---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 06/18/11: 25 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:16 AM - Dillsburg Closing (Wayne Bressler) 2. 04:17 AM - Re: Another Cable Question (Jack) 3. 04:34 AM - Re: A engine (Jack) 4. 04:40 AM - Flight report- back in the air (helspersew@aol.com) 5. 04:58 AM - Re: Flight report- back in the air (Jerry Dotson) 6. 05:02 AM - Re: Flight report- back in the air (Jack) 7. 05:04 AM - Re: Dillsburg Closing (skellytown flyer) 8. 05:09 AM - Re: negative G loading for Piet wing (Jack Phillips) 9. 05:27 AM - Re: Another Cable Question (Charles Campbell) 10. 05:36 AM - Re: Dillsburg Closing (Charles Campbell) 11. 05:41 AM - Piet fix (Gboothe5) 12. 05:48 AM - Re: Dillsburg Closing (PatrickW) 13. 07:18 AM - Re: Piet fix (kevinpurtee) 14. 07:33 AM - Re: Re: Piet fix (Gary Boothe) 15. 07:52 AM - Re: Dillsburg Closing (Doug Dever) 16. 09:05 AM - Re: Dillsburg Closing (jarheadpilot82) 17. 09:14 AM - Re: negative G loading for Piet wing (mark lee) 18. 03:05 PM - Twin Rivers Fly-In (Jack Phillips) 19. 03:22 PM - Re: Twin Rivers Fly-In (Gary Boothe) 20. 07:00 PM - Building a Piet on the farm..... (Jim Markle) 21. 07:10 PM - Re: Twin Rivers Fly-In (RBush96589@aol.com) 22. 07:37 PM - Re: Building a Piet on the farm..... (Ryan Mueller) 23. 07:41 PM - Re: Twin Rivers Fly-In (Ryan Mueller) 24. 07:45 PM - Re: Re: Flight report- back in the air (Brett Phillips) 25. 07:55 PM - Re: Twin Rivers Fly-In (Brett Phillips) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:16:54 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Dillsburg Closing From: Wayne Bressler Saw this on the EAA site... http://www.eaa.org/news/2011/2011-06-16_dillsburg.asp Wayne Bressler Taildraggers, Inc. www.taildraggersinc.com ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 04:17:28 AM PST US From: "Jack" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Another Cable Question Thanks Chuck I wasn't sure that type tool worked well. Looks like it does. Jack _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Charles Campbell Sent: Friday, June 17, 2011 8:24 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Another Cable Question #2. I meant to attach a pic to the first post so if I can get it to come up here it is. ----- Original Message ----- From: Jack Sent: Friday, June 17, 2011 6:33 AM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Another Cable Question Jim, I don't remember that reference in the book. I used three for my tail cables. I have seen some with one but wonder if the tool has a wider surface. See pictures. Jack DSM http://textors.com/DSCN4200_800x600.jpg http://textors.com/DSCN4199_800x600.jpg http://textors.com/DSCN4201_800x600.jpg http://textors.com/DSCN4202_800x600.jpg _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Boyer Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2011 11:01 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Another Cable Question Another cable question; in Bingelis books and in AC43 it says that 3/32 copper oval cable sleeves only need to be crimped once. I am using 3/32 cable for the tail brace cables and I know I have seen other Piets with 3/32 tail brace cables but don't remember ever seeing just one crimp on the copper sleeve. Is that what those of you using 3/32 cable are doing just one crimp? Tried doing three last night as a test and it can be done but doesn't look well and just one crimp makes the ends swell up like you stepped in the middle of a balloon. Cheers, Jim B. http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.matronic s.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 04:34:03 AM PST US From: "Jack" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: A engine Enjoyed the pictures Jeff, beautiful work. Enjoyed the aileron cable routing. Jack DSM Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of bender Sent: Friday, June 17, 2011 4:53 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: A engine Got a head for my engine this week... aluminum Thomas head 7:1... and made a decision on the ignition. got a mallory distributor and will run dual points like the corvair guys.. i've been driving my '30 AA a lot lately and even the original ignition it that old truck just works. no fabbing a mount and drive for the magneto... short wire runs.. and easy maintenance... i'm digging it. http://s1125.photobucket.com/albums/l593/jfaithbass/ got some photos up jeff Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=343339#343339 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 04:40:34 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Flight report- back in the air From: helspersew@aol.com Hello Good People, NX929DH finally graced the skies again yesterday for 1 1/2 hrs yesterday at Poplar Grove. All went well and she is ready to go to Brodhead. Longer rep ort later next week when I can get back to TN and to my Internet connection (sitting here in McDonalds in Belvidere, IL.