspersew@aol.com> wrote: From: helspersew@aol.com <helspersew@aol.com> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Please report in To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Date: Thursday, December 16, 2010, 6:11 AM Are there any new Piets on track for first arrival at Brodhead 2011? Gen-= November is the Annual List Fund -======================== ; - -> http://======================


    Message 23


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    Time: 07:56:34 AM PST US
    From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri@emory.edu>
    Subject: Re: Covering question
    We used a pair of aluminum strips as Jack did, but over the years they got beat up and never fit that well. Plus, if you mess around with dihedral, their holes won't match the holes in the ribs any more. These days we use tarp tape. Several flights in freezing temps so far this winter and no problems. I bought it at: http://www.bacindustries.com/product3-tarp-access-3x108-tarp-tape-white.php One roll should last several Piets through several annuals. No doubt some paint will be lost at the next annual, though we plan just to slit it for inspect and then patch over. White over white won't be seen from 2 feet away. >We are building an air camper with a three piece wing. according to >the plans, there is a 2-3/8" gap between the wing panel butt rib and >the center section butt rib. Since this is the separation point >between the two panels, what is done with this gap when covering the >wing? We don't see any way of supporting the covering at the butt >end of the center section. > >Thanks, > >Jim Birke >Ira G. Ross Aerospace museum >Restoration facility >Niagara Falls N.Y. -- Jeff Boatright "Now let's think about this..."


    Message 24


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    Time: 07:56:35 AM PST US
    From: "Charles Campbell" <cncampbell@windstream.net>
    Subject: Re: Please report in
    Come on, Michael. You are certainly far enough along to be ready this year (2011). ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael Perez To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 9:57 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Please report in My plane will not be there, but I myself may actually make the trip to get a feel for what it is all about. (in prep. for my "official" arrival in 2012...maybe.) Michael Perez Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com Do Not Archive


    Message 25


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    Time: 07:57:28 AM PST US
    From: Jeff Boatright <jboatri@emory.edu>
    Subject: Re: Please report in
    I hope to finally make Brodhead in a Piet in 2011. -- Jeff Boatright "Now let's think about this..."


    Message 26


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    Time: 07:59:22 AM PST US
    From: "Charles Campbell" <cncampbell@windstream.net>
    Subject: Re: Covering question
    I was planning to cover the gap with a strip of aluminum. That could also be the ground plane for a VHF antenna if you planning on having a radio. ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Birke To: Pietenpol list Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 10:03 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Covering question We are building an air camper with a three piece wing. according to the plans, there is a 2-3/8" gap between the wing panel butt rib and the center section butt rib. Since this is the separation point between the two panels, what is done with this gap when covering the wing? We don't see any way of supporting the covering at the butt end of the center section. Thanks, Jim Birke Ira G. Ross Aerospace museum Restoration facility Niagara Falls N.Y.


    Message 27


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    Time: 08:04:18 AM PST US
    From: "TOM STINEMETZE" <TOMS@mcpcity.com>
    Subject: Re: Please report in
    Chuck: Jack Textor posted an e-mail a couple of days ago with an Excel spreadsheet template which I have attached below. Just fill it out and e-mail it back to him directly. I believe his e-mail address is: jack@textors.com Stinemetze >>> "Charles Campbell" <cncampbell@windstream.net> 12/16/2010 9:48 AM >>> I know that was for Jeff but I know my name is probably not on that list either. How do I make the team? Chuck


    Message 28


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    Time: 08:13:00 AM PST US
    From: "Charles Campbell" <cncampbell@windstream.net>
    Subject: Re: TIG inverter welder?
    Michael, do you own your own TIG outfit or are you fortunate enough to know someone who does? Chuck ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael Perez To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 9:51 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: TIG inverter welder? I am not all that experienced with TIG welding, but I am successful at it. I love to weld now and it is quite easy to TIG just about anything. All of my welds are TIG. Takes some time and practice...it took me about 5-10 hours of actual welding to feel very comfortable doing steel stainless and even some aluminum. Michael Perez Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com


    Message 29


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    Time: 09:04:59 AM PST US
    From: brian.e.jardine@l-3com.com
    Subject: A-65 & O-200
    Group, Just thought I'd pass this along...I purchase a fuel tank from this Gent and he also has (2) - A-65's for sale as well as an O-200. Here are the pics. If you are interested contact me off list for his info at Brian.e.jardine@L-3com.com Brian http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List http://forums.matronics.com


