---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 09/20/11: 26 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:52 AM - Re: Retractable sliding step (Jack) 2. 07:12 AM - Re: Retractable sliding step (Bill Church) 3. 09:24 AM - W/B QUESTION (Chris Rusch) 4. 09:37 AM - Re: W/B QUESTION (John Hofmann) 5. 09:45 AM - Re: W/B QUESTION (Ken Bickers) 6. 10:02 AM - Re: Retractable sliding step (KM Heide CPO/FAAOP) 7. 10:05 AM - Re: W/B QUESTION (Bill Church) 8. 10:06 AM - Re: Re: Retractable sliding step (KM Heide CPO/FAAOP) 9. 10:47 AM - modified seine knot (JOSEPH SWITHIN) 10. 10:48 AM - Dick N (JOSEPH SWITHIN) 11. 11:02 AM - Re: W/B QUESTION (dgaldrich) 12. 11:07 AM - Re: Retractable sliding step (TOM STINEMETZE) 13. 11:11 AM - Re: Re: W/B QUESTION (Jack Phillips) 14. 11:23 AM - Re: W/B QUESTION (TOM STINEMETZE) 15. 12:27 PM - Re: W/B QUESTION (aerocarjake) 16. 12:43 PM - Re: Re: W/B QUESTION (Jim Markle) 17. 12:51 PM - Thank you DAVE..... Re: W/B QUESTION (Jim Markle) 18. 12:56 PM - Re: W/B QUESTION (Chris Rusch) 19. 01:43 PM - Re: Retractable sliding step (rvanengen) 20. 02:24 PM - tail spring (bender) 21. 03:36 PM - Re: Modified Seine Knot (dwilson) 22. 03:45 PM - Re: tail spring (BRETT PHILLIPS) 23. 05:46 PM - Re: W/B QUESTION (dgaldrich) 24. 06:13 PM - Re: Retractable sliding step (Doug Dever) 25. 06:50 PM - Re: tail spring (gboothe5@comcast.net) 26. 08:00 PM - Re: Re: W/B QUESTION (Clif Dawson) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:52:14 AM PST US From: "Jack" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Retractable sliding step Ken, looks good, where did you get the "button" clips? Thanks, Jack _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of KM Heide CPO/FAAOP Sent: Monday, September 19, 2011 11:34 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Retractable sliding step Members: Here are some photos I made of my step which I created last year. The key here is light wall tubing slid inside another tube. The buttons are called step buttons found in aluminum canes or crutches. They will allow for my step to slide out and lock into the correct 6" length. Then push the button in and they slide back into the sleeve. I placed this set-up as as far back as I could under my seat. Used small pieces of ash bolted through my 1/4" thick floor! So now... flame away as I added MORE weight to the rear of the fuse! I will have the nicest easy to get into..outside control horned..looking Pietenpol "brick" in the country! However, I am keeping it to plans! KMHeide ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:12:52 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Retractable sliding step From: "Bill Church" No flames ... just a question. The step button seems like a good, simple method to lock the tube in position. I'm just curious as to how you will be able to push the button to collapse the step when you're sitting in the pilot's seat. Maybe you have exceptionally long arms, or is there a secret? BC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=352759#352759 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 09:24:17 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: W/B QUESTION From: "Chris Rusch" When calculating weight and balance, where do you locate the arm? in the center of the cg range? From the leading edge? and you use negative numbers for distance in front of the datum correct? Thanks Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=352768#352768 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 09:37:42 AM PST US From: John Hofmann Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: W/B QUESTION Mine is attached to my shoulder. Signed, Bill Church do not archive John Hofmann Vice-President, Information Technology The Rees Group, Inc. 2424 American Lane Madison, WI 53704 Phone: 608.443.2468 ext 150 Fax: 608.443.2474 Email: jhofmann@reesgroupinc.com On Sep 20, 2011, at 11:21 AM, Chris Rusch wrote: > > When calculating weight and balance, where do you locate the arm? in the center of the cg range? =46rom the leading edge? > and you use negative numbers for distance in front of the datum correct? > > Thanks > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=352768#352768 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 09:45:05 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: W/B QUESTION From: Ken Bickers ... so John why would you want to sign your shoulder Bill Church. Do Not Archive On Tue, Sep 20, 2011 at 10:33 AM, John Hofmann wrote: > Mine is attached to my shoulder. > Signed, Bill Church > > do not archive > > John Hofmann > Vice-President, Information Technology > The Rees Group, Inc. > 2424 American Lane > Madison, WI 53704 > Phone: 608.443.2468 ext 150 > Fax: 608.443.2474 > Email:jhofmann@reesgroupinc.com > On Sep 20, 2011, at 11:21 AM, Chris Rusch wrote: > > > When calculating weight and balance, where do you locate the arm? in the > center of the cg range? From the leading edge? > and you use negative numbers for distance in front of the datum correct? > > Thanks > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=352768#352768 > > > - The --> &n======================= > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 10:02:26 AM PST US From: KM Heide CPO/FAAOP Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Retractable sliding step The snap buttons came form a local hardware store in Fargo, ND called Mac's for the whopping price of .25 each. They carry a few different sizes. If you cna't find them locally, try a store that sells canes and ask if you can buy a few. The idea works really well and easy to fabricate. If people need these snap buttons to create a step please advise and I can send them for costs. KMHeide --- On Tue, 9/20/11, Jack wrote: > From: Jack > Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Retractable sliding step > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Date: Tuesday, September 20, 2011, 5:49 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ken, looks > good, where did you get the button > clips? > > Thanks, > > > Jack > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: > owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] > On Behalf Of > KM Heide CPO/FAAOP > > Sent: Monday, > September 19, 2011 > 11:34 PM > > To: > pietenpol-list@matronics.com > > Subject: > Pietenpol-List: > Retractable sliding step > > > > > > > > > > > Members: > > > > > > Here are some > photos I made of my step which I created > last year. The key here is light wall tubing slid inside > another tube. The > buttons are called step buttons found in aluminum canes > or crutches. They > will allow for my step to slide out and lock into the > correct 6" length. > Then push the button in and they slide back into the > sleeve. I placed this > set-up as as far back as I could under my seat. Used > small pieces of ash > bolted through my 1/4" thick > floor! > > > > > > > So now... flame > away as I added MORE weight to the rear of > the fuse! I will have the nicest easy to get > into..outside control > horned..looking Pietenpol "brick" in the > country! However, I am > keeping it to plans! > > > > > > > > > > > > KMHeide > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:05:32 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: W/B QUESTION From: "Bill Church" Thanks for filling in for me there, John. Pretty much spot-on what I would have responded with. (hard to resist, isn't it?) BC do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=352773#352773 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 10:06:03 AM PST US From: KM Heide CPO/FAAOP Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Retractable sliding step I just lean over the side and push the button and slide it back in. Don't think I have extra long arms... The set-up is located under my seat so it is only reaching outside and back a little bit. KMHeide --- On Tue, 9/20/11, Bill Church wrote: > From: Bill Church > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Retractable sliding step > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Date: Tuesday, September 20, 2011, 9:10 AM > --> Pietenpol-List message posted > by: "Bill Church" > > No flames ... just a question. > The step button seems like a good, simple method to lock > the tube in position. I'm just curious as to how you will be > able to push the button to collapse the step when you're > sitting in the pilot's seat. Maybe you have exceptionally > long arms, or is there a secret? > > BC > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=352759#352759 > > > > > > > > Email Forum - > FAQ, > - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS - > List Contribution Web Site - > -Matt > Dralle, List Admin. > > > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 10:47:16 AM PST US From: JOSEPH SWITHIN Subject: Pietenpol-List: modified seine knot I would sign up for the knot tying class at Brodhead. Having someone show me and then monitoring me as I practice would be very helpful. ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 10:48:28 AM PST US From: JOSEPH SWITHIN Subject: Pietenpol-List: Dick N Dick, The print showed up today, I will send the check out today as well. Thanks Joe ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 11:02:06 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: W/B QUESTION From: "dgaldrich" Now here's a serious answer to what I think is your question. 