---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Fri 03/01/13: 28 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:05 AM - Re: newbie question (airlion2@gmail.com) 2. 06:06 AM - How I decided to build a Pietenpol (Donald Lane) 3. 06:56 AM - Re: a view from the cockpit (aerocarjake) 4. 07:12 AM - carb heat muff (Rick Schreiber) 5. 07:43 AM - Re: newbie question (Jack Phillips) 6. 08:32 AM - Re: carb heat muff (Ken Bickers) 7. 09:09 AM - Re: newbie question (airlion2@gmail.com) 8. 11:56 AM - Re: newbie question (kmercer) 9. 12:05 PM - Re: Re: newbie question (Gary Boothe) 10. 12:22 PM - Jack Textor actually read my Uncle Tony's books! (santiago morete) 11. 12:34 PM - Re: Jack Textor actually read my Uncle Tony's books! (TOM STINEMETZE) 12. 01:24 PM - Re: powder coating is almost impossible to remove (Andrew Eldredge) 13. 02:14 PM - tie downs for fly-ins... (Douwe Blumberg) 14. 02:17 PM - Re: my new tag line (DOMIT) 15. 02:25 PM - Re: carb heat muff (Gary Boothe) 16. 02:27 PM - FW: Your my guinea pig and you didn't even know it. (Gary Boothe) 17. 02:28 PM - tying down (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[Vantage Partners, LLC]) 18. 02:52 PM - Re: my new tag line (cjborsuk) 19. 03:10 PM - Re: carb heat muff (Rick Schreiber) 20. 03:27 PM - Re: FW: Your my guinea pig and you didn't even know it. (Rick Schreiber) 21. 04:04 PM - Re: tie downs for fly-ins... (Jack Phillips) 22. 04:44 PM - Re: Re: my new tag line (Gary Boothe) 23. 05:43 PM - Re: carb heat muff (taildrags) 24. 06:00 PM - Re: tie downs for fly-ins... (jarheadpilot82) 25. 08:05 PM - Re: tie downs for fly-ins... (helspersew@aol.com) 26. 10:06 PM - Re: FW: Your my guinea pig and you didn't even know it. (Chris) 27. 11:03 PM - Official Pietenpol-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) (Matt Dralle) 28. 11:11 PM - Official Pietenpol-List Usage Guidelines (Matt Dralle) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:05:15 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: newbie question From: airlion2@gmail.com Now now jack, I am now an official octogenarian as of last November since I f lew my plane after I turned 80. there is quite a membership and I hope you will be able to joi n. cheers and see you at Brodhead. Gardiner Sent from my iPad On Feb 28, 2013, at 3:40 PM, "Jack Phillips" wrot e: > I had the same experience at my first Brodhead =93 I=99ve neve r seen so many 80+ year old men trailing oxygen bottles (I call them =9C Oxygenarians=9D), and when I told them I was building a Pietenpol they just turned and walked away. All except Bill Rewey, who was a real gem and spent quite a while talking with me, and giving good advice. Thankfully, b y the time I finished mine and flew it there the atmosphere had changed comp letely and it=99s been a very friendly and fun place ever since. > > Jack Phillips > NX899JP > Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia > > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-li st-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[Vantage Par tners, LLC] > Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2013 2:32 PM > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: newbie question > > > Years ago when I came to Brodhead the older crowd was downright snooty and rude to younger newcomers. I was really put off by the arrogance of some > of the builders and owners who you thought just stepped out of a nice Lear jet but in fact just had really rough looking Pietnepols. Thankfully things have > changed and there are folks from all walks of life there and all ages now w hich is really refreshing. > > Mike C > Ohio > > > ~=EF=BD=DE=83g(=D3=8D=D3=87qzn > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:06:00 AM PST US From: "Donald Lane" Subject: Pietenpol-List: How I decided to build a Pietenpol Great story, Mario. It's really nice that you get to work with your Father. Don Lane ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:56:52 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: a view from the cockpit From: "aerocarjake" Mike, that is wonderful.... With all the wind noise you can't tell what engine it is - you could overdub the beautiful "music" of a Ford Model A (ha!) -------- Jake Schultz - curator, Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395347#395347 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:12:23 AM PST US From: Rick Schreiber Subject: Pietenpol-List: carb heat muff I finished up the installation of my carb heat muff yesterday attached are a couple of pictures. This carb heat muff was the one I purchased from Rick Robbins at Robbins Wings. Here is a link http://www.robbinswings.com/Carb_Heat_Muff.htm I was really impressed with the price and quality, as I said before. Rick Schreiber Valparaiso IN ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:43:18 AM PST US From: "Jack Phillips" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: newbie question Yeah Gardiner, but the difference is you are not trailing an oxygen bottle, and you actually FLY (and you=99re pleasant to be around). I hope to be emulating you in 20 years. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of airlion2@gmail.com Sent: Friday, March 01, 2013 9:05 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: newbie question Now now jack, I am now an official octogenarian as of last November since I flew my plane after I turned 80. there is quite a membership and I hope you will be able to join. cheers and see you at Brodhead. Gardiner Sent from my iPad On Feb 28, 2013, at 3:40 PM, "Jack Phillips" wrote: I had the same experience at my first Brodhead =93 I=99ve never seen so many 80+ year old men trailing oxygen bottles (I call them =9COxygenarians=9D), and when I told them I was building a Pietenpol they just turned and walked away. All except Bill Rewey, who was a real gem and spent quite a while talking with me, and giving good advice. Thankfully, by the time I finished mine and flew it there the atmosphere had changed completely and it=99s been a very friendly and fun place ever since. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[Vantage Partners, LLC] Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2013 2:32 PM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: newbie question Years ago when I came to Brodhead the older crowd was downright snooty and rude to younger newcomers. I was really put off by the arrogance of some of the builders and owners who you thought just stepped out of a nice Learjet but in fact just had really rough looking Pietnepols. Thankfully things have changed and there are folks from all walks of life there and all ages now which is really refreshing. Mike C Ohio ~=EF=BD=DE=83g(=D3=8D=D3=87qzn ========= >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List ========= cs.com ========= matronics.com/contribution ========= ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:32:04 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: carb heat muff From: Ken Bickers Very nice, Rick! On Fri, Mar 1, 2013 at 8:10 AM, Rick Schreiber wrote: > I finished up the installation of my carb heat muff yesterday attached are a > couple of pictures. This carb heat muff was the one I purchased from Rick > Robbins at Robbins Wings. Here is a link > http://www.robbinswings.com/Carb_Heat_Muff.htm > I was really impressed with the price and quality, as I said before. > > Rick Schreiber > Valparaiso IN ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:09:59 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: newbie question From: airlion2@gmail.com Thanks jack, you will, I am sure, how is your Rv 10 coming along ? Gardiner Sent from my iPad On Mar 1, 2013, at 10:42 AM, "Jack Phillips" wrot e: > Yeah Gardiner, but the difference is you are not trailing an oxygen bottle , and you actually FLY (and you=C3=A2=82=AC=84=A2re pleasant to be aro und).=C3=82 I hope to be emulating you in 20 years. > > Jack Phillips > NX899JP > Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia > > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-li st-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of airlion2@gmail.com > Sent: Friday, March 01, 2013 9:05 AM > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: newbie question > > Now now jack, I am now an official octogenarian as of last November since I flew my plane after > I turned 80. there is quite a membership and I hope you will be able to j oin. cheers and see you at Brodhead. Gardiner > > Sent from my iPad > > On Feb 28, 2013, at 3:40 PM, "Jack Phillips" wr ote: > >> I had the same experience at my first Brodhead =C3=A2=82=AC=9C I =C3=A2=82=AC=84=A2ve never seen so many 80+ year old men trailing oxyg en bottles (I call them =C3=A2=82=AC=C5=93Oxygenarians=C3=A2=82=AC=C2=9D ), and when I told them I was building a Pietenpol they just turned and walk ed away. All except Bill Rewey, who was a real gem and spent quite a while t alking with me, and giving good advice. Thankfully, by the time I finished m ine and flew it there the atmosphere had changed completely and it=C3=A2=82 =AC=84=A2s been a very friendly and fun place ever since. >> >> Jack Phillips >> NX899JP >> Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia >> >> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-l ist-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[Vantage Pa rtners, LLC] >> Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2013 2:32 PM >> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com >> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: newbie question >> >> >> Years ago when I came to Brodhead the older crowd was downright snooty an d rude to younger newcomers. I was really put off by the arrogance of some >> of the builders and owners who you thought just stepped out of a nice Lea rjet but in fact just had really rough looking Pietnepols. Thankfully thing s have >> changed and there are folks from all walks of life there and all ages now which is really refreshing. >> >> Mike C >> Ohio >> >> >> ~=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=9E=C6=92g(=C3=93=C2=8D=C3=93=A1qzn >> >> >> ========================= ========= >> >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >> ========================= ========= >> cs.com >> ========================= ========= >> matronics.com/contribution >> ========================= ========= >> > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > http://forums.matronics.com > http://www.matronics.com/contribution > > > ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= ========================== ========= > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 11:56:51 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: newbie question From: "kmercer" Thanks for the welcome, everybody. I heard from Mike Groah and will definitely be attending the West Coast Gathering in June, and I hope to get in touch with Jim Boyer later today to see if I can meet up with him to see his project up in Santa Rosa. Looking forward to meeting you all in Brodhead. In the meantime I need to start making some sawdust and wooden airplane parts... Ken P.S. Dan, I'm close to 180 but I'm not taking any chances. I start my diet today! -------- Ken Mercer San Rafael, CA (KDVO) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395370#395370 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 12:05:56 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: newbie question From: Gary Boothe Ken, If you show up at Jim's on Friday, you will witness the breathtaking 1st startup of his Corvair! Gary Sent from my iPhone On Mar 1, 2013, at 11:55 AM, "kmercer" wrote: > > Thanks for the welcome, everybody. I heard from Mike Groah and will definitely be attending the West Coast Gathering in June, and I hope to get in touch with Jim Boyer later today to see if I can meet up with him to see his project up in Santa Rosa. > > Looking forward to meeting you all in Brodhead. In the meantime I need to start making some sawdust and wooden airplane parts... > > Ken > > P.S. Dan, I'm close to 180 but I'm not taking any chances. I start my diet today! > > -------- > Ken Mercer > San Rafael, CA (KDVO) > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395370#395370 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 12:22:11 PM PST US From: santiago morete Subject: Pietenpol-List: Jack Textor actually read my Uncle Tony's books! Hi Mario and all, after reading your post I started thinking about how many Pietenpols are under construction here, in Argentina. Through the years wo rking on my Piet (this is the ninth year) I have been in touch with at leas t 27 people interested in building this plane, I tried to encourage all of them to build this beautiful airplane and invited everyone to this forum. I guess we have at least 10 being built and 2 flying. I know that doesn't so und spectacular, but it's a huge number for us.