Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:19 AM - VNE at cruise (Douwe Blumberg)
2. 06:32 AM - Re: VNE at cruise (Boatright, Jeffrey)
3. 08:02 AM - Re: VNE at cruise (Jack Philips)
4. 08:10 AM - Re: VNE at cruise (Jack Philips)
5. 08:28 AM - Re: VNE at cruise (Andre B. Charvet)
6. 10:11 AM - Re: VNE at cruise (Barry Davis)
7. 11:54 AM - Re: VNE at cruise (AircamperN11MS)
8. 11:59 AM - Re: VNE at cruise (Mike McGowan)
9. 12:03 PM - Re: VNE at cruise (Jeff Boatright)
10. 12:13 PM - Re: Re: VNE at cruise (Jack Philips)
11. 12:30 PM - Re: VNE at cruise (Ray Krause)
12. 01:11 PM - Re: VNE at cruise (Steven Dortch)
13. 01:37 PM - cruise speeds vs. engine choices (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-LME0)[Vantage Partners, LLC])
14. 05:55 PM - Re: VNE at cruise- bungees versus springs landing gear (Charles Burkholder)
15. 07:13 PM - Re: VNE at cruise- bungees versus springs landing gear (Boatright, Jeffrey)
16. 08:42 PM - Re: VNE at cruise- bungees versus springs landing gear (glenschweizer@yahoo.com)
17. 08:55 PM - Re: VNE at cruise- bungees versus springs landing gear (Gary Boothe)
Message 1
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
About the only way I can imagine my Piet exceeding VNE at cruise is with a
JATO pack strapped between the wheels!
In all seriousness, I think aerodynamic mods are fine if they don't add
weight and you find it an enjoyable pursuit. After all, fun is why we build
these things. However, don't expect too much from them and I've often
wondered if the extra effort and time added building, is worth an extra 3
kts cruising speed. I mean, when I'm chugging around for my average 30
minute summer flight, I couldn't care less how fast I'm going. The ONLY
time I ever wish I had a few extra kts of speed is going to Brodhead, but
even then it would only shave off ten-fifteen minutes or so.
That being said..
I did spend an extra month fairing the axle and covering the wire wheels. I
have NO idea how much it helped having not flown without those mods. The
biggest thing I could do to improve my cruise speed would be to fair or
reshape my wood struts which have a poor aerodynamic shape, but again, I've
weighed the effort against the benefit and decided I'd rather spend the time
flying her. I also experimented with some teardrop shaped clear plastic
tubing to fair the round cables. I did my landing gear cables, then decided
against doing the flying wires because it would destroy the vintage look.
But I do think round wires make a ton of drag which could be at least halved
by sleeving them.
I think biggest drag inducers that could actually be helped are: struts,
wheels, strut connections, axle, windscreens, foot pegs, cables.
$.02
Douwe
Message 2
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: VNE at cruise |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Message 3
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Yet another email from Jeff Boatright with no content. Am I the only
one who gets these?
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
(where it was a balmy 8=C2=B0 this morning)
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Boatright, Jeffrey
Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2015 9:32 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: VNE at cruise
Message 4
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Douwe,
Of everything listed below, probably the biggest contributor to total drag
on a Pietenpol is the array of cables hanging out in the breeze. A round
cable being pushed through the air has a rather large drag coefficient.
Streamlined flying wires for the inter-lift strut wires, the bracing wires
on the tail, the roll wires between the cabanes and the bracing wires on the
undercarriage (if using a straight axle) would help a good deal, but would
also increase the cost of building a Pietenpol by about 50%. And nothing
can be done about the elevator cables, rudder cables, tailwheel steering
cables (if so equipped) and aileron cables that all hang out in the breeze.
If you want something fast, build an RV or a Sonex. If you want low 'n'
slow, build a Pietenpol.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Douwe
Blumberg
Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2015 9:19 AM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: VNE at cruise
About the only way I can imagine my Piet exceeding VNE at cruise is with a
JATO pack strapped between the wheels!
In all seriousness, I think aerodynamic mods are fine if they don't add
weight and you find it an enjoyable pursuit. After all, fun is why we build
these things. However, don't expect too much from them and I've often
wondered if the extra effort and time added building, is worth an extra 3
kts cruising speed. I mean, when I'm chugging around for my average 30
minute summer flight, I couldn't care less how fast I'm going. The ONLY
time I ever wish I had a few extra kts of speed is going to Brodhead, but
even then it would only shave off ten-fifteen minutes or so.
