Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:34 AM - Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts (helspersew@aol.com)
2. 05:09 AM - Re: Steam box for bending plywood (Jerry Dotson)
3. 05:11 AM - Re: Steam box for bending plywood (Jack Phillips)
4. 05:18 AM - rib response (JOSEPH SWITHIN)
5. 05:31 AM - Re: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts (Keith Hodge)
6. 05:53 AM - Galvanic Corrosion (Jack Phillips)
7. 06:20 AM - Re: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts (Jerry Dotson)
8. 06:42 AM - Re: Galvanic Corrosion (airlion)
9. 06:49 AM - Re: Re: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts (airlion)
10. 07:38 AM - Re: Galvanic Corrosion (skellytown flyer)
11. 08:16 AM - Re: Steam box for bending plywood (Gary Boothe)
12. 08:22 AM - Re: Galvanic Corrosion (Bill Church)
13. 08:44 AM - Re: Re: Galvanic Corrosion (Jack@textors.com)
14. 10:48 AM - Re: Re: Galvanic Corrosion (Gary Boothe)
15. 10:49 AM - Re: Steam box for bending plywood (shad bell)
16. 11:03 AM - Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts (helspersew@aol.com)
17. 01:49 PM - Re: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts (Jerry Dotson)
18. 02:02 PM - Re: Re: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts (airlion)
19. 02:58 PM - Re: rib jig (rorichts)
20. 03:27 PM - Re: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts (Keith Hodge)
21. 05:48 PM - Re: Re: rib jig (Greg Cardinal)
22. 07:04 PM - Re: rib jig (rorichts)
23. 07:08 PM - Re: Re: rib jig (Ben Charvet)
24. 09:17 PM - Re: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts (Doug Dever)
25. 09:21 PM - Re: Galvanic Corrosion (Doug Dever)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts |
Gardiner,
Here are a couple photos showing the jam nut on the fork threads, providing
for the adjustment and locking ability. I am not an engineer, I can't imag
ine a corrosion problem between the fork threads and the 7075 aluminum inse
rt. Maybe someone with more technical knowledge could chime in (Jack or Bil
l) and give us the official low-down. Hope this helps.
Dan Helsper
Puryear, TN
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Steam box for bending plywood |
Hey Shad when I saw the boiler setup I thought WHISKEY STILL! It makes plenty
of steam
do not archive
--------
Jerry Dotson
59 Daniel Johnson Rd
Baker, FL 32531
Started building NX510JD July, 2009
now covering and painting
21" wheels
Lycoming O-235 C2C
Jay Anderson CloudCars prop 76 X 44
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=365087#365087
Message 3
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| Subject: | Steam box for bending plywood |
Very cool, Shad. Nice to see that Homebuilder ingenuity is alive and well!
Jack Phillips
Do Not Archive
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of shad bell
Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2012 12:36 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Steam box for bending plywood
Hear's a few pics of the steamer.
Shad
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Thank-You everyone for your help. When I reach the next phase I will let you knwo.
Joe
Do Not Archive
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts |
Hello Dan,
I am building a Pietenpol over here in the UK.
Do you happen to have the part number for the fork end which is shown in
the second photograph (i.e. the one with the slot horizontal) and can
you confirm the thread size.
My project has been laid up for some time whilst I was building a house
and I seem to have lost my records of where i ordered them from.
Regards Keith Hodge
P.S. I have attached a rather poor photo of my efforts, which is to be
slightly unusual in having a BMW K100 motor cycle engine with Rotax 3 to
1 gearbox driving a lightweight prop.
P.P.S And finally, regarding the corrosion comments I found (sea photo
2) that my steel fuel filler neck was immovable when I came to remove it
due to corrosion (or did I use locktite? It was so long ago that I
cannot remember. The one thing I was certainly not happy about was the
fact that I paid top dollar from an approved supplier for the parts
which I thought would be properly plated, but they were sure not. I will
be stove enamelling the replacement before fitting it.
On 29/01/2012 12:32 PM, helspersew@aol.com wrote:
> Gardiner,
> Here are a couple photos showing the jam nut on the fork threads,
> providing for the adjustment and locking ability. I am not an
> engineer, I can't imagine a corrosion problem between the fork threads
> and the 7075 aluminum insert. Maybe someone with more technical
> knowledge could chime in (Jack or Bill) and give us the official
> low-down. Hope this helps.