=0ASaludos=0A=0ASantiago ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 12:34:20 PM PST US From: "TOM STINEMETZE" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Jack Textor actually read my Uncle Tony's books! Santiago: Ten under construction and 2 flying is spectacular! I will personally only be really enthused when one in particular starts flying. Will that day ever get here? However, if you beat me into the air I promise to still cheer. Tom Stinemetze N328X McPherson, KS. (working on the instrument and fuel hookups) do not archive >>> santiago morete 3/1/2013 2:21 PM >>> Hi Mario and all, after reading your post I started thinking about how many Pietenpols are under construction here, in Argentina. Through the years working on my Piet (this is the ninth year) I have been in touch with at least 27 people interested in building this plane, I tried to encourage all of them to build this beautiful airplane and invited everyone to this forum. I guess we have at least 10 being built and 2 flying. I know that doesn't sound spectacular, but it's a huge number for us. Saludos Santiago ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 01:24:18 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: powder coating is almost impossible to remove From: Andrew Eldredge I use a torch then follow with a wire brush, the paint burns and flakes long before the metal gets hot enough to worry about. On Feb 28, 2013 6:57 PM, "Joe Motis" wrote: > Mike, try using plain old paint stripper. The powder coat comes of in a > big hurry. > > Joe Motis > > On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 9:34 AM, Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[Vantage > Partners, LLC] wrote: > >> Guys=97just a quick note. I tried to repair a riding tractor part (crac ked >> part) by TIG welding but after bead**** >> >> and sand blasting I couldn=92t touch the surfaces that needed to be clea ned >> hardly at all to get the paint off to**** >> >> make a clean weld because the part was powder coated. **** >> >> ** ** >> >> Just passing along what I found. Hopefully none of our Piet parts >> (painted with spray or powder coated) will ever**** >> >> fail or need to be repaired but that was my experience with my riding >> mower. **** >> >> ** ** >> >> And truthfully after 15 years of flying my Piet there isn=92t one part t hat >> I wish I powder coated. I just did a very good job**** >> >> of bead blasting, priming, and then painting conventionally. I must >> say the finish is pretty nice on those powder coated**** >> >> parts though but it just never appealed to me enough to do it. **** >> >> ** ** >> >> Mike C.**** >> >> ** ** >> >> ** ** >> >> * >> >> " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >> tp://forums.matronics.com >> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> * >> >> > * > =========== =========== =========== =========== > * > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 02:14:24 PM PST US From: "Douwe Blumberg" Subject: Pietenpol-List: tie downs for fly-ins... With warm weather around the corner (hopefully!) I'm starting to plan/daydream about putting the hours on Re-PIET and I've started daydreaming about my first Brodhead flight (unless life intervenes). A few of my daydreams turned to day-nightmares as I remembered some of the horrendous thunderstorms that Marci and I have endured in our tent, especially after my visit to Gardiner and seeing his "pietenpile" photos from the Sun n' Fun disaster of a few years ago. All of which led me to start thinking about the best technique to tie a Pietenpol down when flying around our beautiful, but stormy, Midwest. I'd appreciate hearing experiences and techniques regarding: 1. types of tie downs to carry 2. direction to point the plane as something is roaring in 3. value to tying something like foam tubes on the wing top to break lift 4. and any other ideas you might have. Thanks! Douwe ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 02:17:23 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: my new tag line From: "DOMIT" steven.d.dortch(at)us.arm wrote: > How about "I think, therefore I am! I think?" > > Steve D > > --- Ren Descartes walks into a McDonalds. The girl at the counter asks "May I take your order?" He replies "I would like a Big Mac and a small Coke." The girls asks "would you like fries with that?" He says "I think not... " and POOF! He disappears. Hmmm... my tagline: Windows... from the people who brought you EDLIN! (Only the long-time IT geeks are going to get that one!) -------- Brad "DOMIT" Smith First rule of ground school: This is the ground... don't hit it going fast. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395378#395378 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:25:06 PM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: carb heat muff Nice, Rick! What is the length? I have short, straight pipes. Gary Boothe NX308MB -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Schreiber Sent: Friday, March 01, 2013 7:11 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: carb heat muff I finished up the installation of my carb heat muff yesterday attached are a couple of pictures. This carb heat muff was the one I purchased from Rick Robbins at Robbins Wings. Here is a link http://www.robbinswings.com/Carb_Heat_Muff.htm I was really impressed with the price and quality, as I said before. Rick Schreiber Valparaiso IN ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 02:27:09 PM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: Pietenpol-List: FW: Your my guinea pig and you didn't even know it. All, Our very good friend, and fellow builder, Chris Tracy, www.westcoastpiet.com, has been unable to update his website for a couple years.until now! Send him your stuff!! Gary Boothe NX308MB From: Chris [mailto:catdesigns@att.net] Sent: Friday, March 01, 2013 1:04 AM Subject: Your my guinea pig and you didn't even know it. I finally figured out a way to update the web page and used your photos as the test subject. Here are the new ones. Now all I have to do is add all the rest I have been saving up. http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Gary%20Boothe/gary_boothe.htm Chris Sacramento, Ca Westcoastpiet.com ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 02:28:34 PM PST US From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[Vantage Partners, LLC]" Subject: Pietenpol-List: tying down Douwe--- I put a cap on my fuel filler cap and cork and wire vent when I pa rk overnight to keep dew, moisture, and rain out of my fuel tank. Lightweight wheel chocks are nice to carry. Tie your stick back with the lap belt. Ailerons on Piets love to bang stop -to-stop on gusty days even when there is no thunderstorm in the area. Even at fuel stops I have had to tie my stick back so the ai lerons don't bang around. Perhaps you have provisions for a control gust lock. Some do but for the rest of us the lap belt works wel l. I circle my stick once around before buckling it and that keeps the ailerons from moving and keeps the elevator in the up position. Mike C. ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 02:52:13 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: my new tag line From: "cjborsuk" I don't know Mike, I think your new tag line should be Mike "Ice Man" Cuy. I won't be able to see you or your name in print without humming Ice Ice Baby! Or Mike "The Ice" Cuy. I like it! Chuck Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395382#395382 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 03:10:46 PM PST US From: Rick Schreiber Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: carb heat muff On 3/1/2013 4:23 PM, Gary Boothe wrote: > > Nice, Rick! What is the length? I have short, straight pipes. > > Gary Boothe > NX308MB > Gary, The standard dimension is either 4 or 6 inches. Mine is 6 inches. Just give Rick Robbins a call (303) 423-7002 and he will design the muff to fit your requirements. Rick Schreiber ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 03:27:03 PM PST US From: Rick Schreiber Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: FW: Your my guinea pig and you didn't even know it. Gary, I have just been looking at the new pictures on Chris' site- very nice work! Thanks Chris for posting these. Rick Schreiber ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 04:04:38 PM PST US From: "Jack Phillips" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: tie downs for fly-ins... Hi Douwe, I've been using "The Claw" tie-downs for years, with good results. They've kept my Piet in place through some of the worst thunderstorms Brodhead, Sun 'n' Fun and Oshkosh have offered. They're a bit pricey at about $90 a set, but they work. Their customer service is excellent as well. I have a pair of cockpit covers that my wife sewed for me that work very well, but don't totally prevent water getting in the airplane. It still comes in around the holes in the cowling where the cabane struts meet the fuselage. I always carry a towel to help sop up the water that comes in during the Brodhead monsoon. I've never tied foam tubes on the wings. I do hold the controls by looping the seatbelt over the stick as Mike Cuy suggested, which holds the ailerons and elevator. I would like to have a gust lock on the rudder but I don't. I do recommend a pitot tube cover to prevent rain from getting in your pitot tube (ask Dan Helsper about that). It doesn't matter what you do. When you are lying in your sleeping bag at Brodhead, listening to driving rain and wind and horrendous "Cannon Shots" of thunder, you will wonder if your pride and joy will still be there in the morning. Amazingly, it always has been for me. We had a tornado within a few miles of Brodhead a couple of years ago, and I'm sure that as Gardiner found out, no matter what kind of tie-down you have, it won't save you in a tornado. Hopefully we'll never have such during the fly-in. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Douwe Blumberg Sent: Friday, March 01, 2013 5:14 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: tie downs for fly-ins... With warm weather around the corner (hopefully!) I'm starting to plan/daydream about putting the hours on Re-PIET and I've started daydreaming about my first Brodhead flight (unless life intervenes). A few of my daydreams turned to day-nightmares as I remembered some of the horrendous thunderstorms that Marci and I have endured in our tent, especially after my visit to Gardiner and seeing his "pietenpile" photos from the Sun n' Fun disaster of a few years ago. All of which led me to start thinking about the best technique to tie a Pietenpol down when flying around our beautiful, but stormy, Midwest. I'd appreciate hearing experiences and techniques regarding: 1. types of tie downs to carry 2. direction to point the plane as something is roaring in 3. value to tying something like foam tubes on the wing top to break lift 4. and any other ideas you might have. Thanks! Douwe ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 04:44:09 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: my new tag line From: Gary Boothe "That's right, I'm dangerous, Ice....Man!" Sent from my iPhone On Mar 1, 2013, at 2:50 PM, "cjborsuk" wrote: > > I don't know Mike, I think your new tag line should be Mike "Ice Man" Cuy. I won't be able to see you or your name in print without humming Ice Ice Baby! > Or Mike "The Ice" Cuy. I like it! > > Chuck > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395382#395382 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 05:43:48 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: carb heat muff From: "taildrags" Very nice setup, clean stacks. Looking at the port that you have in the firewall, is that just there to give you access to the front pedals from the firewall side? I assume that you'll just have a flat circle or square screwed onto the firewall to cover the hole? Although I guess you could pipe your relief tube out the firewall and into the heat muff to vaporize the relieved liquid. Gives a whole new meaning to the term "smoke system". All kidding aside, you have a very clean setup. -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford, OR Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395389#395389 ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 06:00:45 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: tie downs for fly-ins... From: "jarheadpilot82" Douwe, Here are some links to some EAA articles showing how to make tie downs. I made the first ones. [url]http://www.eaa.org/sportaviationmag/2011/1106_April_2010_BuildIt.pdf [/url] Hope it helps. -------- Semper Fi, Terry Hand Athens, GA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395391#395391 ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 08:05:28 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: tie downs for fly-ins... From: helspersew@aol.com Hi Douwe, Last year I bought "The Claw". Haven't used it yet due to I was lucky enoug h to get one of the two permanent tie down spots at Brodhead. The Claw is n ice in the fact they give you a carrying bag, and a hammer included with th e kit. And it is not unduly heavy. Dan Helsper Puryear, TN -----Original Message----- From: Douwe Blumberg Sent: Fri, Mar 1, 2013 4:14 pm Subject: Pietenpol-List: tie downs for fly-ins... With warm weather around the corner (hopefully!) I=99mstarting to pla n/daydream about putting the hours on Re-PIET and I=99vestarted daydr eaming about my first Brodhead flight (unless life intervenes). A few of my daydreams turned to day-nightmares as Iremembered some of the h orrendous thunderstorms that Marci and I have enduredin