1. You can locate the datum (reference point) anywhere you want. For example, most big planes use an imaginary point in front of the aircraft so that all arms are positive. Many small aircraft use something like the prop flange, firewall, wing leading edge, whatever, as long as it can give you a single vertical reference plane perpendicular to the long axis of the aircraft. Most Pietenpol builders use the firewall since it's a vertical plane and easy to measure from. 2. The "arm" is simply a distance from the datum, aft is positive and forward is negative. In the case of initial weight and balance calculations, you simple level the aircraft and measure the distance from the datum/firewall to each of the 3 wheels. Weight x Arm = Moment. Add the weights, add the moments to get a total weight and moment. Then divide moment by weight and that gives you another arm. That arm is the distance of the cg from the datum. Then measure from the datum to the wing and if it falls within the acceptable range, you're almost done. You now have the empty weight and cg and all other calculations start from that. 3. To add people, fuel, baggage or equipment, just do the weight x arm = moment calculations for each item and then add the empty weight and cg info. Just remember that weights and moments add but the overall arm is a calculated number. To figure out whether you are withing cg limits in a flyable aircraft, take just the aft cg items (on a Piet, that's typically just the pilot) and calculate the maximum aft cg. If it is forward of the max aft published, then you are good. Do the same with forward cg (typically a "light" pilot as min crew) and add fuel, max pax weight and do the W x A = M calculations. Again, if the calculated arm falls withing the cg range, go forth and sin no more. If not, move the wing until it does. This is a little like telling you how to build a watch when you just wanted to know the time but it should answer your question. Dave Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=352779#352779 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 11:07:24 AM PST US From: "TOM STINEMETZE" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Retractable sliding step These "snap buttons" are also available from McMaster Carr in lots of different sizes. (Along with just about anything else that you may never have thought of.) Stinemetze >>> KM Heide CPO/FAAOP 9/20/2011 11:59 AM >>> he snap buttons came form a local hardware store in Fargo, ND called Mac's for the whopping price of .25 each. They carry a few different sizes. If you cna't find them locally, try a store that sells canes and ask if you can buy a few. The idea works really well and easy to fabricate. If people need these snap buttons to create a step please advise and I can send them for costs. KMHeide ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 11:11:19 AM PST US From: "Jack Phillips" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: W/B QUESTION Good post, Dave. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of dgaldrich Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2011 2:00 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: W/B QUESTION Now here's a serious answer to what I think is your question. 1. You can locate the datum (reference point) anywhere you want. For example, most big planes use an imaginary point in front of the aircraft so that all arms are positive. Many small aircraft use something like the prop flange, firewall, wing leading edge, whatever, as long as it can give you a single vertical reference plane perpendicular to the long axis of the aircraft. Most Pietenpol builders use the firewall since it's a vertical plane and easy to measure from. 2. The "arm" is simply a distance from the datum, aft is positive and forward is negative. In the case of initial weight and balance calculations, you simple level the aircraft and measure the distance from the datum/firewall to each of the 3 wheels. Weight x Arm = Moment. Add the weights, add the moments to get a total weight and moment. Then divide moment by weight and that gives you another arm. That arm is the distance of the cg from the datum. Then measure from the datum to the wing and if it falls within the acceptable range, you're almost done. You now have the empty weight and cg and all other calculations start from that. 3. To add people, fuel, baggage or equipment, just do the weight x arm moment calculations for each item and then add the empty weight and cg info. Just remember that weights and moments add but the overall arm is a calculated number. To figure out whether you are withing cg limits in a flyable aircraft, take just the aft cg items (on a Piet, that's typically just the pilot) and calculate the maximum aft cg. If it is forward of the max aft published, then you are good. Do the same with forward cg (typically a "light" pilot as min crew) and add fuel, max pax weight and do the W x A = M calculations. Again, if the calculated arm falls withing the cg range, go forth and sin no more. If not, move the wing until it does. This is a little like telling you how to build a watch when you just wanted to know the time but it should answer your question. Dave Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=352779#352779 ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 11:23:09 AM PST US From: "TOM STINEMETZE" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: W/B QUESTION Dave: Now that one I'm gonna print out and put in my "must keep" book. That is about as clear an explanation as I have seen on this subject. Stinemetze >>> "dgaldrich" 9/20/2011 12:59 PM >>> Now here's a serious answer to what I think is your question. 