Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:06 AM - Please report in (Oscar Zuniga)
2. 06:06 AM - Looking for Fairchild N81288 (off-topic) (Oscar Zuniga)
3. 06:07 AM - Cowl (Oscar Zuniga)
4. 06:33 AM - cheap tig welders (Douwe Blumberg)
5. 06:44 AM - Re: Cowl (Charles Campbell)
6. 06:45 AM - Re: Looking for Fairchild N81288 (off-topic) (Dortch, Steven D MAJ NG NG FORSCOM)
7. 06:54 AM - Re: Please report in (AmsafetyC@aol.com)
8. 07:04 AM - Re: Please report in (GliderMike)
9. 07:21 AM - firewall size (GliderMike)
10. 07:24 AM - Re: Re: Please report in (AmsafetyC@aol.com)
11. 07:24 AM - Re: Please report in (TOM STINEMETZE)
12. 07:34 AM - Re: runway length? (Kip and Beth Gardner)
13. 07:34 AM - Re: New Piets for Brodhead 2011 (Woodflier@aol.com)
14. 07:41 AM - Re: Re: Please report in (Gboothe5)
15. 07:48 AM - Re: runway length? (Gary Boothe)
16. 08:05 AM - Re: Re: New Piets for Brodhead 2011 (Jack Phillips)
17. 08:40 AM - Re: runway length? (hvandervoo@aol.com)
18. 08:41 AM - Re: firewall size (hvandervoo@aol.com)
19. 09:13 AM - Re: Please report in (AmsafetyC@aol.com)
20. 09:15 AM - Re: Please report in (Kenneth Howe)
21. 09:15 AM - Re: runway length? (Jeff Boatright)
22. 09:24 AM - Re: runway length? (Kip and Beth Gardner)
23. 12:10 PM - Re: runway length? (airlion)
24. 12:33 PM - Re: runway length? (Clif Dawson)
25. 12:35 PM - Re: runway length? (Kip and Beth Gardner)
26. 12:47 PM - Re: Please report in (Rick Holland)
27. 12:49 PM - Re: runway length? (Kip and Beth Gardner)
28. 12:54 PM - PLEASE Help on Gear Fittings (Jack)
29. 01:09 PM - Re: runway length? (Dan Yocum)
30. 01:32 PM - Re: runway length? (Dan Yocum)
31. 01:41 PM - Re: runway length? (Kringle)
32. 01:45 PM - New Stewart Systems, Hanger 21 Covering system (dnboyd1@comcast.net)
33. 02:08 PM - Re: runway length? (Gary Boothe)
34. 02:20 PM - Re: New Stewart Systems, Hanger 21 Covering system (Rick Holland)
35. 02:37 PM - Re: New Stewart Systems, Hanger 21 Covering system (gliderx5@comcast.net)
36. 02:59 PM - Re: runway length? (Jerry Dotson)
37. 03:33 PM - Re: Please report in (GliderMike)
38. 03:37 PM - Re: firewall size (GliderMike)
39. 03:51 PM - Re: PLEASE Help on Gear Fittings (Andrew M Eldredge)
40. 04:06 PM - Re: PLEASE Help on Gear Fittings (Dangerous Dave)
41. 04:14 PM - Re: runway length? (Dangerous Dave)
42. 04:45 PM - Re: runway length? (Jeff Boatright)
43. 05:30 PM - Re: runway length? (Pieti Lowell)
44. 08:57 PM - Re: New Stewart Systems, Hanger 21 Covering system (hvandervoo@aol.com)
45. 08:59 PM - Re: Re: firewall size (hvandervoo@aol.com)
46. 09:31 PM - Re: New Stewart Systems, Hanger 21 Covering system (Jeff E.)
47. 10:16 PM - Re: Covering question (Doug Dever)
Message 1
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Subject: | Please report in |
Dan asked:
>Are there any new Piets on track for first arrival at Brodhead 2011?
Define "new". We're talking about a 1929 design here ;o)
The year 2011 will be my best shot at ever making it to Brodhead with
Scout since I will turn 60 on July 28 and that buys me all kinds of
sympathy with my wife. I've had the charts and routes all planned for
several years but may make some minor tweaks to the route next year
since I will probably fly two-up with my hangar mate Craig Wall and he
is a Tulsa boy. May have to veer into Markle territory.
Craig is re-engining his Cassutt and has promised to let me fly it
when it's back in the air. I have dreamed of flying a Cassutt ever
since my old instructor Charlie used to fly his little screamer,
"Hiccup", at my old home base of Laredo International.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"
San Antonio, TX
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 2
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Subject: | Looking for Fairchild N81288 (off-topic) |
Jerry wrote:
>Oscar I am working on it.( Fairchild N81288)
Steve Dortch suggested I try the Fairchild owners' group.
Thanks for the help, guys. I had forgotten that my friend
David Stroud from the Corvair list is building a Fairchild
replica (though not the 24W) and is on that list, so he's
put the word out too. We'll see what turns up.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"
San Antonio, TX
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 3
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Adrian asked-
>Any of you guys out there that are running small continental engines,
>what is your advice regarding openings in the nose cone. Are they
>required and if so size and location.
Scout has run an A65 and presently is running an A75. No openings in
the nose cone, no cooling problems, and we are in south Texas where 95F
in the summertime is considered a cool day.
Like Jack, I think I have only seen 180F on the oil temp one time on my
A75 and that was in the middle of the summer after a climb to 4500', with
less than 20 hours on the engine since major overhaul so it was (and is)
still quite tight. Most of the time it will settle around 160 in level
cruise, but it takes a while to get to that temp in cooler weather.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"
San Antonio, TX
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 4
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Subject: | cheap tig welders |
No, I have not used one of the cheaper, smaller tig welders. My GUESS (and
it's only a guess) is that they'd probably be powerful enough for pretty
much anything you'd need to weld on an airplane, but they might be trickier
to start as they probably don't have a HF start capability, which is okay,
just have to strike it to start.
