---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 02/25/14: 37 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:35 AM - Re: newsletter (bubbleboy) 2. 03:37 AM - Re: Newsletter (danhelsper@aol.com) 3. 03:48 AM - Re: fish scales (danhelsper@aol.com) 4. 03:55 AM - Re: corvair acceleration (danhelsper@aol.com) 5. 04:38 AM - Re: newsletter (tkreiner) 6. 05:00 AM - Air-Ground Communications (John Franklin) 7. 05:01 AM - Re: VW engines in Pietenpols (Vasek) 8. 05:21 AM - Re: corvair acceleration (Gary Boothe) 9. 05:44 AM - Re: VW engines in Pietenpols (jarheadpilot82) 10. 05:56 AM - Re: corvair acceleration (jarheadpilot82) 11. 05:59 AM - Re: Re: VW engines in Pietenpols (Mario Giacummo) 12. 06:11 AM - thoughts about using a good old fashioned Continental non-electric A-65 engine on a Pietenpol (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[Vantage Partners, LLC]) 13. 06:14 AM - Re: Vasek's Pietenpol project (Vasek) 14. 06:29 AM - Re: thoughts about using a good old fashioned Continental non-el (tools) 15. 06:31 AM - Re: VW engines in Pietenpols (Vasek) 16. 06:45 AM - Re: Re: VW engines in Pietenpols (Gary Boothe) 17. 06:48 AM - Re: Re: VW engines in Pietenpols (Kip and Beth Gardner) 18. 07:47 AM - Re: corvair acceleration (nightmare) 19. 08:20 AM - Re: Air-Ground Communications (Dick N) 20. 10:47 AM - Re: fish scales (taildrags) 21. 12:22 PM - Re: Re: Vasek's Pietenpol project (Steven Dortch) 22. 12:31 PM - Re: Re: corvair acceleration (Steven Dortch) 23. 12:42 PM - Re: Re: Vasek's Pietenpol project (Keith) 24. 12:54 PM - Re: Vasek's Pietenpol project (Vasek) 25. 01:04 PM - Re: Re: Vasek's Pietenpol project (Keith) 26. 01:25 PM - Re: Re: Vasek's Pietenpol project (glenschweizer@yahoo.com) 27. 01:28 PM - Re: Re: Vasek's Pietenpol project (Boatright, Jeffrey) 28. 01:28 PM - Re: Re: Vasek's Pietenpol project (Steven Dortch) 29. 03:39 PM - BPA Newslatter (JOSEPH SWITHIN) 30. 04:29 PM - Re: fish scales (AircamperN11MS) 31. 04:35 PM - Re: VW engines in Pietenpols (AircamperN11MS) 32. 04:48 PM - Re: Re: fish scales (Gary Boothe) 33. 04:51 PM - Re: fish scales (AircamperN11MS) 34. 05:22 PM - Re: Re: newsletter (Michael Conkling) 35. 06:13 PM - Re: Re: newsletter (Boatright, Jeffrey) 36. 06:56 PM - Re: corvair acceleration (Don Emch) 37. 08:28 PM - Re: fish scales (taildrags) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:35:13 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: newsletter From: "bubbleboy" Im in Australia and got mine last week! ...and how cool is that photo on the front cover! Scotty -------- Tamworth, Australia Building a Corvair Powered Pietenpol Air Camper www.scottyspietenpol.com Tail and Ribs built...Building fuselage & undercarriage...Corvair engine at Roy's Garage waiting to be modified. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419305#419305 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:37:17 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Newsletter From: danhelsper@aol.com Me either. I was blaming it on the W. TN U.S. mail., but I need someone els e to blame now (looking around).... Dan Helsper Puryear, TN -----Original Message----- From: Jack Phillips Sent: Mon, Feb 24, 2014 5:29 pm Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Newsletter .com> I still haven't received my newsletter. Who is this John Hofmann, anyway? Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Boothe Sent: Monday, February 24, 2014 6:23 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Newsletter As expected, it took a little longer to get over the Sierra's, and arrived today!...well worth the wait! Nicely done, John! Happy Birthday! Gary NX308MB Sent from my iPhone ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 03:48:44 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: fish scales From: danhelsper@aol.com Oscar, I gave the Official Pietenpol-List Fish Scales (why is this plural?) to Lar ry Morlock at Brodhead last summer. I assume he still has them. As far as t his test being a waste of time.....oh I don't know. At least it will give a relative static thrust compared to all the other Piets that have used it ( them). That is worth something, right? If I were a new builder I would feel a lot better and confident on my very first take-off if I knew that my pow erplant/prop at least was in line with other proven ships that came before. Isn't that how jet engines are rated, static thrust? Dan Helsper Puryear, TN -----Original Message----- From: taildrags Sent: Tue, Feb 25, 2014 4:22 am Subject: Pietenpol-List: fish scales OK, so in another couple of weeks I'll be starting to think about having Sc out do the thrust test with the official fish scales. Not in any hurry though. Who has the scales and how do I go about getting in the mailing queue to try th em out? -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford, OR Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419297#419297 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 03:55:08 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair acceleration From: danhelsper@aol.com Gary Boothe would be the authority on Corvair/prop combinations. He has qui te a hit of experience in this area :O). Dan Helsper Puryear, TN -----Original Message----- From: nightmare Sent: Mon, Feb 