---------------------------------------------------------- Pietenpol-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 03/23/15: 29 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:15 AM - Re: Newest Piet pilot! (womenfly2) 2. 06:29 AM - Re: Metal Fittings (JERRY) 3. 08:53 AM - Re: A65 Engine Start (Peter Johnson) 4. 09:26 AM - A-65 overhaul costs, one man's story (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-LME0)[Vantage Partners, LLC]) 5. 09:38 AM - Re: Metal Fittings (Jack) 6. 09:53 AM - Revised the cabaine struts for a wider center-section... (aerocarjake) 7. 10:43 AM - Re: A-65 overhaul costs, one man's story (Steven Dortch) 8. 10:55 AM - Re: A-65 overhaul costs, one man's story (Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-LME0)[Vantage Partners, LLC]) 9. 11:14 AM - Re: Revised the cabaine struts for a wider center-section... (Catdesigns) 10. 11:46 AM - Re: Newest Piet pilot! (Jeff Boatright) 11. 11:50 AM - Re: Newest Piet pilot! (womenfly2) 12. 12:01 PM - Re: Newest Piet pilot! (Jeff Boatright) 13. 12:47 PM - Re: Revised the cabaine struts for a wider center-section... (aerocarjake) 14. 01:30 PM - Re: A-65 overhaul costs, one man's story (Jack Philips) 15. 01:38 PM - Re: Metal Fittings (johnnysdrop) 16. 01:57 PM - Re: Re: Revised the cabaine struts for a wider center-section... (gliderx5@comcast.net) 17. 02:01 PM - Re: Metal Fittings (George Abernathy) 18. 02:46 PM - Re: Metal Fittings (Bill Church) 19. 03:21 PM - Re: Re: Revised the cabaine struts for a wider center-section... (Jack Philips) 20. 03:50 PM - new builder upstate NY (dmcb84) 21. 03:53 PM - Fw: A-65 overhaul costs, one man's story (Jim Boyer) 22. 04:04 PM - Re: new builder upstate NY (Gary Boothe) 23. 04:09 PM - Re: new builder upstate NY (Gardiner Mason) 24. 04:17 PM - Re: new builder upstate NY (dmcb84) 25. 05:37 PM - Re: Bob Parks (Cub) and Pete Bowers (Pietenpol) in 1969... (Jeff Boatright) 26. 05:56 PM - Re: Re: Bob Parks (Cub) and Pete Bowers (Pietenpol) in 1969... (John Hofmann) 27. 06:12 PM - Re: Re: Revised the cabaine struts for a wider center-section... (CatDesigns) 28. 06:45 PM - The Jeepenpol progress (aviken) 29. 06:49 PM - Re: The Jeepenpol progress (aviken) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:15:43 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Newest Piet pilot! From: "womenfly2" What camera are you using ... GoPro? WF2 -------- Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439758#439758 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:29:32 AM PST US From: "JERRY" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Metal Fittings We are thinking of manufacturing the metal fittings for the Piet. We do fittings for the Skybolt, Pitts and the Christian Eagle and the Radial Rocket. But the Piet parts would not be available till the end of summer and then we would stock them. I don't have any idea of price yet. Jerry Grogan Sky Classic Aircraft -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of tonyp51qa Sent: Friday, March 20, 2015 9:06 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Metal Fittings Has anyone manufactured metal fittings and sold them for the Pietenpol? Is there any plans or supplemental plans out there for building the Aileron, vertical or horizontal stabilizer control horns with a solid piece of steel/aluminum? I don't have access to a TIG welder. Tony[/list] -------- Tony Crawford Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439695#439695 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 08:53:43 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: A65 Engine Start From: Peter Johnson Jack, Thanks for the info, I=B9ll give it a go this weekend. Cheers Peter From: Jack Philips Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: A65 Engine Start Peter it sounds to me like you have a slight vacuum leak, probably around the rubber fittings that connect the tubes from the intake spider to the individual cylinders. Running carb heat tends to richen the mixture slightly so if that makes it run smoother it is probably a bit too lean. I had the same problem when I first built my A65. A dangerous but effective way to determine where the leak is located is to use a spray bottle filled with gasoline (petrol?), and as the engine is running roughly, spray the gasoline on the outside of the suspected leak area. If the engine smoothes out, you have found the leak. Good luck with it! Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Peter Johnson Sent: Sunday, March 22, 2015 1:39 AM Subject: Pietenpol-List: A65 Engine Start Hi Guys, I have been trying a few engine starts on my newly rebuilt A65. I had a few problems along the way but now have most of the sorted. I still have one problem though. I can start the engine after one primer stroke, pull through once and then the next starts. Very good so far. Tick over is good (600 or 700 rpm presently) but as I advance the throttle, the engine starts to miss and generally run rough. If I operate the carb heat all is well. I have managed a max rpm of 2100 static at the moment and feel it could go another 100 or so. If I put the carb heat to cold the engine starts running rough again. I took the air filter off the front of the carb to see if it made any difference thinking there may be a rich/lean mixture. It didn=B9t make any difference. Any ideas? Thanks Peter Wonthaggi Australia http://repiet.cpc-world.com ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 09:26:03 AM PST US From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-LME0)[Vantage Partners, LLC]" Subject: Pietenpol-List: A-65 overhaul costs, one man's story 17 years ago I first flew my Piet on an A-65 that I overhauled with the ove rsight of a great A&P/ IA by the name of Don Helmick. Don had rebuilt lots of these motors and the carbs and mags too so I took Don's adv ice and followed the Continental overhaul manual. By God's grace and favor and not taking any short cuts on that overhaul I w as able to get many years of good flying out of that engine but in the past year or two the oil pressure has slowly started to drop so time for a major overhaul this past winter. I didn't overhaul the engine on the plane but bought a no-logs engine from a guy in Michigan for $500 from Barnstormers. Here's my costs so far. The cost to overhaul a small Continental are pretty affordable, even if you go top notch with having all the inspections, magnafluxing, machining, nitriding, heat treating, resurfacing, and reconditioning done a t FAA Certified Repair facilities with all parts coming back yellow tagged. Total came to $4,801 not including carb or mag overhauls because I'll be tr ansferring those directly from the old engine to the new engine. The crankcase halves were in excellent condition so only required a few stu d replacements and minor machining so saved a bit there by it not having any cracks or re-boring issues. Mike C. No-log A-65 from Michigan: $500 Crankcase halves reconditioned, Crankcase Services, Inc. Oklahoma: $375 Crank, cam, cam followers, rods, and $1,392 rockers reconditioned, Aircraft Engine & Accessory, Dallas, TX 4 cylinders, complete overhaul to STD $1,150 dimensions, Harrison Engine Service, LaPorte, IN All new hardware, gasket sets rings, $1,384 pistons, valve springs, etc, Fresno Air Parts, needed exhaust valves, 1 intake.... ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 09:38:21 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Metal Fittings From: Jack That would be a great service Jerry! I can attest to Jerry's high quality of work. He has been a great help to me welding the critical parts for my Piet! BTW Jerry we are back from Florida and I will come get the mount this week. Thanks! Sent from my iPad Jack Textor > On Mar 23, 2015, at 8:28 AM, "JERRY" wrote: > > > We are thinking of manufacturing the metal fittings for the Piet. We do > fittings for the Skybolt, Pitts and the Christian Eagle and the Radial > Rocket. But the Piet parts would not be available till the end of summer and > then we would stock them. I don't have any idea of price yet. > > Jerry Grogan > Sky Classic Aircraft > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of tonyp51qa > Sent: Friday, March 20, 2015 9:06 PM > To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com > Subject: Pietenpol-List: Metal Fittings > > > Has anyone manufactured metal fittings and sold them for the Pietenpol? Is > there any plans or supplemental plans out there for building the Aileron, > vertical or horizontal stabilizer control horns with a solid piece of > steel/aluminum? I don't have access to a TIG welder. > > Tony[/list] > > -------- > Tony Crawford > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439695#439695 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 09:53:08 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Revised the cabaine struts for a wider center-section... From: "aerocarjake" Hello good Piet-ple, Hope you all are well..... I consulted with a number of folks regarding my center-section and cabaine struts and the consensus was that I should modify/angle my cabaine struts outward to directly tie them to the wing-attach fittings. So after a weekend of work, I am mostly there. I still need my welder "fill" some of the bolt holes in the fuselage fittings (and then re-drill them) but the structural load path is "more correct" (aka WACO, Stearman, etc....) Never fun to do things over that I thought I had done but it seemed like the right thing to do and now that it is nearly done I am glad I made the change. Will be an unusual "look" for a Piet but it's kinda fun that way.... Enjoy your day everyone............ -------- Jake Schultz - curator, Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439779#439779 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/5_cabaine_struts_angled_out_1_399.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/6_cabaine_struts_angled_out_2_146.jpg ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 10:43:17 AM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: A-65 overhaul costs, one man's story From: Steven Dortch Mike, your email is unclear in one area. I think you are talking about a new overhaul, but the way it is worded it could have been your 17 year old overhaul. You bought the No-Log engine when? Thanks for the info/inspiration. Blue Skies, Steve D. On Mon, Mar 23, 2015 at 11:23 AM, Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-LME0)[Vantage Partners, LLC] wrote: > 17 years ago I first flew my Piet on an A-65 that I overhauled with the > oversight of a great A&P/ IA by the name of Don Helmick. Don had > > rebuilt lots of these motors and the carbs and mags too so I took Don =99s > advice and followed the Continental overhaul manual. > > > By God=99s grace and favor and not taking any short cuts on that ov erhaul I > was able to get many years of good flying out of that engine but > > in the past year or two the oil pressure has slowly started to drop so > time for a major overhaul this past winter. > > > I didn=99t overhaul the engine on the plane but bought a no-logs en gine from > a guy in Michigan for $500 from Barnstormers. Here=99s my costs > > so far. The cost to overhaul a small Continental are pretty affordable , > even if you go top notch with having all the inspections, magnafluxing, > > machining, nitriding, heat treating, resurfacing, and reconditioning done > at FAA Certified Repair facilities with all parts coming back yellow > tagged. > > > Total came to $4,801 not including carb or mag overhauls because I =99ll be > transferring those directly from the old engine to the new engine. > > > The crankcase halves were in excellent condition so only required a few > stud replacements and minor machining so saved a bit there by it not > > having any cracks or re-boring issues. > > > Mike C. > > > No-log A-65 from Michigan: $500 > > > Crankcase halves reconditioned, > > Crankcase Services, Inc. Oklahoma: $375 > > > Crank, cam, cam followers, rods, and $1,392 > > rockers reconditioned, Aircraft Engine > > & Accessory, Dallas, TX > > > 4 cylinders, complete overhaul to STD $1,150 > > dimensions, Harrison Engine Service, > > LaPorte, IN > > > All new hardware, gasket sets rings, $1,384 > > pistons, valve springs, etc, Fresno > > Air Parts, needed exhaust valves, > > 1 intake. > > -- Blue Skies, Steve D ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 10:55:27 AM PST US From: "Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-LME0)[Vantage Partners, LLC]" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: A-65 overhaul costs, one man's story TWlrZSwgeW91ciBlbWFpbCBpcyB1bmNsZWFyIGluIG9uZSBhcmVhLiBJIHRoaW5rIHlvdSBhcmUg dGFsa2luZyBhYm91dCBhIG5ldyBvdmVyaGF1bCwgYnV0IHRoZSB3YXkgaXQgaXMgd29yZGVkIGl0 IGNvdWxkIGhhdmUgYmVlbiB5b3VyIDE3IHllYXIgb2xkIG92ZXJoYXVsLiBZb3UgYm91Z2h0IHRo ZSBOby1Mb2cgZW5naW5lIHdoZW4/DQoNCkhpIFN0ZXZl4oCUc29ycnkgZm9yIHRoZSBjb25mdXNp b24uICAgVGhlIGVuZ2luZSB0aGF0IEkgYW0gbWFqb3Igb3ZlcmhhdWxpbmcgaXMgdGhlIG9uZSBJ IGJvdWdodCBpbiBNaWNoaWdhbiB0aGF0IGhhZCBubyBsb2cgYm9vaywgbm90IHRoZSBvbmUgdGhh dCBJIGhhdmUgcnVuIGZvciAxNyB5ZWFycyB0aG91Z2ggSeKAmWxsIHVzZSB0aGUNCm1hZ3MgYW5k IGNhcmJzIG9mZiB0aGUgb2xkIGVuZ2luZSBhbmQgZXhoYXVzdCBwaXBlcywgY29vbGluZyBleWVi cm93cywgZXRjLg0KDQpNaWtlIEMuDQoNCg0KDQoNCkkgZGlkbuKAmXQgb3ZlcmhhdWwgdGhlIGVu Z2luZSBvbiB0aGUgcGxhbmUgYnV0IGJvdWdodCBhIG5vLWxvZ3MgZW5naW5lIGZyb20gYSBndXkg aW4gTWljaGlnYW4gZm9yICQ1MDAgZnJvbSBCYXJuc3Rvcm1lcnMuDQo ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 11:14:39 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Revised the cabaine struts for a wider center-section... From: "Catdesigns" Jake I know you have a wider center section but others have done vertical cabaine struts with wider center sections. What was the line of thinking that made "the consensus [is]... I should modify/angle my cabaine struts outward to directly tie them to the wing-attach fittings". I ask because I do not see the benefit from a structural standpoint. Not a criticism, I'm just curious about the decision path. (I like that part of building). Also, one thing you learn about Pietenpols is there are very few, if any, new changes you can think of. For instance this Pietenpol has the angled cabaine struts too. http://www.westcoastpiet.com/images/WCP_2013_Gathering/IMG_0595.JPG Thanks Chris -------- Chris Sacramento, CA WestCoastPiet.