[famous hometown of Ryan Meull er]) Looking forward to seeing everybody. Pray for good weather. Dan Helsper (from) Poplar Grove, IL. ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 04:58:46 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Flight report- back in the air From: "Jerry Dotson" That is good news Dan. You taking her to Tennessee or staying in Il. Are you running 1 mag or 2? -------- Jerry Dotson 59 Daniel Johnson Rd Baker, FL 32531 Started building NX510JD July, 2009 wing, tailfeathers done, fuselage rolling using Lycoming O-235 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=343377#343377 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:02:52 AM PST US From: "Jack" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Flight report- back in the air Dan that is fantastic news, congratulations! Look forward to seeing you in Brodhead! Jack DSM Do not archive _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of helspersew@aol.com Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2011 6:38 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Flight report- back in the air Hello Good People, NX929DH finally graced the skies again yesterday for 1 1/2 hrs yesterday at Poplar Grove. All went well and she is ready to go to Brodhead. Longer report later next week when I can get back to TN and to my Internet connection (sitting here in McDonalds in Belvidere, IL.[famous hometown of Ryan Meuller]) Looking forward to seeing everybody. Pray for good weather. Dan Helsper (from) Poplar Grove, IL. ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 05:04:44 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Dillsburg Closing From: "skellytown flyer" Saw that the other day. interesting- that 4130 Aluminum tubing must be tough stuff to weld. I'm surprised an aviation editor didn't catch that.Raymond do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=343378#343378 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:09:47 AM PST US From: "Jack Phillips" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: negative G loading for Piet wing That story about a Piet that lost its wing trying to do a loop was used by BHP to explain why Jury Struts should be installed on a Pietenpol. Negative G loading will cause the lift struts to buckle if they are not braced near the midpoint with Jury Struts. I've never done anything more violent that a wingover in mine. A Pietenpol just would not be a good aerobatic platform - too slow a roll rate and way too much drag. If you want to build an aerobatic airplane, build a Pitts. Jack Phillips NX899JP "Icarus Plummet" Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Oscar Zuniga Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2011 11:45 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: negative G loading for Piet wing Mark asked- >Do you know what the negative-G stress loading is on a piet I'm not aeronautical engineer and I didn't sleep in a Holiday Inn last night, but my napkin sketches and calcs indicate that negative G loading is a weak point of the Piet structure. I may also be very mistaken when I write this, but I believe one of the few known structural failures of a Piet was when one fell out of a loop or attempted a negative-G maneuver and the struts collapsed. Normal category loading for certified aircraft is +3.8 and -1.52G and the Piet is certainly no better rated than that, IMHO. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC Medford, OR ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 05:27:54 AM PST US From: "Charles Campbell" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Another Cable Question It works fine! Just takes a little longer than the one with the long handles -- like hedge clippers. When I was rebuilding a Piper TriPacer a few years ago I used that type. When you're working alone I believe the type with the two bolts is easier to use. ----- Original Message ----- From: Jack To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2011 7:14 AM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Another Cable Question Thanks Chuck I wasn't sure that type tool worked well. Looks like it does. Jack ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Charles Campbell Sent: Friday, June 17, 2011 8:24 AM To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Another Cable Question #2. I meant to attach a pic to the first post so if I can get it to come up here it is. ----- Original Message ----- From: Jack To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, June 17, 2011 6:33 AM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Another