> Dan Helsper
> Puryear, TN
Message 6
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| Subject: | Galvanic Corrosion |
All right, Dan. Now you've done it and inspired my Geekiness to come to the
surface. Let's talk a bit about Galvanic Corrosion. This occurs when you
have dissimilar metals in intimate contact in an environment where they can
get wet, such as at the ends of lift struts. Not all dissimilar metals
cause problems - it depends on how "Anodic" they are. There is a chart
listing the Anodic Index of all common metals. To find the susceptibility
to corrosion of any metal pair, find the difference in their anodic indices
- the corrosion will take place at the more anodic of the pair (this is why
on outboard motors that may be run in saltwater you will find "sacrificial
anodes" of magnesium or zinc on the aluminum casings of the motor, so the
corrosion takes place there rather than on the aluminum.
The rule of thumb to be safe from galvanic corrosion is to have a difference
in anodic index of no more than about 0.15 - 0.20 for an outdoor
environment. Here is the chart:
Metal Category Anodic Index
(volts)
Gold, solid and plated 0.00
Rhodium plated on Silver-plated Copper 0.05
Silver, high Nickel-Copper alloys 0.15
Nickel, Titanium, Monel 0.30
Copper, Silver Solder, high Copper-Nickel 0.35
alloys, Nickel-Chromium alloys
Brasses & Bronzes 0.40
18% Chromium Stainless Steel 0.50
Chromium plating, Tin plating 0.60
Tin-Lead solder 0.65
Lead 0.70
Aluminum, wrought, 2000 series 0.75
Iron, plain carbon or low-alloy steel 0.85
Aluminum, wrought alloys other than 2000 0.90
series (such as 7075)
Cast Aluminum alloys, Cadmium plating 0.95
and Chromates
Hot-dip Zinc, galvanized steel 1.20
Zinc 1.25
Magnesium 1.75
Beryllium 1.85
One of the important things to notice is that cad-plated steel (such as AN
aircraft hardware) is not too bad when placed against 2024 series aluminum,
and is even better against 7075 series. What is surprising to most people
is how bad stainless steel is against aluminum (difference of .40 to .50).
Hope this helps. By the way, I changed the subject to hopefully make this
chart easier to locate in the archives
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
_____
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
helspersew@aol.com
Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2012 7:32 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts
Gardiner,
Here are a couple photos showing the jam nut on the fork threads, providing
for the adjustment and locking ability. I am not an engineer, I can't
imagine a corrosion problem between the fork threads and the 7075 aluminum
insert. Maybe someone with more technical knowledge could chime in (Jack or
Bill) and give us the official low-down. Hope this helps.
Dan Helsper
Puryear, TN
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts |
Dan if you tied the plane down outdoors where Ben Charvet lives I feel sure in
a few years there would be corrosion. I had a Luscombe tied down outdoors about
2 miles from the Atlantic. There was steel to aluminum together at the prop
flanges. The aluminum prop was sandwiched between steel with steel bolts. There
was no significant corrosion there but I paid attention to it. I don't think
a hangared airplane will have any real corrosion problem. That said most combinations
of dissimilar metals touching has the potential for corrosion.
I worked for Florida Gas Transmission Co 41 years. They have 3 pipelines coming
from Texas going past Miami to Turkey Point with lateral lines serving most
of the state. They use cathodic protection with anode beds(note dissimilar metal
with the leads fastened to the pipes) and dc rectifiers with a fixed current
output located about every 20 miles. So that said in the right circumstances
dissimilar metals can help! If the pipe to soil voltage dropped below 0.8 volt
we would raise the current out put near 1.2 volts. That meant deterioration
of the pipe coating.
My struts have threads on both ends. In a few weeks I hope to start the final
assembly. I will coat the threads with silver Never Seez. Good stuff. Stays put.
I have no pedigree, just finished highschool.
do not archive
--------
Jerry Dotson
59 Daniel Johnson Rd
Baker, FL 32531
Started building NX510JD July, 2009
now covering and painting
21" wheels
Lycoming O-235 C2C
Jay Anderson CloudCars prop 76 X 44
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=365099#365099
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Galvanic Corrosion |
Thanks Jack, your explanation of galvanic corrosion makes more sense than a
ny that I have heard. Gardiner
--- On Sun, 1/29/12, Jack Phillips <pietflyr@bellsouth.net> wrote:
From: Jack Phillips <pietflyr@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Galvanic Corrosion
=0A=0A=0A =0A =0A=0A =0A=0A =0A=0A =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0AAll right,
Dan.=C2- Now you=99ve=0Adone it and inspired my Geekiness to come
to the surface.=C2- Let=99s=0Atalk a bit about Galvanic Corrosion.
