Today's Message Index:
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1. 04:26 AM - Re: Re: Hat Box, Glove Box (Jack)
2. 05:00 AM - Re: Hat Box, Glove Box (nightmare)
3. 06:27 AM - Re: Hat Box, Glove Box (Bill Church)
4. 07:10 AM - Re: Hat Box, Glove Box (nightmare)
5. 07:34 AM - Re: motivation (Bill Church)
6. 08:15 AM - Re: Re: Once around the patch (Jim Boyer)
7. 08:29 AM - Re: Re: Once around the patch (Ray Krause)
8. 08:50 AM - Re: Re: Once around the patch (Gary Boothe)
9. 09:05 AM - Re: Hat Box, Glove Box (dgaldrich)
10. 09:20 AM - Re: Re: Once around the patch (Ray Krause)
11. 09:25 AM - My antique Smith Airline torches (Jerry Dotson)
12. 09:47 AM - Re: My antique Smith Airline torches (nightmare)
13. 10:18 AM - Re: My antique Smith Airline torches (Gary Boothe)
14. 10:21 AM - Re: Re: Once around the patch (Jim Boyer)
15. 10:25 AM - Re: My antique Smith Airline torches (Jim Boyer)
16. 06:38 PM - 33% or 36% MAC? (Boatright, Jeffrey)
17. 06:53 PM - Re: 33% or 36% MAC? (Gary Boothe)
18. 09:32 PM - Re: 33% or 36% MAC? (taildrags)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Hat Box, Glove Box |
Paul here is another variation. There are a couple more pictures on my site
http://www.textors.com/IMG_7497_1600x1067.jpg
Sent from my iPad
Jack Textor
On Mar 3, 2013, at 3:57 PM, "cjborsuk" <cjborsuk@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> Paul,
>
> Do these help?
>
> Chuck
> 989CB
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>
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>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395547#395547
>
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> Attachments:
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> http://forums.matronics.com//files/front_620.jpg
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_0110_136.jpg
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Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Hat Box, Glove Box |
Looks good Jack. The inner carpenter in me likes how that bottom piece of wood
is not widdled away at the ends. Plus, the more stout motor mount will allow my
future chevy 454 auto conversion.
--------
Paul Donahue
Started 8-3-12
do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395584#395584
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Hat Box, Glove Box |
Paul,
Just for the record, the motor mount doesn't hold the front end of the plane together.
The front end of the fuselage is held very solidly by all of the glued
wood surfaces, including the firewall, which acts as a huge gusset.
Bill C.
Paul wrote:
> Thanks Chuck. That does help. It seems odd that its not designed so the fitting
ties together the bottom wood 1x . But I guess the motor mount does a good
job keeping the forward fuselage nice and solid. Thanks.Paul
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| Subject: | Re: Hat Box, Glove Box |
Ahhh, now that makes sense.
--------
Paul Donahue
Started 8-3-12
do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395593#395593
Message 5
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Wow Earl. REALLY nice work.
Very clean and precise.
Bill C.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395595#395595
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Once around the patch |
Yeah and I had to attend a grand-daughters party so I couldn't go to see Rays Sky
Scout or Gary flying.
Jim
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Once around the patch |
Sorry, guys! Did not know I ruined the day for so many of my friends. I wi
ll try to make it up to you.
Ray
Sent from my iPad
On Mar 4, 2013, at 8:14 AM, Jim Boyer <boyerjrb@comcast.net> wrote:
> Yeah and I had to attend a grand-daughters party so I couldn't go to see R
ays Sky Scout or Gary flying.
>
> Jim
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Once around the patch |
YES! and would have much rather seen your Sky Scout project
rather than go flying!
Gary Boothe
NX308MB
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ray
Krause
Sent: Monday, March 04, 2013 8:27 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Once around the patch
Sorry, guys! Did not know I ruined the day for so many of my friends.
I will try to make it up to you.
Ray
Sent from my iPad
On Mar 4, 2013, at 8:14 AM, Jim Boyer <boyerjrb@comcast.net> wrote:
Yeah and I had to attend a grand-daughters party so I couldn't go to see
Rays Sky Scout or Gary flying.
Jim
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
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3D
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3D
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3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
3D
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Hat Box, Glove Box |
Beautiful work but I notice the lack of shoulder harness fittings for the rear
cockpit. My personal decision was to give up the space and mount a decent 4 point
harness. That decision was based on the experience of our own Axel Purtee,
as well as a LOT of other credible sources.