1. You can locate the datum (reference point) anywhere you want. For example, most big planes use an imaginary point in front of the aircraft so that all arms are positive. Many small aircraft use something like the prop flange, firewall, wing leading edge, whatever, as long as it can give you a single vertical reference plane perpendicular to the long axis of the aircraft. Most Pietenpol builders use the firewall since it's a vertical plane and easy to measure from. 2. The "arm" is simply a distance from the datum, aft is positive and forward is negative. In the case of initial weight and balance calculation s, you simple level the aircraft and measure the distance from the datum/firewall to each of the 3 wheels. Weight x Arm = Moment. Add the weights, add the moments to get a total weight and moment. Then divide moment by weight and that gives you another arm. That arm is the distance of the cg from the datum. Then measure from the datum to the wing and if it falls within the acceptable range, you're almost done. You now have the empty weight and cg and all other calculations start from that. 3. To add people, fuel, baggage or equipment, just do the weight x arm = moment calculations for each item and then add the empty weight and cg info. Just remember that weights and moments add but the overall arm is a calculated number. To figure out whether you are withing cg limits in a flyable aircraft, take just the aft cg items (on a Piet, that's typically just the pilot) and calculate the maximum aft cg. If it is forward of the max aft published, then you are good. Do the same with forward cg (typically a "light" pilot as min crew) and add fuel, max pax weight and do the W x A = M calculations. Again, if the calculated arm falls withing the cg range, go forth and sin no more. If not, move the wing until it does. This is a little like telling you how to build a watch when you just wanted to know the time but it should answer your question. Dave ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 12:27:23 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: W/B QUESTION From: "aerocarjake" On "balance" I imagine your "arm" is tired after typing that fine explanation..... When you could have just explained that "if you give me the money for a 120 it'll take a 120........" -------- Jake Schultz - curator, Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=352783#352783 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 12:43:38 PM PST US From: Jim Markle Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: W/B QUESTION Me too! I never have understood WHY the W/B stuff is so hard for me to understand.... But not now....I think I just got it...one more for MY "must keep" book too!! Thanks Jack -----Original Message----- From: TOM STINEMETZE Sent: Sep 20, 2011 2:20 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: W/B QUESTION Dave: Now that one I'm gonna print out and put in my "must keep" book. That is about as clear an explanation as I have seen on this subject. Stinemetze >>> "dgaldrich" 9/20/2011 12:59 PM >>> Now here's a serious answer to what I think is your question. 1. You can locate the datum (reference point) anywhere you want. For example, most big planes use an imaginary point in front of the aircraft so that all arms are positive. Many small aircraft use something like the prop flange, firewall, wing leading edge, whatever, as long as it can give you a single vertical reference plane perpendicular to the long axis of the aircraft. Most Pietenpol builders use the firewall since it's a vertical plane and easy to measure from. 2. The "arm" is simply a distance from the datum, aft is positive and forward is negative. In the case of initial weight and balance calculations, you simple level the aircraft and measure the distance from the datum/firewall to each of the 3 wheels. Weight x Arm = Moment. Add the weights, add the moments to get a total weight and moment. Then divide moment by weight and that gives you another arm. That arm is the distance of the cg from the datum. Then measure from the datum to the wing and if it falls within the acceptable range, you're almost done. You now have the empty weight and cg and all other calculations start from that. 3. To add people, fuel, baggage or equipment, just do the weight x arm = moment calculations for each item and then add the empty weight and cg info. Just remember that weights and moments add but the overall arm is a calculated number. To figure out whether you are withing cg limits in a flyable aircraft, take just the aft cg items (on a Piet, that's typically just the pilot) and calculate the maximum aft cg. If it is forward of the max aft published, then you are good. Do the same with forward cg (typically a "light" pilot as min crew) and add fuel, max pax weight and do the W x A = M calculations. Again, if the calculated arm falls withing the cg range, go forth and sin no more. If not, move the wing until it does. This is a little like telling you how to build a watch when you just wanted to know the time but it should answer your question. Dave ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 12:51:21 PM PST US From: Jim Markle Subject: Pietenpol-List: Thank you DAVE..... Re: W/B QUESTION Ok, I meant to say "Thank you DAVE"....I need to stop trying to multitask.... Thank you Dave!!! Great explanation.... -----Original Message----- >From: dgaldrich >Sent: Sep 20, 2011 1:59 PM >To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: W/B QUESTION > > >Now here's a serious answer to what I think is your question. > >1. You can locate the datum (reference point) anywhere you want. For example, most big planes use an imaginary point in front of the aircraft so that all arms are positive. Many small aircraft use something like the prop flange, firewall, wing leading edge, whatever, as long as it can give you a single vertical reference plane perpendicular to the long axis of the aircraft. Most Pietenpol builders use the firewall since it's a vertical plane and easy to measure from. > >2. The "arm" is simply a distance from the datum, aft is positive and forward is negative. In the case of initial weight and balance calculations, you simple level the aircraft and measure the distance from the datum/firewall to each of the 3 wheels. Weight x Arm = Moment. Add the weights, add the moments to get a total weight and moment. Then divide moment by weight and that gives you another arm. That arm is the distance of the cg from the datum. Then measure from the datum to the wing and if it falls within the acceptable range, you're almost done. You now have the empty weight and cg and all other calculations start from that. > >3. To add people, fuel, baggage or equipment, just do the weight x arm = moment calculations for each item and then add the empty weight and cg info. Just remember that weights and moments add but the overall arm is a calculated number. To figure out whether you are withing cg limits in a flyable aircraft, take just the aft cg items (on a Piet, that's typically just the pilot) and calculate the maximum aft cg. If it is forward of the max aft published, then you are good. Do the same with forward cg (typically a "light" pilot as min crew) and add fuel, max pax weight and do the W x A = M calculations. Again, if the calculated arm falls withing the cg range, go forth and sin no more. If not, move the wing until it does. > >This is a little like telling you how to build a watch when you just wanted to know the time but it should answer your question. > >Dave > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=352779#352779 > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 12:56:15 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: W/B QUESTION From: "Chris Rusch" dgaldrich wrote: > Now here's a serious answer to what I think is your question. > > 1. You can locate the datum (reference point) anywhere you want. For example, most big planes use an imaginary point in front of the aircraft so that all arms are positive. Many small aircraft use something like the prop flange, firewall, wing leading edge, whatever, as long as it can give you a single vertical reference plane perpendicular to the long axis of the aircraft. Most Pietenpol builders use the firewall since it's a vertical plane and easy to measure from. > > 2. The "arm" is simply a distance from the datum, aft is positive and forward is negative. In the case of initial weight and balance calculations, you simple level the aircraft and measure the distance from the datum/firewall to each of the 3 wheels. Weight x Arm = Moment. Add the weights, add the moments to get a total weight and moment. Then divide moment by weight and that gives you another arm. That arm is the distance of the cg from the datum. Then measure from the datum to the wing and if it falls within the acceptable range, you're almost done. You now have the empty weight and cg and all other calculations start from that. > > 3. To add people, fuel, baggage or equipment, just do the weight x arm = moment calculations for each item and then add the empty weight and cg info. Just remember that weights and moments add but the overall arm is a calculated number. To figure out whether you are withing cg limits in a flyable aircraft, take just the aft cg items (on a Piet, that's typically just the pilot) and calculate the maximum aft cg. If it is forward of the max aft published, then you are good. Do the same with forward cg (typically a "light" pilot as min crew) and add fuel, max pax weight and do the W x A = M calculations. Again, if the calculated arm falls withing the cg range, go forth and sin no more. If not, move the wing until it does. > > This is a little like telling you how to build a watch when you just wanted to know the time but it should answer your question. > > Dave Dave thank you, that helps clear things up. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=352787#352787 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 01:43:28 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Retractable sliding step From: "rvanengen" I like the idea!! -------- --Randall 02xB || !02xB Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=352794#352794 ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 02:24:06 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: tail spring From: "bender" OK.... so i had a leaf from a model a that i cut down and was using as a tail spring...did a little trimming and bending and ...pow.... broke it i know there are other options and i've seen them... but i like the leaf spring. the Ragwing Special i built had an aluminum spring... 