That being said..
I did spend an extra month fairing the axle and covering the wire wheels. I
have NO idea how much it helped having not flown without those mods. The
biggest thing I could do to improve my cruise speed would be to fair or
reshape my wood struts which have a poor aerodynamic shape, but again, I've
weighed the effort against the benefit and decided I'd rather spend the time
flying her. I also experimented with some teardrop shaped clear plastic
tubing to fair the round cables. I did my landing gear cables, then decided
against doing the flying wires because it would destroy the vintage look.
But I do think round wires make a ton of drag which could be at least halved
by sleeving them.
I think biggest drag inducers that could actually be helped are: struts,
wheels, strut connections, axle, windscreens, foot pegs, cables.
$.02
Douwe
Message 5
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: VNE at cruise |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Message 6
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
I think Jeff is using invisible ink. I=99m have been getting blank
ones from him for a while now. Thought I was the only one.
Barry
NX973BP
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Boatright, Jeffrey
Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2015 9:32 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: VNE at cruise
Message 7
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: VNE at cruise |
I see Jeff's just fine. But I am on a PC right now. Wonder if that matters?
--------
Scott Liefeld
Flying N11MS since March 1972
Steel Tube
C-85-12
Wire Wheels
Brodhead in 1996
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=438509#438509
Message 8
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: VNE at cruise |
Does covering the spokes on wire wheels make any difference in directional
control or stability?
Mike McGowan
From: Barry Davis
Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2015 12:11 PM
Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: VNE at cruise
I think Jeff is using invisible ink. I=99m have been getting blank on
es from him for a while now. Thought I was the only one.
Barry
NX973BP
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-lis
t-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Boatright, Jeffrey
Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2015 9:32 AM
Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: VNE at cruise
---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com
Message 9
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: VNE at cruise |
Several people apparently get blank posts from me. I think this happens sometimes
when I reply directly to a matronics post by email. I am sending this message
instead by going to the matronics webpage a replying via the form.
My reply isn't earth-shattering. It was:
Switching from canvas-covered bungees to springs definitely changed how my Piet
behaves when I throttle back for descent in the pattern. With the bungees, the
nose really dropped when I pulled the throttle to idle. This effect is much
less pronounced after we switched to springs.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=438511#438511
Message 10
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: VNE at cruise |
So am I.
Jack Phillips
NX899JP
Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
AircamperN11MS
Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2015 2:54 PM
Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: VNE at cruise
--> <Scott.liefeld@lacity.org>
I see Jeff's just fine. But I am on a PC right now. Wonder if that
matters?
--------
Scott Liefeld
Flying N11MS since March 1972
Steel Tube
C-85-12
Wire Wheels
Brodhead in 1996
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=438509#438509
Message 11
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: VNE at cruise |
To those with "covered wheels", how are they covered? With fabric or aluminu
m discs? If fabric, does it just go around the bead of the rim and cement it
in place? What happens when you have to repair a tire, just recover. Bassl
e has aluminum discs for about $300, covering would be a lot cheaper!
Thanks,
Ray Krause
Sent from my iPad
> On Feb 19, 2015, at 11:59 AM, Mike McGowan <shadetree@socket.net> wrote:
>
> Does covering the spokes on wire wheels make any difference in directional
control or stability?
>
> Mike McGowan
>
> From: Barry Davis
> Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2015 12:11 PM
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: VNE at cruise
>
> I think Jeff is using invisible ink. I=99m have been getting blank o
nes from him for a while now. Thought I was the only one.
> Barry
> NX973BP
>
> From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-li
st-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Boatright, Jeffrey
> Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2015 9:32 AM
> To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: VNE at cruise
>
>
>
>
> ">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List
> ics.com
> .matronics.com/contribution
>
>
>
>
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> www.avast.com
>
>
>
>
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
>
Message 12
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: VNE at cruise |
Per my aerodynamacist, these vintage videos are an excellent source for
information on drag. The professor's lecture voice is a killer, but he
talks the talk.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acySDnGYzVM&index=16&list=PL0EC6527BE
871ABA3
Blue Skies,
Steve D
On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 2:29 PM, Ray Krause <raykrause@frontiernet.net>
wrote:
> To those with "covered wheels", how are they covered? With fabric or
> aluminum discs? If fabric, does it just go around the bead of the rim and
> cement it in place? What happens when you have to repair a tire, just
> recover. Bassle has aluminum discs for about $300, covering would be a l
ot
> cheaper!