=C2- This occurs when you have dissimilar=0Ametals in intimate contact in
an environment where they can get wet, such as at=0Athe ends of lift strut
s.=C2- Not all dissimilar metals cause problems =93=0Ait depends on
how =9CAnodic=9D they are.=C2- There is a chart listing=0Ath
e Anodic Index of all common metals.=C2- To find the susceptibility to=0A
corrosion of any metal pair, find the difference in their anodic indices
=93=0Athe corrosion will take place at the more anodic of the pair (t
his is why on=0Aoutboard motors that may be run in saltwater you will find
=9Csacrificial=0Aanodes=9D of magnesium or zinc on the aluminum
casings of the motor, so the=0Acorrosion takes place there rather than on
the aluminum. =0A=0A =C2- =0A=0AThe rule of thumb to be safe from galvani
c=0Acorrosion is to have a difference in anodic index of no more than about
0.15 - 0.20=0Afor an outdoor environment.=C2- Here is the chart: =0A=0A
=C2- =0A=0AMetal Category=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2- Anodic=0AIndex (volts) =0A=0A =C2- =0A=0AGold, soli
d and plated=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- 0.00 =0A=0ARhodium plated on Silver-plated Copp
er=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2- 0.05 =0A=0ASilver, high Nickel-Copper alloys=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- =C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- 0.15 =0A=0ANickel, T
itanium, Monel=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2- 0.30 =0A=0ACopper, Silver Solder, high Copper-Nickel=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- 0.35 =0A=0A
alloys, Nickel-Chromium alloys =0A=0ABrasses & Bronzes=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2- 0.40 =0A=0A18% Chromium Stainless Steel=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- 0.50 =0A=0AChr
omium plating, Tin plating=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- 0.60 =0A=0ATin-Lead sol
der=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- 0.
65 =0A=0ALead=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- 0.70 =0A=0AAluminum, wrought, 2000 series=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- 0.75 =0A
=0AIron, plain carbon or low-alloy steel=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2- 0.85 =0A=0AAluminum, wrought alloys other than 2000=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- 0.90 =0A=0Aseries
(such as 7075) =0A=0ACast Aluminum alloys, Cadmium plating=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- 0.95 =0A=0A
and Chromates =0A=0AHot-dip Zinc, galvanized steel=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
1.20 =0A=0AZinc=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- 1.25 =0A=0AMagnesium=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
- 1.75 =0A=0ABeryllium=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2- 1.
85 =0A=0A =C2- =0A=0AOne of the important things to notice is=0Athat cad-
plated steel (such as AN aircraft hardware) is not too bad when placed=0Aag
ainst 2024 series aluminum, and is even better against 7075 series.=C2-
=0AWhat is surprising to most people is how bad stainless steel is against
=0Aaluminum (difference of .40 to .50). =0A=0A =C2- =0A=0AHope this helps
.=C2- By the way, I=0Achanged the subject to hopefully make this chart ea
sier to locate in the=0Aarchives =0A=0A =C2- =0A=0AJack Phillips =0A=0ANX
899JP =0A=0ASmith Mountain Lake, Virginia =0A=0A =C2- =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
=0A=0A=0A=0AFrom:=0Aowner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com=0A[mailto:own
er-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of helspersew@aol.com
=0ASent: Sunday, January 29, 2012=0A7:32 AM
=0ATo: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
=0ASubject: Pietenpol-List: Question=0Aabout lower fork ends- aluminum stru
ts =0A=0A=0A=0A =C2- =0A=0A=0A=0AGardiner, =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=C2- =0A
=0A=0A=0A=0A=0AHere are a couple photos showing the jam=0Anut on the fork t
hreads, providing for the adjustment and locking ability. I am=0Anot an eng
ineer, I can't imagine a corrosion problem between the fork threads=0Aand t
he 7075 aluminum insert. Maybe someone with more technical knowledge could
=0Achime in (Jack or Bill) and give us the official low-down. Hope this hel
ps. =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=C2- =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0ADan Helsper =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
=0APuryear,=0A TN=C2- =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts |
Jerry, where do you get silver never seize? I haver never heard of it. Gardiner
--- On Sun, 1/29/12, Jerry Dotson <jdotson@centurylink.net> wrote:
> From: Jerry Dotson <jdotson@centurylink.net>
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Date: Sunday, January 29, 2012, 9:18 AM
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted
> by: "Jerry Dotson" <jdotson@centurylink.net>
>
> Dan if you tied the plane down outdoors where Ben Charvet
> lives I feel sure in a few years there would be
> corrosion. I had a Luscombe tied down outdoors about 2 miles
> from the Atlantic. There was steel to aluminum together at
> the prop flanges. The aluminum prop was sandwiched between
> steel with steel bolts. There was no significant corrosion
> there but I paid attention to it. I don't think a hangared
> airplane will have any real corrosion problem. That said
> most combinations of dissimilar metals touching has the
> potential for corrosion.