I'd also question how they do with aluminum as aluminum requires MUCH more
heat and amperage to weld then the equivalent thickness of steel.
That's about all I can say about that.
RE Brodhead 2011. I'd sure like to be ready, but am seriously doubting it
now with my intense work schedule, but we'll see. I keep plugging away.
Wings are done, and recovered, new wheels almost done. Have to recover
fuselage, finish cowling, hook up engine, make new gas tank and then see if
my engine needs an overhaul or not as it's been sitting for a while.
Douwe
Message 5
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I guess I'm confused. What do you mean "no openings in the nose cone?"
Most of the aircooled engines I have seen on Aircampers have the "rabbit
ears" above the cylinders and heads to direct cooling air down through the
engine.
Chuck
----- Original Message -----
From: "Oscar Zuniga" <taildrags@hotmail.com>
Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 9:05 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Cowl
>
>
> Adrian asked-
>
>>Any of you guys out there that are running small continental engines,
>>what is your advice regarding openings in the nose cone. Are they
>>required and if so size and location.
>
> Scout has run an A65 and presently is running an A75. No openings in
> the nose cone, no cooling problems, and we are in south Texas where 95F
> in the summertime is considered a cool day.
>
> Like Jack, I think I have only seen 180F on the oil temp one time on my
> A75 and that was in the middle of the summer after a climb to 4500', with
> less than 20 hours on the engine since major overhaul so it was (and is)
> still quite tight. Most of the time it will settle around 160 in level
> cruise, but it takes a while to get to that temp in cooler weather.
>
> Oscar Zuniga
> Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"
> San Antonio, TX
> website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
>
>
>
Message 6
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Subject: | Re: Looking for Fairchild N81288 (off-topic) |
When I (meaning my wife) decided we should move up to a 4 seat airplane from my
1959 Cessna 150, I started looking at anything with 4 seats. So I called this
guy trying to sell a Fairchild 24R (with the Ranger engine, inverted.) Once I
found out that they would carry 4 but not too fast and engine parts were hard
to find, I told the guy I was not interested. Though I complemented him on the
plane.
He insisted on flying it up from central OK to Enid and showing it to me. So I
went out. What a beautiful bird. car type doors, tall and stately. the inverted
ranger engine looks neat. But still a 110 MPH plane drinking 13 GPH.
Neat Plane, Great antique.
Blue Skies,
Steve D
----- Original Message -----
From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Looking for Fairchild N81288 (off-topic)
>
>
> Jerry wrote:
>
> >Oscar I am working on it.( Fairchild N81288)
>
> Steve Dortch suggested I try the Fairchild owners' group.
>
> Thanks for the help, guys. I had forgotten that my friend
> David Stroud from the Corvair list is building a Fairchild
> replica (though not the 24W) and is on that list, so he's
> put the word out too. We'll see what turns up.
>
> Oscar Zuniga
> Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"
> San Antonio, TX
> website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
>
>
>
>
Message 7
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Subject: | Re: Please report in |
Like you I turn 60 on July 18 and as much aa I would have loved to fly my
Piet to Brodhead then Oshkosh that's not going to be a happening thing. The
sympathy card don't play in my house so its another date that commemorates
the continued march towards antiquity
John
Do not archive no useful information contained here
Sent via DROID on Verizon Wireless
-----Original message-----
From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com>
Sent: Fri, Dec 17, 2010 14:06:49 GMT+00:00
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Please report in
Dan asked:
>Are there any new Piets on track for first arrival at Brodhead 2011?
Define "new". We're talking about a 1929 design here ;o)
The year 2011 will be my best shot at ever making it to Brodhead with
Scout since I will turn 60 on July 28 and that buys me all kinds of
sympathy with my wife. I've had the charts and routes all planned for
several years but may make some minor tweaks to the route next year
since I will probably fly two-up with my hangar mate Craig Wall and he
is a Tulsa boy. May have to veer into Markle territory.
Craig is re-engining his Cassutt and has promised to let me fly it
when it's back in the air. I have dreamed of flying a Cassutt ever
since my old instructor Charlie used to fly his little screamer,
"Hiccup", at my old home base of Laredo International.
Oscar Zuniga
Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"
San Antonio, TX
website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
Message 8
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Subject: | Re: Please report in |
I plan to be at Brodhead for the first time! Does that count for anything, even
if I drive a car up there?
--------
HOMEBUILDER
Will WORK for Spruce
Long flights, smooth air, and soft landings,
GliderMike, aka Mike Glasgow
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323651#323651
Message 9
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I was scrounging at work and found a piece of metal suitable for firewall material.
It is 27" wide and 36 1/2" high, but it has a piece cut out of a corner.
The corner cut out reduces it to 23" wide x 36 1/2" high, or 24 3/4" x 26 3/4,"
because of the cutout." It is 0.028" thick. Someone probably lost the paperwork
on it, so we can't use it at work, but it is definitely suitable for
a firewall in an experimental. Will this be large enough to use for a firewall
on a Piet?
do not archive
--------
HOMEBUILDER
Will WORK for Spruce
Long flights, smooth air, and soft landings,
GliderMike, aka Mike Glasgow
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323652#323652
Message 10
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Subject: | Re: Please report in |
I guess it means we will see you there
John
Do not archive
Sent via DROID on Verizon Wireless
-----Original message-----
From: GliderMike <glidermikeg@yahoo.com>
Sent: Fri, Dec 17, 2010 15:04:48 GMT+00:00
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Please report in
I plan to be at Brodhead for the first time! Does that count for anything,
even if I drive a car up there?
--------
HOMEBUILDER
Will WORK for Spruce
Long flights, smooth air, and soft landings,
GliderMike, aka Mike Glasgow
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323651#323651
Message 11
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Subject: | Re: Please report in |
I hate it when you young whippersnappers get to complainin' about your
advanced age. I will turn 61 in about 3-weeks so I outrank you both!