Cable Question Jim, I don't remember that reference in the book. I used three for my tail cables. I have seen some with one but wonder if the tool has a wider surface. See pictures. Jack DSM http://textors.com/DSCN4200_800x600.jpg http://textors.com/DSCN4199_800x600.jpg http://textors.com/DSCN4201_800x600.jpg http://textors.com/DSCN4202_800x600.jpg ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jim Boyer Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2011 11:01 AM To: pietenpol-list Subject: Pietenpol-List: Another Cable Question Another cable question; in Bingelis books and in AC43 it says that 3/32 copper oval cable sleeves only need to be crimped once. I am using 3/32 cable for the tail brace cables and I know I have seen other Piets with 3/32 tail brace cables but don't remember ever seeing just one crimp on the copper sleeve. Is that what those of you using 3/32 cable are doing just one crimp? Tried doing three last night as a test and it can be done but doesn't look well and just one crimp makes the ends swell up like you stepped in the middle of a balloon. Cheers, Jim B. http://www.matronics.com/contribution href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List">http://www.mat ronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-Listhref="http://forums.matronics.com">h ttp://forums.matronics.comhref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution"> http://www.matronics.com/c ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 05:36:27 AM PST US From: "Charles Campbell" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Dillsburg Closing Someone at EAA better get their act together. Was Charlie a "WW 2 B-17 pilot" or was he the "Base Sergeant Major"? Don't believe he could have been a B-17 pilot as a Sergeant Major. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Wayne Bressler" Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2011 6:14 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Dillsburg Closing > > > Saw this on the EAA site... > > http://www.eaa.org/news/2011/2011-06-16_dillsburg.asp > > Wayne Bressler > Taildraggers, Inc. > www.taildraggersinc.com > > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 05:41:03 AM PST US From: "Gboothe5" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Piet fix I'm going to be in Bloomington, IN for a couple days and will be looking for a Piet fix on Monday night, June 27..anybody out there? Gary Cool, Ca. ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 05:48:06 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Dillsburg Closing From: "PatrickW" Didn't know he did all the Indy & NASCAR stuff, too. > In addition to providing aircraft grade tubing, Dillsburg supplies all of Indy Car and NASCAR worldwide. This business will be picked up by somebody... - Pat -------- Patrick Hoyt 601XLb/Corvair N63PZ - 99.999% done.... Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=343384#343384 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 07:18:44 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet fix From: "kevinpurtee" Short trip south to Austin. Just sayin'. do not archive -------- Kevin "Axel" Purtee NX899KP Austin/Georgetown, TX Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=343388#343388 ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 07:33:49 AM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet fix I'll be there! Crack a beer, and go ahead and start without me... do not archive -----Original Message----- From: kevinpurtee Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2011 7:16 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Piet fix Short trip south to Austin. Just sayin'. do not archive -------- Kevin "Axel" Purtee NX899KP Austin/Georgetown, TX Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=343388#343388 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 07:52:23 AM PST US From: Doug Dever Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Dillsburg Closing Actually=2C warrant officers did tly fixed wing during WWII. In the movie " The Battle of Brittain" you will see some pilots with sergeant stripes. That part was historically accurate. Dunno about the rest of the movie. Doug Dever In beautiful Stow Ohio > From: cncampbell@windstream.net > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Dillsburg Closing > Date: Sat=2C 18 Jun 2011 08:34:09 -0400 > stream.net> > > Someone at EAA better get their act together. Was Charlie a "WW 2 B-17 > pilot" or was he the "Base Sergeant Major"? Don't believe he could have > been a B-17 pilot as a Sergeant Major. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Wayne Bressler" > To: > Sent: Saturday=2C June 18=2C 2011 6:14 AM > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Dillsburg Closing > > > > > > > > Saw this on the EAA site... > > > > http://www.eaa.org/news/2011/2011-06-16_dillsburg.asp > > > > Wayne Bressler > > Taildraggers=2C Inc. > > www.taildraggersinc.com > > > > > > > > > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 09:05:46 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Dillsburg Closing From: "jarheadpilot82" I don't know if EAA got it right, since they also had 4130 Aluminum tubing in the article, but for those interested in Flying Sergeants, refer to the following website- http://www.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=31103853 Interesting read for us History Geeks (I am one of those that love history and all of its minutiae) -------- Semper Fi, Terry Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=343395#343395 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 09:14:53 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: negative G loading for Piet wing From: mark lee No Jury Struts and trying to loop a Piet! I suppose flying into the side of a barn is also a bad idea.Sorry but I've picked up a bit of a dark sense of humor over the years.Easier to laugh at tragedy than to cry at times. I'm interested in how bad the air can get before being in it becomes a bad thing in the average Piet.The stresses of falling out of a bad loop without Jury Struts,is as good a place as any to start visualizing.Nice to know that the failure was way-way out of any normal sane flight parameter. Do not archive. On Sat, Jun 18, 2011 at 5:07 AM, Jack Phillips wrote: > pietflyr@bellsouth.net> > > That story about a Piet that lost its wing trying to do a loop was used by > BHP to explain why Jury Struts should be installed on a Pietenpol. > Negative > G loading will cause the lift struts to buckle if they are not braced near > the midpoint with Jury Struts. > > I've never done anything more violent that a wingover in mine. A Pietenpol > just would not be a good aerobatic platform - too slow a roll rate and way > too much drag. If you want to build an aerobatic airplane, build a Pitts. > > Jack Phillips > NX899JP "Icarus Plummet" > Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Oscar > Zuniga > Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2011 11:45 PM > To: Pietenpol List > Subject: Pietenpol-List: negative G loading for Piet wing > > > > Mark asked- > > >Do you know what the negative-G stress loading is on a piet > > I'm not aeronautical engineer and I didn't sleep in a Holiday Inn > last night, but my napkin sketches and calcs indicate that negative > G loading is a weak point of the Piet structure. I may also be > very mistaken when I write this, but I believe one of the few known > structural failures of a Piet was when one fell out of a loop or > attempted a negative-G maneuver and the struts collapsed. > > Normal category loading for certified aircraft is +3.8 and -1.52G > and the Piet is certainly no better rated than that, IMHO. > > Oscar Zuniga > Air Camper NX41CC > Medford, OR > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 03:05:49 PM PST US From: "Jack Phillips" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Twin Rivers Fly-In Just got back from the Twin Rivers Fly-in, in the Shenandoah Valley of Virginia. Matt Paxton keeps his brand new Pietenpol there and was flying it, although he can't give rides yet since he's still flying off the Phase I hours. I flew my Pietenpol in, with my wife, Karen, in the front seat. Gene Rambo had his 1928 Travel Air 2000 there, and his friend Pete Hays had his Skybolt. Both of them brought their sons - good to see young kids fooling around with airplanes. In addition there were various other airplanes there, including a Piper Comanche and a Light Sport called a Chinook, that looks something like a Titan Tornado. Since it was getting hot, and my Pietenpol doesn't climb all that well when heavily loaded, I asked Gene Rambo if he would mind bringing Karen back to Smith Mountain Lake in his Travel Air (partly because I wanted her to get her first ride in a biplane). It had taken us 20 minutes to climb from 900' to 3500' to get over the Blue Ridge mountains on the way there, and that was in the morning, when it was cool. Here is a picture of Matt's new Pietenpol. Those of you coming to Brodhead next month will get to see it there, if he can fly another 27 hours in the next month. Here are some other aircraft at the fly-in: And here is Gene's Travel Air in flight: Jack Phillips NX899JP "Icarus Plummet" Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 03:22:33 PM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Twin Rivers Fly-In C=99mon, Matt! Just an hour a day...that=99s all we ask! Gary do not archive From: Jack Phillips Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2011 3:02 