---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 08/12/12: 35 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 02:49 AM - Re: "Experimental" Placard (Jack) 2. 05:28 AM - Re: "Experimental" Placard (Gene Rambo) 3. 06:09 AM - Re: "Experimental" Placard (Gary Boothe) 4. 06:36 AM - Re: "Experimental" Placard (helspersew@aol.com) 5. 06:47 AM - Re: "Experimental" Placard (Gary Boothe) 6. 06:48 AM - Re: "Experimental" Placard (Gary Boothe) 7. 08:54 AM - Blakesburg (Dick N) 8. 09:29 AM - Re: "Experimental" Placard (Bill Church) 9. 09:33 AM - Re: Re: "Experimental" Placard (gboothe5@comcast.net) 10. 11:39 AM - whats the best varnish to use (nightmare) 11. 12:06 PM - Re: Re: first piet piece done (V Groah) 12. 01:19 PM - BS Time (gboothe5@comcast.net) 13. 01:25 PM - Re: BS Time (Jim Boyer) 14. 01:26 PM - Re: whats the best varnish to use (K5YAC) 15. 01:29 PM - Re: Blakesburg (K5YAC) 16. 01:34 PM - Re: whats the best varnish to use (nightmare) 17. 01:37 PM - Re: Re: whats the best varnish to use (V Groah) 18. 01:40 PM - Re: BS Time (Jerry Dotson) 19. 02:30 PM - Re: Re: prop clearence (Ryan Mueller) 20. 02:52 PM - Re: BS Time (John Francis) 21. 03:12 PM - Re: whats the best varnish to use (Mario Giacummo) 22. 03:18 PM - Re: whats the best varnish to use (tools) 23. 03:21 PM - Re: BS Time (dwilson) 24. 03:44 PM - Re: Re: first piet piece done (Ryan Mueller) 25. 03:50 PM - Re: Re: BS Time (Gary Boothe) 26. 04:09 PM - Chic Magnet (Gary Boothe) 27. 06:33 PM - Re: first piet piece done (Jerry Dotson) 28. 07:05 PM - Re: whats the best varnish to use (nightmare) 29. 07:33 PM - Re: "Experimental" Placard (Clif Dawson) 30. 07:48 PM - Re: whats the best varnish to use (Clif Dawson) 31. 08:45 PM - Re: Blakesburg (Ryan Mueller) 32. 08:49 PM - Re: Chic Magnet (Ryan Mueller) 33. 10:20 PM - Re: Re: whats the best varnish to use (shad bell) 34. 10:30 PM - Got about 1.5 hrs of piet time today (shad bell) 35. 11:39 PM - Re: whats the best varnish to use (nightmare) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 02:49:38 AM PST US From: "Jack" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard Gary, why the =BD hatch? Jack Textor DSM NX1929T _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Boothe Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 11:14 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard Yes. It=92s just one of those labels that you get from the EAA. Gary Boothe NX308MB From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene Rambo Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 7:45 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done Is the word experimental on the placard? Know it says amateur built... On Aug 11, 2012, at 12:48 PM, "Gary Boothe" wrote: Mr. Fed had no issue with my =93stacked=94 lettering, which I had copied from others. Interestingly, he chooses to see no value to the =91X=92 in the N-number. Nor was he put off by the fact that I do not have the wording, =93EXPERIMENTAL=94 plastered on the side of the fuselage. His ONLY concern was that, somewhere in the passenger cockpit, amongst the other words on that placard, that the =91experimental=92 word was visible. Gary Boothe NX308MB -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of taildrags Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 9:23 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done --> < taildrags@hotmail.com> Hey Jim (Markle)- just curious... I looked in the FARs in the section about markings and it says that the "N" (or "NX", in our case) is to be followed by the registration numbers/letter. I see that the markings on your rudder are "stacked", so to speak, and not continuous. I guess the second part follows the first and meets the letter of the regs but I was wondering if anyone has mentioned that to you, or if you've seen any other tail markings in the fashion that yours are? It also says that they should not have any ornamentation. I'd be careful about that stylized letter "J" that you've got there ;o) -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford/Ashland, OR Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380660#380660 http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:28:47 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard From: Gene Rambo Can't read the placard On Aug 12, 2012, at 12:13 AM, "Gary Boothe" wrote: > Yes. It=99s just one of those labels that you get from the EAA. > > > > Gary Boothe > NX308MB > > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-li st-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene Rambo > Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 7:45 PM > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done > > Is the word experimental on the placard? Know it says amateur built... > > On Aug 11, 2012, at 12:48 PM, "Gary Boothe" wrote: > > Mr. Fed had no issue with my =9Cstacked=9D lettering, which I h ad copied from others. Interestingly, he chooses to see no value to the =98X=99 in the N-number. Nor was he put off by the fact that I do not h ave the wording, =9CEXPERIMENTAL=9D plastered on the side of the fuselage. His ONLY concern was that, somewhere in the passenger cockpit, am ongst the other words on that placard, that the =98experimental=99 word was visible. > > > > Gary Boothe > NX308MB > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-li st-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of taildrags > Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 9:23 AM > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done > > --> > > Hey Jim (Markle)- just curious... I looked in the FARs in the section abou t markings and it says that the "N" (or "NX", in our case) is to be followed by the registration numbers/letter. I see that the markings on your rudder are "stacked", so to