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439786#439786 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 11:46:39 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Newest Piet pilot! From: "Jeff Boatright" womenfly2 wrote: > What camera are you using ... GoPro? > > WF2 Mobius ActionCams 120 degree lense pointed backwards and 170 degree lense pointing forwards. https://www.mobius-actioncam.com http://www.amazon.com/Mobius-Action-Camera-1080P-Sports/dp/B00DP1WYD2 HTH, Jeff Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439789#439789 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 11:50:19 AM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Newest Piet pilot! From: "womenfly2" Thanks. Takes get video as you have shown. WF2 -------- Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439790#439790 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 12:01:44 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Newest Piet pilot! From: "Jeff Boatright" womenfly2 wrote: > Thanks. Takes get video as you have shown. > > WF2 Thanks. Only downside to them is that they must be programmed for bright versus cloudy days, which requires connecting to the computer prior to flying. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439791#439791 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 12:47:38 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Revised the cabaine struts for a wider center-section... From: "aerocarjake" Thanks Chris, Like you said, everything that can be tried has been tried before...! The thoughts of a friend of mine who is a structural and aeronautical engineer (and who also owns a Travel Aire biplane and several additional antique planes) are that the cabaines ending at the fittings would tie the load directly to them, as opposed to having the load be about eight inches away. He felt that yes, it would PROBABLY be just fine to have the cabaines vertical, but by canting the cabaines outward it should make for a better structural arrangement. There are many, many examples of 1930s era planes with wide center sections where the cabaine struts are angled outward. -------- Jake Schultz - curator, Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439797#439797 ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 01:30:11 PM PST US From: "Jack Philips" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: A-65 overhaul costs, one man's story Mike that agrees pretty well with the costs I had rebuilding my A65 12 years ago, adjusted for inflation. The only things I did differently were to include a brand new camshaft (old one was pitted and had a chunk missing from one lobe) and the new Millenium cylinders, which added $3,200 to the total but included new pistons, new rocker shafts, new piston rings and new piston pins. My total was right at $7,500, including the cost of the engine core. I assembled it myself, under the strict supervision of an A&P, IA. Note that this means the engine was "0" SMOH, or zero hours since major overhaul, NOT zero time. As the Sky Ranch Engineering Manual says, "You can't zero-time the metallurgy" Since then I have rebuilt the oil pump (I did not put new oil pump gears in during the rebuild) for an additional $400 or so. I've put about 400 hours on it in 10 years. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Cuy, Michael D. (GRC-LME0)[Vantage Partners, LLC] Sent: Monday, March 23, 2015 12:24 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: A-65 overhaul costs, one man's story 17 years ago I first flew my Piet on an A-65 that I overhauled with the oversight of a great A&P/ IA by the name of Don Helmick. Don had rebuilt lots of these motors and the carbs and mags too so I took Don's advice and followed the Continental overhaul manual. By God's grace and favor and not taking any short cuts on that overhaul I was able to get many years of good flying out of that engine but in the past year or two the oil pressure has slowly started to drop so time for a major overhaul this past winter. I didn't overhaul