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Twin Rivers Fly-In Just got back from the Twin Rivers Fly-in, in the Shenandoah Valley of Virginia. Matt Paxton keeps his brand new Pietenpol there and was flying it, although he can=99t give rides yet since he=99s still flying off the Phase I hours. I flew my Pietenpol in, with my wife, Karen, in the front seat. Gene Rambo had his 1928 Travel Air 2000 there, and his friend Pete Hays had his Skybolt. Both of them brought their sons - good to see young kids fooling around with airplanes. In addition there were various other airplanes there, including a Piper Comanche and a Light Sport called a Chinook, that looks something like a Titan Tornado. Since it was getting hot, and my Pietenpol doesn=99t climb all that well when heavily loaded, I asked Gene Rambo if he would mind bringing Karen back to Smith Mountain Lake in his Travel Air (partly because I wanted her to get her first ride in a biplane). It had taken us 20 minutes to climb from 900=99 to 3500=99 to get over the Blue Ridge mountains on the way there, and that was in the morning, when it was cool. Here is a picture of Matt=99s new Pietenpol. Those of you coming to Brodhead next month will get to see it there, if he can fly another 27 hours in the next month. Here are some other aircraft at the fly-in: And here is Gene=99s Travel Air in flight: Jack Phillips NX899JP =9CIcarus Plummet=9D Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 07:00:36 PM PST US From: Jim Markle Subject: Pietenpol-List: Building a Piet on the farm..... Well that was fun! Larry Williams and Mark Chouinard came over yesterday and helped ME work on my Piet! I've always been a little hesitant to have someone work on it in the past. That was stupid. From now on, anyone that stops by gets a tool (NOT to take back to it's original owner!) and a project.... It was really great having friends in my workshop...especially fun how they pitched in and helped move my project forward a few giant steps. Thanks guys. Jim in Pryor.... ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 07:10:10 PM PST US From: RBush96589@aol.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Twin Rivers Fly-In looks like a fun day was had.Gene that is a nice looking plane. you should have been bringing it to Brodhead all these years it would fit right in. looking forward to seeing every one there next month. Randy Bush NX294RB do not archive ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 07:37:37 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Building a Piet on the farm..... From: Ryan Mueller Very cool Jim. Kudos to Larry and Mark for coming over to help, and good to see hands on your Piet!! Ryan do not archive On Sat, Jun 18, 2011 at 5:53 PM, Jim Markle wrote: > Well that was fun! Larry Williams and Mark Chouinard came over yesterday > and helped ME work on my Piet! I've always been a little hesitant to have > someone work on it in the past. That was stupid. From now on, anyone that > stops by gets a tool (NOT to take back to it's original owner!) and a > project.... > > It was really great having friends in my workshop...especially fun how they > pitched in and helped move my project forward a few giant steps. > > Thanks guys. > > Jim in Pryor.... > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 07:41:28 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Twin Rivers Fly-In From: Ryan Mueller Well, we can't have the joint classed up too much. Next thing you know, they revoke our reprobate cards.... Ryan do not archive On Sat, Jun 18, 2011 at 9:07 PM, wrote: > ** > looks like a fun day was had.Gene that is a nice looking plane. you should > have been bringing it to Brodhead all these years it would fit right in. > looking forward to seeing every one there next month. > Randy Bush > NX294RB > do not archive > > * > > * > > ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 07:45:48 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Flight report- back in the air From: "Brett Phillips" Very good news Dan! I too am curious to hear what you worked out. Whatever the solution, if it works, FLY IT! Brett Phillips NX311GP ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 07:55:10 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Twin Rivers Fly-In From: "Brett Phillips" The weather there must have been better than at the northern end of the Shenandoah Valley today. Humid and overcast here with cells in the afternoon. Still, had I known, I would have gladly driven the 2 hours to see some REAL airplanes. I need to get lower to the ground... (Ironically, I think that involves having an airplane that FLIES, but I'm working on that...:-) ) Brett Phillips Strasburg, VA DO NOT ARCHIVE ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.