speak, and not continuous. I guess the second part fo llows the first and meets the letter of the regs but I was wondering if anyo ne has mentioned that to you, or if you've seen any other tail markings in t he fashion that yours are? > > It also says that they should not have any ornamentation. I'd be careful a bout that stylized letter "J" that you've got there ;o) > > -------- > Oscar Zuniga > Medford/Ashland, OR > Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" > A75 power > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380660#380660 > > > > > > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > > http://forums.matronics.com > > http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > http://forums.matronics.com > http://www.matronics.com/contribution > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:09:36 AM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard Thought I=92d save some room for instruments, in the future. Gary Boothe NX308MB From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jack Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2012 2:49 AM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard Gary, why the =BD hatch? Jack Textor DSM NX1929T _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Boothe Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 11:14 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard Yes. It=92s just one of those labels that you get from the EAA. Gary Boothe NX308MB From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene Rambo Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 7:45 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done Is the word experimental on the placard? Know it says amateur built... On Aug 11, 2012, at 12:48 PM, "Gary Boothe" wrote: Mr. Fed had no issue with my =93stacked=94 lettering, which I had copied from others. Interestingly, he chooses to see no value to the =91X=92 in the N-number. Nor was he put off by the fact that I do not have the wording, =93EXPERIMENTAL=94 plastered on the side of the fuselage. His ONLY concern was that, somewhere in the passenger cockpit, amongst the other words on that placard, that the =91experimental=92 word was visible. Gary Boothe NX308MB -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of taildrags Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 9:23 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done --> < taildrags@hotmail.com> Hey Jim (Markle)- just curious... I looked in the FARs in the section about markings and it says that the "N" (or "NX", in our case) is to be followed by the registration numbers/letter. I see that the markings on your rudder are "stacked", so to speak, and not continuous. I guess the second part follows the first and meets the letter of the regs but I was wondering if anyone has mentioned that to you, or if you've seen any other tail markings in the fashion that yours are? It also says that they should not have any ornamentation. I'd be careful about that stylized letter "J" that you've got there ;o) -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford/Ashland, OR Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380660#380660 http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:36:02 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard From: helspersew@aol.com There he goes....adding weight and complication......the dark side.... Dan Helsper Puryear, TN -----Original Message----- From: Gary Boothe Sent: Sun, Aug 12, 2012 8:09 am Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard Thought I=99d save some room for instruments, in the future. Gary Boothe NX308MB From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jack Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2012 2:49 AM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard Gary, why the =C2=BD hatch? Jack Textor DSM NX1929T From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Boothe Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 11:14 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard Yes. It=99s just one of those labels that you get from the EAA. Gary Boothe NX308MB From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene Rambo Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 7:45 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done Is the word experimental on the placard? Know it says amateur built... On Aug 11, 2012, at 12:48 PM, "Gary Boothe" wrote: Mr. Fed had no issue with my =9Cstacked=9D lettering, which I h ad copied from others. Interestingly, he chooses to see no value to the =98X=99 in the N-number. Nor was he put off by the fact that I do not have the wording, =9CEXPERIMENTAL=9D plastered on the side of the fuselage. His ONLY concern was that, somewhere in the passenger cock pit, amongst the other words on that placard, that the =98experimenta l=99 word was visible. Gary Boothe NX308MB -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of taildrags Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 9:23 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done --> Hey Jim (Markle)- just curious... I looked in the FARs in the section about markings and it says that the "N" (or "NX", in our case) is to be followed by the registration numbers/letter. I see that the markings on your rudde r are "stacked", so to speak, and not continuous. I guess the second part follows the first and meets the letter of the regs but I was wondering if a nyone has mentioned that to you, or if you've seen any other tail markings in the fashion that yours are? It also says that they should not have any ornamentation. I'd be careful a bout that stylized letter "J" that you've got there ;o) -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford/Ashland, OR Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380660#380660 