    Message 30


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    Time: 09:08:11 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: welding
    From: Ken Chambers <ken.riffic@gmail.com>
    Thanks Douwe. Good info. Have you worked with any of the cheap TIG welders, like this one? http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-key words=tig+regulator&x=0&y=0 Although it's not as cheap as it seems because you still need the $214 torc h and a regulator, as someone else pointed out. Ken On Thu, Dec 16, 2010 at 9:23 AM, Douwe Blumberg <douweblumberg@earthlink.ne t > wrote: > I=92ve been welding for 30 years in various capacities, and probably wel d > every other day in my sculpting studio. Learned on Oxyacetylene, then > learned stick, mig and tig. I=92m not expert welder, but I=92ve worked w ith > them all. > > > MIG welding, commonly called =93wire feed=94 is one of the most common we lding > methods out there because it=92s real fast. It is however, not recommend ed > for airplane construction as it is difficult to control the quality of th e > weld and penetration to the degree required. I=92m sure a top welder cou ld > produce a serviceable aircraft structure, but it=92s tricky for most guys . > > > Stick welding is not for airplanes. > > > Gas welding or Oxyacetylene welding uses two tanks of gas, oxygen and > acetylene to produce an actual flame which is used to do the welding. It > has been used forever on aircraft and can produce great welds. More heat is > generated over a larger area than the electric welding methods, which can > cause problems, but can also be used to straighten things. A gas rig is > cheaper than most tig rigs. > > > Tig welding to me, really feels a lot like gas welding as you=92re holdin g > the torch in one hand, and the filler rod in the other. Tig to me is the > way to go, though the machines are expensive. They easily weld steel, > stainless and aluminum, and lots of other metals. > > > I much prefer tig welding, and as stated earlier by others, is now the > standard aircraft welding method worldwide. I find it requires about the > same amount of technique as gas, is cleaner and faster and very, very han dy > around the shop. I also have a gas rig though for other jobs like brazin g, > silver soldering, stress relieving and removing warps. > > > Douwe > > * > =========== =========== =========== ============* > > -- Ken Chambers 512-796-1798


    Message 31


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    Time: 09:24:57 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: TIG....no no no
    From: Rick Holland <at7000ft@gmail.com>
    Use whichever you have more confidence in doing and can afford. I took gas and tig welding classes at a local community college. TIG was so much easier for me that I went that direction. If you've got gas just buy some Beano. Since we are on the subject of welding, it has been over a year since a "Is post heating stress relief necessary" argument thread has happened. On Wed, Dec 15, 2010 at 3:24 PM, jeff wilson <jlwilsonnn@yahoo.com> wrote: > No. Go gas. You will be able to do everything except under water welding. > And I don't take you for a submariner. > > Do Not Archive. > > --- On *Wed, 12/15/10, Charles Campbell <cncampbell@windstream.net>*wrote: > > > From: Charles Campbell <cncampbell@windstream.net> > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: TIG inverter welder? > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Date: Wednesday, December 15, 2010, 3:44 PM > > I need to start. Where can I find info on the welder mentioned? chuck > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Ken Chambers <http://mc/compose?to=ken.riffic@gmail.com> > *To:* pietenpol-list@matronics.com<http://mc/compose?to=pietenpol-list@matronics.com> > *Sent:* Wednesday, December 15, 2010 2:27 PM > *Subject:* Pietenpol-List: TIG inverter welder? > > > Anyone have any experience with these? The welder below gets great reviews > on Amazon. > > And it looks like it can handle typical Pietenpol thicknesses. > > Amazingly cheap too. > > > Forney 00390 AT-100 ARC-TIG Inverter Welder > > > Ken, who's got to start welding soon. > > * > > href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com > href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com > href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/chref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > * > > * > http://www.matronics.com/cot="_blank" href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">htt --> * > > > * > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"


    Message 32


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    Time: 09:25:40 AM PST US
    From: dnboyd1@comcast.net
    Subject: test msg
    trying to figure out how to post a message D. Boyd, Champaign IL