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ray Krause
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Feb 19, 2015, at 11:59 AM, Mike McGowan <shadetree@socket.net> wrote:
>
> Does covering the spokes on wire wheels make any difference in
> directional control or stability?
>
> Mike McGowan
>
> *From:* Barry Davis <bed@mindspring.com>
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 19, 2015 12:11 PM
> *To:* pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* RE: Pietenpol-List: VNE at cruise
>
>
> I think Jeff is using invisible ink. I=99m have been getting blank
ones from
> him for a while now. Thought I was the only one.
>
> Barry
>
> NX973BP
>
>
> *From:* owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [
> mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com
> <owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com>] *On Behalf Of *Boatright,
> Jeffrey
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 19, 2015 9:32 AM
> *To:* pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: Pietenpol-List: VNE at cruise
>
>
> *
>
> ">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List <http://www.matronics
.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>
> ics.com <http://ics.com>
> .matronics.com/contribution <http://matronics.com/contribution>
>
> *
>
>
> ------------------------------
> <http://www.avast.com/>
>
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> www.avast.com
>
> *
>
> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D
> npol-List"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List <http://www
.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>
> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D
> //forums.matronics.com <http://forums.matronics.com>
> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D
> ot;">http://www.matronics.com/contribution <http://www.matronics.com/cont
ribution>
> D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D
>
> *
>
> *
>
===========
.matronics.com/Navigator?Pietenpol-List>
===========
===========
om/contribution>
===========
>
> *
>
>
--
Blue Skies,
Steve D
Message 13
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | cruise speeds vs. engine choices |
Although I didn't consult with an aerodynamicist or look up any Vne speeds
or drag coefficients, I have
learned, thru my experience in flying Pietnepols that you're more likely to
get passed up more quickly at
cruise speeds by Canadian geese if flying a Ford powered Piet vs. a Contine
ntal or Corvair powered Piet.
Mike C.
Ohio
Message 14
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: VNE at cruise- bungees versus springs landing gear |
Regarding bungee or spring landing gear. I am half done my split axle
landing gear but not at quite the shock absorbers. I am leaning towards
using steel spring due to the low maintenance "build, fly and forget" it
offers. I was talking to a very experienced tailwheel pilot and
instructor (not a homebuilder) about it and he recommended bungees.
Could I have any input on the pro's and con's of each? How many of you
builders have made the switch after your piet was built and why? If
anything it might add 1 knot to the cruise speed!
On 2/19/2015 9:31 AM, Boatright, Jeffrey wrote:
> Switching from canvas-covered bungees to springs definitely changed
> how my Piet behaves when I throttle back for descent in the pattern.
> With the bungees, the nose really dropped when I pulled the throttle
> to idle. This effect is much less pronounced after we switched to springs.
>
> --
> Jeffrey H. Boatright, PhD, FARVO
> Professor of Ophthalmology
> Emory University School of Medicine
>
> From: Douwe Blumberg <douweblumberg@earthlink.net
> <mailto:douweblumberg@earthlink.net>>
> <mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>" <pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> <mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>>
> Date: Thursday, February 19, 2015 at 9:19 AM
> To: "pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> <mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>" <pietenpol-list@matronics.com
> <mailto:pietenpol-list@matronics.com>>
> Subject: Pietenpol-List: VNE at cruise
>
> About the only way I can imagine my Piet exceeding VNE at cruise
> is with a JATO pack strapped between the wheels!
>
> In all seriousness, I think aerodynamic mods are fine if they
> dont add weight and you find it an enjoyable pursuit. After all,
> fun is why we build these things. However, dont expect too much
> from them and Ive often wondered if the extra effort and time
> added building, is worth an extra 3 kts cruising speed. I mean,
> when Im chugging around for my average 30 minute summer flight, I
> couldnt care less how fast Im going. The ONLY time I ever wish
> I had a few extra kts of speed is going to Brodhead, but even then
> it would only shave off ten-fifteen minutes or so.
>
> That being said.
>
> I did spend an extra month fairing the axle and covering the wire
> wheels. I have NO idea how much it helped having not flown
> without those mods. The biggest thing I could do to improve my
> cruise speed would be to fair or reshape my wood struts which have
> a poor aerodynamic shape, but again, Ive weighed the effort
> against the benefit and decided Id rather spend the time flying
> her. I also experimented with some teardrop shaped clear plastic
> tubing to fair the round cables. I did my landing gear cables,
> then decided against doing the flying wires because it would
> destroy the vintage look. But I do think round wires make a ton
> of drag which could be at least halved by sleeving them.