our tent, especiall y after my visit to Gardiner and seeing his =9Cpietenpile=9Dpho tos from the Sun n=99 Fun disaster of a few years ago. All of which led me to start thinking about the besttechnique to tie a Piet enpol down when flying around our beautiful, but stormy,Midwest. I=99d appreciate hearing experiences and techniquesregarding: types of tie downs to carry direction to point the plane as something is roaring in value to tying something like foam tubes on the wing top to break lift and any other ideas you might have. Thanks! Douwe ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 10:06:23 PM PST US From: "Chris" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: FW: Your my guinea pig and you didn't even know it. Oh great Gary, thanks for outing me. Now everyone knows I build websites about as slow as I build airplanes. How would you like it if I told everyone you put a CAR engine in your plane which you built from POPLAR purchased from the local lumber store which you tried to conceal behind a snazzy looking LATEX paint job. Latex I tell you, that's low cost house paint! And don't think I will hesitate to tell them about your home carved propeller and those wood struts. WOOD STRUTS for gosh sakes! There a fraction of the cost of my steel ones. Well, how would you like that, Gaaarrryyyy??? Oh wait a minute that's all really cool stuff that is really impressive and your plane looks really nice and seems to fly rather well. NEVER MIND, forget I said anything. It must be all this warm sunny weather were having getting to my brain. Chris Sacramento, Ca Westcoastpiet.com Do not archive _____ From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Boothe Sent: Friday, March 01, 2013 2:27 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: FW: Your my guinea pig and you didn't even know it. All, Our very good friend, and fellow builder, Chris Tracy, www.westcoastpiet.com, has been unable to update his website for a couple years.until now! Send him your stuff!! Gary Boothe NX308MB From: Chris [mailto:catdesigns@att.net] Sent: Friday, March 01, 2013 1:04 AM Subject: Your my guinea pig and you didn't even know it. I finally figured out a way to update the web page and used your photos as the test subject. Here are the new ones. Now all I have to do is add all the rest I have been saving up. http://westcoastpiet.com/images/Gary%20Boothe/gary_boothe.htm Chris Sacramento, Ca Westcoastpiet.com ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 11:03:25 PM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: Pietenpol-List: Official Pietenpol-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) Dear Listers, Please read over the Pietenpol-List Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) below. The complete Pietenpol-List FAQ including the Usage Guidelines can be found at the following URL: http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/Pietenpol-List.FAQ.html Thank you, Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator [ Note: This FAQ was designed to be displayed with a fixed width font such as Courier. Proportional fonts will cause display formatting errors. ] This FAQ can also be viewed in HTML online at the following address: http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm ************************************************************ ******* LIST POLICIES AND FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS ******* ************************************************************ PLEASE READ. This document contains Pietenpol-List policies and information for new and old subscribers. Understanding the Pietenpol-List policies will minimize problems for the Administrator, and will help keep the Pietenpol-List running smoothly for all of us. ****************************************** *** Quick Start Guide to List Features *** ****************************************** There are many features available on the Matronics Email Lists and each one is described in detailed below. However, using the List Navigator you can quickly access the complete set of features available for this List. The List Navigator can be found at the following URL: http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List **************************************** *** How to Subscribe and Unsubscribe *** **************************************** Simply go to the Web Page shown below and enter your email address and select the List(s) that you wish to subscribe or unsubscribed from. You may also use the handy "Find" function to determine the exact syntax of your email address as it is subscribed to the List. Please see the complete instructions at the top of the Web Page for more information. The Subscribe/Unsubscribe web page is: http://www.matronics.com/subscribe Note that you will receive TWO conformation emails regarding your subsciption process. The first verifies that your subscription/unsubsciption request was received, and the second confirms that the process has been completed. You should receive the first email within a few minutes of your request. The second conformation will arrive in less than 24 hours. You cannot post until you receive the second conformation email message. ***************************** *** How to Post a Message *** ***************************** Send an email message to: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Your message will be redistributed to everyone currently subscribed to the List. ***************************************************** *** SPAM Fighter - You Must be Subscribed to Post *** ***************************************************** When a new post is received by the system, the From: line of the message is checked and compared against the current subscription list. If the email address is found, the message is passed on to the List Processor. If the email address isn't found in the current list of subscribers, it is dumped. This serves to very effectively thwart 99% of the SPAM that gets posted to the Lists. Remember, however, that the syntax of your email address is very important with regard to the configuration of your email application such as Outlook or Eudora. For example, the following two email addresses may be functionally equivalent, but only one would pass the Matronics Email SPAM test depending on which was syntax was subscribed to the given List: smith@machine.domain.com smith@domain.com Either email address syntax is alright, just be sure that you configure your email application to match *exactly* the address you've subscibed to the List. ************************************** *** Enclosure Support on the Lists *** ************************************** Limited posting of enclosures such as pictures, documents, and spreadsheets is supported on the Lists. There are a number of restrictions, and these are detailed below. Please abide by the rules put forth regarding the content of enclosures. These are some of the features and limits of enclosures on the Matronics Lists: 1) Enclosures will only be posted to the Real Time version of the Lists. 