Actually, I believe that I got more accomplished on the Piet this year
than I did in the two previous years so quityurbitchen and get back to
work. You just need to get your spouse involved in the build somehow so
she will have a personal investment and not just have to hear about it all
the time. Get her to quilt you a propeller cozy or something.
Merry Christmas to all at to all do not archive
Stinemetze (in cold but snowless Kansas)
>>> "AmsafetyC@aol.com" <AmsafetyC@aol.com> 12/17/2010 8:51 AM >>>
Like you I turn 60 on July 18 and as much aa I would have loved to fly my
Piet to Brodhead then Oshkosh that's not going to be a happening thing.
The sympathy card don't play in my house so its another date that
commemorates the continued march towards antiquity
John
Message 12
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Subject: | Re: runway length? |
Everyone,
I just signed a contract on an 18 acre farm in NE Ohio - life is good. There is
the potential for a 600-650' (9/27 orientation) grass runway along one edge
of the primary field. To the west there are 40-50' trees about 300-350' from
the possible runway end. To the east, there are no obstructions for about 400',
and then none over 25' beyond that. 75'-plus hill immediately to the south-southeast
of the possible runway location, creek bottom to the north.
My question is, is this enough room to get a Piet in and out? I'll be using a
Corvair for power, I weigh 150 fully dressed & I'm seriously considering the Riblett
612 airfoil for the additional lift.
I'd also mention that there is a private field with available hangar space (Minerva,
Ohio) about 4 miles away, but I'd like the option of keeping the plane at
the farm.
Comments?
Thanks!
Kip Gardner
Message 13
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Subject: | Re: New Piets for Brodhead 2011 |
Dan, I expect NX629ML will make it's first trip to Brodhead in 2011. Looks
like it'll be spring before the first flight though, with winter clamping
down early like it has. I usually make a stop at Big Foot for a day or two
before Oshkosh but will probably go direct to Brodhead next year. I think
Jack Phillips is thinking about flying up with me, and another friend who
recently finished a Chinook project.
Matt Paxton
Message 14
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Subject: | Re: Please report in |
"...Does that count for anything...?"
Sure! I'll buy you a cup of coffee!
Gary Boothe
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of GliderMike
Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 7:02 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Please report in
I plan to be at Brodhead for the first time! Does that count for anything,
even if I drive a car up there?
--------
HOMEBUILDER
Will WORK for Spruce
Long flights, smooth air, and soft landings,
GliderMike, aka Mike Glasgow
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323651#323651
Message 15
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|
Kip,
Shouldn't you have asked that question before signing the contract? ;-)
Gary Boothe
Cool, Ca.
Pietenpol
WW Corvair Conversion, Running!
Tail done, Fuselage on gear
(23 ribs down.)
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kip and Beth
Gardner
Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 7:31 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: runway length?
<kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
Everyone,
I just signed a contract on an 18 acre farm in NE Ohio - life is good.
There is the potential for a 600-650' (9/27 orientation) grass runway along
one edge of the primary field. To the west there are 40-50' trees about
300-350' from the possible runway end. To the east, there are no
obstructions for about 400', and then none over 25' beyond that. 75'-plus
hill immediately to the south-southeast of the possible runway location,
creek bottom to the north.
My question is, is this enough room to get a Piet in and out? I'll be using
a Corvair for power, I weigh 150 fully dressed & I'm seriously considering
the Riblett 612 airfoil for the additional lift.
I'd also mention that there is a private field with available hangar space
(Minerva, Ohio) about 4 miles away, but I'd like the option of keeping the
plane at the farm.
Comments?
Thanks!
Kip Gardner
Message 16
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Subject: | Re: New Piets for Brodhead 2011 |
Sounds like we'll have a good contingent from Virginia, with Gene Rambo's
Model A powered Pietenpol, and Matt's new Continental powered Piet, with my
Icarus Plummet making her 4th trip to Brodhead. The trick will be finding
fields where Gene can land, since he has a tailskid and no brakes. Should
be fun.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP "Icarus Plummet"
Raleigh, NC (although the Pietenpol is now based at W91, Smith Mountain
Lake, Virginia)
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Woodflier@aol.com
Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 10:30 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: New Piets for Brodhead 2011
Dan, I expect NX629ML will make it's first trip to Brodhead in 2011. Looks
like it'll be spring before the first flight though, with winter clamping
down early like it has. I usually make a stop at Big Foot for a day or two
before Oshkosh but will probably go direct to Brodhead next year. I think
Jack Phillips is thinking about flying up with me, and another friend who
recently finished a Chinook project.
Matt Paxton
Message 17
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Subject: | Re: runway length? |
My landing and take off roll are in the 300 - 400 ft range.
So it is possible but with little room for error.
What are the prevailing winds ?
If you have crosswind most of the time it would be very exciting landings!
Hans
NX15KV
-----Original Message-----
From: Kip and Beth Gardner <kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
Sent: Fri, Dec 17, 2010 9:34 am
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: runway length?
hlink.net>
Everyone,
I just signed a contract on an 18 acre farm in NE Ohio - life is good. The
re is
he potential for a 600-650' (9/27 orientation) grass runway along one edge
of
he primary field. To the west there are 40-50' trees about 300-350' from t
he
ossible runway end. To the east, there are no obstructions for about 400',
and
hen none over 25' beyond that. 75'-plus hill immediately to the
outh-southeast of the possible runway location, creek bottom to the north.
My question is, is this enough room to get a Piet in and out? I'll be usin
g a
orvair for power, I weigh 150 fully dressed & I'm seriously considering the
iblett 612 airfoil for the additional lift.
I'd also mention that there is a private field with available hangar space
Minerva, Ohio) about 4 miles away, but I'd like the option of keeping the p
lane
t the farm.