http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:47:04 AM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard My grandson wants a clockso he knows when it=99s time to go home Gary Boothe NX308MB From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of helspersew@aol.com Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2012 6:36 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard There he goes....adding weight and complication......the dark side.... Dan Helsper Puryear, TN -----Original Message----- From: Gary Boothe Sent: Sun, Aug 12, 2012 8:09 am Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard Thought I=99d save some room for instruments, in the future. Gary Boothe NX308MB From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com ] On Behalf Of Jack Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2012 2:49 AM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard Gary, why the =C2=BD hatch? Jack Textor DSM NX1929T _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Boothe Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 11:14 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard Yes. It=99s just one of those labels that you get from the EAA. Gary Boothe NX308MB From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene Rambo Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 7:45 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done Is the word experimental on the placard? Know it says amateur built... On Aug 11, 2012, at 12:48 PM, "Gary Boothe" wrote: Mr. Fed had no issue with my =9Cstacked=9D lettering, which I had copied from others. Interestingly, he chooses to see no value to the =98X=99 in the N-number. Nor was he put off by the fact that I do not have the wording, =9CEXPERIMENTAL=9D plastered on the side of the fuselage. His ONLY concern was that, somewhere in the passenger cockpit, amongst the other words on that placard, that the =98experimental=99 word was visible. Gary Boothe NX308MB -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of taildrags Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 9:23 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done --> < taildrags@hotmail.com> Hey Jim (Markle)- just curious... I looked in the FARs in the section about markings and it says that the "N" (or "NX", in our case) is to be followed by the registration numbers/letter. I see that the markings on your rudder are "stacked", so to speak, and not continuous. I guess the second part follows the first and meets the letter of the regs but I was wondering if anyone has mentioned that to you, or if you've seen any other tail markings in the fashion that yours are? It also says that they should not have any ornamentation. I'd be careful about that stylized letter "J" that you've got there ;o) -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford/Ashland, OR Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380660#380660 http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:48:36 AM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard I=99ll get a better picture todaystand by. Gary Boothe NX308MB From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene Rambo Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2012 5:28 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard Can't read the placard On Aug 12, 2012, at 12:13 AM, "Gary Boothe" wrote: Yes. It=99s just one of those labels that you get from the EAA. Gary Boothe NX308MB From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gene Rambo Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 7:45 PM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done Is the word experimental on the placard? Know it says amateur built... On Aug 11, 2012, at 12:48 PM, "Gary Boothe" wrote: Mr. Fed had no issue with my =9Cstacked=9D lettering, which I had copied from others. Interestingly, he chooses to see no value to the =98X=99 in the N-number. Nor was he put off by the fact that I do not have the wording, =9CEXPERIMENTAL=9D plastered on the side of the fuselage. His ONLY concern was that, somewhere in the passenger cockpit, amongst the other words on that placard, that the =98experimental=99 word was visible. Gary Boothe NX308MB -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of taildrags Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 9:23 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done --> < taildrags@hotmail.com> Hey Jim (Markle)- just curious... I looked in the FARs in the section about markings and it says that the "N" (or "NX", in our case) is to be followed by the registration numbers/letter. I see that the markings on your rudder are "stacked", so to speak, and not continuous. I guess the second part follows the first and meets the letter of the regs but I was wondering if anyone has mentioned that to you, or if you've seen any other tail markings in the fashion that yours are? It also says that they should not have any ornamentation. I'd be careful about that stylized letter "J" that you've got there ;o) -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford/Ashland, OR Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380660#380660 http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 08:54:04 AM PST US From: "Dick N" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Blakesburg I am glad to hear some of you will be attending. It's really a great show. I am planning on going down on Wed and dparting on Sat also. Not on the list, I ialked with Lorin Miller at Brodhead and he is also planning on attending. Itall depends on weather though, last too years have been too windy for me. Dick N. ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:29:14 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: "Experimental" Placard From: "Bill Church" One of these, Gary? BC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380750#380750 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/exp_150.jpg ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 09:33:07 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: "Experimental" Placard From: gboothe5@comcast.net Exactly! ------Original Message------ From: Bill Church Sender: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com ReplyTo: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: "Experimental" Placard Sent: Aug 12, 2012 9:29 AM One of these, Gary? BC Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380750#380750 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/exp_150.jpg Sent on the Sprint Now Network from my BlackBerry ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 11:39:05 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: whats the best varnish to use From: "nightmare" Whats the best poly/ spar varnish to use? is the home depot/ lowes spar varnish just as good as anything else? -------- Paul Donahue Started 8-3-12 do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380755#380755 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 12:06:40 PM PST US From: V Groah Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done Our guy needed the NX on the tail but started to hit us for having the numb er on the wing without the NX. He ruled since it did not have the N it was considered a decoration and did not count for or against us. The guy was great to us=2C very professional and through. He did want to s ee the tag but did not need the big experimental lettering anywhere. We ha ve the small tag on the front dash that says experimental. That seemed to fit the bill with him. He even looked it up in his reg book to be sure. Vic NX414MV Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done From: generambo@msn.com Is the word experimental on the placard? Know it says amateur built... On Aug 11=2C 2012=2C at 12:48 PM=2C "Gary Boothe" wr ote: Mr. Fed had no issue with my =93stacked=94 lettering=2C which I had copied from others. Interestingly=2C he chooses to see no value to the =91X=92 in the N-number. Nor was he put off by the fact that I do not have the wording =2C =93EXPERIMENTAL=94 plastered on the side of the fuselage. His ONLY conc ern was that=2C somewhere in the passenger cockpit=2C amongst the other wor ds on that placard=2C that the =91experimental=92 word was visible. Gary Boothe NX308MB -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of taildrags Sent: Saturday=2C August 11=2C 2012 9:23 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done --> Hey Jim (Markle)- just curious... I looked in the FARs in the section about markings and it says that the "N" (or "NX"=2C in our case) is to be follow ed by the registration numbers/letter. I see that the markings on your rud der are "stacked"=2C so to speak=2C and not continuous. I guess the second part follows the first and meets the letter of the regs but I was wonderin g if anyone has mentioned that to you=2C or if you've seen any other tail m arkings in the fashion that yours are? It also says that they should not have any ornamentation. I'd be careful a bout that stylized letter "J" that you've got there =3Bo) -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford/Ashland=2C OR Air Camper NX41CC "=3BScout"=3B A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380660#380660 http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List http://forums.matronics.com http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 01:19:52 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: BS Time From: gboothe5@comcast.net Took 308MB out to the ramp for her first fill-up. All inspection panels are on...she looks official. Lesson learned? Allow plenty of BS time! One guy drove all the way down from the north end, just 'cuz he saw the tall tires! Still waiting for the chic magnet to kick in... Gary from Cool NX308MB Sent on the Sprint Now Network from my BlackBerry ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 01:25:43 PM PST US From: Jim Boyer Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: BS Time So it looks like the Piet really does draw people. Better make up a handout to give all the lookers so you can get in some flying time versus to much talking time Cheers, Jim B. do not archive ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 01:26:32 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: whats the best varnish to use From: "K5YAC" I applied two coats of Helmsman's spar varnish on my wings, tail surfaces and everything that would be covered. It is supposed to be good stuff. On areas that will be exposed or visible, I am using System 3's marine grade varnish... it is supposed to have superior UV protectors and it goes on clear (not yellowish), so the wood really looks beautiful. The other major difference... Helmsman's = $15 at Home Depot or other home improvement stores. System 3 = $40 at Woodcraft or other wood working or marine stores. Mileage may vary... this is just what I've found. -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380763#380763 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 01:29:29 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Blakesburg From: "K5YAC" I'm considering going... it all depends on work. I'll let y'all know as time gets closer if I plan to be there. Tyler and I stopped in on our way up to Brodhead... we would love to see the place in full swing. -------- Mark Chouinard Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380764#380764 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 01:34:28 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: whats the best varnish to use From: "nightmare" thanks Mark. Paul -------- Paul Donahue Started 8-3-12 do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380766#380766 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 01:37:29 PM PST US From: V Groah Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: whats the best varnish to use We used the spar varnish on the parts that are covered to seal the wood. O n the areas that show=2C like inside the cockpit we used PPG automotive cle ar coat. It is made for a durable finish coat with UV protection and is to ugh. Makes a great finish=2C used three coats. sanded between coats. A bi t expensive. Vic NX414MV > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: whats the best varnish to use > From: hangar10@cox.net > Date: Sun=2C 12 Aug 2012 13:26:26 -0700 > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > > > I applied two coats of Helmsman's spar varnish on my wings=2C tail surfac es and everything that would be covered. It is supposed to be good stuff. O n areas that will be exposed or visible=2C I am using System 3's marine gra de varnish... it is supposed to have superior UV protectors and it goes on clear (not yellowish)=2C so the wood really looks beautiful. The other majo r difference... > > Helmsman's = $15 at Home Depot or other home improvement stores. > System 3 = $40 at Woodcraft or other wood working or marine stores. > > Mileage may vary... this is just what I've found. > > -------- > Mark Chouinard > Wings=2C Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Lan ding Gear > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380763#380763 > > > > > > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 01:40:36 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: BS Time From: "Jerry Dotson" I understand Gary. I can draw a crowd just fire it up. Go around the patch and we have a BS session going! -------- Jerry Dotson 59 Daniel Johnson Rd Baker, FL 32531 First flight June 16,2012 Started building July, 2009 21" wheels Lycoming O-235 C2C Jay Anderson CloudCars prop 76 X 44 do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380768#380768 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/a10_111.jpg ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 02:30:23 PM PST US From: Ryan Mueller Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: prop clearence Product 3 Description; Original Pietenpol Air Camper Supplemental Plans Includes drawings showing the installation of the Corvair engine. This packet of plans includes drawing for a longer fuselage, Corvair motor mount drawing, Corvair propeller hub drawing, 65 hp Continental engine motor mount drawing. Original Air Camper Supplemental Drawings (Extended Fuselage to be used with A-65's and modern engines) Product 3 Price = $60.00 US Dollars *Free Shipping Therein lies your motor mount drawing=85. Ryan Mueller rmueller23@gmail.com On Aug 11, 2012, at 12:29 PM, Gary Boothe wrote: > WOW! An =93improved=94 Piet? I am afeared you have released the Cracken=85 > > Gary Boothe > NX308MB > Do not archive > > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf OfRyan M > Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 10:09 AM > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: prop clearence > > How does engine choice effect prop clearance? I am building an "improved" piet with "cub style" gear but it's drawn with the Ford engine. Do you gain or loose prop clearance by using a Continental? > > (archives searched) > > Thanks, > > Ryan > > From: dgaldrich > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Sent: Sunday, July 29, 2012 6:39 PM > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: prop clearence > > > Just for reference, FAR Part 23.925 requires a 9 inch prop clearance for conventional gear aircraft with the aircraft in level flight attitude or takeoff attitude (whichever is most critical) and at max gross weight. Also says that there must be a positive clearance with the most critical gear suspension collapsed (i.e. broken bungees) and a flat tire on the same side. > > I know we don't have to conform to Part 23 but, like AC 43-13, it's a darn good place to find useful information. Like the guidance from Uncle Tony, ignore it at your peril. > > Dave Aldrich > > do not archive > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=379527#379527http://www.matr onics.com/Navigator?Pietenp; --> ======================= > > > > > > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > http://forums.matronics.com > http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > > > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 02:52:32 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: BS Time From: "John Francis" Shove the potato into the front of your shorts....not the rear. -------- John Francis Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380776#380776 ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 03:12:23 PM PST US From: Mario Giacummo Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: whats the best varnish to use Just regard it have ultraviolet filter... anything work, you have to think just in "encapsulate" the wood, how... it is your choice, the ultravioilet filter .. it is an "add on" that come in evrything you buy today, so, use it it. You can use even epoxy disolved in acetone, or a good wood paint if you like it. did you see old painted wood furniture?. regards Mario Giacummo 2012/8/12 nightmare > pauldonahuepilot@yahoo.com> > > Whats the best poly/ spar varnish to use? is the home depot/ lowes spar > varnish just as good as anything else? > > -------- > Paul Donahue > Started 8-3-12 > do not archive > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380755#380755 > > ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 03:18:30 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: whats the best varnish to use From: "tools" This is really a loaded question, unfortunately... The first question that needs to be answered is what system you're going to use to cover you plane. As it turns out, as far as I can tell, if you're using poly fiber stuff, you need an "epoxy varnish", as the MEK used in that system attacks normal varnishes during its application. Varnish used to be a clue as to what the finish was... no so much anymore. So to make a long story short, check with the manufacturer of your covering system and see what's compatible. Of course, you can use two different varnishes depending whether or not it comes in contact. Otherwise, I've found the most "normal" finish available through major retailers is as good as anything. I just recently used some hinky cool high priced stuff through a high end retailer (woodcraft or somebody) and got hugely burned. Unless it's a really obvious finish (like danish oil, tung oil, shellac, lacquer, etc.) you don't really know if it's real varnish, or some sort of polymerized something or another so only experience will tell if it's really suitable. Generally speaking, from over 25 years of experience, the finishes available these days are really very good and well exceed ANYTHING available back in the thirties, so don't worry too much about it. I've found if you can find something that'll be available for enough years that you can reapply some corporate knowledge, you'll like it. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380780#380780 ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 03:21:31 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: BS Time From: "dwilson" Ok! Gary, I know how the chick magnet thing works. I would suggest that you should have someone else stand next to your plane! Ouch. Dan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380781#380781 ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 03:44:39 PM PST US From: Ryan Mueller Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done FAR 45 Subpart C spells it all out=85. According to 45.22(b), since a Pietenpol is a US registered aircraft that is amateur built and which has the same external configuration as an aircraft built at least 30 years ago it may be operated without displaying marks in accordance with 45.21 and 45.23 through 45.33=85.how does that address items brought up in this thread? If you display the N number using only the capital letter N and registration number, you must have the EXPERIMENTAL placards displayed near each entrance to the cockpit. If you display your N number as NX and the registration you do not need to place any EXPERIMENTAL placards in either cockpit; the fact that the aircraft is experimental is communicated by the N number being displayed as NX and the number (and your little amateur built tag). This is allowed because of the "same external configuration as an aircraft built 30 years ago" provision. 45.22(b)(1) specifies that the registration marks be displayed at least two inches high on each side of the fuselage or vertical tail surface consisting of the Roman capital letter N *followed by*=85=85it does not specify whether it has to be "followed by" either vertically or horizontally. 45.25(b)(1) does specify horizontally, however 45.22(b) exempts you from that because of the 30 years or older provision. Markings must be in accordance with 45.21(c), which states they have to be permanently affixed, have no ornamentation, contrast in color with the background, and be legible. "Ornamentation" is not specifically defined, so I would say since they did not provide a definition as to what the administrator THINKS it means, you would have to go by the dictionary definition. Using that definition of what it means to be ornamented, a Fed or their rep could take issue with the J=85.but since it contrasts in color and is legible you can argue right back. 45.29 contains various requirements regarding height, width, spacing, uniformity=85=85but the 30 years or older provision exempts you from the requirements of that section as well=85. Ryan Mueller rmueller23@gmail.com On Aug 12, 2012, at 2:06 PM, V Groah wrote: > Our guy needed the NX on the tail but started to hit us for having the number on the wing without the NX. He ruled since it did not have the N it was considered a decoration and did not count for or against us. > > The guy was great to us, very professional and through. He did want to see the tag but did not need the big experimental lettering anywhere. We have the small tag on the front dash that says experimental. That seemed to fit the bill with him. He even looked it up in his reg book to be sure. > > Vic NX414MV > > > > > > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done > From: generambo@msn.com > Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2012 22:44:58 -0400 > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > > Is the word experimental on the placard? Know it says amateur built... > > On Aug 11, 2012, at 12:48 PM, "Gary Boothe" wrote: > > Mr. Fed had no issue with my =93stacked=94 lettering, which I had copied from others. Interestingly, he chooses to see no value to the =91X=92 in the N-number. Nor was he put off by the fact that I do not have the wording, =93EXPERIMENTAL=94 plastered on the side of the fuselage. His ONLY concern was that, somewhere in the passenger cockpit, amongst the other words on that placard, that the =91experimental=92 word was visible. > > > > Gary Boothe > NX308MB > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of taildrags > Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 9:23 AM > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done > > --> > > Hey Jim (Markle)- just curious... I looked in the FARs in the section about