---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 09/17/12: 20 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:40 AM - Aircraft Log (John Francis) 2. 03:42 AM - Re: Aircraft Log (Jerry Dotson) 3. 04:48 AM - Re: Aircraft Log (Gary Boothe) 4. 05:02 AM - Re: Re: Update and tailskid operations (C N Campbell) 5. 05:14 AM - Re: Aircraft Log (jarheadpilot82) 6. 05:19 AM - Re: Re: Update and tailskid operations (Kip and Beth Gardner) 7. 05:28 AM - Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 09/15/12 (jarheadpilot82) 8. 05:29 AM - Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 09/15/12 (jarheadpilot82) 9. 07:09 AM - Re: Update and tailskid operations (bender) 10. 09:11 AM - cool vintage style wool coveralls (Oscar Zuniga) 11. 10:03 AM - Re: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 09/15/12 (Ryan Mueller) 12. 10:42 AM - Re: Aircraft Log (Ryan Mueller) 13. 11:24 AM - Re: cool vintage style wool coveralls (taildrags) 14. 05:28 PM - Re: Jeff's external aileron cables (jarheadpilot82) 15. 05:49 PM - Re: Re: Jeff's external aileron cables (Brett Phillips) 16. 06:18 PM - Re: Jeff's external aileron cables (jarheadpilot82) 17. 06:35 PM - Re: Jeff's external aileron cables (DO NOT ARCHIVE) 18. 07:14 PM - Re: Re: Jeff's external aileron cables (Greg Cardinal) 19. 07:34 PM - Re: cool vintage style wool coveralls (Clif Dawson) 20. 08:38 PM - Re: Jeff's external aileron cables (taildrags) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:40:18 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Aircraft Log From: "John Francis" With mykitplane crashing and my log lost, I am looking for another log source that is mac friendly. I was looking at facebook this morning and am considering keeping my log there. Has anyone tried this? -------- John Francis Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383289#383289 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:42:51 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Aircraft Log From: "Jerry Dotson" John I used a spiral wound notebook and a pencil.........no crashes. -------- Jerry Dotson 59 Daniel Johnson Rd Baker, FL 32531 First flight June 16,2012 Started building July, 2009 21" wheels Lycoming O-235 C2C Jay Anderson CloudCars prop 76 X 44 do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383290#383290 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 04:48:13 AM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Aircraft Log John, I put a few pictures on FB (OK, 89 to be exact) in an album for my plane. That would be plenty to convince anyone that I built it, but so would a collection of images in a 'folder' on your computer. One could easily design a simple Excel sheet that would keep track of hours and dollars, too. Funny thing is...my FAA inspector never even opened my photo album to view the build pictures!! Nor was he interested in the stack of receipts; but that's all it would take to satisfy the requirement of proving that you built it. Gary Boothe NX308MB -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Francis Sent: Monday, September 17, 2012 3:40 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Aircraft Log --> With mykitplane crashing and my log lost, I am looking for another log source that is mac friendly. I was looking at facebook this morning and am considering keeping my log there. Has anyone tried this? -------- John Francis Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383289#383289 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 05:02:39 AM PST US From: "C N Campbell" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Update and tailskid operations What's the problem with steerable tail wheels? Do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "bender" Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 11:00 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Update and tailskid operations > > > Thanks... i do have brakes.. > i'm looking forward to taxiing it around to see how it goes.. > i have a wheel around but i'm hoping not to use it > I wondered about the UHMW and if it would last at all > > i actually have a piece of an old tire screwed to the plate now.. > not sure it would last long at all but i thought i would try a couple of > replaceable shoes and see if anything worked > > jeff > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383062#383062 > > > ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 05:14:27 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Aircraft Log From: "jarheadpilot82" John, If you really want to upload your build pictures and log, and you are a Mac user, why not use iWeb, build a simple website and just have it hosted somewhere? Then you have all the records on your hard drive, but have it online as well. Just a thought. iWeb is not that hard to use. If you have questions, contact me off-line, and I would be glad to help. -------- Semper Fi, Terry Hand Athens, GA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383295#383295 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:19:51 AM PST US From: Kip and Beth Gardner Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Update and tailskid operations POS (Purist Obsession Syndrome)? ;) BHP didn't use no stinkin' steerable tailwheel! A good example of a tailwheel-free Piet is Frank Pavliga's Sky Gypsy - just a steel skid. Works for him, but he only flies off of grass (or snow, sometimes). Do not archive Kip Gardner On Sep 17, 2012, at 8:02 AM, C N Campbell wrote: > > > > What's the problem with steerable tail wheels? > Do not archive > ----- Original Message ----- From: "bender" > > To: > Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 11:00 AM > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Update and tailskid operations > > >> > >> >> Thanks... i do have brakes.. >> i'm looking forward to taxiing it around to see how it goes.. >> i have a wheel around but i'm hoping not to use it >> I wondered about the UHMW and if it would last at all >> >> i actually have a piece of an