>
> I think biggest drag inducers that could actually be helped are:
> struts, wheels, strut connections, axle, windscreens, foot pegs,
> cables.
>
> $.02
>
> Douwe
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> This e-mail message (including any attachments) is for the sole use of
> the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged
> information. If the reader of this message is not the intended
> recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution
> or copying of this message (including any attachments) is strictly
> prohibited.
>
> If you have received this message in error, please contact
> the sender by reply e-mail message and destroy all copies of the
> original message (including attachments).
>
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com>
>
> ky"Z+M4Gq(wrzKDKj',.+-
> 5h,z^.+-
Tn+bp+ry'C { ,x(ZP> -Zvkkj+ykym-&j',r5hRm-&j',r5hR08IaT1$+y\{^j)ZnWayg+k&j',r+k&j',rh*'gJ+^N*.~zw,h
jY^.+-kym-&j',rr&*'i0fr((nb{nrf
--
Charles Burkholder
Visit my blog @ http://missionmechfund.blogspot.ca/
Message 15
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: VNE at cruise- bungees versus springs landing gear |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Message 16
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: VNE at cruise- bungees versus springs landing gear |
Hi Jeffrey
Do you have any particulars on the springs you used? Source would be hel
pful too.
Thanks, Glen
Aerial in progress
(Fuse becomes a box this week end!)
Sent from my iPhone
> On Feb 19, 2015, at 7:12 PM, "Boatright, Jeffrey" <jeffboatright@emory.edu
> wrote:
>
> Had bungees. Bungees didn't pass inspection one year. Converted to springs
(they were free to me). No maintenance. No difference in landing performanc
e that I can tell.
>
> =C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3
=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2
=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC
=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC
=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3
=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2
=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC
=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC
=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D=C3=A2=82=AC=9D
> Jeffrey H. Boatright, PhD, FARVO
> Professor of Ophthalmology
> Emory University School of Medicine
> Sent from an iPad with a spelling problem
>
> On Feb 19, 2015, at 8:59 PM, "Charles Burkholder" <born2fly@abcmailbox.net
> wrote:
>
>> Regarding bungee or spring landing gear. I am half done my split axle lan
ding gear but not at quite the shock absorbers. I am leaning towards using s
teel spring due to the low maintenance "build, fly and forget" it offers. I w
as talking to a very experienced tailwheel pilot and instructor (not a homeb
uilder) about it and he recommended bungees.
>> Could I have any input on the pro's and con's of each? How many of you bu
ilders have made the switch after your piet was built and why? If anything i
t might add 1 knot to the cruise speed!
>>> On 2/19/2015 9:31 AM, Boatright, Jeffrey wrote:
>>> Switching from canvas-covered bungees to springs definitely changed how m
y Piet behaves when I throttle back for descent in the pattern. With the bun
gees, the nose really dropped when I pulled the throttle to idle. This effec
t is much less pronounced after we switched to springs.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Jeffrey H. Boatright, PhD, FARVO
>>> Professor of Ophthalmology
>>> Emory University School of Medicine
>>>
>>> From: Douwe Blumberg <douweblumberg@earthlink.net>
>>> Date: Thursday, February 19, 2015 at 9:19 AM
>>> To: "pietenpol-list@matronics.com" <pietenpol-list@matronics.com>
>>> Subject: Pietenpol-List: VNE at cruise
>>>
>>> About the only way I can imagine my Piet exceeding VNE at cruise is with
a JATO pack strapped between the wheels!
>>>
>>> In all seriousness, I think aerodynamic mods are fine if they don=C3=A2
=82=AC=84=A2t add weight and you find it an enjoyable pursuit. After all
, fun is why we build these things. However, don=C3=A2=82=AC=84=A2t e
xpect too much from them and I=C3=A2=82=AC=84=A2ve often wondered if t
he extra effort and time added building, is worth an extra 3 kts cruising sp
eed. I mean, when I=C3=A2=82=AC=84=A2m chugging around for my average
30 minute summer flight, I couldn=C3=A2=82=AC=84=A2t care less how fa
st I=C3=A2=82=AC=84=A2m going. The ONLY time I ever wish I had a few e
xtra kts of speed is going to Brodhead, but even then it would only shave of
f ten-fifteen minutes or so.