24, 2014 6:16 pm Subject: Pietenpol-List: corvair acceleration om> Hey guys . Just curious. Will be using A corvair motor and after Reading th e occasional post that Talks of larger props better for draggy piets. And ho w the corvair will accelerate slower with smaller prop. How does a 100 hp corvair really perform against let's say a 85 he cont. ? Acceleration on takeoff an d climb. I know tough question to get hard evidence because no two piets built a like. Maybe simple opinions on observations from the Brodhead fly in. -------- Paul Donahue Started 8-3-12 do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419279#419279 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 04:38:12 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: newsletter From: "tkreiner" Nope, nothing here in Spring, TX, either! In the meantime, I'm reading old newsletters, trying to figure it all out... -------- Tom Kreiner Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419310#419310 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:00:08 AM PST US From: John Franklin Subject: Pietenpol-List: Air-Ground Communications FWIW: I received my BPA Newsletter yesterday! Is it legal to communicate (VHF aircraft frequencies) with a hand-held radio from the ground to an aircraft? Is it legal to communicate from one hand-held aircraft radio on the ground to another hand-held radio on the ground? Back in 1970 I had to get an RROP (Restricted Radiotelephone Operator Permit) to use an aircraft radio but I don't think they are required anymore. A friend of mine said the above is all not legal but when you read about the RROP, it seems like it would be OK. John Franklin GN-1 / Corvair Prairie Aire 4TA0 Needville, TX ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 05:01:02 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: VW engines in Pietenpols From: "Vasek" Hi Bill, thank you for your article, it is very educative :) Let me ask you a question: There are several variants of VW engine. The smallest is obviously too small to power a Piet, but then we also have the bigger VWs, which have more power. I am talking about VW with 2500ccm, which produces 85hp. What would happen if I installed a larger propeller on it (170cm) - it would decrease the rpm, the power will be lower but torque will increase. Am I right? Would that be a sufficient solution? You know, the advantage of the VW which is connected directly with the propeller - so no reduction drive- is that you don't need to cool down the engine so much, you don't need an electric starter. So I can save let's say 15kg in weight and coolants, liquids. Because this VW is lighter, it would need to be moved slightly forward, but I think that not more than 5cm. So if my ideas are not totaly wrong, it looks like this 2500ccm (2,5litre) VW would be sufficient for a decent flight with a passenger in a Pietenpol. And now I stabbed the wasp's nest :D -------- My production of WW1 propellers, trophies and constructions: Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419312#419312 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:21:50 AM PST US From: "Gary Boothe" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: corvair acceleration Thanks, Dan! Some experience, yes, but I haven't done a race horse take off against an 85.Well..that's not exactly true. A few months ago I did some formation flying with a 85 powered Baby Ace. The Baby Ace is a smaller, faster plane. We lined up on the runway, with me in a trailing position. I was off the runway before him, and stayed with him throughout the climb out. My Piet will easily do 90mph, but it's awfully windy at that speed. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ceM4IENXrTo &feature=youtu.be Eventually, I throttled back and Lee dropped in behind me. I can only say that I have been continually impressed with the Corvair performance. There have been times when a quick slide of the throttle, and that sudden burst of power, have saved my butt on some landings! My home made prop is somewhere around 66 x 34, made from poplar, and weighs a hair over 4 lbs! Gary Boothe NX308MB From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of danhelsper@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2014 3:55 AM Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: corvair acceleration Gary Boothe would be the authority on Corvair/prop combinations. He has quite a hit of experience in this area :O). Dan Helsper Puryear, TN -----Original Message----- From: nightmare Sent: Mon, Feb 24, 2014 6:16 pm Subject: Pietenpol-List: corvair acceleration Hey guys . Just curious. Will be using A corvair motor and after Reading the occasional post that Talks of larger props better for draggy piets. And how the corvair will accelerate slower with smaller prop. How does a 100 hp corvair really perform against let's say a 85 he cont. ? Acceleration on takeoff and climb. I know tough question to get hard evidence because no two piets built alike. Maybe simple opinions on observations from the Brodhead fly in. -------- Paul Donahue Started 8-3-12 do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419279#419279 " target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 05:44:49 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: VW engines in Pietenpols From: "jarheadpilot82" If you are interested in a discussion of propeller efficiency based upon actual testing, you might want to read a recent post by William Wynne at FlyCorvair.net- http://flycorvair.net/2014/02/25/myths-about-propeller-efficency/ It is a good discussion of propeller efficiency in general and not just as it relates to Corvair engines. A good read. -------- Semper Fi, Terry Hand Athens, GA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419316#419316 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 05:56:21 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: corvair acceleration From: "jarheadpilot82" Paul, Read the following post- http://flycorvair.net/2012/10/17/pietenpol-power-100-hp-corvair-vs-65-hp-lycoming/ It discusses the replacement of a 65 HP engine with a Corvair engine and the differences in the flight characteristics. -------- Semper Fi, Terry Hand Athens, GA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419317#419317 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 05:59:30 AM PST US From: Mario Giacummo Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: VW engines in Pietenpols Hi Vasek, Just an other word about the VW. When I begun the project few years ago, I was thinking like you: "I want and I am going to fly with a VW", but now I have an A65 on the nose. The reasons are lots, but technicaly you can not run a VW at 3000 rpm with a big prop; it do not work, you need to reduce the rpm with a reductin drive to keep the big prop, and you have to modify lots of things in the engine too. You can search what in the net. There are VW engins flying, but not in so dragged planes, about conversion of the engine, you can read this article too http://www.eaa.org/experimenter/articles/2010-02_powerplants.asp visit those builders and see what they do with the engins to make them fly safe; lots of job an very expensive at all. Look this thred about engines on the piet: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?t=98883&postdays=0&postorder =asc&highlight=pietenpol+engines&start Regards Mario Giacummo 2014-02-25 11:00 GMT-02:00 Vasek : > > Hi Bill, > > thank you for your article, it is very educative :) > > Let me ask you a question: > > There are several variants of VW engine. The smallest is obviously too > small to power a Piet, but then we also have the bigger VWs, which have > more power. I am talking about VW with 2500ccm, which produces 85hp. What > would happen if I installed a larger propeller on it (170cm) - it would > decrease the rpm, the power will be lower but torque will increase. Am I > right? > > Would that be a sufficient solution? > > You know, the advantage of the VW which is connected directly with the > propeller - so no reduction drive- is that you don't need to cool down th e > engine so much, you don't need an electric starter. So I can save let's s ay > 15kg in weight and coolants, liquids. > > Because this VW is lighter, it would need to be moved slightly forward, > but I think that not more than 5cm. > > So if my ideas are not totaly wrong, it looks like this 2500ccm (2,5litre ) > VW would be sufficient for a decent flight with a passenger in a Pietenpo l. > > And now I stabbed the wasp's nest > > :D > > -------- > My production of WW1 propellers, trophies and constructions: > =88=BC > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419312#419312 > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 06:11:53 AM PST US From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-RXD0)[Vantage Partners, LLC]" Subject: Pietenpol-List: thoughts about using a good old fashioned Continental non-electric A-65 engine on a Pietenpol The very cool thing about a Pietenpol (or any experimental homebuilt in the US FAR's) is that you can use ANY engine you want but dollar for dollar, headache-for-headache, you are going to spend just as much money, if not more in time and repair costs down the road trying to make these other engines as cost-effective and as reliab le as a standard old rebuilt A-65 non-electric Continental engine. The Model A engine is way cool and many have made it reliable and powerful. The other engine choices have more power sometimes than a Continental but can come with an array of stuff you simply don't need on a Continental like starters, batteries, alternators, voltage regulators, starter ring gears, belt drives, reduction drives, ignition coils, wirin g harnesses, fuses, circuit breakers, switches, and don't promise a long life necessarily. Don't get me wrong, I believe we ALL have the right to chose whatever engine we want but....and hear me out on this one.... but if you want a simple, reliable, reasonably priced engine that will not complicate or extend your build time or 'rebuild' time the Continental is the best, dollar for dollar, passenger ride after passenger ride. Mike C. ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 06:14:49 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vasek's Pietenpol project From: "Vasek" I don't know why but I am still wondering about the VW 2.5 litre with 85hp. However, I am not going to buy it, I will wait till the fuselage and wing are finished and then I will decide according to what will be available. This is my imagination: (Modified photo of G-BUCO - I like the cowling) +there will be the leather belts over the cowling made of metal and wind-shields will be made out of three flat parts. -------- My production of WW1 propellers, trophies and constructions: Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419318#419318 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/vasek_pietenpol_2_601.jpg ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 06:29:38 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: thoughts about using a good old fashioned Continental non-el From: "tools" I ALWAYS wanted a Ford powered Piet. BUT, probably a lot like a lot of Piet builders and buyers, I didn't have much experience with ANY airplane engine. I decided I had enough stuff to learn owning and operating my first light civil plane that the added difficulty of a non standard engine wasn't a great idea. So I also opted for the non electric A65. REALLY HAPPY I did. However, it being the experimental it is, I just might still build a Ford A and put it up front. But when it comes to flying it to Brodhead or something, I'll put the A65 back on. Can't imagine it would take more than a day once the conversion is complete. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419321#419321 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 06:31:10 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: VW engines in Pietenpols From: "Vasek" Thank you for the link. Today I talked to a friend aircraft constructor and he could not believe that the Pietenpol would not fly will with the VW 2.5litre 85hp engine. ... So now we have two different opinions. What is the conclusion? -------- My production of WW1 propellers, trophies and constructions: Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419322#419322 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 06:45:55 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: VW engines in Pietenpols From: Gary Boothe Has your friend ever seen a VW Piet? Neither have I. Gary NX308MB Sent from my iPhone > On Feb 25, 2014, at 6:30 AM, "Vasek" wrote: > > > Thank you for the link. > > Today I talked to a friend aircraft constructor and he could not believe that the Pietenpol would not fly will with the VW 2.5litre 85hp engine. > > ... > > So now we have two different opinions. What is the conclusion? > > -------- > My production of WW1 propellers, trophies and constructions: > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419322#419322 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 06:48:13 AM PST US From: Kip and Beth Gardner Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: VW engines in Pietenpols Does your friend have any experience with building a Pietenpol? If not, his opinion is exactly that, his opinion, it may or may not be informed. There are many more than "two" opinions on this, there is an entire history of people working with this design, and the overwhelming experience of those who have tried it is that, yes, you can make a VW engine work, but the time, expense and headaches would be better devoted to something that will actually perform well on the airplane. There are many good engine choices available, no matter where in the world you live - look around and find something suitable instead of putting a lot of energy into making something marginal work. Just my 'opinion' - still planning on using a WW Corvair conversion & hopefully restarting my project with the help of a new partner this Spring. Kip Gardner On Feb 25, 2014, at 9:30 AM, Vasek wrote: > > Thank you for the link. > > Today I talked to a friend aircraft constructor and he could not > believe that the Pietenpol would not fly will with the VW 2.5litre > 85hp engine. > > ... > > So now we have two different opinions. What is the conclusion? > > -------- > My production of WW1 propellers, trophies and constructions: > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419322#419322 > > ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 07:47:24 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: corvair acceleration From: "nightmare" Thanks guys. Looks like WW put out another blog today after reading the same post that I read yesterday. Pretty much answers my question. was trying to chose my words wisely when asking the question. I know engine selection can be a touchy subject here and didn't want to rehash that debate. I've only ridden/flown on PF back's fine plane and was mostly curious of runway length needed and climb rate. Thanks guys -------- Paul Donahue Started 8-3-12 do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419328#419328 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 08:20:46 AM PST US From: "Dick N" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Air-Ground Communications John Don't throw the old license away, It doesn't expire. You don't need it any more in the U.S. But if you fly into Canada you are supposed to have it. I have been into Canada many times and have never been asked for it but, who knows. Dick N. ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Franklin" Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2014 6:59 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Air-Ground Communications > > FWIW: I received my BPA Newsletter yesterday! > > Is it legal to communicate (VHF aircraft frequencies) with a hand-held > radio from the ground to an aircraft? Is it legal to communicate from one > hand-held aircraft radio on the ground to another hand-held radio on the > ground? > > Back in 1970 I had to get an RROP (Restricted Radiotelephone Operator > Permit) to use an aircraft radio but I don't think they are required > anymore. A friend of mine said the above is all not legal but when you > read about the RROP, it seems like it would be OK. > > John Franklin > GN-1 / Corvair > Prairie Aire 4TA0 > Needville, TX > > > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 10:47:59 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: fish scales From: "taildrags" Dan; yes, it really is just a "My turn now... watch this!" type of comparison between Piets, and it doesn't generate any useful data. I've moved on and won't bother with it. -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford, OR Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419335#419335 ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 12:22:12 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vasek's Pietenpol project From: Steven Dortch Just curious, Anyone used s BMW motorcycle engine? Steve D On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 3:16 PM, Vasek wrote: > > Thank you for your advices Jack and Lorenzo. > > I already changed my mind with the VW engine, after I got a clear > explanation about the torque, and after reading the Bill Church's article .. > It would result in many complications which do not worth it.. > > There might be some Microns available here, I will see. > > Another option is now another automobile engine with a reduction drive. I > could use a Suzuki engine. I will see. Now I can build the aircraft and > watch for offers in shops, used engines. > > I will use the original Pietenpol airfoil. > > As for the meeting in Brodhead/Oshkosh, you want me to try the first > trans-atlantic flight with a Pietenpol? :D > > -------- > My production of WW1 propellers, trophies and constructions: > =88=BC > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419261#419261 > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 12:31:11 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: corvair acceleration From: Steven Dortch Good article, However, the conventional wisdom on the "65HP' Lycoming is that it was closer to 50HP. Not near as good an engine as the contenetal Blue Skies, Steve D On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 7:56 AM, jarheadpilot82 wrote: > jarheadpilot82@hotmail.com> > > Paul, > > Read the following post- > > > http://flycorvair.net/2012/10/17/pietenpol-power-100-hp-corvair-vs-65-hp-lycoming/ > > It discusses the replacement of a 65 HP engine with a Corvair engine and > the differences in the flight characteristics. > > -------- > Semper Fi, > > Terry Hand > Athens, GA > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419317#419317 > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 12:42:42 PM PST US From: Keith Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vasek's Pietenpol project Yes, I am just nearing the end of my build using a BMW K100LT engine, fitted with a Rotax "C" gearbox with a ratio of 3 to 1. It has the original fuel injection and electronic ignition and seems to be OK. It gave 2250 Prop RPM when fitted with a 72" by 46", I am now waiting for the winter rains and winds to go away so that I can fit the new 72" by 42" prop which I hope will give me 2550 RPM. Attached is a photograph of the engine installation. Hoping for an engineering inspection in May. Keith Hodge On 25/02/2014 20:21, Steven Dortch wrote: > Just curious, Anyone used s BMW motorcycle engine? > > Steve D > > > On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 3:16 PM, Vasek > wrote: > > > > > Thank you for your advices Jack and Lorenzo. > > I already changed my mind with the VW engine, after I got a clear > explanation about the torque, and after reading the Bill Church's > article. It would result in many complications which do not worth it.. > > There might be some Microns available here, I will see. > > Another option is now another automobile engine with a reduction > drive. I could use a Suzuki engine. I will see. Now I can build > the aircraft and watch for offers in shops, used engines. > > I will use the original Pietenpol airfoil. > > As for the meeting in Brodhead/Oshkosh, you want me to try the > first trans-atlantic flight with a Pietenpol? :D > > -------- > My production of WW1 propellers, trophies and constructions: > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419261#419261 > > > ========== > br> -List" > target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List > ========== > MS - > k">http://forums.matronics.com > ========== > e - > -Matt Dralle, List Admin. > t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution > ========== > > > * > > > * ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 12:54:01 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vasek's Pietenpol project From: "Vasek" Interesting. Could I know what engine it exactly is and its specifications? One guy who lives nearby has BMW from a motorcycle available, but I