old tire screwed to the plate now.. >> not sure it would last long at all but i thought i would try a >> couple of replaceable shoes and see if anything worked >> >> jeff >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383062#383062 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 05:28:38 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 09/15/12 From: "jarheadpilot82" Bruce, I have copied the info below from the [url]FlyCorvair.com[/url] website- "Subj: Insurance I see on your Web site that you were talking with the Vice President and Chief Technician of Falcon Insurance. I'm wondering how insurance companies are feeling these days toward your Corvair conversion, and if you have a feel for what kind of difference in rates a person might expect to pay, say comparing to an O-200 installation? In my case we're talking about a Christavia Mk 1 installation. I know it's probably depending a lot on the type of airframe and other factors, but could you say anything at all regarding any progress made on the insurance rate aspect of the Corvair? Thanks! Mike Sharkey, Ontario, Canada Reply from WW: We've been in continuous contact with Falcon on this issue. Although it has been reported that Falcon will not insure some types of automotive powered aircraft, my understanding is that they look at it on a case by case basis. Several Corvair builders, including Mark Jones (KR-2S tri-gear) and Randy Stout (Zenair 601HD tri-gear), have purchased insurance through Falcon for their aircraft. I spent some time speaking in person with Bob Mackey, Falcon VP, at the LSA Expo in Sebring, Fla. In several follow up phone calls, Bob quoted us a very reasonable rate for our Corvair powered 601. The rate was not significantly different than what we pay Falcon to insure Grace's 1946 Taylorcraft. Bob explained that the primary component was the fact that both aircraft are taildraggers. Tricycle geared aircraft owners could expect a lower rate. The policy came with some small stipulations about time in type training that were more than reasonable. If you're interested in insurance, I suggest you contact him directly at EAA HQ for the straight scoop." I realize that is an older post. I would recommend that you email William Wynne and ask him directly about insurance options for Corvair powered aircraft. I seem to recall he wrote recently that there is someone that insuring Corvair powered aircraft fairly readily. I think he had a recent discussion about it on his website, or on his blog at [url]FLyCorvair.net[/url] -------- Semper Fi, Terry Hand Athens, GA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383297#383297 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:29:32 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 09/15/12 From: "jarheadpilot82" Bruce, I have copied the info below from the [url]FlyCorvair.com[/url] website- "Subj: Insurance I see on your Web site that you were talking with the Vice President and Chief Technician of Falcon Insurance. I'm wondering how insurance companies are feeling these days toward your Corvair conversion, and if you have a feel for what kind of difference in rates a person might expect to pay, say comparing to an O-200 installation? In my case we're talking about a Christavia Mk 1 installation. I know it's probably depending a lot on the type of airframe and other factors, but could you say anything at all regarding any progress made on the insurance rate aspect of the Corvair? Thanks! Mike Sharkey, Ontario, Canada Reply from WW: We've been in continuous contact with Falcon on this issue. Although it has been reported that Falcon will not insure some types of automotive powered aircraft, my understanding is that they look at it on a case by case basis. Several Corvair builders, including Mark Jones (KR-2S tri-gear) and Randy Stout (Zenair 601HD tri-gear), have purchased insurance through Falcon for their aircraft. I spent some time speaking in person with Bob Mackey, Falcon VP, at the LSA Expo in Sebring, Fla. In several follow up phone calls, Bob quoted us a very reasonable rate for our Corvair powered 601. The rate was not significantly different than what we pay Falcon to insure Grace's 1946 Taylorcraft. Bob explained that the primary component was the fact that both aircraft are taildraggers. Tricycle geared aircraft owners could expect a lower rate. The policy came with some small stipulations about time in type training that were more than reasonable. If you're interested in insurance, I suggest you contact him directly at EAA HQ for the straight scoop." I realize that is an older post. I would recommend that you email William Wynne and ask him directly about insurance options for Corvair powered aircraft. I seem to recall he wrote recently that there is someone that insuring Corvair powered aircraft fairly readily. I think he had a recent discussion about it on his website, or on his blog at -------- Semper Fi, Terry Hand Athens, GA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383298#383298 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 07:09:31 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Update and tailskid operations From: "bender" for me it was just the weight and simplicity.. it does seem like it would be high on the coolness factor but weight that far aft was the biggest thing jeff Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383308#383308 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 09:11:40 AM PST US From: Oscar Zuniga Subject: Pietenpol-List: cool vintage style wool coveralls I ordered, and received, a set of the military surplus coveralls that Douwe mentioned. They are a very nice wool material, soft and smooth (not itchy), and as pointed out, they fit the period appearance very nicely. However, that's all that they fit on me. The problem seems to be that Italian military men are somewhat shorter from shoulders to crotch than long-torso Americans, so while they fit me perfectly elsewhere, they are too short in the torso. I am about 