    Message 33


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    Time: 09:31:15 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: TIG inverter welder?
    From: Ken Chambers <ken.riffic@gmail.com>
    Thanks John. Good to know. I don't need to weld aluminum, but anything that makes it easier to learn is a plus. On Thu, Dec 16, 2010 at 12:06 AM, <AMsafetyC@aol.com> wrote: > The unit is a DC only unit which means you cannot TIG weld aluminum which > requires AC current to do. Additionally there is no foot pedal to control > the Amperage (heat) and you will more then likely have to scratch to start > the arc which eventually contaminates the tungsten. By the time you add the > torch, argon gauge and regulator you will still not be able to do much more > than advertised. The big come on is they are TIG units, however you never > get the full measure or range of usage out of it. If you decide to go that > way I may be selling one of my hi freq arc initiator boxes which will get > you away from scratch starting but will not give you foot control and > or aluminum capabilities. > > This really depends on what you're looking for as far as a TIG rig > > John > > In a message dated 12/15/2010 4:08:32 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > ken.riffic@gmail.com writes: > > Forney 00390 AT-100 ARC-TIG Inverter Welder > > > * > > > * > > -- Ken Chambers 512-796-1798


    Message 34


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    Time: 09:34:50 AM PST US
    From: Michael Perez <speedbrake@sbcglobal.net>
    Subject: Re: TIG inverter welder?
    I do not have my own rig Charles, but have access to one. Michael Perez Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com Do Not Archive


    Message 35


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    Time: 09:44:12 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: test msg
    From: "Bill Church" <billspiet@sympatico.ca>
    Be sure to let us know if you figure it out. :) BC do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323571#323571


    Message 36


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    Time: 09:47:58 AM PST US
    From: airlion <airlion@bellsouth.net>
    Subject: Re: test msg
    you just did. har har har ________________________________ From: "dnboyd1@comcast.net" <dnboyd1@comcast.net> Sent: Thu, December 16, 2010 12:22:48 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: test msg trying to figure out how to post a message D. Boyd, Champaign IL


    Message 37


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    Time: 09:51:51 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: welding
    From: Rick Holland <at7000ft@gmail.com>
    And it doesn't look like the cheap ones do AC needed for aluminum. Not a bi g deal on a Piet, I only needed to do aluminum welding on my fuel tank, you can just do a riveted fuel tank. rick On Thu, Dec 16, 2010 at 10:03 AM, Ken Chambers <ken.riffic@gmail.com> wrote : > > Thanks Douwe. Good info. > > Have you worked with any of the cheap TIG welders, like this one? > > http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-k eywords=tig+regulator&x=0&y=0 > > Although it's not as cheap as it seems because you still need the $214 > torch and a regulator, as someone else pointed out. > > Ken > > > On Thu, Dec 16, 2010 at 9:23 AM, Douwe Blumberg < > douweblumberg@earthlink.net> wrote: > >> I=92ve been welding for 30 years in various capacities, and probably we ld >> every other day in my sculpting studio. Learned on Oxyacetylene, then >> learned stick, mig and tig. I=92m not expert welder, but I=92ve worked with >> them all. >> >> >> >> MIG welding, commonly called =93wire feed=94 is one of the most common w elding >> methods out there because it=92s real fast. It is however, not recommen ded >> for airplane construction as it is difficult to control the quality of t he >> weld and penetration to the degree required. I=92m sure a top welder co uld >> produce a serviceable aircraft structure, but it=92s tricky for most guy s. >> >> >> >> Stick welding is not for airplanes. >> >> >> >> Gas welding or Oxyacetylene welding uses two tanks of gas, oxygen and >> acetylene to produce an actual flame which is used to do the welding. I t >> has been used forever on aircraft and can produce great welds. More hea t is >> generated over a larger area than the electric welding methods, which ca n >> cause problems, but can also be used to straighten things. A gas rig is >> cheaper than most tig rigs. >> >> >> >> Tig welding to me, really feels a lot like gas welding as you=92re holdi ng >> the torch in one hand, and the filler rod in the other. Tig to me is th e >> way to go, though the machines are expensive. They easily weld steel, >> stainless and aluminum, and lots of other metals. >> >> >> >> I much prefer tig welding, and as stated earlier by others, is now the >> standard aircraft welding method worldwide. I find it requires about th e >> same amount of technique as gas, is cleaner and faster and very, very ha ndy >> around the shop. I also have a gas rig though for other jobs like brazi ng, >> silver soldering, stress relieving and removing warps. >> >> >> >> Douwe >> >> * >> >> _blank">www.aeroelectric.com >> .com" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com >> ="_blank">www.homebuilthelp.com >> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >> tp://forums.matronics.com* >> >> > > > -- > Ken Chambers > 512-796-1798 > > * > =========== =========== =========== ============* > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"