Comments?
Thanks!
Kip Gardner
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Message 18
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Subject: | Re: firewall size |
The top of the fire wall is rounded, so you loose corners there anyway.
If the piece is free, it is worth trying.
Hans
NX15KV
-----Original Message-----
From: GliderMike <glidermikeg@yahoo.com>
Sent: Fri, Dec 17, 2010 9:22 am
Subject: Pietenpol-List: firewall size
I was scrounging at work and found a piece of metal suitable for firewall
aterial. It is 27" wide and 36 1/2" high, but it has a piece cut out of a
orner. The corner cut out reduces it to 23" wide x 36 1/2" high, or 24 3/4
" x
6 3/4," because of the cutout." It is 0.028" thick. Someone probably los
t
he paperwork on it, so we can't use it at work, but it is definitely suitab
le
or a firewall in an experimental. Will this be large enough to use for a
irewall on a Piet?
do not archive
--------
OMEBUILDER
ill WORK for Spruce
ong flights, smooth air, and soft landings,
liderMike, aka Mike Glasgow
ead this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323652#323652
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-= -- Please Support Your Lists This Month --
-= (And Get Some AWESOME FREE Gifts!)
-
-= November is the Annual List Fund Raiser. Click on
-= the Contribution link below to find out more about
-= this year's Terrific Free Incentive Gifts provided
-= by:
-=
-= * AeroElectric www.aeroelectric.com
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-= * HomebuiltHELP www.homebuilthelp.com
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-= List Contribution Web Site:
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Message 19
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Subject: | Re: Please report in |
Buildapalooza is 4 days old and each day begins with a trip to the hardware
store. The good part about being ADD is multi tasking which means e mial
while driving.
Not to old for that
Do not archive
John
Sent via DROID on Verizon Wireless
-----Original message-----
From: TOM STINEMETZE <TOMS@mcpcity.com>
Sent: Fri, Dec 17, 2010 15:24:28 GMT+00:00
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Please report in
I hate it when you young whippersnappers get to complainin' about your
advanced age. I will turn 61 in about 3-weeks so I outrank you both!
Actually, I believe that I got more accomplished on the Piet this year than
I did in the two previous years so quityurbitchen and get back to work. You
just need to get your spouse involved in the build somehow so she will have
a personal investment and not just have to hear about it all the time. Get
her to quilt you a propeller cozy or something.
Merry Christmas to all at to all do not archive
Stinemetze (in cold but snowless Kansas)
>>> "AmsafetyC@aol.com" <AmsafetyC@aol.com> 12/17/2010 8:51 AM >>>
Like you I turn 60 on July 18 and as much aa I would have loved to fly my
Piet to Brodhead then Oshkosh that's not going to be a happening thing. The
sympathy card don't play in my house so its another date that commemorates
the continued march towards antiquity
John
Message 20
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Subject: | Re: Please report in |
Maybe I can try that sympathy card - I turn 60 in May. But if I do come
it would mean flying commercial from the left coast.
Ken
do not archive
On Dec 17, 2010, at 6:51 AM, amsafetyc@aol.com wrote:
> Like you I turn 60 on July 18 and as much aa I would have loved to fly
my Piet to Brodhead then Oshkosh that's not going to be a happening
thing. The sympathy card don't play in my house so its another date that
commemorates the continued march towards antiquity
>
> John
>
> Do not archive no useful information contained here
>
> Sent via DROID on Verizon Wireless
>
>
> -----Original message-----
> From: Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com>
> To: Pietenpol List <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Fri, Dec 17, 2010 14:06:49 GMT+00:00
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Please report in
>
>
>
> Dan asked:
>
> >Are there any new Piets on track for first arrival at Brodhead 2011?
>
> Define "new". We're talking about a 1929 design here ;o)
>
> The year 2011 will be my best shot at ever making it to Brodhead with
> Scout since I will turn 60 on July 28 and that buys me all kinds of
> sympathy with my wife. I've had the charts and routes all planned for
> several years but may make some minor tweaks to the route next year
> since I will probably fly two-up with my hangar mate Craig Wall and he
> is a Tulsa boy. May have to veer into Markle territory.
>
> Craig is re-engining his Cassutt and has promised to let me fly it
> when it's back in the air. I have dreamed of flying a Cassutt ever
> since my old instructor Charlie used to fly his little screamer,
> "Hiccup", at my old home base of Laredo International.
>
> Oscar Zuniga
> Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"
> San Antonio, TX
> website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
>
>
>
>
Message 21
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Take offs won't be a problem to the east. Landings will be tight
either way. Can the trees be taken down?
><kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
>
>Everyone,
>
>I just signed a contract on an 18 acre farm in NE Ohio - life is
>good. There is the potential for a 600-650' (9/27 orientation)
>grass runway along one edge of the primary field. To the west there
>are 40-50' trees about 300-350' from the possible runway end. To
>the east, there are no obstructions for about 400', and then none
>over 25' beyond that. 75'-plus hill immediately to the
>south-southeast of the possible runway location, creek bottom to the
>north.
>
>My question is, is this enough room to get a Piet in and out? I'll
>be using a Corvair for power, I weigh 150 fully dressed & I'm
>seriously considering the Riblett 612 airfoil for the additional
>lift.
>
>I'd also mention that there is a private field with available hangar
>space (Minerva, Ohio) about 4 miles away, but I'd like the option of
>keeping the plane at the farm.
>
>Comments?
>
>Thanks!
>
>Kip Gardner
>
--
Jeff Boatright
"Now let's think about this..."
Message 22
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Subject: | Re: runway length? |
Thanks Hans,
in this part of the world, normal prevailing winds tend to be from the
west. Any time it's coming from somewhere else, it's usually a
harbinger of weather you would not want to fly in anyway :).