There's an old saying in the nautical community -- "Every ship steers by her own
compass" -- and that certainly applies to personal choices involving things
like safety and aesthetics so consider your choices carefully. This is not a
low risk hobby like stamp collecting.
Stepping down off soap box now...
Dave
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395607#395607
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Once around the patch |
Now, I thought you were a truthful friend!
Ray
Sent from my iPad
On Mar 4, 2013, at 8:49 AM, "Gary Boothe" <gboothe5@comcast.net> wrote:
> YES! and would have much rather seen your Sky Scout project rathe
r than go flying!
>
> Gary Boothe
> NX308MB
>
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-li
st-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ray Krause
> Sent: Monday, March 04, 2013 8:27 AM
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Once around the patch
>
> Sorry, guys! Did not know I ruined the day for so many of my friends. I w
ill try to make it up to you.
>
> Ray
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Mar 4, 2013, at 8:14 AM, Jim Boyer <boyerjrb@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> Yeah and I had to attend a grand-daughters party so I couldn't go to see R
ays Sky Scout or Gary flying.
>
> Jim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
> http://forums.matronics.com
> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
>
>
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Message 11
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| Subject: | My antique Smith Airline torches |
I am posting this just for the nostalgia of having built my Pietenpol with torches
that are older than I am and I happen to be 66 years old! They were my dad's
when he worked for Luscombe. He built engine mounts.
These are my Smith Airline torches. Dainty little guy. With the cutting attachment
on like shown it is only 13" long. The little tools are tip cleaners. Each
torch has a number 20 through 29 with 20 being the smallest. Each tip has a
numbered tip cleaner to match. They are little drill bits with a brass hex molded
on. I have more than 1 of a couple of sizes. Everything is 100% operational.
Not bad considering their age.
--------
Jerry Dotson
First flight June 16,2012
Flying in phase 2
Lycoming O-235 C2C
Jay Anderson CloudCars prop 76 X 44
do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395608#395608
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http://forums.matronics.com//files/a14_196.jpg
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: My antique Smith Airline torches |
Love that story. And torch welding. Check out this little baby. Only about 5 years
old though
--------
Paul Donahue
Started 8-3-12
do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395612#395612
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/20130304_123746_210.jpg
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: My antique Smith Airline torches |
Especially cool, considering their history!!
Gary
NX308MB
Sent from my iPhone
On Mar 4, 2013, at 9:24 AM, "Jerry Dotson" <jdotson@centurylink.net> wrote:
>
> I am posting this just for the nostalgia of having built my Pietenpol with torches
that are older than I am and I happen to be 66 years old! They were my dad's
when he worked for Luscombe. He built engine mounts.
>
> These are my Smith Airline torches. Dainty little guy. With the cutting attachment
on like shown it is only 13" long. The little tools are tip cleaners. Each
torch has a number 20 through 29 with 20 being the smallest. Each tip has
a numbered tip cleaner to match. They are little drill bits with a brass hex molded
on. I have more than 1 of a couple of sizes. Everything is 100% operational.
Not bad considering their age.
>
> --------
> Jerry Dotson
>
> First flight June 16,2012
> Flying in phase 2
> Lycoming O-235 C2C
> Jay Anderson CloudCars prop 76 X 44
> do not archive
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395608#395608
>
>
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/a17_159.jpg
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/a14_196.jpg
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Once around the patch |
Gary I think your nose is going to grow for that one!
Cheers,
Jim
YES! and would have much rather seen your Sky Scout project rather
than go flying!
=C2-
Gary Boothe
NX308MB
=C2-
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [ mailto:owner-pietenpol-li
st-server@matronics.com ] On Behalf Of Ray Krause
Sent: Monday, March 04, 2013 8:27 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Once around the patch
=C2-
Sorry, guys! =C2-Did not know I ruined the day for so many of my friends.
=C2-I will try to make it up to you.
=C2-
Ray
Sent from my iPad
On Mar 4, 2013, at 8:14 AM, Jim Boyer < boyerjrb@comcast.net > wrote:
Yeah and I had to attend a grand-daughters party so I couldn't go to see Ra
ys Sky Scout or Gary flying.
Jim
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: My antique Smith Airline torches |
Hi Jerry,
Thats especially neat that they all work, and at our age (75 here) that may
not be true of all parts!
