Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:32 AM - Re: round vs. Flat Lacing (woodflier@aol.com)
2. 06:46 AM - Thanks Kevin! (Douwe Blumberg)
3. 06:57 AM - what did BHP use to rib stitch?? (Douwe Blumberg)
4. 08:10 AM - Re: Re: Notes on FBG Post-Accident Repair & Recovery (Dan Yocum)
5. 09:53 AM - Re: Notes on FBG Post-Accident Repair & Recovery (Jim Boyer)
6. 10:06 AM - Vert-Offset (TriScout)
7. 10:08 AM - Re: Notes on FBG Post-Accident Repair & Recovery (Gmail)
8. 10:46 AM - Observations on Plans-Built Aileron Hinges (kevinpurtee)
9. 11:00 AM - Quick Update on the Plane & Me & Shelley (kevinpurtee)
10. 11:46 AM - Re: Quick Update on the Plane & Me & Shelley (TOM STINEMETZE)
11. 12:36 PM - skid taxi (bender)
12. 12:43 PM - Big Piet group (1planeguy)
13. 01:13 PM - Re: Notes on FBG Post-Accident Repair & Recovery (K5YAC)
14. 01:57 PM - Re: Notes on FBG Post-Accident Repair & Recovery (dgaldrich)
15. 03:19 PM - Re: Notes on FBG Post-Accident Repair & Recovery (IT Girl)
16. 03:29 PM - Re: Quick Update on the Plane & Me & Shelley (IT Girl)
17. 04:02 PM - Re: skid taxi (helspersew@aol.com)
18. 04:17 PM - Re: skid taxi (bender)
19. 04:20 PM - Re: Vert-Offset (Ben Charvet)
20. 04:29 PM - Re: Big Piet group (Frank Metcalfe)
21. 04:30 PM - Re: skid taxi (gboothe5@comcast.net)
22. 05:06 PM - EAA Magazine (AMsafetyC@aol.com)
23. 06:08 PM - Re: Re: EAA Calendar photo (dog67@aol.com)
24. 07:02 PM - Re: Re: Quick Update on the Plane & Me & Shelley (Dortch, Steven D MAJ MIL USA NGB)
25. 07:13 PM - Re: Re: skid taxi (helspersew@aol.com)
26. 07:14 PM - Re: Vert-Offset (TriScout)
27. 08:34 PM - Re: EAA Magazine (aerocarjake)
28. 09:17 PM - rib lacing cord - round vs flat (Oscar Zuniga)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: round vs. Flat Lacing |
Greg, like Kevin, I used the round and didn't find it hard to work with. O
n a Piet, I don't think the fact that you can see the stitches after you're
finished a bit more with the round makes a difference. When I had to do a
field repair to an elevator at Oshkosh this year, I used the flat, and I di
d have to make sure it wasn't twisted going over the ribs. On future coveri
ngs, I'll probably stay with the round cord.
Matt Paxton
NX629ML
Message 2
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Thanks Kevin for lots of stuff (sent you an off list email) but thanks most
for taking the time to share this info with us all.
I don't think one could put a price on this hard-won, real-world knowledge
which will help builders stay safe!
Good going man.
D
Message 3
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| Subject: | what did BHP use to rib stitch?? |
Well, knowing BHP's propensity for depression era "thrift", here's a few of
his rib-stitching possibilities.
1. Used Dental floss, scrounged from the city dump or his dentist buddy
(oops, probably hadn't been invented)
2. Threads from an old greasy rag he unraveled.
3. horse hair scrounged from the local plow horse
4. Rib-Stitching cord salvaged from a busted up "crate" which had
"come-a-cropper" and been pushed behind a hangar at the field back in 1919.
5. Or, most likely.. Some sort of round thread/cord that he "felt" was
touch enough.
Absolutely "no archive"
Douwe
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Notes on FBG Post-Accident Repair & Recovery |
On 10/01/2012 12:52 PM, K5YAC wrote:
>
> Thanks for sharing this information Kevin. Those last couple of photos aren't
easy to look at, knowing where they came from... but the details offer a bit
of confidence.
I second the motion.
do not archive
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Notes on FBG Post-Accident Repair & Recovery |
Hi Kevin,
Thanks for the information and photos of FBG's damage. I would say Garys wood struts
have definitely proven themselves as up to the task. It is also a good indication
of the strength of the Piet design.
How is the rebuild coming now?
Cheers to you and Shelley.
Jim B.
Message 6
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Hi Folks..
I have a question for you Piet guru's...
I've been flying my A65 powered GN-1 for over a yr now. I am not 100% comfortable
w/having to put a big trim tab on the rudder..even in cruise flight. I even
built a rear view mirrow to watch it while trundling along enroute to the local
cafe's. That little wood fixed vert-stab can't be all that strong w/lots of
rudder in at climb/some at cruise...