Kip
On Dec 17, 2010, at 11:29 AM, HVandervoo@aol.com wrote:
> My landing and take off roll are in the 300 - 400 ft range.
>
> So it is possible but with little room for error.
>
> What are the prevailing winds ?
> If you have crosswind most of the time it would be very exciting
landings!
>
> Hans
>
> NX15KV
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kip and Beth Gardner <kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
> To: pietenpol-list <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Fri, Dec 17, 2010 9:34 am
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: runway length?
>
<kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
>
> Everyone,
>
> I just signed a contract on an 18 acre farm in NE Ohio - life is good.
There is
> the potential for a 600-650' (9/27 orientation) grass runway along one
edge of
> the primary field. To the west there are 40-50' trees about 300-350'
from the
> possible runway end. To the east, there are no obstructions for about
400', and
> then none over 25' beyond that. 75'-plus hill immediately to the
> south-southeast of the possible runway location, creek bottom to the
north.
>
> My question is, is this enough room to get a Piet in and out? I'll be
using a
> Corvair for power, I weigh 150 fully dressed & I'm seriously
considering the
> Riblett 612 airfoil for the additional lift.
>
> I'd also mention that there is a private field with available hangar
space
> (Minerva, Ohio) about 4 miles away, but I'd like the option of keeping
the plane
> at the farm.
>
> Comments?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Kip Gardner
>
> _blank>www.aeroelectric.com
> /" target=_blank>www.buildersbooks.com
> =_blank>www.homebuilthelp.com
> blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
> " target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
> p://forums.matronics.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 23
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Subject: | Re: runway length? |
If you are an Alaskan bush pilot with big wheels you might be able to get in or
out -- and have plenty of tail drag time. I would not try it and I have lots of
taildrag time. Go for the field next door. It is a lot more fun to be able to
get away for a beer. Cheers, Gardiner Mason
----- Original Message ----
From: Kip and Beth Gardner <kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
Sent: Fri, December 17, 2010 10:30:50 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: runway length?
<kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
Everyone,
I just signed a contract on an 18 acre farm in NE Ohio - life is good. There is
the potential for a 600-650' (9/27 orientation) grass runway along one edge of
the primary field. To the west there are 40-50' trees about 300-350' from the
possible runway end. To the east, there are no obstructions for about 400', and
then none over 25' beyond that. 75'-plus hill immediately to the
south-southeast of the possible runway location, creek bottom to the north.
My question is, is this enough room to get a Piet in and out? I'll be using a
Corvair for power, I weigh 150 fully dressed & I'm seriously considering the
Riblett 612 airfoil for the additional lift.
I'd also mention that there is a private field with available hangar space
(Minerva, Ohio) about 4 miles away, but I'd like the option of keeping the plane
at the farm.
Comments?
Thanks!
Kip Gardner
Message 24
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Subject: | Re: runway length? |
Any chance of putting it kitty-corner ( or is that kiddy? )
That could give you another couple hundred feet.
Provided the property is square though.
Clif
> I just signed a contract on an 18 acre farm in NE Ohio - life is good.
> There is the potential for a 600-650' (9/27 orientation) grass runway
> along one edge of the primary field. >
> My question is, is this enough room to get a Piet in and out? I'll be
> using a Corvair for power, I weigh 150 fully dressed & I'm seriously
> considering the Riblett 612 airfoil for the additional lift.
>
> Kip Gardner
Message 25
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Subject: | Re: runway length? |
Unfortunately no unless the adjoining property owners were agreeable.
On Dec 17, 2010, at 12:13 PM, Jeff Boatright wrote:
> Take offs won't be a problem to the east. Landings will be tight
either way. Can the trees be taken down?
>
>
<kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
>>
>> Everyone,
>>
>> I just signed a contract on an 18 acre farm in NE Ohio - life is
good. There is the potential for a 600-650' (9/27 orientation) grass
runway along one edge of the primary field. To the west there are
40-50' trees about 300-350' from the possible runway end. To the east,
there are no obstructions for about 400', and then none over 25' beyond
that. 75'-plus hill immediately to the south-southeast of the possible
runway location, creek bottom to the north.
>>
>> My question is, is this enough room to get a Piet in and out? I'll
be using a Corvair for power, I weigh 150 fully dressed & I'm seriously
considering the Riblett 612 airfoil for the additional lift.
>>
>> I'd also mention that there is a private field with available hangar
space (Minerva, Ohio) about 4 miles away, but I'd like the option of
keeping the plane at the farm.
>>
>> Comments?
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Kip Gardner
>>
>
>
> --
>
> Jeff Boatright
> "Now let's think about this..."
>
>
Message 26
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Subject: | Re: Please report in |
I turned 60 June and am glad to hear that it gives me some leverage.
rick
On Fri, Dec 17, 2010 at 7:51 AM, AmsafetyC@aol.com <AmsafetyC@aol.com>wrote:
> Like you I turn 60 on July 18 and as much aa I would have loved to fly my
> Piet to Brodhead then Oshkosh that's not going to be a happening thing. The
> sympathy card don't play in my house so its another date that commemorates
> the continued march towards antiquity
>
> John
>
> Do not archive no useful information contained here
>
> *Sent via DROID on Verizon Wireless*
>
>
> -----Original message-----
>
> *From: *Oscar Zuniga <taildrags@hotmail.com>*
> To: *Pietenpol List <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>*
> Sent: *Fri, Dec 17, 2010 14:06:49 GMT+00:00*
> Subject: *Pietenpol-List: Please report in
>
>
>
> Dan asked:
>
> >Are there any new Piets on track for first arrival at Brodhead 2011?
>
> Define "new". We're talking about a 1929 design here ;o)
>
> The year 2011 will be my best shot at ever making it to Brodhead with
> Scout since I will turn 60 on July 28 and that buys me all kinds of
> sympathy with my wife. I've had the charts and routes all planned for
> several years but may make some minor tweaks to the route next year
> since I will probably fly two-up with my hangar mate Craig Wall and he
> is a Tulsa boy. May have to veer into Markle territory.