    Message 38


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    Time: 09:53:59 AM PST US
    From: "AmsafetyC@aol.com" <AmsafetyC@aol.com>
    Subject: Re: TIG inverter welder=?UTF-8?B?Pw==?
    Al may be in your future if you plan on fuel tanks. 032 material needs Rig with a pedal and icy makes it disappear into transparent aluminum. You may want to set your sights on doing aluminum then have to set up for it after the fact John Diversity of alternatives gives many more options for skinning that cat Do no archive John Sent via DROID on Verizon Wireless -----Original message----- From: Ken Chambers <ken.riffic@gmail.com> Sent: Thu, Dec 16, 2010 17:31:36 GMT+00:00 Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: TIG inverter welder? Thanks John. Good to know. I don't need to weld aluminum, but anything that makes it easier to learn is a plus. On Thu, Dec 16, 2010 at 12:06 AM, <AMsafetyC@aol.com> wrote: > The unit is a DC only unit which means you cannot TIG weld aluminum which > requires AC current to do. Additionally there is no foot pedal to control > the Amperage (heat) and you will more then likely have to scratch to start > the arc which eventually contaminates the tungsten. By the time you add the > torch, argon gauge and regulator you will still not be able to do much more > than advertised. The big come on is they are TIG units, however you never > get the full measure or range of usage out of it. If you decide to go that > way I may be selling one of my hi freq arc initiator boxes which will get > you away from scratch starting but will not give you foot control and > or aluminum capabilities. > > This really depends on what you're looking for as far as a TIG rig > > John > > In a message dated 12/15/2010 4:08:32 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > ken.riffic@gmail.com writes: > > Forney 00390 AT-100 ARC-TIG Inverter Welder > > > * > > > * > > -- Ken Chambers 512-796-1798


    Message 39


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    Time: 10:53:45 AM PST US
    Subject: Re: Covering question
    From: "AlRice" <Allen@allenrice.net>
    I glued 1/16" plywood on the faces of the butt ribs to provide an attachment for the covering and seal the wings and center section from the weather. Hope this helps. -------- Al Rice Skybolt 260 RV-9A Helping with my grandson's Piet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323582#323582


    Message 40


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    Time: 12:00:35 PM PST US
    From: Ben Charvet <bencharvet@gmail.com>
    Subject: Re: Covering question
    I used strips of aluminum with #8 wood screws into the ribs on both sides. I don't think I'd want to mount my antenna on aluminum that thin though. Ben Charvet On 12/16/2010 10:57 AM, Charles Campbell wrote: > I was planning to cover the gap with a strip of aluminum. That could > also be the ground plane for a VHF antenna if you planning on having a > radio. > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Jim Birke <mailto:jimbir@yahoo.com> > *To:* Pietenpol list <mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com> > *Sent:* Thursday, December 16, 2010 10:03 AM > *Subject:* Pietenpol-List: Covering question > > We are building an air camper with a three piece wing. according > to the plans, there is a 2-3/8" gap between the wing panel butt > rib and the center section butt rib. Since this is the separation > point between the two panels, what is done with this gap when > covering the wing? We don't see any way of supporting the covering > at the butt end of the center section. > Thanks, > Jim Birke > Ira G. Ross Aerospace museum > Restoration facility > Niagara Falls N.Y. > > * > > href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com > href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com > href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com > href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/chref="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com > * > > * > > *


    Message 41


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    Time: 01:20:56 PM PST US
    From: "Mike Tunnicliffe" <zk-owl@CLEAR.NET.NZ>
    Subject: Re: progress
    It looks very nice but will it handle your weight x 6 G? And if it did collapse in turbulence would you still be able to operate the controls? Regards Mike T. ----- Original Message ----- From: "bender" <jfaith@solairusaviation.com> Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 3:22 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: progress > <jfaith@solairusaviation.com> > > the caning came from Woodcraft... i didn't even know they had it till last > week .. i stopped in to pick up the inlay and maple veneer for the dash > and just happened to see it.. > i bought 2 feet and 10 feet of reed to hold it in place... then looked at > a video on youtube to get the basic idea of how to do it.. > i don't have a table saw so i marked the width of the groove i needed and > carefully cut it with a cordless circular saw > it's actually very comfortable to sit on and easy to do > > jeff > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323528#323528 > > >