>>>
>>> That being said=C3=A2=82=AC=C2.
>>>
>>> I did spend an extra month fairing the axle and covering the wire wheels
. I have NO idea how much it helped having not flown without those mods. T
he biggest thing I could do to improve my cruise speed would be to fair or r
eshape my wood struts which have a poor aerodynamic shape, but again, I=C3=A2
=82=AC=84=A2ve weighed the effort against the benefit and decided I=C3
=A2=82=AC=84=A2d rather spend the time flying her. I also experimente
d with some teardrop shaped clear plastic tubing to fair the round cables. I
did my landing gear cables, then decided against doing the flying wires bec
ause it would destroy the vintage look. But I do think round wires make a t
on of drag which could be at least halved by sleeving them.
>>>
>>> I think biggest drag inducers that could actually be helped are: struts,
wheels, strut connections, axle, windscreens, foot pegs, cables.
>>>
>>> $.02
>>>
>>> Douwe
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> This e-mail message (including any attachments) is for the sole use of
>>> the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged
>>> information. If the reader of this message is not the intended
>>> recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution
>>> or copying of this message (including any attachments) is strictly
>>> prohibited.
>>>
>>> If you have received this message in error, please contact
>>> the sender by reply e-mail message and destroy all copies of the
>>> original message (including attachments).
>>> No virus found in this message.
>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>>> 02/19/15
>>>
>>> ky=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD"=C3=AF=C2=C2
=BD=C3=AD=C5=93=C2=A2Z+=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDM4=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDG=C3=AF=C2=C2
=BDq=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD(=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD
=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDw=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDr=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3
=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=93=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2
=C2=BDz=C3=97=C2=A7=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDK=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3
=AF=C2=C2=BDD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=16=C3
=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDK=1E=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=17=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD
j=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD',.+-=15=C3=C2=AD=C2=BA =C3=AF=C2
=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD5=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=A2=C2=81=C2=ABh=C3=AF=C2=C2
=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=1B=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD,z=C3=AF=C2=C2
=BD^=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD.+-=C3=AF=C2=C2
=BD=C3=98=C2=A5=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=98=C5=BE=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=8B=C5=93=C3
=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD =C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDT=C3=AF
=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDn=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD+=C3=AF=C2
=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDb=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDp+r=18=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDy'=C3=AF
=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDC=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD =C3=A5=C2
=A1=C2=A7{ =C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2
=C2=BD,x(Z=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDP=10> -=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDZ=C3=AF
=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDvk=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDk=C3=AF=C2
=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDj+y=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDky=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDm=C3=AF=C2
=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD &j=C3=AF=C2
=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD',r=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD5=C3=AF=C2
=C2=BD=C3=A2=C2=81=C2=ABh=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2
=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDR=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD
=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDm=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3
=AF=C2=C2=BD &j=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD',r=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3
=AF=C2=C2=BD5=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=A2=C2=81=C2=ABh=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF
=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2
=C2=BDR=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD0=04=C3=AF=C2
=C2=BD8=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=02Ia=01=14=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDT1$=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3
