---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 04/03/12: 20 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:04 AM - fuel tanks, flanging dies, etc. (Lawrence Williams) 2. 07:49 AM - Re: fuel tanks, flanging dies, etc. (Michael Perez) 3. 08:02 AM - Re: fuel tanks, flanging dies, etc. (tools) 4. 08:12 AM - Re: fuel tanks, flanging dies, etc. (airlion) 5. 08:14 AM - louvers for cowling area (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC AEROSPACE CORP]) 6. 08:17 AM - Re: Re: fuel tanks, flanging dies, etc. (H. Marvin Haught) 7. 09:34 AM - Re: louvers for cowling area (DaveG601XL) 8. 09:51 AM - Jeep Replica (Gary Boothe) 9. 09:53 AM - FW: Jeep Replica (Gary Boothe) 10. 10:04 AM - Re: Jeep Replica (Bill Church) 11. 10:23 AM - Re: Re: Jeep Replica (Gary Boothe) 12. 12:28 PM - Re: Any thoughts on this idea for turnbuckles (womenfly2) 13. 05:12 PM - Re: Any thoughts on this idea for turnbuckles (Kyle85) 14. 05:45 PM - Re: Re: Any thoughts on this idea for turnbuckles (Ken Bickers) 15. 07:53 PM - St. Croix Aerial Opinions? (Skagit) 16. 07:59 PM - Where to start? (Skagit) 17. 08:11 PM - Re: Where to start? (aerocarjake) 18. 09:54 PM - Re: St. Croix Aerial Opinions? (Ryan Mueller) 19. 10:34 PM - Piets West (Oscar Zuniga) 20. 10:50 PM - Re: Re: Any thoughts on this idea for turnbuckles (Clif Dawson) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:04:43 AM PST US From: Lawrence Williams Subject: Pietenpol-List: fuel tanks, flanging dies, etc. Do any of you metalworkers have a good idea for forming louvers?? Larry ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:49:38 AM PST US From: Michael Perez Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: fuel tanks, flanging dies, etc. Tony B's books talks some about louvers for exhaust stacks...not sure if he covers louvers for any other application. However, you may pick up some ideas. Michael Perez Karetaker Aero www.karetakeraero.com ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:02:53 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: fuel tanks, flanging dies, etc. From: "tools" I can't find them downstairs, but I have a couple books by Ron Fournier on sheet metal forming. I really seem to recall a section devoted to making louvers by hand with simple hammer forming techniques. They're usually on the shelves of the normal big book stores (Barnes and Nobles, etc) in the automotive section. Might be worth browsing through them. Tools Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=369940#369940 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:12:14 AM PST US From: airlion Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: fuel tanks, flanging dies, etc. Larry, Quality Machine in Lagrange Ga. Has a pattern that he uses for stamping out louvers. Bill Hollowell is his name and he made a pair for me. They look nice. Gardiner ________________________________ From: Lawrence Williams Sent: Tue, April 3, 2012 9:04:20 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: fuel tanks, flanging dies, etc. Do any of you metalworkers have a good idea for forming louvers?? Larry ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:14:26 AM PST US From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[ASRC AEROSPACE CORP]" Subject: Pietenpol-List: louvers for cowling area I found a local hotrod machine shop that had a set of louver dies of variou s sizes (long since have gone out of bidness) that they tried on my 2024T3 .025" cowling material and it didn't work well . The edges of the cuts were tearing at the corners so I gave them a test sheet of dead soft aluminum .025" (same mat'l as my engine cooling eyebrows are fabricated from to resist cracking from vibration.) and that worked great b ut I had to fasten the cut louver plates to my 2024T3 cowling and accomplished that as the sketches indicate. Mike C. ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:17:22 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: fuel tanks, flanging dies, etc. From: "H. Marvin Haught" How big do you need them and in what configuration (curved surface, etc)? You can buy flat sheets of louvers in different sizes from the aircraft supply houses, and they work fine to do a cut out and then rivet the panel in place. Even work well on curved surfaces as long as the surface is not a compound curve (curved more than one direction). I have made press forms of different sizes using MDF and successfully pressed them into panels. They are not easy to do. And you can flow form them with a rivet gun and a tool from Tin Man Technologies. M. Haught On Apr 3, 2012, at 10:02 AM, tools wrote: > > I can't find them downstairs, but I have a couple books by Ron Fournier on sheet metal forming. I really seem to recall a section devoted to making louvers by hand with simple hammer forming techniques. > > They're usually on the shelves of the normal big book stores (Barnes and Nobles, etc) in the automotive section. Might be worth browsing through them. > > Tools > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=369940#369940 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:34:33 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: louvers for cowling area From: "DaveG601XL" Mike, I saw Lon Dienst making the louvers on his Art Chester Jeep replica. As I recall, he basically drilled two holes on either end of the louver length and joined them with a single cut line and then bent metal. I am sure it was not as easy a task as I made it sound. I