---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 09/17/14: 10 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:50 AM - Re: wings and cabanes-----one simple question (Braniff1966) 2. 06:30 AM - Re: wings and cabanes-----one simple question (Pocono John) 3. 09:27 AM - Re: Re: wings and cabanes-----one simple question (THOMAS.233327) 4. 09:28 AM - Re: wings and cabanes-----one simple question (Pocono John) 5. 11:42 AM - Re: Drawing the rib (aerocarjake) 6. 03:02 PM - Re: Drawing the rib (Pocono John) 7. 03:16 PM - Re: wings and cabanes-----one simple question (Pocono John) 8. 03:53 PM - Oshkosh trip complete. (tools) 9. 07:35 PM - Re: Oshkosh trip complete. (tools) 10. 07:40 PM - Re: Oshkosh trip complete. (jarheadpilot82) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:50:35 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: wings and cabanes-----one simple question From: "Braniff1966" yes drafting is an art form that is being lost..so sad.. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430660#430660 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:30:19 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: wings and cabanes-----one simple question From: "Pocono John" Appreciate the comments. In making the tick marks along the horizontal reference line, I clamped a long metal ruler (can be seen momentarily at 3:19) and started at the forward line (datum). I measured this ruler with several others by the way, and decided to use the long metal one for all rib measurements to maintain consistency. I had to use a magnifying glass for those 32nd and 64th measurements. Oh, I took a mechanical drawing class in 1978 at SUNY Farmingdale. Still using the old T square (in opening of video, it's behind the blue ruler; you can see the "T" down low as it's hanging upside down). Yes, the pencil line is a bit thick, but didn't think it would make a substantial impact, but I'll try this again with a mechanical pencil. I contacted Andrew Pietenpol and he has already responded (I sent him the video link also). He said he's going to call me later. He mentioned in his note "the plane was always under continuous improvement". One thing I noticed going through the booklet (orange cover) is the wing on page 30 (Sky Scout) is the same rib on plans page 5. Hmmm. Looking forward to a phone call later. -------- John Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430669#430669 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 09:27:29 AM PST US From: "THOMAS.233327" Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: wings and cabanes-----one simple question John and Tom I agree with fine lines, but question the problem with using the end of the ruler or scale. I was a draftsmen for 3 years, then went to template making for Boeing. Drafting scales all have the 0 (zero) a small distance from the end of the scale, machinists have the zero at the end of the scale. Draftsman start at the one inch mark, shop people test the scale making a mark at the end of the scale and at some convenient distance down the scale-1", 4", 3 cm, whatever, move the scale so the 1" mark is on one mark and see if the end of the scale produces accurate measurements. If its good, use the end od the scale, if not THROW THAT SCALE AWAY!. I guarantee you will end up with parts that are 1" short with maddening regularity if you use the 1" mark as a starting point. I spent a whole career in the shop and I learned this from experience (mostly building boats). Tom Hale PS. Yes Jake, I'm the Tom who built the HummelBird and was an officer in 441 of several years. ----- Original Message ----- From: "tkreiner" Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2014 8:43:03 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: wings and cabanes-----one simple question John, Just as an observation... without knowing whether you ever took a drafting class, or had any formal training in layout or lofting... it would appear that your lines themselves, are way too thick. Thin lines are much better as the thickness of the line never distorts or influences the design you're transferring to paper - or, in this case, plywood. Another item I noticed is that your dimensions are taken - and I'm not dissing you here, just giving you another observation - from the end of the scale. If you want to produce accurate dimensions, place the 1.0 inch line at the starting point or datum, if you will, and hold the scale firmly in place while you place - or measure - the location of the tick marks. The above are techniques which aren't being taught anymore in the era of CAD programs, but when you're actually laying out a series of points to produce an airfoil, or any other critical design, the old school techniques can be the difference you're experiencing. After 40+ years of Mechanical Design Engineering & drafting, just my $0.02. -------- Tom Kreiner Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430654#430654 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 09:28:11 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: wings and cabanes-----one simple question From: "Pocono John" Amazing that Andrew Pietenpol would call me. He said: 1) can build either the full size rib OR the rib from drawing 5. There's an 86 year difference between the two (his words). 2) Keep it simple. 3) Stick to the plans. 4) keep it light It sure says something when he can take the time out of his life to chat with a builder. -------- John Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430675#430675 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 11:42:25 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Drawing the rib From: "aerocarjake" hello... I watched your video and it does look like a confusing discrepancy...?!?!? (Since I bought my wings that another person had built, I have not much to offer in regards to this question.) -------- Jake Schultz - curator, Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430682#430682 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 03:02:45 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Drawing the rib From: "Pocono John" Andrew Pietenpol called me this morning. He said: 1) can build from either the full size rib OR the rib from drawing 5. There's an 86 year difference between the two (his words). 2) Keep it simple. 3) Stick to the plans. 4) keep it light Apparently, they are different ribs. The one on plans page 5 is the Sky Scout rib from page 30 of the orange booklet. In his email to me, he made this comment "In short the plane was always under continuous improvement." Since I already painstakingly drew the rib from page 5 of the plans, and he said it's OK, that's the one I'm building. It sure says something when he can take the time out of his life to chat with a builder. -------- John Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430693#430693 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 03:16:03 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: wings and cabanes-----one simple question From: "Pocono John" When looking at the rib on page 5, compare it to the Sky Scout rib on page 30 of the orange booklet. They're the same. -------- John Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430694#430694 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 03:53:57 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Oshkosh trip complete. From: "tools" Left 2rn in Oshkosh for a while to get the condition inspection done and flew it back to chickamauga yesterday end today.. Awesome trip! I think Scott and I are over 45 hours of cross country time together in her. More pics and videos to follow. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430695#430695 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/image_418.jpg ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 07:35:12 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Oshkosh trip complete. From: "tools" More pics from along the way. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430702#430702 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/image_207.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/image_582.jpg ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 07:40:25 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Oshkosh trip complete. From: "jarheadpilot82" Nice picture, Lance Captain! -------- Semper Fi, Terry Hand Athens, GA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=430703#430703 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message pietenpol-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Pietenpol-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/pietenpol-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/pietenpol-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.