>
> Craig is re-engining his Cassutt and has promised to let me fly it
> when it's back in the air. I have dreamed of flying a Cassutt ever
> since my old instructor Charlie used to fly his little screamer,
> "Hiccup", at my old home base of Laredo International.
>
> Oscar Zuniga
> Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"
> San Antonio, TX
> website at http://www.flysquirrel.net
>
>
--
Rick Holland
Castle Rock, Colorado
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 27
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|
Subject: | Re: runway length? |
Thanks everyone. As with most things Pietenpol, it sounds like a
"your mileage may vary" situation. I know it's kind of marginal, just
curious about the opinions on just how marginal that is.
BTW Gary, I know it's approaching blasphemy to say that I did not buy
this land primarily with flying in mind, but that's the case. I'm
actually planning on farming this land - what a novel idea :) !
Kip
On Dec 17, 2010, at 2:24 PM, Clif Dawson wrote:
> >
>
> Any chance of putting it kitty-corner ( or is that kiddy? )
> That could give you another couple hundred feet.
> Provided the property is square though.
>
>
> Clif
>
>> I just signed a contract on an 18 acre farm in NE Ohio - life is
>> good. There is the potential for a 600-650' (9/27 orientation)
>> grass runway along one edge of the primary field. >
>> My question is, is this enough room to get a Piet in and out? I'll
>> be using a Corvair for power, I weigh 150 fully dressed & I'm
>> seriously considering the Riblett 612 airfoil for the additional
>> lift.
>>
>> Kip Gardner
>
>
Message 28
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|
Subject: | PLEASE Help on Gear Fittings |
Guys, I'm cutting gear fittings today. For the split gear bottom and side
fitting plates, are they skewed to the left as shown on the drawings?
Thanks
Jack Textor
29 SW 58th Drive
Des Moines, IA 50312
www.textors.com
Message 29
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Subject: | Re: runway length? |
The field I fly out of is 2400' paved with a 1900' grass strip parallel
to the pavement. I'm happy when I can land in 600' on the grass. I
can't imagine trying to land on a field that's only 600' long. That's
too much pucker factor for my butt...
Dan
On 12/17/2010 12:48 PM, airlion wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: airlion<airlion@bellsouth.net>
>
> If you are an Alaskan bush pilot with big wheels you might be able to get in
or
> out -- and have plenty of tail drag time. I would not try it and I have lots
of
> taildrag time. Go for the field next door. It is a lot more fun to be able to
> get away for a beer. Cheers, Gardiner Mason
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Kip and Beth Gardner<kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Fri, December 17, 2010 10:30:50 AM
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: runway length?
>
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: Kip and Beth Gardner
> <kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
>
> Everyone,
>
> I just signed a contract on an 18 acre farm in NE Ohio - life is good. There
is
> the potential for a 600-650' (9/27 orientation) grass runway along one edge of
> the primary field. To the west there are 40-50' trees about 300-350' from the
> possible runway end. To the east, there are no obstructions for about 400',
and
> then none over 25' beyond that. 75'-plus hill immediately to the
> south-southeast of the possible runway location, creek bottom to the north.
>
> My question is, is this enough room to get a Piet in and out? I'll be using
a
> Corvair for power, I weigh 150 fully dressed& I'm seriously considering the
> Riblett 612 airfoil for the additional lift.
>
> I'd also mention that there is a private field with available hangar space
> (Minerva, Ohio) about 4 miles away, but I'd like the option of keeping the plane
> at the farm.
>
> Comments?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Kip Gardner
>
>
--
Dan Yocum
Fermilab 630.840.6509
yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov
"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
Message 30
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Subject: | Re: runway length? |
Kip,
You've seen a lot of Piet's land at Brodhead. The distance between the
entrance and exit "taxiways" (the closed runways) is just over 1000' and
most of the time I was just at the comfort speed for turning when I
reached the exit. Of course, I probably could have really slowed 'er
down more by creeping over the threshold and stomping on the brakes, but
that's no fun.
Dan
On 12/17/2010 03:06 PM, Dan Yocum wrote:
>
> The field I fly out of is 2400' paved with a 1900' grass strip parallel
> to the pavement. I'm happy when I can land in 600' on the grass. I can't
> imagine trying to land on a field that's only 600' long. That's too much
> pucker factor for my butt...
>
> Dan
>
> On 12/17/2010 12:48 PM, airlion wrote:
>>
>> If you are an Alaskan bush pilot with big wheels you might be able to
>> get in or
>> out -- and have plenty of tail drag time. I would not try it and I
>> have lots of
>> taildrag time. Go for the field next door. It is a lot more fun to be
>> able to
>> get away for a beer. Cheers, Gardiner Mason
>>
--
Dan Yocum
Fermilab 630.840.6509
yocum@fnal.gov, http://fermigrid.fnal.gov
"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
Message 31
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Subject: | Re: runway length? |
I have 900 feet with no obstructions and was wondering if that is enough?
--------
John
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323698#323698
Message 32
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Subject: | New Stewart Systems, Hanger 21 Covering system |
Getting ready to start covering....=C2- Has anyone any experience with th
e new Stewart Systems, from Hanger 21?
It is non toxic, no chemicals, etc.=C2-and you can work indoors.
Dave Boyd
Champaign, IL
Message 33
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More power to you, Kip! I wouldn't know which end of the seed goes
down...Hope you find a way to make it work for your Piet, too!
Gary Boothe
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kip and Beth
Gardner
Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 12:46 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: runway length?
<kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
Thanks everyone. As with most things Pietenpol, it sounds like a
"your mileage may vary" situation. I know it's kind of marginal, just
curious about the opinions on just how marginal that is.
