---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 09/07/14: 7 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:43 PM - Obligatory Pic (john francis) 2. 12:53 PM - Re: Obligatory Pic (Doug) 3. 12:58 PM - Re: Obligatory Pic (Jack Phillips) 4. 12:59 PM - Re: Obligatory Pic (john francis) 5. 01:16 PM - Re: Re: By butt & butt joints (Jack Phillips) 6. 01:27 PM - Pietenpol for sale (ted brousseau) 7. 04:40 PM - Re: Obligatory Pic (Jack) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:43:25 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Obligatory Pic From: "john francis" The required first sit pic in the Captains chair! -------- John Francis Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430157#430157 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/dscn0014_127.jpg ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 12:53:24 PM PST US From: Doug Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Obligatory Pic Did you make airplane noises? :) Doug Dever =0A In beautiful Stow Ohio > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Obligatory Pic > From: Mrkringles@msn.com > Date: Sun=2C 7 Sep 2014 12:42:59 -0700 > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > > > The required first sit pic in the Captain=99s chair! > > -------- > John Francis > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430157#430157 > > > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/dscn0014_127.jpg > > > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 12:58:36 PM PST US From: "Jack Phillips" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Obligatory Pic Did you make the obligatory airplane sounds? Looks great, John! Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of john francis Sent: Sunday, September 07, 2014 3:43 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Obligatory Pic The required first sit pic in the Captains chair! -------- John Francis Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430157#430157 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/dscn0014_127.jpg ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 12:59:41 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Obligatory Pic From: "john francis" Did you make airplane noises? Yes, after everyone left. -------- John Francis Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430160#430160 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 01:16:48 PM PST US From: "Jack Phillips" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: By butt & butt joints Sorry to be so late replying, but I've been out of town. I agree with William, the photo showing the front of the rear seat support is not the best way to do it. The good news is, you know exactly where it is likely to fail (right in the middle). Far better to make a continuous "Shear Web" across the front of the seat to help distribute the loads. The rear seat takes some heavy loads when entering and exiting the cockpit as well as in flight. Typically, most pilots enter a Pietenpol rear cokcpit by standing on the rear seat, which puts a point load of some 200 lbs +/- right on the seat. This load gets transferred through the seat structure down to the lower longerons. Ideally, you want that point load to become a "distributed load" as quickly as possible. The design shown will actually tend to concentrate much of that load toward the middle of the fuselage, in between the longerons. Hopefully, the seat bottom is heavy enough plywood to distribute the load efficiently to the sides and down to the lower longerons. Why is the cross member under the seat missing in the middle? Is it to provide access to the control torque tube? If so, I'd say that is un-necessary. In 10 years of flying mine, I've never needed access to the torque tube, other than to apply lubrication during the annual Condition Inspections. I'm all for modifying the original design if it can be improved upon. I made many modifications to the plans when building mine, and some of them were improvements. Most were not. I've flown many Pietenpols and I can truthfully say that the ones that fly best are the ones closest to the plans design. Those closer to the plans than mine fly better than mine. Bernard was really a very good engineer and his way of doing things is usually best. This is one of those areas where it would be best to stick to the plans. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of William Wynne Sent: Friday, September 05, 2014 11:57 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: By butt & butt joints My 2 cents on the vertical seat base in the photo above marked 3/22/2010: It is a structural mistake to cut it out like that. The plans show this as a 5.5" or 6" tall 23" wide sheet. Yes it has a hole in it for the control tube, but it has a continuous side to side stick at the front of the seat that is cut out in the photo. .. If built to plans, even with the hole in it, the 6" plate is a shear web that spreads half the seat loads all the way to the sides of the plane. Built in the photo, weight on the seat will be allowed to bend the bottom of the fuselage at the center line. Don't take my word for this, just ask Jack Phillips about this. .. Wood structures work because you glue the all together and they become "monolithic." Well made glue joins do a great job spreading loads. deciding to make a wood panel removable essentially prevents it from pulling its share of the load and supporting adjacent panels. Having a seat bottom that isn't glued in is a mistake, and combining it with a structurally cut 6" front support compounds the issue. .. Not flying aerobatics? Go ask anyone with a G meter in their plane where the needle points after a really hard landing, and that applies to planes with 9" of suspension travel and regular aircraft tires with several inches of sidewall deflection. Just because it holds a big guy in the workshop means nothing on the flight line. .. If you don't know structures, resist offering guidance to other builders on how to modify load bearing elements of their planes. -ww. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430061#430061 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 01:27:54 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Pietenpol for sale From: "ted brousseau" A friend of a friend called me last night to let me know that there is a partially build Piet down here in SW Florida. I don't know anything about it other than what was told to me. It is supposedly ready to cover and comes with 2 Model B Ford engines. The seller's info is: Lloyd Moore at 239-464-5437. Might be just what someone was looking for. Ted Brousseau 90/90 & hope to be at Brodhead next year Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430164#430164 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 04:40:02 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Obligatory Pic From: Jack Been there done that. Very nice John! Sent from my iPad Jack Textor > On Sep 7, 2014, at 2:42 PM, "john francis" wrote: > > > The required first sit pic in the Captains chair! > > -------- > John Francis > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430157#430157 > > > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/dscn0014_127.jpg > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.