..then I recently watched Waldo Pfeiffer and noticed the scene they filmed flying
down Main St in Elgin, texas back during filming in '74...noticing the huge
offset in the Jenny stab to accomodate the 200hp Hisso's they used in place of
the weak ol' 90 horse OX-Fivers..(the scene where Axel is screaming; "Marybeth!".....
"Marybethhh!")
1. How much is the right amount of offset for the A65?
2. Anyone else have this concern?
I'm just eyeballing it, figuring any offset is better than none, but don't want
too much either. I am starting with just over a half inch (9/16")..
I attached a short vid. Somewhere about mid-vid, I shine camera into mirror to
watch it, but the video appears to show less rudder than it seems to require in
real life. (rudder deflection not as pronounced in real life). Will attempt
foto attachment as well... Thx in advance, Larry
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7SBy6z9W5wE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384480#384480
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/cc_843.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/ee_955.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/bb_531.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dd_190.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/axl_895.jpg
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Notes on FBG Post-Accident Repair & Recovery |
I agree. Thanks Kevin. It's very generous of you to share this info.
Greg Bacon
Garratt Callahan
gbacon@g-c.com
(573)489-4795
On Oct 2, 2012, at 11:53 AM, Jim Boyer <boyerjrb@comcast.net> wrote:
> Hi Kevin,
>
> Thanks for the information and photos of FBG's damage. I would say Garys w
ood struts have definitely proven themselves as up to the task. It is also a
good indication of the strength of the Piet design.
>
> How is the rebuild coming now?
>
> Cheers to you and Shelley.
>
> Jim B.
>
>
>
>
>
>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Observations on Plans-Built Aileron Hinges |
I used the hardware store strap hinges. Had a guy at work tack the loops closed
for me. (My welding was not that subtle at that point.) We used 2" packing
tape for gap seals. All of this worked great for over 300 hours and three wing-tip
dragging episodes (two right, one left). Despite this abuse, the strap
hinges proved very durable.
We had the chance to thoroughly inspect the hinges during recovery ops. The aileron
on the right side was intact but was stripped from the wing. The aileron
on the left side was completely intact and still attached to the wing. The
hinges on the right side aileron were still firmly attached. Didn't check the
wing side hinges on that side. The hinges on the left side were still firmly
attached on both sides. The left wing was thoroughly damaged but the aileron
and the hinges were in great shape. I had a brief fantasy about ripping the
aileron off with my hands. Fat chance. Very durable.
More information to consider.
--------
Kevin "Axel" Purtee
NX899KP
Austin/San Marcos, TX
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384483#384483
Message 9
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| Subject: | Quick Update on the Plane & Me & Shelley |
FBG: The tail woodwork repair is complete. Hinges are re-attached. Need to rebuild
the control horns. Metal's coming for that. Wood and metal for the center
section are ordered. A very generous individual sent me a complete set of
Charlie Rubeck wing ribs. I have all the wing spars and the fuselage longerons
in the garage. An EXTRAORDINARILY generous individual sent me the better part
of a corvair motor with most of the conversion parts (unbelievable!). WW
will use that as a basis for my engine rebuild. We hope to run the engine at
Corvair College 24 in SC in November.
Me: I'm fine. I limp, cannot run, and fatigue a little quicker than before, but
I'm at 90%. Hope to be running by the end of the year. I flew my friend's
Wichhawk on Friday with no problems, then spent the next 2 hours working on it,
crawling underneath, reaching into the guts, etc. The trim system bowden cable
jammed. Hope to fix it this weekend so I can fly it again.
Shelley: completely recovered. Doing the band-Mom thing full throttle with her
boy and having a ball.
Once again, thank you all for your kind thoughts, prayers and support.
--------
Kevin "Axel" Purtee
NX899KP
Austin/San Marcos, TX
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384486#384486
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Quick Update on the Plane & Me & Shelley |
>>Shelley: completely recovered. Doing the band-Mom thing full throttle with her
boy and having a ball.<<
Band Mom, huh? I think Hockey Mom or even Momma Bear might be more believable.
Stinemetze
do not archive
Message 11
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So.... taxiing with a skid is interesting..
I have individual brakes but i think i need a little more leverage... so longer
levers are coming... its not too bad turning..forward stick and a blast of air
works pretty well...
getting closer
http://s1125.photobucket.com/albums/l593/jfaithbass/?action=view¤t=VID_20121002_141648.mp4
jeff
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384497#384497
Message 12
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Any members of the Big Piet builders group from Georgia on this list?
Would like to ask a couple of questions...
Jeremy Casey
jeremy@kilocharlie.us
--
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Notes on FBG Post-Accident Repair & Recovery |
yocum137(at)gmail.com wrote:
> On 10/01/2012 12:52 PM, K5YAC wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Thanks for sharing this information Kevin. Those last couple of photos aren't
easy to look at, knowing where they came from... but the details offer a
bit of confidence.