BTW Gary, I know it's approaching blasphemy to say that I did not buy
this land primarily with flying in mind, but that's the case. I'm
actually planning on farming this land - what a novel idea :) !
Kip
On Dec 17, 2010, at 2:24 PM, Clif Dawson wrote:
> >
>
> Any chance of putting it kitty-corner ( or is that kiddy? )
> That could give you another couple hundred feet.
> Provided the property is square though.
>
>
> Clif
>
>> I just signed a contract on an 18 acre farm in NE Ohio - life is
>> good. There is the potential for a 600-650' (9/27 orientation)
>> grass runway along one edge of the primary field. >
>> My question is, is this enough room to get a Piet in and out? I'll
>> be using a Corvair for power, I weigh 150 fully dressed & I'm
>> seriously considering the Riblett 612 airfoil for the additional
>> lift.
>>
>> Kip Gardner
>
>
Message 34
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Subject: | Re: New Stewart Systems, Hanger 21 Covering system |
Ecobond is great for gluing on the fabric, no smell and more forgiving than
PolyTac.
On Fri, Dec 17, 2010 at 2:43 PM, <dnboyd1@comcast.net> wrote:
> Getting ready to start covering.... Has anyone any experience with the new
> Stewart Systems, from Hanger 21?
>
> It is non toxic, no chemicals, etc. and you can work indoors.
>
> Dave Boyd
>
> Champaign, IL
>
> *
>
>
--
Rick Holland
Castle Rock, Colorado
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Message 35
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Subject: | Re: New Stewart Systems, Hanger 21 Covering system |
Ecobond is the only glue that I will ever use again. It's great! I have some pics
on my site. I did not use the Stewart system paint. Went with Behr latex and
am very pleased.
Malcolm Morrison
http://home.comcast.net/~mmorrison123/piet.html
----- Original Message -----
From: dnboyd1@comcast.net
Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 4:43:20 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: New Stewart Systems, Hanger 21 Covering system
Getting ready to start covering.... Has anyone any experience with the new Stewart
Systems, from Hanger 21?
It is non toxic, no chemicals, etc. and you can work indoors.
Dave Boyd
Champaign, IL
Message 36
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Subject: | Re: runway length? |
My runway is 1290 feet with power lines on the South end. The North end is open
with just a field then trees 1300 feet from the North end of the runway. It
is not for low time pilots or airplanes with stall speeds of 50 MPH or greater.
A Cessna 150 with 2 on board would be very iffy. I would not try it. A go round
into those power lines might invite a wreck because of the poor climb rate.
Cubs, Aeroncas work fine. One friend has a Cessna 140 and he works it just fine
but he has about 1500 hours in it. I would not fly off a 600 foot strip at
all with obstructions. I flew a Cessna 180 off 600 feet near Clewiston, FL for
a tomato farm conglomerate BUT the only obstructions were tomato plants.
--------
Jerry Dotson
59 Daniel Johnson Rd
Baker, FL 32531
Started building NX510JD July, 2009
wing, tailfeathers done
using Lycoming O-235
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323711#323711
Message 37
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|
Subject: | Re: Please report in |
I turned 61 this last October, and the age sympathy card doesn't work at all for
me, cause my wife is 2 1/2 years older than I am. If I try to play that card,
it gets me in serious trouble. LOL
do not archive
--------
HOMEBUILDER
Will WORK for Spruce
Long flights, smooth air, and soft landings,
GliderMike, aka Mike Glasgow
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323713#323713
Message 38
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Subject: | Re: firewall size |
It was free to me. I think it is the same titanium used as a fire resistant enclosure
around the APU's in the Bombardier CRJ 200's 50 place regional airliner
we fly. Except there is no paperwork to trace this piece back to the mine the
ore came from, so the company can't use it on any of its airplanes.
--------
HOMEBUILDER
Will WORK for Spruce
Long flights, smooth air, and soft landings,
GliderMike, aka Mike Glasgow
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323715#323715
Message 39
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Subject: | Re: PLEASE Help on Gear Fittings |
If you are talking about the 1/4 inch thick sections that the bungees bolt
to, For my part, I would not attempt to locate them other than with the
bungees in assembly.
Andrew
On Fri, Dec 17, 2010 at 11:05 AM, Jack <jack@textors.com> wrote:
> Guys, I=92m cutting gear fittings today. For the split gear bottom and
> side fitting plates, are they skewed to the left as shown on the drawings
?
>
> Thanks
>
> Jack Textor
>
> 29 SW 58th Drive
>
> Des Moines, IA 50312
>
> www.textors.com
>
> *
>
===========
===========
===========
============*
>
>
--
Andrew Eldredge
Sahuarita, AZ
Message 40
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Subject: | Re: PLEASE Help on Gear Fittings |
Jack,They are skewed.BUT..Make all the pieces,weld up the gear legs,get them in
place where they go weld up the bungee cross pieces and hold them in place with
the mounting lugs bolted on and tack the lugs.Everyones gear is a bit different
and no plans will show exactly what angle and where they should be attached
at.If you dont you'll have to bend the a or something else a bit.Been there..Dave
PS have the axles even with the leading edge in flying config.
--------
Covering Piet
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323720#323720
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Subject: | Re: runway length? |
Try at a similar strip some where else.If you can get 500fpm of climb and land
and stop and takeoff in 300' 40 times in a row go for it.If not drive 4 miles
and only build your Piet once.Dave
--------
Covering Piet
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323721#323721
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Subject: | Re: runway length? |
Kip,
Not to rain on your parade, but after thinking about it a little, I'm
not sure you have enough room unless you can clear both approaches of
obstacles.
I have attached Google map images of the runway I fly from. There is
a 50 foot tree to the side of the runway that I can consistently be
above by several feet on take off. Using Google's nifty distance
measurement tool, I find that it takes about 1100 feet horizontal
vector to be above that tree comfortably. I have attached images of
what ~650 feet (your runway length), 950 feet (the average of your
runway length and your estimates of the length to the trees), and
~1100 feet look like. Sort of sobering...