5'-9" and weigh 154. I am going to return these to Sportsman's Guide UNLESS there is someone out there who would like to have them and thinks they will fit. In that case, and since I have to pay return shipping for them anyway, I'll send them to any Pieter who would like to have them, no charge, my goodwill gesture for today. Let me know off-line, otherwise they're going back in the mail to Sportsman's Guide in a day or two. Oscar Zuniga Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" Medford, OR ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 10:03:51 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Pietenpol-List Digest: 18 Msgs - 09/15/12 From: Ryan Mueller Last I had heard, Falcon was fully insuring if you purchase a built engine from William.....my understanding was that they would also insure an engine built using his conversion method (i.e. owner built) without hassle. Best bet is to call Falcon and explain the airframe/engine combo you are considering, and see what they say. When I talked to them back around '09, they told me no problem (for the Piet/owner built WW conversion combo).... Ryan On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 7:28 AM, jarheadpilot82 wrote: > jarheadpilot82@hotmail.com> > > Bruce, > > I have copied the info below from the [url]FlyCorvair.com[/url] website- > > "Subj: Insurance > > Date: 2/2/05 > > I see on your Web site that you were talking with the Vice President and > Chief Technician of Falcon Insurance. I'm wondering how insurance companies > are feeling these days toward your Corvair conversion, and if you have a > feel for what kind of difference in rates a person might expect to pay, say > comparing to an O-200 installation? In my case we're talking about a > Christavia Mk 1 installation. I know it's probably depending a lot on the > type of airframe and other factors, but could you say anything at all > regarding any progress made on the insurance rate aspect of the Corvair? > > Thanks! Mike Sharkey, Ontario, Canada > > Reply from WW: > We've been in continuous contact with Falcon on this issue. Although it > has been reported that Falcon will not insure some types of automotive > powered aircraft, my understanding is that they look at it on a case by > case basis. Several Corvair builders, including Mark Jones (KR-2S tri-gear) > and Randy Stout (Zenair 601HD tri-gear), have purchased insurance through > Falcon for their aircraft. I spent some time speaking in person with Bob > Mackey, Falcon VP, at the LSA Expo in Sebring, Fla. In several follow up > phone calls, Bob quoted us a very reasonable rate for our Corvair powered > 601. The rate was not significantly different than what we pay Falcon to > insure Grace's 1946 Taylorcraft. Bob explained that the primary component > was the fact that both aircraft are taildraggers. Tricycle geared aircraft > owners could expect a lower rate. The policy came with some small > stipulations about time in type training that were more than reasonable. If > you're interested in insurance, I sugges! > t you contact him directly at EAA HQ for the straight scoop." > > I realize that is an older post. I would recommend that you email William > Wynne and ask him directly about insurance options for Corvair powered > aircraft. I seem to recall he wrote recently that there is someone that > insuring Corvair powered aircraft fairly readily. I think he had a recent > discussion about it on his website, or on his blog at > [url]FLyCorvair.net[/url] > > -------- > Semper Fi, > > Terry Hand > Athens, GA > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383297#383297 > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:42:14 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Aircraft Log From: Ryan Mueller You could setup a free blog at http://www.blogger.com. It's owned by Google, so barring them completely discontinuing the service your data should be safe. It's super simple to use, and if something was to happen you can export your blog in XML format to move it elsewhere if need be.... On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 6:47 AM, Gary Boothe wrote: > > John, > > I put a few pictures on FB (OK, 89 to be exact) in an album for my plane. > That would be plenty to convince anyone that I built it, but so would a > collection of images in a 'folder' on your computer. One could easily > design > a simple Excel sheet that would keep track of hours and dollars, too. Funny > thing is...my FAA inspector never even opened my photo album to view the > build pictures!! Nor was he interested in the stack of receipts; but that's > all it would take to satisfy the requirement of proving that you built it. > > Gary Boothe > NX308MB > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John > Francis > Sent: Monday, September 17, 2012 3:40 AM > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Aircraft Log > > --> > > With mykitplane crashing and my log lost, I am looking for another log > source that is mac friendly. I was looking at facebook this morning and am > considering keeping my log there. Has anyone tried this? > > -------- > John Francis > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383289#383289 > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 11:24:34 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: cool vintage style wool coveralls From: "taildrags" We have a winner! I'll be sending the coveralls to another lucky Piet lister to try on ;o) do not archive -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford/Ashland, OR Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383325#383325 ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 05:28:42 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Jeff's external aileron cables From: "jarheadpilot82" Jeff, I could not find the diagram in the '32 manual of the aileron cable setup as you used . I did see it in the 1933 Manual on the Sky Scout. I see that the flight control cable connections in the cockpit are slightly different without