thought it would be to weak. Let me know, this is interesting! [quote="steven.d.dortch(at)gmail."]Just curious, Anyone used s BMW motorcycle engine? Steve D On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 3:16 PM, Vasek wrote: > > > Thank you for your advices Jack and Lorenzo. > > I already changed my mind with the VW engine, after I got a clear > explanation about the torque, and after reading the Bill Church's article -------- My production of WW1 propellers, trophies and constructions: Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419342#419342 ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 01:04:38 PM PST US From: Keith Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vasek's Pietenpol project 4 Cylinder, water cooled, 90 HP @ 8000RPM giving 2666 Prop RPM with the 3 to 1 Rotax gearbox. This is the in line engine. Keith Hodge On 25/02/2014 20:53, Vasek wrote: > > Interesting. Could I know what engine it exactly is and its specifications? > > One guy who lives nearby has BMW from a motorcycle available, but I thought it would be to weak. > > Let me know, this is interesting! > > [quote="steven.d.dortch(at)gmail."]Just curious, Anyone used s BMW motorcycle engine? > > Steve D > > > On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 3:16 PM, Vasek wrote: > > >> >> >> Thank you for your advices Jack and Lorenzo. >> >> I already changed my mind with the VW engine, after I got a clear >> explanation about the torque, and after reading the Bill Church's article > > -------- > My production of WW1 propellers, trophies and constructions: > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419342#419342 > > ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 01:25:10 PM PST US From: glenschweizer@yahoo.com Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vasek's Pietenpol project Looks great. What's it weigh any idea of expected fuel cunsumption? Sent from my iPhone > On Feb 25, 2014, at 12:41 PM, Keith wrote: > > Yes, > > I am just nearing the end of my build using a BMW K100LT engine, fitted wi th a Rotax "C" gearbox with a ratio of 3 to 1. > > It has the original fuel injection and electronic ignition and seems to be OK. It gave 2250 Prop RPM when fitted with a 72" by 46", I am now waiting f or the winter rains and winds to go away so that I can fit the new 72" by 42 " prop which I hope will give me 2550 RPM. > > Attached is a photograph of the engine installation. > > Hoping for an engineering inspection in May. > > Keith Hodge > > > > >> On 25/02/2014 20:21, Steven Dortch wrote: >> Just curious, Anyone used s BMW motorcycle engine? >> >> Steve D >> >> >> On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 3:16 PM, Vasek wrote: >>> >>> Thank you for your advices Jack and Lorenzo. >>> >>> I already changed my mind with the VW engine, after I got a clear explan ation about the torque, and after reading the Bill Church's article. It woul d result in many complications which do not worth it.. >>> >>> There might be some Microns available here, I will see. >>> >>> Another option is now another automobile engine with a reduction drive. I could use a Suzuki engine. I will see. Now I can build the aircraft and wat ch for offers in shops, used engines. >>> >>> I will use the original Pietenpol airfoil. >>> >>> As for the meeting in Brodhead/Oshkosh, you want me to try the first tra ns-atlantic flight with a Pietenpol? :D >>> >>> -------- >>> My production of WW1 propellers, trophies and constructions: >>> =88=BC >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Read this topic online here: >>> >>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419261#419261 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ========== >>> br> -List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpo l-List >>> ========== >>> MS - >>> k">http://forums.matronics.com >>> ========== >>> e - >>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin. >>> t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >>> ========== > > ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 01:28:04 PM PST US From: "Boatright, Jeffrey" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vasek's Pietenpol project Who remembers Earl Klebs? Real nice guy. He built an Aircamper several years ago, and I think he did it in just a handful of months so that he could attend the Brodhead fly-in that celebrated the 70th or 75th anniversary of the Aircamper. His was NOT powered by a BMW, but he did have a BMW connection. Earl is (was?) a character and he gets things done. Built his own home, and it was an octagon. Said he didn't like 90 degree corners. Built a real sportscar from scratch. Raced it locally and won. Earl was to Brodhead a few years ago, but I haven't heard from him since. Hope he's doing well. In any event, one day Earl is driving down a road near his home in NE OK. See's a guy in the ditch with a motorcycle laying nearby. Somehow the kid had run off the road and was beat up a little. Earl tosses the bike (an older 25 HP BMW flat twin) into the bed of the pickup and tosses the kid in the front. Gets the kid to the hospital, and while they're waiting in the ER waiting room, asks the kid what he's going to do with that moto-sickle (which was not too beat up, unlike the kid). Kid says "Mister, I don't ever wanna see it again!" Earl offers him $20 and the kid says "Sold!" I don't think Early ever followed up on the kid's recovery (maybe he can correct me if he's on this list), but he DID hang that BMW flat twin off the front end of an ultralight and went flying. Do not archive -- Jeffrey H. Boatright, PhD, FARVO Associate Professor of Ophthalmology Emory University School of Medicine On 2/25/14 3:53 PM, "Vasek" wrote: > >Interesting. Could I know what engine it exactly is and its >specifications? > >One guy who lives nearby has BMW from a motorcycle available, but I >thought it would be to weak. > >Let me know, this is interesting! > >[quote="steven.d.dortch(at)gmail."]Just curious, Anyone used s BMW >motorcycle engine? > >Steve D > > >On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 3:16 PM, Vasek wrote: > > >> >> >> Thank you for your advices Jack and Lorenzo. >> >> I already changed my mind with the VW engine, after I got a clear >> explanation about the torque, and after reading the Bill Church's >>article > > >-------- >My production of WW1 propellers, trophies and constructions: > 14 > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419342#419342 > > ________________________________ This e-mail message (including any attachments) is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this message (including any attachments) is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please contact the sender by reply e-mail message and destroy all copies of the original message (including attachments). ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 01:28:08 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Vasek's Pietenpol project From: Steven Dortch Very interesting, What is the end Horsepower at what RPM and what weight? How about the BMW Opposed twin? It would look like a natural. but would also need a Reduction drive. Steve D On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 2:41 PM, Keith wrote: > Yes, > > I am just nearing the end of my build using a BMW K100LT engine, fitted > with a Rotax "C" gearbox with a ratio of 3 to 1. > > It has the original fuel injection and electronic ignition and seems to b e > OK. It gave 2250 Prop RPM when fitted with a 72" by 46", I am now waiting > for the winter rains and winds to go away so that I can fit the new 72" b y > 42" prop which I hope will give me 2550 RPM. > > Attached is a photograph of the engine installation. > > Hoping for an engineering inspection in May. > > Keith Hodge > > > On 25/02/2014 20:21, Steven Dortch wrote: > > Just curious, Anyone used s BMW motorcycle engine? > > Steve D > > > On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 3:16 PM, Vasek wrote: > >> >> Thank you for your advices Jack and Lorenzo. >> >> I already changed my mind with the VW engine, after I got a clear >> explanation about the torque, and after reading the Bill Church's articl e. >> It would result in many complications which do not worth it.. >> >> There might be some Microns available here, I will see. >> >> Another option is now another automobile engine with a reduction drive. I >> could use a Suzuki engine. I will see. Now I can build the aircraft and >> watch for offers in shops, used engines. >> >> I will use the original Pietenpol airfoil. >> >> As for the meeting in Brodhead/Oshkosh, you want me to try the first >> trans-atlantic flight with a Pietenpol? :D >> >> -------- >> My production of WW1 propellers, trophies and constructions: >> =88=BC >> >> >> >> >> Read this topic online here: >> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419261#419261 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ========== >> br> -List" target="_blank"> >> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List >> ========== >> MS - >> k">http://forums.matronics.com >> ========== >> e - >> -Matt Dralle, List Admin. >> t="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> ========== >> >> >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 03:39:02 PM PST US From: JOSEPH SWITHIN Subject: Pietenpol-List: BPA Newslatter John, My copy made it to Illinois today. Looks great! Joe Swithin Morris, IL ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 04:29:54 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: fish scales From: "AircamperN11MS" Hey, I have an idea. How about the scale find its way to Frazeur Lake for the Piet gathering. We could have a pull off. Perhaps send it t to Chris Tracy. -------- Scott Liefeld Flying N11MS since March 1972 Steel Tube C-85-12 Wire Wheels Brodhead in 1996 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419352#419352 ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 04:35:40 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: VW engines in Pietenpols From: "AircamperN11MS" Besides all the above. The engine mount would need to be six feet long. It doesn't weigh enough. -------- Scott Liefeld Flying N11MS since March 1972 Steel Tube C-85-12 Wire Wheels Brodhead in 1996 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419353#419353 ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 04:48:47 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: fish scales From: Gary Boothe [Like] Gary NX30MB (I'll be happy just making it there!!) Sent