=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD+y=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD\=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD{^=C3
=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3'=C2=A5=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2
=BDj)ZnW=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDayg=C3=AF=C2
=C2=BD=16=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=86=C2=A1=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3
=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=7F=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF
=C2=C2=BD+=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDk&j=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD',r=C3
=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=7F=C3=AF
=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD+=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDk&j=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF
=C2=C2=BD',r=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDh=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF
=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD*'=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2
=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=98=C2=A8=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDg=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD
J+^N=16=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD*.~=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2
=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDzw=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2
=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD,=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDh=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD
=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD =C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDjY^
.+-=01=C3=99=C2=A2=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDky=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDm=C3
=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD &j=C3=AF
=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD',r=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDr=C3=AF
=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD&=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD*'=C3=AF=C2
=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDi=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD0=C3=AF=C2
=C2=BDf=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2
=BDr=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD(=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD(=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD
=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDn=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDb=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=7F
=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=9F=C2=A2{=7F=C3=AF
=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BD=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDn=C3=AF=C2=C2=BDr=C3=AF=C2
=C2=BD=1Bf
>>
>> --
>> Charles Burkholder
>> Visit my blog @ http://missionmechfund.blogspot.ca/
>>
>>
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
==========================
=========
>>
> )=C2=AD=C3=C3=9F=C2=A2{l=B97=C2=B6r=B0h=C2=AFM4=C3=93M=1Fi=C3
=87=C5=93=C2=A2=C3=C3=A2z=C2=B9=C3=9E=C3=81=C3=8A.=C2=AE'=C2=ABN=17=C2=8F
=B0=C3=AB^=C5=BE=C5=A1%.+-=12f=C2=A2=9DZ+=C2=BAe,z=C3=98^1=C2=AB
k=C2=A2x=C5=93=C2=B0=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B4W=C5=A1=C2=B6=C3=C3=9E=C2=B0=C3'=C2
=AF=C5-=06=C2=AD=C2=A2=C2=BBhn=C2=BA0=C2=B1=C3=ABazf=C2=A7=C3=88=C2=B8=C2=AC
=C2=B6=C3=ABb=93+bz=C3=8B.r=16=C2=AC.+-R=7F=C3=92=C2=B9=C2=BB=1C=C2=AE
*m=C5-=B0=C3=C2=AD=C3=88b=C2=BD=C3=A4=C5=BEj=C2=B7!=0E=C5=92'
=93-=C2=9D=C3=AC6=C2=B2=06=C2=BA0=C2=B1=C3-=C2=A1j=C3=91@@=C3=B8h=C2
=B6=B9!j=C2=B7=C5=A1=C2=9D=C3=99=C2=AEr=19=C2=AEr=19=C2=A8=C2=AD=C3
=C2=A1=C2=AD=C3=A7=C3=A1=C2=B6=C3=9A=7F=C3=0C0=84=A2=C2=ABk=C2=A2x=C5=93
=C2=B1=C3=8A&=C3=BC=C3'=C2=AF=C5-=06=C2=AD=C2=A2=C2=B3=C3=A2z=C3=97=C2=A7
=C2=B0K=C5-=C3=8Ba=C2=B6=C3=9A=7F=C3=0C0=84=A2=C2=ABk=C2=A2
x=C5=93=C2=B1=C3=8A&=C3=BC=C3'=C2=AF=C5-=06=C2=AD=C2=A2=C2=B3=C3=A2z=C3=97
=C2=A7=C2=B0K=C5-=C3=8B=7Fh=C3=13D=C3=A3H %=9E=04S
=98P=C3=84=99jg =C2=AD=C3=C2=ADr=B0=C3=ADz{Z=93=C3=8A=1A
=C2=BD=C2=A8=C2=A5i=C2=B9^=C2=BE&=C2=AD=C3=A5=C5=BElZ+=C2=BAk=1A
-=C2=B7=C5=B8-=C3=9Bi=C3=C3=B7=C3=A8=C2=AE=C3=A9=C2=AC=84
=A2=C2=ABk=C2=A2x=C5=93=C2=B1=C3=8A&-=C3=9Bi=C3=C3=B7=C3=A8=C2=AE
=C3=A9=C2=AC=84=A2=C2=ABk=C2=A2x=C5=93=C2=B1=C3=8A&=C3=BD=C2=A2=C3=A2=C2=B2
=C3=90=C2=A8=C5=BE=C3=9A=C3=A2n=C3=ABb=C2=A2u=C5=BEm(=C2=ADy8Z=C5=BEL=C2=A8=C2
=B9=C3=BA+=C3=8A=B9=C2=AB=C2=81=C3=A9=C3=9E=C2=AE=B9=C2=AC=C2=B2
=C3i=C2=A2=C2=BBLj=C3=9BC=C2=AD=C2=A9ex=C2=B8=C2=AC=C2=B4=07f=C5-v=C2=A1
=C2=AD=C3=A7=C3=A1=C2=B6=C3=9A=7F=C3=0C0=84=A2=C2=ABk=C2=A2x=C5=93=C2=B1
=C3=8A&=C3=BD=C3=8A'=C2=B6=C2=B8=BA=C2=BA=C3=98=C2=A8=C5=BE=1Bm=C2=A7=C3
=C3=B0=C3=83 =C5=A1=C2=B6=C2=BA'=B0=C3=8B=1C=C2=A2o=C3=9C=C2=A2{k
=B0=C2=BB=C2=AD=C5-=B0=C3k=C3=B6=C3~=B0=C3=AD=C3=BE=C5
=A1=C3=9E=C3=BD=C2=BA=1D=C3=8B=C3=B8m=C5=A1
Message 17
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | VNE at cruise- bungees versus springs landing gear |
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|