2) Enclosures will NOT be included in the Daily Digest version of the Lists. 3) Enclosures WILL BE forwarded on to the BBS Forum Web site. 4) Enclosures will NOT be appended to the Archives. 5) Enclosures will NOT be available in the List Browse feature. 6) Only the following file types and extensions will be allowed: bmp doc dwg dxf gif jpg pdf png txt xls All other enclosures types will be rejected and email returned to sender. The enclosure types listed above are relatively safe from a virus standpoint and don't pose a particularly large security risk. 7) !! All incoming enclosures will be scanned for viruses prior to posting to the List. This is done in real time and will not slow down the process of posting the message !! Here are some rules for posting enclosures. Failure to abide by these rules could result in the removal of a subscriber's email address from the Lists. 1) Pay attention to what you are posting!! Make sure that the files you are enclosing aren't HUGE (greater that 1MB). Remember that there are still people checking they're email via dial up modem. If you post 30MB worth of pictures, you are placing an unnecessary burden on these folks and the rest of us, for that matter. 2) SCALE YOUR PICTURES DOWN!!! I don't want to see huge 3000 x 2000 pictures getting posted that are 3 or 4MB each. This is just unacceptable. Use a program such as Photoshop to scale the picture down to something on the order of 800 x 600 and try to keep the file size to less-than 200KB, preferably much less. Microsoft has a really awesome utility available for free that allows you to Right-Click on a picture in Explorer and automatically scale it down and resave it. This is a great utility - get it, use it! http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/downloads/powertoys/xppowertoys.mspx Look for the link "Image Resizer" 3) !! This would seem to go without saying, but I'll say it anyway. Do not post anything that would be considered offensive by your grandmother. And you know what I'm saying; I don't want to see anything even questionable. !! 4) REMEMBER THIS: If you post a 1MB enclosure to a List with 1000 members subscribed, your 1MB enclosure must be resent 1000 times amounting to 1MB X 1000 = 1 Gigabyte of network traffic!! BE CAREFUL and BE COURTEOUS! Also see the section below on the Matronics Photo and File Share where you can have your files and photos posted on the Matronics web server for long time viewing and availability. ******************* *** Digest Mode *** ******************* Each day, starting at 12 midnight PST US, a new 'digest' will be started. This digest will contain the same information that is currently appended to the archive file. It has all of the headers except for the "From:" and "Subject:" lines removed, and includes a message separator consisting of a line of underscores. Each day at 23:55 PST US, the day's messages as described above will be combined and sent as a single message to everyone on the digest email list. To subscribe to the digest list, use the same subscription web form described above, and just select the Digest version of the List. http://www.matronics.com/subscribe Note that you *can* be subscribed to both the realtime and digest versions of the List at the same time. This is perfectly acceptable. Now some caveats: * Messages sent to "pietenpol-list-digest" will be forwarded to the standard email list. In other words, you cannot post messages only to the digest List. * If you are subscribed to both the regular List and the digest List, you will receive the realtime postings as well as the digest at the end of the day. * If you reply to the digest email, your message will be forwarded to the normal list associated with the digest. Important Note: Please change the subject line to reflect the topic of your response! Also, please *do not include all or most of the digest in your reply*. **************************** *** List Digest Browser *** **************************** An archive of all the List Digests can be found online in either plain text or HTML format. These archives contain the exact Digest that was posted to the Digest email list on the given day. The Digest Archives can be found at the following location: http://www.matronics.com/digest ***************************************** *** The "DO NOT ARCHIVE" Message Flag *** ***************************************** At times, your message may concern something that is revelent only to a very small number of persons or to a limited area, and you may not wish to archive it. In such a case, simply put the following phrase anywhere in the message: do not archive Your message will not be appended to the archive, but will be sent to List email distribution as normal. ********************************************** ***** READ THIS - Automatic Unsubscribes ***** ********************************************** Note that if your email address begins to cause problems such as bounced email, mailbox is filled, or any other errors, your address will be promptly removed from the List. If you discover that you are no longer receiving messages from the Pietenpol-List, go to the following Web page, and look for your email address and a possible reason for your removal. The Matronics Email List uses utility called the "Email Weasel" that automatically looks though the day's bounced email for addresses that caused problems due to common things like "user is unknown", "mailbox full", etc. If the Email Weasel removes your email address from the Lists you will find record of it at the following URL: http://www.matronics.com/unsubscribed If the problem listed on the web site above has been resolved, please feel free to resubscribe to the Lists of your choice. ******************************* *** List Member Information *** ******************************* If you have not done so already, please email me your phone numbers and paper mail address in the following format: smith@somehost.com Joe Smith 123 Airport Lane Tower, CA 91234-1234 098-765-1234 w 123-456-7890 h Please forward this information to the following email address: requests@matronics.com I have a file of such things, that I typically use to contact you when there are problems with your email address. The information will