> I worked for Florida Gas Transmission Co 41 years. They
> have 3 pipelines coming from Texas going past Miami to
> Turkey Point with lateral lines serving most of the state.
> They use cathodic protection with anode beds(note dissimilar
> metal with the leads fastened to the pipes) and dc
> rectifiers with a fixed current output located about every
> 20 miles. So that said in the right circumstances dissimilar
> metals can help! If the pipe to soil voltage dropped below
> 0.8 volt we would raise the current out put near 1.2 volts.
> That meant deterioration of the pipe coating.
> My struts have threads on both ends. In a few weeks I hope
> to start the final assembly. I will coat the threads with
> silver Never Seez. Good stuff. Stays put.
> I have no pedigree, just finished highschool.
>
>
>
>
> do not archive
>
> --------
> Jerry Dotson
> 59 Daniel Johnson Rd
> Baker, FL 32531
>
> Started building NX510JD July, 2009
> now covering and painting
> 21" wheels
> Lycoming O-235 C2C
> Jay Anderson CloudCars prop 76 X 44
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=365099#365099
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Email Forum -
> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
> List Contribution Web Site -
> -Matt
> Dralle, List Admin.
>
>
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Galvanic Corrosion |
On my aluminum struts I also used steel straps to mount the jury struts- but I
put a layer of very heavy poly tape that is used to wrap pipelines with underground.I
was concerned with the possibility of corrosion but also the tendency
of aluminum to wear fast of it is under vibration against another hard surface.Raymond
Read this topic online here:
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| Subject: | Steam box for bending plywood |
Ingenious, Shad.but that's one funny looking wing.;-)
Gary Boothe
Do not archive
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of shad bell
Sent: Saturday, January 28, 2012 9:36 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Steam box for bending plywood
Hear's a few pics of the steamer.
Shad
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Galvanic Corrosion |
Lucky for me, Jack stepped up. Otherwise I might have had my geekiness inspired
to come to the surface as well.
Bill C.
do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=365120#365120
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Galvanic Corrosion |
That would be too much for one day Bill
Jack
Do not archive
Sent from my iPad
On Jan 29, 2012, at 10:20 AM, "Bill Church" <billspiet@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>
> Lucky for me, Jack stepped up. Otherwise I might have had my geekiness inspired
to come to the surface as well.
>
> Bill C.
>
> do not archive
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=365120#365120
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Galvanic Corrosion |
...as opposed to... when?
Gary Boothe
NX308MB
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Church
Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2012 8:21 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Galvanic Corrosion
--> <billspiet@sympatico.ca>
Lucky for me, Jack stepped up. Otherwise I might have had my geekiness
inspired to come to the surface as well.
Bill C.
do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=365120#365120
Message 15
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| Subject: | Steam box for bending plywood |
I decided to make the jig 2 sided after I bent the first piece of ply, it t
ook a lot of propane to heat up the cold water, so I wanted to keep it goin
g.=C2- The other thing was I didn't want to waste 2 weeks just to wait fo
r the plywood to dry out so I could mask it off and varnish the insides.=C2
- Should have the top wings ready for fabric by spring.=C2- The bottoms
still need some pully fittings made before I can sheet them.
=C2-
Shad
--- On Sun, 1/29/12, Gary Boothe <gboothe5@comcast.net> wrote:
From: Gary Boothe <gboothe5@comcast.net>
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Steam box for bending plywood
Ingenious, Shadbut that=99s one funny looking wing;
-)
=C2-
Gary Boothe
Do not archive
=C2-
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis
t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of shad bell
Sent: Saturday, January 28, 2012 9:36 PM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Steam box for bending plywood
=C2-
Hear's a few pics of the steamer.
