---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 04/26/11: 18 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:54 AM - Re: Rib Questions (Bill Church) 2. 07:15 AM - Re: Another rib question (Bill Church) 3. 10:37 AM - which airplane will perform better ? (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC AEROSPACE CORP]) 4. 01:19 PM - Re: which airplane will perform better ? (Billy McCaskill) 5. 01:52 PM - Re: which airplane will perform better ? (Bill Church) 6. 01:58 PM - Re: which airplane will perform better ? (aerocarjake) 7. 02:06 PM - Re: which airplane will perform better ? (K5YAC) 8. 02:50 PM - looking for information (JOSEPH SWITHIN) 9. 04:54 PM - Re: which airplane will perform better ? (Pieti Lowell) 10. 05:22 PM - Re: which airplane will perform better ? (Jack) 11. 05:27 PM - C-65 on eBay (Jack) 12. 05:36 PM - Re: looking for information (K5YAC) 13. 05:45 PM - Re: Re: which airplane will perform better ? (Ben Charvet) 14. 05:58 PM - Re: Rudder Cable Routing (helspersew@aol.com) 15. 06:04 PM - Re: which airplane will perform better ? (helspersew@aol.com) 16. 09:08 PM - seeking advice on tie rods vs cables (Douwe Blumberg) 17. 09:30 PM - Re: which airplane will perform better ? (Dan Yocum) 18. 10:01 PM - Re: seeking advice on tie rods vs cables (Billy McCaskill) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:54:51 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Rib Questions From: "Bill Church" Mark, The thingie should align with the whatzit. :) Seriously though, for the wing ribs, the grain orientation isn't critical. Either "A" or "B" should be fine. More important than grain orientation is the grain runout. Make sure the grain slope is no more than 1:15 (preferably even less) or you may end up with broken ribs. The grain orientation in "B" should be slightly easier to curve for the top capstrip. That's how I did mine. Now, if you're talking about spars, "B" is the only acceptable grain orientation. Start cutting. Bill C. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338134#338134 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:15:38 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Another rib question From: "Bill Church" Regarding the Pietenpol rib design, the original plans do not show the vertical uprights adjacent to the spars, but the full-size template (as provided by the Pietenpol family) DOES have them. I believe that BHP added them to the design later, to make the wings easier to assemble. Some builders opt to put uprights on either side of each spar (4 uprights), but this can make assembly more difficult, since the spar is "trapped" between the two sticks. Logic would indicate that adding a single upright at each spar is a good idea. The extra Spruce will account for approximately 3/4 of a pound added to the total weight of the airplane. To the best of my knowledge, there is only one Air Camper currently flying with a Riblett airfoil, but it sure sounds as though there are a lot of ribs being built. It will be interesting to see how many get airborne in the coming years. Perhaps then we will be able to better determine how this alternate airfoil compares with the original Pietenpol airfoil. Bill C. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338135#338135 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 10:37:22 AM PST US From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC AEROSPACE CORP]" Subject: Pietenpol-List: which airplane will perform better ? Q: The one with the Riblett or Pietenpol wing ? A: The plane that has the lightest empty weight. (surely an oversimplification but you get my drift.) ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 01:19:25 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: which airplane will perform better ? From: "Billy McCaskill" Perhaps the answer is the lightest one WITH the Riblett airfoil? Light weight + lower induced drag + better coefficient of lift = win-win situation. :) do not archive -------- Billy McCaskill Urbana, IL tail section almost done, starting on ribs soon Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338148#338148 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 01:52:47 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: which airplane will perform better ? From: "Bill Church" A: The one that is finished. :) BC do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338153#338153 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 01:58:07 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: which airplane will perform better ? From: "aerocarjake" The one who pays for the test... -------- Jake Schultz - curator, Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338154#338154 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 02:06:09 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: which airplane will perform better ? From: "K5YAC" Bill Church wrote: > A: The one that is finished. :) > > BC > > do not archive Exactly what I was thinking. Another correct answer would be... the one that gets flown the most. -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage framed up - Working on Fuselage Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338155#338155 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 02:50:34 PM PST US From: JOSEPH SWITHIN Subject: Pietenpol-List: looking for information I recently purchased the back issues of the International Pietenpol Association. On the cover of the 2nd quarter 1978 issue was a photo of a Piet built by the Emmerson Famliy of Scott, Kansas. Does anyone know these folks, do they still have the Piet, do they have any photo's I could copy? etc. Any information would be greatly appreciated. Joe Swithin Morris, IL In the extended discovery phase, hoping to start ribs soon. ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 04:54:11 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: which airplane will perform better ? From: "Pieti Lowell" You will be amazed, when he who has one and lets you see for yourself. Pieti Lowell Since 2004 on my 612 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338164#338164 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 05:22:36 PM PST US From: "Jack" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: which airplane will perform better ? Mike which one is stuffed with helium filled ping pong balls? Jack DSM _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC AEROSPACE CORP] Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2011 12:00 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: which airplane will perform better ? Q: The one with the Riblett or Pietenpol wing ? A: The plane that has the lightest empty weight. (surely an oversimplification but you get my drift.) ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 05:27:42 PM PST US From: "Jack" Subject: Pietenpol-List: C-65 on eBay http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320690514772&s sPageName=ADME:B:SS:MOTORS:1123 Jack DSM ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 05:36:48 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: looking for information From: "K5YAC" Sorry Joe, I can't offer any information on the people or the aircraft in question. All I really wanted to say was go ahead and get started... the discovery phase never ends! -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage framed up - Working on Fuselage Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338168#338168 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 05:45:26 PM PST US From: Ben Charvet Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: which airplane will perform better ? Indeed! you guys need to spend more time making sawdust and less time typing! Ben On 4/26/2011 4:50 PM, Bill Church wrote: > --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "Bill Church" > > A: The one that is finished. :) > > BC > > do not archive > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338153#338153 > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 05:58:06 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Rudder Cable Routing From: helspersew@aol.com Hi Clif, I am not near my Piet, so I am working from recollection. As with so many t hings with my Piet design, I relied on seat-of-the-pants engineering, based on my schooling and experience (A and P certificate 1976, real life experi ences in the manufacturing field for 30 years). This was one of those times that I used the "there is no reason that this won't work" conclusion. :O) Dan Helsper Puryear, TN -----Original Message----- From: Clif Dawson Sent: Mon, Apr 25, 2011 10:05 pm Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Rudder Cable Routing I'm assuming there's less than 3=C2=B0 of direction change, right? Clif Hi Jack, I didn't think it was necessary to add the pulley. I took a small piece of phenolic, drilled a hole in it, and glued it to the back side of the seat, then ran the rudder cable through. There seems to be enough slack in that s ystem for it to work fine on mine. Very smooth operation with no effort to move the rudder. Dan Helsper Puryear, TN -= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum - -= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse -= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription, -= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, -= Photoshare, and much much more: - -= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List - -======================== -= - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - -= Same great content also available via the Web Forums! - -= --> http://forums.matronics.com - -======================== -= - List Contribution Web Site - -= Thank you for your generous support! -= -Matt Dralle, List Admin. -= --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution -======================== ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 06:04:06 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: which airplane will perform better ? From: helspersew@aol.com This is an under-handed way of trying to make me feel bad, right? (710 LBS E.W.) I am very sensitive. do not archive Dan Helsper Puryear, TN .. -----Original Message----- From: Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC AEROSPACE CORP] (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC AEROS PACE CORP] Sent: Tue, Apr 26, 2011 12:37 pm Subject: Pietenpol-List: which airplane will perform better ? Q: The one with the Riblett or Pietenpol wing ? A: The plane that has the lightest empty weight. (surely an oversimplification but you get my drift.) -= - The Pietenpol-List Email Forum - -= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse -= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription, -= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, -= Photoshare, and much much more: - -= --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List - -======================== -= - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - -= Same great content also available via the Web Forums! - -= --> http://forums.matronics.com - -======================== -= - List Contribution Web Site - -= Thank you for your generous support! -= -Matt Dralle, List Admin. -= --> http://www.matronics.com/contribution -======================== ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 09:08:57 PM PST US From: "Douwe Blumberg" Subject: Pietenpol-List: seeking advice on tie rods vs cables Hey all, The guy that started my project installed solid (round) tie rods with threaded end fixtures for the center section and landing gear bracing. I've just been reading about some flybaby accidents due to flying wires/cables being replaced with tie rods which directed vibration into the spar fitting and cracked it. Though this is a very different application from center section and landing gear bracing, I thought I'd put it out there to the group. Should I change to standard cable or leave it? Douwe ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 09:30:23 PM PST US From: Dan Yocum Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: which airplane will perform better ? Yours is still lighter than mine, Dan. I think it's lighter than Mike and J ack's, too. do not archive -- Dan Yocum yocum137@gmail.com "I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." On Apr 26, 2011, at 8:01 PM, helspersew@aol.com wrote: > This is an under-handed way of trying to make me feel bad, right? (710 LBS E.W.) I am very sensitive. > > do not archive > > Dan Helsper > Puryear, TN > . > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC AEROSPACE CORP] (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC AERO SPACE > CORP] > To: pietenpol-list > Sent: Tue, Apr 26, 2011 12:37 pm > Subject: Pietenpol-List: which airplane will perform better ? > > Q: The one with the Riblett or Pietenpol wing ? > > A: The plane that has the lightest empty weight. > > > (surely an oversimplification but you get my drift.) > > > > > > > > " target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > p://forums.matronics.com > blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 10:01:42 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: seeking advice on tie rods vs cables From: "Billy McCaskill" Douwe, I guess the answer to that would depend on the diameter of the round rods used for the tie rods, what they're made of, and if the threads are rolled or cut with a threading die. If the threads are cut and the rod is plain cold-rolled steel of 1/8" or 3/16" diameter, I'd be willing to bet that 1/8" aircraft cable with properly swaged Nicopress fittings will have a higher tensile strength and would be less likely to break than the steel tie rods... I'd be worried about the rods breaking at the threads, especially if they are subject to vibration. That's my $.02, others please jump in and comment too. -------- Billy McCaskill Urbana, IL tail section almost done, starting on ribs soon Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=338179#338179 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.