from my iPhone > On Feb 25, 2014, at 4:29 PM, "AircamperN11MS" wrote: > > > Hey, I have an idea. How about the scale find its way to Frazeur Lake for the Piet gathering. We could have a pull off. Perhaps send it t to Chris Tracy. > > -------- > Scott Liefeld > Flying N11MS since March 1972 > Steel Tube > C-85-12 > Wire Wheels > Brodhead in 1996 > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419352#419352 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 04:51:51 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: fish scales From: "AircamperN11MS" Us too. -------- Scott Liefeld Flying N11MS since March 1972 Steel Tube C-85-12 Wire Wheels Brodhead in 1996 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419356#419356 ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 05:22:29 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: newsletter From: Michael Conkling Hello Good People! Have faith -- it's got to be close! Our copy has arrived in South Central Kansas. Mike C. (yet another one...) Pretty Prairie, KS On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 6:37 AM, tkreiner wrote: > > Nope, nothing here in Spring, TX, either! In the meantime, I'm reading > old newsletters, trying to figure it all out... > > -------- > Tom Kreiner > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419310#419310 > > ________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________ Time: 06:13:11 PM PST US From: "Boatright, Jeffrey" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: newsletter Bruce, I'd like you to meet Bruce. Old Monty Python skit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_f_p0CgPeyA -- Jeffrey H. Boatright, PhD, FARVO Associate Professor of Ophthalmology Emory University School of Medicine From: Michael Conkling > >" > etenpol-list@matronics.com> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: newsletter Hello Good People! Have faith -- it's got to be close! Our copy has arrived in South Central Kansas. Mike C. (yet another one...) Pretty Prairie, KS On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 6:37 AM, tkreiner > wrote: :tkreiner@gmail.com>> Nope, nothing here in Spring, TX, either! In the meantime, I'm reading old newsletters, trying to figure it all out... -------- Tom Kreiner Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419310#419310 st" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List http://forums.matronics.com le, List Admin. ="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ This e-mail message (including any attachments) is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this message (including any attachments) is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please contact the sender by reply e-mail message and destroy all copies of the original message (including attachments). ________________________________ Message 36 ____________________________________ Time: 06:56:50 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: corvair acceleration From: "Don Emch" I do have to say that I looove my Continental A-65 in my Piet. It is very simple and near bullet proof. Although I've done very little to it, it is enjoyable to work on. There's just not much to them! Because of my experiences, I like to recommend the Continental to the Piet builders. My main experiences with the Corvair however, are fairly limited. Most of my experience consists of being outrun and out climbed by Shad. In a few trips to and from Brodhead and Oshkosh I've found this out. Once when flying home from Oshkosh I was following Shad and he decided to just pop up above the layer of clouds. He went on up and I followed. I had to wallow around a cloud on the way up. Meanwhile he was already up there. Another time we were somewhere over Northern Indiana and the storms were building around us. We were 40 or 50 miles from our stop and he just motored on ahead of me to beat the stuff. Then there was last year, my dad (in the Chief) and I took off ahead of him and he said he'd catch up. He needed to fuel up yet. I thought... yeah, right, see at the next stop on the ground. After about 40 minutes... here comes Shad motoring up alongside me. Shad's a really sharp guy though and any engine is only as good as the last guy that worked on it. Still, I like my Continental. :-) Don Emch NX899DE Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419364#419364 ________________________________ Message 37 ____________________________________ Time: 08:28:01 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: fish scales From: "taildrags" I'll be fine with a pull-off at Frazier Lake in June if Gary will park "Samson" (his airplane) and be the judge, then the rest of us 90-lb weaklings can strain and stretch against the mighty fish scales. And to answer Dan's question about why "scales" are plural, I guess it goes back to when they used the old balance scales with a little pan on each end of a balance beam. I plan to take some of my brass data plates to Frazier Lake in case anybody wants to buy some, but maybe I'll put some up as prizes in the pull-off. -------- Oscar Zuniga Medford, OR Air Camper NX41CC "Scout" A75 power Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=419370#419370 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.