Shad
=C2-
Message 16
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| Subject: | Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts |
Keith,
Here is a link from ACS for the Piper J-3 forks I used.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/strutadjfbsets1.php
Dan Helsper
Puryear, TN
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts |
>Gardiner any auto parts store should carry anti-seize compound. It may be Permatex
brand. Never Seez is a brand name that I used on recip and turbine engines.
If you can wait a week or 2 I will mail you an ounce in a med bottle. That
is enough to do all the Piets struts on the list.
Jerry
do not archive
--------
Jerry Dotson
59 Daniel Johnson Rd
Baker, FL 32531
Started building NX510JD July, 2009
now covering and painting
21" wheels
Lycoming O-235 C2C
Jay Anderson CloudCars prop 76 X 44
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=365160#365160
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts |
Thanks Jerry, you don't have to do that cause I am going to see you when my wife
and are going to Destin for her Rotary convention. I can't remember the date
yet but I'll let you know. Gardiner
--- On Sun, 1/29/12, Jerry Dotson <jdotson@centurylink.net> wrote:
> From: Jerry Dotson <jdotson@centurylink.net>
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Date: Sunday, January 29, 2012, 4:46 PM
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted
> by: "Jerry Dotson" <jdotson@centurylink.net>
>
> >Gardiner any auto parts store should carry anti-seize
> compound. It may be Permatex brand. Never Seez is a brand
> name that I used on recip and turbine engines. If you can
> wait a week or 2 I will mail you an ounce in a med bottle.
> That is enough to do all the Piets struts on the list.
> Jerry
>
> do not archive
>
> --------
> Jerry Dotson
> 59 Daniel Johnson Rd
> Baker, FL 32531
>
> Started building NX510JD July, 2009
> now covering and painting
> 21" wheels
> Lycoming O-235 C2C
> Jay Anderson CloudCars prop 76 X 44
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=365160#365160
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Email Forum -
> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
> List Contribution Web Site -
> -Matt
> Dralle, List Admin.
>
>
>
>
Message 19
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As for building ribs to what extent if any is sanding the joints and gussets a
part of the process? I have been told to hold to a minimum because of the sanded
material degrading the integrity of the joint.
thanks
rich
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=365167#365167
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts |
Thanks Dan,
Now I can get my credit card out and get the job finished.
Keith
On 29/01/2012 7:00 PM, helspersew@aol.com wrote:
> Keith,
> Here is a link from ACS for the Piper J-3 forks I used.
> http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/strutadjfbsets1.php
> Dan Helsper
> Puryear, TN
> *
>
>
> *
Message 21
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Rich,
You have been told correctly. The sanded material fills the pores of the
wood and can prevent proper adhesive absorption.
If you do sand the parts make sure you vacuum the pieces before applying
adhesive.
Best practice is to lightly scrape the pieces just before glueing.
That being said, I did some very unscientific testing by glueing sanded
pieces together with T88. The glue joints did not fail.
Greg Cardinal
Minneapolis
----- Original Message -----
From: "rorichts" <stolflite@gmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2012 4:55 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: rib jig
>
> As for building ribs to what extent if any is sanding the joints and
> gussets a part of the process? I have been told to hold to a minimum
> because of the sanded material degrading the integrity of the joint.
> thanks
> rich
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=365167#365167
>
>
>
Message 22
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Thanks for the help, wanting to error (maybe not a good choice of word) anyway
will redo wing and call the first part of the cost of education. It has been and
interesting experience.
thanks again
rich
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=365183#365183
Message 23
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I had a nice belt/disc sander that I used during the rib making
process. If you push to spruce/doug fir strips into the sanding disc
too much the end gets pretty smooth and looks like the sap has melted,
forming a slightly shiny end. I guess that should be avoided, but I
believe most of the strength of the joints is in the gussets. I was
also told that all plywood gussets need to be scuff sanded to improve
adhesion. Especially the birch aircraft plywood. Lots easier to block
sand the plywood sheet prior to cutting out the gussets. Having said
all that a T-88 joint is pretty strong if you do everything wrong.
If you ever have doubts, try some destructive testing, you'll sleep
better at night ;-) .