Cheers,
Jim
I am posting this just for the nostalgia of having built my Pietenpol with
torches that are older than I am and I happen to be 66 years old! They were
my dad's when he worked for Luscombe. He built engine mounts.
These are =C2-my Smith Airline torches. Dainty little guy. With the cutti
ng attachment on like shown it is only 13" long. The little tools are tip c
leaners. Each torch has a number 20 through 29 with 20 being the smallest.
Each tip has a numbered tip cleaner to match. They are little drill bits wi
th a brass hex molded on. I have more than 1 of a couple of sizes. Everythi
ng is 100% operational. Not bad considering their age.
--------
Jerry Dotson
First flight June 16,2012
Flying in phase 2
Lycoming O-235 C2C
Jay Anderson CloudCars prop 76 X 44
do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=395608#395608
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/a17_159.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/a14_196.jpg
Message 16
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I was reading an Aeronca Champ POH and find that the center of gravity rang
e is 18.0% M.A.C. most forward and 36.O%M.A.C. most rearward. I've read t
he list that the limits for the FC10 Pietenpol airfoil are 25-33% MAC. A 33
% aft limit seems fairly standard. What's special about the Champ's airfoil
that it allows such a wide range?
________________________________
This e-mail message (including any attachments) is for the sole use of
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or copying of this message (including any attachments) is strictly
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If you have received this message in error, please contact
the sender by reply e-mail message and destroy all copies of the
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Message 17
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Jeff,
As I understand, the Champ and the Chief both had 4412 airfoils. The Champ
was originally designed to fly on 50 hp, needing a hi-lift airfoil to help
it get off the ground. Cessna 120's and 140's never had less than 85 hp, and
used the 2412 airfoil.less camber.
Gary Boothe
NX308MB
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Boatright,
Jeffrey
Sent: Monday, March 04, 2013 6:38 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: 33% or 36% MAC?
I was reading an Aeronca Champ POH and find that the center of gravity range
is 18.0% M.A.C. most forward and 36.O%M.A.C. most rearward. I've read the
list that the limits for the FC10 Pietenpol airfoil are 25-33% MAC. A 33%
aft limit seems fairly standard. What's special about the Champ's airfoil
that it allows such a wide range?
_____
This e-mail message (including any attachments) is for the sole use of
the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged
information. If the reader of this message is not the intended
recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution
or copying of this message (including any attachments) is strictly
prohibited.
If you have received this message in error, please contact
the sender by reply e-mail message and destroy all copies of the
original message (including attachments).
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: 33% or 36% MAC? |
Gary;
I don't believe anyone has ever formally tested the FC-10 airfoil to determine
any real "numbers" for it; certainly not anything like putting it in the wind
tunnel. The published CG limits are more along the lines of what was commonly
accepted for airfoils of its era and general shape and loading, and are sort
of just good aeronautical rules of thumb for CG range for these airfoils. Later
developments, modern aircraft such as the C-120/140, T'Craft, Champ, Cub and
others had relatively much more sophisticated airfoils that benefitted from
the work of NACA and wartime development to produce scientific refinements to
airfoils. Mr. Pietenpol only had the wooden floor of his barn, his French curve,
a lead pencil, and his Mark I calibrated eyeball to guide him.
This is a subject that has come up fairly regularly over the years, and there are
two or three camps on the issue. At the far right (conservative) are those
who claim, and rightly so, "it has worked for years this way, don't mess with
it, Air Campers aren't falling out of the sky". The far left (liberal or progressives)
say, "we know a lot more about airfoil modeling with computers nowadays,
so let's put the FC-10 into a program like ProFoil or one of the others
and let's get the REAL numbers on it." The middle camp (most of us), just shrug
our shoulders and move on.
I was a small part of a group of people who worked on the development of an airfoil specifically designed to maximize the performance of the Rand Robinson KR-2 and -2S homebuilt aircraft. This resulted in the testing, refinement, and publication of the new airfoil (actually a series of airfoils from 15% to 18% thickness), dubbed the AS504x series. This airfoil is flying today on various KRs and its benefits have been proven. You can read more about it here: http://www.krnet.org/as504x/ but the bottom line from my perspective is, "don't mess with Mr. Pietenpol's Air Camper".
--------
Oscar Zuniga
Medford, OR
Air Camper NX41CC "Scout"
A75 power
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