know he pitched a few pieces before getting it right. This picture does not show the louvers all that good, but they are visible. I think the bends are a little less aggressive than you show in your sketches. Good luck, -------- David Gallagher Zodiac 601 XL-B: flying, 200+ hours now Next project under construction: Aircamper Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=369956#369956 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/800px_art_chester_jeep_replica_205.jpg ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:51:51 AM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Jeep Replica Mike, That's a neat little plane! Any idea what engine? Gary Boothe NX308MB do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of DaveG601XL Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 9:34 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: louvers for cowling area --> Mike, I saw Lon Dienst making the louvers on his Art Chester Jeep replica. As I recall, he basically drilled two holes on either end of the louver length and joined them with a single cut line and then bent metal. I am sure it was not as easy a task as I made it sound. I know he pitched a few pieces before getting it right. This picture does not show the louvers all that good, but they are visible. I think the bends are a little less aggressive than you show in your sketches. Good luck, -------- David Gallagher Zodiac 601 XL-B: flying, 200+ hours now Next project under construction: Aircamper Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=369956#369956 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/800px_art_chester_jeep_replica_205.jpg ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 09:53:14 AM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: Pietenpol-List: FW: Jeep Replica ....sorry, that's for Dave.... Gary Boothe NX308MB Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: Gary Boothe [mailto:gboothe5@comcast.net] Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 9:52 AM Subject: Jeep Replica Mike, That's a neat little plane! Any idea what engine? Gary Boothe NX308MB do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of DaveG601XL Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 9:34 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: louvers for cowling area --> Mike, I saw Lon Dienst making the louvers on his Art Chester Jeep replica. As I recall, he basically drilled two holes on either end of the louver length and joined them with a single cut line and then bent metal. I am sure it was not as easy a task as I made it sound. I know he pitched a few pieces before getting it right. This picture does not show the louvers all that good, but they are visible. I think the bends are a little less aggressive than you show in your sketches. Good luck, -------- David Gallagher Zodiac 601 XL-B: flying, 200+ hours now Next project under construction: Aircamper Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=369956#369956 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/800px_art_chester_jeep_replica_205.jpg ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 10:04:23 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Jeep Replica From: "Bill Church" Gary, According to this video, it's a Menasco D4. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xhDs62G6r4 Bill (not Dave or Mike) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=369962#369962 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 10:23:01 AM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Jeep Replica Thanks, Bill! Gary Boothe NX308MB Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bill Church Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 10:04 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Jeep Replica --> Gary, According to this video, it's a Menasco D4. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xhDs62G6r4 Bill (not Dave or Mike) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=369962#369962 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 12:28:28 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Any thoughts on this idea for turnbuckles From: "womenfly2" Well, I would say just the buy aircraft turnbuckles. One spends more money going out to dinner a few time vs the cost of the TB's. There is really are not many of them in a Piet. Think about the safety factor and proven design, very cheap insurance at 1000 feet too. My 2-cents worth. -------- Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=369972#369972 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 05:12:46 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Any thoughts on this idea for turnbuckles From: "Kyle85" Yeah, I will be using store bought aircraft tb's. Looking at it now, mine are not lighter, stronger, or much cheaper. Thanks again for the input. I will always be trying to learn more and improve my airplane! Kyle -------- Airspeed, altitude or brains: Two are always needed to successfully complete the flight. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=369985#369985 ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 05:45:26 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Any thoughts on this idea for turnbuckles From: Ken Bickers Kyle, Whether or not you end up with store bought turnbuckles, I'd like applaud your thinking aloud about this. Were it not for inquiring minds like yours, there never would have been experimental aircraft. Everybody would be boring holes in the sky in spam cans. Cheers, Ken On Tue, Apr 3, 2012 at 6:10 PM, Kyle85 wrote: > > Yeah, I will be using store bought aircraft tb's. Looking at it now, mine are not lighter, stronger, or much cheaper. Thanks again for the input. I will always be trying to learn more and improve my airplane! > Kyle > > -------- > Airspeed, altitude or brains: Two are always needed to successfully complete the flight. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=369985#369985 > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 07:53:00 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: St. Croix Aerial Opinions? From: "Skagit" Hi all- New builder here. I'm hoping to begin building this fall and I'm going through all of the "up-front" decisions to figure out what I really want in a Piet. I'm seriously considering doing the Aerial biplane mod...love the biplane look. Can anyone share any opinions on the flying characteristics of the Aerial compared to the straight Piet? How about building considerations? Anything else? Thanks! -- Skagit out 8) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=369999#369999 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 07:59:52 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Where to start? From: "Skagit" Like I mentioned in my other post, I'm a new builder hoping to start this fall. Question for the group is...where do most people start? Wing ribs? Empenage? I was thinking of starting with the tail, mostly because I was thinking about building an RV-8 a while back ($!), and that just seems to be where you start, so I carried that thought over to the Piet. Any input appreciated... --Skagit out 8) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370000#370000 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 08:11:14 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Where to start? From: "aerocarjake" Welcome.... I started with the fuselage as that is what I was most excitied about.... I suggest you start with whatever part of the airplane YOU are motivated to build.... -------- Jake Schultz - curator, Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=370001#370001 ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 09:54:48 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: St. Croix Aerial Opinions? From: Ryan Mueller If you want to build a Pietenpol, then build a Pietenpol (Air Camper or Sky Scout). If you want a biplane, build an Aerial, Hatz, Parakeet, Great Lakes, etc etc....they are all different airplanes from what Pietenpol designed.... Just curious....what are your measurements (height/weight).... Ryan On Tue, Apr 3, 2012 at 9:51 PM, Skagit wrote: > > Hi all- > > New builder here. I'm hoping to begin building this fall and I'm going > through all of the "up-front" decisions to figure out what I really want in > a Piet. I'm seriously considering doing the Aerial biplane mod...love the > biplane look. > > Can anyone share any opinions on the flying characteristics of the Aerial > compared to the straight Piet? How about building considerations? > Anything else? > > Thanks! > > -- Skagit out 8) > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=369999#369999 > > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 10:34:06 PM PST US From: Oscar Zuniga Subject: Pietenpol-List: Piets West John asked- >when are you heading this way? Well, it turns out that I met a very nice gent at Ashland Parker Muni last Saturday and we've struck a deal where I can share his hangar. He's building a Q2 (super low wing), so with my high wing we should be a good fit. "My" side of the hangar should be cleared out by June if all goes as planned, so I should be able to fly Scout out West by the time genuine summertime comes to the Pacific Northwest. Late June, early July. Should be a great time to be out smashing bugs with the windscreen! Ashland Parker Muni is uncontrolled and friendly (more so than Medford Int'l., which has scheduled commercial flights, is controlled, and has roving guards keeping the world safe and demanding to see photo IDs). Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" Flying Squirrel N2069Z "Rocket" Medford/Ashland, OR website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 10:50:39 PM PST US From: "Clif Dawson" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Any thoughts on this idea for turnbuckles Thirty eight by my count. Let's see, assembly AN130-16S, fork on one end and cable eye on the other is $29.00 from AS&S. So 29 times 38 is $1102. Hmmmm. Certainly significantly less from Bed and Breakfast but still enough to give pause. I was fortunate enough to get them one sale from B&B some time ago for about $280 so abandoned my plans to make my own. Before buying them I had made up the tail rig, rudder and elevator wires without turnbuckles at all using the twist method for adjustment. The standing rigging back there still has no TB's. Also don't forget. This IS experimental aviation. Clif A mile of road will take you a mile, but a mile of runway will take you anywhere > > Well, I would say just the buy aircraft turnbuckles. One spends more > money going out to dinner a few time vs the cost of the TB's. There is > really are not many of them in a Piet. > > Think about the safety factor and proven design, very cheap insurance at > 1000 feet too. > > My 2-cents worth. > > -------- > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=369972#369972 > > > ----- > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.