the engine on the plane but bought a no-logs engine from a guy in Michigan for $500 from Barnstormers. Here's my costs so far. The cost to overhaul a small Continental are pretty affordable, even if you go top notch with having all the inspections, magnafluxing, machining, nitriding, heat treating, resurfacing, and reconditioning done at FAA Certified Repair facilities with all parts coming back yellow tagged. Total came to $4,801 not including carb or mag overhauls because I'll be transferring those directly from the old engine to the new engine. The crankcase halves were in excellent condition so only required a few stud replacements and minor machining so saved a bit there by it not having any cracks or re-boring issues. Mike C. No-log A-65 from Michigan: $500 Crankcase halves reconditioned, Crankcase Services, Inc. Oklahoma: $375 Crank, cam, cam followers, rods, and $1,392 rockers reconditioned, Aircraft Engine & Accessory, Dallas, TX 4 cylinders, complete overhaul to STD $1,150 dimensions, Harrison Engine Service, LaPorte, IN All new hardware, gasket sets rings, $1,384 pistons, valve springs, etc, Fresno Air Parts, needed exhaust valves, 1 intake.. ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 01:38:20 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Metal Fittings From: "johnnysdrop" Tony, we have them as an approved mod here in the UK, contact Peter Wright at the Pietenpol Club UK for the details. English Johnny Still on the wings!!!! -------- The only way is UP Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439800#439800 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 01:57:45 PM PST US From: gliderx5@comcast.net Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Revised the cabaine struts for a wider center-section... Jake I did the same as you. A little analysis ( http://home.comcast.net/~mmorrison123/wing_loads.html ) convinced me that with the wider center section, attaching to the end of the center section vice straight up was the way to go for strength. As a result of widening the center section, more lift is carried on the cabanes and less on the lift struts than the standard width center section, but it's a relatively small change. Are you shortening the outer panels to make up for the wider center (that's what I did), or leaving them and going with a longer wingspan? Malcolm Morrison wienerdogaero.com http://home.comcast.net/~mmorrison123/piet.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "aerocarjake" Sent: Monday, March 23, 2015 3:47:20 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Revised the cabaine struts for a wider center-section... Thanks Chris, Like you said, everything that can be tried has been tried before...! The thoughts of a friend of mine who is a structural and aeronautical engineer (and who also owns a Travel Aire biplane and several additional antique planes) are that the cabaines ending at the fittings would tie the load directly to them, as opposed to having the load be about eight inches away. He felt that yes, it would PROBABLY be just fine to have the cabaines vertical, but by canting the cabaines outward it should make for a better structural arrangement. There are many, many examples of 1930s era planes with wide center sections where the cabaine struts are angled outward. -------- Jake Schultz - curator, Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439797#439797 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 02:01:04 PM PST US From: George Abernathy Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Metal Fittings I had the aileron, rudder, elevator control horn fittings laser cut.=C2-I f there is interest I can do another run.=C2- G From: JERRY To: pietenpol-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, March 23, 2015 6:28 AM Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Metal Fittings We are thinking of manufacturing the metal fittings for the Piet. We do fittings for the Skybolt, Pitts and the Christian Eagle and the Radial Rocket. But the Piet parts would not be available till the end of summer an d then we would stock them. I don't have any idea of price yet. Jerry Grogan Sky Classic Aircraft -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of tonyp51qa Sent: Friday, March 20, 2015 9:06 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Metal Fittings Has anyone manufactured metal fittings and sold them for the Pietenpol? Is there any plans or supplemental plans out there for building the Aileron, vertical or horizontal stabilizer control horns with a solid piece of steel/aluminum? I don't have access to a TIG welder. Tony[/list] -------- Tony Crawford Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439695#439695 S - - =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- -Matt Dralle, List Admin. ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 02:46:02 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Metal Fittings From: "Bill Church" This topic comes up from time to time. Pound for pound, the plans-built control horns are the best option. The shaping of the parts provides all the needed strength , while only using thin sheet metal. Some builders have made their horns from thicker sheet steel, but they are always heavier than the plans-built, airfoil shaped horns - usually 50 to 100 percent heavier. The option of aluminum horns get mentioned as well, but due to metallurgical concerns, no welding should be used on aluminum horns - which necessitates more fasteners, which in turn, add weight. But, perhaps more importantly, the plans-built control horns are just the right thing to do on an airplane that was designed in the golden age of aviation. They just look cool (while providing all the necessary strength.) Bill C. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439803#439803 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 03:21:12 PM PST US From: "Jack Philips" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Revised the cabaine struts for a wider center-section... Actually, since the Pietenpol has the lift struts attaching in the middle of the wing panels, there are very little lift loads carried by the cabanes (just the lift generated by the centersection, which is not too much). The fittings are easier to make if the struts attach at the end of the centersection spars (ask me how I know). This is a typical case of one change rippling through the entire airplane. Just be careful to think it through completely. Jack Phillips NX899JP Smith Mountain Lake, Virginia -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of aerocarjake Sent: Monday, March 23, 2015 3:47 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Revised the cabaine struts for a wider center-section... --> Thanks Chris, Like you said, everything that can be tried has been tried before...! The thoughts of a friend of mine who is a structural and aeronautical engineer (and who also owns a Travel Aire biplane and several additional antique planes) are that the cabaines ending at the fittings would tie the load directly to them, as opposed to having the load be about eight inches away. He felt that yes, it would PROBABLY be just fine to have the cabaines vertical, but by canting the cabaines outward it should make for a better structural arrangement. There are many, many examples of 1930s era planes with wide center sections where the cabaine struts are angled outward. -------- Jake Schultz - curator, Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439797#439797 ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 03:50:32 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: new builder upstate NY From: "dmcb84" Ok, thought i would join the fun on here. www.davespiet.blogspot.com Started building march 2014. Lots of reading, EAA sport air workshop, brodhead, and a corvair college in the books. Just starting to get familiar with the airframe. Hope to get alot more building done this year when the weather starts to warm. David McBride Rochester, NY dmcb84@hotmail.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439805#439805 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/screenshot_2015_03_23_17_43_01_409.png http://forums.matronics.com//files/screenshot_2015_03_23_17_42_22_123.png ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 03:53:43 PM PST US From: Jim Boyer Subject: Fwd: Pietenpol-List: A-65 overhaul costs, one man's story ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 04:04:38 PM PST US From: Gary Boothe Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: new builder upstate NY Welcome to the fray, David! Getting those danged ribs done is a big step! Sent from my iPad > On Mar 23, 2015, at 3:50 PM, dmcb84 wrote: > > > Ok, thought i would join the fun on here. > > www.davespiet.blogspot.com > > Started building march 2014. Lots of reading, EAA sport air workshop, brodhead, and a corvair college in the books. Just starting to get familiar with the airframe. Hope to get alot more building done this year when the weather starts to warm. > > David McBride > Rochester, NY > dmcb84@hotmail.com > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439805#439805 > > > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/screenshot_2015_03_23_17_43_01_409.png > http://forums.matronics.com//files/screenshot_2015_03_23_17_42_22_123.png > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 04:09:23 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: new builder upstate NY From: Gardiner Mason Dave, I see thatyouarenot a heavyweight, but you aught to consider building your fuselage 26 inches wide instead of 24. It sure helps for the comfort and doesn't, add that much weight. Gardiner Mason. Up where you live you can dress more warmly? Sent from my iPad > On Mar 23, 2015, at 6:50 PM, "dmcb84" wrote: > > > Ok, thought i would join the fun on here. > > www.davespiet.blogspot.com > > Started building march 2014. Lots of reading, EAA sport air workshop, brodhead, and a corvair college in the books. Just starting to get familiar with the airframe. Hope to get alot more building done this year when the weather starts to warm. > > David McBride > Rochester, NY > dmcb84@hotmail.com > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439805#439805 > > > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/screenshot_2015_03_23_17_43_01_409.png > http://forums.matronics.com//files/screenshot_2015_03_23_17_42_22_123.png > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 04:17:23 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: new builder upstate NY From: "dmcb84" I can dress warmer but the glue doesnt like the freezing temps in the shop. A few more.... David McBride Rochester, NY dmcb84@hotmail.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439809#439809 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/2015_03_23_191120_851.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/2015_03_23_185514_134.jpg ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 05:37:38 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Bob Parks (Cub) and Pete Bowers (Pietenpol) in 1969... From: "Jeff Boatright" That photo in the rain is almost poetic. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439813#439813 ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 05:56:52 PM PST US Subject: Re: Pietenpol-List: Re: Bob Parks (Cub) and Pete Bowers (Pietenpol) in 1969... From: John Hofmann Cool photos. The Cub actually looks to be an Aeronca Defender or L-3 from the nose, gear and tail. Anyone else concur? Best, -john- > On Mar 23, 2015, at 7:37 PM, Jeff Boatright wrote: > > > That photo in the rain is almost poetic. > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439813#439813 > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 06:12:49 PM PST US From: "CatDesigns" Subject: RE: Pietenpol-List: Re: Revised the cabaine struts for a wider center-section... Jake Thank for the explanation. Chris -----Original Message----- From: owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-pietenpol-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of aerocarjake Sent: Monday, March 23, 2015 12:47 PM Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: Revised the cabaine struts for a wider center-section... --> Thanks Chris, Like you said, everything that can be tried has been tried before...! The thoughts of a friend of mine who is a structural and aeronautical engineer (and who also owns a Travel Aire biplane and several additional antique planes) are that the cabaines ending at the fittings would tie the load directly to them, as opposed to having the load be about eight inches away. He felt that yes, it would PROBABLY be just fine to have the cabaines vertical, but by canting the cabaines outward it should make for a better structural arrangement. There are many, many examples of 1930s era planes with wide center sections where the cabaine struts are angled outward. -------- Jake Schultz - curator, Newport Way Air Museum (OK, it's just my home) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439797#439797 ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 06:45:41 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: The Jeepenpol progress From: "aviken" I moved the girl out to the farm where I had some hangar space for paint and assembly. It will stay there while I use my small shop at home to build my wings. Certainly hope the wings will go together without too much difficulty , I would like to fly sometime before Winter. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=439817#439817 ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 06:49:11 PM PST US Subject: Pietenpol-List: Re: The Jeepenpol progress From: "aviken" Trying to add some pictures here, patience. 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