markings and it says that the "N" (or "NX", in our case) is to be followed by the registration numbers/letter. I see that the markings on your rudder are "stacked", so to speak, and not continuous. I guess the second part follows the first and meets the letter of the regs but I was wondering if anyone has mentioned that to you, or if you've seen any other tail markings in the fashion that yours are? > > It also says that they should not have any ornamentation. I'd be careful about that stylized letter "J" that you've got there ;o) > > -------- > Oscar Zuniga > Medford/Ashland, OR > Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" > A75 power > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380660#380660 > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > > > http://forums.matronics.com > > > http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > > > > st" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > ttp://forums.matronics.com > =_blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > > > ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 03:50:39 PM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: BS Time HA-HA! In that case, I want my money back! Gary Boothe NX308MB -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of dwilson Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2012 3:21 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: BS Time Ok! Gary, I know how the chick magnet thing works. I would suggest that you should have someone else stand next to your plane! Ouch. Dan Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380781#380781 ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 04:09:25 PM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: Pietenpol-List: Chic Magnet Maybe the magnet is working... Gary Boothe NX308MB -----Original Message----- From: Rosita Dimbo [mailto:carolinenday1@yahoo.com] Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2012 8:46 AM Subject: Hello my dear Hello my dear Nice to meet you,how is life I hope this letter will finds all of your house holds in the best of health .it is my pleasure to penning down a few lines to check things with you.I am Rosita by name, i know you will be surprise to hear from me.i believe that one thousand journey begins with a step. Though that we have not see each other face to face but God in his infinite mercy have his own way to bring two people together ,be it friends. i think we can write together. >From my own little understanding i believe that love or friendship makes the world go around,I want to share life experience and culture with you,I do hope by the end of this letter you will bring smile to my face.i believe you will have a little time for me.i have something VERY important to tell you.It's never my desire to remain what I am now,but struggling to become what am. Give my love to your family and lots of love to you too. Stay in touch and do write to me! Take care your new friend Rosita ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 06:33:04 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: first piet piece done From: "Jerry Dotson" I addressed those items and printed out 45.21-45.23 and the DAR still would not budge so I put the &^%$# experimental sticker on it. I figured if I had that much trouble with him a ramp check might get ugly. Sometimes it is better to side with City Hall than fight. -------- Jerry Dotson 59 Daniel Johnson Rd Baker, FL 32531 First flight June 16,2012 Started building July, 2009 21" wheels Lycoming O-235 C2C Jay Anderson CloudCars prop 76 X 44 do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380791#380791 ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 07:05:51 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: whats the best varnish to use From: "nightmare" great info guys. i guess since everything will be protected from UV by the fabric anyway, all i really have to do is just incapsulate the wood ,for moisture protection, with some spar varnish from home depot . since im planning on the randolph system , any varnish will do. thank you for the responses. Paul -------- Paul Donahue Started 8-3-12 do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380794#380794 ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 07:33:53 PM PST US From: "Clif Dawson" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: "Experimental" Placard Get one of those backwards ones. :-) Clif "Wait for that wisest of all counselors; Time." (Pericles) My grandson wants a clockso he knows when it=99s time to go home Gary Boothe NX308MB ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 07:48:09 PM PST US From: "Clif Dawson" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: whats the best varnish to use Like our Brit Buds..... Clif "I don't want to go to heaven. None of my friends are there."Oscar Wilde or a good wood paint if you like it. did you see old painted wood furniture?. regards Mario Giacummo ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 08:45:24 PM PST US From: Ryan Mueller Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Blakesburg Are you arriving via car, attempting a short-field landing in your big jet airliner, or bringing the Travel Air? Ryan Mueller rmueller23@gmail.com On Aug 11, 2012, at 10:03 PM, Gene Rambo wrote: > I'm planning on making Blakesburg. Not sure what days. (not in my Piet, of course) > > Gene > > On Aug 11, 2012, at 6:59 PM, JOSEPH SWITHIN wrote: > >> Dick, >> I will get to Blakesburg on Thursday around noon. I will leave Saturday afternoon. >> >> Joe >> Morris, IL >> hunting and gathering >> >> >> >> > > > 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D > 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D > 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D > 