1 1/2 - 1/2 inch thick 6061... bent in a press i know grove made an aluminum spring for the kitfox.. anybody here ever use aluminum ?? i'll be in Wichita next week and will have access to lots of metal..thought about doing some shopping for some aluminum to try out any thoughts ?? jeff Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=352800#352800 ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 03:36:41 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Modified Seine Knot From: "dwilson" I have just a little experience teaching others how to tie this knot. I believe that If you really want to learn how to do it you have to demonstrate the steps to someone else. Then you will never forget ! Usually takes less than 10 minutes unless of course your norwegian! Dan That might be a violation! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=352804#352804 ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 03:45:47 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: tail spring From: BRETT PHILLIPS I have heard (during a forum at Brodhead maybe?, vicious rumor?) that Mr Pietenpol went to the coil spring skid after having trouble with the Model T leaf spring skid damaging the fuselage from side loads. I'm guessing that it wouldn't be as much of a problem if a tailwheel was used, but maybe if it was used as a skid? Can anyone else remember more about this tidbit? Brett Phillips Strasburg, VA ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 05:46:48 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: W/B QUESTION From: "dgaldrich" The one footnote I should have included is that when you weight the airplane, you normally include engine oil and unusable fuel when you do the empty weight calculations. The one mantra of weight and balance is "Weights and moments add; arms do not". And for Bill Church, fingers also add. Dave Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=352809#352809 ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 06:13:30 PM PST US From: Doug Dever Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Retractable sliding step Windsurf shops have em too.- We use them for about everything adjustable: )=0A=0A=0AFrom: TOM STINEMETZE =0ATo: pietenpol-list@matr onics.com=0ASent: Tuesday, September 20, 2011 2:04 PM=0ASubject: RE: Pieten pol-List: Retractable sliding step=0A=0A=0AThese "snap buttons" are also av ailable from McMaster Carr in lots of different sizes.- (Along with just about anything else that you may never have thought of.)=0A-=0AStinemetze =0A=0A=0A=0A>>> KM Heide CPO/FAAOP 9/20/2011 11:59 A M >>>=0Ahe snap buttons came form a local hardware store in Fargo, ND calle d Mac's for the whopping price of .25 each. They carry a few different size s. If you cna't find them locally, try a store that sells canes and ask if you can buy a few. The idea works really well and easy to fabricate.=0A=0AI f people need these snap buttons to create a step please advise and I can s == ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 06:50:03 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: tail spring From: gboothe5@comcast.net Jeff, I believe Zenith 601's are now using 6061 gear legs. I know of at least one builder of the older HDS model that converted the straight, coil spring gear to bent 6061. As I recall, he just bent the gear legs in a Harbor Freight press. Don't see why it wouldn't work for a tail spring. Gary ------Original Message------ From: bender Sender: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com ReplyTo: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: tail spring Sent: Sep 20, 2011 2:20 PM OK.... so i had a leaf from a model a that i cut down and was using as a tail spring...did a little trimming and bending and ...pow.... broke it i know there are other options and i've seen them... but i like the leaf spring. the Ragwing Special i built had an aluminum spring... 1 1/2 - 1/2 inch thick 6061... bent in a press i know grove made an aluminum spring for the kitfox.. anybody here ever use aluminum ?? i'll be in Wichita next week and will have access to lots of metal..thought about doing some shopping for some aluminum to try out any thoughts ?? jeff Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=352800#352800 Sent on the Sprint Now Network from my BlackBerry ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 08:00:30 PM PST US From: "Clif Dawson" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: W/B QUESTION So! Just for Billy Canuck, How do you count to 1023 on ten fingers? Clif The one mantra of weight and balance is "Weights and moments add; arms do not". And for Bill Church, fingers also add. > > Dave ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.