Ben Charvet
On 1/29/2012 5:55 PM, rorichts wrote:
> --> Pietenpol-List message posted by: "rorichts"<stolflite@gmail.com>
>
> As for building ribs to what extent if any is sanding the joints and gussets
a part of the process? I have been told to hold to a minimum because of the sanded
material degrading the integrity of the joint.
> thanks
> rich
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=365167#365167
>
>
--
Ben Charvet, PharmD
Staff Pharmacist
Parrish Medical center
Message 24
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| Subject: | Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts |
You shouldn't have any=2C especially if the fork is cadmium plated and if y
our really concerned=2C used some dielectric compound on the threads. But
=2C then=2C like you I am not an engineer.
Doug Dever
In beautiful Stow Ohio
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts
From: helspersew@aol.com
Gardiner=2C
Here are a couple photos showing the jam nut on the fork threads=2C providi
ng for the adjustment and locking ability. I am not an engineer=2C I can't
imagine a corrosion problem between the fork threads and the 7075 aluminum
insert. Maybe someone with more technical knowledge could chime in (Jack or
Bill) and give us the official low-down. Hope this helps.
Dan Helsper
Puryear=2C TN
Message 25
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| Subject: | Galvanic Corrosion |
Now that's what we were looking for. However=2C I will say that we put all
stainless bolts on our float fittings (non structural) and had zero corros
ion after 10yrs. Go figure.
Doug Dever
In beautiful Stow Ohio
From: pietflyr@bellsouth.net
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Galvanic Corrosion
All right=2C Dan. Now you=92ve done it and inspired my Geekiness to come t
o the surface. Let=92s talk a bit about Galvanic Corrosion. This occurs w
hen you have dissimilar metals in intimate contact in an environment where
they can get wet=2C such as at the ends of lift struts. Not all dissimilar
metals cause problems ' it depends on how =93Anodic=94 they are. There
is a chart listing the Anodic Index of all common metals. To find the susc
eptibility to corrosion of any metal pair=2C find the difference in their a
nodic indices ' the corrosion will take place at the more anodic of the p
air (this is why on outboard motors that may be run in saltwater you will f
ind =93sacrificial anodes=94 of magnesium or zinc on the aluminum casings o
f the motor=2C so the corrosion takes place there rather than on the alumin
um.
The rule of thumb to be safe from galvanic corrosion is to have a differenc
e in anodic index of no more than about 0.15 - 0.20 for an outdoor environm
ent. Here is the chart:
Metal Category Anodic Inde
x (volts)
Gold=2C solid and plated 0.00
Rhodium plated on Silver-plated Copper 0.05
Silver=2C high Nickel-Copper alloys 0.15
Nickel=2C Titanium=2C Monel 0.30
Copper=2C Silver Solder=2C high Copper-Nickel 0.35
alloys=2C Nickel-Chromium alloys
Brasses & Bronzes 0.40
18% Chromium Stainless Steel 0.50
Chromium plating=2C Tin plating 0.60
Tin-Lead solder 0.65
Lead 0.70
Aluminum=2C wrought=2C 2000 series 0.75
Iron=2C plain carbon or low-alloy steel 0.85
Aluminum=2C wrought alloys other than 2000 0.90
series (such as 7075)
Cast Aluminum alloys=2C Cadmium plating 0.95
and Chromates
Hot-dip Zinc=2C galvanized steel 1.20
Zinc 1.25
Magnesium 1.75
Beryllium 1.85
One of the important things to notice is that cad-plated steel (such as AN
aircraft hardware) is not too bad when placed against 2024 series aluminum
=2C and is even better against 7075 series. What is surprising to most peo
ple is how bad stainless steel is against aluminum (difference of .40 to .5
0).
Hope this helps. By the way=2C I changed the subject to hopefully make thi
s chart easier to locate in the archives
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake=2C Virginia
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis
t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of helspersew@aol.com
Sent: Sunday=2C January 29=2C 2012 7:32 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Question about lower fork ends- aluminum struts
Gardiner=2C
Here are a couple photos showing the jam nut on the fork threads=2C providi
ng for the adjustment and locking ability. I am not an engineer=2C I can't
imagine a corrosion problem between the fork threads and the 7075 aluminum
insert. Maybe someone with more technical knowledge could chime in (Jack or
Bill) and give us the official low-down. Hope this helps.
Dan Helsper
Puryear=2C TN
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