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= 3D > ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 08:49:15 PM PST US From: Ryan Mueller Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Chic Magnet You need to hook Rosita up with Jorge from Hanford... Ryan Mueller rmueller23@gmail.com On Aug 12, 2012, at 6:09 PM, Gary Boothe wrote: > > Maybe the magnet is working... > > Gary Boothe > NX308MB > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rosita Dimbo [mailto:carolinenday1@yahoo.com] > Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2012 8:46 AM > To: undisclosed recipients: > Subject: Hello my dear > > Hello my dear > Nice to meet you,how is life > I hope this letter will finds all of your house holds in the best of health > .it is my pleasure to penning down a few lines to check things with you.I am > Rosita by name, i know you will be surprise to hear from me.i believe that > one thousand journey begins with a step. > Though that we have not see each other face to face but God in his infinite > mercy have his own way to bring two people together ,be it friends. i think > we can write together. > >> =46rom my own little understanding i believe that love or friendship makes the > world go around,I want to share life experience and culture with you,I do > hope by the end of this letter you will bring smile to my face.i believe you > will have a little time for me.i have something VERY important to tell > you.It's never my desire to remain what I am now,but struggling to become > what am. > Give my love to your family and lots of love to you too. > Stay in touch and do write to me! > Take care > your new friend > Rosita > > > > > ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 10:20:34 PM PST US From: shad bell Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: whats the best varnish to use With the "Latex Corvair Rocket" we used Helmsman Spar Urethane only-throu ghout the whole structure, and after 6+ years and 314+ hrs of flying have h ad no problems (using the Ceco-Bond Fabric System which is water based).- And as others have said, if you use poly fiber process you will need to us e epoxy varnish where the fabric glues to the structure. I am currently bui lding an all wood aerobatic biplane, and have used Minwax spar urethane on the complete structure, but I am applying 2-3 coats of poly fiber epoxy var nish where the fabric will glue to the structure.- The Epoxy can be appli ed over the Spar Urethane, but make sure the 1st coat of epoxy is a light c oat so it wont lift the urethane off the wood.- The only advantage to usi ng the hardware store Spar Urethane is a big cost savings (mabey $200-300 f or the whole airplane).- In my oppinion, it is worth only buying as much epoxy varnish as you need for areas that come in contact with the fabric, the spar urethane is much less toxic, and faster and eaiser to use, the ep oxy varnish is a 3 part, base, activor, and thinner.- It is much easier t o just open a can and varnish what you need to, than guess how much epoxy v arnish to mix up, and worry about wasting it when doing small jobs. - - Just My oppinion, Shad --- On Sun, 8/12/12, V Groah wrote: From: V Groah Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: whats the best varnish to use We used the spar varnish on-the parts that are covered to seal the-wood .- On the-areas that show, like inside the cockpit we used PPG automoti ve clear coat.- It is made-for a durable finish coat with UV protection and is tough.- Makes a great finish,-used three-coats. sanded betwee n coats. -A bit expensive.- Vic NX414MV - > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: whats the best varnish to use > From: hangar10@cox.net > Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2012 13:26:26 -0700 > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > > > I applied two coats of Helmsman's spar varnish on my wings, tail surfaces and everything that would be covered. It is supposed to be good stuff. On areas that will be exposed or visible, I am using System 3's marine grade v arnish... it is supposed to have superior UV protectors and it goes on clea r (not yellowish), so the wood really looks beautiful. The other major diff erence... > > Helmsman's = $15 at Home Depot or other home improvement stores. > System 3 = $40 at Woodcraft or other wood working or marine stores. > > Mileage may vary... this is just what I've found. > > -------- > Mark Chouinard > Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landi ng Gear > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380763#380763 > > > = > > > ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 10:30:51 PM PST US From: shad bell Subject: Pietenpol-List: Got about 1.5 hrs of piet time today I was able to get a couple flights in the piet today.- Ohio was blessed w ith highs in the low 80's-high 70's this weekend.- I got to fly a little bit of formation time with a friend of mine who just brought home his new S pacewalker 2.- I have always admired the Spacewalker as a kid building an d flying model airplanes. I never thought I would be flying along side a fu ll scale one in the likes of a pietenpol when I was a star eyed kid who had to mow lawns all summer just to buy enough balsa wood to finish a RC Model 'er set of plans I got for my birthday.- - Keep dreaming, keep building, and then start flying, You get there befor yo u know it! - Shad do not archive ________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________ Time: 11:39:07 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: whats the best varnish to use From: "nightmare" thanks Shad, sounds good to me. Paul -------- Paul Donahue Started 8-3-12 do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=380805#380805 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.