NOT be used for any other commercial purpose. **************************************** *** Realtime Web Email List Browsing *** **************************************** Recent messages posted to the Pietenpol-List are also made available on the Web for realtime browsing. Seven days worth of back postings are available with this feature. The messages can be sorted by Subject, Author, Date, or Message Thread. The Realtime List Browser indexes are updated twice per hour at xx:15 and xx:45. You can also reply to a message or start a new message directly from the List Browser Interface (coming soon). You do not have to be subscribed to the given list to use the List Browser Interface in view-mode. http://www.matronics.com/browselist/pietenpol-list ******************************************* *** Web Forums Bulletin Board Interface *** ******************************************* A phpBB BBS web Forums front end is available for all Pietenpol-List content. content. The Forums contain all of the same content available via the email distribution and found on the various archive viewing formats such as the List Browse, etc. Any posts on the web Forums will be cross posted to the respective email List, and posts to the Email List will be cross posted to the web Forums. You may view all List content on the Forums without any special login. If you wish to post a message via the Web Forum interface, however, you will need to Register. This is a simple process that takes only a few minutes. A link to the Registration page can be found at the top of the main web Forums page. Note that registering on the Forum web site also enables you to send email posts to the Lists as well. You will also need to Subscribe to the respective Email List as described above to receive the Email Distribution of the List, however. The Matroincs Email List Web BBS Forums can be found at the following URL: http://forums.matronics.com ********************************* *** Matronics Email List Wiki *** ********************************* In an attempt to make it easy to store and find structured and often accessed information, Matronics has installed a Wiki at: http://wiki.matronics.com The Wiki allows individuals to create web pages to contain useful information for other users of the mailing lists and web site. Unlike an ordinary web page where the content needs to be submitted to Matronics for inclusion, the Wiki permits the users to construct their own pages and have them visible immediately. While constructing pages for the Wiki is not difficult, some may not be comfortable building pages. In that case, simply prepare the text and any images and email it to: wiki-support@matronics.com One of the volunteers on that list will take your submission and construct a Wiki page for you. Often someone produces a particularly useful posting in email one one of the Lists that would be of general interest. In that case Matronics may take that post and convert it into a Wiki page. ********************* *** List Archives *** ********************* A file containing of all of the previous postings to the Pietenpol-List is available on line. The archive file information is available via the Web and FTP in a number of forms. Each are briefly described below: * Pietenpol-List.FAQ - Latest version of the Pietenpol-List Frequently Asked Question page (this document). * Pietenpol-Archive.digest.complete - Complete file with most of the email header info removed and page breaks inserted between messages. * Pietenpol-Archive.digest.vol-?? - Same as the file above, but broken up into small sections that can more easily handled. * Pietenpol-Archive.digest.complete.zip - Same as the Pietenpol-Archive.digest.complete file above, but in PKZIP format. Use "binary" data transfer methods. * Pietenpol-Archive.digest.complete.Z - Same as the Pietenpol-Archive.digest.complete file above, but in UNIX compress format. Use "binary" data transfer methods. Download Via FTP ---------------- The archive file is available via anonymous FTP from ftp.matronics.com in the "/pub/Archives" directory. It is updated daily and can be found in a number of formats as described above. (All filenames are case sensitive.) ftp://ftp.matronics.com/pub/Archives Download Via Web ---------------- The archives are also available via a web listing. These can be found toward the bottom of the following web page: http://www.matronics.com/archives ****************************************** *** Complete List Web Archive Browsing *** ****************************************** All messages posted to the Pietenpol-List are also available using the Email List Archive Browsing feature. With this utility, all messages in the List are indexed, and individual sub-archives can be browsed. http://www.matronics.com/archive/archive-index.cgi?Pietenpol ***************************************** **** High-Speed Archive Search Engine *** ***************************************** You can use the custom, high-performance Matronics Email List Search Engine to quickly locate and browse any messages that have been posted to the List. The Engine allows the user to easily search any of the currently available List archives. http://www.matronics.com/search **************************** *** File and Photo Share *** **************************** With the Matronics Email List File and Photo Share you can share pictures and other data with members of the List without having to forward a copy of it to everyone. To share your Files and Photos, simply email them to: pictures@matronics.com !! ==> Please including the following information with each submission: 1) Email Lists that they are related to. 2) Your Full Name. 3) Your Email Address. 4) One line Subject description. 