the horn as is normally used. What I can't quite figure is the geometry of the cable between the upper portion of the aileron horns. Does the cable go underneath the skin of the wings as they do in the flight controls that most guys do, or do they run above the skin and across the trailing edge of the wing? A picture would probably answer all of my questions. I hope that I am not asking a dumb question. I just can't see it in my "mind's eye" as they say. Thanks for your response. -------- Semper Fi, Terry Hand Athens, GA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383366#383366 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 05:49:24 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Jeff's external aileron cables From: Brett Phillips The early style aileron system runs the inter-aileron cable forward from the upper aileron horn to a pulley, then between some wooden fairleads to identical components and connections on the opposite side. This is all external to the wing, so you can think of it either as a clothesline, or as an upper Midwestern version of vortex generation... Brett Phillips DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 06:18:53 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Jeff's external aileron cables From: "jarheadpilot82" Thanks Brett for the explanation. I thought that might be the case, but I appreciate the clarification, nonetheless. Makes inspecting the cables a lot easier, but I wonder what effect the elements has on the condition of the cable over time. If anyone has a picture of the setup, that would be nice to see. -------- Semper Fi, Terry Hand Athens, GA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383373#383373 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 06:35:11 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Jeff's external aileron cables From: "DO NOT ARCHIVE" I doubt that the elements affect that cable much differently than any of the other cables that are out in the breeze on these airplanes. I will say that the early style aileron system does clutter up the cockpit floor somewhat, and it is easy for the uninitiated to step on the cables when climbing into or out of the airplane. Ours has the early style ailerons, and the system works fine once you are used to it and know where you can and can't put your feet. There are some good reasons that Mr Pietenpol referred to the later ships as "Improved" Air Campers. The aileron control system is one of those improvements. -------- Brett Phillips PLEASE DO NOT ARCHIVE! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383374#383374 ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 07:14:49 PM PST US From: "Greg Cardinal" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Jeff's external aileron cables Terry, Check out Walt Bowe's pictures here: http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/Walt%20Bowe/pictures.htm He has external aileron cables. Greg Cardinal ----- Original Message ----- From: "jarheadpilot82" Sent: Monday, September 17, 2012 7:28 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Jeff's external aileron cables > > > Jeff, > > I could not find the diagram in the '32 manual of the aileron cable setup > as you used . I did see it in the 1933 Manual on the Sky Scout. I see that > the flight control cable connections in the cockpit are slightly different > without the horn as is normally used. What I can't quite figure is the > geometry of the cable between the upper portion of the aileron horns. Does > the cable go underneath the skin of the wings as they do in the flight > controls that most guys do, or do they run above the skin and across the > trailing edge of the wing? A picture would probably answer all of my > questions. > > I hope that I am not asking a dumb question. I just can't see it in my > "mind's eye" as they say. Thanks for your response. > > -------- > Semper Fi, > > Terry Hand > Athens, GA > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383366#383366 > > > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 07:34:40 PM PST US From: "Clif Dawson" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: cool vintage style wool coveralls I bought them too. I'm now 5' 7" with 29" leg. They JUST fit. So there's some kind of benchmark for you. Clif I will beg you for advice, your reply will be concise, and I will listen very nicely and then go out and do exactly what I want > > > I ordered, and received, a set of the military surplus coveralls that > Douwe mentioned. > They are a very nice wool material, soft and smooth (not itchy), and as > pointed out, > they fit the period appearance very nicely. However, that's all that they > fit on me. > The problem seems to be that Italian military men are somewhat shorter > from shoulders > to crotch than long-torso Americans, so while they fit me perfectly > elsewhere, they > are too short in the torso. I am about 5'-9" and weigh 154. > I am going to return these to Sportsman's Guide UNLESS there is someone > out there who > would like to have them and thinks they will fit. In that case, and since > I have to > pay return shipping for them anyway, I'll send them to any Pieter who > would like to > have them, no charge, my goodwill gesture for today. Let me know > off-line, otherwise > they're going back in the mail to Sportsman's Guide in a day or two. > Oscar Zuniga > Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" > Medford, OR ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 08:38:21 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Jeff's external aileron cables From: "taildrags" Yeah, and Walt also has an adjustable leading edge on his vertical stabilizer. It's in one of the photos. Man, is Westcoastpiet a gold mine of graphical information! It's the "Tony Bingelis" of the Piet photo world ;o) -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford/Ashland, OR Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=383381#383381 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.