> >
> >
>
> I second the motion.
>
> do not archive
Is that Dan Yokum? Where have YOU been hiding?
--------
Mark Chouinard
Wings, Center Section and Empannage and Fuse framed up - Working on Landing Gear
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384505#384505
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Notes on FBG Post-Accident Repair & Recovery |
Kevin
Thank you for your most excellent post. Your observations and pics came at an
opportune moment. I am currently working on the turtle deck and had built mine
about to the original FBG height because I like the look of the slightly lower
turtle deck. The new one now in the jig will be 9 inches above the longerons
at the peak, exactly the same height as the forward arches. My shoulder harness
attach points will be about the same distance behind the seats as you used.
Again thank you for your willingness to share what must be a rather unpleasant
experience.
Dave Aldrich
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384511#384511
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Notes on FBG Post-Accident Repair & Recovery |
[quote="gbacon67(at)gmail.com"]I agree. Thanks Kevin. It's very generous of you
to share this info.
Greg BaconGarratt Callahan
gbacon@g-c.com (gbacon@g-c.com)
(573)489-4795
On Oct 2, 2012, at 11:53 AM, Jim Boyer wrote:
>
> Hi Kevin,
> Thanks for the information and photos of FBG's damage. I would say Garys wood
struts have definitely proven themselves as up to the task. It is also a good
indication of the strength of the Piet design.
> How is the rebuild coming now?
> Cheers to you and Shelley.
> Jim B.
>
>
>
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> [b]
I think we will have a complete engine after CC24, all of the tailfeathers are
complete (repaired/reused/rebuilt), and a full set of ribs were delivered yesterday.
Spars were delivered last week, so we are ready to begin building the
wings, after we move some tables from the hangar to the garage.
Kevin is in the garage everyday, his rehab plan is working well.
--------
Shelley Tumino
IT Girl
wife of "Axel"
NX899KP
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384516#384516
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Quick Update on the Plane & Me & Shelley |
Tom,
Aedan is in the high-school marching band, and having a complete blast. I made
sure they knew that I am creative and handy. Now they have a new project for
me every day.
Aedan is the flute player on the 35 yard line in this picture. I couldn't be more
proud
--------
Shelley Tumino
IT Girl
wife of "Axel"
NX899KP
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384517#384517
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_0084_194.jpg
Message 17
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Hey Jeff,
Very cool. Looks great! You want to use the official Piet list Industrial
Fish Scale to test the lbs. of thrust? I can shoot it up to you in one day
UPS.
Dan Helsper
Puryear, TN
-----Original Message-----
From: bender <jfaith@solairusaviation.com>
Sent: Tue, Oct 2, 2012 2:36 pm
Subject: Pietenpol-List: skid taxi
>
So.... taxiing with a skid is interesting..
I have individual brakes but i think i need a little more leverage... so lo
nger
levers are coming... its not too bad turning..forward stick and a blast of
air
works pretty well...
getting closer
http://s1125.photobucket.com/albums/l593/jfaithbass/?action=view¤t
=VID_20121002_141648.mp4
jeff
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384497#384497
Message 18
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that could be fun.... i'm seeing about 1800 rpm at full throttle now
feels windy
jeff
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384521#384521
Message 19
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I have about 1/2 inch in mine and its not quite enough.
Ben Charvet
NX866BC (140 hrs)
On 10/2/2012 1:06 PM, TriScout wrote:
>
> Hi Folks..
>
> I have a question for you Piet guru's...
>
> I've been flying my A65 powered GN-1 for over a yr now. I am not 100% comfortable
w/having to put a big trim tab on the rudder..even in cruise flight. I even
built a rear view mirrow to watch it while trundling along enroute to the local
cafe's. That little wood fixed vert-stab can't be all that strong w/lots
of rudder in at climb/some at cruise...
>
> ..then I recently watched Waldo Pfeiffer and noticed the scene they filmed flying
down Main St in Elgin, texas back during filming in '74...noticing the huge
offset in the Jenny stab to accomodate the 200hp Hisso's they used in place
of the weak ol' 90 horse OX-Fivers..(the scene where Axel is screaming; "Marybeth!".....
"Marybethhh!")
>
> 1. How much is the right amount of offset for the A65?
> 2. Anyone else have this concern?
>
> I'm just eyeballing it, figuring any offset is better than none, but don't want
too much either. I am starting with just over a half inch (9/16")..