5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic. 6-x) One-line Description of each photo or file Prior to public availability of the files and photos, each will be scanned for viruses. Please also note that the process of making the files and photos available on the web site is a pseudo-manual process, and I try to process them every few days. Following the availability of the new Photoshare, an email message will be sent to the Email Lists enumerated in 1) above indicating that the new Share is available and what the direct URL to it is. For a current list of available Photoshares, have a look at the Main Index Page: http://www.matronics.com/photoshare ************************** *** List Archive CDROM *** ************************** A complete Matronics Email List Archive CD is available that contains all of the archives since the beginning of each of the Lists. The archives for all of the Lists are included on the CD along with a freeware search engine written by a list member. The CD is burned the day you order it and will contain archive received up to the last minute. They make great gifts! http://www.matronics.com/ArchiveCDROM ********************************** *** List Support Contributions *** ********************************** The Matronics Lists are run *completely* through the support of it members. You won't find any PopUpAds, flashing Banner ads, or any other form of annoying commercialism on either the Email Messages or the List web pages associated with the Matronics Email Lists. Every year during November I run a low-key, low-pressure "Fund Raiser" where, throughout the month, I ask List members to make a Contribution in any amount with which they are comfortable. I will often offer free gifts with certain contribution levels during the Fund Raiser to increase the participation. The gifts are usually donated by companies that are themselves List members. Your Contributions go directly to supporting the operation of the Lists including the high-speed, business-class Internet connection, server system hardware and software upgrades, and to partially offset the many many hours I spend running, maintaining, upgrading, and developing the variety of services found here. Generally Contributions range from $20 to $100 and are completely voluntary and non-compulsory. I ask only that if person enjoys the Lists and obtains value from them, that they make a Contribution of equal magnitude. Contributions are accepted throughout the year, and if you've just subscribed, feel free to make a Contribution when you've settled in. The website for making SSL Secure Contributions is listed below. There are a variety of payment methods including Visa and MasterCard, PayPal, and sending a personal check. If you enjoy and value the List, won't you make a Contribution today to support its continued operation? http://www.matronics.com/contributions Thank you! Matt Dralle Email List Administrator ****************************************************************************** Pietenpol-List Usage Guidelines ****************************************************************************** The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the Pietenpol-List. You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein. Failure to use the Pietenpol-List in the manner described below may result in the removal of the subscribers from the List. Pietenpol-List Policy Statement The purpose of the Pietenpol-List is to provide a forum of discussion for things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established: - Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc. - THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it. - Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and responses. - Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address, aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary space in the archive. - DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the web page or FAQ first. - If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it easy to find threads in the archive. - When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive can not be overstated! - When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the "reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your response to the original poster. You might have to actively address your response with the original poster's email address. - DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large. - When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly contribute something valuable. - Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing. - Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by List members promoting their respective products or items for sale should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to everyone, including those who provide products to the entire community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists. ------- [This is an automated posting.] do not archive ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 11:11:31 PM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: Pietenpol-List: Official Pietenpol-List Usage Guidelines Dear Listers, Please read over the Pietenpol-List Usage Guidelines below. The complete Pietenpol-List FAQ including these Usage Guidelines can be found at the following URL: http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/Pietenpol-List.FAQ.html Thank you, Matt Dralle Matronics Email List Administrator ****************************************************************************** Pietenpol-List Usage Guidelines ****************************************************************************** The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the Pietenpol-List. You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein. Failure to use the Pietenpol-List in the manner described below may result in the removal of the subscribers from the List. Pietenpol-List Policy Statement The purpose of the Pietenpol-List is to provide a forum of discussion for things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established: - Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc. - THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it. - Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and responses. - Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address, aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary space in the archive. - DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the web page or FAQ first. - If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it easy to find threads in the archive. - When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive can not be overstated! - When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the "reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your response to the original poster. You might have to actively address your response with the original poster's email address. - DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large. - When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly contribute something valuable. - Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing. - Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by List members promoting their respective products or items for sale should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to everyone, including those who provide products to the entire community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists. ------- [This is an automated posting.] do not archive ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.