50 feet is pretty tall. Are you sure that the trees at the end of
your runway are that tall?
Jeff
><kipandbeth@earthlink.net>
>
>Everyone,
>
>I just signed a contract on an 18 acre farm in NE Ohio - life is
>good. There is the potential for a 600-650' (9/27 orientation)
>grass runway along one edge of the primary field. To the west there
>are 40-50' trees about 300-350' from the possible runway end. To
>the east, there are no obstructions for about 400', and then none
>over 25' beyond that. 75'-plus hill immediately to the
>south-southeast of the possible runway location, creek bottom to the
>north.
>
>My question is, is this enough room to get a Piet in and out? I'll
>be using a Corvair for power, I weigh 150 fully dressed & I'm
>seriously considering the Riblett 612 airfoil for the additional
>lift.
>
>I'd also mention that there is a private field with available hangar
>space (Minerva, Ohio) about 4 miles away, but I'd like the option of
>keeping the plane at the farm.
>
>Comments?
>
>Thanks!
>
>Kip Gardner
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Subject: | Re: runway length? |
Kip.
For those of you that knew Allen Rudolf and his farm landing strip, I will be saying
things that you know, But his strip was North and South about 700 Ft. before
he lengthened it to accommodate his 172. He cut the trees at the end of the
strip to clear 10' on each wing tip.
I flew his Ford A with no problem, also flew my clipped wing 4412 Piet with an
85 HP Cont,my Ford A , Werner 145 . Lambert. B Ford first with a Piet wing then
with 612 wing. many times with passengers, The last landing in Allens field
was after he had passed away and I was showing a passenger a possible purchase
that I had in mind, When I arrived the runways were freshly plowed and not to
be deterred We landed on the plowed surface, and found that it took full throttle
to taxi , needless to say it took a bean field to take off,
By the way his barn had a 12 X 12 vertical hinged at the top at th sliding doors
and pulled up out of the way to get his Piet in and out , it worked great, Pieti
Lowell
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323726#323726
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Subject: | Re: New Stewart Systems, Hanger 21 Covering system |
I have used Polyfiber on the Pietenpol
But next projet will most likely be stewart systems.
Hans
NX 15kV
-----Original Message-----
From: dnboyd1 <dnboyd1@comcast.net>
Sent: Fri, Dec 17, 2010 3:45 pm
Subject: Pietenpol-List: New Stewart Systems, Hanger 21 Covering system
Getting ready to start covering.... Has anyone any experience with the new
Stewart Systems, from Hanger 21?
It is non toxic, no chemicals, etc. and you can work indoors.
Dave Boyd
Champaign, IL
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Subject: | Re: firewall size |
Oh well, if it is titanium than by all means.
You will be the first
Hans
NX15KV
-----Original Message-----
From: GliderMike <glidermikeg@yahoo.com>
Sent: Fri, Dec 17, 2010 5:38 pm
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: firewall size
It was free to me. I think it is the same titanium used as a fire resistan
t
nclosure around the APU's in the Bombardier CRJ 200's 50 place regional
irliner we fly. Except there is no paperwork to trace this piece back to t
he
ine the ore came from, so the company can't use it on any of its airplanes.
--------
OMEBUILDER
ill WORK for Spruce
ong flights, smooth air, and soft landings,
liderMike, aka Mike Glasgow
ead this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=323715#323715
-
-= -- Please Support Your Lists This Month --
-= (And Get Some AWESOME FREE Gifts!)
-
-= November is the Annual List Fund Raiser. Click on
-= the Contribution link below to find out more about
-= this year's Terrific Free Incentive Gifts provided
-= by:
-=
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-
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-
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Message 46
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Subject: | Re: New Stewart Systems, Hanger 21 Covering system |
A friend of mine just finished a Rans using the Stewart system. This is
his 3rd airplane. He is a perfectionist and his plane is flawless (or at
least looks that way). He used Stits on the first 2 and said that the
Stewart system has a learning curve, especially on the paint. He hated
it and won't ever use it again.
However, it turned out great and the plane looks like a show stopper.
----- Original Message -----
From: Rick Holland
To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 4:17 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: New Stewart Systems, Hanger 21 Covering
system
Ecobond is great for gluing on the fabric, no smell and more forgiving
than PolyTac.
On Fri, Dec 17, 2010 at 2:43 PM, <dnboyd1@comcast.net> wrote:
Getting ready to start covering.... Has anyone any experience with
the new Stewart Systems, from Hanger 21?
It is non toxic, no chemicals, etc. and you can work indoors.
Dave Boyd
Champaign, IL
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
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3D
--
Rick Holland
Castle Rock, Colorado
"Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers, that smell bad"
Regards,
Jeff
Message 47
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Subject: | Covering question |
Kerri-Ann Price sells plans foar a no gap design her web site is:
http://sites.google.com/site/pietenpolplanpackages/pietenpol-plan-packages/
suppemental-plan-packages
Doug Dever
In beautiful Stow Ohio
From: cncampbell@windstream.net
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Covering question
I was planning to cover the gap with a strip of aluminum. That could also
be the ground plane for a VHF antenna if you planning on having a radio.
----- Original Message -----
From: Jim Birke
Sent: Thursday=2C December 16=2C 2010 10:03 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Covering question
We are building an air camper with a three piece wing. according to the pla
ns=2C there is a 2-3/8" gap between the wing panel butt rib and the center
section butt rib. Since this is the separation point between the two panels
=2C what is done with this gap when covering the wing? We don't see any way
of supporting the covering at the butt end of the center section.
Thanks=2C
Jim Birke
Ira G. Ross Aerospace museum
Restoration facility
Niagara Falls N.Y.
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