>
> I attached a short vid. Somewhere about mid-vid, I shine camera into mirror to
watch it, but the video appears to show less rudder than it seems to require
in real life. (rudder deflection not as pronounced in real life). Will attempt
foto attachment as well... Thx in advance, Larry
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7SBy6z9W5wE
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384480#384480
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/cc_843.jpg
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/ee_955.jpg
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/bb_531.jpg
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/dd_190.jpg
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/axl_895.jpg
>
>
--
Ben Charvet, PharmD
Staff Pharmacist
Parrish Medical center
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Big Piet group |
Sure we are here--... ask away
--- On Tue, 10/2/12, 1planeguy <1planeguy@kilocharlie.us> wrote:
From: 1planeguy <1planeguy@kilocharlie.us>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Big Piet group
Any members of the Big Piet builders group from Georgia on this list?
Would like to ask a couple of questions...
Jeremy Casey
jeremy@kilocharlie.us
--
Message 21
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U2F5LCAiWWVzLCIgSmVmZi4gWW91IGRvIHdhbnQgdG8gYmUgb2ZmaWNpYWwuLi5kb24ndCB5b3U/
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Message 22
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Mark,
Nice job on the landing gear and vise setup article.
Thanks
John
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: EAA Calendar photo |
De Nada, Oscar.
I'll pass on the Growler commentary. She was pretty happy when her squadro
n went over from the Prowlers - systems are a lot easier to work on. Not h
er call as to the aircraft - c'est la vie.
Beware re-using fiber insert lock nuts.
Cheers
jon
-----Original Message-----
From: taildrags <taildrags@hotmail.com>
Sent: Mon, Oct 1, 2012 10:32 pm
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: EAA Calendar photo
Jon: thanks for your contributions to aviation and medicine, and thank your
wife
for her service as well. And I just got this month's Sport Aviation in tod
ay's
mail and I see that the NTSB is also blaming re-used fiber insert locknuts
for
the failure of the trim tab fasteners on Galloping Ghost. I re-use fiber a
nd
nylon insert locknuts a couple of times, but if I can turn them with my fin
gers-
no. Apparently the flutter and/or earlier flights were enough to loosen th
e
nuts and contribute to the failure.
Side note: the Growler people are not universally liked. My Prowler buds a
re
not happy that illegitimates ("Navy") displaced their role and led to the d
emise
of the Prowler as the spectrum dominators. I am one of those who believes
that
the Prowler personifies EW and that the Growler is nothing but a glorified
Hornet with a couple of iPads in it.
do not archive
--------
Oscar Zuniga
Medford, OR
Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"
A75 power
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384442#384442
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Quick Update on the Plane & Me & Shelley |
Shelly, My mother was proud of me in the marching band. She pointed out to everyone
that I was the only kid in step.
Blue Skies,
Steve D
----- Original Message -----
From: IT Girl <shlizbth@gmail.com>
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Quick Update on the Plane & Me & Shelley
>
> Tom,
> Aedan is in the high-school marching band, and having a complete blast. I made
sure they knew that I am creative and handy. Now they
> have a new project for me every day.
>
> Aedan is the flute player on the 35 yard line in this picture. I
> couldn't be more proud
>
> --------
> Shelley Tumino
> IT Girl
> wife of "Axel"
> NX899KP
>
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384517#384517
>
>
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_0084_194.jpg
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 25
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Jeff,
Send me you address off-list. (Hangar?)
Dan
-----Original Message-----
From: bender <jfaith@solairusaviation.com>
Sent: Tue, Oct 2, 2012 6:17 pm
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: skid taxi
>
that could be fun.... i'm seeing about 1800 rpm at full throttle now
feels windy
jeff
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384521#384521
Message 26
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I'm not really looking to get rid of the trim tab completely. Just hoping to tone
it down to a small trim tab without such a big bend in it. I think that half
inch should about do the trick.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384533#384533
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: EAA Magazine |
I agree... Has not thought to tie into the removable vice grips - nice....!!
--------
Jake Schultz - curator,
Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=384537#384537
Message 28
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| Subject: | rib lacing cord - round vs flat |
I'll weigh in on the lacing cord issue. My opinion is to go with the round
=2C but my reason for saying that is purely emotional and aesthetic. I lov
e fabric airplanes=2C and part of the reason why I love them has to do with
the geometry and visual appeal of the lacing=2C the pinked edges=2C the fi
nishing tapes=2C the whole system of covering an airframe with fabric and t
he way it looks. I just find it to be beautiful.
On our airplanes=2C it's not about streamlining=2C aerodynamic efficiency
=2C or anything like that... it's about appearance. I don't think an Air C
amper goes fast enough to benefit from having glassy-smooth surfaces but if
you want your airplane to look smooth and sleek=2C use smooth and sleek th
ings and finishes on it. I like for a fabric airplane to look like a fabri
c airplane=2C and seeing the lacing under the fabric is part of the visual
appeal to me.
do not archive
Oscar Zuniga
Medford=2C Oregon
Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"
A75 power
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