    Message 42


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    Time: 01:40:12 PM PST US
    From: "Charles Campbell" <cncampbell@windstream.net>
    Subject: Re: TIG....no no no
    William Wynne thinks it is. ----- Original Message ----- From: Rick Holland To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 12:14 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: TIG....no no no Use whichever you have more confidence in doing and can afford. I took gas and tig welding classes at a local community college. TIG was so much easier for me that I went that direction. If you've got gas just buy some Beano. Since we are on the subject of welding, it has been over a year since a "Is post heating stress relief necessary" argument thread has happened. On Wed, Dec 15, 2010 at 3:24 PM, jeff wilson <jlwilsonnn@yahoo.com> wrote: No. Go gas. You will be able to do everything except under water welding. And I don't take you for a submariner. Do Not Archive. --- On Wed, 12/15/10, Charles Campbell <cncampbell@windstream.net> wrote: From: Charles Campbell <cncampbell@windstream.net> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: TIG inverter welder? To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Date: Wednesday, December 15, 2010, 3:44 PM I need to start. Where can I find info on the welder mentioned? chuck ----- Original Message ----- From: Ken Chambers To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Wednesday, December 15, 2010 2:27 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: TIG inverter welder? Anyone have any experience with these? The welder below gets great reviews on Amazon. And it looks like it can handle typical Pietenpol thicknesses. Amazingly cheap too. Forney 00390 AT-100 ARC-TIG Inverter Welder Ken, who's got to start welding soon. href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.comhref="http:/ /www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.mat ronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.comhttp://ww w.matronics.com/cot="_blank" href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">htt --> _blank">www.aeroelectric.com .com" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com ="_blank">www.homebuilthelp.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List tp://forums.matronics.com -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"


    Message 43


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    Time: 02:14:30 PM PST US
    From: gliderx5@comcast.net
    Subject: Re: Please report in
    It's probably a long shot, but I hope to make it. Still lots to do! Malcolm Morrison http://home.comcast.net/~mmorrison123/piet.html ----- Original Message ----- From: helspersew@aol.com Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 7:11:12 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Please report in Are there any new Piets on track for first arrival at Brodhead 2011? Gene Rambo, please report. Dan Helsper Poplar Grove, IL.


    Message 44


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    Time: 03:00:55 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: TIG....no no no
    From: hvandervoo@aol.com
    I prefer TIG over gas welding as produces better joints as heat is more con centrated and easier controlled. Post welding reheating aka Stress relieving is not always necessary. But is recommended in high stress areas: Wing attachment point, motor mounts and landing gear attachment points In short when in doubt, stress relief. Hans NX 15 KV


    Message 45


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    Time: 03:09:38 PM PST US
    From: "Charles Campbell" <cncampbell@windstream.net>
    Subject: Re: progress
    Yeah! I'm copying him, also. Chuck ----- Original Message ----- From: "AlRice" <Allen@allenrice.net> Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 10:51 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: progress > > Thanks for the info on the seat, Jeff. Hope you don't mind if I copy you. > Very vintage! > > -------- > Al Rice > Skybolt 260 > RV-9A > Helping with my grandson's Piet > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323546#323546 > > >


    Message 46


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    Time: 03:12:41 PM PST US
    From: "Charles Campbell" <cncampbell@windstream.net>
    Subject: Re: Covering question
    I like the tarp tape idea! ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Birke To: Pietenpol list Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2010 10:03 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Covering question We are building an air camper with a three piece wing. according to the plans, there is a 2-3/8" gap between the wing panel butt rib and the center section butt rib. Since this is the separation point between the two panels, what is done with this gap when covering the wing? We don't see any way of supporting the covering at the butt end of the center section. Thanks, Jim Birke Ira G. Ross Aerospace museum Restoration facility Niagara Falls N.Y.


    Message 47


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    Time: 05:42:12 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Please report in
    From: "Dangerous Dave" <dsornbor@aol.com>
    Covering over Xmas week,see no reason can't make it.Maybe Rick and I can fly out together.Dave NX59061 -------- Covering Piet Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323620#323620


    Message 48


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    Time: 06:55:53 PM PST US
    Subject: Re: Please report in
    From: Rick Holland <at7000ft@gmail.com>
    Ah, ... yea maybe. rick On Thu, Dec 16, 2010 at 6:39 PM, Dangerous Dave <dsornbor@aol.com> wrote: > > Covering over Xmas week,see no reason can't make it.Maybe Rick and I can > fly out together.Dave NX59061 > > -------- > Covering Piet > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323620#323620 > > -- Rick Holland Castle Rock, Colorado "Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"




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